Don't Touch The Fish: Why Student Films Fail

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Many film students may think that they understand how to put a successful short together, until they actually attempt it by trying to replicate one of their favourite movies and realises that something is off. In this video I’ll look at the biggest mistake made by young filmmakers embarking on short films through a concept I call: don’t touch the fish, focus on the rice. I’ll go over my early experience of making a short called 'Windstil' and outline basic principles to follow if you want to produce a quality, successful student film.
'Windstil' Short Film: www.graykotze.com/windstil
List Of Films Featured:
2001: A Space Odyssey (1968)
The Godfather (1972)
Jaws (1975)
Following (1998)
Saving Private Ryan (1998)
Shaun Of The Dead (2004)
4 Months, 3 Weeks And 2 Days (2007)
Inception (2010)
Jiro Dreams Of Sushi (2011)
Windstil - Short Film (2013)
Whiplash - Short Film (2013)
Whiplash (2014)
Interstellar (2014)
Thunder Road - Short Film (2016)
Hail, Caesar! (2016)
0:00 Introduction
1:04 Don't Touch The Fish
2:59 My Short Film Experience
6:09 How To Make A Good Short
7:39 Conclusion
Music:
Geographer - ‘Bright Idea’
Geographer - ‘Away’
Asher Fulero - ‘Night Snow’
Geographer - ‘Lightning Bugs’

[@juhosallinen1627]

I see many comments here, saying they disagree with the message of this video. I don't think the video is trying to tell us not to aim high or be experimental or creative - it's just pointing out some of the most common pitfalls of student films and advises people to start on the right foot and learn the basics first. Many of you saying that failure is a great chance to learn from... of course it is, but I don't think you should deliberately try to aim for failure. The chances of you failing in your first attempts at filmmaking are pretty damn high anyways, so why self-sabotage and try to make a WWII epic with 2 friends and a 5 dollar budget? It's a different story of course if you do it tongue-in-cheek and just for fun, but I've seen many aspiring filmmakers and most if not all of them are very serious about their projects - and when their unrealistic expectations are not met with and they're denied of their instant gratification, most of them quickly lose interest. So I think you sir are right on the money: learn to cook the rice first! It may be a rather classical take on education, but it's proven to be effective.

[@smartstuf1026]

yeah this comment section is like a large echo chamber pinning down the same point that was never contested in the first place.

[@auron1987]

"Failure is a great chance to learn" - And learning from someone else's failure is the best because then you didn't have to make the same mistakes.

[@paulpierantozzi]

Why not try to make a WW2 epic with 2 friends and 5 dollars? That is literally what steven spielberg used to do in the desert with his friends.

[@gregorylagrange]

@@paulpierantozzi The key point to recommending not going for an epic as the very early attempts is the fundamentals that need developing and mastering. People usually get swayed by the spectacular when they get motivated to learn a craft. Or the grandness as a whole. And early attempts are often done without the necessary attention to the small parts that epics are built with. Which can cause added frustration and delayed development. So go ahead and try for an epic with two friends and $5. Except epics aren't made with that. But simple scenes with good dialogue and relatable subject matter are. So he's not saying don't. He's saying he's recognized patterns and offering advice. And those patterns say that the people who make epics now didn't get that good by making epics. They got good by making small fundamental stuff. There's always somebody who wants to argue with binary extremes. Even Spielberg's early movie "Duel" wasn't an epic. But it was full of fundamentals and very well done. And was key in him making his mark as a good film maker.

[@paulpierantozzi]

@@gregorylagrange Who would need that advice? I have never heard of a person who has thought they could make Lawrence of Arabia with $5, but I have heard of someone who tried to make something that looked like a million bucks with nothing.

[@ZarconVideo]

Why student films fail? your best friend jim can't act.

[@HillaryMarek]

Damnit Jim.

[@DoctorCyan]

We still love him, though. Jim rules.

[@vlcthefish]

This is why you need a best friend named Bruce.

[@JimTheCurator]

​@@DoctorCyanthanks man

[@snowset675]

This is so true! I love my friends, and I don’t wanna be hard on them, but like, the acting doesn’t match the tone I’m going for. I’ve decided though, that my solution to this is to make the movie less serious, cos at the end of the day, it’s supposed to be fun. Otherwise it’s just work.

[@altonkatz2041]

I think the greatest issue I see in most student scripts Is you can clearly tell that they wanted to make a movie and story came second to that.

[@bighands69]

Not everybody is cut out to be a movie maker. It is just the fact of life. Not everybody can be a basketball star or an opera singer. I was a high end ameuter boxer but I was never going to be a top professional as I lacked one thing and that was raw punching power that the top fighters have. I could easily go three rounds with the top fighters in an ameuter bout but was still not cut out for it.

[@MightyEFX]

​@@bighands69maybe cause you didnt understand that the power comes from the torso, and for writers of movies its important to write characters and a situation, and see how the characters handle it, instead of writing excuses for scenes

[@KennethLyVideography]

My filmmaking journey was to realise I'm not a director and storyteller. I found my home as cinematographer, editor and colorist. I was far better at helping directors execute their stories. Focusing on those skillset has also allowed me to work as videographer and has helped sustain me inbetween shortfilm projects.

[@murk4552]

​@garowice I want to get my 1 of my Masters degrees in Film Scoring/Composition and the other involving Sound Design, or Audio Production.

[@murk4552]

​@@KennethLyVideographyBut to add, I am also interested in scriptwriting as songwriting and scriptwriting share a lot in common when it comes to the mediums of song and film.

[@connornyhan]

You’re probably right. But that isn’t going to stop me from making my 20 minute monster movie. Odds are procrastination will stop it first.

[@thomasarnt2933]

do it

[@connornyhan]

Thomas Arnt I’m trying

[@HeyYou992]

@@connornyhan Reply here when it's finished. Then it will be my turn to procrastinate about watching it.

[@connornyhan]

@@HeyYou992 Deal

[@lonewalkerproductions]

Lol go for it!

[@orangeechofilms]

I remember the biggest issue in film school with students writing shorts was that often they tried to write essentially a condensed feature. The professors would often say to pick a scene or a moment of that story and focus on that for a short.

[@houdinididiit]

I’m a musician with a hobby of providing free soundtracks for student films. I have seen many of them. My advice: do not end your film with somebody waking up from a crazy dream. I’ve seen it more than anything else. Suddenly, the story takes an unusual turn. Bizarre activities begin to take over the screen. And then… yawn... You know this is going to go nowhere. Except someone waking up in a grand... GASP... their face staring straight into the camera. Try something else.

[@enveritas4948]

Having seen (and made) a lot of low budget films I can agree with this. Most would easily have been made 100% better by cutting the "She wakes up" bit and letting all the surreal mad stuff ride out. leave the audience guessing if it's a dream, don't spoon feed them it.

[@zebjwest6709]

people actually do the "it was all a dream" thing ?!

[@Alexhf]

how can i contact you for a soundtrack?

[@tinysalad]

I feel personally attacked.

[@yael4627]

How bout somebody waking up from a crazy dream...at the beginning of the film? A vision of sorts?

[@Trakinasnove]

It's funny that it takes so long to become a master. Both Kurosawa and Hokusai only thought of themselves as good artists when they got to 80 years old. And even then they still wanted to improve.

[@RoGersVision]

Video uploaded 8 minutes ago...and this comment here was put 5 days ago 😂

[@gateCodeKC]

@@RoGersVision ahahahaha interstellar!

[@jonstnr]

@@RoGersVision Paying subscribers get early access to uploads...

[@saturatedcranium]

holy shit I'm confused... how is this comment older than the video?

[@vlasser]

Yet, Kurosawa made in his best films in his 40-s

[@janscott602]

I’ve suffered through student film screenings and the problem is the filmmakers are overly pleased with themselves. For example, they have a drone shot of a car. They love it so much they force you to watch it for 20 seconds to a minute. The other big problem is bad audio.

[@red-oy3mu]

Literally me yesterday. First film flopped, hard. Mostly because it was a fest and I couldn't film many scenes, this lacked context to many scenes. The audience bored out and didn't like it. It was my first student film, it genuinely hurts. But I just need to progress more, and I'll already overcome this failure.

[@jamieoxenham1656]

​@@red-oy3mu dude,, that is possibly the most important thing that could have ever happened to you! You learned more with all that, you can ONLY get better. I bet the next thing you do will be really good, because you know what needs the proper attention! I wish you all the luck in the world, but you wont need it :)

[@MrBuc128]

To me the one thing that stands out in a negative way in student films is the cinematography. It seems to me that often times framing a shot is something people take for granted. It’s not as easy as many people think . It tends to be the first thing I notice particularly if done badly.

[@cleaverspoonage]

For those that haven't seen "Thunder Road" (the cop at the funeral dancing) it's an amazing film and you should give it a try

[@breakerzee2874]

Agreed

[@BoyBlessing]

Not that good of a film

[@shravansinghrathod4046]

Thanks for sharing it💟

[@TxxT33]

I remember when the director did an AMA on Reddit, if I'm not mistaken he also acted in it.

[@rightbehind]

Jim Cummings is a legend

[@bandgeekproductions9239]

A common question that people ask me is "How can you call yourself a filmmaker if you haven't seen this movie?" The answer is simple: I like to make movies and I haven't seen that movie. I don't need to see that movie to make a movie. Instead, like this video states, I need to learn the fundamentals to make a movie

[@huntskopf123]

I can relate to this so much: My first film became a huge production during pre prep. We became more and more people because of practical effects (blood squibs and wounds), a huge cast (whole classroom plus teacher) and even a B Camera. Don't get me wrong I was thrilled because it all looked like a professional movie set, we were about thirty people on Set and I had an assistant director and production manager. I was pumped up by the idea of telling a story about a mass shooting in a classroom and the Style of Tarantino. For my first film it did fine and due to its overkill style it even got selected for some festivals but before finishing the film in post I already knew I could do waaayyy better. We got so much to think about during shooting that the sound and lighting were horrible. The acting could have been improved by my directions but I had to have so much in mind all the time. A couple projects (and a whole year) later I shot my application film for film school: - The story was inspired by an event that happened in my family - I had one AD, one DoP, one AC and one Sound Master as a crew - Three actors for the whole short film - 90 percent natural lighting That project was really well received by the audiences and got many of them very emotional. It was personal, looked good with beautiful shots, was way more focused on detail and the core of the story. And I still like to watch it, even after working on it for a long time. So as a conclusion you could say: It is not "wrong" to try your best in recreating your idols style or make something laborious (it was really great fun to shoot the first one) BUT in the beginning of your career it is always good to really focus on your personal experiences in life and give them a chance to be told on screen. It will get cinematic without you even trying as long as its an honest project, believe me. Cheers.

[@IgnacioArmstrong]

Thanks for this comment, Don Falcone.

[@afterfall8133]

Bruh both of your movie in my agenda is a big production movie , my first movie to my fifth movie i only do it myself.

[@bjarkisteinnpetursson9736]

My goal right now in film school is to think: What is the most we can do with what we have? And then do a little bit more. What’s the point of making something you know you can do?

[@officialmarlowjamesfilmcen2879]

"if you love filmmaking enough, you cant help but make a good movie" -Tarantino

[@christianschonberger9695]

Hmmm, if you really love the movies, you know exactly the results you want, but not how it's done.

[@shadi5885]

@@christianschonberger9695 loving the movies and loving filmmaking are different :) It’s like loving photos but not being a photographer

[@christianschonberger9695]

@@shadi5885 yes I know. And you know what I was trying to say. :)

[@smartstuf1026]

yeah both of you guys are right. Tarantino loved the inner workings of film and has learned from that.

[@robrobusa]

Ah, yes the good ol' survivors bias.

[@vlogbrothers]

This is all amazing advice for authors as well.

[@MediaBuster]

No, it's not. Authors can write about anything.

[@smeech5177]

@@MediaBuster yeaaahhhh. I’m confused by his comment lol

[@MediaBuster]

@@smeech5177 Yeah he makes no sense. There are no limits to what you can write. Producing a film from it is a different story.

[@BThings]

@@MediaBuster I don't think the point of the video (or this original comment) is just about having physical resources at your disposal. It's about having the skills needed to do something well. While it is true that writing has no budgetary limitations, it is still a skill that must be honed over time. That's why people tend to write short stories and things before embarking on 2,000-page epic novels. It's also why someone doesn't start playing the piano by performing Rachmaninoff at Carnegie Hall. Really, this whole thing is about the importance of practice and building your skills in manageable stages, rather than trying something so outside your current ability that your talent is overshadowed by your ineptitude.

[@sighduck13]

@@MediaBuster I mean, they've published over 8 books combined, so...

[@bedelian]

I always compare making your first film to getting into a fight for the first time. Most people think they have a great idea for a film that would blow people's minds, and a lot of men walk around thinking they can secretly beat everyone up. Then when you try it for the first time, you realize "holy shit, I am not as good at this as I thought I'd be. This is actually really hard."

[@Ssalamanderr]

Nice video! I saw this first hand in a filmmaking workshop. At the end we had about a day to shoot a short, using professional actors and our fellow classmates as crew. Several groups planned ambitious films with multiple locations, and weren't able to complete their project at all. With so little time to shoot they had no chance. The projects that did small, contained stories were able to be completed. A friend of mine is a filmmaker and took this approach as well. He started with very simple shorts, then in each subsequent project tried pushing his limits a little. One project would have a big "1er" long take shot. The next would add digital effects. Stuff like that. It worked and he recently shot his first feature film, building on all his previous knowledge.

[@bighands69]

Stanley Kubrick was famous for having scenes that had a film to screen time ratio in the thousands. That mean for 1 minute of footage there could be several thousand minutes of filming. That could be 16 hours to 1 minute of footage. And yet we have a generation that thinks they can just point a camera once and film a movie. Or they will have a great idea about what sort of movie they would like and that then means they can make a good movie. I would suggest to any budding movie maker that they film hundreds of short movies from 30 seconds to 5 minutes before they move onto the next stage. The true greats of movie making were multi talented. Spielberg was a great editor, Tarantino was a great writer, Kubrick was a great photographer and Hitchcock was a great technician.

[@13TeK11]

The true master is the eternal student

[@ChanMorgan]

Part of the beauty in student films is learning from failure. Experiencing that feeling, especially when you're in film school, is a luxury. We're allowed to fail because it's not the real world yet. It's a safe place to do so. There's so much knowledge you can potentially gain from failure that cannot come from textbooks or anecdotes from fellow peers. Everybody falls at some point, but we can also learn to get back up.

[@jonathanfurtado6880]

As an instructor I agree with this. I always hate giving grades. For those who are dedicated learning from their failures is more valuable.

[@beretaniastreet6384]

Film school is a waste of money - it was an important stepping stone when gear was expensive and there was no other real way to learn the craft. Now, itʻs a waste of time. The fact that one is afraid to fail "in the real world" is just mindbogglingly confusing.

[@canererbay8842]

@@beretaniastreet6384 you must be very smart and talented.

[@beretaniastreet6384]

@Caner ERBAY Yes. Thank you for noticing 👍🏽

[@canererbay8842]

@@beretaniastreet6384 no worries but you can't really signal it to so many people like this. You should maybe rent a billboard or something.

[@jean_mollycutpurse_winchester]

So true for any artist. I've recently finished my 74th novel and I'm just getting the hang of it.

[@Ram0nAlan]

I don't even have a short story that I am proud of, a lot of work ahead. It's' easy to get anxious about it.

[@georgeofhamilton]

How many do you write per year?

[@hekikoka5792]

@@georgeofhamilton 😂😂😂

[@DavidLeidy]

“You have to be a fool, in order to become a master.” Your video exemplifies how our society blinds itself from this age old adage. Try to be the master and play it safe all the time and only make what’s technically and conventionally considered perfect and you’ll end up becoming the fool you were avoiding to be all along. Allow yourself to embrace being the fool in the beginning by acknowledging your ignorance and limitations in a field but still embarking on the journey knowing that there will be points where you will fail and face obstacles and you will eventually become the master from what you discover along your explorations

[@cupajoe99]

Wish I could like this comment multiple times.

[@kta0702]

I love this

[@jas_bataille]

If only filmmaking school was embracing this philosophy, it would be great. I remember when I made my first short : the whole class was in total awe. Not because it was perfect, no; but because we busted our asses of to no end for it. I did a cameo disguised as a woman, with two twins who were our friends, who played and also did my make-up. The scene didn't required any of this, we just did for fun. Crazy shit. Filming a character looking in the mirror and opening a light at the same time... a night scene in day time... etc At the end everyone loved our short in the room. You could feel it worked. It was full of errors, some on "purpose", some not. It was far from perfect. But it was a good short. Low and behold, the teacher shamed it so intensely that I ended up deleting most of the dailies instead of fixing the only thing that was off, which was the editing. I couldn't believed it : he spent the whole semester talking about Bresson and Godard and his non-linear editing, which I tried to replicate, and he wouldn't even acknowledged that this is what I was trying to do! I mean at least acknowledge I failed at something I tried to do when I say so. The same teacher told me that he "really hated" the film that I picked up for analysis that same semester (said film was on HIS own list). Granted, despite working my ass off on that analysis, I never presented it. Thank God the other cinema teacher is actually amazing and has my back.

[@SvenRonPooc11]

i dunno...i think you miss the point a bit. no point getting lost in taking on something you can't manage...becuase there's no growth there...only frustration and burnout. better to work within constraints and to focus on good ideas..

[@herrar6595]

Imagine trying to make a film, never having opened an editing programm... it´s impossible and really discouraging to try. Same thing aplies throughout all of the learning process

[@jamosreece1693]

love how the main point boils down to "get gud"

[@fleeplayTV]

"...at the fundamentals"

[@tonywords6713]

I like what Tarkovsky said where if he sees something in a scene that resembles what another filmmaker has done he goes out of his way to change it up.

[@themoreyouknowfools4974]

Sadly that didn't always work out. There was a scene in mirror that looked like it was taken from Bergman. Also the cover from Mirror looks a lot like the art museum shot in vertigo. I'm sure he didn't realize this though. It's just that most ideas aren't original.

[@lisasimmons1832]

Well said. Building a foundation is so important. And he’s definitely not saying don’t try or don’t not be creative--just to build a good foundation, and that often comes from repetition of the simpler stuff.

[@LetsCrashThisParade]

This is a great video but the idea of being like "ok Ive worked here for a decade now... Can I cook the EGGS?" Is so funny to me

[@canererbay8842]

Yeah, it's outdated romantic bullshit.

[@sydneycastellano]

Write what you can budget. Budget what you can shoot. Shoot what you can edit. If you overestimate your own skill set or the skills of those on your production (or how far $100 can go, or how long 10 shots will take, etc)-- that is where you'll fail.

[@SpaceMonke99]

This applies very well to almost every craft. Here in the West we've been raised in a culture of instant gratification, giving up before we've really taken a proper a swing at something because we're pissed off that our sushi is crap. We need to stop lambasting ourselves for taking things too slowly because we're 'wasting time'. You're sure to fall if you try to run before you've learned to walk. I actually think when students try to mimic big blockbusters, it represents a failure of imagination as opposed to one that lacks the tools it needs. Films at the end of the day are always a human story (and genre as you pointed out is good for covering shortfalls in those), so if you really care about your art, you'll find a way to tell one of those stories regardless of the fact that all you have is an iPhone and your mates Bob and Jim for actors.

[@flyit9496]

This might be the most underrated channel for filmmaking on youtube. I am SO GLAD I found your channel dude. Keep it up and never stop producing this amazing content for us

[@LukaSzent]

I loved this analogy, wrote my screenplay with this advice in mind and will hopefully have it shot and edited by this summer! Amazing channel.

[@bighands69]

Write hundreds of screen plays. Master it. No body every has to see them only you.

[@fanusbogey]

I'm so deep in the fish that I can't reach my rice cooker

[@Sticks]

Great perspective & analogy! Enjoy the process of nailing each skill and tell contained stories that mean something to you. You don’t want the centre stage until you’re ready anyway 🙏🏼

[@EpicLightMedia]

Amazing!!! You put into words what I’ve been thinking for years! You’re right that most short films are destined to fail from the beginning because of over-ambition.

[@rafaelj8808]

The Evil Dead: *am i a joke to you?*

[@sumboi2321]

The evil dead still had several limitations though. Limited casting, budget and locations. It even got to a point where Sam Raimi got his family members to work as body doubles for some of the shots where the characters aren’t facing the screen. Also worth mentioning that Raimi had a clear vision on how the film should play out, and focused on the execution of the production.

[@rafaelj8808]

@@sumboi2321 offcourse the Evil dead had alot of issue's. The characters were cheesy and, as you mentioned, the budget was very low. But it is still impressing that a movie with such a low budget could look very realistic and is still good.

[@sanitorz232]

Early Peter Jackson and Roger Corman’s entire career are also great examples of why going to exploitation is not a bad idea.

[@Incredible_Mister_J]

Even the master had to learn the basics. Also this advice goes beyond filmmaking. Thanks a lot!

[@teacupofwonder]

This video makes me feel so much better for sticking to small scale stories in my own short films that I will make. I was afraid that it might seem like I was taking shortcuts, but since I don't have the resources, I am trying to work my stories around my technical limitations. Thank you so much for this video. It is a good reminder to push yourself, but also be wary of to what extent you push yourself as there are always other constraints and circumstances.

[@JakubChlouba]

I discovered this channel about 2 weeks ago, and I can honestly say that it is one of the best channels on cinematography and the way you present everything is very understandable and entertaining! Keep the good work Gray!

[@jas_bataille]

I think the important point here is, you don't have to make complex in order to make it interesting to work on. You can be very ambitious yet make something that's very simple. It's a good thing to know your limitations and use them creatively. For instance, right now I'm trying to shoot a short, me and 3 other students. We can't shoot inside anyone's house or apartment; we can't cast people who aren't true relatives if we want them to stand closer than 2 meters away from each other; we had to abandon a character which was a 10 years old kid; and we only have access to school for interior locations. That's already a LOT of restrictions, and I can't imagine when you're quarantined! Now is the time to simplify your stories. Simplification is great. I get the "try and fail" sentiment - I did, and we all go through this. Your short isn't gonna be a masterpiece just because you simplified it either... But if you are to look at the debut shorts from master directors, there are almost always *dead simple*. You can create so much magic with *simple* tricks. A little splash of color here, a little flare there. A nice line of dialogue. A nice tempo in the editing. The thing is, a lot of students are trying to be the virtuoso with their films. The same was true when I was in music school. The results were often boring and uninteresting to listen to, contrary to what people believe. The audience don't know how hard it was to create your film, and most importantly, they don't give a damn. They want emotions. There are a lot of clever, simple shorts that works superbly well, but we don't listen to those, we listen only to blockbuster movies. We need to start by watching actual shorts in order to realize why most student shorts fail, and it's basically because it wants to bend a feature-film structure into a short film and it doesn't work.

[@CaseyWilsonDP]

A lot of the criticism I would be willing to venture is from people who have yet to make their first 'large' student or independent film. This is great advice. Making any film, short or not, is an immense undertaking... so why not focus on making a contained *good* movie, instead of a mediocre genre piece. Look, any experience is going to help you, and you're going to make mistakes regardless, but you are investing both your time (it's limited, believe it or not) and money so why not invest in something that will make the most of those resources? Most of those who disagree will either never make their too-ambitious of a movie, or will realize afterwards the wisdom that was spoken here.

[@TChristopher]

I'm freaking excited that this channel is blowing up! A brilliant analysis as always!

[@HoldenHardman]

Great video! It's cool to see common themes among low budget, independent filmmakers that I relate so strongly to. What a great lesson.

[@elijoby]

I was taught a solid technique for cooking rice but found it didn’t really improve my experience eating it. Now I cook rice the same lazy way I did before.

[@winonacrvz]

I don’t think he was trying to tell us to not be creative and to limit ourselves or to avoid mistakes entirely. Making mistakes is inevitable anyway but we don’t have to intentionally aim for failure. He’s highlighting how important it is to learn the fundamentals of creating an impactful story, which is the core of a great film. It’s important to learn the basics and then go on from there. If you have this big idea, keep it and if you’re fortunate to have some budget and more skills then make that film! However, for the meantime, be resourceful!

[@jonathanfurtado6880]

Thank you, thank you, thank you for making this! I will show this to ALL of my students. You've summed up things in a dozen of my lectures into 8:38 of pure gold!

[@kaliquinio2034]

As a young starting film maker this video is really comforting in a way, there are so much standards, ideas, that professional film makers show. Its quite stressful, and sometimes we think we want to learn it all instantly, and get upset when it doesn't look the way we want to.

[@caferastas8591]

I think also a good example of this is the movie “Primer” made by 5 guys using easy location lile their house or garage and using even friends and family as a actors. By the way i appreciate your videos.

[@CharlieKnottFilms]

I wish I had seen this video essay when embarking on my four year MICA Film and Video thesis project titled Boathouse. Specifically, I would’ve taken note of story over visuals. I ended up taking a year handcrafting a 1/24 inch scale miniature model of my home which I floated on the ocean to achieve a practical effects shot, but truly the most influential moment of my filmmaking education was in something my thesis professor asked of me during the writing process. She said she wanted me to rewrite the full script from scratch, after having worked on it for four years. To me, there has never been a moment in my process as an artist that’s shaken me more, and I was better for accepting it and implementing that mindset. Hopefully someone will read this and make constructive changes to their film thesis based on a trusted teacher or friend.

[@windowdresser1643]

I wonder what your advice is for those people who are more interested in art-house, non linear, visual cinema. I'm someone who is more into criterion / MUBI type of films and I notice they tend to work differently, in many ways, from most commercial cinema. Currently, my process is on watching some of my favorites and taking notes while watching them. I also make a lot of shorts by myself which I share to friends. Another thing, it's more of a personal thing more than anything, but I try to listen to people, and have conversations with strangers on the street, I also do a lot of journaling as a way of reflection. I wanna hear your thoughts on this!

[@CharlieKnottFilms]

@@windowdresser1643 your observations and thinking is where it needs to be. Making the work consistently and for the process is something everyone should strive for. In terms of making experimental or cinema that is non-commercial, I tend to lean towards that as well for my personal work. The ideas that come for those pieces are derived from observations I have when my memory connects with something that catches my eye or surprises me. However, ideas are simply ideas and if you’re interested in writing a story surrounding them, a dedicated effort should be made to identify the structure and process that works for you to tell what you find authentic and fresh. The advice of writing what you know is a jumping off point for some great stories, of which could even be inspired by all of the people you meet. Best of luck with your work.

[@aatmansharma9036]

Absolutely Brilliant with the theories & Narration... Well Done!

[@TolulopeOlamideAjayi]

So much learning and truth in one video. this deserves so much! Thank you!

[@Paarths]

Tarantino once said you're a big fish in a puddle so what. Get out of the loservillie and compete with giants so that you improve the next time

[@bighands69]

Tarantino got his break because he was a fantastic writer.

[@RedFlowas]

@@bighands69 he got big because he did some weird "Hollywood" shit. Not to diss his writing, it's pretty good.

[@bighands69]

@@RedFlowas He was selling scripts before he became a director. His scripts were so good that he was given a directors opportunity because of it. Tarantino could live on being a scriptwriter alone. He was still working in jobs when the sold the script for True Romance. He is only director today of merit that actually writes his own scripts for his movies.

[@Rockyroadpool]

Eyy I knew you were South African! The voice gave it away. Love the content man! Really helpful

[@nowkirkwon]

I love this more realistic approach you gave us. Keep grinding, you are talented!

[@alexanderhawdon5526]

Thank you so much for this. I'm going to be writing and creating a short film later this year/early next year. I know I have very high ambitions with complex stories, such as you mentioned in this video. Yes I certainly agree that it is imperative to master the fundamentals as well as to have a strong story. The way I see it is the story is the backbone of the entire film and everything else; lighting, shots, art direction, dialogue and more are just ornaments that add to it, but on their own, fall to pieces. My aiming too high and high too early and my perfectionism has caused me to procrastinate and create little for too long. I really needed this video. So again thank you so so much!

[@andylausupremacy6478]

Damn! You caught me there. I tried to make my first ever short film in high school similar to Scorsese's "The Departed" and "The Double" with Jesse Eisenberg, lol! Upon finishing that film, I realised that I was a bit too ambitious the first time and learnt so many mistakes on the way. Your vid just helped me realise that I should look out for my own limitations if I want to pursue a career in filmmaking. Thank you sir! P.S. Will you reveal your face in future vids?

[@ComingSoonOnVHS]

But you learned a lot from your experience like you said, and it may have been too ambitious, but did you you enjoy it? That's how you learn, & if you only do basic boring projects, that's all you'll learn how to do. Make as many Scorsese films as you can, and eventually, you'll make a damn good one. All that matters is if you & the people you worked with had a good time. Make another one! Just keep learning & you'll get better!

[@andylausupremacy6478]

ComingSoonOn VHS Oh it was a lotta fun definitely! The only thing I cared about at school tbh 😂

[@akshaybhatia8971]

While I understand that this is just another path towards learning, I don’t inherently agree with the message. My first short film, which did fail and was overly ambitious, taught me an enormous amount about filmmaking through the process of failing. If you don’t allow yourself the room to fail, and you stifle and pare down your ambition, you’ll never explore in the areas that you want to create within and thus never learn how to reach the heights you will eventually want to. Ultimately I learned countless lessons by making a noir short film that wanted to be The Third Man, rather than trying to be Following. Neither were conceivably in my reach at the start, but The Third Man was far further from where I was, and so the failure was greater. And ultimately, you followed your rules when you made your own short film, and just like me, you cringe at the end result. So if the end result is the same, I’d rather not trade out the lessons I learned from going big and failing dramatically, just for a shot at making a first short film that was slightly better

From what you're saying the lesson you learned was that the idea was indeed to big and you should have aimed to a smaller scale... which is the point of this video...

[@PandyBong]

@ Not necessarily. Or, only academically, at the very least. It’s only by failing that we learn and film school should be a lot about failing and seeing the faults at your own hands.

[@saiashwin26]

@ There is no guarantee that if he had made a smaller scale project, it would have been any better.

@@saiashwin26 The point isn't to be better, is to learn.

[@SwegDawgs]

@ and you learn by going big

[@maxshiz1735]

Keep it up man! This helps a lot

[@crazyleg2006]

Really good video. Thanks for taking the time to put it up for me and everyone else. It's always nice to find videos and information.

[@byronbunning7877]

Hey, just wondering what camera was used to make this short film and why it was shot in interlaced? Assuming it was because the camera wasn't capable of progressive but in the video it looked like you were holding a canon c100 which is capable of 1080 progressive. Cheers

[@simusvisuals]

"Don't try to recreate the cinematography of Interstellar in a student film" Oops. That's just what I did with my first student film TALOS (you'll find it on KZbin if you're brave enough). But it's kind of a part of the learning process, right? Realising that some projects are simply too ambitious.

[@nikolatesla9384]

Went there and watched it and all i can say is "dont touch the fish, focus on the rice"

[@markwalk5637]

can you put a link here? I could not find it... thx

[@simusvisuals]

@@markwalk5637 kzbin.info/www/bejne/enWXd3p3jLyHbtk there you go :)

[@markwalk5637]

@@simusvisuals thank you ;)

[@ComingSoonOnVHS]

I just watched it, and I disagree with Tesla, it seems like you're doing it for fun and passion, if that's the case, then go for the fish! Do the project that YOU want to see and do, at the end of the day it matters the most to you, so make sure you're happy with it above all else

[@zzz8630]

I just wanted to say you’re extremely underrated. You get straight into the point, your visuals are pleasing and appealing to the eye, and overall the content you upload looks extremely professional. Whether you edit/make these videos on your own, or if you have a team, I just wanted to say that you/you guys definitely deserve more recognition and support and im still not sure how this channel doesnt have millions of subs and views. Keep doing what you do 👍

[@jankmedia1985]

Fantastic advice. I keep looking up advice videos for short film and it's incredibly reassuring with what my goal is, I feel like my head is in the right place. We'll see how I feel once I actually get to filming it though, lol. Practice, practice, practice.

[@gregsomlai297]

When learning to make sushi takes longer than mastering nuclear physics, and building a space shuttle by hand, I'd say you're not cut out to make sushi!

[@eastlakefilms9407]

👍

[@RedFlowas]

Being black, im sure it's difficult to be patient and wait and practice an art meticulously.

[@InDepthCine]

What are some of the biggest lessons that you learnt from making your early short films?

[@aa_gg]

Just check that audio is recording correctly and and insert audio or any cables tightly and perfectly......

[@galstafferoc]

Get more footage than you think you need. At least until you start to understand what you actually need.

[@LeonardoKlotz]

I am an aspiring filmmaker myself Right now, I am an amateur. I've done some experimental shorts just to acquire knowledge and experience on the way So far I've done 2, and I'm about to finish my third short. They are on my channel if you wanna check out.

[@TChristopher]

Balance. Just because it sounds or looks good on page, doesn't mean it will be so on screen. So plan thoroughly to make sure your vision is well crafted before you get to set and spend time and money figuring it out.

[@matthiaspoeltinger]

Working together as a crew, working around the actors as a Cinematographer, location scouting + tech recce, Your Essay may be the best video on that topic. I see alot of mistakes that I did on my student films. But learning from them is the main outcome of student films I think.

[@hrhYT]

My attention span and learning generation doesn't do much for college or even throughout my grade school years, so thank you for being a teacher of mine. I study through KZbin channels like yours, and online courses like Masterclass/more independent versions of the new medium. You are a very clear and articulate instructor. You organize your video structure in a very efficient and well thought out way. Thank you, have a good week, and I am excited for further viewing :))

[@aureliae.8703]

This is exactly the video I needed. Thank you.

[@zallesproductions]

Don't limit your creativity! Create what you want to see, regardless of the risk of "failure".

[@super8studios208]

Joshua Gonzales exactly

[@DavidLeidy]

Joshua Gonzales spot on

[@akeemhimself3742]

All he said was learn the basics first

[@vikassm]

Yup.

[@pipopipo6477]

I like this video but I don't agree completely. Your advice is probably true for most film students but not everyone. "Many roads lead to Rome". I think you could start with a genre film. But If you do so you should make a 1 or 3 minute movie first instead of failling with 30 minutes. David Sandberg is a good example. He made a bunch of 3 minute horror shorts in his apartment with his GF and ended up directing Hollywood movies...

[@CinemaSteve]

The point of this video is to ring true to most film students or short film directors. It isn’t to be 100% correct. It’s to point out or lead these novice directors in the right direction by telling them things they’ve probably not even realized they’re doing wrong.

[@dalano_films]

My take from the genre advice is don't just rely purely on the genre - use it to aid your story rather than be your story.

[@pipopipo6477]

@@CinemaSteve I understand that. I just perceived that it wasn't true for me and I wanted to give my 2 cents to the discussion. I did a fantasy short with two actors in a full CGI world as my graduation film (Animation film school) and it was a success. I won best swiss short at NIFFF and it was shown at countless A-festivals all over the world… Since then I made two drama shorts with no VFX and they was widely rejected from most festivals…. My next movie will be a heavy VFX project again;-)

[@cupajoe99]

@@pipopipo6477 Thanks for commenting - I respect a lot of stuff in this video, but I do agree with you. I think the video's advice is good for people who've never really directed before - when I first started doing my own films in high school, one of the things that actually allowed me to finish my first project was realizing that I couldn't always dream big - I had to work with what I have. Since then, some of that sentiment has carried over into how I edit scripts - balancing trying to write well with scenes that I know are filmable. But it's so important to push boundaries as you grow, I think. Go ahead and touch the fish. And if you need more time to practice, now you know. But sometimes you surprise yourself with what you can do when you try something outside of your comfort zone.

[@SwegDawgs]

@@pipopipo6477 Where can we see your fantasy short?

[@ionut-razvanbarbu9502]

Amazing content! Really useful and well put together. Thanks for sharing your experience

[@saga755]

Very nicely said! Thank you for this, I am glad I discovered your channel.

[@paulpierantozzi]

I have found the complete opposite of this sentiment to be true. A common theme I witnessed in film school was an adversity to risk taking. What you end up with are a whole bunch of films that the filmmakers put a lot of effort and money into making which are boring to watch because nothing happens in them. I think trying something ambitious can only be beneficial, even if you fail in the end. At least you tried to make what you wanted to make. Filmmaking is not like making sushi. In sushi making or any other fine craft there is a method to accomplishing it that has been passed down that you must train to perfect. There is no "perfect" way of making a film. If you spend your life trying to emulate Stanley Kubrick or David Lynch or any other "master" of the craft you will end up without a unique voice and ultimately make bland art. If there is one thing I have learned when at film school it was that the only interesting films were the ones that took big risks.

[@DavidLeidy]

Paul Pierantozzi Yes exactly, glad I’m not alone in this sentiment

[@siddharthkhattar1297]

I agree with your sentiment!

[@chimpauto8217]

Thank you for this. After seeing this video I think I am in over my head drastically because i am almost done with my first feature film that is a comedy/crime film with tons of action scenes and extras and stuff, I am the first one in my school film program to ever even attempt a feature film, and I start to think to myself "maybe theres a reason no one has tried to do this before, maybe I should have just stuck to short films and gone the easy route. But your comment here helped me to realize that even if my movie doesnt turn out how i wanted it to be, it will stilll be the one film that did something different, was unique, took risks, and who knows maybe it will turn out good. You might not even see this, but sincerely, thank you.

[@CraigBickerstaff]

I don't agree with the sentiment, it sees failure as a negative that you should avoid at all costs. The start of your career as a student is the perfect time to fall flat on your face so if you can do it early you should do it early and have fun doing it.

[@cupajoe99]

Exactly. This video assumes that the goal is to maximize artistic and critical potential. But there's other goals to have - there's other things to strive for when growing as a filmmaker. I agree with the sentiment that you'll get better results by working with what you have, of course - but young people need to reach for the moon, I think - so they can figure out what works and what doesn't. Experimenting even when you know you're not "there" or whatever, that's how you figure out what you're capable of.

[@CraigBickerstaff]

@@cupajoe99 I also think it teaches you how to deal with criticism. I don't know what the reception was to David lean when he was starting out but the criticism towards Ryan's Daughter hit him so hard he didn't make another film for 15 years.

@@CraigBickerstaff That's not the point of the video tho. The point here is that you need to learn to work with what you have, rather than with what you wish you had. If you have and idea, or a dream movie, don't rush it and don't be impuslive because the only thing you're going to learn from those things is that you shouldn't have rushed it nor been impulsive.

@@cupajoe99 I'm sorry, but that sounds like a terrible advice. Why young people should make the same mistake that the previous generation did when we can teach and learn from others experiences? The point here is exactly that: If you try to reach for the moon without even knowing how to build a rocket, the only thing you're going to learn is that you should have learn how to make a rocket first...

[@saiashwin26]

@ Filmmaking is like learning to walk the first time as a baby, you can watch hundreds of tutorials but if you cannot actually go ahead and do it and fall flat on your face (which you will eventually) then there is no point and you will never learn.

[@bfree1148]

Beautiful message. Thank you.

[@johnpooky84]

I'm really liking this channel! It's helping me with my short "films" (meaning my Elite Dangerous expedition videos).

[@mentalretard2359]

The most important part is: Making a good movie is the realm of a minuscule minority of people. In the age of KZbin and mushrooming social media and film schools people have started believing that virtually anyone can make a movie. Secondly, what is a good movie is highly subjective itself.

[@bighands69]

There is nothing subjective about a good movie. Postmodernism which is the imagination of of the unimaginative believe everything is subjective. Every man knows what a beautiful women looks like or what a pretty flower in the garden looks like. Even children can recognise beauty and quality in something.

[@leninmckay3144]

“Just make your godamn movie!” -me three seconds ago

[@NUCLEARDASH]

I often get back here when im lost. Thank you so much, greetings from Brazil.

[@ThomasSmartt]

Honestly I feel like I'm at a loss for words. I wasn't expecting a video about why film students fail to so dang inspirational! You made me feel like I really truly can achieve any goals that I might have with your concept of "not touching the fish." Near the end of the video with the music and your words filling my ears you made me feel grateful and happy with where I am in life and that it's okay if something takes time to accomplish. I only just recently found your channel but I am loving every thing about it so far. Thank you so much!

[@DavidLeidy]

I think you miss the point of making art. Inspiration that causes an exploration into the unknown which brings forth transformation from discovery. The way to get better is to allow yourself room to fail. No exploration, no revelation/discovery (the point of storytelling and art in general). Dont make something because you know it’s going to be perfect. Make something because you’re driven to tell that story but have no idea as to why. Uncover the real reason why while making it and you’ll bring forth revelation

[@ryanchadeayne4070]

Exactly. I think the best way to grow as a filmmaker, is to just do it. Make movies. Sure not all of them may be good, but you’ll be learning and growing. I don’t think anyone expects student films to be masterpieces.

[@DamisBran]

For sure you have to fail in order to suceed. He is not saying that you must not fail but he is telling that you do not have to make something big and "awesome" from the beginning. All he says from my perspective is: Make films with what you have and dont try to make something vast from the start". Definitely its art so there are not any rules so maybe all we say is pointless haha but sometimes a bit usefull. Good night !

[@oikeasti_anton]

@@DamisBran I feel that you should create what you feel. This video is meant for absolute first time beginners making their first film EVER and I think that in no case should anybody else than a first time beginner take this advice. I agree with @david leidy here.

[@Luca-bv5ic]

You have to be realistic though. Nolan had the idea for inception for ages and was probably itching to make the film. But he didn't try and make it on an indie budget because it would've come out half baked. Unless you only have one idea for a film you really want to realise, start off with some more low key stuff before moving onto the ambitious stuff.

[@emilormasenvallersnes4016]

I have learnt from my mistakes already, and the mistake was making my film too ambitous.

[@SamsTechTips]

I'm a second year film student. I have to say, I'm going to take this into consideration going forward with my assignments, luckily with the 2 short's myself and our little team have made haven't been too far out of our current skill or knowledge level. That being said, I think it would be very easy to start to get cocky over the praise we've gotten. I think I'll send this video to the other in the team and get their opinions on it.

[@J.ortegadesign]

Amazing content man. Keep up the amazing work!

[@filmbylim1907]

By you simplifying and embracing the growth process of young filmmakers, I gained some clarity on how to move forward. Thank you for this video!

[@overratedprogrammer]

This intro is "To be fair, you have to have a very IQ to understand filmmaking"

[@cashdavenport6822]

Gonna be honest, I don’t agree with this. I feel like following this would hold you back. I’m not saying that you shouldn’t try something simple, but if I have the option (between two short films) to watch a really well made small scale drama and an attempt at a large scale genre flick, I’m going to pick the latter, because it’s a lot more entertaining and it gives the filmmakers an opportunity to try and work around their limits. That’s my two cents.

As an audience member, sure, it can be far more enterteining to see an overly ambitious proyect rather than a small scale one, but as a filmmaker I think is you can learn far more things from doing the smaller one first.

[@cashdavenport6822]

@ having made a few few shortfilms myself, I feel like the more ambitious of a project, the more I have to try to work my way around and use my creativity to problem solve.

[@jas_bataille]

@@cashdavenport6822 Here's my take on it : working with what you have is a big challenge to problem-solve. For instance, right now my team can't cast a 10 years old kid because of COVID, so the scenario is re-written to change that character. We also can't shoot inside anyone's house or apartment, we only have access to school for any scenes inside, etc The only point where I disagree is "don't make a genre movie". You can make a very simple sci-fi short.

[@govnopochta69]

this vid is just what I needed. this comparison of filmmaking and sushi cooking was great btw

[@hirakjsarma]

I love all the essays you make. You are so good ❤️

[@abnt_official]

Touch the fish first so you understand exactly why you shouldn't. Never stop people from trying something above their head. There is no failure, only results.

[@lukaANDkrosty]

100% agree. Just got back into filmmaking a couple of weeks back after dropping out of film school and did a bigger short than usual because of that exact same reason. Making mistakes is the best teacher and I feel motivated to dial it back and make a better short next time :D

[@farisraza1902]

The Neighbors Window (Oscar winner from this year) was a great short film too.! 💝

[@AntonioHernandez-li7kv]

This video is is so motivating, thank you for this video; and keep moving foward ✌️

[@boldofyou1094]

Easily one of the best videos I have seen for young aspiring filmmakers. Brilliant work!

[@super8studios208]

You think Tarantino waited until he was 80 to make a good movie? What about George Lucas? It's stupid that you compare filmmaking to fish but according to you, by the time Tarantino is making Pulp Fiction he's just about allowed to touch the fish, except he made the sushi. That comparison is bad, this advice is bad. There are more examples, Jordan Peele didn't wait until he was 80 to make Get Out, but that was a great movie, the list will keep going on

[@InDepthCine]

By no means should you wait for years until you attempt to make your first film, the opposite in fact. My main point is that when you are in the initial stages of your filmmaking career it's better to focus on doing the basics correctly rather than overexerting your capabilities. Tarantino is a perfect example of this: Reservoir Dogs is a very contained film, which executes the fundamentals masterfully and is built around his access to budget and resources (and that wasn't even his first film).

[@super8studios208]

I suppose that does make sense, but that message didn't come across very well in the vid, also apologies I forgot about My Best Friend's Birthday

[@aliensoup2420]

When your ambitions far exceed your abilities it becomes too difficult to determine where your failures occur. Does a scene look bad because of bad lighting, set design, art direction, improper camera settings, or all of the above - but how do you separate and identify the mistakes?

[@TonOfHam]

May this spare me from yet another crappy rendition of an inspiring director's dream.

[@tymace9045]

Great video mate. As an aspiring DP I found this super helpful. I’m a relatively new subscriber, but I love all your content. Keep up the good work! 😊

[@Gh0st_702]

I absolutely loved this video and am a new subscriber! I'm very much looking forward to binging the rest of your videos

[@aa_gg]

*Following is a No-Budget Masterpiece, this movie is better than most of multi million dollar films....*

[@drake909]

And it's also better than most student films and one of the best amateur films. The problem with student films, just like he explained in the video, is that they try to do things they aren't even prepared to do. Nolan wrote 'Following' acknowledging his limitations. He did everything in his reach and didn't dare cross that line.

[@godfreyofbouillon5634]

Who Killed Captain Alex is far better than any other big or small budget film and it only had a budget of 85$ with a run time of 1h14m.

[@kielanellis117]

I understand the point you're aiming at, but I do disagree. I think that failing is something that should be encouraged, especially in young filmmakers. People in their late teens and early twenties aren't usually making rice, because they love sushi, and they want to see how their sushi is. If they don't make the awful shitty mistakes with the fish till they're in their 30's, even after they've mastered the rice, they'll still be making terrible terrible sushi. I think its better to make sushi, really bad sushi, and learn from your mistakes - figure out why the rice is bad, deconstruct what you've done. Filmmaking can't exist in individual vacuums, because it's more abstract than that, and there's more that comes with the pursuit of artistic honesty and expression than simply wanting to perfectly master a craft.

[@colinsoder]

But there are so many mistakes that can be made when making rice!!! You can burn it, it can come out dry, it can not be seasoned, it can not be done, it can be gluey....All mistakes to learn from. Same thing with film. There are so many mistakes to be made (and to learn from) in even the simplest scenes and short films...That is where you must start, otherwise you will be making so many mistakes you won't be able to isolate where they are, let alone how to fix them.

[@kielanellis117]

Colin Soder I agree - but then once you feel confident in the rice (which takes ages) you’ll have to go through the same years and years of insane work to master the fish! Much easier to learn them together and just be smart about the way you self-analyze! I appreciate the thoughtfulness in ur response tho - most ppl don’t wanna actually converse about an issue. I think we might have to agree to disagree on this one

[@blakestake]

except when you jump to making sushi right away, you’ll likely make a LOT of big mistakes all at once, and maybe not even recognize some of the mistakes you made enough to work on them. By starting with rice, as one of the replies above said, you’ll still likely make mistakes, but at a rate where you can take them on one by one and fully learn from them. Then when your rice is good enough, then you’ll move onto sushi, where you’ll likely still make lots and lots of mistakes! But by taking them one at a time, you’ll have more time to learn and grow. I don’t think this video was devaluing the good effect of mistakes, but rather trying to give filmmakers tools and room to take on each mistake and make use of them without being overwhelmed to the point of quitting, perhaps. :)

[@erikwerner8755]

Amazing video and analysis!

[@adiadagale123]

Keep it up man I love your videos they are very helpful

[@SwegDawgs]

If you just wanna make something fun for yourself, don't listen to this guy. Do what you want

[@LE672AJ]

No lie... I was eating rice as I started watching this 😆

[@JosephelLeon]

Thank you. Great video, vital message!

[@niamscookery3442]

I love the title of your video as much as it's content.