Does Sim Update 15 Increase Performance in MSFS 2020? SU15 vs SU14

[@FTStratLP]

It had always been announced as performance boost in very FPS demanding situations and for LOW END SYSTEMS. I run a low end system and got a huge boost by SU 15. The sim runs much smoother now.

[@avilesgu]

Exactly the same thing for me. No differences between SU14 and SU15

[@imacmill]

Same here. No performance change.

[@mraviatorboii2510]

MSFS is just very poorly optimized, it’s why I am waiting for MSFS 2024

[@pet4be]

In my case, frames dropped from 90-100 FPS to 60, regardless of low or ultra settings. Specs 7800x3d and RX 7900xtx

[@HelioAguiar1981]

An increase on CPU utilization from 62 to 70+ Will be a big improve on stutters most PPL have. For me the update runs much more smooth with 13900k and 4080 oc strix.

[@MtheHell]

I run the sim in 1080p with an i9-13900K and a MSI RTX 3080. I'm using DLSS 3.7.0 (with the "E" FG preset) and so the FrameGen Mod for none-40xx cards. Of course,I don't have any performance issues. I could run the sim in 4K with this hardware, but I use a 40" FHDTV as my primary display, so 1080p@60 is the maximum I need. I have steady 60fps (so the tool tells me), no matter where/which scenery or how many FSLTL AC there are. I had this with SU14 as I have it now with SU15. When it feels good, it's good. I'm not counting frames, I judge by visual impression. What I don't see anymore is the "stuttering/loading/lagging" in the short final, I often had, and the ground handling feels much better than before - especially in the Dukes now. The A2A Comanche was better already like the Pipers of JustFlight were, too.

[@pillomino]

Great insights mate. I'm on a comparable system with a 5800X3D and a 4070 Super and 32 Gigs of RAM. Though, I decided to stay with DX11 and TAA because my tests showed a 10 - 20 fps drop on DX12 - not worth the benefits of FrameGen (not even taking into account the blurry displays with DLSS). But yeah, struggling around 30 - 40 fps with all those add ons FBW, FSLTL, GSX, BATC 😅 - SU15 didn't change anything at all. Though, don't want to complain.

[@nydelicious4u]

Omg I see I’m not alone I also have like 15 addons running in the background lol But I have a problem now I don’t know why it keeps freezing and then shutting downn any idea

[@pillomino]

@@nydelicious4u oh no sorry to hear. Unfortunately I don't have any idea... Luckily mine's stable at least.

[@Wilem35]

Numbers don't really matter, the experience is far better with SU15 in VR.

[@pumpkineater23]

But the experience can differ so much from one day to another? How do you know today's experience is due to SU15?

[@Wilem35]

@@pumpkineater23 That's not my experience. Was rock stable during the beta with an obvious improvement as soon as the update was loaded. Maybe your issue is server related?

[@pumpkineater23]

@@Wilem35 interested to know your specs? Some people are saying the update is better for the low-mid range systems. Mine isn’t high end so hopefully I’ll see improvements. (3080, 5900X 32gb ram, Quest2).

[@johnmcgahern3946]

I've never had it run this smoothly before and I play everyday. A coincidence? I think not.​@@pumpkineater23

[@Wilem35]

@@pumpkineater23 4080 I5 11600K 32gb hp reverb g2

[@johnmcgahern3946]

My performance had a huge improvement, especially on final approach and take off, no stuttering at all. Smooth as butter!

[@goalski134]

i’m not sure how it is for others, but my fps is very stable and consistent when facing forward. when panning the camera around, especially when quickly looking around, the fps plummeted. now on su 15 it’s must more stable

[@MegaPeedee]

Once again another undelivered promise. Update 15 has made the pausing and stuttering problems I was experiencing after Siim Update 14 far worse. I have no vehicle traffic and my graphics sliders are way down (most of the other sliders are turned off). The Sim is unflyable. Thank you Asobo. Here's what I would say to the teaM: "Why is it so difficult to do what you promise? We paid you for the product, so why don't you step and do what your are paid to do?"

[@Aronn1121]

You should reinstall. My performance is way better

[@MrJblow]

Yep same for me. Running 7950x, 4090, 32gb ram.....more stutters, fewer frames....very disappointed

[@bazstevens3874]

same here. 4090, 64gb DDR RAM, i14900k, z790 HERO MB, Pimax Crystal. I have never exerience these stutters in MSFS 20 until this update. FPS is down terribly and have stutters. Tried a reinstal and didn't do a thing. Absolute sim breaker of a patch here.

[@ClevaTreva]

! How are you not getting stutters? Have they fixed the memory allocation? In SU14 I could quite happily sit at 22fps but *still* have a smooth experience - but only when there were no stutters.

[@tjfSIM]

Exactly. People are so obsessed with FPS but actually for me it's more about having a constant and stable frame rate. It's the stutters that really ruin the experience, particularly as they cause huge 'jumps' and sometimes loss of control when the sim 'unfreezes' itself.

[@tvflight7858]

With a lower-end computer I feel like there might be a very small improvement in overall stability, on approach specifically, but I still get sometimes a huge lag almost like a 1-2sec freeze right on touchdown.

[@0_Dare_0]

Haven’t noticed anything major in terms of performance myself. I tried the ini320 which is definitely a frame eater for whatever reason and was in Gatwick with it as well and the frames dropped a lot despite running similar specs. I also tried the auto fps third party program to help it give a small boost in performance. The only thing I’d say that they have done right is they finally fixed that terrain glitch when you run the frame generator as now I’m not seeing the odd random squares of dirt or a dirt printed plane on the ground or taxiways. All the other airports iv been to have been running fine no issues whatsoever but those were with FBW, PMDG, Horizon 787 etc.

[@pillomino]

I can assure you, at least some green tiles on taxiways and aprons were happening with DX11 with no DLSS or FrameGen as well - but haven't noticed them either since I'm running SU15

[@Oscar-lg8hl]

Same here with an 5800X3D and 3080Ti. Vatsim and model matching causes a significant FPS hit.

[@willemfs6733]

Good job Airnott. You have to try the Ini A320 Neo. I have similar specs and this airbus takes another 15 frames over Fenix and FBW witch is rediculous. Thanks for your quick test and till the next one!

[@frankdiehl8749]

Did you get the free "enhanced" pack from the marketplace? Adds the cabin as well as high-res textures I believe. That might kill fps I imagine. Getting decent frames with both the a300 and a320, but I'm not big into Airbus, too much automation, the a300 for me just about hits the sweet spot for automation.

[@ati4280]

​@@frankdiehl8749Nothing different in my side. Because this new A320Neo from inibuilds is so heavily CPU bound, the additional texture resolution and polygons does not affect a thing.

[@frankdiehl8749]

@ati4280 Yeah, that's the running theme with it all; try to find some extra frames but it simply refuses to utilize your entire CPU. And then in the case of the IniBuilds planes, they went wild with the modeling. Just raw polygon-count that kills it.

[@ati4280]

@@frankdiehl8749 I think inibuilds does not fully utilize the MSFS SDK. Unlike Fenix needs external application, inibuilds use all stuffs within SDK. What I found is, other mod like PMDG 737, FBW 320, and even Fenix, they create 3D project cache during first load, you may check it out in localstate folder. But inibuilds does not create any cache for their model. It might affect performance, somehow.

[@sky173]

Great video. I'm curious if hardware has hit the upper limit that requires throwing in these 'non-real' frames. DLSS and frame gen is nice, but I'd much rather have hardware-generated frames.

[@AirNOTT]

You and me both. I think the main bottleneck is the CPU, the single core performance, more specifically. So as new processors release im curious to see how the sim will improve without the need for frame gen

[@Royalbobcatgto]

I didn't check my fps before the patch, but I had found MSFS pretty demanding on my system as I was playing in VR. Since the patch there's been a noticeable improvement though. It does say in the patch notes that "Improved FPS, particularly where the FPS was low" so I assume it's making a bigger difference in my case as I'm running a 3070.

[@hasmodai]

Way more smooth for me. Way less stutters too, even with FSTL trafic and static airplanes. Now AFMF works better too. And DX12 are faster than DX11 was on 14. My system: i5 12600kf at 5.2ghz, 32gb ram and RX6800.

[@augustomartins9516]

At LAX your cpu was 67ºC on SU14 and 80ºC on SU15. Just like i noticed on mine

[@mdhazeldine]

Just did my first test. i9 13900k, 64gb RAM, 4080, running in 4k. EGLC London City to iniBuilds EGLL v3.0.2. Always suffered stuttering on approach on previous sim builds, even with tools like AutoFPS managing my LOD settings dynamically etc. First attempt on Sim Update 15. I seem to have fewer BIG stutters, but now have more smaller ones. Not sure which I prefer, but it's slightly disappointing, given that the improved memory utilisation was supposed to fix this. Going to try updating to EGLL v3.1.0 now to see if it's maybe just a scenery issue.

[@SN57ONE]

It did kind of smoothen Fenix for me, though it was mostly because I shrank the textures from 4K in order to run smoothly in 1080p and GTX 1650.

[@infinitysimwings]

The best gain I had was in the ability to pop out the instruments using DX12 with Frame Gen and no hits on FPS! Finally……

[@mancave-simpilot]

My micro stutters are GONE. I have made several flights now and I am so happy. Finally!

[@yams900]

Well done mate ! Thx for sharing :)

[@gamesdeep8500]

I just had a play in SU15 and i have to say i thought my sim had turned down the settings on me with how smooth it seemed. No real fps increase but a lot smoother

[@unclealig]

Firstly, thanks for those side by side comparison. Thats the only way to truly compare things. Secondly, the GPU is barerly on full load load and CPU is also nearly never on full load. I see the same on my system. Sad that the code is not as optimized to take advantage of the remaining resources/power of cpu and gpu. And also sad, that there is no real perfomance increase as praised by the devs in the many devs streams when talking about the su15. Still need to check how it performs on my system - i took notes from different scenarios from su14 to compare with su15. And one thing which i am also going to check are loading times. The devs said in the dev streams that it will heavily be improved as the coding will be changed in a way, that the sim does not mind on how many addons you have installed. But did not read something about that in the su15 release notes, whicb seems odd.

[@briank3754]

This is not an optimization issue. You are using DLSS and this will reduce GPU workload. You will almost always be CPU "limited" in DLSS. If you switch to TAA you will see that you will certainly get into GPU limited situations.

[@707liner8]

I know it's a long shot, but have you cleared the cache? I'm still downloading the update, so I don't know how my performance will stack up, but from what I'm reading, I think I'm going to be disappointed as performance improvement was a big draw card for me. After that, reducing stutters is high on my wish list, so that'll be interesting too.

[@cezary593]

Thanks for the comparison. I am also disappointed with the performance on VATSIM and I am still waiting for something to change in this aspect 😢

[@Dillon737]

You should have compared Working Title gauges before and after (Cirrus). What I'm seeing on my end is the WT gauges perform worse in SU15 than 14. Also there's weird strobe lights on AI traffic now. Asobo is using a new effect for AI strobe lights. It's especially bad using the HP Reverb G2.

[@Paul-mg7bh]

Finally able to do some decent long haul flights with the 747 but tried today and the bird won't reach cruising altitude 😢

[@johnboy8846]

Hi, why is your MSFS Frame counter green when it goes above 30fps. the default is 60fps before it goes green. what setting do you have is it to do with vsync?

[@jimbojames6401]

I had a 50% reduction in FPS after SU15 with micro stutters - went through everything in the community folder and finally found the culprit was actually FSLTL so have got rid of it and now back to 60 FPS (RTX 4070ti 32GB Ram)

[@Simmymind360]

Thank you for the video...in the update notes it stated that you need to rename the community folder or move folder to another area like desktop..if you don't it will clash with new update and create stability issues..so not sure if you did that

[@Canac010]

I've noticed that the su15 is lower framerate than su14 but overall the su15 is much smoother. Which probably means less bottlenecking for me on the cpu side.

[@ryrydadeala]

Great presentation bro 👍

[@crazzagameplaylaughs9910]

I think vram is not being used as much. I noticed on another video like your graphics one you were using 14gb vram now your using about 12gb. On this same run.

[@frankdiehl8749]

Holy RAM utilization?! Look at that! First thing I noticed. I had been scratching my head why I only ever saw like 8-9 gigs of memory being used in the previous build. It's think thats the key point here, that's what they addressed... Now I'm seeing 20+ gigs. People seem to think they were going to get free fps, but fps in this title is almost a none-issue provided you're at some reasonable baseline.(I'm between 50 and 100+ fps, worst case busy airport and complex weather to flying the Nardi 333 over open water, 4k res.) What messed it up was the load-in stutters and hang-ups. The frametime inconsistency. Can't really say I've ever experienced that to a degree where it was even close to game breaking at all, but I know it was an issue for many. Tripling ram util. should improve things massively there. The next big step is multi-core optimization, but they've already announced to assign some of the worst offenders their own respective threads instead of lumping everything into 1 mainthread... I swear, open HWinfo at any point in your session and have a good cry at how poorly it uses your 16c/24c or so chip. That's the real bottleneck, until that's "fixed" you can play around with DLSS, framegen and the like all you want.

[@iaexo]

The hardest hitting airport by far for me is iniBuilds KJFK. At Mkvy’s EGKK I can get around 35-40 FPS, at ini KJFK it’s 20-25… For me no difference between SU14 and SU15 performance-wise

[@dubdubdidubadubdub]

The issue with VATSIM is loading the planes. Not sure why the heck it kills CPU. It should be only a graphical overhead, in the end it has to do no calculations for the AI traffic, it's just update position. make sure though that vPilot isn't loading anything but your model matching library, otherwise it can hit you even more.

[@CptLevii]

Still the same exact stutters on approach some approaches on testing was fine but others no no change even with auto fps and the lasso app to give msfs all the performance from the cpu it just doesn’t help that my only problem and it’s been this way for soo long immersion breaking stutters on approach micro and large stutters maybe I need a upgrade finally but I’m not sure I have a Ryzen 5 still for so long but when I first had MSFS it was fine combined with a 1080 ti founders 16 gig 3200mhz now I have a 4060 ti same cpu and it feels like over the course of updates and the addition of addons my game just stutters on approach I followed guides clearing cached deleting shaders a bunch of troubleshooting. And after this final “performance update” which it does feel like something’s are alittle better now my game is missing the options menu missing airport textures like lights and signs I can’t even see setting to configure anything but still manage to attempt flight with stutters in on the approach. A test airport for me for aircraft for me is Piarcos Int TTPP an airport that shouldn’t stutter but it does every time in the same exact way. Help if any would be appreciated.

[@CarlWicker]

are you using a LOD manager addon?

[@TheGadgetbadger]

I thought they released SU15 without the performance improvements as it was causing issues on xbox

[@goalski134]

BY FAR the smoothest and most stable FPS i’ve ever had in the sim. i love it so far.

[@Poseidon6363]

Same here , never bother looking at FPS, just look at how smooth it is.

[@LoCCr]

I have an performance boost from 15ms per frame to 4ms! (60 fps to >200 FPS!)

[@TheAviationLads]

What pc u got mate

[@MyBagpuss]

After an agonizing wait for what was heralded as a major update, SU 15 appears to be no different to its predecessor. The silence on the forums is deafening! Somebody please tell me which button to push to open Pandora's box. Improvements in VR would be good. PC is fine.

[@Hemeralopie]

Any difference in tile texture loading or mountain resolution?

[@augustomartins9516]

yes. Worse

[@EasyRhino58]

Run AI7. G force. 1060TI. laptop HP. notice the frame increase. actually it got. better. on DX12. from DX11. frame rates. are about 4647. Lowe's are. Lowes are. 3334.

[@b1lleman]

thank you for the video, I didn't see any difference either. Maybe non-3D cache cpu's might see a difference. Cheers.

[@Jim610]

Same for me. Load of hype, nothing delivered in terms of performance!

[@Jose0421]

Does anyone know if this update fixes the AI planes going thru each other?

[@willbennett1359]

I've lost 10fps in each scenario.... Really frustrating

[@nuegaifuentes9738]

How doing go back to 14? I'm on an xbox.... and it runs like crap.... I want it gone

[@AirNOTT]

Filmed 14 ahead of 15s release

[@Peter-55]

I have a low end system, but running 4k (i9-9900k & RTX2080ti). I see no difference, but I have yet to fly a long flight.

[@simemsayss4395]

That's not low end

[@RickyBobbyNASCARLOVER]

I got a 6700k an old cpu so hopefully it’ll run better and on mine

[@ElitistMagi]

Bro still no dynamic ground friction (wet/snow/dry) and working wipers FFS xD

[@ilya.kortev]

MS uses the old allocation mechanism (using processor cores). Essentially, one coordinating core is used, which is responsible for everything; previously it was the first, but now this role has been transferred to the last physical CPU core. Until they radically change the approach to distribution and optimal use of the entire CPU, there will be no improvements in performance - an increase in CPU-dependent FPS! They made one big step - completely changing the graphics engine compared to FSX-P3D. The second step remains. Look at how we solved the problem of using multi-core CPUs in DCS, without a single stutter with large volumes of objects in the scene. MS(Asobo) needs to do the same.

[@Rickk69er]

exactly thats why all these gamer dudes complain they dont understand msfs is not a first person shooter game

[@Iosis07]

Maybe difference is noticeable on some configurations, but here I do not see difference. Those few fps is nothing. I didn't yet tested on my system but I expect same.

[@Cursory3]

Me still wondering why my GPU utilization is stuck in 40% and my CPU having the time of his life doing jack shit

Sorry to say, same experience over here

[@dannymiester5825]

No fps improvement for me

[@FlameBot]

Try TAA and test again

[@MisterNashies-mv2my]

So then....this is a non update, but with a free plane....that's the same as another plane. Edit, next day: Tried the new A320. It definitely doesn't fight you as much as the old one. Will even let you "joyride" a bit. I did a short flight from Helsinki to Tallin and was just about to make the smoothest landing I ever have with a large jet....when the plane suddenly ramps the throttle to 99% like it's protecting itself from a crash. Does anyone know how to completely shut off all automation in this plane? I know she was literally designed to be flown without much human effort, but I'd like to fly her old school now-and-then.

[@briank3754]

With DLSS enabled you will always show CPU limited. To really test the performance difference you need to use TAA. Your GPU frametimes are almost half CPU frametimes with DLSS, this is normal. This is a result of DLSS reducing GPU workload. If you are in TAA you will see a drastic uptick in GPU frametime.

[@strangegoat7382]

SU15 has killed my sim in terms of stutters

[@stopspewinshit7878]

they didnt fix shit.... my frames went from a solid 39-44 in airports and SOLID 60 plus at altitude

[@NicolajFlies]

ASOBO lost their credibility a long time ago. They keep putting themselves in these situations, when announcing “MASSIVE PERFORMANCE IMPROVEMENTS”. Have y’all noticed how many 2024+ all of a sudden. I am done with 2020, and waiting at least 3 months to buy 2024.

[@georgefaulk2528]

Massive stuttering for me in big cities.

[@brianflyer1]

no difference at all with a 4090 and 64g ram

[@zwerushka1]

looks like soap on 4k. dont use taa and frame gen.

[@TBMPilot736]

For me same thing, no difference whatsoever!

[@stevesumner9988]

No difference for me.

[@ParZIVal19D]

Worse on Xbox somehow. 🤦🏼‍♂️

[@jordydejong-vv6xb]

😢

[@nydelicious4u]

BS same shit

[@19Zet72]

What do you thank them for? for destruct the simulator once again? The AI movement is not working. There are no planes at the airports. jams even after 2 seconds. graphics deteriorated and you thank them? puschback PRO does not work as it should. Go with them for asparagus to Germany. It was supposed to be a big update, but it's a big... you now what i mind.

[@WayneByrne-hs3pz]

No difference for me