DIY Lithium Titanate (LTO) Battery Part 2

[@WillProwse]

Keep in mind that you do NOT want to use 5s/10s configuration of LTO for 12v/24v systems. This was covered extensively in LTO Part 1 Video (link in description above). If you look at the discharge curve of LTO, a 13.2-14.0v 5s pack will instantly drop to 11.5v within the first few minutes. 6s configuration is ideal for 12v equipment. 11-12s is ideal for 24v. Please watch the first video if you have not watched this one! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Does off-grid solar confuse you? Check out my DIY friendly website for solar system packages and product recommendations, and so much more! www.mobile-solarpower.com Join our DIY solar community! #1 largest solar forum on the internet for beginners and professionals alike: www.diysolarforum.com Check out my best-selling, beginner-friendly 12V off-grid solar book (affiliate link): amzn.to/2Aj4dX4 If DIY is not for you, but you love solar and need an offgrid system, check out Tesla Solar. Low prices and great warranty, and they can take your entire house offgrid with their new Powerwalls: ts.la/william57509 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ My solar equipment recommendations (Constantly updated! Check here first): 12V/48V Lithium Batteries: www.mobile-solarpower.com/solar-batteries.html Solar System Component Directory: www.mobile-solarpower.com/solarcomponents.html Plug-N-Play Systems: www.mobile-solarpower.com/full-size-systems.html Complete 48V System Kits: www.mobile-solarpower.com/complete-48v-solar-kits.html DIY Friendly Air Conditioner/ Heat Pumps: www.mobile-solarpower.com/solar-friendly-air-conditioners.html Complete 48V System Blueprint: www.mobile-solarpower.com/48v-complete-system-blueprint.html ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ My Favorite Online Stores for DIY Solar and Coupon Codes: -Current Connected: SOK, Victron and High Quality Components. Best prices and warranty around: currentconnected.com/?ref=wp -Signature Solar: Cheap Server Rack Batteries and Large Solar Panels: www.signaturesolar.com/?ref=h-cvbzfahsek -Ecoflow Delta Official Site: My favorite plug-n-play solar generator: us.ecoflow.com/?aff=7 -AmpereTime: Cheapest 12V batteries around: amperetime.com/products/ampere-time-12v-100ah-lithium-lifepo4-battery?ref=h-cvbzfahsek -Rich Solar: Mega site and cheaper prices than renogy! Check them out: richsolar.com/?ref=h-cvbzfahsek -Shop Solar Kits: Huge site with every solar kit you can imagine! Check it out: shopsolarkits.com/?ref=will-p -Battery Hookup: Cheap cell deals bit.ly/2mIxSqt 10% off code: diysolar -Watts 24/7: Best deals on all-in-one solar power systems, with customer support and distribution here in the USA: watts247.com/?wpam_id=3 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Contact Information: I am NOT available for personal solar system consult! If you wish to contact me, this is my direct email: [e-mail] Join the forum at diysolarforum.com/ if you wish to hang out with myself and others and talk about solar FTC Disclosure Statement and Disclaimers: Every video includes some form of paid promotion or sponsorship. Some links on this youtube channel may be affiliate links. We may get paid if you buy something or take an action after clicking one of these. My videos are for educational purposes only. Information is subject to change/update at any time. Electricity is DANGEROUS and can kill. Be smart and use common sense :) DIY Solar Power with Will Prowse is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, An affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com

[@MrJordinhand]

DIY Solar Power with Will Prowse, most automotive devices are designed for up to 16V. Working in automotive testing during my college career we frequently tested production automotive parts to 16V. So long as you are using these cells with decent quality equipment, it should operate very well.

[@michaelmcclellan916]

using a victron 12v inverter the high voltage alarm doesn't kick in till 17v

[@cantseeusprius9069]

@@michaelmcclellan916 ^ crucial info for people building a 6s LTO system for vanlife.

[@marka7519]

How about using these to build a "climate controlled" system for a LiFePO4 battery bank. You could have a temperature cut-off so that if temps drop too low, your panels charge the LTO batteries that run a heating pad to get the LiFePO4 pack back up to a safe temp to continue charging.

[@HellTriX]

Didn't know Lithium Titanate existed until this video. Learned something new, my day is complete.

[@UnprotectedTechs]

I have learned so much from your videos in no small part because of how well you edit out pauses and dead air. Thank you for post-producing your content so well and keeping the information density so amazingly high. My ADHD and thirst for knowledge thanks you. I don't know if anyone out there knows more than you, but they can't speak like you. Thank you.

[@MrSkyDivine]

Dude, I love your channel. I first came to your channel for some simple advice, now I find myself just watching your channel. This has been my favorite content so far. You guys answered so many questions I had about battle born batteries.

[@FKYT]

Ya he doesn't have the clickbait or wasted time on stuff that doesn't pertain to the topic. It's just the information, I wish more KZbinrs made content like this.

[@uhadonejob]

I think price is a big factor in the value of the BatteryHookup LTOs. At $125 for 10 cells (sold out) seems like a good deal when the AliExpress batteries were $486 for 6! Thanks for the great info. The application I am considering is powering some LED lighting in a small greenhouse at night in the winter in Canada. The inefficiency isn't a completely bad thing because it just pours some extra heat into the greenhouse. The batteries can still charge and discharge at low temperatures is a big plus. I can even build the lights to run directly off of DC to the voltage of the battery. One of my favourite channels.

[@martinberard8649]

Seams a perfect fit for powering my wireless backhaul radio antenna up here in Canada. Thank you for making such inspiring videos.

[@TMS5100]

yep these are perfect batteries for remote locations. they can take incredible abuse and keep running.

[@joeh3767]

At about 7 minutes in when you knocked over the one cell it came close to shorting out on the other battery buss bar. Be careful please so we can see more video’s from you!

[@quinnfoster4671]

I've been wanting you to recommend people check out battery hookup. I'm glad you are already all over it.

[@jmac430]

@DIY solar power with Will Prowse An effective and cheap alternative to an expensive LTO BMS is by using supercapacitor charging and balancing modules... you can get the 6s ones for less than $20 and they actively balance all 6 cells throughout, each to 2.7 volts max (I believe that's the voltage, but either way, I know the voltage is identical to that of LTO) and the nice thing is that bc supercaps can throw around an immense amount of current, these charging modules can easily handle the high current capabilities of LTO... worth looking into and it's nice that it's already a perfect 6s like you were discussing. Great content btw, keep it coming! Cheers - Jesse

[@stevegorkowski3246]

All you really need is active balance. The cells can discharge to 0 vdc and most electronic devices shutoff long before that.

[@stevegorkowski3246]

@@marsBeBelinda LTO can go to zero voltage with no damage. The cell can go to zero if you want many times. In real life the device shuts down first. LTO cells can go over voltaged for hours at a time and still work but if you get them too hot they can get puffy. When they cool down they normally have higher amp/hr ratings. They just don't care. If you get them too hot and the seals around the tabs release you can damage the cell but short of that they just don't fail under reasonable use.

[@ted6090]

Any link to a good active balancer for the yinlong?

[@gunadigm1884]

Like your video because it is the most easy to listen and understand. Also the volume so loud and clear.

[@magua73]

This video went a bit over my head, but that's OK, I will have to replay it a few times. Your videos are much appreciated.

[@00708046]

So Will , it looks like you've adapted to living in a house . A little comfort doesn't hurt. Good for you !

[@obadiahscave]

Battery production technology is improving every year. It's good...😎👍

[@ARepublicIfYouCanKeepIt]

Two words: Buck converter I typically build 24V packs and including buck converters provides a flat 12 volts throughout the discharge, which is great for DC loads. A buck converter would also be perfect for connecting the Toshiba pack to a *12V* inverter.

[@franklinbrown7389]

Ok. This was really good. I think you hit all the important points. Good work.

[@jimthvac100]

I found a few BMS's online that are very similar to the programmable one you demonstrated earlier that will work with LTO chemistry they also used a bluetooth connection for use with a phone so you can use an app. One was 108V for 100 amp and came with a display.

[@daan3298]

I built a 24v 120Ah pack (3 parallel 11 series) and have been using them in my van for over 8 months now. The pack works to specification and I'm perfectly happy with it. The pack can be mounted under the chassis as they can be charged below freezing and it saves on space on the inside of the van. I do not care they are heavier than LiFePO4, they are still lighter than lead acid. I do care that they are safe and will probably outlast my van and me.

[@alexnuevohorizonte7737]

Thank you for all your input, you are one of the best and regards in the city of Chicago.

[@ianthompson3520]

You’re crazy but that’s exactly why I watch you I do love the appliance of science

[@patrickmckowen2999]

Great vid I'm thinking the 40ah yinlong would be great for an electric paramotor trike , max draw can be 300 amps, but the good part is the fast recharge and multiple recharges a day Cheers

[@DIPSHITONASTICK]

will thanks for bringing up the vehicle underhood FLA replacement applications in all weather.. i've been wondering for years about this. how cool would that be.. a true lifetime car starter battery / house battery solution.

[@romaintrevisiol9159]

I think they can be very good for my non heated garage project in the mountains of Colorado to power lights and a couple of appliances all year around without worrying about it. There's so much sun that efficiency is not really a problem. But yeah you're right the application scope for solar is very narrow.

[@SuperVstech]

Looks nice for RV or trailer use in cold weather.

[@jamest.5001]

Great video, can't wait to see what's next!

[@rashmiranjannayak3251]

Nice presentation to LTO.

[@AndrewStorlie]

We've been using yinlongs in car audio for awhile now. I use the 55ah cells in my build

[@BrewskyAZ]

was waiting for this video...

[@noobulon4334]

The little prismatic pack looks like a cool starter battery replacement, ill have to do some math for that one

[@SteveWrightNZ]

Much better voice control in this video, Will. It's much nicer to listen to.

[@simonmanners4108]

Brilliant information. Fantastic content.

[@chrisi1920]

How about a mini LTO backup for supplying a heat source for more sensitive Lipo main supply, seems like you can have an all weather system by combining the two battery types.

[@halasimov1362]

Great apocalypse pack for basic needs! Pumps and stuff

[@KS-wr8ub]

Thank you for yet another great video Will! What about running a 11s configuraton? That would give you that 1/2 cell that you'd need and hopefully get a good voltage for running 24V.

[@controlyourfuture5477]

You would have to take cells from the other pack and add it to the 24 pack you're trying to build. This would be nice way to go.

[@jarlnieminen4307]

I like the look of the 55ah cylindrical cells that are like yours but much longer.

[@Tezza66]

be good to see a 24v system with these.

[@TheKlickitat]

You are a great teacher and I am learning a lot from your channel. Can we please get a comprehensive explanation of C rating and discharge. Thanks.

[@gossumx]

For an RV air conditioner, would it be worth it to have a split battery bank with Lithium Titanate/Lithium Ion? That way, you could use the L-Titanate as the primary battery to run the AC and other appliances that will be discharging heavy loads, with the ability to recharge really quickly via the alternator or generator? Then build the rest of your bank with L-ion so that you can at least have a larger battery bank for those times that you run out of power from your expensive L-Titanate, or cant run an engine?

[@steffen707-]

What if you have a mini 20AH titanate battery pack that is only used to pre-warm your much larger 100-200AH lifepo4 battery?

[@upnorthandpersonal]

You know, I did think about using LTO for my solar off-grid building here in Finland precisely because I might not have been able to guarantee the cells were above freezing at all times. Prices do seem to come down as well, as ev-power has cylindrical 40AH cells at $63. I will probably have a set to serve as backup, and maybe emergency heating for the LiFePO4 cells or run other stuff in the tech building when the sun is out, I'm not around, and it's -20C etc.

[@Alienking01]

I have seen the cells on ev-power as well. Sounds good, give It a try. A LTO car starter battery sounds interesting as well.

[@dtvking]

Nice video Will. I would definitely use a Bluetooth programmable BMS. You can set all the cut-off voltages and amperages including the balancing cut-in voltage, cut-off temperatures etc. I'm using a 320Amp version that cost under 100 UK Pounds

[@christianbuchner8675]

More info about this BMS please.

[@dtvking]

@@christianbuchner8675 if you search for this on Ali Express you will find it. Thanks Smart 7S ~ 20S ANT Lifepo4 li-ion Lipo LTO Battery Protection Board BMS 400A 300A 100A 80A Bluetooth APP 10S 13S 14S 16S Balance

[@ElectronicMarine]

the application where you can use them are mostly in energy recovery systems for ev, and all those applications where fas charging and recharging are neded, mostly in traction applicaions, those small packs are probably from forklifts and/or golfcarts... hitachi use them in forklifts...

[@nickaltvater5592]

Any suggestions as to the type and amount of batteries needed to power a mini split ac system that pulls 1000 watts per hour for 12 hours? Maybe in conjunction with minimal solar panels? I'm trying to not idle my semi truck on hot days. Idling kills the diesel particle filter. Batteries will need to be charged with the trucks 12. lot alternator or through the inverter.

[@JonOffgrid]

the new cotek SP 2000 inverters are grate for them batteri I have one testing one out it i like it so far

[@omotolaoyeniyi631]

A 12v interter will definitely work with 15v to 16v DC comfortably no need to bleed, good job

[@czthor1]

Will P. We can use the Lithium titanate batterys to run the heater pads for our LifePO4 in colder areas before charging them?

[@dwilson6334]

I definitely want to see you test titanate with a Prius. From my research online the max amp load is around 30amps. I'm looking for a solution for my 2007 Prius. My lead acid battery replacement only lasted 2 years

[@aspudkicker]

Im very interested in your suggestion of testing lto on your prius, its a similar thought I've had for my van. Im looking for a chemistry I can take from van to van. 30 to 54 years will see me fail before the battery, I note your mention of calendar aging etc but if it lasts only 25 years it will likely out live the average age my family lives to, and mean there will be exciting new chemistrys to replace it before I die. I'm looking at the savings and safety factors involed, my situation requires a lot of driving, the extra drag of solar panels means using my alternator if set up correctly will use less fuel and be more financially beneficial to me for my power consumption, reducing the starter battery weight and temperture benefits might also improve my vans efficancy.

[@ariangorman2325]

I love the thought of LTO, any chance of hypotheticals or setups in the future?

[@irajtaghizadeh5913]

Hi, I really like your channel, because of you I move to RV and I love it, just Have a request could you open one of the Renogy lithium iron battery and check what is inside? Thanks

[@jamest.5001]

If schematics are available for the BMS, it may be possible to change a resistor to lower the balance voltage!

[@clivestamp1891]

Will as always an interesting video thanks for the ongoing education. Personally I am new to solar so this is all great stuff that you are looking at and testing. I hear you often say that products are not useful for solar ie high discharge rates but surly it depends on what you are using your solar for? As a sail boat owner who is looking to remove propane from my boat and switch to lithium batteries for the house usage I am still left with what batteries to use to start the Diesel engine and generator and drive the heavy draw Bow thruster all heavy draw short period needs. Would be great to have a mixed solution but moving away from the big heavy short life cycle lead options. The LTO s look like a potential answer??? Be nice if you could cover Usage types home RV boat etc. :-)

[@jamest5149]

Looks like these would be ideal for a power pack to do high load use like a site compressor and MIG welder?

[@corresandberg]

I just used 16V Supercaps on a poor 5V led light - My kitchen has a strange smell of burnt plastic. I will throw 5V supercap to test that poor light anyhow. Awesome video - we who lives in the artic or north of it appreciate tests that is similar to a normal life.

[@jamest.5001]

The reason I'd like LTO, is to power my house, I wouldn't need to worry with the batteries for about 25- 30 years +/-, maybe longer then maybe just add a few cells to gain some capacity, but the cost I haven't bought in on the lto at all, I live off a 5kw inverter, 1500 in pv, and a generator, occasionally, with a 24v main system, and a 12v lighting system, with LiFePo bank, so I have lights at least if something goes down, and a fla 24v and a 7s liion bank. It's hard to afford batteries,

[@kenkoh1724]

Good video, don't understand a lot what you're saying but good job.

[@lemonandlime99]

The ant bms would control these nicely it says lto on the sticker and is programmable to your specs

[@fisherus]

Just for anyone's information, DALY will make a common port BMS with 24 S@ 57.5V 60AMP in 50AMP out or 40AMP in and out for around $30ea. for LTO SCiB 64.8V batteries. The best power production is a 60V Nominal and 48V Minimal. I am using a Sol-Ark 12K on my off-grid farm using this battery bank system. You can also split the two sets of 12 cells for a 24V Solar system if you don't have a 48V system.

[@Jack2of3]

Looking forward to the MPP LV follow-up

[@WillProwse]

Ok, will do. Thanks for suggestion

[@mondomarshall7287]

I think a UPS for electronics will be a good fit. Like an APC battery back up etc.

[@billjacobs8035]

Has the makings of an impromptu dc stick welder

[@randal1470]

Have you worked with SiO2 batteries at all Will? They are exceptionally good batteries for cold weather use and very cost friendly.

[@Adventures_EC]

you can maybe use a combination between parallel andd series?! until gettin the 12 you need? but it will be too expensive

[@CryptoNut82]

Great video as always! You should get a thermal cam to look at battery hotspots

[@electairexports5236]

The high discharge rate could be good where there is a load with high starting load like pump or refrigerator Roger Caplin

[@melodysouljahrootsdubpress5539]

With prismatic cells, I wonder if a heat sink arrangement where a sheet of aluminium or copper wider than the cells sandwiched between each cell would help dissipate heat. I have nmc prismatic and thought about this, although my discharge rate is nowhere near enough to generate heat. Other fins could be attached and have a forced air cooling system. I'd love to use these for off road racing kart/buggies!!!!

[@ddkuo]

We have built at least 300 of these Toshiba LTO cells for cars. All lasted longer than 3 years. We built it to a size of 40 Ah maybe 60 in some larger batteries. Of course you’ll have to improve the connections. Your startup will be faster, and better sounding stereo. Also 5S is enough. 6S makes the cells operate in a lower V interval, which makes it weaker.

[@deankoch7305]

Great video.

[@chrislewis9345]

I hope you can do reviews on mpp solar equipment...really interest in the lv5048 inverter/charger.any info would be great!

[@bucknaykid5821]

Hey Will I am looking at putting a 24v system in a cargo trailer conversion. What do you think of using one of those mpp all in ones with a tesla battery?

[@ronclifford9371]

Hey Will, is there a solar charger that can switch back and forth between solar panel charging and wind turbine charging on the same bank of batteries -and if so do the battery types matter?

[@Dman-gk7ym]

These would be good to build stand alone yard lights with a 100 watt solar panel. Those round cells would fit inside a pic pipe. Works in just about any weather!

[@McTroyd]

I have (sail) boat building aspirations. These would be perfect if I could protect them from salt water. I could power a high-wattage electric drive to get in and out of the harbor, and/or power the lights for a great length of time. The high cycle count and low temperature handling is a bonus to that application as well.

[@andrewfidel2220]

Check out Sailing Uma, they're using a lithium setup in exactly the fashion you're describing, they've even gone several miles up river from a port with their system.

[@McTroyd]

@@andrewfidel2220 Will do! Thanks for the suggestion.

[@mvansumeren4313]

@ Will Prowse I see your SCIBs obliterated the pink packaging peanuts too. I've had a miserable time finding a 20S LTO balancer or BMS for a 48V application. I'm not ruling out building something from scratch, but would prefer something ready made. Any suggestions?

[@indycharlie]

Again a good one !!

[@dr.projectx5142]

In a razor go kart would be great 24v 30amp for 720w. The little cells would be good for just that. Even at 12v it just might pull 70amo at 15v. That would be fun to try. Got a free razor go kart loaded a laptop batteries in 6s and I was able to go 8mph on the razor go kart at 230 lb lol. So yeah those cells would be good to test out on that. Wouldn't mind the high charge sin the motor control has a good voltage expansion on the input and the motor is 24v.

[@movax20h]

The claimed 80-90% round trip efficiency might be bad, but it is probably measured at very high charge and discharge current. Probably 5C or 10C. They do have high discharge rates, so the internal resistance should be relatively low, even if they heat up a little bit at 10C. That suggest to me that they should have a really good or better efficiency at lower current. Try 1C or 0.5C. But to test it you really need different charging and discharging. Because at your current setting you don't really utilize full capacity of this batteries. Similarly calendar aging probably occurs more at high voltages, and higher temperatures, so if you use them more gently, and because of inherent lower voltage in LTO, I think they can actually age better than LiFePO4. Again something to test for.

[@WillProwse]

Good points

[@stevegorkowski3246]

I charged at a little over 1c and discharged at 2c and power out vs power in was almost the same. This was well within instrumentation error. The only detectable decrease in capacity was discharge testing at 70 degrees F vs 32 degrees F. The efficiency didn't change for me. Remember it was just a sample size of one for this test. I didn't need to do anymore tests because they perform good for my needs. LTO Batteries at high temperatures may degrade some but the amp hour rating increases! Even when they cool.

[@sebastianlehmann3698]

Please test this option of 1C because I have seen videos of 99% efficiency for LTO (measured and proven).

[@mikemmcmeans]

any inverters with a wider input voltage range? i have lots of 3s 4s 5s 6s 10s packs laying around

[@MrTespro]

You mention here that it might be possible to build an LTO pack that could be used as a vehicle starting battery and that you even have a Prius where you could test it out. The Prius uses a DC to DC charger for its 12V battery so would that work to charge the LTO pack as well? I'm VERY INTERESTED in what's possible to use in my own Prius!

[@jimthvac100]

I bought three of the used 8 cell LTO modules I figure I can put them all in series for a 24 Cell 48 Volt 1kw battery pack, I found a BMS that will work with 24 cells and also an active cell balancer that will work with these too. Every cell was tested at 2.21V. I was thinking of buying three more but looks like they are all sold out.

[@dcmike1967]

if you use the victron inverters they can handle up to 17 volts so you can fully charge these battery's at the 2.8 volts max charge

[@danthemanxf]

Hey Will, is there an ideal voltage that this chemistry would work at perfectly with an odd amount of cells? 22/23 cells for 48v? Maybe I misunderstood, ignorant still of most of this subject, one of the main issues with this chemistry is the awkward voltage profile right? Is that toshiba pack the optimal layout? Great video

[@00708046]

The small aluminum pack would be great for a fatbike ebike application being used for winter riding . Maybe one could even use the heat created for hand warmer ,heated handle bar or something along that line. What was its weight ? Most ebikes require 24v ,36v or 48v but they sell waterproof transformers that convert 12v to 24v and 24v to 36v at reasonable efficiency. They would reduce number of batteries and weight. Maybe you should get into this too . Another side of this grand plan. I'm sure that you would make a difference. You and Elon , making this world better without robbing people.

[@mikemasc5774]

The chart shows LTO at 80 wh per kg, but i'm seeing 93 wh per kg on the toshiba scib's. I have 5 20ah's in the 24v 10s pack. It looks like I see some in the back ground of the video on the bench. I'm building them with 80Amp 10S Daly's for my trolling motor. While they may be a tad heavy, they are built out at 45 cents on a dollar compared to Battle Born, and a heck of a lot lighter than pb. 100ah for just under $900.

[@LuisMartinez-dt3id]

Hi so what is the best battery for solar power in a house please let me know the best option . You got the experience I don’t I will really appreciate thanks

[@SuperVstech]

That Toshiba bank appears to have the same size prismatic as you tested first.

[@tannermeaden2697]

Hey will can u please do more testing on lto cells. I live in canada and we do deal with alot of cold weather. I would like to know if you can jump start a car in cold weather. Would that bms be enough to push the amps needed to start a car. I could see these cells being perfect for guys ice fishing. Cheers!!!!

[@brianlacey5491]

Found you recently. I've been watching and trying to absorb as much as I can. How long did it take to recharge that prismatic pack.. and what amps and Volts

[@VLBrander]

Hey Will.. This was some great info.. I bought some lto pouch cells off ebay.. 3 p 6s battery I made but it frickin heavy. We are traveling through LV this weekend.. Would love to capacity test it.

[@VLBrander]

NO clue if the bms I bought off Ali is working

[@TOMAS-lh4er]

YEH!! were going to open something up !!!

[@nikolamadjarov2226]

I really wonder, how did you get those numbers for LTO efficiencies of 80-90%. Then, if that is true, how one can charge/discharge them with 5C/10C with so moderate temperature rise. By the way using '8' and '9' will assemble quite a typical figure of the LTO efficiencies - it is about 98%. Because of that high figure, the charge / discharge efficiencies must be measured with more precision instruments and set-ups. Otherwise, once I've come across to someone who registered 100.3% round trip efficiency - one funny result among his multiple charge /discharge cycles measurements. By the way, could somebody refer to a commercially available battery chemistry being more efficient than LTO? To me LTO is a dream battery technology from electrical perspective, but some other downsides as you pointed out like energy density- gravimetric and volumetric (weight, space), price etc. would limit their use. Of course, please consider that as a small remark in your video. YOU ARE SUCH A GOOD PRESENTER AND YOUR VIDEOS A VERY MUCH EDUCATIONAL- GOOD STAFF AND KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK!!!

[@jackripper5240]

It can deliver 5C/10C because the titanate chemistry allows higher ion exchange rates. However, it has limited "columbic" efficiency since most of these batteries are constructed with rudimentary electrodes such as activated carbon. Currently, there is one company in China which uses graphene. These LTO batteries have much higher capacity retention rates due to very low ESRs.

[@mrtechie6810]

@@jackripper5240 Which company?

[@mirsidorov5112]

@@jackripper5240 I would also love to know which company makes them with graphene.

[@WiSeNhEiMeR-1369]

THANKS COOP ...

[@Alienking01]

I would be interested in a LTO car starter battery. The temp, high charge/discharge, lifetime specs and low discharge capability would fit the job quite well. Also, the capacity isn't as important. I would be happy with 10- 20 years lifetime.

[@danielrouw2593]

@@marsBeBelinda after looking through datasheets and with secrecy surrounding the removed bms i believe these packs are used military starter batteries.

[@stevegorkowski3246]

Like I told you in the past I only use LTO. The used cells in the glued in pack did have a bms and my cells aren't welded but have studs and they are still weigh 20% more than pouch LTO cells. You don't need to worry about heat so much or tossing tons of current at them and they don't go into thermal runaway even at ungodly high temperatures. When you run them over temperature they will have more capacity! Remember they have lower IR by design than Lifepo4 so they will generate less heat. Active balance is the way to go on the cells. Here is why I use LTO. My Ebike cargo bike for example needs a 48v 20 a/hr pack. The 18650 pack can weigh 8-10 lbs but my new pack of LTO is 18-20lbs and more volume. One would say why would you use LTO? Well the 18650 pack under high current drops off at least 20% capacity. I ride when it is 30 degrees or colder and under high current you really have a 10 a/hr 18650 pack. The LTO is around 18 a/hr at 30 to 10 degrees. The other problem with 18650 packs is they don't like the cold and need to unplugged and charged in the house. The LTO pack can stay in the garage and charge. I have noticed on the 18650 cells the high current draw has made the IR raise and made the bike less snappy. To be honest the shorter life on the 18650 cells is due to over heating of the cells and to fix that the cells should have heat sinks or some type of cooling but if I add weight to cool them I no longer have a 8-10 lb pack and that is why the other cells just don't make the cut for me. I don't have the issue you have with voltage drop out , my motor controller is good from 60-36v. I own 1000 lbs of LTO so I will have all I ever need. I also have some 2017 Prius cells to play with but the weight is high for the cells . I think that cell weight is needed for cooling at the 3C rate. I am looking for a used Prius. It takes some rethinking to get your mind around LTO. I am a few years out on a home LTO solar system. Glad you looked at LTO cells!

[@SiriusSolar]

Awesome information thanks for taking the time to explain that.

[@jamesmason7124]

Thank you I’ve been thinking about doing a lot battery system in my bus and I’m looking for options

[@Vaioman67]

Will LTO work on a 48v 50ah or higher? I have a three wheeled electric bike

[@edbeecher3193]

Would building a voltage regulator be advisable in this instance of needing 12v but having 15v?

[@billlorimer4065]

How about cutting open the BatteryHookup pack and assembling the ideal 12v 6 cell battery? You're great at extracting cells...glue, shmoo!

[@prof.crastinator]

Spot welding! Automotive or motor starting! These would be fantastic for spot welding...

[@xavierpendrag0n]

@will So I'm wondering why the BMS only kicks in so high in the state of charge on that chemistry. That seems just odd. Is it an issue with the LTO chemistry specifically that calls for that or maybe the numbers just aren't there for the engineers yet to give more room for balancing earlier in the state of charge? Any thoughts on that? These cells look like they have a lot of potential. These would have been great as a load sink for years ago when I used to do car audio systems for competition, but nobody quote me on that. It will destroy the components eventually. Well, if you are doing db drag, that is your goal anyway. Great video as always.

[@SiriusSolar]

The voltage discharge curve didn't look as flat so maybe they're easier to keep balanced.

[@marktheamerican4162]

How to test my Lithium 2.4 Titanate 40Ah batteries simply all I have is a few volt meters an amp meter ! Is there a way ?

[@salahalsulaiman]

Sounds like the best battery for off grid stationary solar, as for the slight in efficiency, a few extra panels are cheap any way , they also work in very high temperatures extremely well and not just low temperatures, whilst lithium ions will lose alot of capacity, i'm ipressed by these batteries ,

[@SiriusSolar]

My thoughts exactly. And the voltage is not really a problem with most truly off-grid people because we're running inverters that can handle 10 to 16v respectively.

[@SiriusSolar]

@@Lisas4us other than a used Tesla module where can you get lifepo4 that cheap?

[@salahalsulaiman]

@@Lisas4us i have been looking around at different suppliers for both technologies and surprisingly the variations in price for each chemistry vs it's like from an other company are staggering , its a bonanza out there! in conclusion it apparently just depends on who you buy from dear Lisa .