Dragon Ball Z Theory - Movie Timeline Placements

[@Akjayy74]

23:28 back when everyone still called beerus "bills"

[@BurmudaTriangleTV]

I forget what language it is, but I know that Beerus' translated name is Bills. Kinda like how Freeza is still Frieza

[@patrickray5692]

it wasn't wrong tho.

[@theresaalgeri7130]

patrick ray yes it was

[@SuperiorIronman98]

Bills is better than Beerus.

[@ZeroDividedByZero]

@Space Bear Wait wouldn't Birusu be "Bills"? pls explain I feel like the answer is super easy and I'm just retarded...

[@FinneyGames_BBG]

In Japan they probably would go to school if the world was ending

[@QaamansLand]

RastaManFinney why?

[@FinneyGames_BBG]

Qaamans Land It was a stereotypical joke, probably not funny in hindsight lol

[@hatakuu]

RastaManFinney I laughed.

[@FinneyGames_BBG]

hatakuu yay!

[@AbdouSefiani]

RastaManFinney The sad thing is that you're probably right.

[@EnigmaGameMaster]

6:58 "Near the conclusion of Goku's *five minutes* fight with Freeza" XD

[@maripozadeayer]

Enigma ..... .. .

[@Renzgill670]

E

[@GamefreakRX]

I've always seen Super Android 13 occurring in the unseen timeline, the one where cell doesn't exist and the z fighters kill or deactivate the androids a different way (never mentioned how). It makes more sense time wise and that no one would have entered the time chamber

[@D_Abellus]

In all honesty all these movies could have happened in the unseen timeline.

[@React2Quick]

ShadowJoey777 basically all the movies before Son Goku & his friends return, Battle of Gods and Resurrection F are more considered what if scenarios

[@Devilofdoom]

+GamefreakRX That's exactly what I thought. Super Android 13 fits that timeline perfectly. +SadowJoey777 That's true, except of coarse the first few that occur in the era common to all timelines (Before Trunks First Appeared).

[@UniVS427]

Meta Cooler could fit that timeline as well

[@blessedxxiii5583]

GamefreakRX yeah bro agree💯

[@haircafekevin]

I like to think of Dead Zone as more of the final Dragonball movie as opposed to a DBZ movie.

[@himmothyyy]

me too but the animation is more Dbz than db

[@SuperSonicWarrior93]

I kinda thought the same thing. I also sometimes think of Garlic Jr. as Emperor Pilaf's long-lost cousin.

[@himmothyyy]

i always thought the same too they even the same voice actor

[@guswindsor8842]

People were trying to get their kids into schools while Cell was terrorizing the world because Mr. Satan already announced he was going to fight Cell and everyone believed he is Earth's strongest and he would beat Cell no problem. Moral of the story: Don't put your much faith in Satan, because whe you do.. ehh well you saw the fight between him and Cell..

[@pokehunterhd]

Gus Windsor what about goku and chichi?

[@Nikketmzee]

Movie 10 is a timeline where vegeta kills buu with the explosion. That's why the kids didn't know the fusion and why vegeta's not there. Because he's dead,

[@MisterW99]

Can someone tell me who that is at 0:56

[@magalybenitez6255]

+Prime Gaming That's Android 13

[@superbuu4925]

Akira Toriyama does not want Goten and Trunks to grow up.

[@bigginger7417]

+Ex Novus it should have been gohan seeing how gohan was supposed to be the main character

[@Jiron127]

That's not true. Buu hasn't even debuted yet. M10 is an amalgamation of various timelines. It's own, being a direct sequel from m8. M9 after the defeat of cell. The original timeline after gohan beat cell. Vegeta isn't present because originally after gohan beat cell, vegeta stated because of his pitiful performance and the death of his chief rival goku, he'd never fight again. M9 follows that trend as well. By having gohan be the main hero and vegeta "originally" not intending to fight again. M10 continues the "what if" gohan remained the main hero on earth and continued to train. Vegeta has given up fighting in this continuity and won't appear. Don't know why piccolo isn't there. That's why, gohan in m10 has his training gi on and has mastery over ss2. Akin to the later buu arc ss2 goku/vegeta. Obviously this continuity explains why goku is still dead. Why unlike in m9 when he broke the rules to interfere, he had to be wished there for a moment.

[@DenniDownBad]

This is a Top 2 Qaaman Video in my eyes. 8 years later and it still holds up so well.

[@QaamansLand]

My editing and narration wasn't as developed back then though

[@DenniDownBad]

@@QaamansLand That may be true to a certain degree but the topic at hand was very interesting nonetheless especially back then

[@ColeTrainPhenomenalcrew]

Most of his videos from 10 years ago still hold up excellent. Although editing ain’t as good as today. His quality is still amazing

[@ChibiAlly]

Bulma probably lied about her age. I wouldn't put it past her...

[@samueljackson3512]

ChibiAlly "She's been 37 for 10 years now"

[@The_Big_Jay]

23:24 Gohan never lost his ability to go super saiyan in Z, it was stated that his "Mystic" power was so great that if he were to go super saiyan, it wouldn't make much difference

[@StevenJones851]

Glad he didn't

[@giodawg45]

such a throwback. your channel has always been an awesome source of dragon ball knowledge

[@QaamansLand]

Thanks brother

[@lightyearpig12]

16:43 Gohan: Mr. Piccolo? Krillin: HA, gotcha! Gohan: Wait wha........... Krillin: I thought dressing up as someone else would make me stronger, so here I am. Gohan: Y'know, disguising as Piccolo won't make you more powerful. Krillin: Dangit! (Krillin Owned Count: Too many to count)

[@Young_BZ]

He finally stops dressing like Goku and now this.

[@BigIsaac91]

What the...? Did you re-upload this? There's a simple reason why Goku and Gohan didn't seem much stronger than Vegeta and Trunks in the first Broly movie - they were all getting eclipsed by Broly so much throughout the entire fight that the difference didn't shine through.

[@QaamansLand]

yeah check the annotation in the beggining. KZbin took my video down so I just reuploaded it since I have the project saved. Luckily they didnt give me a stike.

[@NeroPiroman]

Qaamans Land what about Qaaman's Timeline Placement Analysis Of Dragon Ball Z specials????

[@RokaSoka]

Bosniantoptens I agree, he should do a video on the specials and OVA' (Plan To Eradicate the Saiyans) just like he did with the movies in this video.

[@NeroPiroman]

RokaSoka what does ova mean?

[@RokaSoka]

Original Video Animation.

[@johnsmith-tq5zn]

Timeline 1 (Cell's Timeline) -Bardock Special -Bardock goes to the past and creates Timeline 6 -Movie 1 -Saiyan Saga -Freeza Saga -Goku kills Freeza and Cold -Movie 5 (Coola is killed) -History of Trunks -Trunks goes to the past and creates Timeline 2 -Trunks returns from the past and is killed by Cell -Cell goes to the past and creates Timeline 3 Timeline 2 (Unseen Timeline) -Timeline 1 Trunks kills Freeza and Cold -Movie 5 (Coola survives) -The Z-Fighters deactivate the Androids -Movie 7 -Timeline 1 Trunks goes back to his timeline -Movie 6 Timeline 3 (Main Timeline) -Cell hides underground -Timeline 1 Trunks kills Freeza and Cold -Movie 5 (Coola is killed) -Androids Saga -Movie 8 (Broly is killed) -Cell Games -Timeline 1 Trunks goes back to his timeline and creates Timeline 4 -Movie 9 -Buu Saga -Movie 13 -Tapion goes to the past and creates Timeline 5 Timeline 4 (Trunks's timeline) -Trunks kills the Androids and Cell Timeline 5 (Tapion's Timeline) -Timeline 3 Tapion saves Konac -Movie 8 (Broly survives) -Cell Games -Movie 9 -Fat Buu is killed, either by Vegeta's suicide or by SSJ3 Goku -Movie 10 -Movie 11 -Movie 12 Timeline 6 (Bardock's Timeline) -Episode of Bardock -Timeline 1 Bardock dies of old age -Bardock Special -Movie 1 -Goku arrives in time to fight Vegeta and Nappa -Movie 2 -Movie 3 -Movie 4

[@saorlathesurly]

In my opinion, most (if not all) of the movies take place in alt. timelines, for instance; Movie 1 - Like you said, can fit into canon almost perfectly well. Movie 2 - Takes place in an alt. timeline where Goku arrived earlier and prevented Piccolo from dying, killing off Vegeta. Movie 3 - Takes place in the same timeline. When they went to Namek, Goku took down the Ginyu force and went up against Freeza, killing him in his First Form with Kaioken. They then resurrected Tenshinhan, Yamcha & Chaozu. Movie 4 - Movie 7 all take place in the same timeline as 2 & 3. Mainly just as an alternate progression of the series. Movie 8 - Takes place in an alt. timeline where Super Vegeta actually killed Semi-Perfect Cell. When Goku & Gohan emerged from the Room of Spirit & Time, they just simply stopped training up their SSJ forms because they didn't need it. Movie 9 - Like you said, can fit into canon almost perfectly well. Movie 10 & 11 - Takes place in the same timeline as Movie 8. Movie 12 - Takes place in an alt. timeline where Gohan killed Super Boo, so Goku & Vegeta stayed dead. Movie 13 - Like you said, can fit into canon almost perfectly well. Movie 14 - Is canon.

[@gloriouspurpose_]

I'm sure if Akira Toriyama saw all of this he would laugh his head off. Everyone's making ways to figure out the plot, while he admitted to just winging half of the story. It can barely be considered canon itself lol

[@Patx89]

In movie 2 we saw a scene from the dragon ball series. The scene when piccolo protect gohan of the ki blast of nappa. But maybe goku give him senzu beans just before he dies. So he arrived like one minute earlier.

[@demonobat7749]

@@miguelvillanueva2849 Ok

[@nexusshark]

I can forgive the issues in Cooler's revenge, because Gohan really could've grown another tail in the gap and it doesn't look that major to me anyway. As for the Super Saiyan thing, that could be fallen into the writing cathegory. Goku doesn't imidiately go Super Saiyan in later movies either. And Gohan even goes so far to fight normal Super Saiyan BROLY, while being in BASE FORM. In Bojack Unbound Gohan also doesn't go Super Saiyan 2 at once either, eventhough he has shown that he can in the series. So I view Goku's struggle becoming a Super Saiyan in Cooler's Revenge as a climax writing gimmick used constantly throughout the later movies, because Toei likes to drag things out and keep the best for the climax. As for Battle of Gods, it was made to be part of the official DBZ story, so that movie is supposed to fit in the timeline. However, aside from the inconcistencies you've pointed out, there might be another more or less major inconsistenciy, which goes together with the aging. WHERE IS BULLA?????? Videl is pregnant with Pan, and we know for a fact that Bulla is a little older than Pan, so she should've been a baby. Unless Toryama wants to dismiss that DBZ ending along with GT and continue the story from where the Buu arc ended. That's the only way it makes sense and I cinda hope that's the case.

[@kingjesterxii3963]

nexusshark bulla wasnt born yet cause shes younger than pan

[@Saint0999]

nexusshark ye fax. Cooler even said " so this is the power u used to destroy my brother" so this guy dumb af

[@obiwankenobi1608]

This comment didn't age well...

[@nexusshark]

@@obiwankenobi1608 Speaking of aging, DB characters age either very slow or very fast.

[@jackthegreek6092]

Plot twist: The non-canon movies have their own storyline and fit in perfectly with each other!!!

[@Judgementkiryu]

Re-watching this for nostalgia. You should totally re-do this vid!

[@TheAdamusPrime]

I always imagine that most of the movies, are all parts of their own parallel universes, which would explain major plot differences, so particular event's are different in these universes.

[@dannylopez5976]

Always good to revisit these old Qaaman videos. Old mic quality, young sounding Qaaman. Live on Questions and Answers Man.

[@QaamansLand]

What do you think of the newer videos?

[@omegashinobi]

I think gotten and trunks take after goku and vegeta more, since pure blood saiyans don't age fast (remember goku was 15 during the king piccolo arc but he looked YOUNGER then gotten and trunks)

[@Darkblender5]

When Vegeta was five, he looked younger than Goku. lol

[@bm4604]

i almost fogot about sayain slow age ing. But gohan aged just fine tho. It was a plot hole on goten and trunks stating the same

[@omegashinobi]

Gohan takes more after his mother, so he may simply grown faster. (Through most of DB chichi was taller then goku)

[@rbraunbeck96]

Also, it's next to impossible to determine someone's age in an anime

[@ssgoku7192]

Oh course goten looks like Goku

[@tim9119]

i like all of the movies whether there canon or not i honestly dont care its an old argument and pointless

[@SuperSonicWarrior93]

THANK YOU! Finally, somebody besides me thinks this is a stupid argument. When I marathon Dragon Ball Z, I include everything.

[@SuperSonicWarrior93]

Plus. I'd like for the next movie to be The Revival Of Turles. Either him, or Dr. Wheelo, or a 4th Broly film.

[@tim9119]

sonic1234529 i would love to see a fourth Broly movie

[@SuperSonicWarrior93]

And if they do, they would have to keep the tradition of having American heavy metal rock songs playing in the background. Hell, all the future Dragon Ball Z movies need to go back to that style, and Bruce Faulconer as musical director (plus an extended version of his DBZ theme music as well). Also, if there were a 4th Broly film, I'd like for Broly to go Super Saiyan 3. I'd also like for Turles to go Super Saiyan as well. And for Goku to own Vegeta in a fight this time.

[@mechaocean170]

+Shadow316 Yeah, I'm pretty sure Toriyama said to see them as side-stories anyway and IN MY OPINION, fans have to accept that they're just other DBZ stories. If we only had CANON movies, then all we would have is BOJACK UNBOUND and WRATH OF THE DRAGON (and Battle of Gods and Resurrection F depending on if you accept DB Super more now) and I'm pretty sure that would kind of suck for DBZ fans. Let's just enjoy the movies as seeing more adventures with Goku and the gang outside of the DBZ canon where they're sometimes separated from each other for long periodos of time.

[@extremelegendsupreme4596]

Definitely a top 3 best qaaman video ever.

[@thereviewersblock7459]

Movie 1: I always had in my headcanon that Kami erased the memories of everyone involved and as such Krillin wouldn’t remember meeting Gohan and Goku and Piccolo wouldn’t remember Gohan’s powers. Movie 2-4:yeah these one wouldn’t fit in canon. Movie 5: Goku’s tail grew multiple times throughout Dragonball, and Gohan’s tail grew back again in Z. Seeing as how it really isn’t a major plot point (except for Cooler’s men grabbing him but the tail), I could disregard it and put it in between the 3 year gap. As for Goku going SSJ, I chalk that up more to wanting a tension filled climax, that and Goku doesn’t like going all out from the beginning. Movie 6: Although Vegeta is a SSJ in the movie, the only character who saw him transform was Goku and when he transformed himself in front of the androids and z-fighters, Goku was out of commission. This could fit in the final years of the 3-year gap. With the z-fighters nor Goku mentioning Vegeta becoming a SSJ. The new namek plot point does create an issue though. Movie 7: can’t fit the timeline. Movie 8: In between Cell games gap. Goku and Gohan May have been scolded by ChiChi about being SSJs since she was going to a school meeting. She would obviously want her husband to be as presentable and normal as possible. As for the other people, I’m sure they would believe Mr.Satan would be able to handle Cell. For the final point, you could just say that Broly overpowered all of them that Goku and Gohan’s strength didn’t make a difference. Movie 9: absolutely could be canon, Trunks could’ve gone back just to reunite and chill with his friends. I’m sure chichi told the gang about being pregnant prior. Movie 10: Apart from Piccolo and Vegeta not being there, it fits pretty well. I’d say it could be canon. Movie 11: absolutely no way that Goten and Trunks would mess around with 18 fighting Bio-Broly when there were more important issues. Wouldn’t fit. Movie 12: Even though this was my favorite film out of the non canon films, Gohan being on earth is a major inconsistency that I can’t overlook. Movie 13: Yeah, it could fit as an after story after Buu. Battle of Gods: I’m sure you could overlook Bulma and Mai’s age since I wouldn’t put it past Bulma to lie about her age. Goten and trunks is a bit iffy but it has no real bearing on the plot and is kind of superficial since they still seem to be about the same strength, they are more childish due to having Goku, Gohan and Vegeta protecting earth after all.

[@brandonn4553]

What if movie 1 takes place in a timeline to where piccolo never used the special beam cannon on Raditz and Goku just flats out kills him with a kamehameha blast or something which means he never dies and goes to otherworld rescues gohan and boom Garlic Jr appears.. which may explain why some of the z fighters was able to recognize gohan right away

[@markmagician2471]

Cooler's Revenge definitely can fit since it takes place after the fight against Frieza and Roshi said Goku was different after his fight with Frieza

[@يوسفسلامة-ف4ع]

battle of gods is canon so you can't say it's not cannon

[@thickthinproductions4358]

+Yousof Abu Suliman Not anymore

[@revenge3265]

+Thick Plus Thin Productions Akiyama said so

[@thickthinproductions4358]

Revenge Sniper Dragon Ball Super

[@revenge3265]

+Thick Plus Thin Productions Lol that also confirms the movie

[@thickthinproductions4358]

Revenge Sniper I was under the impression that Dragon Ball Super redid the events of the movie

[@Omega_1998_]

A few yearz back when watching this 4 the first time I heard Qaaman say about "The Return of Cooler" that it "foreshadows" Dende becoming the new guardian,he actually sez that it "foreshadowed" Dende becoming the new guardian. Another major detail and overall problem with "Return of Cooler" is that at the beginning of the movie Dende is on Earth with Mr.Popo as its new guardian.

[@QaamansLand]

When did I say that?

[@Omega_1998_]

@@QaamansLand I M saying that I misheard U in the video a few yearz back. I honestly thought I heard U say the word "foreshadows" but you really don't,you say the word "foreshadowed" that is all.

[@Just10tb]

23:25 Gohan fought bills as mystic gohan, since that form is stronger than any of his super saiyan forms.

[@lilprincekilla]

Qaamans Land, I disagree with you on Gohan's tail never growing again. It can fit because when Goku was young he grew his tail back at least a couple to three times. So I highly disagree with what you said there.

[@reaper7915ify]

Piccolo actually yanked Gohan's tail out after he destroyed the moon, then you see Gohan with a tail again when he fights Vegeta that's how he turns into the ape.

[@lilprincekilla]

reaper7915ify And notice when it happened? As a KID. Have you ever seen an adult Saiyan's tail grow back? Not even Gohan's. Goku had his tail yanked at least twice. Same with Gohan. Vegeta, once it got cut off was when Yajarobi cut it. Only logical explanation I can think of is because they were adults. In DBZ, I never seen an adult tail grow back.

[@reaper7915ify]

Yeah that's true, maybe its because their kids and their still growing so the tail grows back you know what I mean? because once their adults they stopped growing.

[@விஷ்ணு_கார்த்திக்]

+reaper7915ify pretty sure that was filler/

[@videlonlyfans8495]

விஷ்ணு கார்த்திக் same I thought it was filler too

[@SP3Nayias]

out of all of these, I knew with absolute certainty that Bojack Unbound and Wrath of the Dragon both fit with no issues. And i felt that Cooler's Revenge and and Broly were the other two most likely. i just couldn't look past a few of those problems in Dead zone. but like mentioned with a few tweaks in dialog and interaction and it would be easy to set up as a prequel event to the start of Dragonball. The second Broly Movie I always wrote off as being impossible. as i assumed it took place during the hunt for the dragonballs after the world tournament. but what you said about it's placement makes it possible for me. I feel that Dragonball Multiverse did it the correct way as you described and i found myself much more enjoying their version than the actual movie.

[@Type03xx]

Your idea pretty much on spot. 1. Dead Zone is prior to Z. 2. World's strongest can happen in alternate timeline where Z fighters successfully driven Vegeta off with Piccolo still alive. 3. Tree of might is similar to World's strongest, except that no Z fighters died in the battle against Saiyans. 4. Lord Slug is hard... don't know where to put, even with alternate timeline. 5. Revenge of Cooler can happen if Goku finish Frieza off with spirit bomb. 6. Return of Cooler is hard with SSJ Vegeta. 7. Andriod 13 is hard too. 8. Broly1 just like you said. the 9 days gap. 9. Bojack happened after Cell game. 10. Broly2 may happen before Goku's 1 day in Earth. 11. Bio Broly maybe possible if Buu was not there to begin with. 12. Fusion reborn is AU where SSJ3 Goku finshed off Fat Buu before he has to go back to other world. 13. Wrath of the dragon happen after Buu saga. 14. Beerus after WotD.

[@beyrsf]

Goten's mouth didnt move when we heard his voice wishing, so it was just his thoughts, Goku (who was sensing/watching the fight, took it upon himseerlf to come to earth to aid his spons... thus Goten never officially met Goku/his father until the Martial arts tournament

[@DarthBobCat]

I respectfully disagree about Broly's movie fitting into the 10 days for a few reasons (I think it makes the most sense as an alternate reality). 1) Minor detail: Goku and Gohan not using their Full Power Super Saiyan states. 2) The speed of space travel- considering how long other space flights have been in DBZ, New Vegeta would have to be very close to Earth for them to get there and back in 10 days. and 3) When it turned desperate against Cell and the Cell Juniors, why didn't they try to share energy with Goku to pump him up to the point that he could defend them? Also, 4) Piccolo being able to hear across the universe and apparently teleporting across the universe too. Although, I like to imagine this situation... Cell: Where were you? I lost track of your energy for a few days. Goku: Sorry, we went to space. We fought Broly. He was REALLY strong. I think he was even stronger than you! Cell: You went to space without me? AND you fought a strong guy? Goku: Yup! Cell: ... I was just going to have a regular tournament before, but now you ALL DIE! NOBODY LEAVES CELL BEHIND!

[@solidzdar467]

DarthBobCat I think cooler fits in better than broly

[@azuresaiyan9005]

I view some of the films as what ifs. Movie 12 is more of "what if" Gohan beat Super Buu, and Movie 5 as pretty much the Trunks timeline 3 year gap, as opposed to the main timeline. The ssj thing doesn't seem all that much of an inconsistency, as it was there to serve the story, same as Gohan with ssj2 in movie 9, that or work in the heart virus as a possible answer for Goku's troubles on becoming one. Movie 8 doesn't fit as Goku would have tried to coax Gohan to unleash his hidden power on Broly, knowing how powerful Gohan would be, as opposed to asking for everyone's power.

[@omegazee2042]

It would have been cool to see SSJ2 Teen Gohan vs LSSJ Broly, Broly would definitely lose, but it would still be awesome.

[@raidera3]

Cool video. I've had quite some fun trying to place these movies on the DBZ timeline myself. Despite the inconsistencies I really like to analyze the stages of development for each character.

[@MiseryDuke69]

I wish that Broly was Canon... he is my favorite DBZ character (i accept being called a Brolytard but oh well) anyway... I think that'd be awesome and they actually had him come back by some how surviving that sun hit and he then hits his LSSJ3 form or whatever... that'd be so cool

[@omegazee2042]

I wish a bunch of movie villains were canon. Like Coola, Janemba, Hirudegarn, Bojack, Garlic Junior and Broly.

[@Oli-sw5uu]

If you are talking about dbz and not the manga or kai you could say that garlic jr is cannon due to the garlic jr saga

[@omegazee2042]

Oli34576 Yeah I guess you could say Garlic Junior is technically canon, but I mean true to the manga canon. I wish Akria Toriyama would do a little manga special with some movie villains, like Dragon Ball Minus.

[@Oli-sw5uu]

Not a bad idea as some of best villains arnt even cannon

[@gloriouspurpose_]

Lol does it really even matter who's canon or not?

[@darkangel220a]

aside from attle of gods coolers revenge bojack unbound and wrath of the dragon fit perfectly with the canon

[@DiffyCue]

This is a great video. Nice work. Very thorough.

[@danielshottopics8187]

Remember Beerus said there are 12 other universes in the DBZ Multiverse I Think that the other Dragon Ball Z universes are diffrent Variations of the Dragon Ball Z 7th universe 1-future trunks timeline (z warriors die): Bardock: the father of Goku/ Manga Canon (until end of Frieza saga)/ History of Trunks This is also the timeline Bardock was caught in Frieza's blast and sent into the past of the next timeline listed (below) 2-current timeline (i.e. the one future trunks saved): Episode of Bardock/ Manga Canon/ Son Goku + friends special/ Battle of Gods/ Revival of F/ Bardock This is the timeline where Bardock awoke in the past on Planet Plant, defeated Chilled and became the Legendary SSJ which started the rumours within Frieza's family. 3-cell's original timeline (where cell stole trunks' time machine and Trunks defeated the androids with a switch created by Bulma. This is also why in the movie Super Android 13, Trunks is stuck in the past and never leaves, 17 and 18 are defeated and there's no cell, only Android 13) 4-Dead Zone/ anime (manga canon) + filler ie Garlic Junior Saga/ Cooler's Revenge/ Return of Cooler/ Bojack unbound/ Wrath of the Dragon/ GT/ GT movie 5-Tree of Might/ World's Strongest/ Lord Slug (SSJ as we know it with Gold hair and green eyes don't exist in this timeline according to the movie Lord Slug) Notice in every movie, Goku's most powerful/ finishing technique is always the spirit bomb. In this timeline, Raditz was defeated and never called Vegeta/ Nappa to come to Earth. 6- Broly timeline (which could fit into other timelines) in this timeline, cell is defeated in form 2, never absorbs 17/18, Gohan never turns SSJ2. 7- Fusion Reborn.. In this timeline, Majin Buu's defeat was different, since Vegeta was never brought resurrected after self destructing, fat Buu was most likely defeated by SSJ3 Goku, who in the current timeline states he could have defeated him but wanted the other warriors to have their chance. This could also explain why Goku didn't just instant transmission Ultimate Gohan to fight Janemba. (Gohan was not his Ultimate form when killing Frieza. UG was not yet invented by Toriyama at this time. Because of this, GT could also take place after this timeline. Just a few...

[@nadawiib]

With Broly: Second Coming, there is also another detail. I think I remember Videl throwing a ki blasts or something at Broly. If she knew how to use ki, why didn't she use it at the World Martial Arts Tournament?

[@dusknoir64]

um, there's one last inconsistency with battle of gods, that being that king kai's planet is somehow back.

[@dusknoir64]

***** then why didn't he do that in the buu saga?

[@pamelaromano5262]

dusknoir64 dunno.

[@jayhit4212]

dusknoir64 in the movie whis humorously comments to king kai that a kai of his level should easily be able to restore his planet if he wanted to and king kai nervously laughs. reason he doesn't restore his planet? because he doesn't have enough power, he is relatively weak for a kai.

[@dusknoir64]

Jason Hittinger ok, then why didn't he just keep west kai's planet?

[@jayhit4212]

If memory recalls your talking about when he made the bet with west kai wagering their planets on either pikon or goku. It was a tie so nobody got it

[@33jedi]

I got a question me and one of my friends were talking about. What ever happened to frog Ginyu? He was wished to earth with every living creature right? I am surprised that no one said anything about a giant purple alien with horns hopping around on all fours.

[@33jedi]

That may be true, but for the entire 4 years before the androids, and then another 7 years til buu destroyed the planet, no one seen him? That's 11 years of hiding and that seems unlikely in a world where people are everywhere.

[@33jedi]

1 Popo's power was never read, 2 there is no foundation for that statement, 3 If Popo was stronger than Cell why didn't he kill the saiyans, the androids, and freeza when he came or better yet, Cell? If you are going to give an answer at least be serious about it.

[@bureikusaikusu]

He was talking about dbz abridged what dbz fan doesn't watch that

[@33jedi]

Well yes I know the refference but I am asking a DBZ question not a DBZA question. That is why I didn't entertain it. Now if I were to ask what pwn count is Krillin up to then I would expect an answer like 10 Million lol

[@bureikusaikusu]

People would have noticed but it would be normal for them considering their king of the earth is a dog

[@phantom_thief_jk9859]

bojack unbound is probably the movie that makes the most sense

[@Spitfire_94]

A reason behind Goku and Gohan not being in Super Saiyan for that brief time in the first Broly movie could be be that ChiChi wanted them to be descended while in public? Goku being a Super Saiyan in the interview would be a little odd. Gohan being Super in public at a picnic would probably raise some eyebrows too, people weren't aware of what Super Saiyans were until Gohan was known as the "Golden Fighter" if I recall correctly? Even in the Buu Saga they weren't supposed to go Super in public but Goten did, Gohan and Trunks told him that he wasn't supposed to. I could be dead wrong lol.

[@unlucky8739]

gohan has the same hair as a ssj, so people could just think he dyed his hair

[@HaremKing403]

Mazr Wiperi And his eyes?

[@unlucky8739]

I don't know, contacts maybe?

[@HaremKing403]

Mazr Wiperi Dbz citizens are unusually dumb, I wouldn't doubt it

[@WEEWEE_GUY]

Akira Toriyama even stated that Battle of Gods took place 6 months after defeating Kid Buu

[@capefeather]

I tend to see Cooler's Revenge and Bojack Unbound as the most possibly canon-fitting movies, but I suppose we have different priorities on what it means to be canon-fitting. I ask myself how drastically a movie or the anime would have to change with respect to fundamental plot changes or changes to characters' experiences in order to air out the contradictions. This is in line with your approach when it comes to incorrect clothing and such, but it diverges a lot more when it comes to other things. You seem to treat knowledge of certain characters and their powers on a case-by-case basis, writing off Gohan in Dead Zone as minor while treating Super Saiyan Vegeta in Cooler 2 as major, but I see all of it as major because the movies are heavily altering the characters' experiences. On the flip side, I see stuff like Goku not turning Super Saiyan right away in Cooler 1 as minor, because all you have to do is say he just didn't want to resort to Super Saiyan immediately (while that would change the plot, it wouldn't change it on a fundamental level or change any character's experiences all that heavily). That said, I see Gohan not turning into a Super Saiyan 2 in Broly 1 as a major problem because at that point he had to have been capable of it in a pinch. I know you can bring up the Cell Jr. thing, but the fact that the possibility wasn't explored at all is damning IMO. At least Goku actually transformed in Cooler 1.

[@paulstgermain8449]

***** That has always been my theory.

[@himmothyyy]

Bojack Unbound and Wrath of the dragon are the two movies that fit if they were canon

[@hiimjustin8826]

Gohan was majorly powered down after that time period, I'm not sure he could go Super Saiyan. And what's up with Gohan's super saiyan after Buu anyway? It's been a while, but I remember something about him not being able to go SSJ after having his potential unlocked by the Grand Kai (twice this has happened, Gohan has a lot of potential apparently).

[@dragom2009]

***** more likly like goku didn´t go to yarda

[@Vintagegaston]

One thing to make note of: In Cooler 2, Krillin actually refers to Piccolo as Super Namek Piccolo, which means he fused with Kami, after losing to the Andrioids, so it can't fit into the 3 year gap. In addition, where did Vegeta get a Sayian pod?

[@kadindarklord]

If you look at the TFS Countdown of movies, Return of Cooler makes no sense at all. There is blindingly obvious proof that this must take place in the 10 day gap. It's implied that Piccolo and Kami must already be fused as Dende is the Guardian of Earth during this movie. But Gohan isn't a Super Saiyan for two more movies. So why did Piccolo get his ass handed to him? He's easily as strong as a Super Saiyan now.

[@Jiron127]

Remember piccolo's fight w/meta coola wasn't shown. SO he probably did get some good hits in. But meta coola may've regenerated, gaining the upper hand. Not to mention that meta coola was already about as strong as 17/18. The future versions at the least, before all of his improvements.

[@thepencil448]

God what a blast from the past it is to hear someone call Beerus "Bills"

[@XuntosIzor]

Great video! I agree with all of your points except one. So Gohan having a tail and Goku taking a while to turn Super Saiyan in Cooler's 1st movie are too much of a problem to let it be in the "perfectly fits" category, but Broly's movie does fit "perfectly"? I'd definitely argue that the time placement and context of Cooler's movie makes way more sense than Broly's movie because they were just messing around and training for three whole years with no immediate threat other than the androids eventually coming. Why would all of the Z fighters that had only 10 days to train to defeat Cell in the Cell Games decide to gamble with their precious time left to prepare and take a random trip into space? Also, there was a revolving door of characters going in and out of the Hyperbolic Time chamber during the 10 day time span, so it's really unrealistic to think that they would all manage to find one day to hang out, and then use it to go into space to see Vegeta's supposed new planet. They would have just told Paragus to wait lol.

[@user-bk9er8ov3k]

I guess they figured out that broly was more of a bigger threat.

[@XuntosIzor]

sid3 That doesn't make sense though. They didn't know who or what Broly was before agreeing to leave Earth

[@user-bk9er8ov3k]

XuntosIzor I meant has in story plot wise lol I'm just joking by the way.

[@XuntosIzor]

sid3 lol it's always hard to tell in comments

[@mattwo7]

Bio Broly, Fusion Reborn and Wrath of The Dragon all take pace on unspecified dates in the same year as the Buu saga while Broly the Second Coming took place some time between Videl mastering the Sky Dancing Technique aka "flying" (which happened in the episodes between the Cell Games and the 25 World Martial Arts Tournament) and the 25th World Martial Arts Tournament.

[@ninjawaver]

Another thing you have to remember is that in Broly's Second Coming when Videl fought Broly, she said "Why do I always get the big dumb ugly ones?" This is another plot hole since she's most like reffering to her match with Spopovich. Meaning this must've taken place AFTER the world tournament

[@cade.s]

That brings in another plot hole because where the hell was vegeta? Goku was dead and in Z he had went to elder kais world so explain all that

[@DarthBobCat]

Here's a random proposal for you, Qaaman. How about Broly the Legendary Super Saiyan being an alternate reality where Trunks ignored Vegeta's instructions to stay out of his fight with Perfect Cell? Vegeta was launching the enormous Final Flash and Trunks decided to add his blast to the destruction. Well, with no help originally, Vegeta inflicted wounds on Cell that would have killed (or at least seriously maimed) a normal person. it'd explain why Gohan could go super saiyan, why everyone was celebrating at the start of the movie (yay, no Cell! No Androids! And nobody had to die!), and why Gohan and Goku weren't practicing their Full Power Super Saiyan state (no Cell, why worry?) It'd also explain where the Androids were- 17 would have died with Cell, and 18 and 16 would have presumably been killed by Trunks since to Trunks, the only good android is a dead android. It even explains why Vegeta is so emotionally fragile- while he thinks he PROBABLY would have killed Cell without Trunks' help, he'd have that niggling doubt in the back of his mind, that could destroy his self confidence the second he felt Broly's enormous power. The ONLY problem with my alternate timeline theory is that Broly's second movie makes no sense at all in that timeline.

[@theycallmesully2386]

Most of the movies are better than the TV show continuity to be honest.

[@karnage_lotus5965]

Umm some what true my only problem is the movie worlds strongest it was the fight with vegeta over again

[@DenniDownBad]

This, this right here needs more exposure

[@bzrkscythe7971]

with coolers revenge I always thought Goku used Super Saiyan as a last resort. that he didn't want to just use super Saiyan just up and starting. cause to be honest Goku always pulls out something to keep the earth from being destroyed with the exception of kid buu

[@RedBoy747]

Alternate timelines can make some of thoughts movies fit cause they could have been given more time with 2 or 3 things

[@bakerboardz39]

Please change your greeting...

[@vandaman1702]

I Don't Mean To Correct You But The Return Of Cooler Had To Be During The 10 Days Of The Cell Games Because Dende Was Earth Guardian and During The 10 day gap goku went to namek to find a namekian to be the guardian of earth

[@QaamansLand]

Yes but Dende makes it impossible to happen in a conflict with gohan being in his form prior to the htc.

[@ninjaman11user]

Qaamans Land random question:What if Goku became a Super Saiyan when Krillin died in Dragon Ball and how would it affect the seris?

[@carlosmoret2675]

john hawley well then he would have killed piccolo a long time ago so no dragonballs and radtiz would bne a piece of cake. but then nappa and vegeta would come to earth to find out about ssj. And frieza would have come to earth cause of the ssj prophecy. He would blow up earth and that would be the end. Maybe bills would wake up and kill frieza like he said he would befor finding out frieza died

[@beyrsf]

Takes place during the Android wait before Trunks future came back. Dende was just there early to practice beinbg a guardian. (Popo/Elder Morri/King Kai had previous conversations). Just try to use their imagination. Or the non-canon DB movies take place in an alterate universe seperate from the regular "4 timelines/realities" of Dragon Ball.

[@nwo2cool]

I believed Cooler's Revenge and Return of Cooler probably took place in Future Trunks timeline. It makes sense because Frieza and King Cold was killed by Goku in Trunks' timeline. Maybe the other movies took place in different timelines. There's alternate timeline where Imperfect Cell killed Trunks to steal his time machine.

[@abandonedchannel6251]

And that one problem you were saying where Goku and Gohan were not much stronger than Vegeta and Trunks in Broly the Legendary Super Saiyan. That doesn't really make much sense you saying that that doesn't make sense broly in his legendary form was far above all of them Goku and Gohan we're still far above Vegeta and Trunks Broly was just making them look like they were all the same strength because he was just so far above them

[@michaelprada3947]

He was beating all them up without breaking a sweat

[@abandonedchannel6251]

+Michael Armani exactly. the only way they were able to defeat Broly was by combining the powers of 4 super saiyans and a super Namek.

[@fyst6114]

also trunks was probably taking a break from training and decided to keep the armor for the cell games or bulma could have been cleaning his armor for the cell games

[@Philip-vi1dy]

The Broly movie didn't fit in perfectly like you said... The problems you said where "minor" where pretty big problems....

[@midsectionmark8956]

What was some big problems?

[@Kriscuit_Bonkin]

+Mark Peters It seem to have take place during the 10 day period before cells games.

[@solidzdar467]

Philip yeah if he counts that I think coolers revenge should count

[@nexusshark]

The Bio Broly movie ending could also be a deciding factor, because Goku is chilling in the otherworld, eating spaghetti, instead of being in the realm of the supreme kais, where Gohan is training.

[@AndyBar97]

Why is English the "universal language" of the Dragon Ball Z Universe?

[@Zexi141]

Because English is the universal language of our own world.

[@parkerkrakowiak2990]

It's only English if you watch it in English

[@Darkblender5]

The same reason Japanese is the universal language in their dub.

[@AndyBar97]

Parker Krakowiak I know, I was just wondering if they attempted to answer this canonically.

[@parkerkrakowiak2990]

I doubt it could be, although I believe there's a line where frieza says something in his native language, and I THINK he mentions something about translating it to the universal language, not sure though

[@cakebuu887]

The thing is with some of the earlier movies they are meant as a Re-Telling of the story that has taken place but just with different characters , so you could say that they happened at exactly the same time as the stories that they are similar to , e.g Frieza/cooler.

[@parabalani]

Gohans Death Note Guys, this video is awesome :)

[@jabbathehut6827]

The reason on the second movie that goku wasnt super sayian was because he didnt have control of it, in trunks saga he said that he just got control of it which means that under that film he wasnt able to control, when to turn into super sayian

[@zwannmustapah]

My personal opinion on the movies is that they all represent "What if" scenarios. Here's my thoughts:- Dead Zone: what if Raditz and the Saiyans never went to earth? World's Strongest: what if Goku managed to reach Piccolo and give the Senzu bean before he was killed by Nappa's blast? (evidence of why Piccolo was alive, Gohan was now close to Piccolo, as Piccolo almost sacrificed himself for him) Tree of Might: What if Goku killed Vegeta and followed the others to Namek to use their Dragonballs? (this would also be what if their trip to Namek was a smooth ride, and never encountered Freeza's forces at all, they made their wish and went back home safely) Lord Slug: What if Goku managed to kill Freeza through the spirit bomb? (Goku would not achieve Super Saiyan, he and the others would return safely to Earth) Cooler's Revenge: What if Goku managed to use Freeza's ship to head back to earth after defeating Freeza? (Goku would not train with the Yathdract, would not yet master Super Saiyan form) Return of Cooler: Would be a follow up of Cooler's Revenge Super 13: What if there was no Cell, and the Z Fighters managed to defeat 17 and 18? Legendary Super Saiyan: What if Goku defeated Cell in the Cell Games? (no Super Perfect form) (some speculated to opening scene of the Z Fighters celebrating at the beginning was for their success in defeating Cell) Fusion Reborn: What if Gotenks did managed to kill Super Buu?

[@tpx7414]

I like to think that Cooler's Revenge takes place in an alternate universe where Goku actually killed Frieza with the Spirit Bomb.

[@GweiTheLeafChild]

The inconsistency about Bulma and Mai's age can easily be explained. Women in anime and most fiction, and pretty much in real life don't like to mention their ages, so, they either don't try to talk about it, or lie and give a younger age than they actually are. Goten and Trunks can be more forgiven since they're about the same proportion Goku was in Dragon Ball, when he was 12. Gohan is more tricky, considering how you take his status in having his power unlocked by Old Kai, I can't recall if Old Kai said if Gohan undergoes the process, he won't be able to go Super Saiyan or not. I think it's implied that Ultimate Gohan's power is greater than if he went Super Saiyan, and somehow, going Super Saiyan would either downgrade him, or not add anything at all. Another more humorous reason is that Gohan was drunk at the time, so maybe he forgot, or something.

[@andraethegiant1987]

It makes sense that Broly Second Coming should takes place around the time Spopovich and Yamu drains Gohan's energy at the tournament.

[@awsomeroxem]

Ahhhh, 10's by Pantera jamming in the background when it's on broly.

[@matsegberts8261]

Coolers revenge would make sense if frieza was killed with the spirit bomb

[@blessedxxiii5583]

Yeah bro agree the whole movie is like a "what if" scenario💯🔥

[@froyoz]

Qaamans Land keep in mind goku was 13 at the start of the series and he looked small until he was at least 14-15 years old as for gohan, he went in the hyperbolic time chamber for a day making it go by like a year so when he was 11 his body looked older

[@mattwo7]

The fight against Androids 19 and 20 took place on Age 767, May 12. Return of Cooler took place somewhere between May 17 and 26 the same year, meaning it took place at some point after the Cell Games were announced on the 17th, most likely before Future Trunks exited the Hyperbolic Time Chamber for the second time on the 20th. Super Android 13, Broly, and Plan to Eradicate the Sayians takes place in the same time period, while Bojack Unbound has no specific date but took place in the same year according to the official timeline.

[@daysgobye]

"This movie fits in almost completely well." Bravo, Mr. Qaaman's Land.- include head bow.

[@Conflict-ff5pi]

I have a theory about the movies. The movie timeline(at least most of them) took place in the same timeline as GT and normal dbz took place in the same timeline as battle of gods. That would explain why some movie characters show up in GT and also why most movies can't be placed in a normal timeline. Plus it explains why the super useful techniques used in the movies weren't used in the main series, for example in the broly movie when everyone powered up goku but then they didn't do it again in the main series but then they did at a few times in GT.

[@ILove2EatUranium]

The only movie character that was in gt was cooler. Also you still can't fit all the movies into the gt timeline, since the events of dbz still happened in gt.

[@Mudkip971]

Speaking of your Timeline theory (which is most likely right) couldn't the Cooler movies, the Super Android and Tapion take place during the "Unseen Timeline"?

[@blessedxxiii5583]

Yeah man💯🔥

[@spookyskeleton9816]

Dam that's some og classic at this point

[@NoahNasi]

M1: Before Saiyan Saga (I'm skipping the other first 4 movies, as the timeline placements for those make NO sense) M6: After #19 is defeated, but before #20 is killed. M7: Before Vegeta and Trunks went into the Time Chamber, but after Cell appears, and after Trunks loses his sword. M8: Not too long after Cell announces the Cell Games, as Gohan isn't Teen Gohan yet (his hair is too small, unlike Teen Gohan, and Kid Gohan before the HBTC), Vegeta and Trunks are still using their Ascended forms, and Trunks' hair is still long (Bulma cut it in the 10 day wait). M9: After the Cell Games, but before Goten is born. M10: Before the World Tournament. M11: Doesn't make sense. M12: While SSJ Gotenks is fighting Buu, I know that there are scenes with Goten and Trunks fusing, but they're just filler. M13: After the Buu Saga, but before they wish for Buu to be forgotten. Vegeta is still wearing his World Tournament outfit, so is Gohan. OVA2 and M14: 2-4 years after the Buu Saga. M15: 1 year after M14.

[@Agentshadowolf]

As for Goten and Trunks is age in battle of gods remember vegeta said that saiyans age more slowly than humans. Also there isn't that much of a gap between the time before the World Martial Arts Tournament and battle of gods. Last thing about Gohan in battle of gods is he already unlocked his full potential so he wouldn't need to become a Super Saiyan anymore as that would be a power down for him. As ultimate or mystic Gohan however you prefer to call him, is beyond the Super Saiyan 2 maybe 3

[@darkinferno1219]

On a note with BoG, Gotens and Trunks' appearance is fine as in Dragon Ball Goku was 12 and he looked around the same physically as Goten and Trunks. Not to mention 4 years later in the Tien Shinhan Arc he was 16 and his appearance didn't really change at all

[@AsymmetricalCrimes]

Saiyans age slower than humans but Goten and Trunks are only half Saiyan.

[@KingLeo7]

The Broly movie is my introduction to Pantera and I'm glad we met 10s is my top 3 favorite song of all time because of that scene

[@Laekith]

This is my headcanon for movies: Bardock - The Father of Goku Dead Zone [Saiyan Saga] [Freeza Saga] Cooler's Revenge [Android Saga] The History of Trunks Broly - The Legendary Super Saiyan [Cell Saga] Bojack Unbound Broly - Second Coming [Boo Saga] Fusion Reborn Wrath of the Dragon Battle of Gods Resurrection 'F'

[@jahmaisofly]

Revenge of cooler fits in when vegeta reveals he is a super sayian and defeats that android. Trunks still hasn't come back to the present at that period and they are looking for dr gero

[@suivatra123]

I'm pretty sure in the games these are all what if saga fights. And Gohans trail grew back once when being trained with Piccolo.

[@TecTitan]

"Are you Ready?" Camera at cell's abs going down.

[@lukebickner6013]

With this video I discovered Qaaman. The rest is history.

[@ccmcdoug]

He forgot the fact that Gohan did not turn SS2 against Broly's second coming.

[@EddleavyMillerjr]

the pun for the fusion reborn movie hilarious

[@brandongarcia8826]

For Battle of Gods, Gohan doesnt need ssj anymore, it just consumes his energy. So he only needed it to give the pure sayain power to his pops ;)

[@Gamekiller166]

My theory for the first cooler.movie is that happens in Future Trunks timeline. Goku himself kills Cooler's brother and Father and he comes to earth to get his revenge.

[@lallen1395]

As mentioned in Qaaman's alternate timeline video, there are four different DBZ timelines. Isn't is possible that the ones that do not fit in our timeline could fit in the others? Specifically the unseen timeline and Super Android 13.

[@TKDragon75]

In revenge of Cooler, maybe goku just didn't think he needed super saiyan, and got to beat up and tired to transform. So he had to let rage bring it out. Maybe?

[@MagicalPuddinPops]

I might have an explanation for Coolers Revenge but it's not likely: I theorized that Coolers Revenge could have taken place if Goku somehow visited Earth after beating Freiza (but before or during his training on planet Yardrat). Goku visiting Earth at that point would explain why he couldn't turn into a Super Saiyan on command. This event of course would disprove that anybody had even met Future Trunks during Cooler landing on New Namek.

[@naroulin9279]

C-13 Movie is possible. - When the Original Trunks (The one Cell killed before stealing his Time Machine) came to the passed, he gave Goku the cure and warned him about the androids. - Then he came back 3 years later to help Goku and his friends to kill the androids which they did. They killed the androids and Trunks probably decided to stay a bit and enjoy his friends and father. After all he can go back in his timeline when he want, like five seconds after he left his mother for example. Plus, he still had to find the way to beat the androids in his timeline. . So it is possible, in this timeline, C-13, C-14 and C-15 woke up. We know time travels change things. Original Trunks (Cell Timeline) never saw them in his timeline but by traveling in the past, he changed it a bit. - Z-Team and Trunks fight and destroy C-13, C-14, C-15 - Knowing that someone or something (Gero's computer) was sending new androids, Z-Team came back to the lab to prevent new androids to come and they found the secret underground lab, the blue prints then destroyed the computer and Cell. - Trunks give Bulma the blue prints (It may be the young Bulma or Mirai Bulma) and with the remote control, he destroy the androids. - When the Time Machine is charged again, he is ready to come back in the passed and tell his friends the good news but Cell is watching and kill him.

[@secondaryadjunctofu0]

one more interesting fact about this movie dealing with Gohan, is that he actually climbs Korin tower, he does the same thing his dad did when he was a kid almost like he was having to complete similar trials.

[@transylvani600]

Dbz movies are always good to watch

[@babysinclairfan]

cooler could fit if we assume that goku didnt want to go super saiyan until it was needed. This could be true, since goku tried to talk cooler down multiple times before killing him. Also, recent post battle of gods retcons say that super saiyan 2-3 are somewhat restrained and that regular super saiyans have unlimited power if the user is angry enough. Goku may have been in one of those moments when he transformed.

[@Negetive2digit]

Got to give credit to the makers of Buu's Fury for taking the Jenemba arc and putting it in the timeline without messing up the story too much. They only used the Other World segment of the plot and it integrated well into an RPG by giving you something to do besides the typical 'follow the plot of the manga and anime' stuff that DBZ games have been known for for the last two decades or more.

[@DNAsGhostzHouze]

I always considered the movies to be part of an alternate DBZ timeline. If you just took the movies and filled in the gaps, you could have a whole new series...