Did the Jewish People Accept the Shulchan Aruch?- Interview with Rabbi David Bar-Hayim

Interview with Machon Shilo's Rabbi David Bar-Hayim
Visit us at www.MachonShilo.org

[@jonathanm.8646]

The very existence of a Rema and all other commentaries on the Shulchan Aruch who often differ with Rabbi Karo is the most obvious proof that the Shulchan Aruch was not regarded as all-binding. If one is to say that at least for the most part it is accepted, then the same statement can be said of the Mishne Torah or any other Code of Law, including the Talmud itself.

[@sarukeshel6429]

It is important to know the history of the authorship of these works. Today when people talk of the Shulchan Aruch, they generally include the work of the Rema that he addended to the work of R Karo. The Rema actually wrote is own much longer version of the work found in the SA, which he intended to act in the same way in his world. When he heard of the SA, he addended his work to this.

[@mider9996]

The codification are what Rabbi Karo and Rambam gleaned from the Torah, Mishna etc All in all the truly binding work is the Mishna

[@Sam-fp8zm]

Psalm 69 22 May the table set before them become a snare; may it become retribution and[b] a trap. 23 May their eyes be darkened so they cannot see, and their backs be bent forever. 24 Pour out your wrath on them; let your fierce anger overtake them. 25 May their place be deserted; let there be no one to dwell in their tents. 26 For they persecute those you wound and talk about the pain of those you hurt. 27 Charge them with crime upon crime; do not let them share in your salvation. 28 May they be blotted out of the book of life and not be listed with the righteous.

[@mosesgarson1940]

The Shulchan Aruch included the pesakim of the Rosh, an Ashkenazi.

[@goldengun9970]

Yes we accepted it. As one of the main books to use for halacha.

[@dakruise1]

Short answer: yes

[@LeonRosenSF]

Outstanding

[@apollocreed1000]

If the leading Rabbis of every generation accepted the Shulhan Aruch then we defer to their authority

[@jovaniskandar5089]

But they didn't, each community had a different shulchan aruch even if they were called the same name. The original shulchan aruch is not accepted by all the leading rabbis. For example, Chabad uses the shulchan aruch harav but they call it shulchan aruch even when it has differences from the original. Breslov uses likutei halachot, which is also referred to as shulchan aruch. and a lot of yeshivos today use aruch hashulchan which is also different to shulchan aruch. The idea that everyone accepted shulchan aruch is only because they ended up coming with their own texts and called it shulchan aruch. The actual shulchan aruch was not accepted by everyone

[@Yomi2012]

I don’t follow the Shulhan arukh. Too many different opinions that are not universally accepted by all

[@EverythingHumorous]

The Mishneh Torah is the best Code

[@shlomonissenbaum3750]

so bc geographically Israel is the center of Jewish people this revives a dead (psak wise) mesorah ? preposterous. the mesorah is not passed down by grain of sand to grain of sand. a geographical location, space, has no authority on its inhabitants, rather mesora (transmission of body of wisdom and law received originally at Sinai) is from one generation of Jews to another generation of Jews. whatever geographical location a mesorah passed thru is entirely tangential Poland, morroco, Iraq, Yemen - it is not the 'space ' that binds the people who lived thwir but the communities of jews. the point is the Jews who HAPPENED to have live in those places decided Jewish law a certain way. those decisions are binding on successive generations of progeny of the Jews who HAPPENED to lived in those lands even if they move somewhere else. even if they moved to Israel. had the community of Israel survived as a whole and continued practicing according to T. Yerushalmi conceivably we could imagine that they would be like Ashkenazi vs. Sephardic vs. Hungarian vs. Yemenite traditions. just throw in the 'Israel' version. but alas there did not remain in Israel a contiguous community thru most of the exile and the last time Jews as a community practiced according to the psak of t.y. was well over 1600 years ago. that mesorah died a long time ago 😭. why don't you go try to revive the mesorah of the 10 tribes for the communities of shomron and the galil while you are at it. go search for anthropologically sound descriptions of how Eliyahu and Elisha haNavi practiced halacha and reconstitute that for menashe and ephraim! so if in the year 250 a jew moved from Bavel to Israel he would have kept the traditions of Bavel. and vice versa. just like today a Sephardic Jew would not adopt Ashkenazi practice just bc he moved from Morocco to France (which once upon a time in a galaxy far far away was a major center of Ashkenazi jewry) . of course the mere suggestion is foolish bc the dust of France has no halachic authority. well buddy, news flash, neither does the dirt of Israel as holy as it may be (except of course in laws directly tied to the physical land) so today's Jews who live in Israel are not subject to any mesorah passed down by any inanimate regvey adamah but the decisions made by people who proceeded them the geography of where is ancestors lived is just a descriptor. this whole discussion is poreach ba'avir on a terribly mistaken notion of what Jewish law is about. גסות רוחך גרמה לך להגות דיעות משובשות בשרשן עד כדי גיחוך.

[@paiuteman1]

Good teachings but he speaks too slow.

[@jonathanm.8646]

Turn up the speed. 1.5 is good.

[@markbr5898]

I would not say he speaks slowly at all. In fact, he is extremely eloquent.

[@sasha8329]

indeed@@markbr5898

[@user-of1kq6qt1j]

@@markbr5898 exactly he thinks well before speaking

[@sarukeshel6429]

@@jonathanm.8646 I do this!!

[@otracuentaperra4290]

About 85% of the Jewish people are secular .

[@moraymond9630]

actually in Israel 85% of the jews are traditional or observant

[@StephenGordon87]

@@moraymond9630 No, the Hilonim (self-described secular Jews) make up 43.2% of Israel's population according to a 2018 census. This means 57% of Israelis are traditional or observant. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hiloni

[@mikhailfinkel3288]

Time to restore Patrilinel descent.

[@liramtassat5311]

Patrilineal descend was never practiced in Judaism, except in some later sects such as the Karaites, who themself admit there is a dispute concerning this matter in their own environment. Read Ezra chapter 10 and see who's right.

[@mikhailfinkel3288]

Liram tassat It was aways patrilineal before time of Mishna. Rehovam, the son of Shlomo and Amoniti women was chosen by Hashem to be a King, and king can't be the one who is not a Jew. So G-d considered him a Jew.. Ezrah and all Ktuvim never even close in authority to Humash, and Humash all across is patrlineal. Take Ki Tize. Ezrah did what he did because most women taken were from prohibited nations, besides Egiptian ones, which are allowed. It is difficult to comprehend such a strange thing Ezrah did, that he sent away egyptian wives.

[@eliyahum4285]

We went to maternal decent when we became a conquered people and could no longer protect our wives and daughters from our enemies. Prior to that it was always paternal.

[@eliyahum4285]

@@liramtassat5311 Wrong!! Read the Torah.

[@shlomonissenbaum3750]

and remove matrilineal descent so what have you gained, you are still leaving a problem with half of the intermarried population. sounds like an overtly sexist idea to me just trying to remove the important status women receive by Jewish law.

[@RabbiMosheBernstein1]

Surely the Shulchan arouh is accepted and obligatory to the entire Jewish people. And one who says it does not it is heretical opinion.

[@akivatalansky]

Who decided that this is heretical?

[@jarousse2095]

Karo himself says in his responsas, that it is forbidden for those who follow Rambam as well as their descendants to turn their backs on the Halakha of Rambam, would he have voluntarily transformed Jews into heretics

[@RabbiMosheBernstein1]

@@jarousse2095 The author of the Shulchan Aruch, Rabbi Yosef Karo, had a Magid sent from heaven who informed him that the book of laws he was writing would be accepted by all the people of Israel. After all, if there is an individual who thinks that the Shulchan Aruch is not binding on him, then the rule says that his opinion is invalidated by the majority of the people, meaning that his opinion is nullified regarding the opinion of the public who accepted the Shulchan Aruch. A personal opinion, in this case, is Btela meaning nullified in comparison with the majority of the public.

[@jarousse2095]

@@RabbiMosheBernstein1 another Chabad madness, the responsa came after the shulkhan aroukh so the responsa has more value and even in the case if your madness was true, then for the tefillin at hol hamoed he would have decided and he would not have said at all the world to do what it wants

[@jarousse2095]

@@RabbiMosheBernstein1 you are Chabad, stop your hypocrisy, beit yossef said Zohar vs gemara, it is the gemara who wins, your rabbi said Zohar so I deduce that you qualify your rabbi as am ha'arets