Difference between a PWM & MPPT Solar Controller (Real Life Example)

This video describes the difference between a PWM & MPPT Solar Controller with a practical demonstration. The practical demonstration shows an EPEVER 20A PWM and a 20A MPPT connected to the same model solar panels and batteries in order show a real life example of the difference in performance between the two.
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[@dannystrachan475]

Basically...if you're building a large solar system, get a mppt charge controller. For a small 12v system, get a pwm charge controller and a extra solar panel for better results. Nice video. Brilliant explanation of how both controller work.

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Thanks mate - glad you enjoyed. You're pretty much on it. Even If you have a 12V system and get a higher voltage panel (like 38V) you should use an MPPT. A pwm is best suited to a 12V panel charging a. 12V battery.

[@owenbruce4120]

24 volt system changes the whole equation, 31.8 volt panels match very well to pwm for 28-30 volt charging...simplicity and cost effective. MPPT is good for voltage matching, that's the main plus ...thanks for the demo⚡

[@trevorann-marieclegg1382]

This Video Explains in very simple layman's terms why an MPPT is the better option. Along with a more detailed explanation. He does this in just over 5 mins. BRILLIANT > thank You so much . If this was an American Guy or Shiela (LOL) explaining, we would probably be 30 mins plus. Thanks Bruce

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Haha thanks Bruce! Glad it helped

[@rabeelmirzavlogs]

This is true practical demo which i was looking for. Thanks

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Glad it was helpful!

[@user-gp3vu3mx7g]

شكرا لك اخي الكريم

[@yusifsuleiman5502]

Based on this experiment, I will not use high voltage panels arrangement with pwm controller. Thanks for the information

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Mppt for higher voltage.

[@yusifsuleiman5502]

@@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545 I just changed higher voltage’s series connection of panels to parallel connection on pwm charge controller. Thanks again

[@baselcommodities1353]

Great explanation, really helps newcomers like me. Cheers from Brazil

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Thanks mate. Glad it helped

[@engr.ireniyiayo-philip3955]

The best explanation 👌. Weldone

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Thanks a lot!

[@727jetjumper]

kudos for actually fusing (breakers/interrupters) on your lines.

[@KumoTvofficial]

nice ,im a new member here👍

[@lawrencedavidson6195]

On my small system of 240 watts, I have been using a PWM for 15 years now and it has worked very well except for the slightly incorrect voltage and amperage displayed. I will be upgrading to an MPPT early next year and adding more panels. Thanks for the video and greetings from sunny Jamaica.

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Hey Lawrence - that’s cool. What brand controller is it? Mppt will be good for you if expanding the solar panel array! Plenty of sun in Jamaica like Aus.

[@lawrencedavidson6195]

@@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545 I am currently using a 30 amp PWM Sunforce controller. Yes lots of sun like Austrailia. I have family in Australia BTW.

[@jussikankinen9409]

Can even 2 chargers in same battery, dont measure voltages but impedance

[@lawrencedavidson6195]

@@jussikankinen9409 Actually, I now have two MPPT charge controllers on the same 100ah LiFePo4 battery. Everything is working well and the 1000 watts of panels are supplying about half of my homes power.

[@Electronzap]

Good info.

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Glad it was helpful!

[@JamesShisiah]

nice

[@jeoffer]

For small systems PWM is adequate. If you want more amps from PWM add another solar panel to compensate.

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Well yeah you could. I think the key point here is - a pwm is fine for small systems where the solar panels voltage is close to the batteries voltage.

[@yoandre5185]

Hey, in the video u refer to the other test between mppt and pwm but with 12V panels. Is this video no longer available? Thx in advance

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Hey mate - sorry I don't think so. Do you know what test I was talking about specifically?

[@bmwkwi]

Hey mate. Question on the breakers in your videos. I'm putting a Noark Switch MCB DC 2 Pole 40A 360V non-polarised breaker on my camper van. Same model as you have here, a Ex9BP-N. Do I just put the 8 B&S - and + from the solar panel into the bottom of the Noark, (one each side ie. one to each screw) then out the top (load side) then connect the MPPT solar in via Anderson plugs like you wired up here?. (I want to protect MPPT and be able to isolate panels with the Ex9BP-N). I'm thinking of adding Andersons 50a connectors to the breaker wiring too, both ends so will have permanent Anderson connectors each side (input and output) of the breaker. Any issues in having Anderson connectors attached to the breaker wiring? reason, my MPPT then can be unplugged and taken out into the portable solar when not taking the camper trailer with me, example: going to the beach and just taking fridge, solar panels and battery, and of course the mppt. Also, last one, why the different breaker with red switch lever and not to same breakers ie. both Ex9BP-N's? Cheers!

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Hey mate. Thanks for the message. Yes you can connect pos and neg of solar into the breaker from your panels then out to the MPPT. An anderson plug on either side is also fine and a good idea for your application - ie to unplug and use elsewhere. No reason for using a different breaker only that’s what I had on hand. If you look at my other video I use a heavy duty battery isolator switch and fuses on the cable to isolate from the battery to the mppt/distribution. This is a better option over a circuit breaker if you have big loads from the battery - like an inverter.

[@droneskyview7808]

I have a mppt eleven tracer and the volts are high but the amps is really low any suggestions?

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Hi There - do you have any more information?

[@rm6857]

26W from PWM in this example. If you use 24V battery, it would be 52W, because from MPP down, power is almost linear. Basically no difference between PWM and MPPT, or maybe 2Watts would be with those panels and 24V battery.

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Correct. Minimal difference in power loss between the two if your solar Vmp is close to your charging voltage. But the higher your solar voltage vs battery/charge voltage the higher your energy loss in a linear relationship.

[@rm6857]

@@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545 Good to see, there are some people who understand it. Not just MPPT good, PWM bad.

[@pltspemula]

More expensive more quality 🇮🇩👍

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Agreed!!

[@jasonga]

So how do you adjust the charge amp to suit your batterys????

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

What do you mean?

[@mussemaahmed1770]

How many Amp .breaker needed for for 4 200watt solar panel.

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Hi Mussema - depends. Did you wire them in parallel or series?

[@eiouldelarosa8368]

hey when pv is off on my pwm epever it shows 12.5 v but the battery icon is only 2 bar why like this

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

12.8v should be 100% right% I think this is an error with the controller firmware because it thinks float is 100%. It is annoying that’s for sure but nothing you can do I don’t believe.

[@robertcormier242]

I wish someone would open up the backs to show the difference

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

I can do it if you like.

[@swedesspeedshop2518]

must be a steaming pile around there somewhere ?

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

nah just me....

[@ToddM452]

I believe if your just wanting a maintenance charge on some rv batteries the ppm controller should be just fine 2 panels wired parallel

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Yeah mate if you don't care about how much of the power is used from your panels - ie just for maintenance it wouldn't matter. If your trying to maximise the power out of your panels then it might.

[@JM-yx1lm]

So what's the point other than using a higher volt panel?

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Very little point if you are using a small 12V system. Typically when you start using larger systems you use higher voltage panels and run them at higher voltages. This is when MPPT's come into their own.

[@fratermus5502]

MPPT will, on average, make ~15% more power in daily power harvest. There are scenarios where it will be more (habiltually low battery bank voltage, low ambient temps) or less (Absorption stage, warmer ambients). So it's a horses-for-courses thing. The big advantage of higher-voltage panels is they tend to be cheaper by the watt. Used 24v panels can be 1/3rd the cost of new 12v.

[@istopedthewuhanlabfunding6351]

OooozzzY

[@henschelchabala6954]

Hello..Great video I'm confused dont know if its normal,my 24V 300watts panel charge my 12V 200ah gel battery with 40A 12/24 PWM charging controller ,the confusion is if the sun is high I see absorb of about 13.6v and sometimes even float.But the moment the sun is down the volt drops to 12.6v or 12.7v sometimes even without load is it normal? or is there anything wrong?

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Hey Mate. I think this is normal. Can you check your battery specifications online and check what it's 100% capacity voltage is? Generally a lead acid battery is 100% full at around the 12.8V mark. I'm assuming during the day the battery is full and the mppt is sitting in float at about 13.6V with little to no amps going in - can you check this? When the sun goes down and the MPPT is not charging the battery will go down to 12.8V which is it's 100% voltage when there is no charge or load on the battery. Hope this helps. Zach

[@henschelchabala6954]

@@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545 hello thank you...I checked online I never found it's 100% capacity voltage but it says it requires more than 15A for it to be fully charged...the solar isc is 9.83,the imp is 8.86A.if I continue charging it can it get damaged nd if I use mppt charging controller how many amps will be increased?

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

@@henschelchabala6954 Hi. Can you share the battery brand and model with me? Thanks.

[@henschelchabala6954]

@@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545 Brand.battery king Model:gel battery 12V 200ah

[@rm6857]

It is normal, because for this "smaller" battery its kinda high charging current. Higher charging current, higher the charging voltage to push it there. One option is to add second battery, second one is to limit your maximum charging current.

[@rexgeorg7324]

Batteries prefer a trickle charge than a power surge mate

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Hi Mate - AGM batteries are should be charged by a Bulk, Absorption, float charging profile. 'Trickle' charge occurs during the float stage. See manufacturer's spec for charging their batteries resources.fullriverbattery.com/fullriver-battery/charging-instructions/batteries.pdf

[@rexgeorg7324]

@@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545 cheers

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

@@rexgeorg7324 No worries!!

[@rexgeorg7324]

@@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545 If manufacture worried, we wouldn't be using antiquated batteries still

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

@@rexgeorg7324 You miss understood the phrase.

[@buzzdev]

Where goes that wasted energy into, on the PWM controller?

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Hey Buzzdev - from my understanding PWM acts like a switch by turning on and off very quickly. It works out the required amount of time on vs off so the average V over a time is reduced to the required charging voltage eg14V. This then means all of the energy from the panel is just not used - 'wasted'. Like turning a light on and off - there's power available but only a % is used when it is on. There are other losses within the controller which are dissipated as heat. Hope this helps.

[@ramzg5402]

When the amperage is reduced means better than the increased one.

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Hi Ramzi - the more amps the more power.

[@Reelix]

TL;DW: PWM is cheaper, but you should get an MPPT (Similar to batteries for storage - Lead Acid is cheaper, but you should get a Lithium)

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Get what you pay for. Only time PWM is not too much better than MPPT is when you are charging a 12V battery with a 12V solar panel. Minimal difference in power harvest between the two.

[@rm6857]

@@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545 or 24V battery with 24V panel, or 36V battery with 36V panel, or 48V battery with 48V panel. Basically if you choose panels close to battery voltage, difference is not more than 5-10%.

[@rm6857]

I just got 12V 100Ah used AGM battery for 30USD, when its not usable i can get back in recycle centre 20USD back. Should i get Lithium for 200USD?

[@jussikankinen9409]

Better and cheaper panels cause mppt can use 240v panels

[@Micexxx]

MPPT also uses more power than pwm. So you are not getting a whole lot more.

[@sunbiasolaroffgridsolution6545]

Nah not entirely. Really depends on your solar panel or solar array's operating voltage. If you've got 60Vmp of solar coming in charge a 12V battery a PWM would enormously less efficient than an MPPT.

[@jussikankinen9409]

Maybe in 2002

[@crpth1]

Playing devil's advocate! Don't be so hasty drawing conclusions! ;-) PWM CAN be your preferred choice if you consider ROI (return of investment) on a properly set/designed system! PWM are dirty cheap, in comparison mppt are very expensive. That is a given. With this said, we also know that pwm become more inefficient as we step further away from it's ideal point! Meaning if you design your system from the beginning considering this issue. Your potential losses will be minimal and your ROI will be max! Example: Use 12v (nominal) panels, to charge a 12v battery! Instead of using much higher voltage panels (expensive mistake), to then bring it down back to 12V (even more expensive)! Seems basic, seems logical (and it is)! Although you step away from this. To show case your video example! Making the mppt sound like the "perfect solution"! When in reality it's simply a wasteful way to ditch money! Or in other words on this video example. You end up correcting one design mistake, by adding an expensive correction step! A good analogy would be to put an expensive cork, after making the hole on the boat! LOL or Oops! :-) Cheers