Does Fitness Work?

Going from one thing that says it increases attack speed to another. Today I test and find out whether fitness does what the wiki says it does.

[@leveticus5721]

I’ve noticed the game modifiers for stats and skills are just too stingy, almost like an MMO. If the idea is to emulate human range of capabilities, a 0 score should be basically handicapped while a 10 score should be Olympic level conditioning/capability. The performance gap between 0-10 should be far more than a measly 20% as it is for attack speed. Even a 60% performance difference is too low.

[@shdowdrgonrider]

In my opinion it would be alright if getting to 10 without already starting there didnt take multiple human lifetimes.

[@denemi3065]

Yeah but then 10 Fitness and 10 Strength character builds would be the meta, you're already a killing machine with those stats to the point that hammers can sometimes break before you get tired, to give more buffs is just needless I feel, plus I don't think it's Olympic level, just gym jock level, still great but not that great That and PZ is a local level game, with a broad range of average people intended to be portrayed, don't think it'd be fitting for you to start off like that, nearly hero levels

[@leveticus5721]

@@shdowdrgonrider Actually, the difficulty of improving stats only reinforces the idea that they are meant to (somewhat) represent the range of human performance. Taken from that perspective, I could train five lifetimes and still not get as strong as Hafthor Bjornsson or as fit as Bear Grylls. A totally different approach would be to have maximums and rates of growth linked to starting stats. The grind would be less, but a character wouldn’t be able to go above a clearly stated maximum. For example, a character might have a 4/7 Strength indicating starting value and lifetime maximum. There could be traits that modify the range and growth rates as well.

[@leveticus5721]

@@denemi3065 10 Strength and Fitness are already meta though. From what I’ve seen in videos, people take other things just for the challenge/variety. But you have a great point. I think character creation needs an overhaul, and my original observation could be part of the rebalancing. One simple way to address your “hero” concern is to scale starting points for set difficulty ratings. I’ve played with this in mod mode to try a super character, and people already do something like this by taking way more negative points than positive ones for a bigger challenge.

[@VasuAmpaipan]

For game sake, beginning is hard enough for average player, late game is easy enough for whomve survived

[@doivnjoijf814]

The fitness gram pacer test is a series of multi-aerobic

[@GhulKing]

Keep these vids up man. It’s refreshing to see accurate information being distributed finally

[@harlek1149]

Thanks for busting so many myths, there’s quite a lot of outdated and in some cases outright misinformation out there.

[@Nativel79]

Hello, I do the same but on russian channel and in this patch, the developers removed the effect of running speed reduction on clothes, the character runs at the same speed as in clothes that do not reduce running speed, most of us know that. But, some clothes have an attack speed factor, I have not checked if it is removed or not? It's just idea for your future vids) Keep it up good work)

[@Nativel79]

I checked it, clothes with attack speed factor slow down attack speed.

[@jobRobbemond]

Thank you for the information. Can you name any specific clothes? Or is it the same clothes as the run speed reduction clothes?

[@lnlsun]

@@jobRobbemond Any long sleeve outerwear clothing slow your attack speed down by 5%.

[@davidburnett5049]

@@lnlsun I had no idea. Thank you

[@jamesonmcripfist5584]

There’s a mod for 15x fitness XP that’s much more realistic. Without mods this stuff as everyone says is basically unachievable, and not even fun or worth it to achieve, either. As someone said before me: level 10 should be maximum human capacity, like olympic level. I like the game, but you’d think after 8 years there’d be more balance than needing to survive for a few years before you could get even to the halfway point of human fitness. Isn’t the point of a game about surviving a walking dead type apocalypse to actually be realistic? After a week or two of exercising for 20-40 minutes a day you can see gains in the real world, what gives?

[@goldkat99]

Honestly as someone who has done some game development on small personal games/projects I think I know what the issue is. For the designers at Indie Stone project zomboid is the first game a the majority of them have ever worked on, and its been in development for 8 years. One trap a lot of new devs, myself included can fall into is the allure of adding new features to a game while ignoring previous aspects of it. Its really fun to add new features, its flashy and interesting to implement and solve how to get them working in the game. However if you are always focusing on new features you end up leaving behind old features and since core functionally often gets programed first this can lead to a scenario where you have buggy or poorly implemented core features that get ignored in favor of expansion. As a dev you get used to the quirks of your game, something that seems jarring or broken to a new player is easy to overlook as a dev because you have been working with it for so long. On top of that its really hard and boring to fix and refine old features, it can take days or weeks of work just to change something in a way that looks the same on the surface. Not to mention that as you build out any type of programing project, if you change the systems/code something else is going to be broken somehow because of it. Its that very reason that the US military still uses ancient computers built in the 60s. Because it cant be changed without causing a bunch of issues and making a bunch of work to fix it. And considering how old zomboid is and how inexperienced the devs were when they started its no surprise the game is poorly optimized and has weird meta mechanics. I like this game, and I think it has potential. We have seen the devs working on changing things and fixing older systems. One notable example is bringing on modders as part of the team and adding those systems to the main game. Such as with the VHS tapes or the new foraging system. I worry that the devs are rushing into multiplayer because they need funding for the project and want to attract a fresh playerbsae. A system like that can extrapolate the problem discussed above, because now the whole game has to be written to communicate with multiple clients at the same time, and good luck rewriting anything after you do that. But I do have some faith that they will pull through and make a decent game in the end.

[@jamesonmcripfist5584]

@@goldkat99 But how long is it until the end? Another 10, 20, 30 years? Do the devs plan to train up their children and have them also join the team? 8 years is a very long time for any game created to stay in Beta phase. At that point most people have accepted something is not going to change. I believe there is potential, and it’s a cool game, but let’s be honest...it’s most likely never going to escape beta hell and you’ve accurately listed a few reasons why. After 70,000 hours of development you can pretty much assume that something is never going to leave the phase it’s in. It’s not military computers or technology, it’s a game...and they’ve proven that they will in fact completely remove features for an entire rework so that point you made isn’t really a good one.

[@goldkat99]

@@jamesonmcripfist5584 You do realize that it is in fact Literally technology. Its a video game, which is a code base running on top of a modified game engine. That's a paradigm that applies to the whole of programing and to a lesser extent computer science. Removing features can cause even more problems, because as I said the systems must be concurrent with each other and there may be hidden dependency or cross referencing between them. Honestly I don't disagree with your overall sentiment that zomboid may never leave its current beta status, however you seem voracious in your vexation with this game. Its not uncommon for games to stay in development for years even in AAA studios. Game devs can make a lot of mistakes that slow progress, and you never know how much time is actually being spend on development of the game. For a lot of AAA games they either get forced into a deadline and come out half finished and broken or they just get shelved and cannibalized for assets. Zomboid is an indie game and they are not bound by any such restrictions which will ultimately be the deciding factor in the games fate. Maybe they mess around too much instead of committing and end up abandoning the project, for an example look at a game called "The dead linger" it died because the devs spent too much time messing around and ended up changing engines several times because they were trying to chase the "perfect game" instead of just making cuts and changing features to fit what they had. Or maybe a few years from now they finish the game and its a hit because of how complex it is and the large amount of features. Honestly if they released the game as it is now in build 41 and had never had an open beta, how many people could tell the difference between it and a finished but rushed game? Cyberpunk 2077 was a buggy mess of unfinished garbage because they changed engines so many times, but when it came out a lot of people who were unfamiliar with the game bought it and liked it. TL;DR You're being rather rude, and the game has a reasonable potential to succeed but its equally likely to fail.

[@jamesonmcripfist5584]

@@goldkat99 For sharing my opinions on a game I am 'voracious in my vexation'? I really think you just wanted to find a reason to use those words...it has nothing to do with vexation. I am simply stating the obvious patterns that are prevalent within the games development. How is it rude to state the fact that things to achieve are well beyond what they should be, for any game? I haven't been rude once during this conversation and if you think sharing an opinion is rude, you should check the first amendment and realize that freedom of speech is a protected thing in my country. If it takes 8 years to simply achieve some form of balance it has nothing to do with rewriting code. Build 40 itself was one of the most unbalanced things ever to come from the game...and it's just recently changed to something slightly more realistic and attainable. You can change codes in a simulated test environment without actually changing them for the whole playerbase. I don't understand where you've gotten 'this person is being rude' from. I've simply stated my opinions...which you seem to be half-agreeing with. Cyberpunk isn't really a great comparison either, as that is a pile of flaming garbage. Zomboid is actually a decent game that MAY someday exit beta, but I am severely doubtful of this as perfectionists will never find a perfect balance. It's always subject to change with types like these. However, you may be right. Maybe someday it will be exiting beta...although I am doubtful it will be in our lifetimes.

[@CassiusGreen]

No? I don't know what made you think you'd be an olympic level athlete or even half of that (Think State Championships) in less than two or three years IRL? The average Olympian is less 24, Women's Gymnastics average was 19 and they start at around 7. I don't know why you think you could be one or even half of one within a few years. Olympic fitness and world championships are the complete opposite of fun to achieve. Compare it to Jazz players who also strove for excellency, most were crippled by heroin addictions coupled with the stress of being the best and major depression throughout their lives. PEDs are used extensively by foreign players (depending on where the country takes place). It can absolutely fuck up your health. Pro cyclists deal with depression and are loaded with insane PEDs. Really why the fuck do you think you could be even half of what an Olympian is in "a few years" because you lost 5kg after walking instead of taking the elevator every day for a few months?? I think the game should strive to be UNrealistic here. Act like GTA SA in which you go from skinny dude to Arnold or Ronnie Coleman in a few weeks, though I'd rather see it in months.

[@Inkubun]

Subscribing because Zomboid is literally my favorite game out there and this is stuff I would like to know, thanks for the video!

[@Nativel79]

I glad to see you found english channel, probably here we will see vids about update soon)

[@Inkubun]

​@@Nativel79 I can't believe you remember me! Hello! lol

[@janorszulik6429]

Read up how Haste works in games (for example in WoW), it will explain why 100% haste is 50% more attacks executed (outside of additional dimishing return).

[@Retanaru]

Haven't played WoW in ages sheesh. All the recent games I've played have had the UI adjust to match the outcome so I wasn't even thinking about the proper math.

[@kinkajuu1]

Hi I got a question for you, night owl works, but not sure how it affects the code. But I know that it means that you restore more fatigue with short sleeps. What if you add restless sleeper to the mix? Is that godtier? Cuz you sleep for only 2 hours to near max fatigue with night owl anyway, and restless sleeper may cause you to automatically wake up earlier anyway. So maybe night owl, wakeful, restless traits could be a perfect insomniac build. Granted youd need athletic to test the diff fatigue recovery rates but still. ;)

[@kinkajuu1]

My meta build is security guard, wakeful and my fitness routine is. Sleep 2 hours, do squats for 6 hours, sleep 2 hours etc on loop and I tend to get to level 5 fitness from 0 in 1 week. It took me 1 month to get to lvl 7 fit and lvl 5 str. 3 months to get to lvl 10 fit. I started by running to all restaurant's and stockpiling food in the freezer, then get max fatigue and read books whilst watching tv without any sleep cuz you gain fit xp for being at max fatigue. Get to lvl3 fit without exercise. It's super easy, barely an inconvenience.

[@Retanaru]

I tested night owl and restless sleeper in "sleeping and fatigue" not too long ago. It does improve the amount of fatigue recovered per hour, but the problem with restless sleeper is its near impossible to get less than 20% fatigue so you end up forever living with slower endurance regen.

[@TouhouFan]

Night owl, wakeful, restless... Why did that hit me so much?

[@SushiCat0316]

can you do videos about Fever or Quesy coz that things always kill me...

[@tfigmoney520]

Well once you get queasy you're 100% dead no matter what. It suuucks.

[@jrnpedersen7095]

@@tfigmoney520 Not correct. If you get queasy from a bite...yes you are dead. But you can get queasy from sleeping near dead bodies and survive. I have just survived queasy status by doing so :)

[@tfigmoney520]

@@jrnpedersen7095 good to know

[@jrnpedersen7095]

And no...my character does not have necrophilia XD

[@thatsneakyneenja2595]

As others have stated you can get sick from being near dead bodies, this can very easily kill you if you do nothing about it. Is that what you've been doing?

[@Letham316]

I love this trend with the reverse clickbait thumbnails, where the title asks something like "can you do x?", and the thumbnail would just have "yes" in big letters. On a related note, I hate it when a thumbnail is like "oh look, here's a thing, but it's blurred out / pixelated, better watch the video to see what it is". 😑

[@Brocuzgodlocdunfamdogson]

Any way to isolate the swing recovery animation to see if it’s changing?

[@Keragom]

Great video mate! Fitness > Strength any day because of all it does and because of how much easier it is to raise strength. My current minmax build runs fitness lvl 9 and strength lvl 0 and it's an absolute joy to play.

[@anasshole6976]

wait what ? shouldn't it be the other way around im confused

[@Keragom]

@@anasshole6976 Nope, combat damage mvp stat is weapon skill and fitness determines how often you can swing. Therefore weapon skill + fitness is the dream team and strength is nearly irrelevant besides its bonus to pushing and carrying capacity.

[@anasshole6976]

@@Keragom I was like he is shitting on fitness and your comment in return weirded me out.Okay gotcha

[@gmfreeman4211]

I do the opposite. I start with 0 Fitness and 10 Strength. I just work out every night, and I'm at 5 Fitness in a 2-3 months. I need that carry weight in order to properly utilize my trusty sledgehammer.

[@federicom74]

@@gmfreeman4211 0 to 5 in 2-3 mounth, you are crazy, I would just kill myself after the first mounth, I want do things not stay at home and grinding all the day, it's fucking boring

[@torstentvhd4003]

ur not you when ur hungry

[@icqueservices]

Ur channel is awesome!

[@mr_niceman]

0:17 jesus flipped for our viewing pleasure???? lmfaooooo

[@samsteffensen3538]

You know what does work? Fitness di- This user has been banned

[@capitalm9304]

What is the difference between level 8 and 9 fitness... Dose it worth to build for level 9 fitness

[@deadsoldiertr]

In level 9, Athletic perk comes in to play and it really makes a big difference. Going 5 to 6 and 8 to 9 worth it because of the perk, other than the difference is really small. The perk helps a lot.

[@capitalm9304]

@@deadsoldiertr already experiment it and found out.. Thanks anyway ❤️

[@cyrusstoke11]

The real question is does lucky work ?

[@Twixx_77]

Yes, I tested it, my average outcome was ~12% more loot (unlucky ~12% less loot).

[@gmfreeman4211]

Thank you for sciencing the sh|t out of PZ for us.

[@foreverjune8]

One hundred thousand stats.

[@TowMater603]

FiTNuS Iz 4 Da WeEk

[@justpette1503]

Everyone is at 5 fitness on average anyway so it's not worth it imo

[@gavinjenkins899]

lol 1% per level? What a joke

[@ekothesilent9456]

Indeed. But almost all of this game is a joke. An amazing concept by the laziest and most dishonest development team since the release of No mans sky

[@tnh723]

we do appreciate it man thank you

[@FumblsTheSniper]

The only fitness I care about is fitness whole can of spaghetti Bolognase in my mouth?

[@dichebach]

Uh . . . "Twenty percent" is 2/10, not 2/1 So assuming the 10 fitness toon has managed 12 swings at the point when the zero fitness toon has managed 10, then that proves a "20% boost to attack speed."

[@XxsaviorxX2]

you should do a video on tailoring, and how useless it is..

[@Andyisgodcky]

For real, if you're getting munched you're playing wrong

[@jupitard]

Tailoring is the opposite of useless.

[@olaf5929]

@@jupitard tailoring...without mods and tweaked skillgain is *useless*. Clothes are only useful to keep you warm. Protection is false security

[@strajkz]

@@olaf5929 >Protection is false security I beg to differ, two days ago in an attempt to save a friend of mine I got munched 4 times in a row (not from the back), got lucky enough that none penetrated my protection, it did completely destroy it though.

[@ImNotThatAsian]

The pleb fears the lvl 10 Tailor.

[@asmresonance6072]

ur not you when ur hungry