DOCTOR REACTS TO THE LOBOTOMY | Psychiatry Doctor Analyzes Ratched #2

[@rachellewis5210]

Knowing the history of Walter Freeman and the transorbital lobotomy makes me SOOO grateful I wasn’t born in the 40s. It’s a shame that this man pretty much arbitrarily scrambled so many vulnerable peoples’ frontal lobes :/

[@DoctorElliottCarthy]

Yes he did. Him and many others. Fortunately we are past that now. Couldn't imagine being a psychiatrist in that era

[@urbicide_if]

JFK’s sister Rosemary got a lobotomy because she had seizures and mood swings. Her father planned it without discussing it with anyone else in the family. She was left permanently incapacitated and couldn’t speak coherently.

[@Lozzomatic]

Actually Rosemary was left mentally disabled- at least to some degree- during her birth. She was born September 1918 during the Spanish Flu pandemic and the doctor who was supposed to help her mother give birth was busy due to the pandemic when her mum went into labour. The nurse actually instructed her mum to not push and pushed the crowning Rosemary back in, depriving her of oxygen for several minutes until the doctor could arrive. She was noticeably slow in her development, learning to walk, talk etc compared to her siblings and other kids her age, which to her super competitive dickhead father was a huge disappointment. When she was in her teens/ early twenties her behaviour, at least to her dad, was getting worse. I mean from what I read about it she was just a relatively typical young woman who was acting out her frustrations of being seen as 'less than' by her own douchey socialite dad, and her dad was only pissed because she wasn't anything like the smart, preppy, upper-crust, goody-goody, socialite who was as competitive as his other kids that he wanted her to be. Also he was very much into Eugenics, and her disability, even though it was brought on by oxygen depravation during birth and not genes, didn't want his socialite rich snob buddies to see him as genetically inferior. Still, her dad heard about the lobotomy as this 'New, exciting cure for all mental ills!' and went for it. As you said, he set it up behind everyone else's back, including poor Rose, who seemingly thought it was just another medical check up or minor treatment, the procedure ruined her, she went from an average but peppy young woman to a woman with the mental capacity of a toddler, and her dad basically dumped her in some posh mental hospital and didn't tell anyone, even the family about it. He told the press she was at some college busy with studies for years until eventually he never mentioned her again. He didn't even visit her ONCE. Just 'Oh she's useless, dump her over there' and fucked off. What a great dad! /s Later on her brother JFK found out about what happened to her (I think just after he became president) because unlike his dad he actually GAVE A SHIT about her and had wondered for a long time where she went and why. I can't remember if he did visit her, I think so, but most of her other siblings did and had her moved to a better place. They would visit her often over the years until she passed on in 2005.

[@stellafanders]

@@Lozzomatic oh wow, this was so interesting to read, thank you!

[@morganrogers3666]

We are all lucky that the lobotomy is considered barbaric and banned

[@hunterfox6176]

Yeah, otherwise half the US population would be walking around with only half their frontal lobe right now.

[@Anon26535]

@@hunterfox6176 You mean they're not? Could've fooled me...

[@ikarabout]

Really glad you could do a deep-dive into this episode without showing the horrific procedures. Well done!

[@Five0f5even]

Dr. Hanover: Simple Elliot: Stupid Dr. Hanover: Elegant Elliot: Barbaric. 😂🤣💀

[@braddishv3146]

This show helped me get through my extended quarantine... Totally camp, but interesting at the same time. I hope to see more in this series on the channel! :-D

[@fernandoroquerojas8405]

From Wikipedia: Amphetamine had no medical use until late 1933, when Smith, Kline and French began selling it as an inhaler under the brand name Benzedrine as a decongestant.[28] Benzedrine sulfate was introduced 3 years later and was used to treat a wide variety of medical conditions, including narcolepsy, obesity, low blood pressure, low libido, and chronic pain, among others.[48][28]

[@fernandoroquerojas8405]

I really like your videos! They're so educational and fun :D Regards, a fellow physician.

[@DoctorElliottCarthy]

Thanks so much 😊

[@oldschoolm8]

Benzedrine, or “Benny” inhalers were popular amongst the Beat Generation. Jack Kerouac was a frequent user until he thought it exacerbated his phlebitis. It’s what fuelled his long, uninterrupted narrative he’d write for hours on end, the inspiration for his novel ‘On the road’. Not to advocate it’s use, of course!

[@MadePramana]

00:17:02 “It’s not a DIY thing.” Love this reaction 😂

[@buckleygeneration]

Really appreciate that you immediately put your foot down to actually showing the procedure.

[@ML-di8lt]

It's almost a joke (albeit a very dark one) with my spouse that almost everything suggested for me to watch ends up having lobotomy scenes.... When I lost my frontal lobe due to TBI... *I was young enough that my brain was able to compensate.

[@cookiemocher388]

You're brain compensated, that's great man, or woman, or cat, I like cats, they're cute🐈

[@felixhenson9926]

I'm sorry that was done to you. I'm relieved to hear you appear to have made some kind of recovery/ life for yourself in spite of it.

[@stefanforrer2573]

@@felixhenson9926 well, if it wasn't "done" to her, she'd most likely be dead..... traumatic brain injury can often only be survived by removing the dead and/or too severly damaged tissue, not to mention the pressure build up caused by intracranial bleeding

[@josiehensley5705]

@@felixhenson9926 TBIs can result from a lot of injuries, falls, car accidents, etc…the younger you are the better your brain will heal and make new connections in different areas to perform the same tasks you usually did and often young people with TBI heal and recover to normal or almost normal abilities….the older you are the less likely that is to happen and you are more likely to have more severe side effects…but yes this probably wasn’t “done” to her

[@josiehensley5705]

@@stefanforrer2573 TBIs usually don’t require tissue to be removed. In the case of a tumor, then yes it would need to be removed but I highly doubt she had necrotic brain tissue lol

[@batt3ryac1d]

There has actually been a couple situations where metals used in fillings have picked up radio waves making people think they were losing it, it's really interesting.

[@Thecardinalsyn]

Meth was around in some form in that time so it might be that? Japanese and German soldiers used them in world war 2

[@gabe6475]

Bruh..... It's nitrous oxide. Idk how ppl wouldn't guess that, he's got tons of surgery shit and tranquilizers / anaesthetics are what he would have access to (plus a little bit of cocaine most likely)

[@davidrussell5759]

I'm gonna try my best to like and comment all of your videos until your channel gets popular

[@felixhenson9926]

"Simple," "Stupid." "Elegant," "Barbaric." I loved you so much more from your reaction to this part.

[@Thryfte]

This was super interesting, I never actually knew what a lobotomy was.. looking forward to episoxe 3! :)

[@DanielFolsom]

I'm so impressed you were able to pick up the "too perfect presentation" of an actor's attempt to make the symptoms too obvious. Question related to lobotomies: this ep inspired me to do some reading, and I read a stray comment in one article that a cingulotomy is a "modern version of a lobotomy," and-while I understand that's like comparing an axe to a scalpel, I did look it up on noted medical journal Wikipedia, which said it treats fairly common illnesses-depression, obsessive-compulsive disorder, chronic pain, and, in Russia, addiction. I was wondering what aspect of symptoms lead you (or psychologists generally) to suggest surgery today. Their severity? Their duration?

[@DoctorElliottCarthy]

Good question. At least in the UK, such a surgery seems confined to textbooks. I don't know anywhere in the country that offers such a procedure nor a psychiatrist that has ever recommended it 😊

[@reuvenknight1575]

For the most part it is for severe symptoms in which all treatments have been exhausted and the patient agrees to it or requests it. Another version, the lobectomy, is used to treat seizures in severe, medically resistant cases.

[@sqi_low]

I really enjoyed your Ratched videos! I’m still curious about #3 Cheers

[@brycealthoff8092]

There was a documentary on PBS here in the US years ago called The Lobotomist. It was about Dr. Freeman and how he introduced and practiced lobotomy in the US. Very interesting. Grim, but interesting.

[@Char10tti3]

I think the Within the Wires podcast has a line that described an "institute" in an alternative timeline as "hearing the sounds of carpentry but not smelling sawdust" or something like that. The first series is described through relaxation cassettes with really surreal imagery and it oddly balances creepy af and calming pretty well - but in a way that a calming voice in these kids of places just also sends shivers up my spine

[@emperorxenu519]

Especially in people prone to opioid dependency, opioids can be quite energizing in the right dose. This isn't an effect that can be maintained indefinitely, of course, the sedative effects will catch up eventually, especially if they're using throughout the day, but that can sometimes take all day if they're being careful. This is very much the desirable effect that I was after when I was dependent on opioids. So yeah, someone appearing energized is not necessarily contrary to their taking opioids.

[@erbalcloud3664]

Yes Dr Hanover is still high when you said he was energetic, though I don’t know what drug it was, you can clearly see his mannerisms become a bit erratic and unhinged. Though some things don’t exactly make logical sense in this show, I enjoy it a lot and am happy that you checked this out. But I have to ask for you to keep watching. Later one there is a patient with multiple personalities. I’m not sure if that the showcase of the different personalities disorder is accurate but the actress gives me chills with her performance

[@reuvenknight1575]

Considering the time period and his profession, ether or nitrous oxide are two very likely candidates. While both are stereotyped as knock-out drugs, they can be used recreationally to cause euphoric highs similar to being drunk, though nitrous tends to wear off quickly while ether is longer lasting. To be frank though, the series is pretty much dreck so it could be anything, even a made up "new treatment" thing.

[@Anon26535]

There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge... and I knew we'd get into the rotten stuff pretty soon.

[@MentalHealthTreatment]

I think he may have been inhaling ether? Doesn't entirely suit the era or the effects presented here though.

[@DoctorElliottCarthy]

I had the same thought but it doesnt make sense with the stimulating effects that happened afterwards. Its TV tho so who knows 😂

[@Raeat]

Is it possible Doctor Carthy doesn't know who Nurse Ratched is? She is a famous character, known for her ability to manipulate, play on fears, and control every conversation she engages in. Abilities we see displayed at every turn in this show named after her. She is a monster. She is portrayed brilliantly by the actress and the show. They even tell us in the opening and closing credits.

[@ihavelemonade5640]

not sure if there is an onomatopeia for the noise i made when the dude said "the eyesocket"

[@SouthPark333Gaming]

I once met a (transorbital)lobotomy patient (it had been performed by Walter Freeman in the early 60s from what I could gather). He actually seemed normal enough to me. He had even gotten a university degree after the procedure.

[@saraperlstein]

From what I've read, the lobotomy did benefit a small minority of patients (which obviously doesn't justify it in any way), although what is probably more likely is that some of the functions of the frontal lobes were compensated for over time due to brain plasticity. There's an interview with a guy on KZbin who had been subject to the transorbital lobotomy at age 11 (due to a stepmother who thought he was too rambunctious), and due to his young age at the time of the procedure he was able to recover, although he does describe lasting effects (and actually became more disinhibited after the procedure). In other words, the guy you met probably was able to live normally in spite of, rather than because of, the lobotomy.

[@gojewla]

That’s so cool.

[@Iceis_Phoenix]

It was successful for many people. 1/3 actually

[@SouthPark333Gaming]

@@Iceis_Phoenix Exactly!

[@HolyTurtleOfDoom]

@@Iceis_Phoenix I mean define success what did they actually "fix" ?

[@jayviescas7703]

Saw this series on Netflix when it came out and it's a fictional backstory for Nurse Ratchet from One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest.

[@nataliereed4238]

I'm thinking the inhaler was maybe ether, nitrous oxide, or amyl nitrate maybe? I don't think there's any opiates that can be done as pressurized vapour like that. Certainly not in the time period. Feeling invisible "wires" extending from one's body is a hallucination I used to see a lot in intravenous meth users back when I was myself an IV addict (different drug, though). I vividly remember one guy who carried a sort of small metal hoop around with him and he'd run it up and down his arms and legs, or over his head and back again, to prove to himself that the wires weren't really there. It wasn't as common a hallucination as the obsession with non-existent insects or parasites, or the 'shadow people', but still pretty common. I can't hear that Cape Fear music without just thinking "Oh it's the Sideshow Bob song!"

[@cleothehelpfuljack1057]

I am so glad that I was born in the 90’s. I am glad I live in a society that is far less barbaric.

[@venetianjack1348]

Psych Doc: “Drink your poison...” 😂

[@roxanes8369]

Great video! It's very interested to have the point of view of a mental health professional. The actors especially Sarah Paulson (Mildred Ratched) and Finn Wittrock (Edmund Tolleson) are amazing

[@coltonsmith6227]

Nitrous oxide or ether? Some sort of aerosol?

[@merrymachiavelli2041]

It may be worth noting that while Lobotomies were awful for all the reasons mentioned, but not _everyone_ who had lobotomies had severe cognitive difficulties as a result. A lot of people who are still alive had lobotomies in their youth, and managed to recover to the point there other people can't necessarily tell.

[@griffalo1013]

I think the liquid that Ratched adds to the priest's tea is supposed to be Chloral Hydrate in alcohol, otherwise known as Knockout Drops or a Mickey Finn.

[@douglasmarshall3273]

You are adorable. :) Hope you enjoy the series as much as I did!

[@MM-id3be]

The Knick is a good medical show, i want to say 19th century.

[@stacynonyabizz4241]

the labotomobile was a real thing. the bedroom seems pristine by comparison

[@phil_leoui]

Watching this as a psych RN helps :)

[@cookiemocher388]

Thank fuck lobotomies aren't done anymore😰

[@dionrodrigues4857]

I love your videos , they are very informative and fun to watch

[@wak69]

3:09 if I remember he's actually on pure oxygen

[@jeffandrew300]

I love Dr. Carthy’s expression when he finds some incredulous or odd.

[@SjofnBM1989]

I'm honestly surprised that in the first scene he didn't clue in that the doctor was inhaling ether.

[@GentrifiedPotato]

Dr. Carthy channeling Dr. McCoy from the 4th Star Trek movie.

[@DoctorElliottCarthy]

That's a niche reference that I def had to Google 🤣

[@KotRFFXIV]

~I can't imagine working in a field where I disagree so much with something that happened in the past.

[@praxillascucumbers7680]

I mean...most fields have dark backgrounds; most people just don't look into them. There are plenty of awful trends that I know of in (just to name a few): teaching and childcare, engineering, ALL branches of medicine, anything to do with finance, lots of large scale farming, most high fashion, criminal justice (obviously), construction, manufacturing, journalism... I'm guessing there was a dark and terrible trend in flint knapping that would cast a long shadow still, if we only remembered it.

[@resarfjomes1807]

As someone on the Autism spectrum, this hit close to home.

[@DominicNJ73]

Sweetie..you're not on the "autism spectrum." Know how I know...autists don't go around saying they are autistic.

[@alexandarvoncarsteinzarovi3723]

In the old days you just beat some nails into the skull run some voltages till all the person understands is "YOU PICK UP TRASH",...BOOM ....Servitor,s

[@galatea742]

I’d say that 99% of the times that I’m hallucinating, it doesn’t look like anything, maybe the occasional slight glance but they’re not really noticeable unless you are actually looking for them and even then, it’s unlikely that you’ll catch all of them. My therapist and psychiatrist are basically the only people who really pick up on any! A lot of people acting as if they are experiencing hallucinations (of any sort) seem to waaaay overdo it!

[@spilledcoffee5150]

It’s his ether!! Don’t mess with his ether!

[@KotRFFXIV]

So I've started watching your videos the other day and they're fantastic, I love see your views on things and how they differ, especially for me, sometimes I find myself writing comments about issues I've had in my life and how IP need help etc but then delete it because I know my doctors are not like you, I wish they were.

[@KotRFFXIV]

Even this was a lot longer till I deleted it.

[@throneisbed7833]

Lobotomies are such a fascinating subject for me. Like, they were horrible, I know this, but there's just something that I find absolutely intriguing about bygone medical treatments. Probably why I enjoyed being the dramaturg for my high school's Roselake Asylum Tours production. Interestingly enough, my character of Chester Murphy was the only one who was given a "medical" "treatment" in front of the audience, and that "treatment" was a botched lobotomy.

[@FulcanelliRosetta]

Albuterol perhaps with a nebulizer. They made vape pens for medical purposes in 1950s or at least the patent was on the books.

[@noldos]

Wouldn't transorbital lobotomy leave heavily bruised eyes? In the case of the priest that would be a bit of a giveaway.

[@aangrylemon1291]

Most likely but I’m not a lobotomy professional

[@hallwagner]

You should react to Dexter next.

[@oliverwilson3062]

Google says they still do lobotomys in the UK also whats the name of the film/tv program

[@peanutbutterbruv]

I live in Lisbon and my local hospital is named after Egas Moniz.

[@amyfeatevanescence]

Actually, during the 40s it was suuuuuperuncommon that lesbianism would even be mentioned as a diagnosis in the asylums - it was a part of the DSM, but in general female sexuality was still deemed as something that was reliant on men, which made female relationships *hint hint, wink wink* basically go completely undeteced / historian writing her thesis on homosexuality in mental hospitals during the 40-s

[@DoctorElliottCarthy]

Ooooo that's so interesting. Do send me some resources if you can as I'd love to learn more about it

[@amyfeatevanescence]

@@DoctorElliottCarthy Well, a lot of my research is unfortunately in swedish at the moment, but here are two articles in english that brings up the subject: * King, M., & Bartlett, A. (1999). British psychiatry and homosexuality. British Journal of Psychiatry * Beccalossi C. (2012). Female same-sex desires: conceptualizing a disease in competing medical fields in nineteenth-century Europe. Journal of the history of medicine and allied sciences (I can also share that I at this point in time has gone through approximately 750 female journals and 50 male, and only found one outright containing homosexuality - in the male journals)

[@mehlover]

That is scary to learn the lobotomy got a Nobel prize yikes I hoped it was rescinded

[@DominicNJ73]

Nope. Nobels aren't rescinded.

[@Nsinger998]

Walter Freeman chased down a patient who volunteered for Lobotomy but then changed her mind and went back to her hotel. Freeman followed, knocked her out and performed a lobotomu right there.

[@Iceis_Phoenix]

Ohh my sick

[@aangrylemon1291]

I’m gonna be sick

[@DominicNJ73]

Cute, you watched the Scientology video about psychiatry and took it seriously.

[@Nsinger998]

@@DominicNJ73 scientology video? This really happened and i learned about it from several sources including an autobiography by a man who freeman lobotomized when the guy was 12.

[@ahjgbhlahgaohgl]

It's probably Ether

[@TheGalgut]

You say opioid, I say nerve tonic

[@robdeezy420]

Cannabis Sativa... Often produces a “Mind High” or an energizing, anxiety-reducing effect . If you use Sativa dominant strains, you may feel productive, not relaxed and lethargic. Sooooooo that’s my guess is to what he inhaled! Let me know what you think 🤔?

[@vieramajernikova5264]

That's not true, I think you're thinking of Indica strains. Sativa strains tend to have a higher ratio of THC to the other CBDs and tend to have the opposite effects e.g. lethargy, sleepiness and sometimes even paranoia.

[@gabe6475]

Bro did someone lobotomize *you*? There wasn't a fucking inhaler for THC, ppl barely got high from normal bud at this time.

[@katiemcbainnn]

Gabe RIGHT LMFAOO

[@DominicNJ73]

Ewww...only losers use drugs.

[@atrumluminarium]

I think that inhaler was an amphetamine

[@samanthaard599]

Please do the movie Bug with Michael Shannon and Ashley Judd. The psychiatrist I work for are having a debate.

[@Char10tti3]

I had to stop watching for a bit when this came up in the episode and kinda is the reason I'm a bit iffy about watching the whole series hahah I always find brain surgery and these kinds of things just extra gross and creepy and especially because it's done to people without consent most of the time. It's so odd that we have videos of procedures like this to me, like you think it's not too long ago

[@lucar9873]

Pretty sure he was huffing nitrous. Short high, feels like it changes the world around you for a minute.

[@ridinggambit5017]

Benzedrine (amphetamine) inhalers were common in that time period.

[@ghost.8032]

9:08 my favorite part 😂

[@annaw7437]

My first thought, when he inhaled that was Oxygen. Doesn't pure oxygen make you high?

[@dannydethanos6994]

I loved this series

[@zalzalahbuttsaab]

9:13 Englishmen and their tea

[@zalzalahbuttsaab]

7:06 LOL The look on your face! (I seriously don't know how you can watch these videos, bro). Well pissed about the lesbian and also the breach of confidentiality. So much for peer-reviews in journals. Supremely cringeworthy. Good on yer.

[@DoctorElliottCarthy]

Talking about the past and analysing it is the best way to try and prevent the same mistakes from happening again.

[@zalzalahbuttsaab]

@@DoctorElliottCarthy You don't say!

[@maggiepie8810]

'Juvenile distraction'? Is he talking about ADHD?

[@DoctorElliottCarthy]

Unfortuantely it was probably even more broad than that as not all distraction is due to ADHD. The fact that this stuff really happened to a lot of people makes it even more concerning

[@j.h.miretskay3430]

@@DoctorElliottCarthy - These days, antipsychotics are the “hot” treatment for ADHD, especially where children from lower socioeconomic backgrounds are concerned.

[@AngloAm]

I love how Dr. Carthy confidently rubbishes that which is rubbish.

[@stevensudit]

In "Cider House Rules", a surgeon is depicted inhaling ether to get high. Perhaps that's what this is supposed to be here.

[@psychosoma5049]

I'm sorry but this has nothing to do with the subject at hand but you are the most beautiful man I've ever seen.

[@Argiopocalypse92]

As far as whatever drug the doctor inhaled. You said you thought it might be some sort of opiate? Opiates don't always have sedative properties. In addicts it can actually make you chatty and more lively.

[@mcgoo721]

I get the dude isn't a good doctor. But, for his own sake, would he really let the guy know right up front that he's on to the game he's playing alone in a room? Wouldn't you take note of that and wait to be in a safer environment to call him out on his bullshit?

[@jamegumb7298]

All praise Franz Gall.

[@RapidVidsProductions]

8:33 nice edit lol

[@JoeRyMi]

Psychiatrists were largely trying to help people. Unfortunately mental disorders were far less understood than physical problems. They thought lobotomies worked. Thankfully the practice was understood to be barbaric.

[@j.h.miretskay3430]

Dr. Hanover is likely getting high off nitrous.

[@notanopp5053]

radium mouth XD

[@PullthaleverKronk]

Is that Silas Botwin?

[@arcaine3907]

opiates have stimulating effects..... how do you don't know this??!!

[@doreencaputo2942]

Pervitin?

[@siennayay1]

3:20 meth.

[@Anon26535]

I'd rather have a bottle in front o' me.

[@JayG666]

😐😑😶

[@dhanaurbina7782]

Drink your poison 😂

[@Iceis_Phoenix]

It worked in apes, and 1/3 humans had a good life after. I must admit I think it was a brilliant surgery for severe mental ill but I do feel for the people that died or ill reaction it was a risk just as any surgery. . I know I am the minority but for the 40s this was beneficial because there was no meds. The people were really suffering.

[@matths226]

First

[@j.h.miretskay3430]

Dear Shrinkie, psychiatry *is still* utilized as an instrument of social control. I don’t know how you Brits do things, but here in the USA, children in foster care are given massive quantities of antipsychotics when compared to other children. Similarly, it’s not uncommon for children to be sent off to inpatient psychiatric facilities, even when such interventions are entirely inappropriate. Furthermore, in nasty divorce proceedings, it’s not at all uncommon for one - or both(!) - parties to attempt to get mental health professionals involved, to argue that the other is insane and unfit to have custody. It’s not unheard of for relatives to grossly embellish - or outright fabricate - psychiatric symptoms, so as to provoke an involuntary commitment. Oh, and by the way, a major behavioural health hospital chain (UHS) utilized inappropriate usage of involuntary psychiatric commitment to maximize corporate profits. These antics prompted a congressional investigation, a few lawsuits, and a bunch of fines - but the chain continues to operate, with healthy profits, and with abuses continuing. Alas, dear Sir, I’m afraid that you’re overly idealistic and naive!