Did the Duke of Wellington Call His Men Scum?

"(Our soldiers...) are the very scum of the earth!" It's the most iconic and infamous of Wellington's quotes, and has helped to define popular interpretations of the Napoleonic-era British army for generations. But, what did Wellington actually mean when he said this? What was the context of this seemingly scornful derision of his own men? And what, if anything, can this tell us about Wellington's own character, and the social orders of the Long 18th Century?
If you'd like to read more on the subject, I recommend this article:
adventuresinhi... -
-
-
-
This video was made in support of The Native Oak. Learn more about our educational mission here:
www.nativeoak....
If you'd like to support the channel, please consider giving on Patreon,
/ brandonf
You can follow me on social media too!
/ thenativeoak
/ brandonfisichella

[@adventuresinhistoryland5501]

My dear sir, As the administrator and writer of the blog Adventures in Historyland I thought I must take this opportunity to open communication. I stumbled upon your video by dint of KZbin’s suggestion panel, not realising I was to feature at the end. I was both pleasantly surprised and greatly flattered that you cited my article of 2014, ‘What Wellington Said,’ in such a complimentary fashion. Most pleasingly it was your sentiments about the ‘Great Duke’ and your initiative in conveying this important contextual information to your subscribers that drew me to the video and why I very much enjoyed it. There is no anti-Wellington trope so annoying as the scum of the earth one. You have helped greatly in setting the record straight. Should you ever want to get in contact, or require any assistance, please don’t hesitate to get in touch via the contact info on my website. Believe me, Yr Obt Svt. Joshua Provan. Adventures in Historyland.

[@Oversamma]

Immediately remembered that scene in the ball room from Waterloo (1970) when I read the title. Kind of stuck with me.

[@BrandonF]

For better or worse, that's always one of the first things to pop into my mind as well when thinking about Wellington!

[@PeptoBismarck244]

Great movie

[@vkeshav3519]

gin.. is the spirit of their patriotism

[@Wanderer628]

Suprise, suprise a quote which in its entirety isn't that bad, is turned around to paint a bad image. Even in these days of video evidence and instant communication it still happens.

[@AeneasGemini]

It's even worse in today's day and age, it's easier to masquerade deliberate fabrications, modern technology makes media fakery a whole lot easier

[@ablethreefourbravo]

"Yes, my soldiers are scum. But they're MY scum. If I hear you speak ill of them again, sir, we shall exchange much more than just words." -Arthur Wellesley, 1815 (probably)

[@Apollo890]

Thank you for this Brandon, I remever my history teacher tried to use this misquote to suggest that Wellington hated his troops and was cruel to them whilst Napoleon just loved his troops and never abused them. It always annoyed me in my mind mind a man who stood over the bodies of his dead troops and wept (as Wellington did after the assault on Badajoz) is not the actions of someone who hated his men.

[@BrandonF]

The narrative is only rarely so simple, eh?

[@Apollo890]

He was a disciplinarian for sure, but he felt that necessary in places like Spain to keep the local population onside, whereas Napoleon's troops would "live of the land" which meant that they would steal food and because of this the local population hated them. Wellington wanted the support of local population's so firmly enforcing discipline where possible was vital.

[@garymoore2535]

The Duke of Wellington always tried to give his forces the best chance of success for the least possible cost. He went to great lengths to choose the best ground for them to fight on. If he judged that a superior force was approaching he did the sensible thing and withdrew to ground where they could better defend themselves. The Duke publicly hanged and flogged those who looted, raped and murdered locals. He did so to ensure that his forces understood the consequences of such actions ! The Duke relied heavily on locals for intelligence, local knowledge and partisan support. The quickest way to lose this support was to behave like the enemy he sought to repel. The Duke much admired and respected the fighting ability of his forces and did his level best for them. Napolean......not so much !

[@99IronDuke]

Wellington was a complex character, and it it is fair to say he distrusted many of his officers more than most of his other ranks. He was also sometimes unkind, he was after all the best General of his age, not a social worker. It is also fair to remember that Wellington never left his home without a guinea or two in his pocket to give to any veteran he met who had served under him, and that was most of a month's pay for a private soldier

[@sirbernardwoolley7789]

He wasn't the best general of his age, not even by a long shot.

[@archivesoffantasy5560]

Wellington himself called Napoleon the best general of all time and said his presence was worth 40,000 men

[@archivesoffantasy5560]

@@sirbernardwoolley7789 Wellington is comfortably the second -third best general of his age competing with Suvorov. Napoleon obviously number one

[@reiverraider4887]

@@sirbernardwoolley7789 best British general though. That's what most Brits refer to when we think of him as the best.

[@garymoore2535]

Napolean was such a great General that he assembled a Grand Armee of 600,000 to attack Russia against the Tsar's armies of 220,000. Napolean marched them to Moscow before fleeing back to Paris with just 50,000 left alive closely pursued by the Russians who then took Paris ! Ask yourself which General you would have wished to fight for ? 🤔 🤯

[@britishofficersdontduck9928]

Bernard Cornwell covers this brilliantly in his rendition of the Wellington Lecture!

[@noahgibsonspeninsularwarsa1134]

And Waterloo.

[@britishofficersdontduck9928]

Noah Gibson his book on Waterloo is superb

[@joshuaAdams3561]

I do like how you explained the complexities of Wellingtons opinions. If I may be so inclined, the TV Series Sharpe, I think, really portrays the complex personality of Wellington with only a few scenes. Some of these scenes express both his frustration and pride with his army.

[@dannymcdonald9730]

Very well done Brandon, my 2nd 4th and 5th grader love when you do these types of shows. Please keep up the good work

[@Marshal_Windsor]

“Has Wellington nothing to offer me but these Amazon’s?”

[@jaxsonh.266]

*Confused* *In* *Baguette*

[@MB-oc1nw]

Yeah well, he lost mate

[@kerrell95]

Two of my friends used to call themselves scum of the earth. It's basically a recognition that they have come from nothing and have built themselves up from that.

[@WarReport.]

Well yes. We are talking about the high upper nobility who would be officers and the lower class men joining because they have no bloody better options or were forced to, but the army did give them purpose and discipline. Most I doubt could even read, but fighting requires strength!

[@leojordan8903]

Brandon, do you find it hard to do a British accent at reeneactments

[@oats4632]

Nobody does accents at reenactments. I think its for the better, not everyone is good at accents

[@BrandonF]

I never try to do an accent or put on a voice. I just have a lecture tone...

[@hadrianbuiltawall9531]

The character of the British soldier at the time was exemplified during the retreat to Corunna (could be classed as a rout in some circumstances) in 1809 under general Moore. In the presence of the French pursuers, the British troops where disciplined and brave, and unlike many disorganised retreats throughout history, they didn't lose a single cannon. However, when the French weren't attacking them, they fell into "a mob of licentious and degenerate animals not fit for anything but looting corpses" (don't remember the exact quote). And just to prove that the British troops were almost bipolar in their nature, on reaching Corunna with a large French army so close to their rear that they couldn't evacuate onto their ships and no apparent chance of survival, they formed up, faced the French, beat them thoroughly and won an unexpected victory.

[@sebastiantiainen2749]

It's the "throw your men into positions in which there's no.escape and they will prefer death to surrender" or some such. Essentially they had their backs against the wall and couldn't escape so they fought for their lives, it's like backing an animal into a corner.

[@oliversherman2414]

I love your channel keep up the great stuff

[@cullmancreations]

For a more in depth look into Wellington’s army and dispelling with the the myth of the “Scum of the Earth” quote I recommend reading Edward J Coss’s book “All for the King’s Shilling” Which argues that a majority of Wellington’s army in the Peninsula was made up of skilled tradesmen and not “Ne’er Do Wells” who took up military service as an escape from unemployment caused by the industrial revolution back home. www.amazon.com/All-Kings-Shilling-Wellington-Commanders/dp/0806141050

[@TheManofthecross]

did not help weselly a lot when he lost a 4th of his whole force down there in one battle.

[@TheBlinky81]

@@TheManofthecross The Duke of Wellington did a fine job during the Peninsular War - you can't attribute every minor detail of a battle to him though.

[@CivilWarWeekByWeek]

How could he call them scum when the french were right there?

[@Jackthesmilingblack]

"I don't know what they do the enemy. But by God they frighten me."

[@dukadarodear2176]

Wellington was referring to his fellow-Irish troops here; it's quite common for the Irish to dole out non-flattering compliments. Napoleon and Wellington (the Corsican and the Irishman) each graduated from small islands within their realms to posts of supreme power within their respective empires. The Irishman had the last laugh though.

[@Grenadier_]

Hi Brandon quick question: do you know how long a British soldier and a sailor would serve in their respective service between 1770 - 1820 especially during war?

[@mauricefrost8900]

Wellington looked down upon pretty much everybody “He was socially superior to his intellectual equals and intellectually superior to his social equals” How good a general was he in reality? Assaye and Salamanca are truly great victories He was rescued from disaster before Quatre Bras by a couple of Dutch officers disobeying his orders to consolidate to the West which would have uncovered the road to Brussels after which Waterloo would not have been fought The counter factual question that would be worth thinking about is had Sir John Moore not been killed at Corunna would he have been able to do better in the Peninsula Campaign than Wellington did In this I am reminded of the description of Wellington in the Peninsula by A G Macdonald as “The master of the interminable stalk followed by the modified pounce!”

[@Aramis419]

I name all my devices after the heroes of the Pantheon of Heroes of the British Empire. My phone is named after Wellington and my computer is named after Jackie Fischer. I got kicked out of a university conference when I used the term "Pantheon of Heroes" back in 2008. Peasants!

[@princessdianasexplosivepet1524]

Read Wellington Years of the Sword and Pillar of State a 2 vol. bio. by Elizabeth Longford.

[@harveth4900]

Hey Brandon. Was wondering if you could mention reenacting community in some countries with a smaller audience such as Australia. It would be greatly appreciated and would really help out some of the smaller reenacting communities and I know for a fact that the main reason no one joins is because they haven't even heard of it! Some regiments to note are the 2/95th Rifles Australia and the 42nd Highland Regiment just to name a few. In areas such as yours I hope you do truly appreciate the fact that you are able to reenact on such a grand scale and can witness all those massive battles. Thanks, Martin.

[@BrandonF]

I've had a few people from Australia ask me about the community down that way, so I may do just that one day. Or, at least, post some videos on what I think makes certain reenactment groups flourish, and good practices in the hobby.

[@harveth4900]

@@BrandonF Thank you, M'lord.

[@theecapitan]

Very informative. Bringing a new light to the quote. Thank you for that. I would assume that you are aware of the Sharpe series? Both the books and the T.V. Series? What’s your opinion on them?

[@colinharbinson8284]

"I would rather see you dead than in a red coat," in a letter from a mother to her son. Gives you a good idea of how most English people though of the army.

[@SusCalvin]

The british army starts to change into a smaller corps that goes on expeditionary wars abroad, with a smaller footprint on the british public. They start to separate the role of the armed forces and the new police.

[@RedcoatsReturn]

Excellent explanation…indeed 😊👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏Well done my‘ol mate 👍👍😉

[@ironstarofmordian7098]

Oh I see. He never respected them as an equal. But he did as Soldiers. Ok. This leads me to the question... Would Wellington raise Sharpe from the ranks if Wellington was written to be like the real man in Sharpe?

[@legionarybooks13]

Absolutely not. While I love the Sharpe series (both the books and films), that was the first thing that stuck out rather glaringly. Wellington certainly had conflicted feelings about his fellow officers, particularly senior generals, lambasting many as incompetents who only achieved their rank through wealth and privilege. And yet, he contradicted himself by staunchly defending the purchase system for officer commissions and promotions, which wasn't finally abolished until around 1870. Wellington utterly detested the concept of commissioning from the ranks, though on occasion he begrudgingly accepted its necessity, given the high rate of officer casualties. That said, there is no documented case of Wellington ever endorsing the commission of an enlisted soldier. In fact, while a 'battlefield commission' may have been sometimes necessary, as soon as the crisis in question ended, the new officer had to either come up with the funds to purchase his commission, or else revert back to his former enlisted rank.

[@Apollo890]

@ James Mace, I disagree I think Bernard Cornwell gets Wellington spot on. In the books Wellington only raises Sharpe up because Sharpe had shared his ambition to be an Officer with a Colonel who let Wellington know of this. Wellington was portrayed true to life in being very skeptical of this and loudly expressed his opniom that it would all end in tears and throughout the series never truly accepted Sharpe as a gentleman but respected his abilities as a soldier. A scene from the Book Sharpe's Waterloo: "a menacing creature" said the Duke of Richmond, "he came up from the ranks, he saved my life once" said Wellington with a note of disapproval at both statements "but I fancy that if I had ten thousand like him tomorrow I would see Napoleon beaten by midday".

[@AeneasGemini]

Well if Sharpe can get laid with nearly every single female character that turns up in the Show, then I'm sure he can seduce Wellington too

[@SusCalvin]

@@legionarybooks13 Post-revolutionary France has much more opportunity. A lot of positions in the administration and officer corps are empty, and non-aristocratic men start to see that they have a shot at them. Napoleon is not the only one of relative middle class obscurity who starts to climb the ranks at the time.

[@henrymathias2702]

Hey Brandon sorry about the LINDON thing. But after watching this video I thought that you would like to read or listen to Jonathan strange and Mr Norrell. Have a good Friday

[@lfricmunuc4534]

You talked about this quote WITHOUT including a clip of it from Waterloo (1970)?

[@asakhosaminchevhasninkvarinq]

Hey brandon, What exactly happened on your last stream you turned it off suddenly?

[@jaxsonh.266]

Maybe his internet went out. And was down for several days. Not only was his stream turned off. But he suddenly went offline on steam, suggesting he had lost internet or even electricity totally. Hopefully he had remembered to pay the electric bill!

[@asakhosaminchevhasninkvarinq]

@@jaxsonh.266 Whats his steam name?

[@jaxsonh.266]

@@asakhosaminchevhasninkvarinq Brandon. Just Brandon.

[@asakhosaminchevhasninkvarinq]

Can you link it, too many people named brandon

[@jaxsonh.266]

@@asakhosaminchevhasninkvarinq look up armchair historian. Theyre friends

[@SusCalvin]

It's in the shift from the army as the personal skullbashers of the crown to a professional core of soldiers who go abroad where someone else has to deal with all the fuzz. And coming out of the early modern period armies where mercenaries and pressed men filled out the ranks. Post-revolutionary France has a more or less incidental period where a lot of positions in the officer corps and administration are open and non-aristocratic men find that they now have a shot at it.

[@carbon4454]

Just watched Waterloo for the first time so this is quite apt. I'm a bit conflicted on the Englishman playing Wellington and the eh attitude of the Royal Inniskillings haha!

[@adventussaxonum448]

Canadian, I believe?

[@carbon4454]

@@adventussaxonum448 I don't think the actor is, however if he is Canadian he can do a great accent!

[@adventussaxonum448]

@@carbon4454 Christopher Plummer is most definitely Canadian. I presume you are referring to the Waterloo (1970) movie? His accent is very believable and no doubt similar to how Wellesley's would have sounded, being born into an aristocratic Protestant Anglo-Irish family, and educated at Eton.

[@carbon4454]

@@adventussaxonum448 Yes he does the accent quite well, but with Wellington still being Irish he would still have a certain way about speaking that still is Irish

[@adventussaxonum448]

@@carbon4454 " Being educated at one of the most expensive English public schools means that I have an immaculate English delivery, to be sure." 😃

[@oats4632]

I wonder, if the soldiers found out what he said, what would they think of him?

[@BrandonF]

They'd probably agree!

[@Gjoufi]

They would take it as a badge of honour I'm sure.

[@WarReport.]

@@BrandonF aye and eyes down or you get a floggin

[@SusCalvin]

It's not secret that landed aristocracy was a better class at the time.

[@shinano3010]

Gotta love Brandon

[@wb6wsn]

Benny: Don't ask, don't tell.

[@cat_city2009]

0:50 So the quote is more or less accurate.

[@alanmoffat4454]

OK BUT WAS HE RIGHT OR WRONG IN HIS ASUMPTHION.

[@chrismac2234]

He said they were scum after the rout of French and Spanish forces at Vittoria. When millions of Francs were stolen by the soldiers. History's greatest and only undefeated general.

[@daisyhilldude1]

What’s a dooque?

[@johnkilmartin5101]

One has to ask why Wellington and most of his officers were in the army. In his own case having a father who was a much better violinist than money manager.

[@SusCalvin]

Here it as traditional for lower aristocracy to fill out the ranks of the growing administration and the life guard and the officer corps. It was expensive to maintain a lifestyle better than others, and the crown starts to amass more and more resources. If these men had not been of the right class, they would have been marched up and down with their kit if their dad had played away their money.

[@WILLIAM1690WALES]

As the deputy leader of the Labour party, Angela Rayner called the Tory Conservative party scum. When it comes to scum of the Auburn, some would say ginger appearance, she could be quite literally called the ginger minge.

[@grahamking2239]

The French generals get there men in trouble, mine get me out ! Wellington

[@daveturner6006]

Of course the system of voluntary enlistment was better than conscription...we won! ;)

[@johnnotrealname8168]

Wellington became a reluctant social reformer, at least for Catholics.

[@yescommander4423]

If only he had that same regard to the foreign men he lead on the battlefield of Waterloo...

[@TWBrit65]

Brilliant

[@danmoran485]

Just because you were born in a stable, it does not mean you are a horse.

[@rat_thrower5604]

I wonder if much of the officer corps were also the scum of the earth, for their standards. Many of the gentlemen officers were Irish, including the Duke himself, because the army was the main career open to them, unlike in the more industrial, mercantile England. Of course not in the same way as to the working class soldiers, but was there some kind of contemporary snobbery towards Irish gentlemen?

[@jcstides]

Wait, I’m related to that guy!

[@GRBoi1993]

I feel that this attitude died out in the US pretty early on, seeing as professional soldiers were very scarce (just look at the Battle of New Orleans) until after the 1st world war and, as recorded in the War of 1812, these soldiers performed extremely well. But that is based on nothing but my perceived lack of material recording such attitudes among American officers of the era.

[@SusCalvin]

The US army is a much smaller force for most of history. It's a cadre of officers and instructors and specialists that they build a volunteer/draft lottery force around. They are fully able to train an influx of volunteers up to standard, but they don't seem to have much of a standing force or a pre-trained reserve. The navy is the exception. It grew harder to muster up a navy from scratch, if you built a ship at the start of a conflict it could be ready to see its finish.

[@Mikesman1000]

2:00 XDD WHATS HAPPENING TO THE HORSE?!

[@NordicTG]

well with out Wellington at the Helm as Supreme Commander all hell might have broken out in the Brittish Army at the time, doesn t matter if the Army had mix of Low, Middle or High Class Men Serving in its forces, the Royal Navy had the same issues, Wellington had some pure luck that not all the officers or Generals under him, wasn t all bad, or neither too good, mixture of both help him just fine. Napoleon had very loyal, well oiled and disciplined (well not always, but most of it) however Bonepart had few good Generals and Marshals... the Grouchy & Gerad issue for istance and the lack of the 1/3 of the Army at Waterloo didn t help Napoleon much either, and that he didn t finished of the Prussians well another mistake and faital wound by Napoleon. now Wellington did few mistakes I am sure, but he didn t trust the Allies he had under him during the Napoleonic Wars, the Dutch, The Brunswick, The Hannoverians etc... well accourding to certain movies or stuff about it on the webb. simply put it like this UK : best and strongest Navy, Small and prombelmatic Army. vs France Pathetic and weak Navy, Strong, Well oiled and experianced Army. it was down to the Leadership and pure luck for either side at Waterloo. if it wasn t for Napoleon s Stomach problems that faithful day 1815 and splitting is Army with 60 or 80 000 Men trying to find the Prussian Army... well how knows how the History would have gone down instead and what if the Prussians didn t arrive to help the English and their Allies at Waterloo 1815? what then?

[@gogogomes7025]

So just like the US marines

[@SimonNZ6969]

I find it fascinating how older cultures refused to put perfectly good men into the service out of prejudiced. Like. Oh we don't think you're worthy of being butchered on the battlefield! Piss off! I feel if the Roman's had employed a proper system of granting citizenship earlier on, they wouldn't have suffered the serve manpower shortages they had later on and wouldn't have to suddenly recruit a lot of non-Latin speaking foreigners with no loyalties to the Empire.

[@sarajurjans3662]

You remind me a bit of "Ben Shapiro"... great videos!... please keep up making more!

[@hadrian.2796]

No homo

[@remainingknight8339]

I do not believe you will find very many Generals who did not have utmost respect for the Soldiers under their command.

[@aldenrodzik3011]

When Brandon first at heavens command arose from out the KZbin main page... Arose arose arose from out the KZbin main page... This was the charter the charter of the site and old subscribers sang this strain: Rule Brandonia! Brandonia rule KZbin! Brandonia will live on! Those channels not so blessed as thee must in their turns to tyrants fall... must in their in their turns to tyrants fall. While thou shalt flourish and grow ever still! The dread and envy of them all!

[@pacthug4life]

I know that multiple people already complained about it, but the way you modulate you voice is so incredibly annoying. You actually say some interesting things, but the pretentious way say those things gets on my nerves.

[@horkosofdonso7624]

Bemuddling video

[@salty4496]

:)

[@tbone6924]

I actually really enjoy this channel, but Brandon...for the love of god...drop the badly done faux English accent...it REALLY doesn't work.

[@AudieHolland]

No whitewashing of history, please. Look up: Siege of Badajoz. Speaking about *propaganda:* Have you been able to watch "Rules of Engagement (2000)" yet?

[@heartofoak1237]

AudieHolland No pushing minor facts please.

[@oliver8928]

Whitewashing?

[@davidthomas8599]

I thought the quote was. “ our army is made up of scum, But they are our scum” which is a sort of backhanded compliment

[@mexicanfries5336]

Wellington was Irish.

[@dupplinmuir113]

Wellington was an Englishman who happened to be born in Ireland, just as Guy Gibson - who led the Dams Raid in WWII - happened to be born in India.

[@swaythegod5812]

@@dupplinmuir113 He was anglo Irish And was born and raised in Ireland Not England regardless of what you think his nationality is technically Irish In fact when he went to college in England and they made fun of him because of his Irish Heritage Also this was pre famine Ireland so a lot of Irish supported being British Thus why so many Irish serviced ironically in the British army Some of biggest recruitment drives for British army in the British isles were in Ireland and Scotland witch made up the majority of the soldiers around that time Sadly this isn’t common knowledge Because it’s inconvenient for loyalist And the Irish nationalists who are both trying to push there black and white narratives of history when history is actually a lot more grey

[@komradematt8025]

hhehe 666th like xD

[@xys7536]

Do something soon I'm losing interest

[@batman6621]

jorge aldridge huh

[@NaughtyTeache12]

Scum rises to the top. Always.