Douglas Murray explains the 'war on Western values' | Full interview

"The National Trust is run by ignoramuses."
Author Douglas Murray says the institution "knows nothing about our own history" and that the history of Britain cannot "only be seen through a lens of racism, oppression, slavery and colonialism."
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[@artemisjuno]

The huge problem we have is that most people do not read anything except cheap novels and the headlines in the tabloids. Everything is being reduced to misinformed soundbites for mass consumption or images on tiktok.

[@romainvicta3076]

Bingo - all ideas of enlightenment came from complex knowledge of concepts only fully grasped from reading books regularly

[@zapatavive1801]

he seems to conveniently think when an injustice exceeds a generation it should get a pass

[@user-qi4hu1cq5o]

Could not agree more!

[@mrlawilliamsukwarmachine4904]

Agreed. There’s a severe lacking with regard to interpretation of words, signs and symbols. It’s very easy to fool the masses by ‘implication’, or the ‘implied’ versus what was actually said or meant. An example....if I have a chainsaw accident and end up in A&E, they will ‘test’ me for the lurgy. Let’s say it reads positive... If the blood loss I have is severe, they’ll admit me to the ICU. Now they can say “an increase of c*v*d cases in the ICU”. People can’t pick that apart. People won’t ‘get’ this video. Our problem is that we may send them the link, but to understand or appreciate it, you need to send them a dozen audio books, lectures, articles, wikis to get them somewhat up to speed.

[@loverelationshiptalk3503]

When you’re accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression’ Sums this interview nicely

[@UNCHART3DGAMING]

Read Madness of crowds and now halfway through The War in the West - thank you for your efforts to educate those who want to know and helping us pushback with actual facts to arm ourselves - love the phrase and will use it often “compared to what?”

[@robertwood7792]

I'm still waiting for the Italians to apologise for crucifying Jesus Christ

[@makerealitygreatagain8809]

My goodness. They couldn't have cared less, the Romans were essentially extorted by the Pharisees. Aka and from the mouth of Jesus himself "The Sinugogue of Satan."

[@dinosgura]

🤣🤣🤣

[@gordonodenbark535]

I’m so grateful that the Universe decided that it was a good idea to create Douglas Murray!❤

[@dina113east]

In the US the Democrats want to pay reparations to the descendants of slaves. However, 65 to 70% of the population have ancestors that arrived in America after the Civil War and long after slavery was abolished. They did not benefit from slavery and their lives were difficult and brutal. They worked 12 or more hours a day for little money, but they did get to go home at night - at least to what was called a home. They sacrificed for the benefit of their children and their descendants. No one gave them anything and their lives were difficult and short. We all have benefited from our ancestor's sacrifices but remember we are fortunate that we are in America. In the history of the world no people have had a better life than we have right now in America. Even with all our current problems.

[@jasonambercrombie9214]

You speak much that is true and needs to be said. I will say that people of color around me in my life, have worse outcomes - lower pay, worse housing, terrible health care. I do not feel this is because they are worse people. Therefore there must be an external explanation as to why people of color - as observed in my world right here in America - have significantly lower standards of living than the white people.

[@dina113east]

@@jasonambercrombie9214 There is a huge middle class of people of color, also there is poverty. There are many reasons for this, but one of the reasons is a home without a Father. That fact is true for people of all races that are raised in a home without a Father who is present in the family. There are studies of people in America with families who remain in poverty for generations. For example, many of the people of the Appalachians. The structure of the family often predicts the outcome of the lives of the children in a family.

[@blairrobert3438]

'In the US the Democrats want to pay reparations to the descendants of slaves'. Do they and if so how much and what would be the criteria?

[@zachhenrichs8438]

A well spoken man...

[@7pinky791]

Yes, well educated man but some what blinkered.

[@ChrisHFal]

Murray in full flow is a thing to behold.

[@zapatavive1801]

just another typical white backlash colonizer who can't for the life of him acknowledge the Native Holocaust on Native Homecontinent

[@nomasksnojab5525]

His books are fantastic. I agree with every word he writes. Loved The Madness of Crowds too. Gives me ammunition ( verbal obvs) against all these lefty minorities

[@fundzreal7680]

Shame he won’t save the west though that’s already over lol

[@TheDragonKeeper100]

@@fundzreal7680 Yes we will, save the west.

[@thanksfernuthin]

95% correct. It's not self hatred. It's plain old hatred. These people don't see themselves as Americans or Britons or Europeans. They see themselves as above all that. They have nothing but contempt for their fellow citizens and the culture that improved the world so alarmingly. Like Satan... they have no room in their beings for gratitude. Yet another amazing talk by the great Douglas Murray! A national treasure belonging to my cousins across the pond!

[@jl9205]

Dougie's on a tear! I love it when he gets riled. There is nobody better.

[@artemisjuno]

Douglas Murray - one of the brightest,most clear sighted and rational writers alive today.

[@tomgl6684]

@Jason Barnett In the space of a 13 minute interview, he's demonstrated he doesn't understand the difference between a personal apology ("sorry I kept you on a leash and forced you to work for me") and one issued on behalf of the organisation you represent ("sorry my organisation profited by enslaving your ancestors"). If he's, whether honestly or disingenuously, failing to grasp that distinction in 13 minutes given to let him present his position unchallenged, I don't think a full book is going to do much to correct that.

[@dantescave1]

If ridiculous Douglas Murray and his idiot rhetoric is admired, deemed significant enough to broadcast, no wonder Brexit-Boris catastrophe has reduced Britain to its pitiful status today…persistent archaic systemic mistakes on sexism, racism, classism …but, after the Tories are through destroying Britain, there will be nothing left to even reform…

[@dantescave1]

@@tomgl6684 hilarious!…

[@skylark8828]

Popular with Farage & Co. then?

[@AlphaMaverick1111]

Complete clown and a fraud.

[@DrawnInk1]

Douglas you are a fantastic voice for common sense and good.

[@benjaminmackenzie8146]

Why am I only hearing half a discussion here? Is the presenter that bad you just cut him out completely?

[@antondelacruz9362]

So they can say that they had famous conservative murray on, but not have to deal with any potential backlash from sounding like they agreed with him or like they were too combative against him.

[@stablefairy9437]

Facts, Facts, Facts - you cant argue with facts. Just love Douglas Murray!

[@casteretpollux]

Pity his own grasp of them is so superficial.

[@beecat9951]

@@casteretpollux How so? Your argument is superficial in that it lacks substance altogether.

[@casteretpollux]

@@beecat9951 It's an observation, not an argument. I've set put more detail in an opening comment. He has no analysis of the woke phenomenon - he just moans about. Patently the "woke" thing is a CIA divide and rule cultural project.

[@fundzreal7680]

Most superficial man going, waffles in a ‘proper’ accent. He’s an angry homosexual in simple terms.

[@TheHippocrocapig]

@@fundzreal7680 repressed homosexuality intensifies! Lol

[@landsea7332]

Notice that this is occurring almost exclusively in the US , Britain , Canada , New Zealand and Australia . Also, notice that with a few exceptions , nearly every statue being ripped down , vandalized , or historical figure being discredited , was a Protestant . At what do people start saying this is a hate crime ? At what point do people start saying this is cultural genocide ?

[@peterhall3405]

Eh.... How many statues have been ripped down? The one that was ripped down was a of slaver. Now, I dunno about you, but I reckon slavery made this country what it is today. How about puting up statues of slaves?

[@jacksykes9980]

@@peterhall3405 Slavery did not make Britain what it is today. That's absurd. It was a small part of Britain society. Britain was created culturally and technologically by the vast majority of the people who have lived there. The vast majority of British literature, technological innovation, philosophy, etc. came from British people not slaves imported from other parts of the world. Stop with the self hatred and nonsense

[@StillAliveAndKicking_]

@@peterhall3405 Actually no, they are trying to destroy anyone. They defaced Churchill’s statue claiming that he was a racist and hence the statue should go. They went for the philosopher Hume, removing his name from university buildings.

[@peterhall3405]

@@StillAliveAndKicking_ 1) The real cancel culture comes from the lunatic right - the far right. They have just brought in laws to prevent protest. They bring in anti-democratic laws. They routinely censor left wing voices. ANd when that fails, do all they can to throw them in jail.

[@peterhall3405]

@@StillAliveAndKicking_ You pick on Churchill. Did you forget that the people who fought WW2 voted him OUT of office, first chance they had? Whty was that? Maybe because he has never, ever, not once supported working people. Ever. He even ordered guns be turned on striking miners.

[@sebastianmelmoth7331]

One of the great minds of our time.

[@fundzreal7680]

Lol

[@TheHippocrocapig]

Absolutely

[@thesoulbrother8636]

Yeah, right........😂😂😂

[@christianb8647]

Thank you for doing what you are doing!

[@julianshepherd2038]

"Men make their own history, but they do not make it just as they please; they do not make it under circumstances chosen by themselves, but under circumstances directly encountered, given and transmitted from the past. The tradition of all the dead generations weighs like a nightmare on the brain of the living."

[@bec5250]

Author please - Karl Marx

[@dantescave1]

@@bec5250 so? This observation is a general truth.

[@bec5250]

@@dantescave1 It is still important to attribute quotes. For a start, it educates people, and let's face it, people could do with that right now.

[@dantescave1]

@@bec5250 excuse me, I appreciate the attribution…so used to trolls, thought you were dismissing quote because of source.

[@bec5250]

@@dantescave1 Please don't apologise. Truth be, I was being a little pedantic. And it was a great quote, and well used. And I am with you there....so many trolls. It's like there's a paid farm of them (or ten). I sometimes wonder what is happening to their psyche as they spew their toxins into social media day after day. It must be damaging and demoralising in the long term. Have a fantastic week!

[@meganhuggins7494]

Are the zealots going to track down all the descendants of the black Africans who sold their brothers, sisters, neighbours and those taken from other villages?? They will be extremely busy!!

[@1969fata]

Douglas is right. There is no use in governments apologizing for sg that happened centuries ago. It would be much more sensible to realize today's mistakes and apologize for those.

[@weldongraham4131]

Mmkk . P O Ll

[@brendanscully5787]

Except that they are not sorry......

[@gspringellable]

Spot on again!

[@landsea7332]

Our Heritage is part of our Personal Identity - Our Culture helps establish who we are as People . So if corporations wanted to make Citizens more vulnerable , the best to do it would be to destroy our Cultural Heritage . .

[@landsea7332]

Apologies for the grammar : That should have read If corporations wanted to make Citizens more vulnerable , they would try to destroy our Heritage .

[@1907jdee]

What of the war on family, on marriage? Where the family goes, so goes society!

[@Vanessa-lf2jn]

Excellent commentary!! Can’t wait to get my copy of Murray’s latest book!!

[@Baz63]

damn good read

[@zapatavive1801]

He needs to go educate himself and read American Holocaust and watch Exterminate All the Brutes for beginners

[@russpaxman3660]

Reparations should only be paid by people who owned slaves, that are still alive, TO people who were slaves, that are still alive.

[@nickg5624]

I am so tired of other peoples customs, cultures, religions that I need to tolerate. Get over it, we in a new world and a new order. Let them go and as you evolve and become more civilized. Enough!

[@nathaniel4334]

Thank god for DM

[@lynnmcquillan2338]

Well said ! .. each country has its bad as also each individual has his/her own bad. Learn & move on . It’s madness to think wrongs can be undone - we only have the present to do anything in .. let’s be better than our past but stop wallowing in it .. 👍🙏☮️🙏

[@vssjim4311]

What a brilliant man

[@blancaandrovic6406]

with brilliant Mind

[@dextercool]

how is a cut video the "full" interview?

[@royjacobs1204]

They cut out the presenter making a fool of himself

[@rerite2]

"An era of grandstanding..." Touche'.

[@formicapple2]

The results of crt. You must have a victim, therefore there has to be an oppressor. Never the fault of the individual victim.

[@downwardlymobile4957]

No, it began with Marxism which postulated an oppressor/oppressed narrative. My great grandather, a working class man, owned 3 houses at his death whilst most of his contemporaries didn't own a single one. He achieved this through hard work and good choices.

[@user-qi4hu1cq5o]

Thank god for people like Douglas Murray!

[@jameshumfry1256]

Douglas is consistently superb

[@harpar1028]

super B

[@bobbbaz2526]

And his belief is right. Here in sweden that belief shows its true self as we are gettin close to election times.

[@christopherwinrow3878]

Brilliant video YNWA

[@ryanjsimpson]

well spoken, Doug. Very articulate

[@kap925]

DM=👍🏻👍🏻

[@alanthorpe3640]

He is spot on about history. We are being attacked for it, when we should be learning from it, but that means we have to understand it, and we will not do it through novels and glossy TV dramas and documentaries. Bring back Starkey.

[@dantescave1]

…criticism of entrenched systems generate incredible backlash and retaliation in furious opposition to observation, evaluation, reform, as described by Hannah Arendt in ‘Origins of Totalitarian’

[@SepulchreBrit]

He is dressed like he’s been interrupted in the act of something 😈

[@Grace17893]

God help us keep it together

[@julio5prado]

Brilliant man in a world of ignorance and ideology

[@naufala93]

Douglas Murray is genius!! I can't wait to read his book "The War on The West"

[@mohamedali2858]

Any civilization in the world consists of three things. 1. The idea 2. People's 3. Things I *Does the idea understand human, social, political and economic values? * And are people as equal in right and duties as possible? *Does Things belong to the idea and people or are they looted and bring problems?

[@ancienbelge]

"The National Trust is run by ignoramuses." there's a typo in that sentence: "ignoramuses" should read "ignoranuses" ;)

[@senister14]

When are we going to stop tering each other down, we need to start lifting people up and building a better tomorrow, not fighting to see who wins the biggist pity trophy like some type of life poker game.

[@coenvanwyk1]

Hear hear!

[@wikingagresor]

Great performance from Douglas Murray, but you should at least put some graphics with the questions he is answering...

[@eaglestrike6875]

My family owned slaves. But they seem to have gone AWOL. Is there a Lost and Found Section for slaves ...... ?

[@luisatilano1]

Please just give this guy a f***ing book.

[@Stopinvadingmyhardware]

Gates of Vienna It’s Karma time.

[@7pinky791]

Tell the Germans and Japanese that they must be proud of their recent history??? Why?

[@tarpalin1]

please dont ever stop talking the truth,you have found the perfect arguement,go douglas,truth will always win

[@WordSalad980]

Parallel societies then isnt it.

[@terrydoyle4120]

many many many agree with Douglas........................look at the queue to see her majesty lying in state.....................the silent majority....never think you are on your own

[@tomsaveryscotlandicproduct8505]

Sick of it

[@andrewdawson5281]

Culture is the problem, not race. The culture of some ethnicities is what creates their lack of achievement in society (Vide Thomas Sowell). To that end: Most of the people that would appear to be racists and may believe that they do indeed hate people of another race are actually disapproving of the culture that the race brings and fears that it will change their own.

[@theequatableskeptic8148]

I would vote for this man.

[@nigelduckworth406]

Superb. A brilliant dissection of The Woke - even though this term, as Douglas says, is inadequate to describe those out to destroy our culture.

[@marymatthews678]

Don't explain, don't complain.

[@robertjenkins2740]

Very well said

[@Daffy310]

💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯

[@chuckkottke]

Progress happens when we develop better relationships, it's a work in progress, but we need to be reminded of the problems to actually act. Whether slavery, colonialism, or corporate capitalism, these are not healthy arrangements. History leaves it's patterns and marks, like red lined neighbors and a lack of generational wealth. Capitalism must either be reformed or replaced. What exists are low living standards and low self esteem in poor neighborhoods, a lack of hope and a lack of economic prosperity left in the wake of "deindustrialization". A case in point are new citizens to the US arriving from Jamaica. They do quite well! But they're given a fresh start in life, I think that highlights the problem and the solution. 💚

[@jakubcidlik]

That's not Capitalism problem. That is US problem. It is not a problem in Europe.

[@isaacolivecrona6114]

The histrionic left.

[@donikajorgo5612]

Hate? From what and when comes? Asks Jewish people? Or Rwanda.. Or how many people around the world.. Why they created hate? And something honestly England have play a negatively role in so many different things in world geopolitical.. In corruption too.. I like your intelligence.. But there have always a reason for something fell in favor or disfavor... Hate brings hates.. If it's for long time in table scene.. Thx

[@chrisrayne3274]

Thanks for your thoughts. I'm guessing English is your seventh language.

[@Dave-po2mz]

Lots to fear from the woke left but crickets on the neo fascist right, gotcha.

[@user-gz9yx5ty1r]

@Mac Adamia In all these countries except Poland, the right-wingers are not Nazis

[@JohnSmith-iu3ui]

Did the fascist right create autonomous zones or defund the police in 2020?

[@globalshift8382]

Well done Douglas

[@jonathanjollimore4794]

More worried about the war on facts the truth right now

[@redhammer9910]

Well said.

[@NothingIsKnown00]

Here, Murray specifically calls exaggerated emphasis on racism “anti-western”. Let’s also acknowledge the anti-Western movement that fights abortion rights, gay rights and secular education. These rights are as fundamental to the “West” as freedom of speech. No social conservative should ever have exclusive right to “Western values”.

[@SimDeck]

You missed the point of the whole thing in such a manner i doubt you even listened to it. Point out the bit where he says "exclusive rights" to anything. Bloody deluded dingbat. Ffs grow up.

[@stevenrichardson1843]

The rights claims you mention are all welcome recent innovations, but the western tradition that allowed them to happen started a long time ago. Freedom of speech allowed for all those developments to be discussed, argued over, and then adopted. It's far more important than any single issue.

[@johnnybumgarner9100]

Well you chose the right name for certain

[@kiafaridge7101]

Nonsense.

[@stevenrichardson1843]

@@johnnybumgarner9100 Less polite than I was but I suppose that was what I meant.

[@themonkeymanofStockbridge]

What are western values?

[@al-hassan9200]

It's the Christian culture

[@jeremymanson1781]

Independent judiciary, independent media, free and fair elections, right to a fair trial by your peers, habeas corpus, freedom to practice any religion or none.

[@andrewcox2810]

People trafficking /slavery is relevant today .No one seems to bring this up and tackle it.It’s century’s old and has happened to every country.

[@zapatavive1801]

Has the Holocaust happened to everyone

[@Njerve1]

Genocides are not uncommon in history, sadly. But only the west makes an effort to remember, instead of hide the atrocities that happened on their watch.

[@zapatavive1801]

@@Njerve1 ONLY the Native Holocaust continues to be minimized and swept under the rug unlike Germany. "there can be no more monumental example of sustained genocide-certainly none involving a 'race' of people as broad and complex as this-anywhere in the annals of human history

[@Njerve1]

​@@zapatavive1801 But it is being taught in schools, which is my point. I looked up a list on wikipedia. Its pretty long. I hadn't heard of most, and some are presently ongoing. Also, one that I know of is notably missing; the Uyghurs. But I can guess why that is.😒

[@user-gz9yx5ty1r]

@@zapatavive1801 Only Germany did a Holocaust. The United States did terrible things, but it's not even close Most of the natives died of disease and they fought the Americans

[@jacobzaranyika9334]

Good. Maybe they need examining.

[@robg5111]

So calling people you don't agree with ignoramuses is constructive criticism? Not being hypocritical at all 🤔🤣

[@theculturedjinni]

It might be hypocritical and an ad hominem, but hypocracy and calling outsome doing an ad hominem when the rest of the arguments hold are still logical fallacies kzbin.info/www/bejne/rJayfqOPm7uNqaM

[@robg5111]

@Jason Barnett no sorry, I am too ignorant

[@paulklee5790]

@@robg5111 Yes, yes you are...

[@oldgreybeard2507]

Anti western until they need a handout. Actually regardless of demanding handouts

[@voranartsirisubsoontorn9010]

" Any war against West Value " is very individual concept. Sometime it is a concept of a leader which influent the whole nation and sometimes it is a concept by individual person/group of people in any nation. I myself much prefer West Value over any value that does not support Power by,from,for the People and obviously because I prefer Democracy ways of the West.

[@alanhulme7794]

If we are to ignore the scale and scope of the horrendous crimes of our colonial past the we can't condemn Mr Putin for suppressing the narrative on Stalin and Soviet Russia. But agreed, perspective and relevance should be observed. Transatlantic slavery was done at a mass industrial level, something documented by those that profited by it. What values do we have, that are worth defending, if we don't accept that the riches that built our nations, and that, hopefully, you and I and our fellow citizens prosper from, were partly got by such deplorable means? What values do you we have if we ignore this legacy and fail to correct its repercussions?

[@Heidi123]

Slavery existed all over the world and at all times in recorded history sadly.

[@jag5470]

Our past is the past, ky do u pretend to care? Are u one of the entitled that needs a cause?

[@jeremymanson1781]

OUR colonial past? You would need to know whose ancestors arrived in the UK after slavery was abolished and exclude them.

[@julianshepherd2038]

We live in a time of endless turmoil because capitalism is continuously reinventing itself and that changes where we live, how we work and our relationships round them. Things don't just happen. Women didn't suddenly think working was better than staying home. Industry needed their labour and provided machines that made home work easier. You won't stop change unless you return to feudalism or some form of planned economy.

[@Mike-br8zt]

No thanks - been there and done that.

[@acm1137]

Feudalism isn't such a bad idea.

[@robertharper3754]

@@acm1137, it's a TERRIBLE idea, history has proven that. If America would stick to the documents that lay out their government, we'd be much better off, though adding more checks and balances on power, having ALL government employees + politicians put their investment assets in a blind trust, term limits for the House and Senate at the least, stopping government entities from re-defining/change in interpretation of the laws/regulations to get around the legislative process, stopping the transfer of wealth from those who actually pay taxes to those who don't, and having a flat-ish tax where everyone really pays into the government so they would have some skin in the game. (That MIGHT make people pay attention to what our government does) IF we could achieve the above America would truly be able to fix ALL of it's problems rather quickly and keep them from happening again.

[@soulfireonfire6423]

BS!

[@casteretpollux]

My view is that the woke thing is almost certainly a CIA op.

[@vivo-audio]

He thinks the British public know a lot about these things. Lol.

[@jeremymanson1781]

On the left and on the right there seems to be a lucrative income to be earned by constantly whining, whinging and playing the victim. Its simply so negative, energy sapping, counter-productive and just very tedious. Meanwhile Mr Murray has a book to sell...

[@chrisrayne3274]

Yet you took the time to leave a comment? I bet you watch films you feel are offensive all the way to the end as well just so you can be especially outraged in the morning.

[@jeremymanson1781]

@@chrisrayne3274 For better or worse I didn't listen to Mr Murray for more than a few minutes. He is all over youtube like a rash and he tends to stick to the same script. I am making a general point about the tedious victimhood on display. And trying to inflate minor issues that most people don't have time for into 'apocalyptic end of civilisation' issues. I am looking for practical solutions to real problems. Whinge-fests just don't do it for me anymore.

[@chrisrayne3274]

@@jeremymanson1781 understood, though I would respectfully point out that the victim/oppressed narrative has been somewhat one-sided so far. Regardless if you do not consider the continued polarisation of American politics an issue that could have disastrous consequences I would say you are in a complacent minority.

[@jeremymanson1781]

@@chrisrayne3274 I think the vast majority of US citizens who vote are sensible people. It is the attention seeking noisy extremes who I find tedious. The GOP are going through a very prolonged identity crisis and have manouvered themselves into an untenable corner. I hope they eventually sort themselves out. Where the GOP are at present they either have to impose an authoritarian state or become irrelevant.

[@-ucanthandledatruth01-12]

The innate narcissism, delusion and denial of w.society is a fascinating thing to observe

[@tallyeb]

Gaslighting.

[@chrisrayne3274]

Ahh.. The sign of the lazy critic. I bet you've got "dogwhistle" and "projection" waiting in the wings too....

[@colinmagnier1232]

ignorami

[@al-hassan9200]

He was interviewed by Sam Harris .. he wasn't at it! When you say "the western culture" , we all know that you mean "the Christian culture" ✝️ 🙄

[@thecuttingsark5094]

That’s not true. Western culture is not the same as Christian culture. There is a big overlap definitely but our capacity for science, empiricism, rationalism etc has not been a result of Christianity.

[@godwynthegael9912]

You clearly know nothing about us in the west then 🤦‍♂️

[@johnemorrison-kj3ox]

INCORRECT ! ! 😳

[@jennyk9748]

Actually, we don't all know that. Douglas Murray is an Agnostic, if you want to be precise about it.

[@jennyk9748]

@@thecuttingsark5094 Well said!

[@michaelsheehy1000]

The thumbnail says 'full interview' but the video turns out to be some reactionary crank reading out culture war talking points. Very poor video.

[@royjacobs1204]

Yes I am sure you had your first book published during your first year at Oxford University, as Douglas did

[@roymichaeldeanable]

Nope, we are living in an Age of 645 donut MP's whose education of virus stopped at age 3

[@dfwherbie8814]

Anyone who talks like this is lost. I’m not even interested in engaging with this anymore.

[@stephensuddick2557]

The speaker is benighted. Without complete acknowledgement and recognition of the mistakes of our past, we are doomed.

[@SimDeck]

Listen to it again. You have missed the point completely.

[@stephensuddick2557]

@@SimDeck I will. Thanks

[@stephensuddick2557]

@@SimDeck I listened again and I just can't agree with his points of view. I can't speak to Britain but his take on America is just not accurate in my view. I am a proud American with a deep appreciation for my country and the shining parts of it's history. But if he and I were to have a conversation he would accuse me of the things he describes here because I am also fairly well versed in the dark history of my country and I will vociferously describe it as such in a conversation.

[@jasonambercrombie9214]

@@stephensuddick2557 I agree with this

[@soulfireonfire6423]

@@stephensuddick2557 Like what? Share some if the deep dark history! Please enlighten me! Can’t wait to hear YOUR version of what you think is “ true history “ of America. Since apparently you believe there is a true history.

[@derekzilich4109]

Douglas Murray - from an upper-middle class English family, educated at Eton and Oxford, Murray's ideology and political views pander to the Eurabia theory: which asserts the gradual Islamification of Europe, thereby weakening its existing culture exemplified in 2017 "The Strange Death of Europe: Immigration, Identity, Islam,". Murray's work tries to put a socially acceptable face on the Eurabia theory and echoes the ‘Great Replacement’ hypothesis: which contends that the developed world is being overwhelmed with non-white immigration. His approach is old-school gentrified xenophobia; vintage posh-tosh; sugar-coated racism in elegant, highbrow language. His 2019 book “The Madness of Crowds: Gender, Race and Identity” examines issues of sexual orientation, feminism, race and transsexuality. It describes new culture wars playing out in workplaces, universities, schools and homes in the name of social justice, and identity politics, viewed through the lens of an upper-class right-wing provocateur. ‘The War on the West’ his latest book, seems like the sequel to "The Strange Death of Europe…” bluntly written in more dramatic and alarmist terms with shreds of ‘Madness of Crowds’ drizzled here and there; a manifesto to the ‘Great Replacement’ hypothesis and a social justice, identity politics, critical guidebook. All three manuscripts will be cherry-picked by extremists to suit their attitudes to ‘foreigners’ and the ideologies will be distorted to suit the arguments of social stratification.

[@janetcalderwood6385]

And Douglas is right

[@SantinaCrolla]

If that's the way you feel, then why are you here watching the video & writing a long winded essay? 🙄

[@chrisrayne3274]

In what school, college or university did they teach you that a summary of someone's claims or assertions mixed with a few slurs or non sequiturs bundled as associations, serves as any sort of critique or rebuttal? You may just as well have graffitied a toilet wall for all you have added to the topics at hand.

[@albertinapisano22]

I suppose that for you being educated at Oxford and coming from an upper middle class background makes you a racist?? There is nothing racist about him, sorry. This is a silly ad hominem critique.

[@user-fd1lz2vc4s]

Funny that, considering douglas is vocalising what the vast majority of the native working class brits think.

[@tomgl6684]

"There is not a person alive who can give or accept an apology for slavery." Look mate, this isn't rocket science. Say John Smith runs an institution that has previously benefited from slavery and he decides to issue the first apology that institution has given for using slaves to prosper. John Smith is not apologising for using slaves personally. He wasn't alive during slavery. He is apologising on behalf of the organisation he commands, the one which HAS benefitted from slavery and, under all management prior has not previously apologised for that. Still too woke for you? Okay, take slavery out of the question. Heck, let's even take black people out of the equation. Some American soldiers baked a cake for an Italian woman and presented it to her last week. Why? Because during the second world war, some US soldiers stole a cake that was baked for her when she was just a little girl. Now those soldiers that presented it to her last week didn't personally steal her cake. They have nothing to apologise for, right? They can't possibly make right what a bunch of different people did before they were born, right? Except they can, because they presented her with that cake not as themselves but as delegates of the army that originally stole her cake. They, as representatives of the US Army were making right a wrong inflicted by the US Army earlier in its existence. Obviously much different scale of injustice but the exact same logic applies to formal apologies issued around slavery. Christ this stuff isn't hard.

[@antithetical]

And yet what your long rant fails to answer is how far back exactly does one reach into the past, to find grievances to drag into the present? When do we draw a line in the sand and say redress has been made at X point in the past and therefore restitution is not required in the present. When does the ever mounting debt pile of Western guilt cease? After the complete and total deracination of Western Culture, history and tradition is complete?

[@antithetical]

And yet what your long rant fails to answer is how far back exactly does one reach into the past, to find grievances to drag into the present? When do we draw a line in the sand and say redress has been made at X point in the past and therefore restitution is not required in the present. When does the ever mounting debt pile of Western guilt cease? After the complete and total deracination of Western Culture, history and tradition is complete?

[@antithetical]

Oh and to add: Is comparing Western Guilt over slavery an equal equivalence to giving an Italian woman a cake? It seems like a rather slim stretch at best to say either are comparable. Especially as European powers have repaid their debts to their former colonies and continue to provide financial aid.

[@tomgl6684]

@@antithetical Putting aside the fact that I explicitly accept that the scale of the two things are in no way comparable: The point 💨 💨 💨 💨 💨 💨 Your head But let me make it real simple for you: Apologising for something that a body you represent did years/centuries ago is not the same as admitting personal fault for doing that thing that happened before you were even born. Do you get it yet? No, who am I kidding. Of course you don't.

[@antithetical]

@@tomgl6684 so to clarify, your concept of a well thought out and reasoned argument is to use a false equivalence? Ultimately institutions within societies that have undergone radical social reforms: like the West, are part of said reformed Societies. Saying Institutions like the National Trust or Tate serve only to teach future generations that everything is the product of Slavery/Racism, is a false and one dimensional view of history and the West. You could as easily argue that the NT and other western institutions, are the byproduct of abolitionist western societies rather than the byproducts of slaver societies.

[@ma55382uk]

Isn’t heterosexuality and condemning homosexuality a western value ?

[@Njerve1]

The west is the only place on earth where you will find homosexuality celebrated. How would you argue its condemned?

[@chrisrayne3274]

No it isn't.

[@Flashyfinancier]

Hey Ahmed, check the Middle East and Africa

[@jasonambercrombie9214]

You gave us an exercise now let me give you one. Please spend a week prefacing EVERYTHING you say with "As a wealthy white man..." then you can say whatever else you like after that. Maybe over the the UK the descendants of viciously oppressed people are doing Ay- OK and are on economic par with white men but here in the US the racial disparities are unconscionable so all that past you seem to think is packed up and put away and pre-apologized for is still with some of us right here today - For example, "as a white man living in America, I want to get my car windows tinted in the front but I don't dare because I don't want to increase the odds of being pulled over by law enforcement". For example, "as a white man, I think all this fuss over racial disparities is silly and overblown". "As a cisgender heterosexual male, I think all this accommodation of gender diversity is a waste of time". Just like you said to the professional you are speaking with, "as someone who knows nothing you about job - let me tell you how it is". You are only speaking for your own experience and the experience of people who have your background and position in society but you act like you are speaking for the people whose lives are still being affected by the history you feel is somehow no longer relevant to them today.

[@godwynthegael9912]

Viciously oppressed people in the UK....so other white people 🤦‍♂️

[@jeremymanson1781]

Practical solutions are a lot more useful than counter productive attempts to make white heterosexual people feel guilty just for existing.

[@joelmccoy9969]

Ya, Ya. Don't discuss slavery, don't discuss genocide of aboriginals, don't say Gay, don't discuss Jim Crow laws, don't question white supremacy. It is the same all over, don't question white supremacy! And if you do, you are an ignoramus. Brexit is about racism. But we've given ourselves a pass now.

[@zaniwoob]

Nah but it's the convenient leaving out history that makes you a self-loathing anti-european racist.

[@dantescave1]

Hear! Hear!

[@paulklee5790]

Sorry I have absolutely no idea what point your trying to get over here...

[@Njerve1]

We discuss these things endlessly, if you haven't noticed. What we don't do, is discuss the vast amount of things we do better than anyone else. Today, and in the past. He says ignoramus, because people ignore all the good in western culture, and ignore all the bad in other cultures. Its a completely one sided argument against the west, with no attempt to learn about the other side of the story.

[@Flashyfinancier]

Joel are you Black?

[@tmcb2000]

People who point our racist past aren't acting in bad intent or nonsensical but exposing the racism and slavery that persists to this day even in the UK but particularly in the US. Personally I would applaud the dumping if statues such as Coulson in the harbour.

[@jeremymanson1781]

Who very specifically in the UK are you referring to when you say 'our racist past' ?

[@kiafaridge7101]

Slavery exists in the US? Where? And how does dumping statues help point out the past?

[@tmcb2000]

@@kiafaridge7101 Start with prison labour, which is the biggest horticultural workforce in the land. Then look at the illegal immigrants who are trafficked, many into prostitution. In the UK, as on the US, there are statues erected to men who profited from such trade I'm happy to see them toppled into the harbour.

[@jeremymanson1781]

@@kiafaridge7101 the Coulston statue in the centre of Bristol was a very particular very long running (since 1925) issue.

[@Commander_ZiN]

Wow so boring, just went on and on with the same point over an over.

[@MoMo-bi7ck]

Whats he ranting about? Teaching people TRUE history that has been hidden for decades and treating all human beings equally????? My question is : What is the problem with the Western white man? Is he afraid he is now equal to non whites......is he afraid of losing his white supremacy? These are the questions that need to be asked of the likes of D Murray.....

[@MoMo-bi7ck]

And its not about apologising......its about teaching TRUE history, treating people equally and yes if you stole something you give it back.......the effects of slavery and colonialism are still here with racial inequality rampant in the west......but as Mr D Murray is a western white man he has not experienced it and for some reason cannot see it......

[@chrisrayne3274]

OK so what history is not being taught? And just exactly how are minorities not being treated equally in 2022?

[@MoMo-bi7ck]

@@chrisrayne32742 facts: school curriculums have for decades concentrated on cut and paste history and hiding the many evils of empire......and secondly the fact that minorities have to do double or treble to what their white colleagues have to do to get recognised is proof in itself..........teaching good so we follow it must include teaching evil so we don't repeat it....

[@chrisrayne3274]

Cool, so it's the usual "we should have known better 300 years ago when we didn't know what a germ or atom was" routine. OK so can you tell me what we have to apologise for (or hide for that matter)? Everyone was doing the same thing, it was part of species development and cultural expansion. The only significance of "colonial" in the process was it meant more developed countries that could project power further. Native American and African tribes were doing exactly the same thing, they just couldn't do it across such distances.

[@MoMo-bi7ck]

@@chrisrayne3274 fair enough. But all people need to work together to create a level playing field......extreme lefties or extreme right wingers are not the answer.......

[@heereandqueer_andpeggy7375]

The world has moved on. Murray is living in a colonial past. His ideology doesn't allow him to react to the real changes in the world.

[@stephenphillips4984]

You completely misunderstand what is going on. It's FAR deeper than the racism of the past. Murray is speaking about the vacuous symptoms in society of postmodernism, which absurdly reduces life to conflicts between identity groups. That what has only moved. The destruction of classical values by a godless, Marxist philosophy brainwashed into the graduates of universities.

[@beecat9951]

He's criticising other people living in a colonial past and trying to change it. What ideology do you think he has? He literally condemns colonialism in this video. Did you even bother to watch it?

[@sullyx5142]

Aww, the nostalgic supremacist Douglas Murray that can't handle the decline of the West Welcome to a multipolar world

[@chrisrayne3274]

So, you welcome the decline of your life, your family, or your community with open arms do you? Of course you don't. Ideological hypocrisy as usual.

[@sullyx5142]

@@chrisrayne3274 I actually don't care as it's the way the World is going to be due to division being created

[@chrisrayne3274]

@@sullyx5142 that sounds more bipolar than multipolar...

[@sullyx5142]

@@chrisrayne3274 Nothing wrong with that

[@chrisrayne3274]

@@sullyx5142 if you'd ever loved anyone with depression of some sort, or known a person living with bi-polar disorder, you would know how crass, malign and offensive that is. JP does plenty of videos on the toxic nature of nihilism, I'd suggest you watch them.

[@tomgl6684]

Been impressed by the calibre of guests Times Radio has had on of various stripes and backgrounds. Shame you had to end that good streak with this utter twerp.

[@beecat9951]

Well it seems he's triggered you into being incapable of making any counter arguments so I think that's a win for Douglas Murray.

[@tomgl6684]

@@beecat9951 I've made the counter argument multiple times in other comments on this thread. I'll accept your apology for calling me incapable of doing so once you've gone back and read them with your eyes and had a think with your brain, thanks. But essentially it boils down to this: Murray either cannot or pretends he cannot understand the distinction between someone offering a personal apology for something they themselves have done and them offering an apology on behalf of the organisation they represent for doing something they personally had no involvement in. Those US soldiers that gave a cake to an old lady in Italy didn't personally steal that cake left out for her when she was a little girl. They weren't even born. But the soldiers that did were US Army soldiers. They were making right something the US Army did, not them personally. They didn't feel any personal guilt because they didn't steal the cake - but they will have accepted making right that wrong would be a nice thing to do. Same logic applies to apologies made for organisations that profited off slavery. So yes, if you can't grasp that simple difference, you're a twerp. Goodbye.

[@kevintaylor3319]

Another angry ignoramus on the right