Does online activism even work? | with Moya Lothian-McLean

In the wake of the viral ‘All Eyes on Rafah’ AI image being shared tens of millions of times there’s a renewed discussion around online activism and whether it even works at all. Is it purely performative? Can it make a difference in the real world? Benedict is joined by journalist Moya Lothian-McLean to break it all down for you and help cut through the noise and the bickering.
#alleyesonrafah #palestine #gaza
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Welcome to Scroll Deep, the show that keeps up with all the latest goings on so you don't have to, because who has time to keep up with all this internet? Me, apparently. Formerly KZbinr News (RIP).
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[@cnj122000]

she's so well-spoken and on a personal level, i love how she nipped "normies" in the bud. i completely agree that we need each other to build movement and we can't do that by alienating each other

[@RachelMay1989]

Moya is so eloquent, so pleased you had her on the show 💖

[@amnesiacore]

I know this is a break from the normal carefree comedy, but it is greatly appreciated. ❤❤❤

[@kepriest]

Such a refreshing thing to see on my timeline. Really helped settle some thoughts and feelings I had swirling about recently, great job!

[@beejamjam]

an unexpected yet appreciated crossover!!

[@epaisley]

Came for the news, stayed for the rat content, delightfully surprised by the thoughtful conversation - absolutely loved this video, thank you Scroll Deep!

[@juanelo1332]

We all know Benedict can talk for hours and make light of situations and fun of them. It was refreshing to see him stay quiet while Maya was speaking, way to go. He definitely listening to understand not to respond.

[@spooky-spaghetti]

respect to ben and scroll deep for this video! saw the tiktok asking for an informed person to talk to and it's great to see that actually come thru. moya was a great speaker and i appreciate how u didn't try to curb her answers free palestine 🇵🇸

[@vampivicous]

This was a great and well conducted conversation! Thanks SD team!

[@KalebPeters99]

Brilliant video guys! You're such a great interviewer, Benedict! Would love to see more discussions like this in between the normal content!

[@_sophies]

Great interview! I think the reason why people often say online activism is useless is because there isn't really a clear path from it into real activism? And even some IRL activism, like JSO chucking soup on things, has questionable efficacy.

[@yellowbounder]

I definitely avoided watching this video, because of the "helplessness" talked about within it on Gaza, but I'm so glad that I did. Thanks for posting this guys, I'm gonna be sending it to my family, so I can have a common set of ideas to talk to them.

[@aliflanagan7669]

Really enjoying this scooch towards "real world" journalism from SD, reminds me of the best BuzzFeed was.

[@tothemoonandforward]

Fantastic, honest and transparent video. Love your usual internet content but love this new style too

[@Ryanblairfolk]

I really loved this longer episode. The interview was fantastic. Please do more it was very interesting.

[@thefelicits]

I loved this convo. Scorning online activism only serves the people we want to protest against. I really respect the nuanced exploration here. I just started watching this channel recently, have watched Novara for ages so it was delightful to see Moya here. She really knows her stuff and expresses herself brilliantly. Less importantly, we just see her head on Novara; who knew she was so stylish? :o

[@bluebell560]

This was a really great conversation, I’m so glad you guys were able to get Moya on the show. I really hope this video gets more traction. There are a lot of people out there who need to see this.

[@3zObafouzr]

love moya and the whole novara crew. this was excellent, more please 🙏🏾

[@harrietprothero5856]

Really like this different episode!!!

[@favouriteghost]

Absolutely not what I subscribed for and this was my favourite video yet. I have journalism degree and I wrote extensively about social media and its variety of impacts as an undergrad (I moved away from journalism post-grad but I'm still very passionate about it) and this was such a wonderful conversation to see. She is clearly so intelligent and well studied, but there's something extra there when you can see the PASSION someone has for a topic. When she said "i could talk about this for hours!" i was like i believe you and i'd watch it. and a great job of bridging the line between Scroll Deep Internet Nonsense to Internet Important Things. I hope you're able to make more videos like this that do deep dives into relevant projects. Fantastic.

[@ConejitoPequenito]

I loved all the questions you asked, Ben! Moya gave really insightful answers

[@julietskelly9135]

This was really interesting and Moya was a fantastic guest speaker, thanks SD :)

[@camillastacey4674]

Loved this, thanks for facilitating it. I liked that Moya acknowledged that not everyone can get out and protest with other people- this is something I've really struggled with and beaten myself up about. I have multiple chronic health conditions that mean being in groups of people/protesting etc is hard for me, and then I think about the fact there are people in Palestine with the same chronic conditions (and worse) who don't have the luxury of choosing not to join a march and I feel that I should do more. I'll keep on boycotting, sharing, talking and voting. Thanks again.

[@lilliancastanera6814]

Loving these longer vids thank you

[@Chloe-pw4uh]

Thanks Benedict and Scroll Deep (and Moya!) for this excellent conversation

[@blakesby]

Fantastic video. Greatly enjoying this channel as is, but it's nice to now also feel proud to be subscribed. Appreciate this very frank discussion.

[@Edud62Alugetha]

I'm glad this video was made. These conversations do help and it reminds people how collective activism works. I follow you both but was not expecting the combination! I'm glad to see it.

[@chippen_g]

Brilliant episode! Would love to see more like this, maybe even a pt. 2 of this subject with someone with a different background/view.

[@peachshandy]

Fantastic video. Thank you to all involved. 🍉

[@vonvard]

Great video. Moya is awesome. And I love to watch a proper intellectual conversation between two decent humans

[@Kaguki]

Honestly, even though this was a break from the usual content, it still felt completely appropriate for the show. There IS a lot of online nonsense when it comes to activism, and this was a great way to address it

[@TJThomas116]

Great video! Really enjoyed having a guest on

[@videospielesindkunst]

This video is really healing my soul after being frustrated with so many activists in my community. Also gives me confidence to organize more productively against the far right here in Germany :)

[@cronchypickle]

What an awesome guest!

[@SomeoneCalledDana]

what an amazing first guest. very down for more of this type of content!!

[@fionamcc2315]

Moya is so well spoken, such a brilliant and refreshing conversation.

[@MegCazalet]

19:01 I was just thinking about the Qanon movement when you brought this up. That (terrible) movement somehow caught a lot of people’s attention and deeply deeply impacted their very lifestyles. The far right knows how to catch attention that turns into action, unfortunately.

[@jamiemoran]

Love this format, love the fact that this conversation is being had. Awesome job, SD team!! Keep it up

[@yogaboop]

Such an important episode! Amazing guest!

[@zonule_]

Excellent interview!

[@MegCazalet]

47 million is such a huge number. It seems at least like an indicator that an immense number of people are willing to pay attention. In chunks, at least. People have such a limited psychological ability to expose themselves to the horrors of a distant war, no matter how important it is. I dealt with this as an installation manager at at my city’s Holocaust museum, and that wasn’t an immediate, pressing genocide. It’s frustrating to figure out how to capture attention. The AI image was a very sanitized image that doesn’t have a gut reaction, so people felt fine just sharing it and moving on. Galvanizing people is incredibly hard.

[@ianweniger6620]

And leaflets are often the start to organizing that galvanizing

[@chelbelle4188]

This was a great watch!

[@celsient]

thank you moya for your wisdom!

[@catcatcatcatcat2]

Well done! Refreshing to see a person speak so well and nuanced over just yelling in your face and be angry.

[@kazu9445]

I saw an Instagram uhh tag thing where you click on it and share it to your story? Same as the all eyes on rafah photo, that said “share this if you stand with Palestine (I can see who skips)” that really rubbed me wrong. You see people attack others who haven’t shared stuff about Gaza and I just don’t know how to feel about it. Should we attack people (normal Instagram accounts, just people using it ordinarily) for not sharing things about the war on their stories? Even if that isn’t something they necessarily want to do? Because if that’s the case…shouldn’t everyone everywhere be posting about EVERY war that’s happening right now? Every injustice in the world? Where do we draw the line?

[@ichm5557]

You are not obligated to do so It is a humanitarian issue for honorable people only

[@nalanimulcahy8451]

No, you shouldn't be attacked for it. You may not want to share because you aren't aware of the atrocities being perpetrated on the people of Palestine, for example, there have been TWICE as many bombs dropped on them than was dropped on the cities of London, Hamburg and Dresden in WW2 combined, but maybe you are aware, and don't care, that of course is your prerogative. Either way, one person writing something as silly as "I can see who skips", especially about such a serious subject, shouldn't take away from what matters.

[@kazu9445]

@@ichm5557 that just seems very backhanded "honourable people only"

[@kazu9445]

@@nalanimulcahy8451 agree with you! It's just a tricky one isn't it. Not sure where to draw the line

[@ianweniger6620]

​@@ichm5557obliged

[@selmalarsson8920]

This was such an interesting video

[@arfi47]

This was such a great episode, I feel like I've learnt a lot. Thank you for speaking up about Palestine 🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸

[@namjoonie936]

Omg I love her, I’m gonna follower her!

[@himabinduporoori]

LOVE THIS CHANNEL!

[@goodgabi655]

Love this convo! 🍉🍉

[@MegCazalet]

There needs to be a specific CALL TO ACTION attached to these online activism images. Not just “like and share” but HERE’S WHAT YOU CAN SPECIFICALLY DO. I think too many people simply don’t know what to DO that will make a difference.

[@ianweniger6620]

No one's stopping you, comrade😁👊🏻🇵🇸

[@MegCazalet]

@@ianweniger6620 Stopping me from what? I’m joining in the discussion and suggesting that this kind of online activism needs to have a call to action. Raising awareness honestly doesn’t do much. Getting the eyes and just getting a like and a share wastes that opportunity of attention. I’m not a professional, skilled activist, I don’t create campaigns, I don’t create content, period. I’ve done my own personal action to contribute help to the various causes I support. But here I’m talking about the subject of the video, and putting in my two cents about online activism. Comrade.

[@pariahred13]

Best episode ever

[@Atlasrobin]

Felt called out when she said you’re not Atlas

[@ce7406]

OMG I WISH U LED WITH MOIYA IN THE TITLE!!!!! WOULD HAVE CLICKED IMMEDIATELY 100%

[@TheGong00zler]

AMAZING thank you!!

[@melbapeach162]

With a name like Lothian McLean I fully expected a Scottish accent NGL 😮

[@ianweniger6620]

Don't be racist lok

[@melbapeach162]

@@ianweniger6620 I'm Scottish

[@MsRainingDays]

Suns scots move south. It's just the way life goes

[@melbapeach162]

@@MsRainingDays rip.

[@jaketaf98]

This was great

[@freebeerishere]

NOVARA SCROLL DEEP COLLAB????

[@orancutland9793]

In my very immediate and emotional response it seems like Moya’s point around online activism is that it’s important to reach people so maybe someone will read some more and DO something in the real world, which is to say engage in actual activism. She suggests making the focus of sharing stuff the actual physical things you can do about it which to me feels like get rid of the posting and go out and do something. In making her point for online activism Moya made me resent it and its differences to real activism even more. That’s my opinion for everyone that didn’t ask.

[@aliflanagan7669]

I see where your frustration is coming from. I feel it a bit too. I think it's important to make sure we're not doing only online activism, but for those who do, even if it changes the mind of just one voter or leads to just one donation, I think it does have a valuable place.

[@jeongbun2386]

I LOVE THIS !!!!

[@ianweniger6620]

Ok, SD, if comrade Moya was willing to come on your show, you're tryna stay on the right side of history.😁👊🏻🇵🇸

[@suddenlysavannah]

perfect film

[@leazawacki4966]

Appreciate you G

[@pj881]

Great video

[@stellaa3285]

a 27 minute video ??? this is not my scroll deep

[@wilweswin]

Can you do a video about the guy/people who open plane doors?

[@Mary1337]

The "annoying" part is when people spam the flag where the topic is completely something else. Which fair, I see their perspective, they want more people to know. Okay, sure. But as of right now I'm just seeing that flag and 50 replies agreeing... Is it actually reaching someone who perhaps "doesn't know much about the issue"? How many? Again, I understand that it's better to reach 1 out of 50m rather than 0 but... Yeah... Just my view of using social media the last couple of months.

[@aliflanagan7669]

I think a lot of the time it's people full of justifiable rage who desperately need to feel like they Did Something.

[@ConejitoPequenito]

No one spams a flag to make new people investigate the cause. Flags and symbols are used for those who recognize them, not to teach concepts. Also, a lot of people on social media do algorithm baiting by commenting many symbols in a short time There's some people who spam actual information in comment sections, but Ive never seen anyone respond well to those, either. I dont think comment sections are a place for education

[@aliflanagan7669]

@@ConejitoPequenito I agree its probably not effective 😂 but I understand why people do it. There's also the value of engagement boosting a video's reach, and the video itself usually has information (although some ppl think the algorithm doesn't pay attention to things like single words or emojis)

[@babymitochondria]

yesssssssss love novara!!

[@holilex]

woo!

[@MsRainingDays]

Folks, not me saying to do more clickbait. But your clickbait game is so weak, that even though I follow Novara, it took me two days of being sick enough to only be able to watch KZbin too find this fire video. Three months after its release

[@mohuss2001]

loved her

[@ichm5557]

All eyes on gaza 🇵🇸🇵🇸❤️❤️

[@FTChomp9980]

I support the current thing!

[@jeongbun2386]

@@FTChomp9980 by your own standards, were the people supporting desegeragation only doing it because it was "the current thing"? Same can be said about women's sufferage and the abolishion of slavery. It's telling how annoyed you are by people who support current human rights movements, you might want to question yourself why.

[@FTChomp9980]

@@jeongbun2386 U speak like an NPC since your not unplugged.

[@jeongbun2386]

@@FTChomp9980 help ☠☠

[@Kaeros77]

​@@FTChomp9980 Calling other people NPC's for questioning your lack of empathy and lack of critical thinking has got to be one of the most NPC things someone can do.

[@marc8223]

KONY 2012!

[@thesebridgesareburnt]

Free Palestine! Solidarity! Forever!

[@johnboyle6294]

Just a quick note- Gaza isn't the most densely populated areas in the globe its very densely populated but its probably comparable to london more than Hong Kong, about 70,000 tonnes of israeli explosives have been fired since october 7th when 2.6 million tonnes fell in ww2. I am horrified by the genocide but idk why we need to lie to make this any more tragic than it is

[@MsRainingDays]

Ok, I agree that there is context to the numbers she said. And that is important to formulate things very exactly when you're on the internet. But she said: "the most densely populated area being bombed right now". Sounds accurate. And at a _rate_ greater than ww2. Now I'm not going to do the maths for you, but I am going to say value of 70000 is from April and things went south since then. And that comparing ALL the bombs dropped in ww2 is quite unfair. But it would be fair to look at places like London or Dresden. Famously terribly affected. She could have been even more extreme in her speech. She could have said Gaza has already been bombed more than any of the densely populated cities in ww2. And that would still be correct.

[@MsRainingDays]

Moya wow 😲 is all KZbin a village?

[@nom_quack_girl]

😮

[@gefen314]

Free the hostages

[@kalvisjatnieks7740]

what an elite channel lol

[@ayjay579]

The short answer is no. The long answer, is nobody in the history of humanity has ever changed their mind about anything. In person activism is entirely ineffective and has never lead to change, and online activism is even less effective than that. You can raise awareness for people who haven’t heard about something but once someone has heard about it, they’ve made their decision and will never change their stance once that decision is made.

[@leazawacki4966]

I don’t think that’s necessarily true. there are plenty of people who used to be zionists who are now anti Zionist, what made them change their minds?

[@ayjay579]

@@leazawacki4966 Who are these alleged people? I haven’t heard of a single Zionist changing their mind throughout this genocide. Many have doubled down on their Zionism but none have become anti-Zionist as far as I’ve seen.

[@FTChomp9980]

Quick Answer:No! Plus don't be an Activist.

[@Chloe-pw4uh]

You commented this 6 minutes into a 27 minute video lol go back to skibidi toilet

[@jeongbun2386]

im putting this in terms you will understand. stop being a team rocket supporter.

[@FTChomp9980]

@@jeongbun2386 I don't support either party both are corrupt. KZbin don't delete this I didn't mention either party I can't stand Red or Blue.

[@FTChomp9980]

@@jeongbun2386 KZbin deleted it I don't support Red or Blue. I am not a Team Rocket supporter Activist! Both sides of war lose innocent people if u did research instead of being an NPC.

[@jeongbun2386]

@@FTChomp9980 wow, i didnt know you read so much material on the history or palestine forgive me sire