4TF Console Face-Off: Xbox Series S vs PlayStation 4 Pro: Elden Ring, Cyberpunk, Witcher + More!

[@fengxii]

Great example of how raw GPU power is far from the full picture

[@GeneralKenobi69420]

I mean, duh. The series S has more RAM, a (much) better CPU, a SSD, a GPU architecture that must be like 7 years apart and most likely a myriad of software optimization due to having more recent hardware. I'm not really sure what people were exactly expecting (nor what the point of this video really is)

[@remowind1578]

Yeah, a completely shitty PS4 CPU is holding back the GPU. What a great example of a silly bottleneck.

[@degenplanet]

all Microsoft had to do is repurpose their original xbox x with a better cpu but hey..

[@lawyerlawyer1215]

If the rest of the hardware is nearly 7 years old. Then yes , the GPU clearly “isn’t the whole picture” But if the hardware is half decent and RECENT , THE GPU is 90% of the picture …

[@jamesrouse3466]

True, but the argument can't be dismissed outright. TFLOP numbers are still a decently reliable gauge of GPU performance if both products use the same or similar architecture (i.e. Xbox Series X vs PS5).

[@emma6648]

The Series S really is a little beast for a good price, especially with game pass too, its a great deal for people who just wanna play many great games at a decent quality and frame rate

[@Tyler-sf4kv]

Exactly why I got one this black Friday. Plus it's pretty easy to set up an emulator on it, so it's kind of a no brainer to me

[@rickyfelan]

Shit in some stores the Series S is even cheaper then the PS4 Pro

[@tonybalony1028]

Series S is more for a kid I had a series s and I always felt like I was missing out so I got the Series X to go with my PS5 👍

[@majesticcamels4198]

One x is better.

[@TheBean87]

@@majesticcamels4198only if you’re playing 30fps.

[@vanceg4901]

Was impressed with how good FSR2 looks on my Lonovo budget laptop. Way better than older anti aliasing techniques in many games. I know most of you are used to SSD speeds but I've only experienced it recently, so nice to get into games in a few seconds. Feels like a luxury.

[@219SilverChoc]

Any good implementations, sadly my only experiences is the broken implementation in Deep Rock Galactic and the blurry one in Witcher 3, I can't get over how they literally disable the sharpening option when FSR2 is selected lol.

[@vanceg4901]

@@219SilverChoc - In Witcher 3 FSR2 looks good on the Quality setting for my PC. Anything higher reduces performance.

[@puppy.shorts]

I know its just amazzzzing

[@mechanicalmonk2020]

I literally bought two of my friends SSDs because I was tired of waiting around in co op games for them to load in 🤣

[@219SilverChoc]

@@vanceg4901 It worked well from a quick test on my PC, but il have to add a small amount extra sharpening to get close to how it used to look. Would rather take softness over the pixelation on PS4 Pro or the oversharpening that the default sharpening can cause.

[@Orain88]

A really good example for comparison would have been the recent Resident Evil Remake 2 and 3. RE3 is especially impressive on the series S with RT and 120 fps modes. Doom Eternal is another big standout on the S for having 1440 60fps and 1080 120 fps modes.

[@VTorner]

The two games you mentioned are examples of great optimization. Cyberpunk, Elden Ring and GTA V on the other hand...

[@Orain88]

@@VTorner I'm a little spoiled having a solid screen with freesync premium, for me the framrate fluctuations on series S rarely impact the overall experience. That said, now my ps4 feels extra worse to play since any fps dips are super noticeable. With the right display you really won't even notice poor optimization on series S. You hear them mention this a lot on digital foundry and for people questioning if it's worth the display upgrade, I can say with certainty it absolutely is. Also, a game like Plague Tale Requiem massively benefits from the 40 fps mode you only get with a 120hz or higher screen.

[@main_tak_becus6689]

@@Orain88 I have a pc freesync 1.0 monitor, will it be usable for Series S? The range is 40-72hz

[@Orain88]

@@main_tak_becus6689 I'm not sure. Freesync 1.0 is pretty old right? I'm not super familiar with the full range of compatibility of this stuff. I can tell you I have a 60 hz freesync screen as well and that seems to work fine so long as the fps stays high enough but it doesn't maintain as much smoothness as my high refresh rate screen since it has low frame-rate compensation features that helps smooth out any big performance dips. I don't think series S or any 9th gen console for that matter can take full advantage of a 72hz display. It only offers 60hz or 120hz. I would think that in 60hz mode with freesync enabled it ought to work most of the time save for severe framerate drops, but I don't know for sure.

[@woodysrevenge39]

@@VTorner gta 5 is just disgusting on XSS in performance mode

[@jonathanlee726]

It’s always fun seeing what the-little-console-that-could is capable of! Loved the video!

[@jaimemrls29]

I agree. Microsoft have really outdone themselves this time. Good thing it's early in it's life cycle so we can watch it struggle for years to come.

[@rinkumultani6515]

what could serie s do?= no 1 knows except falling way below 1080 p and missing ray tracing from most new games

[@theseventhdman]

@@rinkumultani6515 L

[@rinkumultani6515]

@@theseventhdman agree calling series s next gen console is stupid when its missing ray tracing in almost all games and have lower resolution then ps4 in few games

[@SuperRamio64]

@@rinkumultani6515 "Next-Gen" Doesn't just refer to graphical capabilities. Nintendo Switch is considered a 9th Generation console.

[@ajgamingcomparisons]

And Series S does all that at 50-60% less power consumption compared to PS4 Pro.

[@avocadopictures9706]

I’ve been considering getting a Series S after selling my old laptop for the last couple of days but couldn’t find any recent videos that go in-depth on how it’s been performing overall, your timing is incredible.

[@pastqr]

The series s is amazing for its price.

[@austin4700]

Definitely spend the Xtra money and get the series x, next time you watch digital foundery you will be happy you did

[@mrglass7133]

You can't beat the performance and the visuals that you get for the price it's an amazing little console..... Especially with a 1440p monitor

[@TruthIsKey369]

For the price and if you have a VRR screen it's a nobrainer.

[@343ishill]

@stefan Or they could just spend the extra $200 on buying video games...

[@HuGiv5]

Series S problem is the RAM split, GPU is also kinda problematic but not as much. But for 199€ as it was here in Portugal on the holidays, absolutely insane deal.

[@guesswho5170]

It’s not a problem. Go play A Plagues Tale: Requiem and it looks a amazing. These guys just need to start using the next gen technologies and things will really start to shine. The Series S punches above its weight if anything.

[@Rresenden]

199€? Sempre vi a 249€ :| Quem me dera ter apanhado uma 199€ era compra certa.

[@lemmy154]

@@guesswho5170 are you developer?

[@xxYetterxx]

It's not really. More often than not its textures that are loaded into the RAM and if you're not targeting 4k you need significantly less RAM

[@j.cesarbraga]

That's not the problem, that's a feature part of the Xbox Velocity Architecture. It's up to the game developers to work with that for the benefit of their games. But the majority of games being released until now are being made with the 8th gen in mind still.

[@randytyson]

I already knew I made the right choice with the series s when it turned on faster & loaded the menu in seconds

[@belzebub16]

One enourmosly useful feature I love about the Series S/X is the Quick Resume feature, which is overlooked too often imho.

[@DeanT1987]

I’ve gotten so used to it that last month I bought a PS5 and forgot that it wasn’t the standard on PlayStation. I was pissed when I had to do a whole boss battle on GOW after I had switched over to Ratchet and Clank lol

[@bizmonkey007]

Quick Resume sort of ruined my experience with the Series S. Games would too often refresh completely and some weren’t supported at all (the Outer Worlds). It didn’t play well with online servers either, even for single-player games. It badly needs to be fixed.

[@Steinegal]

@@bizmonkey007 yeah it doesn’t work well with online games and some games does experience bugs after resuming, but for me playing mostly offline it is superior to having to completely reload the game even though it is fast.

[@icarus9980]

when i used my uncles xbox series x that’s the feature i found most impressive and that i missed the most when i got my ps5

[@d.a.3003]

@@bizmonkey007 obviously it can't work properly with online games, do you think that the servers will stop the game for other players too, waiting for you? LoL For single-player games, in my experience, it works very, very well.

[@Beaut_Beau]

I love these sort of videos with an interesting premise, fantastic work as always Oliver!

[@mauriciosanchez9237]

Back in the day DF upgraded HDD to SSD, it would be interesting to see that more leveled comparison. I upgraded my PS Pro to WD SSD and makes great difference as you guys absolutely know.

[@TecraX2]

Since Last-Gen consoles lacks hardware decompression, loading times are often bottlenecked by the Jaguar CPUs in the PS4 Pro. This is also the reason for why the improvements in loading times while playing Last-Gen games on Current Gen consoles, scales with the increase in CPU performance rather than Storage Speed. However, having an SSD in a Last-Gen consoles can still provide great improvements over a mechanical drive, primarily when it comes to Random Access, due to the much lower Seek Time!

[@04Saleen256]

@@TecraX2 yep, in many games, the simple swap from a HDD to SATA SSD (or even external USB SSD) in these older consoles results in like a 50% cut in most loading times and way less pop-in. Night and day difference.

[@denisruskin348]

Good 1080p screen, Series S and GamePass is a formidable, value-oriented and ready to go gaming combination.

[@hopepeho]

Yep, I bought mine for an old 1080p plasma TV that I wasn't using and it's been amazing with GP. I only bought it on a whim and I ended up using it far more than I thought I would.

[@Gervasolaporta]

yep

[@SalivatingSteve]

If you wanna play Cyberpunk on a last gen console, it’s best to use an external SSD to help the asset streaming so you’re not waiting for textures to load in.

[@GotSawst]

What about a external SSD on PS5 or Series X for playing Cyberpunk? Would it play even better? 🤔

[@Kareemisag]

@@GotSawst well I don't think you can use a external SSD on the series x and don't know how the ps5 handles an external SSD

[@kamilciura7953]

In case of PS4 Pro, it is best to replace the HDD with SSD. The console have SATA3 interface - there are bottlenecks elsewhere that make it impossible to utilise this bandwidth fully, but it still helps massively in terms of loading times and texture pop-in. Unfortunately, launch PS4 and Slim use SATA2 which means difference between stock HDD and SSD is almost none. In general, if someone is stuck with PS4 Pro as their main/only gaming machine for foreseeable future, getting a SATA3 SSD is definitely a worthy upgrade.

[@SalivatingSteve]

@@GotSawst no because Series X version would require using the faster internal SSD.

[@conza1989]

Just right off the bat, what an awesome idea to compare these, I really like it, we've all seen S vs X and PS4 Pro vs One X, but this is a very interesting idea so kudos, even if it's obvious at the end I don't think a lot of people have thought of comparing these two.

[@zalankhan5743]

There is a Series S vs One X video on the Channel

[@juanestrada7757]

@Zalan Khan they stated that in their comment.

[@zalankhan5743]

@@juanestrada7757 yeah hadnt watched The Whole Vid at this point

[@BerkleyJones]

Also a factor that some may want to take into account. The Xbox Series S Power consumption is around half of the Ps4 Pro. This was the deciding feature for me for my Mobile Home running on battery storage. Also, after playing on a PC with a 3070, the Series S absolutely punches above its weight. I'm Very Happy with the Series S.

[@OneLastScholar]

Yeah, Eurogamer made an article on this. Series S is by far the most energy-efficient console out there (not counting the Switch) and blows a PC out of the water in this department.

[@BerkleyJones]

@@OneLastScholar oh, Cheers mate. Gonna go find it and have a read. I think its amazing how much graphical fidelity they can push out of this console at just 75-80 watts. 👍

[@jimj78]

@@OneLastScholar I mean, it's obvious. A 720p machine compared to a pc will definitely use less power

[@YCStudios_greece]

​@@jimj78It's around 1440p to 1080p

[@OneLastScholar]

@@jimj78 If you think a XSS is a 720p machine you need to study more about the current-gen consoles before you comment on them. :)

[@recordatron]

Another cracking video Oliver, great to see how well you've integrated into the Digital Foundry ecosystem 👍

[@TurboXray]

"cracking"????

[@emiloguechoons9030]

@@TurboXray Brit speak for "great"

[@notthebees2950]

Itz chewzday innit bruv

[@recordatron]

@@notthebees2950 fetch me a bo'oh o wa er bruv.

[@iChronical]

Would've been nice to see if the pop in with Cyberpunk improves with installing an SSD in the Pro.

[@Benger2185]

It’s beautiful imo. I would not recommend ssd on an original ps4 with cyberpunk, because it is limited to SATA II read speeds but it’s still a great play through on all consoles and pc

[@j_mick69]

Great video! The analysis between Series S and last gen consoles is very intriguing. I’m not sure if it would make enough of a difference to justify another video, but I’d be interested to see this same head-to-head breakdown, but with PS4 Pro utilizing an internal SSD instead of the stock HDD. Interested to know if the SDD on PS4 Pro would help with the texture streaming issues that lag behind Series S

[@XBX1MASTER]

Negligible. Updated my X1X to SSD and load times definitely improved but it doesn't have enough matching I/O architecture to keep up with asset streaming like the new gen.

[@AlexDeivid]

@@XBX1MASTERI put an SSD on XoX and same games changed a lot, Ascent for instance, the loading times fell from 2 minutes to 25 seconds, but I only see this degree of diferences on new games, at old ones the difference was little.

[@morgitory]

@Alex Deivid da Silva that makes sense as when I got the Xbox one x at the time there was no increase in drive speed as they couldn’t or didn’t increase it. They definitely did it on purpose but idk why

[@Loundsify]

@@AlexDeivid that's because the CPU has to decompress the level assets when loading so depending on their size this takes much longer, so the SSD makes very little difference as the bottleneck is the jaguar CPU cores.

[@victim2077]

Apart from SSD I would also let Pro run in 1080p mode without Super Sampling - framerates are a lot more stable and there's no checkerboarding artifacts, plus it's a lot more quiet (and I mean A LOT MORE).

[@anthonyrizzo9043]

Before this video, I would say I would take a series s all day, load times, longer shelf life higher fps. Also what some people don't understand is that eventhough the graphics power seems the same between the 2 consoles, the series s uses rDNA 2 which is way more efficient and it's clocked way higher and has a new features. Flops don't mean anything unless your comparing 2 of the same thing.

[@stansmith7445]

Higher graphical fidelity as well on the series s; devs just choose to sacrifice resolution for higher in game graphics settings. They could easily push for ps4 pro equivalent settings and get even better results at a higher resolution.

[@synicalfutilist4890]

First sensible comment ive read so far, your absolutely right. And throw in an ssd to the pro and those load times are much more impressive giving the console a lot more life and less of the 'wait-ache'. Also helps with pop in and stuttering

[@elwingy]

Tell that to xbox fanboys… there were all about them teraflops 😂

[@anthonyrizzo9043]

@@elwingy which generation are you talking about?

[@elwingy]

@@anthonyrizzo9043 current

[@Mrhandyhitman]

They need to revisit this while giving the PS4 pro an SSD upgrade

[@OmariRevolution]

Great video! Really goes to show that a lot goes into overall performance aside from raw GPU/memory differences.

[@tamaalit4913]

I'm a series s user and unless you're a casual gamer that doesn't care about quality and just wants to sit down and play for an hour or two and then watch KZbin or something else, buy a series s. If you cannot afford a series x or PS5, the series s is a good cheap option but if you're willing to spend 550 dollars on a console even if you'll just play for 1 hour or 30 minutes a day, buy a PS5 or Series X, both of them will give you a true next gen experience.

[@tesxfaye]

The little guy is holding up better than I expected

[@Krynis]

this video shows both that the series S is actually pretty decent for what it is, but also that the Pro is still a deceptively capable machine when properly utilized but I get why they would move away from older hardware and architectures.

[@mayen67]

The ram allotment on the pro and SS is not roughly the same! The series S has over 50% more with 8gb available, the pro has 5gb.

[@coolsteve1342]

Dont tell me, the os takes 3 gb on the pro

[@bltzcstrnx]

@@coolsteve1342 it's always around that. Usually between 3 GB and 3,5 GB of RAM reserved for the os.

[@killermoon635]

Ps4 pro is 5.5gb for games

[@GlobalGaming101]

A $250 console gets you access to a 20 year catalogue of amazing titles. What a deal.

[@RandomMan10]

Smart move from Microsoft for the budget games who want to play new gen games

[@mitchjames9350]

It would of been good if the S had a bit more teraflops, more memory and faster memory.

[@aboveaveragebayleaf9216]

I mean, when you consider that it runs at lower settings/resolution, is the amount of ram really an issue? It's a budget option for people who want to play new games, but aren't as worried about fidelity.

[@matthasl4164]

Own nothing and be happy little one's

[@blubbntroet]

When they finally leave last gen behind is where the new ones will start to shine. This finally help the Series S even more. Remember, PS4 and XBOX One games developed over time too

[@deathtrooper2048]

Truth is that games will look the same due to the series s being weaker than the one x

[@blubbntroet]

@@deathtrooper2048 I know what you mean but I don’t think so. UE5 hasn’t even started. Many new technologies are not really been taken advantage off and devs are not using them to full advantage. VRS and FSR for example will make engines more efficient but have rarely been used so far 😉

[@kprowler]

@@deathtrooper2048 So, you obviously have never gamed on a PC. The Series S won't hold anything back.

[@existentialselkath1264]

@@deathtrooper2048 a gpu bottleneck is the easiest to overcome. Last gen consoles were held back because they couldn't push the cpu or hard drive. The S shouldn't hold anything back, even if it has to run at lower resolutions or lower settings.

[@altramen7045]

@Existential Selkath idk man, devs keep saying how much they hate the series s and that it's actually going to hold games on xbox back. Microsoft should've done what Sony did, just make the series s the same as the x but without a disk drive.

[@ak2112]

I just grabbed an Xbox One X for $100 and I've been enjoying the enhancements to old Xbox One/360/Xbox games.

[@bombyo3634]

I would have got the 1 x but i got a series s that i threw away and got a series x.

[@innovade7887]

I'd swap in an SSD for some speedy loading since they're pretty cheap these days.

[@shanez1215]

@@innovade7887 It's an absolute game changes.

[@219SilverChoc]

@@bombyo3634 bruh, did you literally toss a brand new peice of hardware?

[@bombyo3634]

@@219SilverChoc i put it in storage some where. I hate the series s. I went and got a series x.

[@SamsonSilvo]

Already knew the Series S was gonna win out solely because of its vastly improved CPU. Raw GPU power only means so much when it's being severely bottlenecked by a tablet grade CPU and a 5400 RPM laptop hard drive, both of which being slow even by 2013 standards.

[@easyygo3008]

Say that to the series x which often gets outpaced by ps5

[@easyygo3008]

@Jacob Lmao, that's false. Ps5 usually wins, the magic teraflops was marketing, ps5 is basically on par as it has faster CU's. All games are identical through and through. For all the crap about the 9 tflops rhe xbots gave, it was utter BS

[@easyygo3008]

@Jacob Lmaoz it hasn't. Low software sales and the series s is the reason for that. God, xbox fans are unsufferable, they can't accept the truth that series x teraflops was just a lie. Ps5 is a much better system in the net, net. The difference is negible between both anyway.

[@SamsonSilvo]

Console fanboys... Gotta love 'em... /s

[@Jev55]

The Series S does exactly what I wanted it to do. Be a lower priced console for $250 that can run new releases at 1080p at either 30fps or 60fps.

[@deathtrooper2048]

The base ps4 can do 1080p 30

[@hectorsequi5252]

well... 1080p is very optimistic. In some cases the DRS goes lower than 600p

[@kasimahmed3841]

We have a series x at home but at uni I purchased a series s and it's been brilliant, played elden ring, cyberpunk, f1 jedi fallen order and they've all been pretty solid for the most part, if you haven't purchased it then it's definitely worth a cop

[@Scornfull]

@@deathtrooper2048 not in newer games from the past 3 years

[@chrisjerome4111]

120 to for next gen games

[@babyboy1971]

Thank you for this! My family gifted me a series S shortly after it launched and it got me back into gaming, and helped me through a really rough time in my life. The Series S also got my disabled girlfriend into gaming, which really gave us both immense joy. Who knew a 300 dollar console could be so good? I now have the series X and a PS5, but I still dearly love my series S and play it daily. For the price, and with game-pass, it really can’t be beat. I’m glad DF is giving it some love here. People love to hate it, but it has a rabid fan base, and I’m proudly in that camp of devotees. Series S is a tiny beast with a beautiful design and a unique soul.

[@DocRobotnik]

If ever there was a video that required the "that's bait" meme, this is it 🤣

[@Igolorbr]

More content like that, please! More Series S vs One S, X, and SX. Moar, please!! Great work, guys.

[@spvrda]

Am I supposed to be impressed? PS4Pro and XSS had a 4 year gap, same as OG Xbox and Xbox 360.

[@djayjp]

Pretty cool review of the state of these two thx! Good concept you came up with :)

[@nickduncan8171]

Interesting as the chip that's rumored to be in the next generation Nintendo Switch(NVidia T239, based on the T234) has a max power of 4 Teraflops. Of course for a portable machine it will be paired back, but for docked play it is nice to see that 4tf with modern features still makes for a nice machine. Also Nintendo Switch 2/+/Pro will have DLSS to help.

[@Ukzgamer1]

It will be around 2-3tf on the switch 2 but because it’s on a newer architecture it can probably match a ps4 pro

[@marleystar3]

Dude states rumors as facts

[@Ukzgamer1]

@@cinemascenes2010 I mean the first switch came out in 2017 and is weaker than the Xbox one which came out in 2013 and the Xbox one was already weak for 2013 standards

[@nickduncan8171]

@Dante I don't think people realize that PS4 Pro level performance with modern features on a 15W power limit is like... Insane. This isn't Nintendo doing the thing where they use outdated hardware, this is as fast as mobile chips get right now. Very much looking forward to more info.

[@Ukzgamer1]

@@cinemascenes2010 switch 2 will be dlss 2 compatible which will compensate for it being underpowered

[@kijuanadams5650]

I’ve waited years to see this thank you so much keep up the great work

[@prairiefarmer5994]

It’s worth noting that the Pro can take advantage of an SDD upgrade. Not as much as the PS5, but when I put an SSD in my Pro I absolutely noticed a difference in load times.

[@juraj_b]

got Series S for travels and it's been spectacular.. tiny but perfectly capable to boot any game quickly and enjoy it when travelling

[@davidbrown6976]

Same here, Sony could benefit from making a smaller sku as well.

[@charlestrudel8308]

for travel, yeah, i think since its way smaller, it makes more sense in such a scenario. (the hotel scenario mind you, not bus or train.)

[@pixeljauntvr7774]

@@davidbrown6976 No thanks. I'd prefer not to have another lesser console bottlenecking the generation.

[@YCStudios_greece]

​​@@pixeljauntvr7774o thanks I'd prefer a console that doesn't leak no the motherboard an issue pc and xbox doesn't have also consoles have fucked the world of graphical fidelity smoothens sound quality keyboard and mouse

[@butterflydreamer9649]

@@YCStudios_greece first learn what punctuation is, second the ps5 leaking was proven false like a week ago, hell it was obviously fake when it was first said anyway.

[@friedpuddycatgamer4682]

Would like to see the pro using an ssd. That's also a reason for a drop in quality.

[@ViciousRead]

Still playing on a 1080p 60” LED Samsung and I LOVE my Series S. If Microsoft were to make a newer model with newer specs, I’d preorder in a heartbeat.

[@daysgone3950]

The XSS is really great for value but if Microsoft designed the GPU to boost over 2Ghz, which is not unusual for RDNA2, it will be creally razy. PSP was unlocked to 333mhz in later years.

[@teehundeart]

Even just base Series X clockspeeds would probably help a lot on smoothing out rough edges

[@braedonlock3359]

They did allocate a couple hundred MB’s of RAM a year after release. Might not sound like alot but good for those ruff edges as you said. I don’t think they will change clock speeds but it’s definitely possible.

[@kimsoderholm9101]

I sold my ps4 pro to buy an series s and i only play battlefield 2042 on it. I have to say that the uplift in that game is insane. From 40-60 fps and a maximum of 64 players frame dips all over the place to a rock steady 60 fps at 128 players. Feels amazing to play the game now. I love the rush mode where 128 players is fighting over a very small piece of territory, complete chaos and it can only be experiences on a true next gen console. Series s even outperforms my gtx 1650 in some games like cyberpunk but in elden ring i get a smooth experience on my gtx 1650 at medium settings hitting 60 fps most of the time in the open world.

[@tears2040]

If you only play BF 2042 and getting this performances then just enjoy , as there’s no need to upgrade. 2-3 years from now we should get another update, price to performance ration nothing is better than Consoles 🔥

[@Hybred]

Why did you say the Pro and Series S run at very similar resolutions (without stating what those resolutions were) in Cyberpunk when even on a compressed KZbin video it's still so much clearer? Like here at 4:27

[@faves2064]

I love the Series S, just wish it had a disc drive so I can play my 360 games on it.

[@219SilverChoc]

It's great at last gen gaming with FPS Boost and the resolution boost some games have, Gears 2 and 3 use both even! But the lack of disc drive really hurts, I can get why to an extent though. If it had the 4k blu-ray player the X has, it would add alot to the already tight cost. If it had a basic blu-ray drive for back compat titles, consumers would be confused why discs only work on Series X. I sold my physical games and rebrought them all when they where on sale, but I don't think people who have large collections can really do that.

[@banguseater]

I really wish they could just add USB DVD drives support in the OS for 360 or OG Backwards Compatible like how you can use an EXHDD for it as well, and I;m assuming its because you have to download the backwards comp patch anyway so its not actually running on the disc or just another way to make more money in the Xbox store but it's really messed up having to not being to use your own collection.

[@MetalGearyaTV]

Many X360 games are dirt cheap on digital sales. Buy there.

[@belzebub16]

You can get Xbox 360 games either on the Store or through the Game Pass, but of course a disc drive would have been nice, still at the price point it's hard to argue about, when the PS5 Digital is 200€ more and also has no drive.

[@galaxymaster]

Yeah them not including a disk drive killed the system for me. I want physical ownership of my games. Not rent it for a system and if that one dies one day my stuff will be gone

[@machoke666]

You should've used a PS4 Pro with an SSD for a fairer comparison

[@mbsfaridi]

Always wanted his video. Thanks for he video Oliver 👍

[@MmntechCa]

I'm more a PC guy, but I do have a Series S for playing Game Pass games on the TV. To be perfectly honest, it's all most people need. Games on it still look great, play great, and it's an incredible value for the price.

[@YCStudios_greece]

​@@cinemascenes2010Do you have 40.000 exclusives on steam?

[@lllIIllIllllIIIIl]

I switched from the Xbox One X to the Series S in mid 2022 and didn't regret it one bit. As a GTA Online Player, the extra CPU power was very welcome. Going from sub 20fps in public lobbies to an almost perfect 60fps was a game changer.

[@-TriP-]

So a current gen machine is better than a last gen machine with a similar number of TFLOPS. Truly insightful, I'd have never guessed.

[@ZimmermanTelegram]

And it's cheaper too.

[@johnwest6977]

Now you know

[@Raider_X9978]

Series S is the true champion of this generation of consoles

[@fullauto86]

God i love this channel and these videos.

[@victim2077]

Great vid DF as always, but I have to rise one question: How does PS4 Pro with SSD running in 1080p mode without super sampling compares to Series S? I have to ask this because performance and frame rates should be a lot more stable (maybe even better) in this case.

[@Malothegoat]

It’s about the same

[@kranibal]

I learned a lot from this video. Thank you!

[@PrettyRagdoll]

I don't understand why people are excited a "Next gen" console is just slightly better than a console that came out years before

[@darthmaul589]

As an owner of both these consoles, the biggest difference is not in framerates or pixels. It's in decibels.

[@victim2077]

Run Pro in 1080p mode without Supe Sampling, your ears will thank you, plus frame rates are a lot more stable, not to mention lack of any visual glitches caused by checkerboarding.

[@Supersayainpikmin]

@@victim2077 That's the only way to use the Pro IMO. Stuff like the RDR2 checkerboarding just looked hidious, so getting native 1080p with the smoothest console version at the time was pretty cool.

[@net_news]

past-gen wars!!! this is DF Retro!!!

[@Mightyguybrush2]

I haven't watched DF for a while but I'm glad to see they are keeping the console war burning. Good work guys.

[@zengat123]

What about testing the PS4 Pro with a internal SSD?

[@rexthesheep]

It's far from a magic bullet, but we have a SSD in our Pro and it can help in even just making the system feel that little bit more snappy. I wonder how that closes the gap particularly with the asset streaming in C2077, the hitches in Callisto and stuff.

[@dmywololowol]

It doesn't. There's much more to asset streaming than just raw speed from your drive.

[@rexthesheep]

@@dmywololowol You are absolutely not wrong. It can depend on the game though. FF7 Remake is one game with notorious texture streaming issues that a SSD can help with. But that is just one example and like I said, putting a SSD in a Pro isn't going to magically fix everything.

[@TheSimsFocus]

I upgraded from a PS4 Pro to a Series S, thinking I wouldn't notice much difference. Boy was I wrong. As long as you're happy with 1080p, it's a phenomenonal console. But the PS5 is next on my list for that 4k goodness

[@rolig9303]

Choose the SX instead, i had a friend a religious PS user hating on anything but Pc and Ps, he bought a Ps5 2 years after it came out, he was happy with it mostly, he was saying things like: Okay Ps doesnt have Gamepass and the games are expensive but its worth it. (He bougth the console way overpriced (800€). He was always s.hitting on Xbox AND THEN i brought over my Series X i bought day one and he was blown away, couldnt believe his eyes, but still in denial then i showed him gamepass and some first party games… dude changed that day to Gamepass on Pc using the playstation only for call of duty xdd

[@smittyvanjagermanjenson182]

@Németh Roland the fact that ps5 doesn't have quick resume either is an absolute deal breaker in my eyes. Being able to play 5 separate games near instantly... that's what blew my mind, PCs can't even do this with out knowledge of how to physically make it work lol

[@illestcatnnebraska7331]

Gamepass is trash 🗑

[@dmywololowol]

You'll be disappointed. PS5 can barely run any games at native 4K.

[@TheSimsFocus]

@Dmywololo Wol Nor could the PS4 Pro but it still looked good. But of course the main reason I'm getting one is for the exclusives

[@porkysoda5899]

All current gen consoles haven’t been used to their full potential yet.

[@AzaiaMonota]

They hit their full potential the second they came out all you'll see after is devs being forced to better optimize their games on console because unlike PC these consoles are stuck with what was already considered mid tier power half a decade ago

[@DarkReturns1]

@@AzaiaMonota devs have barely scratched the surface, what are you talking about lol? No console that's ever existed has hit their full potential the day it came out....

[@AzaiaMonota]

@@DarkReturns1 what potential? games already far exceed what the consoles are capable of

[@DeegoL9]

I really enjoy these Series S comparisons to the One X and PS4 Pro. As an owner of both a Pro and One X the S was never the intriguing console but it is very fun to see these comparisons.

[@kennethbailey9802]

I have a series s, it's fine if you just want to experience games and not too worried about perfection, it's a huge step up over the older base xbox one.

[@lucid523]

@Kenneth Bailey yes, but also no the One X Definitely outperforms the series s but the only reason why the series s is fast is due to the SSD I seen people but an Outer SSD on the one x and it was pretty much like in the middle of consoles

[@kenbailey4827]

@@lucid523 the fast loading makes a huge difference, I dont touch my xbox one s anymore other than for as a dvd player. Also, the fact that the series s can hold state of multiple games is a nice bonus.

[@Malothegoat]

@@lucid523can your one x do 120 fps

[@jcfan1979]

Don't forget to mention Unreal Engine 5 in instances like the Matrix Demo were impressive showing off that the Series S can do difficult Ray Tracing. Hopefully developers will be more willing to push the little console harder when they don't have to focus on last-gen as a base. I still think it should have been given 6TFlops of compute and matching RAM to the Series X to really make the 1440p dream a more consistent reality. That being said games look great on a nice 1080p monitor or TV with high\variable refresh rates.

[@MisterReen]

Series S is too weak for real RT. Matrix was just a Demo, an impressive one for sure but don’t expect a lot of games with RT in the series S. Even the bigger consoles struggling with this.

[@FoxUnitNell]

I got a series s but got a 4k monitor instead of a 2k high refresh rate because the series s can still upscale to 4k as well as stream 4k videos. I noticed a few games had 4k too but they were the ori series.

[@tigerdefensesystems]

Its surprising how well last gen consoles could hold up today.... especially given the AMD Jaguar based APU, but installing a modern HDD or better yet sata SSD helps alot with performance, loading times, and texture loading. I'm sure many of the PS4 HDDs have already died out or soon to be and sluggish performance to begin with but thats what it was back then. Simple upgrade.

[@CrocoDylianVT]

one thing I noticed is that GPUs tend to age better than CPUs, a CPU and GPU combo might be perfectly paired in their moment but a few years forward and while the GPU may be able to still keep up, the CPU however does not, it's something I testing some games myself and looking at benchmarks as well, for example GTA V being able to run on graphics cards weaker than the one found in the PS4 at 60FPS simply cause they're paired with a CPU that can actually keep up, same thing even happened with 7th gen consoles, testing for example a Ryzen 7 3700U at 15W, the GPU will run at only 200MHz while the CPU can still run at full speed, testing Xbox 360 era games that ran at 30 FPS and my 3700U gets 60FPS, and looking at afterburner I see the GPU at 100% while the CPU is barely breaking a sweat, so I'm convinced in a few years we'll see something similar with current gen consoles where they'll still keep up graphically, but not "processorly", as I made up that word just now

[@ThomasCaiJinzhan]

Eh...weird comparison.....TF is never a benchmark of anything...and the PS4 pro's CPU class is at least 2 gen behind the SX, not to mention the storage is way slower. And then there's the SDK being used. PS4 pro games are essentially beefed up ps4 games while Series S games are toned down Series X games.

[@sergeleon1163]

Great video that also shows the fact that not all TeraFlops are the same (besides CPU and storage advantages from the Series S in this case) in a same way as on PC new architectures are able to achieve higher quality with newer techniques and also can't always be compared 1 to 1 amongst different manufacturers like AMD/NVIDIA/Intel

[@patjc6598]

The best advert for the Series S I have seen.

[@blcdrg]

i bought the Series S for a economy perspective, but i never expect more than 1080p, allways think that this is the ground, with a FSR monitor (witch i have) the console is amazing.

[@Sjm2685]

Next week DF will be comparing the Series S with the ps one.

[@cellspeed8682]

Spoiler: Series S will be superior in every regard and people will thank DF for this "great comparison"...

[@Panyc333]

I would imagine most people who spend the money on a TV that has VRR aren’t buying a Series S but a Series X.

[@BigSnipp]

The Series S is now $250. It's an incredible deal.

[@tech-ryze]

This is true. Much of the noise about it dying, is from people who want to do anything to kill off the console that doesn't load from optical disc. I'm a die hard disc user, and therefore my next consoles are a PS4 Pro and another 360 and PS3, for the future. I also want another PS2, or 1st gen PS3. HOWEVER! The Series S has become so hard to ignore - especially due to my having an Xbox One X, and seeing how much of my purchased content from the past 15 years is now sat waiting on that system as soon as I plug it into a fast network connection. I'll VERY likely impulse buy a Series S at some time in the next 18 months, and put it in a bedroom.

[@easyygo3008]

Is theft. Is a bad console. Just save money for the real thing

[@xMarkie]

@@tech-ryze I caved and impulsively bought a Series S for $200 cash brand new off of someone locally. It’s a great little console to have next to my beefy PC! I am getting the itch to buy a PlayStation next to the two and I am looking at buying a PS4 Pro to save money. I’m mainly looking to play the Older Uncharted games lol

[@tech-ryze]

@@xMarkie Yep - it's an easy 'extra' console. I have no plans to buy the Series X or PS5 for several years, as I've a lot of life to live that wont happen if I'm playing Gran Turismo or not paying for flights. The Series S might just edge its way in, if I find myself stuck at home for any reason.

[@xMarkie]

@@tech-ryze Sounds about right man! I just know you won’t regret it!

[@jaffaman99]

Be interested to see if cyberpunk benefits greatly from having an ssd in the ps4 pro

[@SquintyGears]

You can only put a sata ssd. I haven't tested but in theory it improves the first load time allot but asset pop in gets reduced much less. It's not in the same class of performance as the NVMe drives the new consoles get. But of course it's still an improvement.

[@jaffaman99]

Totally but the jump from HDD to sata SSD is more felt than SSD to NVMe in games. It def could help texture pop in with random reads being far superior on an ssd. DF’s own video on this showed the texture improvements in FF7 remake.

[@PumpedSmartass]

It probably reduce loading speeds and popups, but thats all.

[@jared8530]

Time to upgrade

[@smittyvanjagermanjenson182]

Still going to be CPU bottlenecked. SSDs are great, but they aren't magic, only able to go as fast as the CPU can go. Unfortunately the CPUs in 8th gen consoles are a joke. Pop-in and load times will get reduced somewhat, But you'll still see it get easily over taxed.

[@devonmarr9872]

If you have no PC or one x/ps4 pro and want to stay at 1080p you really can't do any better. Add gsme pass and emulation and you have a system capable of easily handling any 8th Gen and older game while being able to give a decent modern release experience.

[@VincentVanBro]

at 2:51 the difference in ambient occlusion is staggering. The PS4 Pro looks a generation older.

[@jhroyalty7]

It is a generation older

[@SimonStewart75]

Why do you think that is?

[@VincentVanBro]

@@jhroyalty7 big brain moment: they have very comparable raw compute, hence this video comparison, and my comment

[@PkStarstormAlfa]

I believe series S can easily deliver 1080p 30/60 fps for all the generation, even more achievable with fsr. And being able to play all current generation games at an acceptable/good graphics and performance settings, for that low of a price, its a wonderful machine

[@omarsabir1210]

They marketed it as a 1440p 60 fps console lol

[@PkStarstormAlfa]

@@omarsabir1210 some games, run at 1440p and many run at 60, some games run at 1440p/60fps, so there's no lie lol

[@smittyvanjagermanjenson182]

@Luis Cuevas I'm gonna need a list of these series S 1440p @ 60fps games lol. Specifically games that are S/X optimized, last gen titles don't count. Because the best thing I've seen on my series x is the Balanced mode some new games offer (sub 4k @60fps).

[@marcomilan3738]

@@PkStarstormAlfa yeah, some🤷 the problem is they said it could do both at the same time, and it hardly happens They also said that it was capable of ray tracing, there is close to zero titles that use the feature🤷

[@kenroyforrester156]

@Smitty Vanjagermanjenson and yeah dynamic 4k isn't 4k you hardly see game's running at full resolution on the bigger consoles let that sink in for you bud these new soo call next-gen consoles weak are weak from the s to x to the ps5 all are disappointing

[@jch010]

Here in 2024 and games included newest COD are still being cross-gen developed.

[@felspawn4841]

DF: TF is a meaningless point of comparison Also DF: Check out these TB device comparisons!

[@Terminatar98]

I think this kind of video highlights perfectly that TFLOPS are not the be-all and end-all comparison point. Especially when comparing two boxes with substantially different supporting hardware.

[@Terminatar98]

I just realized Oliver iterates this point at the end of the video as well, haha.

[@Wobbothe3rd]

​@Terminatar98 nobody ever thought TFLOPS was an important guage of anything. Average consumers can read specs like VRAM, only journalists and insiders even know what a TFLOP is. This whole video is pointless filler

[@zorastin]

It's df so whatever comparison makes Sony come out on top. They can't help themselves even this one which seems like they are praising xbox is really just a humble brag for playstation and to eventual have the whole console space sitting over xbox for holding the generation back.

[@vladislave7826]

7 years... Time flies by indeed.

[@renatoramos8834]

6 years

[@galaxymaster]

was the Pro tested with a SSD or the normal HDD? I gave mine a SSD and it is night and day

[@VariantAEC]

Indeed he wants to look at games that are still supported on Xbox Series S and those which stopped being supported a long time ago on OG components knowing full well PS4 Pro could see benefits in some games when using better and still officially supported SSDs instead of the standard 5,400RPM HDD that ships with the console. This was an exercise in showing us the obvious fact that newer software runs better in newer HW, not a true attempt to level the playing field based on the performance between the systems and even so PS4 Pro only looked really bad in The Calisto Protocol which was next gen focused from the start and The Witcher III which just received next gen support. GTA5 looks the same between the devices, but runs better at a higher resolution on Series S still not exactly a night and day difference. That SSD could have corrected poor performance in CP2077 and shortened loading times in Elden Ring bringing that 2016 console more in line with Series S in two of the five games showcased above.

[@04Saleen256]

Should do at least some testing with the PS4 Pro after swapping out the HDD for a SSD. I’d imagine a lot of pop-in and those loading times become way more competitive with a Series S. The One X vs Series S video had the One X running an external SSD, no?

[@fcukugimmeausername]

Let the battle for 720p begin!

[@existentialselkath1264]

The ps4 Pro is aiming for the best visuals possible on older games. Series S couldn't care less about visuals as long as it can run current games. Anyone complaining about the visuals on S is missing the point. I'd much rather be able to afford to play current games at all rather than have to spend double just to look pretty

[@jimmy3951]

A really good face-off, and i think the Series S and the Pro are just great value for people in the used market !

[@219SilverChoc]

more Pro as the Series S is digital only and still pretty new, probably gonna get a PS4 Pro too someday as ive missed out on a bunch of Playstation exclusives the last few years!

[@jimmy3951]

@@219SilverChoc a good choice, a ton of excellent 1st and 3rd party games

[@219SilverChoc]

@@jimmy3951 Yeah, just wondering if there's any examples of 3rd party games that are better played on PS4 Pro over Series S, or even better on there than PC? Wish PS4 could have the really great back compat Xbox One and Series has.

[@perfectlyslicedegg3348]

Ppl focus way too much on Tflops... There are certain games that run on the Switch that I never thought could.

[@Blindsyde5762]

I love my series s. I have the PS4 pro as well, and one thing I love about series s is how quiet and small it is as well. My pro is LOUD and slow

[@-dragsteR]

right? hahaha thats what im thinking. I had ps4 pro and sold it cuz was a plane with overheating with a stupid performance. No need to add the lie about the 4k beeing a reescalated 2k😹 Somethings wrong with this comparison

[@Sabakinno]

PS4 Pro is for enthusiast and Series S is for plebs and masses fully dependant on whats on gamepass

[@DRKeerl]

I have a Series S as a companion to my Series X. It's honestly a perfect console for my indies older gen titles. Ray tracing in most current gen console games is just ray traced shadows. While cool, not really a game changer imo. If I want that level of graphical fidelity, I'll play on my 3080 Ti.

[@vgnvideogameninja2930]

I've got my 4090 for the highest level of graphical fidelity and my Series X and PS5 for couch gaming in my living room on my 88" LG Z2 OLED.

[@maxmaxneolit]

At that price point, Series S made investing into any type of "upgrade" of your previous gen console futile, BUT, if you do have a ps4pro and no way to buy a new console in the next two years, buy a Samsung 870 QVO SATA 2.5 Inch Internal Solid State Drive, for like $70-$80, and slam it into an external case that supports UASP (usb attached scsi protocol), for example like Sabrent external case, pretty much any 2.5" external usb drive case with USB 3.2 Gen 1 (they are like $10-$15) and attach this to your ps4pro usb. You'll gain tremendous bump up in loading performance and streaming of assets in-game. In fact, just before CDPR messed up CP with later patches where they throttled down streaming to acomodate base ps4, I finished CP2077 on PS4Pro with this setup and I had great exeprience. No popup in game, no performance dips, it was superb (except those unavoidable occasional game crashes).

[@mr8I7]

Performance wise it's an easy win for the Series S. But if you consider what's the best games console overall right now I think it's a lot closer. So many good games have come out even recently for the Playstation 4 whereas the Series consoles are still building momentum.

[@tonyrivera8996]

The lack of noise on the S makes it a win in my book.

[@Telecuhubby]

Thank you for that clear explanation. It was pissing me off how certain devs and players were calling out series s and people were believing it's not a capable little box. No, it's not as strong as it's x brother or PS5 but it CAN do next gen gaming with ease if it optimized correctly. The chip architecture and available ram and higher speeds are WAAAAY stronger than a typical PS4 pro. Not all TFLOPS are created equal. Because it's a new gen RDNA 2 4 TFLOPS on an s would be like 8 on a last gen console so it's a strong little box. The bottle neck is going to be those 10gb of ram vs 16 on PS5 xsx and ray tracing quality. Besides that, if you can make a PS4 pro run Callisto protocol and cyberpunk on that old hardware the xsx should be able to atleast do 1440p 60fps (already shown it can do more on some games up to 120fps) on next gen games. It's truly an amazing little box. If I didn't have a PC ,Xsx, and PS5 already and I was in the market for a cheaper option it's by far the best for it's little $250 price tag.

[@SianaGearz]

I don't think you can expect Series S to hold up in all circumstances, specifically the GPU throughput (yes those teraflops) can rub against limits on geometry density and resolution-independent compute passes (particles, broadpass etc), not purely on the resolution. So i think we might see some compromised titles where it's not anybody's fault and not much can be done about that. But at least CPU performance and overall architecture are for sure a good match for current gen games in general. Do keep in mind that this a roundup of cross gen games, which have, compared to what modern consoles offer, really hilariously little CPU and storage throughput requirements, since they must run on last-gen systems which were quite deficient in these metrics from the get go when they released well over a decade ago now, and now it's really painful to try to release something on those and get anywhere near bearable performance, so modern system has an easy win, even if its GPU was same or slower. Though it's fair to say that modern GPU architecture achieves better hardware utilisation with more recent titles, so fewer of those theoretical teraflops are left burning power while not being utilised. And of course it's an extreme budget system; as such it's doing just fine! It's difficult to beat even just on marginal cost of a GPU only that you tack on to cost of building a productivity-only PC, not counting other sensible/necessary upgrades.

[@joe9966]

Devs probably know more about what happenes behind the scenes then you do

[@whatspadethinks]

The numbers geek in me always loves watching these Digital Foundry shootouts. However if I'm to be dead honest, they pretty much prove we are right and truly in the era of diminishing returns. I started watching this video on my smartphone screen and aside from the contrast differences in The Witcher 3 section there was just no difference between the two consoles. So, I paused the video got on my 50" 4K panel and started the video again...Now of course, there IS differences to be seen, but even from just 6 ft away there is just not some mind blowing improvement. A few textures are sharper (if you sit and focus, no action on screen with the video paused) and the frame rates on the S made a few stretches of Cyberpunk smoother...but in the action, playing the game for hours I just don't think anyone who isn't a tech wonk like most of us would notice or even care. The last console evolution that was truly night & day was the sixth generation to the seventh generation (PS2 to PS3). The upgrade from PS3 to PS4 was when the diminishing returns started to creep in. I know, gameplay is paramount, graphics are superficial but still... I get into each console generation towards the end of them anyway usually because I have a big backlog and first iterations of new hardware is often hampered by bugs and growing pains. My PS4 Pro has 50+ games on it that I haven't even started and with sales & the PSPlus game libraries I will have plenty to keep me busy until the PS5 Pro comes along, hopefully in black.

[@eqjase]

Series S can be had for like 250 if you look around. There is no better value in gaming period. Even a used optiplex with a GPU doesn’t touch that value anymore.

[@JDisclmd]

Its pretty much 350 since it doesn’t play physical games. Might aswell get the ps5 digital for 400 than. Better games, more games and way better quality

[@kraenk12]

A PS5 is only 100-150 more and three times as fast! Much better. Value

[@kraenk12]

@@JDisclmd much much faster too.

[@eqjase]

@@JDisclmd not sure I understand, what makes it 350? You talking about adding storage? I could argue that with internet speeds what they are in most urban areas the storage matters way less. However for a rural gamer more storage is totally worth it. If you absolutely need the storage the PS5 digital would be a better value.

[@JDisclmd]

@@eqjase disc drive

[@gordonfreeman9733]

Amazing video! Thanks!

[@Diegonando64]

the AMD Zen 2 cpu is very, very underrated. The closest thing considering the size of the cache memory is a Ryzen 7 4700G (CPU-wise), we are talking about 8 cores with a fairly decent IPC capable of using SMT (16 threads) last generation consoles have 8 cores without SMT and offensive single-thread performance, that's why last generation games have poor frame-rates, yes, I mean GTA online on PS4/one

[@ghost25killer]

considering that the PS4 is priced about the same as the Series S this is a good comparison tbh. Wish Sony would make their own version of the XSS to make it more affordable since most devs already have to consider XSS specs when making games these days

[@griffgames9538]

Sony selected a $100 SKU split by offering the UHD Blu-ray reader version and discless digital version models. Cerny emphatically did NOT want a spec gulf between the two PS5 model SKUs, apart from disc drive/no drive differentiator. It probably worked out for the best. On the other hand, the Series S has been a hot seller for Microsoft, and since unit sales of Series S and Series X are combined into one stat, it helps to bolster the perceived total installed base of new gen Xbox console hardware. Especially towards their Game Pass strategy, Microsoft's decision to offer a budget spec-reduced new gen console proved to be effective for propagating an affordable mass market Game Pass vessel -- with pretty damn good specs for the cost.

[@Krstorm402]

Who would have thought the newer console with newer technology would perform better?

[@marrow94]

Yeah a stupid video that seems created only to say "buy a Series S! It's better" Yeah no shit, it came out how many years later?