Dr Kat and Katherine Howard

[@EmoBearRights]

These days we'd recognise the poor lass was groomed and exploited.

[@ivorybluesky]

yes was a victim all the way. poor girl. Those men were ruthless. They did it all for the power, land and wealth.

[@Thepourdeuxchanson]

Women groomed and exploited was normal for those days. Families only needed daughters for the purpose of alliances beneficial to the family. Even up to quite recent times girls were not encouraged to study or advance beyond marriage, but to settle down to home and children.

[@kimberlybates6261]

Sadly, I think she was a very confused and easily manipulated young girl. Tragically I think people used her. Very sad.

[@Utubekrakl76]

Kimberly Bates I couldn’t agree more. Being raise without family makes naive girls hungry for any kind of affection and easy manipulation.

[@alicemorton9145]

Thank you Kat for sharing poor Katherine’s story! It’s sounds to me that she was a younger teenager not assertive and violated by predators! Because she never had a child I wonder if menses had even ever occurred giving her a possible age of up to 15🤔

[@mangot589]

Plus being a ding dong. She was in WAY over her head. But her cousin being executed for being unfaithful should have given even the dimmest person a clue, that that isn’t a good idea🤷‍♀️.

[@mangot589]

The Strange one المغربة No. Her not being a virgin wasn’t specifically the problem here. Her hiding it, was. Even though that wasn’t a crime, it sure made him angry. It completely humiliated him. And that’s really all it took. She was his “Rose without a Thorn”.

[@annwilliams6438]

The Strange one المغربة No. Anne probably wasn’t. BUT with many marriages in those days being a case of the couple saying ‘we’re married’ and then having sex. There were not that many church marriages in those days as they were expensive. So Henry with Catherine having called another man ‘husband’ after having a dalliance with him as a younger woman, it could have been argued that she was already married! And THAT would have been a HUGE problem for Henry as once again (as with Anne Boleyn) there may have been questions about the legitimacy of any offspring from her. The marriage contract for the King was extremely important and he had been married to, spoilt and raised (in status) to a woman who may have already been married! Most terribly embarrassing as well. And Henry did NOT like being toyed with.

[@Rachel-art-and-design]

I think if I found that the king was interested in me I would have fled to France.

[@greekre]

i would have hung around to get me some coldpepper

[@kurtdaisley8629]

Or immediately joined a convent

[@eveduibhir8902]

I agree, but unfortunately, Catherine would almost certainly not have been able to have avoided this "great honor" the king was bestowing upon her. Sad story.

[@stoker1931jane]

Oh I would have wanted to do the very same thing: France or a Convent, anything but the King's "love". BUT Your "loving" Family would probably not let you slip away - as it would bring THEM prestige, status, power, and wealth. 😔

[@kat8753]

When a king proposes it's not a request it's an order. Henry VIII actually considered marrying Mary queen of Scots mother Mary de guide before she married king James, but she refused allegedly saying she would only marry him if she had two heads. Lol

[@restrictedmilk]

Thank you for clearly reminding us of her age. Far too often she has been aged up into something "more palatable" for modern viewers. What a shocking and difficult life this poor child had to endure. It's tragic how she was manipulated and abused

[@bryanmcgucken7209]

Poor kid. She may’ve been foolish but that’s hardly unusual in an adolescent. I’ve a lot of sympathy for her.

[@susannebemis3311]

me too ,you just want to get her out of there and protect her!

[@miathomas6476]

She wasn’t foolish she was 13 when she was with mannox and she was not allowed to say no or even if she did it would of been ignored just like with the other men because in the 16th century no meant nothing in a Rich mans world

[@hildajensen6263]

@@miathomas6476 Well, for the few decisions that she was able to make for herself, she does seem to have made some foolish choices. - But that's not unusual for an emotionally neglected child.

[@jpcodnia9133]

16th century martyr > Queen Howard

[@--enyo--]

It sounds like she was trying too hard to please everyone. Something women are often pushed to do to this day.

[@blondbraid7986]

Personally, I think her request to have the execution block brought to her to practice her own execution on was an attempt to take control of the situation on a mental level, and perhaps get used enough to it to remain somewhat calm and disassociate on the day of her execution. She could do nothing to stop her beheading, but this may have given her at least a sense of peace by focusing on the few things she still had power over, such as how she would move her body to lay her head down on the block. From what I've heard, some abuse survivors take up self harm as a way of taking back the power over their bodies their abusers took away by punishing and controlling themselves, and perhaps the seemingly morbid request of having the execution block brought to her filled a similar purpose to Katherine Howard.

[@kimberli8225]

Dear Dr. Kat, Your videos are as always educational and entertaining , however I don't believe any of the Portraits are Katherine Howard, if I could see the ears I would know for sure. The shape and interior of ones ears are very individual and don't change with age . Thank you for your wonderful videos,. 64 yr.old Florida Girl.

[@amandadunn1238]

I agree with you absolutely! If I were in her shoes I would have done the same. To be in control of her emotions and actions on the day of execution had to be her focus. I would be terrified of doing something embarrassing.

[@RobinSmith-de2zl]

I enjoyed your video extremely knowledgeable 😊

[@msinvincible2000]

Anne of Cleves was the wisest of Henry's wives: she understood he was a crazy tyrant, and got out of his way.

[@richland1980]

@@not1-not2 One theory was that Anne of Cleves deliberately made her self unattractive to the grotesque homicidal sociopath Henry

[@EnglishTMTB]

@@richland1980 Or just didn't try to make herself attractive? Presumably beauty standards involved a lot of work back then, even more than now? In which case, lack of effort would be a real turnoff for men who expected a woman to make that effort?

[@BendiakM]

@@EnglishTMTB what kind of work? I look at the portraits and there is no makeup, no anything, except tons of cloths and jewelry, well maybe hairdos were tricky, but she wasn't doing them herself I presume.

[@caroline5576]

@@BendiakM there were a lot of weird beauty rituals women had to endure back then.

[@Lila-mq5qq]

She certainly had the best outcome!

[@ellebelle8515]

The true winner out of Henry VIII's former wives- Anne of Cleves. Smart woman, went out with her head and with dignity. Once again, you are an Amazing story teller of so many historic people and events.

[@GildaLee27]

No one protected her, even under her grandmother's own roof, from being used by unscrupulous men. Then she was blamed for what was done *to* her. Henry could have put her in a nunnery, or exiled her (after divorce). But no, she had to be killed to appease Henry's weak ego. Tragic. About that rumored assertion she made at the very end, that she'd rather be Culpepper's wife. Given how abusive her family was to her, all the trauma she'd been subjected to (including seeing her former lover's head on a pike), perhaps she did say it with full knowledge of the consequences they'd face in the hope of causing them to suffer, thereby getting vengance on them. Who could blame her if she did?

[@jayesimond9301]

No only that, but let’s face it, stating that she would have rather died Culpepper’s wife, was a big FU to Henry’s ego ;)

[@GildaLee27]

@@solangereyes2489 Define propaganda in the 16th century context we are discussing here. Also, at 28:03 "There are some who claim that Catherine used her scaffold speech to assert that she "died the wife of a king but would rather die the wife of Culpepper." *Unfortunately, this quotation and the claims surrounding it are a romanticization from later years.* Catherine had committed treason. Her family were implicated. Such a statement would have risked making her own fate and that of her family substantially worse." Which part of this is propaganda?

[@leanie9660]

I doubt that she had actually "seen her former lover's head on a pike". Her supposed lovers were executed in November. Heads were then boiled and tarred before being displayed. Katherine passed near the site in mid-February. Whike she may have had the heads pointed out to her (doubtful), she could not have recognized either of them.

[@venusangel222]

@@leanie9660 actually her lovers were executed on the 10th december 1541 so its very much likely she could recognize them.

[@sabbethroberts3674]

Unfortunately she was not alone , most women were used as such

[@leticiagarcia9025]

This poor child never had a chance. Her family failed to protect her from her abuser. She was not nurtured either. I think she was trying to find love and acceptance that she risked it. The sad truth is that she had no one on her side.

[@Angie2343]

Henry was willing to give her love and acceptance.

[@leticiagarcia9025]

@@Angie2343 Henry was a cruel tyrant. When he was married to Catherine of Aragon for a while they were happy. Being a king he felt entitled to stray no matter how happy his marriage was. He was a man of his time. Henry was a very superstitious and a suspicious man. He came to believe that Catherine and, Arthur consummated their marriage. He had his eye on Anne Boleyn. He wants a son. He scandalized Christendom to marry Anne Boleyn. Henry broke from the Church creating the Church of England. The Vatican excommunicated him. Anne failed to give him a son and, he had his eye on Jane Seymour. Cromwell used trump up charges to convict. Henry hired a swordsman from Calais to come and execute his wife. The arrest, the trial and, the execution were all made up before her arrest by Henry and Cromwell. This is a man incapable of caring and, love.

[@Angie2343]

@@leticiagarcia9025 I see.

[@GertiePants]

Victims who are groomed learn submissiveness. She submitted to Henry Maddox, Francis Dereham, King Henry VIII, and I believe, Thomas Culpeper. She was taught to "go along with it." I think that that submissiveness, the readily giving in, is apparent in her practicing with the block the night before her execution. She was yielding once again and trying to make the best of it. Even at the hour of her death, she wanted to please. That is classic submission by a victim.

[@morriganwitch]

I think the block in her room is a sign of someone who tries so hard to please xxx

[@rebeccaveitch9028]

And I think that’s why it’s so tragic. It’s almost childlike in its innocence. She didn’t want to appear foolish at her own execution.

[@morriganwitch]

Rebecca Veitch out of all the wives I feel the sorriest for her . No one deserved the treatment they got from him but she was blatantly groomed and then discarded xxx

[@kateh2007]

Dr Kat, as always I appreciate your humanity and empathy towards the victims of historical abuses. I see Katherine as a victim and just because the language wasn't available and victim blaming was even more prevalent than now, she must still have been so very traumatised by said abuse, add to that the violence of her step grandmother and the forced separation from Francis Dereham who she believed she would marry, she was already set up for her downfall. She had no clue that she would ever marry into royalty and I don't see how she can be held accountable for her previous PAST behaviour. She was very young and immature, badly educated and vulnerable imho. I don't understand why she entertained Culpepper though, it could be loneliness, immaturity or blackmail. She probably genuinely trusted him or was manipulated by him and Lady Rochford. Once she realised the perilous position she was in she must have been absolutely desperate and terrified. I agree about the block, I have no idea of what the psychology of spending the night with it means, it simply makes her story even more pitiful imho. The fact Henry Mannix got off completely free despite being the one to set this whole tragic story in motion makes me furious. Stay well❤

[@theproplady]

I thought Mannix had gotten off because he hadn't "gone all the way with her", just some pawing and kissing. Also, he ceased contact with her after she married the king so, no adultery charge. Doesn't make him any less of a jerk, though.

[@prettypic444]

Catherine always read more “messed up foster kid” than “evil seductress” to me. Maybe that’s why Henry was so different when it came to her execution- he knew deep down that he was the main beneficiary of the system that murdered her. It’s probably also society seems so determined to slander her, calling her a slut, trophy wife, or hedonist

[@pbohearn]

Exactly. And I could just see all her “loving” relatives who had nothing to do with her slithering to visit their beloved Niece/sister/cousin etc now their Queen! She was WAAAYYY out her league as Queen. She’d barely been at court, having a sheltered, but not protected, childhood “out in the country.” Cousin Anne came to court having done a tour of duty at the tres chic French court, full of charms, aesthetic interests and all the skills of the game of seduction she had learned in France. Catherine must have been pretty, but oh my, she was no Anne Boleyn. Overwhelmed and clueless. And to be Queen? That false sense of power and the flattery she received must have contributed to these lapses of judgment. And who could she confide in? She did what she knew. No one did her a favor and told Henry she was previously betrothed. Someone should have told him. BTW I wrote an essay on that mean step daughter, Mary, published on Medium, and also one on the current Queens Mom-in-Law, Princess Alice, a most fascinating person and life. Photos included! Check them out: link.medium.com/Xz7u4bBQ99, link.medium.com/e9FFGgEQ99

[@prettypic444]

Patrick Oh! I totally agree with you about everything, but I think ‘betrothal’ is too strong a word for what happened with Mannox and Dereham- they both preyed upon a young, venerable girl who nobody really cared enough about to stop them (my god, some estimates put Katherine as young as 11 or 12 for Mannox and 13 or 14 for Dereham- definitely statutory rape in our time). Both men were in significant positions of power over her, and yet Katherine received almost all the punishment for their actions. It’s no different than a modern foster child being abused by a teacher or assistant social worker On a much darker note, I think this is also what made Katherine a perfect wife for Henry. She’d been groomed from a young age, and so was the perfect balance of sexual and submissive for an aging, horn dog (excuse the term, but it’s the only one I feel really fits) king.

[@sheilalopez3983]

She was I'll used, at any rate.

[@edp3202]

she was a teenager also. a teenager! remember how we acted at that age. and you're married to a nutjob? Culpeper may have been the only real love she had ever experienced.

[@OdeInWessex]

@@pbohearn The stakes were so high for all concerned in those days that it seems in most cases all morality and sense of Justice goes out of the window. Life was very cheap for all concerned in the pursuit of money, power and influence. Poor Catherine got caught in the cross hairs of so many different vested interests the poor girl had no chance of holding her own in that environment. I feel nothing but helpless compassion for her and contempt for those who took advantage and abused her trust. Poor, poor girl.

[@RinaHendriks]

Anne of Cleves deserves more hype. She was so in control of her emotions. Impeccable.

[@Laramaria2]

Sometimes I think she just wanted some validation, to be loved by who she was and her desperation for approval was pure gold to her family's enemies...

[@birdbrain9625]

I believe that Katherine Howard ask to practice on the block because she wanted to prove to herself and the rest of the world that she could be just as brave and regal as any Queen that had ever sat on the throne before her even during death.

[@CISSY500]

It is illuminating how young Katherine Howard was as was Jane Grey. Very much manipulated by scheming families and older men.

[@prince6a]

My thoughts exactly

[@angryerika]

and were sadly put to death for it

[@revitalsela4063]

I see Katherine Howard as a tragic character, she was used as a pin in the game of her uncle and was abused since she was very young, sexually and emotionally. She knew nothing better than to use her physical charmes to some attention. She was so young, she didn't really know she was being used...

[@amyrat151]

She had no real parent her whole life. No one who wanted to protect her from the people who took advantage of her or taught Katherine how to recognize danger behind smiling faces.

[@BlackCatMargie]

I like the point you make about Henry's different reactions to being supposedly 'cuckholded' by two of his wives. The processes involved in the fall of Anne compared to Catherine were so different. Anne's fall took place so fast, and Henry moved right on, showing what a sham setup it actually was, but Catherines fall took months and every process of law was followed. Henry seems to have been genuinely shocked that such a thing could really happen, as if it never had before. I do feel very sad for Catherine, as I do for all of his wives. I dont believe any of them deserved their fates, and neither did the men who fell with Anne Boleyn. Horrific times!

[@dalehoward3704]

Horrific particularly for women(girls)!!!

[@christina3521]

And new process of law - since the break with Rome. He went out of his way with new treason laws to have her removed. See Gareth Russells’s book Young & Damned & Fair.

[@christina3521]

Hi - Culpepper also had a brother also named Thomas. 😮 From what have read no one knows who to pin the criminal activity on. But can you imagine if it was HIM? it is a vibe, that kind of behavior. Just viscous times.

[@BlackCatMargie]

@@christina3521 yes, I've read it. Excellent book on the rise and fall of Catherine, and also learned a lot about her family.

[@christina3521]

@@BlackCatMargie 🤗 don’t you just want to warn and save them all???!!! So much to know and study!

[@Utubekrakl76]

My married name is Katherine Howard. When I first married and became such, someone pointed out the fact that somone by that name was a wife of ‘ole Henry VIII. I had heard that but wanted to know more. That began one of my favorite pastimes. Historic reading and study, a pastime that I had previously no interest. I have been Katherine Howard for almost forty-four years now, and proud of it! Love your videos, Dr. Kat!

[@marymohr2799]

Yes! I love how you explained that Katherine was a victim, even if she wasn't viewed as such at the time. Just because society had a different way of viewing things and a different definition of right and wrong, doesn't mean the way people were affected by the tragedies and abuse they faced were different than today.

[@allisoncampbell1631]

I saw a video on KZbin, a lecture given by an Old man that tried to say that in her dealings with Mannox and Dereham she had the power and the upper hand due to her station in society..Like really? she was a CHILD...She was a naive girl who was used as a pawn by the Duke of Norfolk to regain position and prestige lost with the whole Anne Boleyn affair and it cost her life

[@lesleamoore7994]

I think about Ann of Cleves often when I watch historical videos,Her behavior after she is no longer the Kings wife specially. She would have made a great wife for him. She was very proper in her behavior, she was very accepting, she seemed to take great care to serve the court in the most proper way. He would have done much better with her.

[@amberbrown5359]

Agreed. I also feel Ann of Cleves, in the end, was one of the most political astute of Henry's wives. Though divorced she remained a favourite of the King, she was provided for and lived a relatively comfortable and stable life for a divorced and single women of that time. Though she is portrayed as plain and simple - in reality she was arguably smartest in the end. Anne did not have children with Henry so she didnt have to worry about the legitimacy of her children being threatened like Catharine A. And Ann B which I think afforded her some freedom. Just my thoughts

[@calamityjean1525]

@@amberbrown5359 I've always thought that Ann of Cleves was relieved to have gotten away intact from her smelly and bad-tempered husband, and that she might have actually felt sorry for Catherine Howard.

[@KatTheScribe]

@@amberbrown5359 Agree, that is my impression of Ann as well. She seems to be above the fray.

[@mornington2427]

Yes Ann of Cleves was the wisest of them all. I never understood why she was called ugly as from her portrait she looks very attractive. If its an incorrect rendition of her looks then surely Holbein would have been severely punished,

[@dumbdumb8526]

Carrie-Ann CeeUK also, the fact that Anna was allowed back into court afterwards too- she wasn’t very skilled at much from what I remember, and court was all about showing off? The only virtue she could’ve possibly had was being beautiful. Plus, she was called beautiful by everyone else, so they would’ve fallen out of favour for deception.

[@IntrepidFraidyCat]

Catherine's letter...she repeats several times how she wants to see or be with him. I'm not sure if it's because she's so young and not well educated in writing or because she's trying to convince HIM. Maybe she was being coerced??? I'm just not sure. But once again, Dr. Kat, you have me actually debating to myself what was truly going on. I've watched many other channels that cover these events and they never inspire me to rethink things from another angle. It's why I adore your channel!

[@sabsman100]

I love her storytelling skills. She's wonderful

[@montrelouisebohon-harris7023]

Catherine and Culpepper had been in love before she and the King got involved but after dereham was sent off to Ireland. When it was apparent the king wanted to marry Katherine Culpepper asked her not to but she did anyway.

[@hiswife2002]

I think the reason that Catherine Howard is so interesting is exactly because of the tragedy of her life. She was abused, abandoned and neglected by those who had the responsibility to adequately care for her, if not to treat her as a valuable member of their family. She was preyed on by sexual predators who used her without the power, or perhaps without even the will, to protect her from the harsh price that society demanded of girls and women who allowed themselves to be victims of sexual assault. I can't imagine the horror of being sold to an aging, insane, cruel, smelly and emotionally crippled old man in order to enrich your family. I can't imagine the terror, at the "mature" age 22, of being blackmailed with a traitors death for the crime of having been assaulted. I can't imagine the loneliness of having not one person invested in seeing you loved and protected. I can't imagine the trauma of her life or the need to accept that the only option left to her as regarded her life was to practice that last act of victimization.....be a good girl and put your head just so, here on this block, so it can be cut off in one fell swoop instead of hacking it at it when you jerk back in mortal terror. I feel pity for Henry's other wives, as well. They all, with the possible exception of Anne Boleyn, had little to no choice in marrying this horrible person. But I feel....almost angry about Catherine Howard because she was so victimized from day one.

[@camilledvorak7151]

Anne Boleyn was stalked and every bit as much a victim of Henry. "Come to me my pretty" "sure, when you marry me" Who would have thought he'd actually do it? Certainly not Anne. Yes, she was a bitch later to his daughter Mary, but how compelled would you be to be courteous to someone who called you a whore at every opportunity? Her profound error was deciding at some point that Henry wasn't the monster she originally thought him to be, with fatal consequences.

[@agelianaioannidou2913]

Beautifully said by both of you

[@camilledvorak7151]

@@agelianaioannidou2913 thank you for the compliment for my blunt and less than eloquent words.

[@lesleamoore7994]

After Anne Boleyn I think Henry began down an uncontrolled spiral a victim of his worsening mental health as the women whom he married. With Jane he suggested they have an affair. She basically told him in her reply letter that she would if she were married. Once Ann was on her way out, Henry married Jane. Had she lived it would not have mattered if she walked around with a bird in a cage in her hair, she would have been his most beloved. Henry was a megalomaniac by the time he married Howard. She had lack a proper education in the way to practice courtly love and would throw her favors at any man who took interest. She had two affairs before going to court. She was gasoline added to a fire. Henry would have married any women who agreed. He victimized both Cleaves and Howard. After Howard’s grandmother found her in the arms of a second man she just should have married her off to the first candidate acceptable.

[@obsessivefangirl5055]

I highly disagree with your statement regarding Anne Boleyn and how much choice she had in her marriage. Do you really think if Anne suddenly tried to end everything between them (and there are historical sources that claim that when the King's obsession with her was growing too much, she went away from court and to her family's house in the countryside, probably as a genuine attempt to end their "affair"). Do you really think if she refused to marry the king of England, he would have been totally cool with it and he would have been able to let it go? Like "sure, babe, if u don't wanna marry me that's cool. It's your choice". I'm not saying that Anne didn't enjoy being queen, or didn't even relish the possibility of it, or that she hated her power & status once she was queen, but honestly I doubt she could've ended their affair without endangering her and families' necks in either case. What Henry wanted, Henry got. It was that simple. So yeah, I believe Anne was as much of a victim of Henry as the other 5 wives. Especially considering she was completely innocent of all the charges laid against her for which she was beheaded.

[@elizabethjmiller8329]

While I recognize that we all must take responsibility for our actions, I believe Katherine Howard was essentially a child. I don’t think guile played any part here. I think she was silly, but fundamentally....childlike and innocent of manipulation but not of being manipulated. She’s the one of Henry’s wives for which I feel the most pity.

[@fleetskipper1810]

I think she tried to please everyone (not possible) because she’d been victimized her whole life and never knew any other was to survive.

[@melaniekeeling7462]

@@fleetskipper1810 As they say, pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

[@samanthafordyce5795]

@@fleetskipper1810 That's the best summation I've seen.

[@AN-tn8nw]

I love your nuanced and sensitive analysis Dr. Kat! I watched this video two days ago and keep thinking about it. There is a part in Katherine’s letter to Thomas Culpepper where she says something along the lines of “I pray you will remain as you have promised me” - and the first possible meaning for that that popped into me head is “I pray you will stay quiet” (about what he may know). I’m sure it could be read other ways but that is my thought. Katherine Howard has such a sad story and I am heartbroken that she is still villainized by some people.

[@julieblackstock8650]

all power and respect to Anne of Cleves. I wouldn't have been so dignified.

[@pamelaoliver8442]

I think she may have learned from Catherine of Aragon's lack of success...

[@kimberlybates6261]

I believe she was the only woman on Earth who got away with hurting his feelings and lived. I don't believe she was ugly at all. If that were the case. He would never had invited her to court as much as he did. Thinking language and cultural issues also may have played a part. I'm just theorizing.

[@kimberlybates6261]

Poor Catherine of Aragon. It wasn't her lack of trying. Poor women. Left to die in a cold castle. No wonder her daughter Mary was crazy. Her father was a lunatic

[@deborahbranham-taylor6682]

All respect to Ann of Cleves! The most rational, circumspect and probably one of the more intelligent of Henry’s wives. A woman who could “read the room” so to speak, and knew when to acquiesce in the face of a more powerful opponent or circumstances.

[@GullibleTarget]

@@deborahbranham-taylor6682 "..in order to get what we want. Not by stomping our feet but by allowing men to think they are in charge"

[@melanie7601]

I think the terribly upsetting thing about Katherine Howard asking to have the block brought to her so she could “practice” her own execution is how it glaringly illustrates how badly she just wanted to be good - even at being executed. Her desire to obey, to please, to do things right, was so strong that it even extended to wanting to go to her own death “properly” if you will. It’s heartbreaking because these desires, whether part of her natural personality or how she was raised, is likely how she got to be in the situation that lead to her own death - please Mannox, please Durham, make the family powerful, please the king, please Culpepper. She just seems to have wanted to make people happy.

[@hogwashmcturnip8930]

I think that is one of the best assessments of Katherine I have ever read. If she had lived now, she would have been an 'Authority child' because that is Exactly what t her upbringing was., Just because it was provided by some geriatric old dame of the Howard mafia makes no difference. They probably found it a way of dealing with her too. It seems that all the surplus, the wrong side of the blanket, the poor relations were palmed off on this old dear. a holding pen of the flawed, but still valuable, no doubt to be used if the circumstances required it. They must have thought all their cherries had lined up when Katherine caught the king's attention. A sensitive young girl, desperate for affection, would have been easy prey for all those men who used her.

[@meg1955]

The first time I've heard the comparison of Henry's attitude and mien upon Catherine's betrayal as opposed to the same upon Anne's circumstances. Thank you for that.

[@lorischauss7690]

Such a sad story. I agree that her practicing placing her head on the block adds to the horror of her story. It drives home how young she was . How awful to be forced into marriage with a terrifying king!

[@maiskitty]

I've always found her requesting the block, and spending her final night practising for her end, especially touching and upsetting as well. I think it's because this humanizes her - she's more than an historical figure, but a real person who had a very relatable emotional reaction. I could imagine myself doing the very same thing, if in her shoes. Over thinking, as anxiety takes over... needing SOME ounce of control... So very sad.

[@rachelmarshall6384]

I’ve just read ‘Young and damned and fair’ which is a fantastic account of Katherines life. Really well researched and explores the view that she was a far more intelligent young woman than she is given credit for usually. She had been in love with Culpepper before her marriage when she came to court but he only wanted an affair. I think she loved him never stopped and was at the start just wanting to be with him a person her own age , maybe flirt etc. But it became more and she got careless and carried away with the relationshipleading to their downfall.

[@mimitheblonde333]

Great point , also I believe Culpepper thought he could do much better than her before she married Henry as shes only an impoverished minor member of the Howard clan. When shes become Queen an ambitious Culpepper was only too happy to attach himself again to her. Henry didnt have much time left and to marry a Dowager Queen would be be a big deal for him

[@sandraclout2639]

I also read the book. Very good

[@moyrakeatings7878]

I just finished it last week, it's the definitive version for sure.

[@lynneperry7454]

Thank you for that sympathetic and interesting reading of her short life. This poor young woman never really had a chance.

[@madmonkee6757]

I guess it did sound a bit tinny (had a bit of an echo) at the beginning, but the good content of the video quickly drives away any concerns about the quality of the audio.

[@kel1559]

Often, because it is difficult to grasp the differences in culture from modern times compared to Tudor times, we measure a person based on what we think we would do, not understanding all the complexities that existed for a young woman such as Katherine Howard. I believe she was groomed and molested. Her behavior through all the time that came after fits the psychological norm and, due to the value of women during this time and especially during Henry's reign, she had to have felt powerless in almost all situations. There is so little proof of her actual personality but my imagination sketches a lovely young woman, average intelligence due to lack of education and youth, someone who may find her own self-worth in her connection to others, who basically had no choice in many or most of the important decisions of her life. I am not trying to cast her in the role of martyr. I am just trying to understand the person she must have been, taking circumstances into account. Hers is a sad story.

[@nessbowify]

When I was a teenager, and first became interested in the lives of Henry VIII and his wives, Katherine Howard was always my favourite. I think that's largely because she was closest to me in age, and I felt like I related to her a tiny bit. Like you, I have always found the image of her using her final night to practice with the execution block utterly chilling. Katherine's story is deeply sad, and I wish we had more information about her life to understand better the person she was.

[@dawnvickerstaff9148]

I read Katherine's letter as desperate and full of supplication. She was undoubtedly groomed and abused and continued to be taken advantage of when she ascended to the throne. She must have been deeply frightened and further traumatized by the her marriage to a man who could have been her grandfather, well, certainly her father. Henry VIII was dangerous. What choice did she have in any of the events that took place in her life. Poor girl. Doomed at birth by her sex.

[@beverlyfletcher4458]

I understood Culpepper was already at Court, assisting Henry, particularly in his illnesses. What a tragic figure she was; didn't stand a chance from her early life, let down by all those who should have cared for her. Really surprising the Duke of Norfolk survived Henry's reign! Great video, thank you.

[@micaelagauthier4964]

Because the Duke of Norfolk was a councilor to the King -and had been for a long time, he was trusted by the King- and he had probably sworn to the King that he had no knowledge of what Katherine had been doing and also had no part in her treasonous activities.

[@lauriealexander5857]

Henry's circle knew how sick he was and unstable, they got rid of Ann so I'm not shocked she got accused. They did not care about human life at all. It's all sad really.

[@montrelouisebohon-harris7023]

I agree because Henry had actually get his head several times before he had that job costing accident. He was suffering from horrible headaches long before the jousting accident in 1536. The English Court was always a bit of backstabbers and the same thing happened during Queen Elizabeth's reign. Queen Elizabeth did sign the death warrant for Mary Queen of Scots but she said she did not want Mary executed until she hand-delivered that execution warrant. Her advisor & Chief council member, William Cecil, took that warrant out of Elizabeth's desk & took it to the Executioner. Mary Queen of Scots was executed quickly and secretly without Elizabeth knowledge and Elizabeth was horrified after she found out about it. I think the main reason she was horrified is because she was petrified that every Catholic Nation surrounding them would attack.

[@merricat3025]

@@montrelouisebohon-harris7023 I think you would have cared about herself more than she cared about anybody else. Yes she wouldn't want the Catholic to attack because she will not endanger her position. I don't think she had some great love for Mary

[@namelia4439]

Poor Katherine...what an eternally tragic figure. Her whole life story just breaks my heart. That it all ended w her practicing how to lay her head on the block before her execution only magnifies her tragedy. It seems she spent her life being abandoned and being taken advantage of and being victimized over and over and traumatized again and again, and would’ve had to figure out how to cope w all of it and to compensate and even to survive all on her own...and I would say that she did the best that she could w what little she had at her disposal. In short, she was forced to raise herself under far from optimal circumstances. Katherine was not well educated, nor was she well looked after or cared for, nor did she have appropriate role models, nor did any adult seem to do right by her or help her or protect her, nor did she have anyone - at least not anyone who actually had her best interests at heart - in whom she could confide. Her actions and her responses to her different life situations seem very immature and careless, impulsive and irrational, not to mention dangerous (mostly to herself), and were those of someone w little adult or real world experience, nor any true guidance or wise teachings, upon which she could reflect or from which she could draw. She was young, true, but I do believe, based on what we know today, that those actions and responses were a direct result and reflection of the things - abandonment, abuse, neglect, sexual molestation and/or assault, etc - that she very likely endured beginning at a very young age. Since there was no awareness or acknowledgement or understanding of such things at that time, she certainly didn’t have the option of, or access to, any kind of therapy and may well have suffered from unknown and untreated anxiety and/or depression and/or ptsd in the bargain. When we see children (and other people) subjected to such treatment and abuse and trauma today, we do our best to punish the perpetrators of these heinous acts. Katherine was never afforded that luxury. She had to endure everything that happened to her - not to mention bear the unwarranted blame for some of it - and then had to suffer the harshest penalty and consequence of all while still practically a child when her actions and responses, being born of trauma and having gone untreated and uncorrected her entire life, landed her on the bad side of a mean, evil, self absorbed, narcissistic, ego and megalomaniacal tyrant w no compassion or empathy, who himself took advantage of a very young, very impressionable, and very damaged young woman. Today, Katherine would have had recourse and resources...unfortunately, she ended up w nothing more than the too small comfort of knowing how to place her head on the block. And, yes...that pathetic scene IS sickening and it IS a hard punch to the gut...and it is SO painful and just heartbreaking to think of that damaged, hurt, confused young woman - a mere girl, really - trying, as her last act, to at least get her own death right...and to ensure that she didn’t endanger the lives of disinterested family members who had abandoned her not once, but now twice. Even in her deepest, darkest, most painful and frightening hour of need, Katherine had nobody to take care of her or help her or protect her...she was, as she always was, left to fend for herself. Absolutely tragic.

[@nobodysbaby5048]

The tragedy is that you think it's different now.

[@maxiner4349]

Thank you for this, Katherine has such a tragic story. Xx

[@harrietlyall1991]

A superb presentation, Dr Kat, you show an exceptional degree of psychological insight, empathy and compassion for the actors in the gruesome tragedy which was the life and career of Queen Katherine Howard.

[@reinadegrillos]

In our eyes, Henry's marriage to poor Katherine is no more than grooming a child to abuse her. I think she did love Culpepper because it would be a normal thing to turn to a young, goodlooking and near boy to love and be loved by him, regardless of the dangers. Today's kings and royal families commit crimes and are not punished for them, so in Henry`s times, the sense of impunity for him would have been absolute. Excuse my English, I'm a Mexican living near Barcelona. I find very interesting and well documented all your videos, thank you, and keep them coming.

[@HavocSirin]

I agree. And please don't feel like you have to apologise for your english -- it is fantastic! It is an incredible thing to be multilingual :)

[@GildaLee27]

I agree. Her letter to Culpepper shows she was likely in love with him. And the trauma of her former lover being executed in such a painful & horrible way because of her, then seeing his severed head --- she must have felt terrified, guilty, abandoned, desperate. Poor thing. Whenever I think of her, I have to say a little prayer for her soul. Also, no excuse is necessary. Your English is very good.

[@reinadegrillos]

@@user-uk5mu1gv9z Thank you.

[@reinadegrillos]

@@HavocSirin Thank you.

[@reinadegrillos]

@@GildaLee27 T.hank you

[@minnesarah]

There are a lot of things I enjoy and appreciate about your channel Dr. Kat, but what I like best of all is how nuanced you are in your approach to dissecting history. You're fantastic, thanks so much for everything you do!

[@silversweet9211]

Its funny. Katherine Howard's song in "Six the Musical", and in it when it comes to Thomas Culpepper, she states that all she wants is someone to confide in, however all Thomas wants is sex with the queen. The emotional moment is portrayed by the other five queens touching her all over in the final moments of the song, as her voice raises in pitch as her violation is acted out. Sadly I think this captures Katherine's true feelings over her relationship with Culpepper.

[@peanut2006100]

Thank you for all your uploads. I’m from Austin, Texas and your accent is so wonderful! Your uploads are a favorite and I look forward to them. They keep away the Covid blues, entertains, and keeps us all thinking! Thank you!!

[@peanut2006100]

I’m so sorry for the poor grammar! Typing on my phone isn’t fun :)

[@ashtoneva4926]

Did anyone else think about All You Wanna Do from Six when watching this video? So young and had such a tragic life.

[@jbos5107]

You sound lovely no matter what mic you use. And you are lovely too. Thank you for making these videos. I really enjoy them.

[@POGGIOALSERE]

Hi Dr.Kat , So wonderful to see your upload today on Katherine Howard. I wanted to tell you though I think that the new KZbin advertising default is affecting your uploads because at least for me, I’m getting an advertisement about every 2 to 3 minutes, so by the time I’ve finished with your fabulous content, I’ve had to skip many adverts. I have read that there’s a way of changing your advertising default that other KZbinrs have had to do. I hope this is helpful and that you can check on it. In any case, it doesn’t dissuade me from listening to the end, even with all the advertisements. Thanks...a faithful viewer. 🤗

[@Jules-fl8yq]

POGGIOALSERE I had the same problem with the adverts. Very off putting when a jolly jingle suddenly interrupts a tragic story like this.

[@POGGIOALSERE]

Jules Evidently it is a new KZbin anomaly that many KZbinrs are facing without their knowledge until viewers make them aware. I know people who have KZbin channels that have had to reprogram their adverts and you must do this before every upload. That’s what I’ve been told, however I don’t have a KZbin channel so I’m just going on what I’ve read from other KZbinrs that have had this problem. Once it’s recognized it’s fixable and many KZbinrs are very apologetic and want to fix the problem for us viewers. It’s to get you and me to pay for a KZbin subscription without advertisements.

[@Erica-ye7kp]

@@POGGIOALSERE youtubers control how many ads there are. Period. I work on a channel. The more ads the more money. Except when you skip them she doesn't get paid for your view. She's making money. Can't say I blame her she had a new son

[@lspthrattan]

Fascinating! Thank you for putting all that together; it's not just facts and dates here, it's the connections, the storytelling, that really make your videos a great way to learn about history. You really have a gift. Keep'em coming! (and the mic problem wasn't that bad, btw :) )

[@annmorris2585]

Catherine Howard was a poorly brought up, ill-educated and borderline neglected young woman. Taken advantage of all the way and especially by her powerful Howard male relatives who saw opportunity for themselves when she caught the King's eye. My feeling is that her "dalliance" with Culpepper was expediency- try and get pregnant. It is, I think, fairly obvious that Henry wasn't able anymore, or not often anyway. I think poor Catherine was desperate and, don't forget, Anne Boleyn was her cousin. Catherine knew what could happen... she took a risk and forfeited her life. Poor young lady.

[@hogwashmcturnip8930]

But If she was hoping to get pregnant, surely that means the King, fat, smelly and repulsive as he was, must still have been able to perform? Or was she going to claim Immaculate Conception?

[@ginnysimpson5232]

Considering Henry's past history I am amazed that anyone would conspire with Katherine in her unfaithfulness. She was playing with fire but so were Culpepper and Lady Rochefort and neither of them were as naive as Katherine. The potential consequences were dire so what would entice them to collude with and even encourage her. As for the letter it might be interpreted much differently then. A love letter or intending friendship only, who can say?

[@BTScriviner]

Gareth Russell wrote an exellent biography of Catherine Howard titled "Young and Damned and Fair."

[@christina1wilson]

I watched the Worsley series on the queens--I found her presentation of K. Howard to be compelling and sad. Especially if she was on the younger side (less than 16 maybe) at the time of her marriage to the king.

[@greekre]

where is this series?

[@christina1wilson]

It might still be available on PBS.org in the passport section.

[@pamelaoliver8442]

I've always wondered what made Jane Rochford go along with this...maybe she wanted some sort of revenge on Henry and reveled in making a fool of him? She was an intelligent woman I believe, and much misaligned in our minds. ..

[@melaniesomes4235]

What a different way to see her, & how she handled herself. Thank you!!

[@graceogara2164]

I have always had the same reaction to the fact that she practised laying on the execution block. For me I find it so upsetting because it makes it so real and I have to acknowledge the fact that this was a real event that really happened to a poor teenage girl who was a victim her entire life :(

[@violetbell6550]

Dr Kat uplifts my lockdown once again...thank you! I think yours is one of the best summations I have heard on Katherine (Catherine?) Howard and there have been so many. I am glad to see all points properly considered and her not sensationalised as a vacuous oversexed teenager as per a particular well known male historian’s account of her short royal life. There are still so many who resist seeing things from a more considered point of view of the women. We will never know for sure about Culpeper but a man with a record such as his would have been hard for a young woman to deal with, particularly one whose background may have had some early manipulation in it that we would term as grooming -it could have triggered patterns in her behaviour. I acknowledge the modern slant in this. My own personal opinion is that there is a good chance that letter was a vulnerable and frightened woman placating a dangerous man for her own safety. Many women even today know that this is sometimes the only way to survive. His possible knowledge of her prior life would have given him sway over her. I can see why others may think otherwise I just don’t see her as simply a write off as the stupid nymphomaniac she is sometimes given to be. For me there is some dignity in her manner at the end and on her execution. I think the early confrontation of the block may have been to face the fear to then be more calm upon the actual event. To in some small part take some sting out of it?? All of this is of course only my thoughts. I enjoy reading all of those in the comments. Thank you Dr Kat stay safe.

[@eloisewalsh7139]

Such an interesting video!! I really liked the point about Henry’s behaviour with the execution of Anne and Katherine

[@sharondreisbach4445]

So happy to see your upload today! Its a bright spot in my day. Your voice and delivery style makes listening a pleasure no matter the content. Have a fabulous day!!

[@owendraper1491]

Simp

[@beverlyfletcher4458]

Yes, so clear and understandable.

[@victoriakmartin]

I read Young and Damned and Fair by Gareth Russell recently (such a great book) and have become very fond of Catherine Howard as a result. I do however think that the idea of her as a victim takes away some of the agency she clearly used. While no doubt she was mistreated and used by the people around her, she also was perfectly happy to throw her own weight around and she certainly seems to have used the fact that she was of higher rank than Mannox to her advantage. Also Russell states that the story about Culpepper assaulting a farmer's wife/murdering the farmer may not actually be about the same Culpepper who was involved with the Queen, as IIRC he had a brother or cousin who was also named Thomas. I'm particularly curious about the fact that neither Culpepper nor Catherine ever admitted to actually sleeping together. Catherine certainly admitted to many other things and it makes me wonder if she was telling the truth about this.

[@Katielady329]

Thank you for putting words to the difficult concept of applying the impact of sexual trauma on people who lived in a time where women were expected to submit to sex and men without question.

[@rebbekahcannons9805]

Her letter to me sounded like two things, like she was just lonely and wanting to talk with a friend who really knew (or she thought maybe) her and that she was also hoping to keep him silent for both theirs and others sakes.

[@Juliannasstudio]

Everyone knows Anne Boleyn, but I find KHs story to be the most haunting. If she’s still in the Haunted Gallery, I hope she can find peace.

[@ferociousgumby]

Here is why I think K and Culpepper were lovers, or at least passionately attached to each other: "it makes my heart die to think what fortune I have that I cannot be always in your company." That phrase "makes my heart die" is more powerful than any "darlings" she could write. It's so starkly physical. The tone of the letter indicates a craving for his presence which goes far beyond any manipulative motivation. This is just my take on the matter! K obviously had fairly simplistic writing skills, but that phrase "it makes my heart die" leaps out at me. This strikes me as a physical yearning for him, not just playing court games. Of course physical yearning is infinitely stronger when it isn't consummated.

[@maxingham9139]

I think the block practice was to help her imagine, easing the transition which would become reality.

[@amberbrown5359]

Mmmmm. I very much enjoyed your analysis on Catharine Howard. I felt Catharine is often portrayed as a frivolous harlot who used her charms to seduce the King for material and social gain - at least in the Tutors. I feel Catherine epitomizes "victim blaming" with respect to how she was perceived after she was taken advantage of by various aggressive and predatory men - including Henry VIII. Was Catharine really empowered enough and in a social position to say "no." I feel it is a bit ironic that 2 cousins were married and executed by the same King for adulteress affairs. Also, this point is more related to the popularity of womens names in the 1500s, but Henry divorces a Catharine to marry an Ann then later divorced an Ann to marry a Catharine. Rest in peace sweet young Catharine. 💐👑🏰

[@cathyvice1971]

Yes! The practicing with the block always deeply disturbed me. Was she truly this insecure that she was “practicing” so as to not embarrass herself or her family?? She is my “favorite” wife of Henry VIII because her story is so sad and tragic.

[@kathydunai6332]

Don't forget that Henry could joke after Anne Boleyn's demise because he had a new love to go onto; when he didn't after Catherine's execution. However he organised Lyme to be thrown over Catherine's body to destroy/ obliterate her completely (which didn't happen to Anne). Interestingly also, so much is written about what Anne wore to her funeral- but nothing about Catherine, who was a style leader before her demise. It's like she was already forgotten when she was executed.

[@made-line7627]

Do you mean Anne's beheading? Not funeral?

[@cullisgate]

Fantastic job, as always. I'm reading a book about Henry VIII's wives and they're all so unfortunate but I've gained a newfound level of sad respect for Katherine Howard lately and this was just the cherry on top. Thank you for sharing your knowledge, Dr. Kat.

[@pattihuke2992]

Thanks from Canada 🇨🇦 for a great video. As well as you humanitarian view on Katherine Howard. What a said life, with no one to turn too.

[@annwilliams6438]

I always wonder whether Catherine and Lady Rocheford we’re desperately trying to ensure that she had a child because it was obvious to them by this stage that the King would not be the one doing the seeding. Culpepper then became her love and Lady Rocheford was drawn in deeper and deeper.

[@rachelavincent]

It's interesting that she uses the formal "you" in her letter to Culpepper, rather than the informal "thee", it's something we might miss as a modern audience but perhaps should be paid some attention?

[@lisw85]

Thanks Dr. Kat. So excited to discover your channel. You present topics in an unbiased perspective and humanize figures in history, which I feel most historians lack. Your visual are wonderful and appreciate you don't rush. It was wonderful to dive into Katherine Howard as she is often quickly dismissed. I thought it was especially important to show her has a victim of society and so interesting that in fact she wasn't madly in love with Culpepper but maybe lonely or trying to appease an important courtier. Look forward to your new videos and catching up with others in the archives!

[@ladyfarrahtarot]

Thank you so much for your outlook. I have tried to find interesting stuff about her but so little is known. I loved it. Hope you make one about Elizabeth Woodville!

[@elizabethraitanen5057]

Thank you for your sympathetic analysis of the tragic life of this very young woman.

[@christopherseton-smith7404]

I think one has to have a heart of stone not to be moved by the figure of poor "silly" Catherine Howard; and I'm not sure I even mean "silly"; just terribly young, and used and abused throughout her short life, by people who otherwise should have taken care of her. I always understood that the step-grandmother's oversight was somewhat lax, and her household somewhat ramshackle, and Mannix was a footnote creep in the pages of history I think Dr Kat's comments about groomers quite apt; I recall one of my history masters commenting that human nature doesn't change overmuch throughout the centuries, as we galloped through two years of a medieval history A-level forty years ago, and what was likely to motivate us or not, would have motivated the people who inhabit the past, for good or ill, however eminent they were supposed to be. Who now, in their right mind, would have wanted to have been on the hamster wheel of court life in the reign of Henry VIII? Like a fairground ride without the safety features.

[@deborahbranham-taylor6682]

If we had lived then, most of us would have been peasants. When people ask me who I was in a past life, I tell them a swineherd’s daughter! 😆 Truly no one today would want to be anything higher than some low status gentry in that era. They probably schemed and offed each other whenever possible also for position and gain.

[@christopherseton-smith7404]

​@@deborahbranham-taylor6682 I do so agree with you. I've never understood the estimates that millions of us are supposedly descended from Edward III; arithmetic I can cope with, but mathematical calculations of geneology quite beyond me. I'm sure far more of us are anonymously ancestored, and along with John Ball's peasants, "When Adam delved and Eve span, who was then the gentleman?"

[@unicornreality1771]

I think she was just very young and totally out of her depth, surrounded by predators (including the king). Sadly it seems she never had a friend or mentor who could help her

[@mesamies123]

Another excellent and thoroughgoing video, Dr. Kat. Thank you. You have given voice here to someone who has been rendered voiceless in more ways than one. This young woman - not unlike the young Elizabeth - was clearly used and abused by those around her, particularly men, at a young age. The psychic scars and the trauma that she carried could lead to nothing good for her. Henry, not a well person himself psychologically, is just another man in the long procession of men who used and abused her. He, of course, ultimately kills her, which caps the hideous tragedy. She suffers and dies because men and their accomplices want to use her as an object. She never had the time or the capability of growing into an adult and a subject. This is how sex abuse works, and still today so many victims of sex abuse have no one to whom they can talk and no way to make sense of the world- to heal. It is a disgusting business, and it has always been going on and unless we change it will always go on, and girls, women, some boys, and even some men will continue to perish in the lascivious hands of rapists and oppressors.

[@oraenaytzadah8967]

Amazing videos, thank you. The reason why the queen asked for the block to be brought to her room the night before her execution is probably the idea that placing the neck “wrong” on the block would make her execution more painful or / and longer. Perhaps it was a way to deal with her fears and anxiety ahead of the facts and to be somehow proactive in trying to get it done as fast and painless as possible.

[@judyw5584]

Catherine Howard I see as the saddest and most exploited of all H8 consorts. Pathetc figure of an exploited youth. Go as far as seeing her as a child of trafficing. Excruciatingly painful to think of what happened to this girl

[@veenapaulson4934]

Delighted to have found you! Always fascinated by Henry and his wives. And I always learn something new, when I listen to you. Great soothing voice and you are a lovely person. Thank you for your investigations and hard work.

[@carrieswank]

I do not think she was having a physical affair with Thomas, but an emotional affair; which is an affair, none the less. Katherine was a queen, but she was still a very young woman. She was young, lonely and bored being married to a smelly, sickly man, so she looked for companionship in Thomas. It’s a very sad story.

[@louise-yo7kz]

One can't blame her.

[@ButterflyEars60]

Firstly, I have to say again that I really enjoy your deep thinking on the subjects you cover. You do such a great job of bringing forth various aspects and possibilities. I always eagerly await your next video! I feel Katheryn was indeed abused and used. She would have been traumatized by what happened, as well as left emotionally stunted, by her experiences with her father and step grandmother. I feel she was emotionally unfulfilled. But it sounds as though she could have been blackmailed by her former "friends" as well. Either way, she was so young and hadn't had the upbringing to deal with her situation. Deeply sad.

[@irena4545]

I recall hearing/reading that the man who raped the commoner and killed her husband was a different Thomas Culpeper, but it's been a long time, so I don't recall the reasoning, I'm afraid. Is this just a wild theory, or is there any meat to it? A great observation of Henry's reaction to Anne's and Catherine's respective affairs - it further solidifes that Anne was a victim of judicial murder and the accusations against her were unsubstantiated. Served Henry right, to be on the receiving end for a change - if only it wasn't for the collateral damage of Catherine's life :-( I always had an impression that being so young and raised to such a high position from her rather humble background, she didn't really stand a chance, she lacked the education, the savviness, perhaps even the strength of will... She was doomed from the very beginning, poor girl.

[@MissMarquise]

why are you afraid?

[@GildaLee27]

@@MissMarquise That is a common English expression, like "pardon me." She is not saying she literally fears something. She is just saying she doesn't quite remember the details.

[@jenniessamsung3958]

im pretty sure thomas had an older brother with the same name and these two got mixed up. at least thats what i found on wikipedia.

[@ladyliberty417]

Hi Dr. Kat! Your description of Henry at the time Katherine married him explains vividly why she would have been so vulnerable to the attention of other (young) men, Who was there to befriend and guide her wisely? So sad, it is painful to think about, I understand your feelings here🥰 Stay well❣️

[@racheloneil9173]

Listening to Dr. Kat is fascinating but also just a wonderful voice and explanation of things, I will never get tired of listening!

[@OzGirl11]

I always choke up when I watch the scene in the Tudors, where Catherine is dancing while locked up. I feel sorry sad for this young girl, she was taken advantage of by older man. The poor thing didn't know any better.

[@kevindavis5966]

No worries, I would read lips or subtitles if that was the only way I could view your content. Keep up the great work!

[@jamieyoho2310]

Thank you for this. History is very unkind to Catherine Howard. Notice her grandmother caught her in an embrace twice, coincidentally. In reality she was probably getting caught on purpose so that her grandmother could protect her from those men without it getting back to her the wrong way. I never did hear the interpretation of her letter to Culpeper being a placating one.

[@faefolkarts]

That letter sounds more like she's looking for a friend than anything else...

[@greekgeek6346]

Catherinee Of Aragon has it worst

[@faefolkarts]

@@greekgeek6346 may I ask you what in my comment made you think of that? This isn't Six. This is actual history that we're trying to understand. The language within the letter makes it sound like she wanted a friend, but all the men in her life just wanted her for pleasure. And even so, trauma isn't a competition and shouldn't be treated as such. Debating who had it worse is pointless because all six wives had their own unique and terrible experiences. There's no comparing different traumas and who had it worse.

[@babablacksheepdog]

Perhaps she was looking for a friend, she certainly seems to have been lonely. But the language in the letter sounds to me like she is addressing someone she has romantic feelings towards. I honestly wouldn't blame her. She was just a teenager, who was suddenly thrust into a loveless marriage to an old disgusting creep, a marriage she had no choice but to accept. Then a handsome young man comes along, and he shows some interest in her. Had she been older and wiser, she could have waited it out like Katherine Parr (meaning she could have waited until the decrepit Henry inevitably died, and married someone she liked then), but alas she was young, naive and impulsive.

[@greekgeek6346]

Ace Pixie Ik I watch documentaries about this I’m just saying she had I worst so calm tf down

[@greekgeek6346]

Ace Pixie and I get she was lonely (Katherine Howard) but ok this is not a debate centre so chill out

[@Thepourdeuxchanson]

Another clear presentation of known facts, but also informed opinion that is clearly presented as opinion or speculation. Some presenters don't seem to draw the line between the two like this lady does. Excellent as usual.

[@memyselfi8461]

This is one of the best historical channels ever. You're brilliant !

[@stacihensley7533]

I can't believe how much Scarlett Johansson resembles Catherine Howard, based on this portrait! I too believe Catherine was a victim. Love your channel!

[@vikkiwinfield1377]

Thank you!! The more I have learned about Catherine Howard, the more I feel for her and her tragic life.

[@janvan113]

Thank you Dr. Kat, for researching Katheryn for those of us who don't have the resources. I'm glad you clarified the matter of Katheryn's speech before her death. It seems unlikely that she would have uttered the words "rather die the wife of Culpeper" in plain public view. It would have been a very dangerous statement to make. Even given her youth, I don't think she would have said that. I think it's possible that someone, at some point during her incarceration, might possibly have heard her utter a sentiment similar to that, in private. She may have said such a thing, under the circumstances, and then over the centuries it became her "scaffold" speech through hearsay and speculation. It is quite gut wrenching to think of that poor young girl practicing with the block overnight, knowing she was to die the next day. The letter is very difficult to decipher, since there is more than one interpretation of what her words could have meant. It seems on the surface she is longing for him, and pledging herself to him. On the other hand, as was pointed out, she didn't really use any terms of endearment. It is a little baffling, and would take much study to come to any real conclusions about what her intent was. Historical figures are very distant from the modern world, and much is lost over the years. But you bring so many people into the present, not only to examine what really happened, but to see them as real people. They were as real, in their time, as we are today, and sometimes their sufferings were immeasurable. I have personally never seen anyone who brings them to life as well as you do.

[@Anita-rq9ev]

Hello Dr. Kat. Very interesting topic and the sound was good too. Thank you

[@charliesworldx]

During lockdown I have recently discovered your channel and I cannot tell you how much I love it! I’ve always loved modern history but since watching your video I’ve developed a new love for the Tudor period. Thank you! ❤️

[@Glorindellen]

I question just how recognizable the heads were, they were dipped in pitch to prevent them from rotting, weren't they?