Downgrades and Infinites | Mario Party 4

[@lightninja4795]

Man i love having boards that look exactly the same with just different backgrounds. Am also so happy with lost all the items from mario party 3 and we have mushroom shoved down our throat. Who needs the distinct boards from mario party's 1-3 when you can just have boards that look the same best decision ever lol.

[@MarioPartyTV]

The boards actually ruin this game for me, every board has basically the same style and the only gimmicks are that all of them can absolutely screw you with infinites you can't control. Plus with there being less opportunities to play yourself out of those bad spots (worse Chance Time, item system, no duels) it can definitely feel like you are just waiting for the game to end because the early game screwed you so much. The overall package is solid but the board gameplay def regressed in 4. ~ Steeler

[@darrenvanleyden4988]

Steeler What is your ranking of all Mario party’s?

[@buzzytrombone4353]

If ND Cube decides to remake any of the boards from the games as DLC for Mario Party Superstars, I think that they would be better off only remaking two of the boards from this game because of how shit the design was for them to begin with. They could get creative with taking a look inside of the boxes that the bridges with spaces are hovering over, while still keeping things structurally sound.

[@Twentydragon]

This is where I think we're going in completely different directions. While I would argue that MP3 is better than 2, I can understand ranking them differently. But 4, to me, doesn't play any better than 1. *Boards* The boards are, without exception, bland catwalks with little to no visceral interaction with the environment. The item play is slightly worse than 2, even taking into account that you could only hold one item in 2, and the "Mini-Mega System" is far overhyped and overplayed. The mini gates are a huge pain to try to use and are a poor substitute for the locked doors of 2 and especially 3 (where you could bounce off the door to shorten your roll). Not a single board here sticks out to me as being fun to play. I have the same problem with 3, but it was mitigated a lot there by fun item play. The only reason to play any board in 4 is as a device to tie the minigames together and to give them stakes. *Minigames* While some of the minigames are pure genius (Dungeon Duos, Booksquirm, Mario Speedwagons, Team Treasure Trek, Archaeologuess, Fruits of Doom), the ones that are purely mashing a single button (Domination, Slime Time) have nothing at all going for them. "Mash A" games overstay their welcome before you're even through the instruction screen and should be discarded in their entirety or reworked to have something else going on (Gondola Glide [6], Button Mashers [5], Triple Jump [5], Mario Medley [4], etc.). Unfortunately, this is the beginning of the trend of slapping a new coat of paint on the same game and filling another slot with it. Three Throw is painful if you're stuck in the middle. Bob-omb Breakers tried to do too much at once with the shared grid and hectic matching. Goal (not worth spamming caps) controls very poorly. Revers-a-Bomb is hard to follow and can easily lead to getting practically stun-locked. Bowser's Bigger Blast returns from 2 with a new name, but there's nothing bigger about it except the fancy 3D graphics. There's nothing new or redeeming about it. It's pure luck. For the extra games, I'm glad they didn't use Panel Panic and Doors of Doom as standard minigames. They're kinda fun to watch, but they're pure luck. Barrel Baron should have been used as a standard game somehow, although we did see Metal Detectors [S]. Mushroom Medic and Bob-omb X-ing could have easily been elimination-based games (make a mistake and you're done). Goomba Stomp could have easily just been score-based. *Theming* MP1: Adventure MP2: Theme Parks MP3: Stuck in a Toy Box MP4: Birthday This is the weakest narrative theme so far, and it does a poor job tying the game together. Granted, this isn't hugely important, as Pummel Party doesn't even have a central theme and it turned out fine. However, a poor one can detract from the game, and here it does. *Summation* If I were doing this series, I would simply chuck all the boards and items and salvage some of the minigames. I'd cut the mini gates, all of the items, the lottery, and the mini board events. Team Match can stay. There's just not much going for Mario Party 4 that another installment didn't do much better. My current ranking: 4 < 1 < 2 < 3

[@ultrairrelevantnobody1862]

I have to agree with this. I respect Mario Party 4 since it was my introduction to the series, but it feels so stale and uninspired revisiting it. I'm not sure if I would say it's better than 1, but it definitely falls short compared to 2 and especially 3. 50Hz especially makes Mario Party 4 such an unbearable slog.

[@darrenvanleyden4988]

@@ultrairrelevantnobody1862youre ranking from Mario party 1 to 8?

[@ultrairrelevantnobody1862]

@@darrenvanleyden4988 I would say 1, 4, 5 and 8 aren't all that great. The rest are good.

[@darrenvanleyden4988]

@@ultrairrelevantnobody1862 same but 8 is not that bad in my opinion

[@Guylan]

Pro: Speeding up and slowing down taunts with the C stick. Additionally pitch shifts taunts and spinning the c stick warbles the taunt for added annoyance.

[@ivth3058]

I got a Japanese copy of Mario Party 4 for Christmas and so far I've been enjoying it. Sure I can't read anything, but it's Mario Party y'know? Mario Party 6 is my favorite in the series, but so far I'm pleasantly surprised with 4. Good video, man.

[@Possum880]

I love Mario Party 4 and find it super underrated in the series. I’m shocked to see peoples frustrations with the boards as I generally loved them. I don’t have any memory of the infinites ruining the experience. I just chalked it up to Mario party being so reliant on chance and luck

[@phanpyken986]

Personal rankings 6. Koopa(I mainly dislike it because of the dolphin mechanic because you can miss a star. Also because during my 30 turn game it took 18 turns to get one star because of its position and no lamps were ever sold). 5. Bowser’s gnarly party(interesting board but the bowser mini event sucks when you want to use an item) 4. Toad’s midway madness(decent but you can get stuck in the teacups loop) 3. Goomba’s greedy gala(great board but like 4 you can get stuck but you have a way to leave) 2. Shy guy’s jungle jam(Great board but boo is hard to get to) 1. Boo’s haunted bash(My only concern is stars appeared on the bridges but if you have a lamp you’re fine. Also I recommend playing this board for 30+ turns to see the big boo event because of how rare it is) Also I feel like Mario speedwagons is okay but not one of the best. I feel like 4 is not as good as 3 in terms of the board game aspect. The minigames are better but the boards all feel bland and somewhat identical

[@nintendoboy3605]

Hot take here. Slime Time > Domination

[@Wannabechefguy]

Here king, you dropped this: 👑

[@nintendoboy3605]

@@Wannabechefguy Thanks *Takes crown*

[@Aserl]

Based

[@scantyer]

The mega and mini mushroom were a good mechanic on paper but the fact the former makes you skip events (including the star) and the latter reduces ur dice roll to 1-3 (making it really bad if you wanna go into the small pipe, its only purpose) means that i fear using the mega in case i pass through a star and one huge section of each board goes unvisited. Also the star count stays really low because many stars are locked behind luck based events. The monkeys in the koopa board are the fucking worst. MP4 has solid minigames but its boards are frustrating as fuck. It really is only one step above 1.

[@guildmasterandy3767]

Can think of an easy way to remove the Infinites in Gooba's Greedy Gala. For the Red Zone just swap the direction you move, so move counter clock wise instead of clockwise, and then add a junction right after the lottery shop leading back to the roulette. After that move just add a junction to the Purple area that leads you to the Red area.

[@piksqu9544]

9:54 skill issue

[@wizardwor511]

The Luck Lottery Ticket almost never results in a winner though..

[@juliioyamigos]

As in real life

[@nyckobedoya]

What does the failure of mp3 means? Thats my favorite!

[@bvni]

not to pile on more descent, but there's no way I'd put this game above any of the classic trilogy; maybe above 1, given how primitive that game is. The board design and board play is just way too egregious compared to prior entries, a definitive stepback in the series in my opinion. While though I do agree that the new features (team matches, custom minigame sets, last 5 turns roulette) are very welcomed additions and the minigames are the best to this point, I don't think it's enough to save it. with the board design, the entire problem is that the majority of the boards have infinites. I'd argue that infinites as-is represent some fundamental flaw in board design, as it implies enabling the player to get locked in to a part of the board by RNG. Peach's Birthday Cake, Wario's Battle Canyon, Mystery Land, and most of the boards in MP3 suffer harshly from this. However, against all odds, the infinites in MP4 somehow managed to out-do the infinites in MP3. The infinites in MP4 are nicely placed at some of the most important junctions of the board, where making the wrong move could cost you the game to no fault of your own. As if that's not enough, almost every infinite is beyond your control. Compound this with the bland square-ish design to every board, and things don't look or play well as-is. Compound this again with the sluggish game pace, which to be fair seems to have been entirely forgotten about past MP3, and it's just horrid. It's like I'm playing Wario Battle Canyon Party, rather than an actual Mario Party game. Cynically speaking, I'd say these downgrades imply where Hudson's priorities went in a game that was likely developed on a 1 year cycle (gamecube 2001 -> MP4 2002); the minigames looked real good, but the boards are some of the worst to this point. that's not to mention that the board play itself is screwed from what MP3 achieved. It all starts with the mega/mini system, which itself was needlessly shoehorned into the game for no particular reason. If anything, it only serves to punish and complicate tasks that were already possible through other items. The mega mushroom is just a bastardized combination of the bowser suit and mushroom, all while punishing you by forcing you to skip some of the most important board events (the item shop, the STAR SPACE). The potential coin gain does not justify the fact that the only way to gain mass movement in this game is to potentially risk passing up an item shop or star space; there is no mushroom or golden mushroom. The mini mushroom is even worse, as I'd argue they made the skeleton key into an even worse version of itself. Not only does it still take up your inventory space like a skeleton key either way, the idea of putting the key into the gate has somehow become an entire song and dance. Your roll is slashed in half, and you have to take a bet on a needless high roll just to get through the gate. If you miss the gate, too bad, you just wasted an entire turn for no reason. Not to mention that you're still set behind because, no matter what, you were forced to roll a 1-5 on yourself. There's a reason there's little application for applying a poison mushroom to yourself in MP3, so to combine that mechanic with the skeleton key is just poor design in my eyes. As an even further intrusion, the mushroom spaces practically replaced item spaces, which locks many items behind the item shop; this is an unnecessary hard paywall, and can potentially lock players into a loss. Combine this system with the fact that many powerful and useful items (RIP reverse mushroom) were completely stripped from MP3, and you have another major setback in a key gameplay element. i'd personally go 4 < 1 < 2 < 3 up to this point, as these issues alone leave a very bad taste in my mouth. The series should be moving forward by this point, not regressing for the sake of reinventing the wheel on the shiny new console. opinions on the game aside, I'm really enjoying this series so far, and can't wait to hear your thoughts on MP5. This is provoking some good thought and discussion, so keep up the good work.

[@ultrairrelevantnobody1862]

Mario Party 4 was the first game in the series I've played. I was young and would play it for hours until the disc got scratched. Unfortunately though like most games from my childhood, 4 doesn't hold up even with my nostalgia goggles attached. I could detail why but you pretty much did the talking for me. I can understand why 2 would be someone's favourite (charm and simplicity), or why 3 is since that's my favourite (intricate design, items and replay value). 4 just feels like the midlife crisis instalment that fails to translate the series to next gen proper. I used to think I liked 4 more than 1, but revisits have proven me wrong.

[@wizardwor511]

OBLIGATORY COMMENT FOR VASTLY UNDER RATED CHANNEL.

[@thomas1999]

MP4 is definitely my go-to aswell. I think with some changes it would be perfect. Item shop revamp- items cost too much, meaning ppl dont buy them. everything should be cheaper. e.g: Warp pipe should be 3-5 coins, sparky sticker should be maybe 5-7 coins. etc. etc. mushroom buff- mega doesnt skip board events, mini can roll up to ten. nerf mega by only taking 5 coins instead. reversal of fortune replaced with chance time dice rolling event (RoF always results in coins being swapped.)

[@spartanq7781]

I detest the boards and the items but the mini games are godly. If these mini games were brought back in a Mario Party Superstars 2 whilst fixing the boards,fixing Mario Party 5's boards and bringing in two from Mario Party 6 and 7 would be perfection.

[@tjlnintendo]

The GameCube was the first console I ever owned and this game was my first game along with it.

[@juliioyamigos]

I used a cheat so that the animations are faster (it feels really good), and the minimushrooms can get numbers from 1 - 10, with those two small changes the experience is much better, the next time I invite my friends to play I'll put this game. P.S; I put the cheats on the wii through USB loader GX

[@BlueDragoon97]

Not sure if you already said you’d do this or not, but I sincerely believe you should plan on looking at Mario Party DS as part of this sort-of-but-not-quite retrospective, since it is essentially the last legitimate Mario Party made by the Hudson devs, and it has some ideas in regards to theming and board design that I believe are worth considering for a “Perfect Mario Party.”

[@J05Youtube]

He said in the first video that he's just covering the console games for this review series. If he does end up reviewing it, it would be after this.

[@CowFoodYum]

The reason I'm not going to look at the handheld games is because I simply don't have a way of capturing footage for them. If I can get a 3DS capture card then I will do videos on all the handheld Mario Parties.

[@nascour5991]

@@CowFoodYum cool hopefully one day you'll be able too

[@nn17fi99]

I just can’t get over the glowing path boards

[@AgentXRifle]

I think this is better than 3 but not as good as 2. I think there seems to be a lot of hate towards 4 compared to 5/6 but as you stated, the minigames are great and the graphical enhancements were huge back then (even today, MP3 looks like paper mario took a shit on MP2s face)

[@Antifrost]

This was the first Mario Party game I played, so I may be tinged with a bit of nostalgia as I think back on it. My brother and I spent so many hours between this, 5, and 6, and all three were thoroughly enjoyable. I never played any of the N64 Mario Party games either, so I didn't have anything to compare it to. If anything, I'd say that 4-6 were the games responsible for molding my perception of what a Mario Party game should be, and it was somewhat harder for me to enjoy games that deviated from that formula.

[@rodolfovargas7952]

Mario Party 4 is one of my favorite games, but third to Mario Party 6 and Mario Party 2, I like Boo's Haunted Bash. I LOVE Team Match, it returns in other Mario Party games, except 9, 10, Island Tour, Star Rush, and The Top 100. I love Boo's Crystal Ball, it's stronger than the Boo Bell, I'd carry Boo-related items, but not the Boo Repellent and the Gaddlight, they'll kill the Boos.

[@WaddleDee105]

I personally think MP4 is one of the weaker entries. The minigame list is incredible, but the boards are slow and tedious. The focus on Mega and Mini Mushrooms is just too much and it takes away from the other items. The removal of Duel Games, and the smaller list of items just felt like a regression compared to 3. Also, I didn't know it was possible to like Mario Speedwagons.

[@phanpyken986]

Evan Holtz yeah I agree also in my opinion I feel like the 1vs3s are some of the worst in this game. Aside from money belts and hop or pop.

[@Theterminator154]

you smell

[@13Dragonblade]

Mp4 is actually my favorite one. But I can see why people don't like it. To each their own.

[@SuperBrandeaux]

It's bottom of the barrel comparing 1-7

[@theaveragemushroom6474]

Unoriginal yet still Interesting and underrated content

[@robertlauncher]

The infinites kinda keep me from putting 4 above 2. The boards are extremely punishing

[@13Dragonblade]

There is IS duel minigames. The story minigames you play against the host. Are 1 vs. 1s duel style minigames. Some of my favorites in the series. I get it no "duel minigames" none for stars/coins to be won. They tried something different. 4, 5, and 6 were my favorite ones by far. In my order: best to worst: 4, 6, 5, 2, 7, 8, 3, 1, 10, 9 and super. I can understand there are some "aspects" not to like its fine all games have em. But Id say 4 was great! 👌

[@nn17fi99]

Its a shame that MP4s minigames are so good because I just HATE the boards and board gameplay

[@rtyuik7]

10:00 - that should be Merch...like, not even with any fancy font or graphics, just Your Handwriting, the way it is here...

[@antant6217]

the item spaces are single handedly the shittiest part about mario party 3. not only is using both items a huge gamble, but the ai is way too stupid to use them and they often just throw matches whenever they use them and none of the boards use them meaningfully well despite being a major selling point the game tried to make you can make custom minigame sets which is neat, but the board design and awful mushrooms make this one of the weaker entries for me

[@OutFreak28]

I hate mario party 4

[@SuperBrandeaux]

4 over 3 and 2? Big yikes

[@callinater6133]

Boards having infinites is a much bigger turn off for me than stars simply leaving play. I don’t know why you are so passionately against stars leaving play to the point that it’s a difference between a 3/10 and an 8/10. The only time stars leaving the game would completely ruin the board is if there isn’t a consistent addition of more stars to the game (a star stealing board for example). Otherwise, it doesn’t really matter. Losing stars to bowser is just another aspect of mario party and it can be overcome by simply getting more stars. For me personally, it’s preferable losing a star to bowser as opposed to another player since not only does the latter result in a net difference of 2 stars between players, but stealing it back is not an opportunity that arises very often unless it’s a star stealing board.