Dismantling a Vincent Black Shadow engine

[@TheGrumT]

Had a '49 series C Rapide back in the day, split the crank cases and the crank. Made a new cranl pin and machined the fly wheels and pushed the crank pin out by 4.5mm bringing the size up to 1,098 cc. The big end bearings have 3 rows of crowded needle bearings with spacers to keep them apart. I replaced them with an ally cage and roller bearings. Other than having to put spacers under the barrels you couldn't tell that the cc's had been played with. More torque but no more top end speed. Also had the cam plate spindle bush break off but had it welded back on. The welder didn't line up the bush so had to machine it out and fit a plug then re drill and tap the boss out to take the cam plate spindle. Sold the bike for £199 back in the day when that was what they were worth. Breaks my heart now, but have just purchased a Yamaha Niken, so much better i'm afraid to say.

[@t.s.racing]

Proper preheat and postheat, the stress members bolted together and torqued, and TIG welded by a knowledgeable weldor and you won't warp the cases. We weld and repair grenaded Harley cases all the time. Complete repair and patch panels installed is regularly done successfully.

[@holmes1956O]

SARGE BULLDOG I am glad someone pointed that out. I hear that same nonsense about not being able to weld things all the time at my shop. Total nonsense

[@MatsErikTeigen]

Agreed from Norway! I have welded lots of heads, crankcases and other engine/transmission related castings. With the right process of heat, welding and filler most can be done! Have a nice day :)

[@pauliebots]

Now that's just plain showing off. Bringing the vincent engine in the trunk of a classic M G? Classic. Somebody over there is living right! Cheers from Long Island,N.Y.

[@TheMightyGarage]

Hehe, he's a classic guy, Paulie ;) Best wishes

[@johnmcclain3887]

This is the first time I've seen the insides of a Vincent, having drooled over them better fifty years. I've been a mechanic since the early seventies, laid hands on a few Vincents, just never got to ride or work on one. Thanks for this video, quite interesting indeed.

[@wjgrind]

I was shocked when I saw the crank/ flywheel assembly come out. I owned a Rapide years ago, sold it for 12K. My V-twins were vintage Indians and I rebuilt 2 of them. The Indians used a male and female connecting rods on a common shaft like harleys. When I saw the Vincent set up then I guess end play also is influenced by that center spacer. Where Vincent was smart was having the cylinders offset with that rod setup for cooling. Thumper

[@453421abcdefg12345]

Very nice ! This will give you confidence to split your crankcases, interesting the number of recovery repairs that have been done on this engine, main bearing housings, gearbox camplate housing etc , but that is the beauty of these engines, they are made to be repaired, unlike modern designs that are made to be thrown away. One thing that makes a big difference on a Vincent is getting the main shafts lined up perfectly, due to the engine having double main bearings to hold the crankshaft extremely rigid, any misalignment will wreck the bearing housings, (as probably happened with this engine).

[@replevideo6096]

The Vincent factory was a former barn. My father went there a number of times to collect bikes for the dealership where he was a mechanic. No delivery vehicles in those days so he had to ride them home. He told me of an old guy whose job was to press the crankshafts together and true them up. He would first put one in a jig so it could be rotated and any error measured. Then he would remove it and hold it in both hands at an angle and toss it on the concrete floor. The cranks would then be re-checked, and would always be accurately trued every time. The angle at which he held it was determined by how far out it was. Now that was real skill.

[@TheMightyGarage]

Thanks very much for sharing this great story! It must have been an amazing place to work. Best wishes, Mike

[@bobcornford3637]

....and the reason why we have no bike industry.

[@replevideo6096]

@@bobcornford3637 That's true. If you remember the Triumph triple engine, they did not have a machine to bore 3 cylinders at once, so had to bore 2, then the third one separately. The industry never invested in new machinery, and the same applied to our car industry. Soichiro Honda started out by investing in the highest quality machine tools, the same brand only used by Rolls Royce in the UK. It enabled him to make high precision components which resulted in extremely reliable and long lived engines. Meanwhile the British industry soldiered on with old and obsolete machinery. The engines would leak oil everywhere. My father used to strip out brand new engines and machine all the mating surfaces flat to make them oil tight, before his boss put them in the showroom for sale, but not every dealer did that. It had the bonus of keeping the showroom floor clean. His boss signed up to be a Honda dealer as soon as they became available here, and he sold a lot of bikes. He later took on Suzuki and Yamaha as well. The dealership did not shut until his son retired and did not have any sons to take it over, only 3 daughters who were not interested in bikes. My father retired at 70, and still did repairs and servicing at home for old customers until he became too old to do it anymore.

[@robertklein9190]

I was at the machine shop one day, they just machined a crank and one of the machinist(the one with a drinking problem) lifted it out of the grinder and drop it on the floor, OMG!. As I think back at that, maybe he could have gotten a job at the Vincent works.

[@derf9465]

I love rebuilding bike engines, simple and fun. Four bangers need lots of space but two strokes are wicked fun

[@littleworkshopofhorrors2395]

That brought back memories of a lovely old chap that i knew many years ago who had a Vincent as his ride to work bike. A very clever machinist, when the need arose he made his own big end, all cleverly made to have the right tolerances when at working temp. When he got fed up with the standard clutch he designed and made the Honda clutch adapter for the Vincent that Conways used to sell, are they still going? I seem to recall he made his own cam for points and coil ignition conversion,too. So thanks for the memories

[@TheMightyGarage]

Thanks a lot for sharing this story. Yes, those guys are few and far between these days! They can turn their hands to anything and are amazing. Yes, Conways is still going strong. Here's their website for fun: conway-motors.co.uk/wp/ best wishes, Mike

[@theodavies8754]

Awesome. Relieved I don't own an HRD engine.

[@tadpoles10]

Talk about 'we're going in' sure was an insight to the world of Vincent 'inerds' no surgical knowledge required. Thanks for sharing Mike. atb t ..

[@sandgrownun66]

A fine international effort, chaps!

[@JimiHendrix998]

More please. Gearchange adjustment especially... many thanks

[@gentlerowdy]

hi mike, i admire your work, it would had been good if you could had made a video of a vincent engine assembly, keep doing such videos i must tell you they are very interesting especially the one as this was a tutorial by itself.

[@TheMightyGarage]

Thank you Rahul. There is a short video of the engine cases for this particular engine going back together again: kzbin.info/www/bejne/bnKYl4x_ibCamsk And here's a playlist of my own engine rebuild: kzbin.info/aero/PLgDzKiI-i6nY67gu5wiq3nzvrrx9zfcrB Best wishes, Mike

[@JR-bj3uf]

I had a buddy, back in the heady days of the 90s, who make (and lost) a fortune in the DotCom boom. He called me to come down to his shop. He said "I have a couple of bike I think you would enjoy riding. I of course ran down there and found a Suzuki RG500 Gamma and a Series D Vincent sitting in the parking lot. Of course they were like chalk and cheese. The Suzuki was small, light and didn't do anything below 7K. But turn it up and it was wicked fast. The Vincent was just the opposite, heavy, masses of torque, no brakes to speak of and it's handling was very strange. I test rode both bike in the heavy airport traffic around Dallas Love Field and I was actually a little terrified of wrecking a bike that cost more than I made in a year. I am very glad I had the opportunity.

[@TheMightyGarage]

Thanks for sharing that great story JR. I really enjoyed reading it! Best wishes, Mike

[@tedf1471]

10.0 Oil pump body, happy memories producing these at Dick Gibbs Gears in the 70s (An order from Australia if I remember correctly) - a real struggle to cut the eccentric groove - high spoilage rate...

[@TheClassicMotorcycleChannel]

Nice video Mike!

[@TheMightyGarage]

Thanks! Hope all is well. Best wishes, Mike

[@pauliebots]

I wish I had half the confidence Chris has!

[@TheMightyGarage]

I know what you mean! He just goes for it!

[@geoffhalsey2184]

Fiddly. You can see why the Japanese went for horizontal split cases. As you mentioned your first bike, mine was a Honda SS50. I was gutted when the Yamaha FS1E came out a few weeks later with double the acceleration and a bit more top end.

[@peterwuenscher54]

Hello chris K . Nice to see your vincent in here .. have a nice trip jochen from bangkok

[@375GTB]

Beautiful MG Magenette!

[@TheMightyGarage]

Isn't it lovely!!

[@geoffreycarson2311]

THE BEST V TWIN EVER MADE !!!g

[@didanaim7368]

Thank so much mike

[@rvanderw998]

Surgeons Mike and Chris perform open-shadow exploratory surgery... very entertaining. Reason(s) for tear-down, besides wonky worn steady plate? Love the polished crank.

[@TheMightyGarage]

Richard Vanderwell Hi Richard. It was much better than he expected, but there are a couple of problems with the engine. The conrods are rocking excessively and Chris is also thinking about getting a rebore, since he has ridden it 50,000 miles! I think he’s also getting a new valve job after he suspects a build up of carbon on a valve caused one of the pushrods to break.

[@stephenpate7505]

There have been a lot of hands in that motor previously. That was kinda tough for me to watch.

[@TheMightyGarage]

I know what you mean, Peter. Hopefully when it comes back from the shop this next time, it will be in much better shape. Cheers, Mike

[@rvanderw998]

The start of my own engine rebuild a few years ago was a burnt exhaust valve. Boy it sure snowballed from there, but John McDougall saved the day and made everything sweet again. Measuring the rocking in the conrods was when I realized the big end was finished...

[@shug831]

That oil pump is just a bigger version of the one on my chainsaw!!

[@claimnumber515]

What do you do with the springs and strange looking pieces left over afterwards? :)

[@TheMightyGarage]

haha, we just set them to one side 😉 I don't think they were needed any way 😉😉

[@hugieflhr03]

That’s a very interesting piece of history. I was very surprised to see the side by side connecting rod and the flywheels drilled out like that.

[@TheMightyGarage]

Thanks a lot for your comment. Best wishes, Mike

[@1silvervespa]

Could have been a Watch maker ..... but thank god he went into Bikes !!!

[@thakery5720]

Looking at the engine whilst being dismantled, I am quite struck by the similarities with the Sportster engines that Harley made via the K models from the 'pre-unit' format of their '45's'..... I suppose there are only so many permutations that can be used but it does make one wonder if this is where Harley got their inspiration from.

[@royhuxley8903]

Can we see you put the engine back together again?

[@TheMightyGarage]

Sorry Roy, Chris had a lot of the engine work done by a well-known Vincent expert. But here's a link to the finished product and the bike runs as great as it sounds. Best wishes, Mike kzbin.info/www/bejne/jZ2ZmJyFiqymm8U

[@nealebradford6417]

silly question mi ty, been watching john renwicks vincent vids have you seen them.

[@TheMightyGarage]

Hi Neale, yes I have seen the videos about John several times. Amazing! Harvey Bowden has taken a few and these might the vids you're mentioning but they are great. kzbin.infovideos Best wishes, Mike

[@jaggynettles]

they were fast in there day compared to the cars around at the time it takes a good engineer to sort out a high mileage one! and a big wedge of cash my mate reckoned about £7000 to put them in tip top shape and thats a few years ago , he rebuilt lots of them and showed me all the usual things that needed attention , the ironic thing is they still perform well when totaly clapped out the usualy faults you will encounter are loose cyl liners ,loose cam spindles ,worn timing gears , loose main bearing ,poor mainshaft location ,loose rocker blocks , worn out bigend asembly v pricey , crap oilpump ,worn out clutch can be converted to modern suzuki iirc having had the chance to ride a couple of well sorted ones i was a bit dissapointed and wondered what all the hype is about , the tuned ones super nero etc are where they get there performance legend status from . id take a good pre unit triumph T110 instead

[@robertklein9190]

It's funny they were "State of the Art" now a kid on a 1,340cc Hyabusa would blow the doors off that Vincent, just turn the key and wheelie away. Had a chance years ago, but parts were unobtainable, and they were finicky.

[@rick928]

(Guy talking at the end) '' my first 'bike' was a NVT easy rider'' That was my first 'bike' also

[@TheMightyGarage]

Hehe, Rikkie, yes that was me ;) My brother and I both got one from the local dealership in Barrow-in-Furness. I think the guy was delighted to see them go ;) but we had tons of fun on them, riding them over to the Lake District and about town. My dad and I painted the false tank on mine blue to match the rest of the bike and try to make it look like a Fizzy FS1E ;)

[@rick928]

@@TheMightyGarage Wow, I also painted (not that well) mine to also like the fizzy ! ( on that dummy tank lol. ) I remember falling off it (wet leaves) on the way home. I traded it in for a 1974 Honda CB250. That one was finally written off after a car pulled out on me. Next came a Honda 400 super dream (loved that bike!) followed by a Kawasaki 750. That was traded in for a legend ...Honda CBX super sport (wish I still had that!) No idea why I decided to change that but I then bought a Honda CX500 turbo. Had a lot of work done on it (chroming, Dream machine paintwork etc) Then came a 30 year gap (family etc) I am now back with a CBR1000 fireblade, complete with a Nos kit and twin bottles (don't tell the wife!) My dad had a Norton in the early 60's and I have become really interested in any 60's cafe racers, hence me watching this video. My aim is to own a one of these iconic bikes!

[@TechnikMeister2]

Phil Irvings wet dream. The Japanese solved so many problems by going to horizontally split crank cases. This flaw ultimately led to the demise of British bikes. Chronic and leaking crankcases, maintenance and dissassembly being a nightmare. Just the addition of a starter motor to them was a drama.

[@donwright3427]

honda c90 split down middle no leaks.lap casings on plate glass and brits don't leak

[@7316bobe]

Must fully agree with Technik Meister. I have a 2006 Yamaha XVS V Star 650 Classic with a V twin engine. It has vertical split cases but I have never had a problem with oil dribbles. Before I had this bike I had a 1964 Royal Enfield (Indian made) which I rode around on for 3 years. It also had vertical split cases and no matter what I tried it was a little bit of a dripper. The Japanese always seem to find ways of making an engine truly oil tight. I was not sorry to see the Royal Enfield go down the drive way with it's new owner. Thank God that there are still dreamers left in the world.

[@donwright3427]

Jap alloy does not deform as easily as the softer British alloy.I have had to butcher open japan casings with various nasty tool in the past and the always seal up nicely when required assembled.

[@7316bobe]

@@donwright3427 Yes I think that you have it. Thank you for your message back to me.

[@7316bobe]

@Derek Dust Must agree. With my 1964 350 single Royal Enfield I rewired the whole thing. Modern wiring with modern connectors had the electrics running good. I put in an electronic ignition as well and this solved all the ignition issues. If you have a Royal Enfield single and the engine vibrates just get the crank balanced and trued by some one that knows what they are doing and it will be like riding a new motorcycle. I did this with mine and it was as smooth as any other single on the road. The Indians do not do any of these things to there Royal Enfields and they vibrate like mad. You can buy a Japanese motorcycle and not have any trouble from it, or you can buy a British bike and have nothing but trouble. It is fairly easy though to rebuild the British motorcycle "properly" and then you will have an older motorcycle that is growing in value and fun to ride.

[@jamestregler1584]

So my Sportster's grandfather 🤔

[@TheMightyGarage]

hehe, possibly James, or it could be the other way around! Best wishes, Mike

[@GBewley]

Looks like a John McDougal camplate spindle bore repair.

[@TheMightyGarage]

Hi Glenn. Yes, Chris K (owner) mentioned that John worked on his bike a number of years ago and made this and other repairs. Best wishes, Mike

[@tomthompson7400]

thats a tasty bit of heavy metal ,, but without the rock , or the roll.

[@TheMightyGarage]

Hehe, I agree ;)

[@keithsage1593]

I bet we could make new cases on a CNC mill..(machine).

[@marx4325]

Can i hear a Kiwi?

[@TheMightyGarage]

Hehe. An Ozzie, but married to a Kiwi, so probably rubbing off 👍😉

[@richardthomas1566]

Who puts that pointy ass heavy mess in the back of such a nice car ?

[@TheMightyGarage]

Hehe, that pointy-ass-heavy-mess is worth more than the car ;)

[@geoffhalsey2184]

It's the reason I have a Citroen C5 estate, so I can easily load it up with pointy ass heavy stuff.

[@capitanvonchickenpants8492]

The most overrated engine in motorcycle history, there are much simpler engines that give the same performance The Vincent snake oil never worked on me, id rather have an old guzzi or BMW