Don’t Flat Tow in NEUTRAL!

Flat Towing Can Damage a Transmission. Be it a manual or an automatic transmission, flat towing in neutral can damage the transmission. It’s perfectly fine for some, but others need special consideration.
In most cases, transmission components are lubricated and cooled by either pressurized or splash lubrication supplied by the input shaft (engine side of the trans). If the transmissions are spun by the output side of the transmission, like when flat towing, lack of lubrication can result in transmission failure.
So always refer to the owners manual before attempting to flat tow a vehicle behind and RV or for vehicle recovery.
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[@MattyJones]

Ahhh crap. I've flat towed my 08 Wrangler 15k miles with it in Neutral. I just went back and reread my manual and apparently you're right! 😢 No bueno. Well it still works with 215k on it, so i got that going for me.

[@freedomworx]

Luck Counts 😂👍

[@MattyJones]

Towing 4WD Models NOTE: The transfer case must be shifted into N (Neu- tral) for recreational towing. Shifting Into Neutral (N) Use the following procedure to prepare your vehicle for recreational towing. CAUTION It is necessary to follow these steps to be certain that the transfer case is fully in N (Neutral) before recre ational towing to prevent damage to internal parts. 1. Depress brake pedal. 2. Shift automatic transmission into NEUTRAL or de- press clutch pedal on manual transmission. 3. Shift transfer case lever into N (Neutral). 4. Start engine. 5. Shift automatic transmission into DRIVE or manual transmission into gear. 6. Release brake pedal and ensure that there is no vehicle movement. 7. Shut the engine off and place the ignition key into the ACC position. 8. Shift automatic transmission into PARK. 9. Apply parking brake. 10. Attach vehicle to the tow vehicle with tow bar. 11. Release parking brake. 12. Disconnect the negative battery cable, and secure it away from the negative battery post.

[@freedomworx]

Thats a pretty thorough process.

[@HammerWrench]

You’re a wealth of knowledge Jamin.

[@freedomworx]

I’m a nerd 🤓

[@brentmcgillis]

This is an awesome piece of information for people like me with the Class A motor-home. This video gives a great visual confirmation of how your transmission works.

[@freedomworx]

I’m glad you enjoyed it 👍

[@ericfraley1514]

Great visual and descriptive explanation.

[@freedomworx]

Glad you got something out of it 👍

[@thelast929]

Everyone knows some exception, 😂 here’s mine: Pre 1967 power-glides have a fluid pump in the tail shaft. In “N” w/engine off the fluid still moves. This allowed me to push start (@88mph) my ‘66 many a time!

[@freedomworx]

You have friends that can run 88MPH 🤯

[@thelast929]

@@freedomworx LOL, no! The 88mph was a joke! If you found a slight decline that was long enough (like the twin pines mall parking lot) it would start if you could sustain 10mph for a bit. 20mph pushed by another vehicle worked best though!👍

[@freedomworx]

Yeah, I’m aware that some of the older Autos had the rear pump on them 👍 😉. But you can’t go back in time at 88MPH unless Mr. Fusion is properly engaged.

[@pblackbird]

Ok, that's where I was unclear. I thought you had held the output shaft side with vise-grips and the hammer. I couldn't tell which end was which. Now I can see the clutch would ride on the left.

[@freedomworx]

10-4

[@jf4872]

Greatly depends on the trans...with the vehicle in neutral (5spd manual only) there is 'no load' on the engine as there would be with the engine running. The oil level will also be up to where the fill plug is at whereas in the video the sump is empty. The oil (when filled) while on the road in neutral will splash around relatively easy allowing lubrication.

[@freedomworx]

www.tremec.com/not_am_detalle/flat-towing-manual-transmission-vehicles/

[@Thunderstormworld]

That's exactly what I told him as apparently he never had a transmission working to see how much oil flings around even when the engine is not running in neutral and moving. I had to do it once and got drenched in oil to fault find a noise in the transmission. Unfortunately experience sometimes out smart people's who think they know everything and by making a video to prove a point without having every detail correct just brings egg on face.

[@freedomworx]

@@Thunderstormworld you are arguing with the manufacture, not me. And all the people who have actually burnt up a trans for the exact reasons I explained. Click on this link and tell Tremec they don't understand the transmissions they designa and build. Then tell every heavy tow truck driver to stop pulling the drivelines before they tow semis... because you said it's a waste of time 😂 www.tremec.com/not_am_detalle/flat-towing-manual-transmission-vehicles/

[@jf4872]

Don't see where he mentions anything of a Tremec vehicle. Never heard of myself. Automatic transmissions pump fluid thru the trans whereas manual trans generally do not especially if it's a asynchronous trans like in a VW.@@freedomworx

[@gene2200]

Excellent video by someone that knows their shit, and sir I believe you do, I'm old school, gotta dolly my 82 4 spd bronco 17miles, thought I'd look into it. So if I dolly it put transfer case in N and trans in 4th so oil gets it all grezzy n stuff. Makes sense, 1st one that did. Taking shaft out of my 68 Cougar. Unless they work backwards 😮?

[@gene2200]

May still have owners manual. Says start shift go fwrds... great video btw!!!!!! People don't think about stuff like that these days!

[@freedomworx]

Yeah it’s not common knowledge these days. Honestly don’t know if it ever was. 😂

[@alecboyyes]

Flat towing in gear: best way to spread your engine all over the highway. My Ford Focus (UK) manual says to put in neutral if being towed on four wheels.

[@freedomworx]

Who said to flat tow it in gear? 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@alecboyyes]

@@freedomworx Doesn't the title say not to flat tow in neutral?

[@freedomworx]

@@alecboyyes doesn’t say to flat tow in gear, nor did I ever say or insinuate that. The point of the video is to teach people that it isn’t always safe to just throw the vehicle and neutral and yank it down the road. Sometimes you simple can’t flat tow without disconnecting some mechanical components. That’s why I stated to read the owners manual 🤷🏻‍♂️ www.tremec.com/not_am_detalle/flat-towing-manual-transmission-vehicles/

[@alecboyyes]

@@freedomworx Cool, no worries. Probably got my wires crossed, just found your video out of curiosity having watched something on a different channel.

[@freedomworx]

@@alecboyyes no problem. Thanks for watching.

[@akzocolo]

My 1992 F150 4WD has a 5-speed manual transmission (M5OD), and a Manual Transfer Case (I think it's a BW13-56). I assume I can put the Transmission and Transfer Case in neutral, set the front wheel manual hubs to Free, and flat tow without problems. It seems that with the Transfer Case in neutral, and front hubs set to free, the transmission would not be spinning. It seems that the tranny would be separated from the front wheels and from the rear wheels. The rear driveshaft would spin. The rear output shaft of the manual Transfer Case would spin. But I assume the Transfer Case oil pump would operate because the oil pump for the Transfer Case is on the rear output shaft. Is that correct? Does this seem right?

[@freedomworx]

You really have to read the owners manual. I think the M5OD might actually be fine to be towed in neutral. But generally, when flat towing a 4x4 truck. The T-Case is in Nuetral and the transmission is left in Park or in Gear. Although there may not be a mechanical couple between the tires and the transmission, the fluid friction alone in the T-Case will still spin a transmission output shaft while flat towing.

[@ericfraley1514]

​@@freedomworx I posted a question under a different comment, I think this is the answer I was looking for. Thanks!

[@BeeRAD56]

Thank you for this video. What gear should the transmission be in? My manual says put it in gear, but it doesn't say what gear. If my tow speeds are as high as 65 mph, it would seem to me that it should be in 5th or 6th. Any advice is appreciated!

[@freedomworx]

The only way your transmission should be in gear when being flat towed is if its a 4WD with the transfer case in neutral. In which case, it wont matter what gear. So long is it's not in neutral.

[@ericfraley1514]

If it's a 4WD vehicle with the transfer case in N, would it matter what gear the transmission is in, could it be in park or neutral or whatever you choose? Wouldn't the transfer case isolate the drive shafts from the transmission thus making the gear selection irrelevant?

[@freedomworx]

The trans should not be in neutral. The T-Case will still spin the trans even if the T-Case is in neutral. Fluid friction alone will cause it to spin the trans. Every owners manual I’ve ever seen specified that the trans should not be in neutral. Manuals must be in gear and autos must be in park.

[@christopherkenn53]

May I ask you a towing question? I just bought an RV with a 2016 SRX Cadillac fully set up for flat tow. Am I buying a peck of problems. Seller is a retired pilot. A real belt and suspenders kind of guy. Dealer service history is impeccable. Thoughts?

[@freedomworx]

I'm not a Cadillac fan. If it's a good deal, go for it. But I would never buy one. I'm a Lexus guy.

[@christopherkenn53]

Nothing I've researched recommends flat towing in my case a 2010 RX350 which I was planning to sell gor $10k cuz I only have a 2 car garage. Me, sit behind a 22 Taco trd sport

[@calenmoerman]

I've never quite had a handle on this topic, as it relates to Wranglers with T-Case in neutral, assuming we tow with engine off. It seems to me that if the T-Case is in neutral, it wouldn't spin the transmission output shaft. If it did spin the transmission output shaft somewhat, then if the transmission is in gear, doesn't that mean it's also spinning the engine, which is turned off? For that reason, it has seemed intuitive to have the transmission in neutral, to avoid spinning the engine, and then of course the unlikely threat that if the T-Case ever jostled into gear (which it almost certainly never will), then if the tranny is in gear too, you'll certainly have multiple drivetrain damage. Just wondering how leaving the tranny in gear lubricates the tranny without turning the engine.

[@freedomworx]

Leaving the trans in gear while the T-Case is in nuetral does not lubricate the trans, it just keeps it from spinning. Even with the T-Case in nuetral, fluid friction inside the T-Case will cause the trans output to spin, the same way this trans output was able to cause the input to spin in Nuetral. It’s not mechanically coupled, it’s just fluid friction causing the rotation. Putting the trans in gear will couple it to the engine and stop it from rotating.

[@madislandguy]

What's an owner's manual?

[@freedomworx]

It’s got words and stuff. 🤓

[@samsaverino8159]

I didn't know this.

[@freedomworx]

Most people don’t. You have to check your owners manual to know what’s safe for your specific transmission. It’s ok for some manual gear boxes.

[@infadelakainf]

How do you tie a FWD car with a manual transmission?

[@freedomworx]

FWD cars have transaxles, not transmissions 😉. Most FWD manual transmission car can be flat towed in neutral safely. But you have to read the owners manual to be certain.

[@djjaysky9071]

you always tow in neutral or you will blow the trans

[@freedomworx]

Go read some owners manuals and get back to me. www.tremec.com/not_am_detalle/flat-towing-manual-transmission-vehicles/

[@djjaysky9071]

this is like the idiots saying to flat tow in park

[@freedomworx]

In a 4wd vehicle with an automatic the T-Case is placed in Neutral, and the trans is placed in Park 🤷🏻‍♂️(generally). Says it right there in the owners manuals. Might want to do a little research before you start calling people names. Those “idiots” might be smarter and more informed than you.

[@linuxguy1199]

Why not just tow in gear with the ignition off? Thats what I do, then everything gets all nice and lubricated.

[@freedomworx]

It’s an option. Though a lot of people think the oil pump doesn’t work if the ignition isn’t on. (Though people obviously don’t understand engines very well)

[@linuxguy1199]

@@freedomworx Plus it gives you some free trailer braking to help prevent trailer sway!

[@freedomworx]

@@linuxguy1199 touché 😎

[@braixeninfection6312]

I tow in gear with engine running. That way my tow rig gets better gas mileage lol

[@larryhutchens7593]

This applied to manual transmission rear wheel drive only. Front wheel drive manual trans, OK.

[@freedomworx]

Front wheel drive's have a transaxle, different animal 😉. Same with old VWs. The ring a pinion is in there slinging oil everywhere. 💦💦

[@larryhutchens7593]

@@freedomworx I am very aware of that and that is the reason that I purchased a used Fiat 500 to tow behind my little RV. In case you are not aware it is very difficult to find a car with a manual transmission here. Very difficult.

[@freedomworx]

@@larryhutchens7593 where are you located? The Jeep Wrangler/Gladiator are good Go-To vehicles to flat tow here in the U.S. Just slap the T-Case in Neutral and you're good to go.

[@larryhutchens7593]

@@freedomworx Couple of problems with your suggestion. 1) It's a 4 wheel drive, don't need or want that, too many moving parts in the drivetrain to maintain and I do nearly all of my own maintenance. 2) It is too heavy. I tried towing a Chrysler LeBaron sedan on a U-Haul tow dolly (the larger one) with a combined weight of about 4,100 lb. Fried a torque converter in my little Class B camper. My Fiat weights in at a little over 2,400 lb. Cars, not trucks or Jeeps, with manual transmissions are very difficult to find. Cars that weigh less than 3,000 lb: Toyota Yaris, some Toyota Corollas, Honda Fit, GEO (or Chevy) Metro, Suzuki Swift, and a couple of others that are kinda rare. All the Metros that I found were totally worn out, could be fixed easy enough but basically ready for the junk yard. Metros would be a good choice due to their simplicity, no electronic bells & whistles just basic transportation. I did find one Chevy something or other that is made in Korea but it had such a hideous color of paint. A greenish yellow that looked like it would glow in the dark. I think it was called a Spark or something like that. Choices seemed to be either a European or Japanese car.

[@freedomworx]

@@larryhutchens7593 I'm not suggesting a Jeep, just saying that it has been a very popular flat tow vehicle for decades in the U.S. because the 4WD system makes it simple to flat tow because all you need to do is put the T-Case in Neutral. No need for auxiliary pumps or driveline disconnects like on a lot of other vehicles. Of course, Jeeps are much bigger and heavier than they used to be. I've seen many people towing Fiat 500s as of late.

[@bluedeval03]

But follow your owner’s manual as every vehicle can be different on what needs to be in what position.

[@freedomworx]

Yep. I stated that and typed it in the description 👍

[@pblackbird]

Unless your driveshaft is disconnected or the transfer case (if equipped) is in neutral, wouldn't the output shaft be turning the whole time you're moving? That should provide adaquate lubrication for flat towing.

[@freedomworx]

The output shaft does not distribute oil in the transmission, that's the point of the video.

[@pblackbird]

​@@freedomworx, I understand what you're saying, but you say the countershaft spins when the output shaft does. Your video clearly demonstrates that. Isn't that what is doing the splashing? The video seems contradictory, and I'm just trying to figure out how the transmission on your bench could be damaged if the countershaft is spun by the output shaft by the wheels turning.

[@freedomworx]

@pblackbird the video says that the countershaft only spins when the transmission is in gear or the engine is running. I demonstrate that it is not spun by the output in neutral. Watch it again 😉

[@pblackbird]

at 0:57 is the countershaft not spinning while the transmission is in neutral?@@freedomworx

[@freedomworx]

@@pblackbird yes, because I’m turning the input shaft, not the output shaft.

[@Shade_tree_garage01]

Well now I’m going to since you said to not to :V (joke)

[@freedomworx]

Never know until you try 🤪

[@NdinguAnda]

This a whole bunch of nonsense

[@freedomworx]

I guess you know more than the companies that design and build the transmissions 🤷🏻‍♂️. www.tremec.com/not_am_detalle/flat-towing-manual-transmission-vehicles/