Induction light - what's inside, schematic, experiments

[@BusyElectrons]

This was a fascinating tear-down. Well worth the time. Thanks for taking the time to make this video.

[@DiodeGoneWild]

Glad you enjoyed it ;)

[@davida1hiwaaynet]

Beautiful piece of engineering. This is 1000 times better than any short or tick-tock video. Thank you! I will order a lamp of this type to use at my workshop, after my bad experiences with LED outdoor lights. I really appreciate your time spent on this.

[@SrKevinWolf90]

Preserve them properly, the driver and construction is wonderful, it is built to last. Thanks for the disassembly, these lamps have always fascinated me for their great durability.

[@DiodeGoneWild]

I definitely keep them :) my future vidoes might be recorded under them.

[@wlfgang]

Huge power consumption compared to modern lighting

[@iamdarkyoshi]

​@@wlfgangNot really, these may take 200w but they throw out a hell of a lot of light. They'd probably be comparible to 160-180w of LED lighting for the same amount of light.

[@CliveChamberlain946]

Great comments as usual. These 200 watt electrode-less 5000k lamps can operate 7/24 and last up to 12 years continuously. The whole assembly's a bit complex, but the lifespan at 90+ lumens per watt with an excellent power factor, typical balanced fluorescent color spectrum and even light distribution, seems worth it for a low maintenance design that functions from a wide range of voltages found anywhere in the world. Nine of these on a single north american 120v 15amp circuit would give 162,000 lumens. 2 banks (18) could light a whole school gymnasium (with Plexiglas) for 25 years of maintenance free life, but the idiots pushing LED's say this is inefficient and must be thrown out? This is the evil of religious zealotry imposed over an already decaying civilisation.

[@TheTemporalAnomaly]

I could not agree more! I am sick of replacing faulty led light fixtures and I am sick of exaggerated led light output claims. Led lights seem to offer good efficiency at low power levels (a few watts) but they don`t seem to scale well to higher powers where thousands of lumens are required.

[@ЯСуперСтар]

I guess it always happens to the world when a new tech considered to be magic of some kind, that can solve all the problems. Sooner or later it would be balanced out, LEDs will become usual and its weaknesses will appear. Green lobbyists will be shocked right after a big mountain of disposed LED lamps grows all across the world. Humanity learns the hard way.

[@Alex-mj7km]

LEDs have better spectrum than most fluorescent tubes, and higher efficiency, like 150-200 lm/w.... But you can't just buy them. Most light fixtures have horrible LEDs that barely do 80 lm/w (because they are over driven to hell), shit CRI and awful drivers that put power factor above output light flicker. So yes, some LEDs would be more efficient and have better CRI, but unfortunately it would get replaced with over-driven inefficient junk that flickers and would fail in 1000 hours. Some LED fixtures have worse flicker than fluorescent fixtures with ordinary inductor ballast.

[@mernokimuvek]

LED maniacs will also say that fluorescent lamps are toxic, but Codys Lab proved that putting your entire hand in elemental mercury will not give you poisoning. Only soluble mercury compounds are toxic, not the metal itself. And some LEDs contain gallium arsenide, its toxicity is comparable to mercury compounds.

[@mernokimuvek]

@@Alex-mj7km Most LED fixtures are also terrible because the light source is integrated and not replaceable. 90+ CRI high quality fluorescent lamps were available but most people were fine with standard 80+ CRI ones and didn't pay for the extra price.

[@RODALCO2007]

Very interesting lamps, never seen them before. Thanks for making the detailed video.

[@long-d4k]

You know its going to be a good day when diodegonewild uploads

[@2arc.]

Great video. I had never seen a lamp like this one. I have been working with electronics for thirty years, in my experience I have only had contact with a few examples from Eastern Europe because the machinery I used to maintain had parts from Hungary. Very interesting. As anyone can see, the cat is very concerned about your health.

[@Ale.K7]

Very cool and well constructed lamps, thanks for explaining us how they work!

[@thewindevtech]

I am always happy to watch longer videos on your channel :D Also, i really like all these teardowns :D

[@DiaconescuAlexandru2024]

24:00 that's because an analog scope doesn't show you one-time events, like those random pulses on the digital scope. Or rather, it does show them to you, but the human eye cannot see them fast enough due to them not repeating in a certain pattern, like the gate drive signal. A digital scope shows you those because it first stores all the info it gets from the ADC, then it displays the info to you, including random pulses and noise. Also, the long vids are great, your vids always feel too short :)

[@FindLiberty]

Love it !

[@jessishandsome]

This light must be the ham radio killer

[@DiodeGoneWild]

230kHz sine wave is probably better than 50kHz square wave with a lot of ringing.

[@mernokimuvek]

Actually no. There are even 2.65 and 13.6 MHz induction lamps and everything worked fine.

[@lorenzorentniop717]

It's because the induction ring has somewhat of a shealding

[@snakezdewiggle6084]

You are forgetting the Harmonic Frequencies. And, a Square wave = every wave, Spark Gap Transmitter. RFI +

[@christopherleubner6633]

These cause a lot of interference on AM bands ime. Used them as grow lights a while back. They do have one advantage though. They have an extremely long service life ❤

[@Alchemetica]

Great video. The lamp housings are very cool, the sort of lamp housings one often sees in restaurants for the "in" people. The length is fine with me, those shorts and tic-toc videos are clearly designed for those with a short attention span.

[@westelaudio943]

I don't think they use 200W fluorescent lamps in a restaurant :) Those are heavy duty industrial lamps. For warehouses and factories and such probably. But nowadays it's fashionable to make low power lamps mimicking that look for some reason. I've seen them at IKEA where they had cheapish lamps but with about five 1/2" bolts to hold a plastic lampshade, and something like a six watt LED bulb.

[@Alchemetica]

@westelaudio943 Yes, it was the shades I was referring to and the type of restaurant is where they sandblast the walls back to brick and make an "industrial" look. And they end up with terrible acoustics - reverberation plus.

[@7oplex09]

It's so cool that my home city is still using these type of lamps since 2016. Right now, they're still in operation and they haven't loss their brightness since. They're very robust and long lasting. Sadly, they're ever so slightly being replaced by LEDs.

[@quantumleap359]

Thanks for this in-depth teardown and operation. I've always wanted to know how these things work and see the internals. As usual, great video.

[@VoidElectronics]

Nice job! I was always fascinated by these. I liked the reverse engineering of the ballast. 😁

[@mostlymotorcycles.]

Thank you for the best deep dive electronics channel on the planet.

[@madscientist15808]

Awesome video and teardown. Maybe one day you can get your hands on a sulfur lamp, I'm sure that would also make for a really interesting video. Or you just build one with all the magnetrons you got ;) Btw, at 19:41, you can see that they even printed the time when the board was manufactured or designed on the silkscreen (14:48:42)

[@Alexelectricalengineering]

I definitely prefer your videos, love it, keep going 😎👍👍👍👍👍👍👍

[@MrEdwinHubble]

I love that some random components are flopping around in the variac knob. Never change DGW!

[@Speeder84XL]

Really interesting! I have never seen a lamp like that before.

[@FindLiberty]

Very good - Thank you Gave me 30 minutes of joy with 100% concentrated attention at 3:30 am Oct 30 2023

[@pierre7127]

Thank you very much for the this long and very informative video (not like some crappie stuff on TikTok or shorts). I really appreciate your work. 👍 Merry Christmas 🎄

[@ManuelGonzalez-tc1bl]

good teardown and explanation as always👍

[@a.lisnenko]

Thanks a lot! Haven't seen these lamps ever in my life.

[@power-max]

22:30 you can also notice that the ON time here is nearly constant and that makes sense when you look at the boost converter topology and average input current.

[@brancarr1]

Never heard of inductive lighting before. Thanks for sharing.

[@steve-paul]

I've been waiting for one of these types of videos with an induction lamp for so long!!

[@TheTemporalAnomaly]

Great video and very happy with the longer formats.

[@curiousflight5923]

Every time I learn something new. Thanks a lot for these videos.

[@RazvanTataroiu]

28:00 I love how the autotransformer knob is used as a random parts bin :)

[@1pcfred]

The verdict? Nice!

[@michaelfisher9671]

So huge. Hope you have a large attic

[@christopherleubner6633]

These have a very well made power supply. Most would be fried with operation with the wiring changes and open transformer. Also the wire coil in the glass pip is the ignition antenna. The plasma forms around that then ignites the rest of the lamp.❤

[@W1RMD]

Very cool! I'd love to have one as a work light for my electronics bench. Great job on this video.

[@tiagoferreira086]

What an awesome fixtures! Great build quality and technology, i didn't even knew there were light tubes electrodeless induction driven. I wish i could have a couple of them, you friend was pretty cool in give you those nice fixtures. I like to see that you refurbished one, very cool indeed. Also your videos are never to long, please keep going with your great work and content 👍

[@armin7515]

as always nice video❤ watching from iran

[@George_salve.magister]

I like long videos because are more detailed one!Keep it up!

[@AugustineAriola]

Great video as always Watching from Africa.

[@ehfik]

your videos make me smile. thank you!

[@HIDLad001]

Induction lamps were used for street lighting for a brief period in the US. Because these are 5000K, they would probably make great video lights.

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

I'm curious: what is the benefit of this induction style lamp over a notmal filament based fluorescent light?

[@DiodeGoneWild]

Mainly no electrodes to wear out. This thing can last 100 000h, while normal tubes last 5000 - 25 000h.

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

@@DiodeGoneWild that's quite amazing. I suppose short cycles also aren't a problem for an induction lamp either? (Versus short cycling a filament based tube and instant starting it seems to shorten the life dramatically)

[@analoghardwaretops3976]

​@@DiodeGoneWild...and even after 200K hours of running... there's supposed to be less than (5-10)% decrease in light (brightness) output.

[@andyapple9]

Finally a SMPS video. Niceeee!

[@DiodeGoneWild]

The next one will also be a SMPS, with a full schematic :)

[@andyapple9]

@@DiodeGoneWildCan't wait to see it. I hope for a new topology that hasn't been already on your channel.

[@hosemarino]

Those are my favourite videos. Thanks.

[@whatevernamegoeshere3644]

22:18 I think it's to make it a bit more bulletproof in overvoltage or similar cases. That transformer will 100% certainly lock out one mosfet while the other is running so that means a short is basically impossible. It will always fail just dead instead of failing smoked and spicy like a good dinner

[@hendriagustian7082]

Maybe

[@mrlux0716]

what an incredible video! Such a promising technology was discarded by LEDs… and talking about fluorescents, when will you make the video about the Philips electronic starters that you showed in a past video? I am anxiously waiting

[@fredcrayon]

You were straddling the Nyquist frequency which was giving you the frequency aliasing but you already know this! That light could almost be another retina burner!😂

[@Duracellmumus]

These small moments are take me home.

[@timun4493]

oh the crazy czech with the magnetron plasma speaker has a youtube channel, awesome, love your stuff :)

[@ingloriousbuddah]

love the longer videos

[@michalcz123]

Dobrý pivo na začátku. :D (Nice beer at the beginning. :D)

[@child_of_god_]

so entertaining and informative, thankss

[@DadofScience]

Assuming the power supply doesn't give out, I wonder what is the lifespan on the bulb and what it's failure mode would be?

[@DiodeGoneWild]

Well, a good question. If the power supply doesn't fail and the glass doesn't crack or leak air, it would run almost forever. But the phoshor probably deteriorates over time, absorbs the mercury or argon, and maybe outgases and ruins the gas mixture. This thing with an external phosphor would probably last even longer, but it makes no sense in our world with its disposable bussines model.

[@mernokimuvek]

@@DiodeGoneWild The external phosphor would fall off, it barely sticks to the inside of the glass tube. You can clear a mercury vapor lamp by putting it on a Tesla coil and the phosphor inside the outer bulb will fall off where the arcs strike it. Unlike high pressure sodium lamps, most mercury vapor lamps have the outer bulb filled with nitrogen and will not produce X-rays.

[@drobotk]

I think they probably turn pink as the mercury gets absorbed by the phosphor. This happens with regular fluorescent lamps too, but very rarely because the filaments usually fail way sooner than that can happen.

[@mernokimuvek]

@@drobotk And pink lamp can still be repurposed as party lights. Fluorescent tubes with broken cathodes will also wors as induction lamps. You can also use Tesla coils and flyback transformers to power them.

[@ЁбрагимИпатенкоибнАдхарма]

​@@DiodeGoneWildexternal phosphor wouldn't work due to glass absorption of uv, produced by discharge. Quartz tube could work (but less effective due non-zero absorption), but it significantly expensively

[@WinningOnline]

These lamps are far more reliable than most of the LED equivalents and can last up to 100,000hrs

[@G1ZQCArtwork]

Very interesting, keep it up. Like the Cat and the Dog as supervisors.

[@hugoegon8148]

20:00 Why do they isolate the 3 full plastic power transistors with the extra rubber hose?

[@DiodeGoneWild]

It also surprised me :). Not sure the thermal resistance is better or worse with the rubber. Might be better if the rubber is thermally conductive, as it makes a good contact with the entire surface. Without it, the thermal resistance would be better if the surfaces are very even, but worse, if they're uneven, leaving air gaps.

[@analoghardwaretops3976]

​​@@DiodeGoneWild...at these high switching frequencies , inter device & heatsink coupling capacitance should be minimised to keep losses down and avoid strange circuit misbehaviour.

[@Desert-edDave]

Lol 9:16 random but I love it. "...and here is the dog."

[@3327439]

svaka cast na videu

[@Mike-gk7qh]

Nice video,,,we need much longer videos👍👍

[@harrymartin1661]

Allways good!

[@lmwlmw4468]

Nice work.

[@uecmitsuimarinedieselengin873]

Very nice lamp, mine inductively coupled plasma functions in a similar way.

[@techtinkerin]

When I was younger I would have used these for growing special plants😂

[@janno288]

I wonder if you could use blown fluorescent tubes (blown filaments) wind a few windings on the ends and use them as induction lights

[@DiodeGoneWild]

This wouldn't have any benefit over running such tubes using a higher voltage or bypassing the open filaments. In either case, the problem isn't just the open filament, but also the loss of emmisive layer.

[@janno288]

@@DiodeGoneWild Well that too, obviously. Running them at higher voltage would get some extra life for sure, but they wouldnt last long

[@sneakybeanie01134]

Been subscribed to you for a long time now. When are you making a live?

[@robertball2741]

Really interesting, thank-you

[@thisisdvd8094]

At 13:23 it seems to be ticking pretty accurately once per second... Is that intentional?

[@piezku]

long videos are always better than short ones. its impossible to get this deep into something with a shorter video

[@alexloktionoff6833]

Can you try to light general fluorescent tubes laps with these induction transformers? They should not need filaments, so even broken lamps could work much longer.

[@sanjikaneki6226]

for the high side FET i can see a few reasons why you want to use a transformer but for the lower one the only reason i can imagine is extra safety OR control is somehow galvalicaly isolated itself from the lamp part

[@steve-paul]

Could you try making your own power supply for the tube?

[@AmerRimireZ]

🎉Great video 🎉

[@j7ndominica051]

How is radio interference near one of these lamps? Seems like induction has much greater longevity. I've never seen such lamps.

[@laughingoreilly1334]

Interesting video thanks

[@pietskiet3595]

Beautiful lamp that! Would love to see the spectrum, assuming it would similar to a regular florescent?

[@DiodeGoneWild]

It's probably about the same as regular fluorescent tubes. It's just that the power gets into it differently.

[@johncoops6897]

The spectrum is dependant on the phosphors used. There were many high quality European fluorescent and induction lamps (Philips, Oxfam, etc), and they could have very high CRI if that was desirable. However, the Chinese make clones that were compromised in various ways to reduce costs, especially in the phosphors... that didn't mean that they told the truth about that of course! Usually (for the typical use case for thess) it was better to sacrifice some CRI to increase efficacy, like with LEDs. The lower the CRI, the higher the efficacy, since any phosphor conversion has a

[@atoptip6193]

What makes the clicking noise when there does not appear to be a electro-mechanical relay? All the best to my fave channel!

[@DiodeGoneWild]

Probably the loose halves of the ferrite cores at a high current due to magnetic forces (or magnetostriction).

[@galaxycomputers7252]

Thanks great job Plz experiment on strat tube light with these induction rings.

[@windigo000]

love the reference dog.

[@chuckvanderbildt]

Those glass covers may be interesting for making a wimshurst machine.

[@tajtrlik1111]

Ďakujem za toto zaujímavé video, ani mi neprišlo nejako veľmi dlhé, ubehlo to rýchlo, lebo ma to bavilo, ja pozerám také elektronické videá, kde sa robí niečo konštruktívne, ako napríklad vysvetľuje nejaká teória, niečo sa rozoberá a vysvetľuje princíp činnosti, ako tu v tomto videu, ešte mám rád aj také videá, kde sa niečo vyrába alebo opravuje. Osobne ma nezaujímajú videá o elektronike, kde ide iba o "špeciálne efekty" ako napríklad odpaľovanie alebo rozbíjanie niečoho len tak pre zábavu, na prvý pohľad to môže vyzerať zaujímavo, ale podľa mňa sa také videá rýchlo opozerajú. A ešte by som chcel niečo povedať k tomu gate driver IO, prečo sa výrobca rozhodol použiť gate driver transformer (GDT), myslím si, že výrobca to urobil preto, aby bolo zariadenie spoľahlivejšie, čítal som niekde skúsenosti nejakého konštruktéra (už si vôbec nepamätám, kto to bol ani kde to bolo), že tieto IO pri budení horného MOSFET-u, kde musí byť použitý bootstrap kondenzátor a dióda, tak niekedy majú problémy so spoľahlivosťou, takže asi to výrobca vedel alebo mal sám s tým problémy pri vývoji, tak sa nakoniec rozhodol ísť "na istotu" a použil radšej GDT. A samozrejme sa veľmi teším na video, kde budeš opravovať časovú základňu toho osciloskopu Tesla, v poslednom videu o oprave tohto osciloskopu si myslím vravel, že bude ešte jedno video o oprave tej časovej základne.

[@Josh-b3c]

I wonder what the life expectancy is on the bulb are you meant to throw the entire unit away or disassemble it and just change out the phosphorus tube They're built really nice actually I mean it wouldn't be too hard to keep these things going forever if you had tubes

[@DiodeGoneWild]

I have in total 5 tubes, so I can keep it running for a long time :) but then, they're probably unobtainium or bloody expensive (over 150 USD).

[@drobotk]

Makes me wonder if it would be possible to put an ordinary T9 circular bulb in it. I wonder if there would be a voltage between the unconnected filaments. Actually, they would probably need to be connected to complete the loop?

[@Fluxkompressor]

No easy way of swapping the tube out. You probably spend a good 15 minutes up on a boom lift in an terrible to reach area were these things are meant to go to change just the tube. Then the balast also has 100k hours on it, the glass is dirty and what not. 100k hours is a damn long time for every bit of electronic. Capacitors dry out, junctions go bad and so on Also with 8 hours per day that thing lasts 3 decades. No way you get replacement tubes on them after that They are made to be swapped as a whole unit for sure

[@michaelmaass9518]

@@drobotk yes, this will work of course. You can also use a linear tube, connect the pins with a piece of wire to close the loop/circuit and it should/will work. BTW: The last generation of T5 linear tubes have reached an efficiency of over 100 lm/W but are now forbidden to sell due to EU regualtions (thanks a lot to the Brussels bureaucrats).

[@christopherleubner6633]

The design of this would be set and forget. The lamp would give stable output for literally decades.

[@denchesnuk8470]

Здравствуйте благодарю вас за роск аз и проделанную работу. Продаёте Ти вы этот блок питания для индуктивной лампы благодарю.

[@6WTF_MAN9]

Классные светильники) Интересно какой у них ресурс.

[@Debraj1978]

I have never seen or heard about such lamp before. Why would we make such lamps when we can have a panel of fluroscent lamps?

[@VC-oz5fi]

Even in this era I think this lamp is still have their own place. They are is relatively compact, energy efficient, and doesn't require massive cooling like LED

[@goldenheart1405]

Please make a review of bidirectional technology in solar inverter like voltronic

[@petehiggins33]

Now I need to know how they made that toroidal tube. Presumably it was made in two halves which are then joined together but how do you make the halves?

[@ЁбрагимИпатенкоибнАдхарма]

Take a straight tube and bend it under heat, ta-daa) and under-ferrite areas really look like joints

[@beatrute2677]

that big reflector would make a interesting topload for a tesla coil

[@DiodeGoneWild]

Good idea :)

[@mernokimuvek]

And you could use the induction lamp with the Tesla coil if the chinese power supply failed.

[@MrTurboturbine]

A little surprised you didn't try measuring the discharge with a coil wrapped on the tube.

[@ЁбрагимИпатенкоибнАдхарма]

This was done, but thriugh a coil wrapped on the ferrite. Go learn some physics

[@MrTurboturbine]

thanks, smartass@@ЁбрагимИпатенкоибнАдхарма

[@blg53]

Because this fluorescent ring lamp does not have heated cathodes on its' end it is very difficult to see how it can possibly fail. Also there should be no darkening of ends for the same reason. No wires threaded through the glass should also add longevity. It looks like that design is well out of step with the 21-st century philosophy of "built-in obsolescence" which probably explains why it has been largely discarded.

[@mernokimuvek]

The only way I can imagine it failing is the phosphor coating on the inside of the tube falling off after many decades of wear, producing blue light instead of white. It could also absorb the argon and mercury reducing the pressure and efficiency. As long as the tube is not cracked allowing air to get in, it should never fail completely.

[@5478Ashley]

I like how you start the video with a fire extinguisher

[@wolfrobben6914]

I had expected some laborious calculations proving that an LED would be only a few percent more efficient. Also a spectrogram ia missing. 😉 Just kidding: thanks a lot!

[@DiodeGoneWild]

Thank you for your support ;) I might also try to show the spectrum, but the video was already getting bloody long! :D

[@kyoudaiken]

Very nice. I think my city has bought some of these with the tiny bean in the middle for street lighting in the short period before LEDs. They are still running them! What has been bought is being used until it breaks or the supply of the lamps has depleted. German cities are more ecological and sustainable than German enterprises.

[@plevoss]

Supr video! Díky :)

[@cainabel2553]

What is the precise size of the object, in "dogs"?

[@shirishthakare9842]

Non exposing side need internal reflective coating. Why circular section tube? Thin flat rectangular section is more efficient.

[@deepblueskyshine]

These reflectors are great industrial design, I'd find a way to reuse them.

[@iamdarkyoshi]

Those are so cool. I've never heard of this tech before for some reason.

[@DiodeGoneWild]

There were also rectangular ones. But induction lamps were never very common. For these high bay lamps, mercury vapor or metal hallide lamps were used way more commonly, and then LEDs came.

[@iamdarkyoshi]

@@DiodeGoneWild Yeah that's pretty much what I've seen here in the states. I wonder if these were just too late to really catch on. I'd imagine they'd really only lose brightness as the phosphors age, I can't see much else that could go wrong with them aside from electrical issues

[@mernokimuvek]

These are much older than you would think, developed by Nikola Tesla in the 1890s. He used both inductive and capacitive coupling.

[@ronniepirtlejr2606]

They are very attractive light fixtures. 5000 K is blindingly bright. I like the softer lighting around in the 3000 k Spectrum. Fascinating teardown! Thank you for the video & for a chance to see this type of Technology!👍

[@timhartherz5652]

The 5000K is the color temperature not the brightness. It's basically almost perfectly white light. Not very cozy for a living room but perfect for studios and workshops.

[@75L48]

not suitable for factories this lamps come from. Warm light 1800-3800K promotes feelings of sleepiness. 4000-4500K is neutral, suitable for work offices. Cool/daylight white 5000-6500K promotes sharpness, thus it gets used in critical workspaces where poeple need to stay focused.

[@monoc4d]

Thanks!!!

[@hendriagustian7082]

It looks like this GDT circuit is similar to the one using IC TL 494, isolated and safe. High voltage GDT ac current in IC IR2156.