Do Lutherans Adore the Body and Blood of Jesus in the Supper?

This video is an excerpt from Cross Defense, a weekly radio show hosted by Pastor Wolmueller. Cross Defense talks about the joy of theology, the comfort of the Gospel, and the wisdom of God's Law for these darkening last days.
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[@xxca15]

Thank you Pastor Wolfmueller, I am a cradle Lutheran what is now ELCA, and I stopped going a number of years ago and have since been very turned off by their increasingly liberal views on inerrancy and social practices. I was in RCIA converting to Catholicism and I came across your videos and Missouri-Synod and this I feel is my home. Thank you so much. Lutheran church is closer to the early church which focuses on Jesus and God and not “worshiping” Mary, Saints and the elevation of the papacy.

[@ruthgoebel723]

Very similar to my own experience!

[@Dilley_G45]

Then come back home to confessional Lutheranism, but change if your church becomes woke

[@Awakeningspirit20]

I might have to go Lutheran at least to have a home in my self-exile from Catholicism. Diocese and Catholics do not help me, nor do they want people like me. Only alt-righters. The Church has basically made it a requirement to be a Republican and I just cannot and will not. I need the Eucharist and am always shocked to read some sources indicating that Lutherans seem to believe the exact same thing (but don't get in the way of people and their God as Catholics do).

[@Nonz.M]

🎶"It is truly good, right, and salutary..."🎶

[@mysticmouse7261]

The kneeling is so beautiful.

[@markhorton3994]

Luther made a point of keeping everything that was not harmful. Doing anything in order to earn merit is harmful. Doing some of the same things to receive God's free gift of salvation or in praise is good. Praising God in a language one does not understand is essentially meaningless. Praising God in a language one understands is good. That is why Luther translated hymns to German, wrote new ones and encouraged others to do the same. That is why Lutheran liturgical worship still looks like RCC. Luther kept what they had right and rejected RCC errors.

[@augustineonuigbo9360]

May b u should tell me how u can worship God without doing anything to earn God's grace ..... I hope Paul wasn't mad when he said .... Work out ur salvation with fear and tremblings....

[@markhorton3994]

@@augustineonuigbo9360 NOTHING can EARN God's grace. Paul said that no one can be saved by the Law because no one is righteous by the law. God's grace is a free gift. Jesus, who is God, sacrificed Himself to atone, ie pay the price, for our sins. All we have to, or can, do is accept God's free gift. What Paul seems to mean is that we must work out in our own minds that we actually are saved. Paul was not mad, he was inspired. Some truths are hard to comprehend.

[@augustineonuigbo9360]

@@markhorton3994 wat u think , how u perceived and ur personal opinion ,does not make u right and the other wrong .....

[@jakkistaatmcdonald4555]

What is RCC?

[@augustineonuigbo9360]

So who is fooling who then?

[@bryantrelfa6211]

I KEEP GOING OVER THESE OLDER VIDEOS AND I LOVE THEM, THANK YOU BRYAN, HA MY NAME IS BRYAN TOO, BUT I HAVE SENIORITY BY YEARS, HA.

[@judithtaylor6713]

This is a solid declaration. Thank you.

[@lc-mschristian5717]

Thank you.

[@danielvanhaften5779]

I am a Catholic living in Tennessee, and have been looking for a church where I live. I saw a sign in front of an LCMS church that said, among other things, 'we're very Cathoilc'. I thought, 'Oh really?' So I went there one Sunday because we also have friends that go there, and out of curiosity of course. I have to quantify this a bit by saying that I was brought up in the old Latin Roman Cathoilc Church and loved it, and I miss it. If there was a TLC church near me, I'd go there in a heartbeat. But there isn't. I have a lot of problems with the current 'modern' church, and it's blatantly heretical Pope. That man is tearing the Church apart, and I suspect there is soon going to be a schism. But anyway, so I attend the service in this LCMS church and I have to say I was blown away. It seemed to me that it was the old Latin Mass...in English. The liturgy, the respect and reverence, the faithfulness to what is without question like the worship of the early Church was astounding! So I have to say that you are in fact a lot more Cathoilc than most Cathoilc Churches. Pray for me, because I am still wrestling with how to deal with that.

[@empackmanmueller1725]

Go to local catholic church and express your questions. I was like you lost, but found true answers in church fathers. Reading diary of st. Faustina shows her vision of Luther in hell. Enough for me, look at true eucharistic miracles. Have only occurred in catholic church. Not another protestant church. You. Must have faith and pray to God to show your true heart! Look up trent horn council of trent or catholic answers.

[@caderiddle5996]

Hey Daniel. How’s it going brother?

[@chapagawa]

Cool, I was thinking that it was a play on the lower case catholic, but the service, etc are very similar, for obvious reasons.

[@rogerlarsen4498]

I got and are getting more and more catholics in my family. Because some of my friends and brothers, are married and marrying Philipino girls. And they are Catholic. Some is charismatic, and other are more traditionalists...But, they often attend and my siter in law....Is on weekly basis attending services in the Evangelical Lutheran church of Norway. Their comment is that hey feel much at home, and they receives Eucharist in the Lutheran Church. I must say that I like the historic connection the Lutheran Church has....Well thanks for good content. God Bless!!!

[@BookDragon273]

This was extremely helpful, thank you. I attended my first Lutheran church today and they told me to go up and take the Lords Supper, and I had no clue what I was doing so I ended up eating the bread but no wine. I had no clue I had to kneel. I just went back to my seat…it was very embarrassing.

[@johnmarquardt1991]

I don't think you attended a real Lutheran church.

[@kkuster1]

Very nice explanation. Well done.

[@angiesplace5313]

My LCMS church has the altar lamp that indicates the presence of Christ in the altar, this is the same lamp that Catholics use 🤷 when I go into the church I adore Christ who I'm physically in the presence of... Honestly I would genuflect to the altar if I wasn't so afraid everyone else would call me Catholic 😂

[@thewordrules]

We do not have an "altar lamp" at out LCMS church. Our church is very conservative, but I've never heard of this.

[@CarolineJoyAmico]

I genuflect, and many at my LCMS church do. I appreciate that.

[@joyceelmer131]

@@thewordrulesthe Methodist Church I used to go to had a Christ Candle at the alter. I was told that it was given as a gift.

[@thewordrules]

@@joyceelmer131 We have a Christ candle that is lit during the service. In my former Catholic church they had candles, mostly around statues of Mary, lit 24/7.

[@Nonz.M]

My church also has an altar lamp, and people genuflect/bow before entering the pews. Don't let anyone stop you from showing reverence to Christ. After all, we are the true Catholic Church cleansed by the gospel.

[@markhorton3994]

I love the scene where when Zwingli met with Luther seeking unity. After long disagreement Luther threw off the tablecloth either revealing or allowing him to write on the table THIS IS MY BODY and proclaim it loudly. Upon which Zwingli went back to Geneva in a huff.

[@MrGassemann]

Mark Horton hoc est. Awesome story.

[@offeritup1]

I thought Calvin was in Geneva (later) and Zwingli was on the other side of Switzerland...other than that I love that point in history as well.

[@judithtaylor6713]

They did not shake hands.

[@shellieperreault6262]

I often listen to various traditional Catholic (aka "Trad Catholic") news and opinion sources, and I can't think of anything they complain about more from Vatican II than the destruction of the Latin Mass and how they must suffer abuse from priests over the priests' PROHIBITION of of receiving the Eucharist on the tongue or while kneeling. I will never cease to be astounded at how many people have given their lives (on all sides) during the Reformation over the Realities and meaning of the Eucharist, and at how few people within the Catholic church nowadays would fight for it... Theology aside, Luther had a conservative reformation compared to what happened to the Vatican in the 1960's and I frequently wonder how many Catholics (again, theology aside) would be ashamed of the post-Vatican II Catholic church if they ever came to a normal Lutheran liturgical service?

[@augustineonuigbo9360]

Which Lutheran ? Lol is that mess .... Stop fooling urselv , one rather embrace paganism ,than even imagine being lutheran ...... Its damnable so repent .

[@leeenk6932]

@@augustineonuigbo9360 Catholicism is a confusing mess. Take a good look around. Even traditionalists fight amongst themselves. All Lutherans regardless of their abbreviations who follow the Lutheran confessions (the book of Concord) are in communion with each other. There is just no centralized authority other than scripture and the confessions. There are different Synods, but one confession. Example, Dr Jordan Cooper is from a different Synod then me, and he doesn't say or believe anything different than I do. Same with the KZbin channel Ask The Pastor, different Synod, but same doctrine. Liberal so called lutherans who deny the inerrancy of scripture and deny the confessions are not lutherans.

[@brendonpremkumar8207]

I would say that there are also modernist Lutheran churches that do commit similar liturgical abuses to some Vatican II churches, but you could go into a more traditional Lutheran church and see more solemn Mass than many Roman Catholic churches.

[@faithofourfathers]

Interesting to hear a Lutheran point of view. I wasn’t aware that at some point you do actually “adore” Christ presence in the Eucharist. Do Lutherans use the term “consecrated host” or “consecrated bread”?

[@PastorBryanWolfmueller]

I think either is fine. I've heard and used both, but the prefered way of speaking is "The body of Jesus".

[@malcolmkirk3343]

Posture in Communion depends whether it is Eastern rite Catholics, and Latin rite Catholics, as opposed to Western rite Catholics. That said, how can you believe the consecrated body and blood of Christ Jesus are there on your altar, and yet NOT worship Him in His Eucharistic form? Christ is Christ, and due worship in whatever form He presented / presents Himself; whether incarnate in a manger, or crucified on a cross, or risen from the dead, or ascended to heaven, or presented in the Eucharist.

[@rachelhayes6366]

I love this video. I searched for this topic in your channel, because recently there was a TikTok in which someone was talking about how ridiculous it is that we take Mathew 26 literally and not figuratively. I have a hard time understanding the figurative perspective. They supported their statement by saying Jesus always spoke in parables. They asked how could it be HIS body if He was standing there holding the bread. They asked what the purpose of turning bread into His body would be. They stated that cannibalism was not Biblical. I haven’t responded to this person yet, because quite frankly I don’t even know where to begin!

[@lauraandrews1676]

Well, I can't answer all your questions. But I'm Reformed Baptist, so I can at least give you an idea. We feed on Jesus by faith. Communion is our remembrance of his sacrifice, similar to how the Passover feast was a remembrance of the actual passover in Egypt. We partake of Christ by faith throughout the week, not simply on Sunday. The communion is a time of self-examination and loving remembrance; I do believe that there is 'something more' going on spiritually, and that we are not JUST taking a bite of bread and a sip of wine. But *spiritually*, not physically.

[@villarrealmarta6103]

We don’t believe in transubstantiation.

[@angiesplace5313]

But the host is still the real body of Christ

[@villarrealmarta6103]

@@angiesplace5313 of course it is the real body and blood.

[@jb_0029]

I've been working through this doctrine of the literal Body and Blood, how to de.reconcile that with the Jerusalem council where the prohibit consuming blood?

[@PatrickMoto97]

This may be an exception. John 6:53 So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you.

[@jb_0029]

I heard a recent detailed presentation of the Lutheran belief in the Body and Blood of Christ being present in the Sacrament and it made a lot of sense. So they don't believe in the literal, carnal flesh and blood of Christ as transubstantiation proposes. Instead, they understand it to be a mystery in the sense that Christ promises to be where two or three are gathered in his name, or that he is with the apostles until the end of the age. Christ IS with there with them as he claims to be, but it is a different sort of presence than Jesus literally being there in a bodily form as he was when we literally walked with his disciples. That actually helped me understand this point of the Lutheran communion so much better. Dr. Jordan B Cooper's video on this topic is called "The Nature of Christ's Presence in the Lord's Supper" I hope it blesses you!

[@maxonmendel5757]

"the outward looks a lot the same" I guess you could say the essence has changed but the accidents remain

[@that39warguy6]

The question is, is that what's actually going on? If you know Aristotilian metaphysics is the proper understanding of the occurrence of "real presence" then how do you know that it's true? What is the evidence?

[@maxonmendel5757]

@@that39warguy6 🤷‍♂️ that's something for the priest to account for. you know, there have been accounts of the Catholic eucharist being turned into real blood.idk if I believe any of them. but for us lay people, what difference does it make? we all drink from the same cup, bloody or not

[@ClassicalProtestant]

Pastor Bryan which translation do you prefer or use?

[@BibleLovingLutheran]

ESV in our churches. I personally prefer KJV and/or NKJV

[@Outrider74]

But see, that raises a question: is it really the body and blood in the sacraments of a church that teaches a different gospel, such as Rome? With an evangelical/Reformed church, you'll at least get lip service to justification by faith alone; that's completely absent in a Roman Catholic church (if they're consistent). How can God honor a church that denies His gospel?

[@markhorton3994]

That is why Lutherans practice closed communion even though Paul said that when even evil people do God's work it is still God's works referring to Baptism. If a person has doubts about themselves or the administration of the sacrament they do themselves harm by participating. I'm sure Pastor can site where that is in Scripture and explain it. I can't.

[@weststeven77]

Look at faith alone and grace alone in Lutheran thought. It is different from Evangelical thought.

[@Mygoalwogel]

I agree that there is tension on this topic in the Lutheran Confessions. The Confession-Confutation-Apology progression on Article X shows no real complaint on either side. But Article XXIV shows complete disagreement between the Papists and Evangelicals. XXIV insists that private Mass, etc. were horrid abuses *because* it is the body and blood. On the other hand the Smalcald article on the Mass makes it questionable whether a sold mass or private mass has any certainty of offering the true body and blood.

[@augustineonuigbo9360]

Funny enof u have that word cos that church gave u ..... Come out from ur mess .

[@jakkistaatmcdonald4555]

@@weststeven77 I would love to hear the difference. I'm wondering if you might mean Calvin's rather then Evangelical?

[@paulmclaughlin710]

As a Catholic who worked for the United Methodists and the Moravians for a combined 26 years, I think Catholics are ignorant of other faiths. It’s just not a need to know thing. In any case, I think Catholics think most Protestants as being “Low Church” and don’t grasp that Lutherans, Episcopalian and some others are very “High Church.” As for Communion, I differ to a leading Moravian saying during a conversation with Lutherans about the “real presence” where he said Jesus can be present where ever he wants to be. These debates are kinda silly, in as much I expect when enter into the more immediate presence, we will see we missed the bus on what our life after life is about.

[@gregbeckern9wxg580]

You claim Jesus is with everyone who kneels. I have severe arthritis in my spine. It is all I can do to walk to the alter. It would take several people to help me up if I knelt. Comment?

[@CarolineJoyAmico]

That is, of course, understandable. Is your heart kneeling before Christ? I'm sure it is. I didn't kneel when we were at Lutheran camp, and Communion was offered outdoors, in a place where we would've gotten dirty. But we stood in a respectful manner. There are circumstances. Some day I won't be able to kneel either, but my heart will be fully prostrate. God bless you!

[@CJCappella]

The question is, where do the Lutherans receive their authority? Luther was not able to make priests who bring to the altar Christ the Lord.

[@brendonpremkumar8207]

Lutheran pastors do have authority. Even though Luther may have been excommunicated, that didn't stop him from being a priest. So he ordained other priests to administer the sacraments and preach the word. Lutheran pastors have never been self-ordained, ordained by a layperson, or unordained. Our churches do have apostolic succession, regardless of what the Roman church claims.

[@BoondockBrony]

Also some of the older Lutheran churches in Europe, or even America if you dig deeper can claim apostolic succession much like the Anglicans can @@brendonpremkumar8207

[@TheBlackToedOne]

Question pastor: around the 4:45 mark you say, "...and now the Lord's body is there...". Are you talking CON-figuration or TRANS-figuration?

[@augustineonuigbo9360]

Lutheranism is a mess , stop the mess Luther was aa catholic and u are the product of his mess , and all is catholic church which u guys today pretends but in confusion

[@BibleLovingLutheran]

Wow, tell me you’re wrong without telling me you’re wrong.

[@lowerbackmutilator2987]

How can you say “you should kneel because your posture shows your view of the sacrament” and then also say “we shouldn’t adore it because the Bible doesn’t tell us to” lmao

[@lowerbackmutilator2987]

Also the only thing actually said in the book on this is “When the bread is NOT distributed, BUT adored”

[@awake3083]

Nothing he said was contradictory. The Eucharist was not instituted to be paraded around, worshipped, or adored. It was made so we could "take" and "eat". A simple genuflection is just you, as a believer, showing reverence to the body of our Lord. Nothing in Scripture tells us to do the innovations of what the Romanists currently do today, though.

[@lowerbackmutilator2987]

@@awake3083 it also doesn’t say to kneel.. so we should just not venerate it at all? And he’s wrong about the point of your posture towards the sacrament?

[@awake3083]

@@lowerbackmutilator2987 Kneeling is a logical conclusion of being in the presence of our Lord, but you’re correct you aren’t obligated to. It’s just a sign of reverence. But indeed, you aren’t called to “venerate” the Eucharist- simply take and eat. He’s not wrong at all.

[@lowerbackmutilator2987]

@@awake3083 Just like you aren’t called to kneel.. it’s just the logical conclusion to venerate and honor the body and blood of Christ.