Does the average person need to lift in low-rep ranges? | Layne Norton and Peter Attia

[@joec6344]

At age 67 I got a tip from my super experienced and super strong 36 year old son based on recent "research" he came across. Two worksets using a rep range where you hit failure between 4 and 6 reps. Then stop and move on to something else. Allegedly equal hypertrophy and strength improvement were found in the population of lifters that did that and a control group using more conventional strength protocols with more sets and other rep ranges. I'm on that for a couple months and like it a lot. Strength much improved from my high rep experience, less soreness and my lean mass seems to have increased (via BIA tests).

[@r_ds8057]

I have seen a couple of other doing this 2 set routine. Do you do warm up set or do you jump right into the 2 sets (after general warm up)?

[@joec6344]

@@r_ds8057 After a general warm up I do one or two lighter sets. For pullups, just one usually at bodyweight before tying on a kettlebell. A couple of sets for bench.

[@someguyusa]

Nice. It all comes down to your goals and how much weight you do or do not want to lift. I don't care for using heavy loads anymore. Really taxes my body in ways the make my daily life suffer, so I stick with moderate weights, reps, and sets. I'm not trying to be a pro or anything, just fit and healthy.

[@joeberger3441]

​@@someguyusaI'm 37, I genuinely don't understand this notion that low rep training leads to excessive fatigue, soreness, and/or wear n tear. I actually feel BETTER each week from getting in some quality top sets in that 1-3 rep range. But it matters how well you manage and select loads for these kinds of reps.

[@someguyusa]

@@joeberger3441 I'm glad it works for you. I didn't say it taxes yours or everybody's bodies in ways that make daily life worse. I said it taxes MY body that way. Hence, it comes down to the person. I can't handle it due to various reasons, but you're more than welcome to hit it hard.

[@Nipajim]

73 yr old here, I love that there are no definitive answers and we all need to grind in a way that suits us ...

[@oolala53]

That’s what it pretty much comes down to!

[@JourneyFitness210]

This guy gets it

[@MrBizfit]

Loved the very last tidbit from Layne about not quite having to go as close to failure on compound lifts compared to more isolation movements!!! Thanks 🙏 🎉

[@Weeweesilly]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aYqxaIV6jNBpq80si=53bWDMppoQNmSdli

[@oolala53]

@@Weeweesilly how about a hint about what the link is for? Is it reinforcing this information or a rebuttal? Thank you.

[@SubnetMaskedMan]

I made the most progress with low rep ranges, like 3-4 reps. I mean the most progress in BOTH strength & hypertrophy. However it always causes muscle imbalances for me. I believe it really depends on the person. Maybe because I’m 6ft with long arms, I dunno.

[@hikedayley9309]

Doing something, anything, low reps or high reps is better than no reps. There, I covered it all.

[@RaoBlackWellizedArman]

High reps or low reps better than no reps. 😅

[@RbgBennett]

U genius

[@whatever_it_takes6691]

Thanks Captain Obvious

[@hikedayley9309]

@@whatever_it_takes6691 ROFL

[@fitgearhunter]

Dear lord this is so good. Just the whole entrance aspect on his example of build up to a PR as just an aside to whole conversation is gold info.

[@Photoshop729]

In my 50s. Spent decades doing 3 sets of 10 with good results but just learned in last year about finding the 5 rep weight where you have 2-3 reps on reserve. Way better way to train! Faster results, shorter time in gym. Better muscle burn vs just boring last set or two.

[@robertsmentkowski312]

Same here after 5 decades of: Old; 3 sets of 8; work up to 12; add weight & drop reps to 8; repeat. New: workouts with different % 1 rep max. E.g., bench: 4 sets of 4 -90% or 4 sets of 8- 80% or 5 sets of 6- 85% or 3 sets of 12- 70%. I do warm up with 4-6 reps each with an empty bar (form), about 1/2 the weight, about 2/3 of weight & 3/4 or so the lifted weight. For me, 3 sets of 12 is less fatiguing & easier to do than 4 sets of 4.

[@oolala53]

@@robertsmentkowski312 are you saying that easier way gets you better results? Or is it just more likely that you’ll do that?

[@robertsmentkowski312]

@oolala53 Thank you for your comment. This made me examine the percentages I use of my 1RM for various rep ranges. No, it’s only less fatiguing and physically easier to do 3S of 12R @ 70% of 1RM [S sets; R reps; 1RM 1 rep max]. I find 5S of 6R @ 85% the most fatiguing & 4S of 4R @ 90% the most physically challenging. I am going to adjust the % of 1RM for reps as I progress. My current % of 1RM are: R % 2 95 4. 90* 6. 85** 8. 80 10. 75 12. 70*** * may add 1R to 5R for more fatigue; **since I lift at home w/o a spotter, I start 4R 83% @ & 6R @ 80%, then over time work up to the recommended %. *** I start @ 12R @ 70%. I will either slowly increase the % by 2% or add 1 rep at a time.

[@Soccasteve]

Layne did a good job explaining the difference in training mainly for strength vs. size. Guys always get caught up in their numbers, which is to their detriment if all they really care about is getting bigger. Not saying you shouldn’t try to get stronger, but you need to let that happen organically as progressive overload occurs from proper training.

[@ElBoyoElectronico]

For me personally, I love doing low rep sets (3x3) because it is fun! I really like to push myself and to be able to move more weight. Also, this might just be me, but it is controversially easier on my joints, than doing high rep sets. Of course, I am mainly talking about squats and deadlifts here. I already have huge legs by nature and I tend to focus more on strength for my lower body and more on hypertrophy for my upper body. Therefore when benching I go for the classic 3x8-12 routine.

[@Weeweesilly]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aYqxaIV6jNBpq80si=53bWDMppoQNmSdli

[@davidwagner9644]

Periodization is a training method individuals use to not get injured all the time. If all you do is train at 90 to 95% for 1 to 2 reps your chances of injuries are greater and you will plateau.

[@chadz393]

The strength and hypertrophy research has been really shit throughout the years, It's getting better. The only reason you need to do low reps is if you want to show how strong you are, as he says its a specific skill. Which can be dialed in pretty quick. All of the health and performance benefits can come from essentially any range as long as you're pushing it hard and close to failure.

[@Weeweesilly]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aYqxaIV6jNBpq80si=53bWDMppoQNmSdli

[@manymoms920]

And we intuitively know this

[@Soccasteve]

Well said. What’s unfortunate is guys always chase numbers thinking the size will follow when all they need to do is apply the correct stimulus and allow progressive overload to occur naturally.

[@RossKempOnYourMum01]

What's close to failure though? I thought 3 RIR was better for strength?

[@taurusx1000]

I think the point is to stimulate the muscle not wear it out

[@chattingwithshap8010]

There is a huge physiological and psychological adaptation. I teach strength training. Many people think they are at an RIR of 1-2 or RPE of 8-9, when it’s more like RIR of 4-5. They have trouble understanding what truly hard is. I don’t think there is any one number necessary for strength and size. There is no study that shows you’ll get much stronger doing sets of 3 than doing sets of 4. Or bigger doing a set of 9 or 10. It’s much more the intensity factor. Now for those competing, that’s a different ball game. You have to handle 2s - 3s etc.. Simple because you need to do a single in a meet, and having an opening lift number is important.

[@robertsmentkowski312]

@@chattingwithshap8010 yes, low rep sets near 1RM are mentally the most challenging. They hurt, so I learned to warm up with 4-8 reps at 40%, 60% & 80% before 4R @ 90%

[@MilanSteijn-n2v]

Sets of 10 also lower the likelyhood of injury, especially if you want to train into middle and old age. I think sets above 15 are not as effective to become or stay your strongest.

[@crossfunctionalfitness]

We've had a client reverse Osteoporosis lifting with 3-5 reps only. So yes, is the short answer.

[@KyleParker88]

It's not can you. It's do you need to.

[@crossfunctionalfitness]

@KyleParker88 yes, if you prefer having strong muscles, bones, tendons, ligaments and connective tissue. As opposed to weak.

[@bobp5523]

And how many people (particularly elderly people with osteoporosis) get injured doing near maximal workouts consisting of sets of 3 to 5 reps? Then they end up doing 0 sets of 0 reps.

[@crossfunctionalfitness]

@bobp5523 I don't have the stats for that. Maybe you'd care to share? But I do know of dozens who got fractures from not doing anything - some from rolling over in bed. Light weight won't do much for improving bone density.

[@bobp5523]

@@crossfunctionalfitness Depends on what you mean by light vs heavy. Please define. So I ask : Are you saying you know dozens of people who are in their 50s and 60s and who had severe osteoporosis that are now doing bench presses for 5 sets of 5 with a barbell loaded to their bodyweight or squats at 1.5x? That is what I consider heavy. I seriously doubt most untrained elderly people with or without osteoporosis would be able to work up to anywhere near loads like that without getting injured in the process.

[@eduardosuarez2414]

If you want strength and some hypertrophy, just alternate rep ranges each session. One session is your "heavy" lift, the next one is light. So in the heavy one you might start at 5x5 and work through 4x4, 3x5, 3x3 for example until you reset. In the lighter one you're doing maybe 75% of the heavy weight from 3x10, 3x8, etc. I was actually doing 6x2 for the heavy sessions at the end of the cycle, and now that most lifts have started to stall in that range, I'm going back to 3x5 for a deload and to check how much my strength has increased from the last time. I tried Starting Strength for a couple of months and my deadlift was stalled for about 4 weeks until I went back to the above method, and progress continued. I'm not blaming the SS program, it just didn't really work for me.

[@ariconsul]

As Lane implies the bigger problem for me is the brain (adherence), not the rep ranges. My muscles fibers are simple. If I feed them time under tension, nutrients and rest, and don't injure myself, then like plants they will grow. The issue is getting my brain and the nervous system to get my muscles to produce enough force and volume of work safely intensely, and consistently. My brain doesn't naturally want to work to near true failure, eat boring but nutritious, and get to sleep early (and stay asleep!). Psychology as much as physiology. Social support is my best supplement - a good gym partner is better than creatine.

[@DrSynapse72]

3:55. Well, what do you enjoy? BINGO!

[@oolala53]

I remember getting training in super slow three decades ago. The big sell was that I only did one set of four or five movements in a session. Took about 20 minutes. Once or twice a week. I found that feeling of those last few reps was so awful that I ended up dropping the practice even though I did notice after a few weeks that there was a lot more pep in my step. I admit I would have been better off sticking with it, but it was just too unpleasant. Unfortunately, I also didn’t do something more pleasant, which might not have gotten me the same gains, but would probably have left me in better stead than I am now at age 71. I’m willing to experience that feeling a little more, but in my training so far, my trainer has me at higher reps at least for now. He has a lot of experience dealing with older clients so I’m going with that for now. Also, it’s made a real difference to have somebody be able to guide me into the very precise position needed. When I would try some of the moves on my own, I didn’t know I was not accessing all the muscle fibers, and I’m sure that that helped create some imbalances. I’m actually in a better position healthwise, then a fair number of my peers, but my body composition has definitely be going in the wrong direction, and my A1c has been creeping up in a way that I thought I was protected against by losing a 40 pounds 12 years ago and keeping it off. I’ll never know that that might not have happened anyway even if I had been a regular exerciser, but I suspect if I had been getting in some moderate aerobic work, several times a week and a few sessions of resistance work in good form, it might take a few more years for that rise to happen. And having witnessed older relatives and in-laws struggle, it’s hard not to want to believe that some action I can take will make a difference.

[@clarkeduggan]

Why are all the comments so bad? What happened to Peters following?

[@oolala53]

What makes the comments so bad? And it’s “Peter’s.”

[@justinb7859]

Specifically i meant this guy ...so many more knowledgable legends in the space whos approach obliterates this guy

[@tsebosei1285]

Dr Layne Norton nice biceps

[@straycat1115]

Showing off a little..😂

[@haitzz23]

*triceps

[@sassysandie2865]

Too big. I bet he has trouble buying shirts.

[@oldnatty61]

Me thinks homeboy's starting to deep his beak into the honey jar.

[@Weeweesilly]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aYqxaIV6jNBpq80si=53bWDMppoQNmSdli

[@mattmullenix]

2:13 What does Layne mean by STABLED in this context?

[@ariconsul]

His pronunciation is a bit mushy. The word is "stapled", with a "p", not stabled with a "b" Think of the visual image of someone failing on a bench press. Their arms collapsing snd the bar falling on the chest is being compared to being pressed and flattened against a surface by a piece of metal like a stapler does with sheets of paper (or the shape of the staple itself before and after stapling).

[@mattmullenix]

@@ariconsul Oh that's great. Thank you friend. That makes sense. Has that phrase been around in weightlifting for a while? I went off and thought he meant like a horse being returned to the stable because he's done working or something! Thank you.

[@ariconsul]

@@mattmullenix You're welcome. My sense of time isn't great and I don't use that phrase actively. Google pulls up results from 2006 and I'll bet it's been used in the powerlifting community long before then.

[@miketracy9256]

VARIETY MAKES SENSE AND FOR US OLDER LIFTERS, HIGHER REPS SEEM SAFER.

[@bobp5523]

Exactly. I’ve trained for decades, both cardio and weights. It is much easier to get injured going heavy when you are in your 60s than it is when you are in your 30s. And recovery is much slower. So I prefer to do sets of 8 to 15 now. My 5 sets of 5 and 3 sets of 3 days are long gone. My goal now is to keep training and stay injury free.

[@mathew9851]

Missed opportunity to discuss improvements in brain health due to strength training in that rep range. Obviously, the brain isn’t laynes expertise, but it would be great to have somebody on the podcast to discuss this in detail for those that would benefit from hearing it.

[@kwikstep-1]

They will not address brain health, only on muscle mass & strength. Here is an exercise if you are interested in brain & physical health.This is an excerpt from a study in Frontiers in Aging Neuroscience “ Dancing can actually reverse brain changes that occur due to aging. People in the study who did a variety of dancing styles for an hour 3 times a week had healthier white matter in a part of the brain linked to memory. Scientists believe that the combination of exercise(Dancing), mental stimulation ( you have to remember all the steps, figures, timing, rhythm, body, hip, leg action of each different dances), social engagement make dancing a good choice for holding off the effects of aging. It is difficult than just lifting weights, or strength training since your brain does not have to remember anything because of the repetitive nature of the mentioned exercises I reach the old age of 86 yrs, by just following the Scientists recommendations.

[@oolala53]

⁠@@kwikstep-1 you actually don’t know if that’s why you reached the age of 86. I’m sure studies can show that many kinds of physical activity promote brain health. But I remember reading years ago that people who went and did social dancing three times a week. We’re actually more fit than people who did three sessions of an hour of aerobic workouts. They couldn’t tell why, but I would imagine the increased mental engagement there might be by needing to flow with a partner could contribute to. But it probably has to do with comfort zones. It’s possible somebody who loves this kind of regimented exercise would feel more stressed by having to manage outside input. And dancers might really hate that sense of having to push so hard.

[@kwikstep-1]

@@oolala53My priority in exercising is to enjoy life. Dancing is the only exercise to me that I find most enjoyable & enable me to engage in social interaction without talking, I let my feet do the talking. The physical exercise I get is dancing 4 to 5 times a week, for at least 2 hrs,

[@JourneyFitness210]

Layne’s biceps lookin real juicy here 💪

[@cimarronMC]

Effective reps are what matters most.

[@timmiet47321]

Well, some folks have connective tissue issues that limit high volume training.

[@oldnatty61]

For what goal?

[@Weeweesilly]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aYqxaIV6jNBpq80si=53bWDMppoQNmSdli

[@thecastle09]

Do what works for you….

[@K4R3N]

Best duo

[@someguyusa]

I grew up on a farm. It's obvious that you don't need to go to failure to get bigger and stronger. It never ceases to amaze me how researchers get so lost in the sauce on some topics like this. Like, dude, when you work hard for a living it's really obvious.

[@Soccasteve]

It’s not that you can’t gain any muscle staying away from failure, but insinuating you can become as big as possible staying far from failure is just silly. There’s a big difference between farm boys and bodybuilders.

[@oolala53]

@@Soccasteve neither Lane nor Peter is a bodybuilder.

[@excalibro8365]

@@oolala53 Layne has competed as a natural bodybuilder

[@Coover90210]

Guy on the left held up the start of the interview to do a few sets with a curl bar.

[@adnan7698]

I'm injured bro 😭

[@blubberman258]

2 years ago. come on

[@bobo-cc1xw]

Yeah human physiology has changed so much in the time. My muscles now work on I've olive oil

[@Themata]

​@@bobo-cc1xwit's more that we thought it was a new conversation, but it's a years old clip of a conversation many have already seen

[@robertcachia6484]

Meeting of the mind's just missing Derrick.

[@SiVispacemparabellum045]

Ok I can get ‘plenty strong’ and ‘real strong’ dam. 🤨

[@robbhensel7842]

4-9 Rep Range. Mic drop

[@okoiful]

Get DR JACK KRUSE!

[@shawnheath6966]

No. But, why be average?

[@tamberlame27]

Because I have other priorities in life

[@christiancoats1]

Because going for max strength increases risk of injury, and that's not worth it for many people

[@bartrobinson2103]

​@tamberlame27 Exactly!

[@steven209]

Do roids simple

[@stevenjezyk9435]

You have to do exercises you hate 😡 when it comes to resistance training 💪. Unless you have an injury 🤕

[@grimtrigg3r]

Couldn’t disagree more. What an odd relationship to have with training if you feel you have to hate it to make progress. You must be pretty new to the game.

[@stevenjezyk35]

Lifting 40 years. Sub 5% body fat. Nattie. You ?

[@JasonBassettphotography]

no, you don’t. you can program what you like.

[@stevenjezyk9435]

​@@JasonBassettphotography usually means easy 😅

[@bradthompson5383]

@@stevenjezyk35 That is at least 1 lie.

[@kenycharles8600]

I really would like for gym rats to be able to communicate with words instead of acronyms. Yeah, sure, he's got big biceps. But, what is he saying? What is RPE? What are RDLs?

[@davidwagner9644]

RPE= Rate of Perceived Exertion- it is a subjective metric people apply to weight training. RDL= Romanian Deadlift. It is a posterior chain (backside of body) exercise. Americans do it wrong. Anothers you might here are: TUT- Time Under Tension- this is the time your muscle is under tension. Basically what you want to do is slowly lower (eccentric phase of exercise) for 2 to 8 seconds to increase the amount of tension the muscle experiences. RIR= Reps in Reserve. Meaning how many reps you are away from failing. It is a subjective measurement as well.

[@kenycharles8600]

@davidwagner9644 thank you.

[@BBBerti]

Google it

[@kenycharles8600]

@BBBerti gfys Google it.

[@zebulon5768]

Not worth it unless competing in strength

[@bartrobinson2103]

What a joke

[@Weeweesilly]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aYqxaIV6jNBpq80si=53bWDMppoQNmSdli

[@emilienbialecki448]

The more reps you do the less big you become

[@paull9086]

Is this guy even a doctor!?

[@bartrobinson2103]

The two clowns

[@Weeweesilly]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aYqxaIV6jNBpq80si=53bWDMppoQNmSdli

[@bartrobinson2103]

​@@WeeweesillyHa ha he's a clown thank you

[@powskier]

10 sets of 3 will benefit you a hell of a lot more than 3 sets of 10.

[@Soccasteve]

Benefit you more in what way? If you’re talking muscle growth I would disagree. Sure you can gain a lot of muscle doing that but 10 sets of 3 is going to wreck you and chances are you won’t be able to do much productive training after that.

[@powskier]

@Soccasteve wrong.

[@oolala53]

Is anybody talking here about doing 10 sets of three question mark and you’re saying 32 failure are almost failure? Of course getting to failure or near failure 10 times is going to do more. It’s gonna do more of a lot of things, some of which may detract from the real goal.

[@BBBerti]

No, it will not benefit you a " hell of a lot more" lol, it has strength benefits with its own downsides, that is it. And you'll spend more than 3 times as long in the gym cause you need to rest much longer after 3 rep sets with high rpe

[@DrJuliusG]

LN: Cognitive dissonance was beaten out of me. Also LN: There is nothing inherently wrong with processed food except for [the inherent properties of processed food]. kzbin.info/www/bejne/aYKaooWtbs-SorM

[@oldnatty61]

You can get strong on sets of 1000, and if your goal is health, fitness, longevity you'd be better off.

[@nyguy5370]

Nah - that is called cardio. 😂

[@Fraunzi]

This is false and you’re incredibly misinformed

[@brianmcg321]

lol. How dumb.

[@oldnatty61]

@ cardio and strength are just two ends of the strength and conditioning spectrum.

[@oldnatty61]

For all those below who tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. kzbin.info/www/bejne/gZnWg4WjZsqBkM0si=wOHygM38LyjKFzZ6 kzbin.info/www/bejne/eHuphoiFq76kfs0si=ihfIaG1qDeqC6WnA kzbin.info/www/bejne/gGLSo2dmaNlrp68si=DGbreY3OakUEgTto kzbin.info/www/bejne/oInNc3SepZJ0bJIsi=HjUucEVFNON2Sqti kzbin.info/www/bejne/nXuTeIqaqNV8rpIsi=MpSbPFN6p3qFFlHm kzbin.info/www/bejne/o33QeHqLnLedZrcsi=wvzXIh_Mp1YyvzyE kzbin.info/www/bejne/imizYqJniKuqjposi=SYqFbU0KsPFIHgvy kzbin.info/www/bejne/b3irnZZspdmXoLcsi=J6Nc5W2_52cgKWmt kzbin.info/www/bejne/Z5fZhK1toLCtp9Usi=dJHN4-AXw1QQVCYH

[@petercoderch589]

Peter Atti'a dumb jock arch continues, like a whole year now and counting now. Maybe time to rename this "The Peter Attia Bodybuilding Podcast". Endless videos on weightlifting, protein powders and exercise. It's crazy that this guy 2-4 years ago was all about fasting, autophagy, calorie restriction mimetics, rapamycin, geroprotectors and inhibiting MTOR for life extension, and now he is all about packing muscle, stimulating MTOR as much as possible via eating massive amounts of protein and BCAA. Oh, and exercice, exercise, and more exercise on top of even more exercise, even though there's no evidence whatsoever that exercise increases lifespan or even healthspan. Por marathon runners have an average lfe expectancy of 56 years(average male: 78) Bodybuilders are even more short-lived, with most dying in their late forties on average. Even the ones that don't take steroids live short lifespans. Peter Attia says: "You need lots of muscle for glucose disposal and insulin sensitivity.:" While completely ignoring that building and maintaining large amounts of muscles requires a great calorie intake, which increases oxidative stress and worsens insulin signaling. Not yo mention that the extra weight puts a huge strain on your heat. Peter Attia is so dumb that he thinks that you can can pack 20, 30 or even 40 lbs of muscle without that extra tissue not putting stress on your heart. Hey, Peter, you do realize that is live tissue that requires extra blood, right? Mayve on his next podcast Attia could have Jeff Nippard or "Coach Greg" since weight lifting and bodybuilding is all that he cares about now.🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@oolala53]

Are you talking about peer-reviewed studies on marathoners and weightlifters related tohealth span? But I get what you mean about the emphasis on fitness. I listen sometimes, but I’m always a little suspicious because it really seems to me that people who already had a predilection for exercise find research that supports it. And that goes for other focuses as well. One person’s grandma escaped heart disease with a diet of very low animal, food sources, and lots of beans and vegetables, and they say lots of studies that show the advantages of that. They all poo poo the validity of the other guy’s research. But I find a hard to believe that there is no evidence that moderate, consistent activity is not correlated with longer health span say, into the 80s. I’ve read recently that getting to 90 and above seems very highly correlated with genetics which is pretty much luck. But are you saying you think that lifestyle wouldn’t have any effect on a longer health span?

[@justinmininger5973]

Thanks Peter, Layne I'd love to see you and Mike Israetel just chat and b.s. Please and please again

[@DrAJ_LatinAmerica]

Maybe Layne and Andy Galpin

[@PaulRamen]

There's an upcoming podcast of peter with mike

[@meltedsnowman9637]

@@PaulRamen Where did they announce this?

[@HollyTBaxter]

Since neither of them has published any research on this topic, (they mostly just appear as guests on papers but don’t do any research themselves), it might be more beneficial to have Peter consult a researcher with in-depth knowledge of the muscle growth data. That way, we can gain insights that extend beyond the perspectives of social media influencers. Dr Samuel Buckner, Dr Eduardo De Souza, James Steel etc.

[@DrAJ_LatinAmerica]

@HollyTBaxter true. As a side note: Isn't divorce fun? For the male, it's the ,"f,ing" you get for the little you got. For the female, it is the "f,ing" you can give back for all you had to take, when you didn't want to take it.

[@olegnovitski6987]

Actually the only efficient range for naturals to train is 3 to 6 reps. It is the only way to increase strength, which eventually leads to muscle gain. For enhanced lifters anything works.

[@robbhensel7842]

4-9 for enough effective reps

[@oldnatty61]

Not at all true.

[@alec_schumacher]

What happens though if someone does 7 reps with 0 reps in reserve?

[@olegnovitski6987]

@@alec_schumacher It will mean around 15% decrease in intensity compared to 6 reps, which is quite a lot. 8 reps will mean 30% decrease and so on. Every big decrease in intensity makes a set less efficient for strength for natural lifters. In natural lifters strength equals hypertrophy to an incomparably higher extent than in enhanced lifters.

[@oldnatty61]

@@alec_schumacher Shit! I don't know!? There's no research on it! We have data on 6, 6.25, 6.5, 6.75, 7.25, 7.5, 7.75, and 8 and 0. But we don't have anything on 7 and 0! It's uncharted territory! A black hole! WE JUST DON"T KNOW!