Dragoon pathfinding is not the best...

Dragoon pathfinding is not the best...
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[@Dubanx]

Huh, I didn't realize dragoons COULD make it up those stairs. Legitimately though they were designed to make you leave them behind.

[@epicfail3167]

As did I!!! Glad to see I'm not the only one

[@JosueC730]

Back in the old days I forced them to go upstairs by blocking the path below with other units.

[@Earthboundmike]

Thank christ I'm not the only one

[@sasbe1852]

Now I feel great that I didn‘t thought so.

[@JTpower201]

I don’t blame you I had to click on the stairs over and over again, small baby steps to get them up there. Or I have to click on the other side of the map in the figure out I want to go that direction.

[@weeb_disappointment_8917]

If it had a kid with the goliath, it will be the ultimate hybrid that not even Kerrigan, the Protoss or the UED will be able to destroy

[@DarkTemplar42]

If it could get to the battle XD

[@rjthom5]

@@DarkTemplar42 It can't be destroyed because it's not there.

[@user-sr6pi5lp3q]

*able to move

[@JTpower201]

Same way a tank can’t destroy a Barbie doll if its on the other side of the planet with that logic.

[@Glass-Bowl]

*Goliath Are Needed?* _bzzt_ (runs into wall)

[@Weigazod]

I had never known Dragoon could use the stairs. What an eye-open event!

[@Nnneemo]

What are you expecting from weponised wheelchair? It's miracle it targeting system can work correctly!

[@FenixtheDragoon]

You are your own worst enemy. -Kerrigan watching this

[@Ofasia777]

Who get to decide what is the best path. You? Me? No. Its the Dragoon. The Dragoon knows what is path best for the Dragoon at given time. It is hubris to pretend we know any better than the one who walk where and how to walk to any given destination.

[@JTpower201]

“Wise words, Praytor Jean-Philippe Martel your wisdom, has restored my faith in the Templar Caste.” Judicator Aldaris direct quote.

[@usmh]

I know, right? Maybe it was giving a moonwalking performance and this guy was too narrow-minded to realize.

[@pierreo33]

It's unreal how much better the unit voices and music are in SC1

[@incrediblebat]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/sHK2aX6fq7-La9U

[@MarKreationsStudios]

Yup, traded in good pathfinding for good sound design 😅

[@dragonsdynamite6403]

SC2 is a huge turn off just due to the the graphics. I tried to enjoy watching ESL, I really did

[@NovaPrime2285]

@@dragonsdynamite6403SC2 graphics are bad?

[@dragonsdynamite6403]

@@NovaPrime2285 not bad but I prefer SC1 graphics. Personal preference, that’s all

[@Trades46]

I just thought Dragoons can't go up these stairs when I played SC1 as a kid.

[@DarkTemplar42]

Same here! Came back and found you could

[@kentreed2011]

I just found out that they could go up those stairs just today when I watched this video lol.

[@ZethHolyblade]

Not only does the dragoon share ED-209's quotes but his aversion to stairs as well (albeit, in reverse)

[@Its_me_Stolas]

Now I see why he was so wobbly in Carbot's animation

[@theprogenesis2000]

I played this mission again today on remastered after over 20 years since last time I played the campaign. Back then I'm pretty sure I thought dragoons couldn't use the stairs. Today I tried to wiggle the dragoon up the stairs and it worked. Weird how this video was recommended to me after the fact.

[@acb1511]

Kerrigan: So long as you continue to be so predictable, Fenix, I need not face you at all. You are your own worst enemy.

[@IdealIdeas100]

that bad pathfinding has to with its hitbox actually changing sizes as it moves.

[@Lappmogel]

I don't understand why they did that, just let it have the stationary hitbox all the time. Who cares if the units clip into each other a little bit when they walk around, and if that's a problem just use the bigger walking hitbox all the time.

[@Dubanx]

@@Lappmogel 90s games honestly weren't as well thought out as modern games. Remember things like missingno and Ogre Battle 64's item duplication bug? Crazy and weird artifacts was common back then. Partly due to lower standards and partly due to heavier restrictions on resources like memory and CPU. A lot of tomfoolery was afoot to limit resource usage in old games.

[@Lappmogel]

@@Dubanx Having 1 hitbox would be less techically demanding though. They probably went with 2 to make the game look better, which is understandable. I wonder how much the game would change if they just deleted the movement hitbox, replaced it with the stationary one and then just let the legs clip into each other. Probably a pretty big buff for goons

[@Dubanx]

@@Lappmogel If I had to speculate, I would guess that the hitbox was tied directly to the sprite. Leg extends, sprite expands, hitbox expands, pathfinding goes to hell. Which could easily be the result of some weird technical limitation.

[@arbiter11171]

Stairs aren't disabled-friendly.

[@Santouryu3]

Dragoon: Stairs! My one weakness! ED-209: Join the club, bruh...

[@Mikonid_Ozone]

CL4P-TP: wub wub wub wub wub wub wub wub wub wub wub DROP wub wub wub wub

[@ponteusbolecki8103]

Remember when in iccup in 2007 I accidentally won becouse of enemy dragoon bad pathing the final of tournament was so epicly bugged.

[@michaelandreipalon359]

Not even jamming Warthogs and Makos to tight spaces in Halo and Mass Effect respectively was this challenging, by gar!

[@julyjun3314]

CL4PTR4P: STAIR? NOO DRAGOONS:

[@sethiddings7293]

Give em a break they don't have stairs in Auir

[@enrique16ish]

Goliaths: *S Y S T E M S F U N C T I O N A L*

[@alex_ho]

I wonder if people will be mad if they ever get around to fixing it

[@Dubanx]

It won't happen because you couldn't improve Brood War's pathfinding without destroying the game. The #1 difference between how BW and SC2 play is the pathfinding. Splash damage is far stronger, melee units are only really effective in small numbers (since tight balls of ranged units kill them faster they can close the distance), and mutalisks would be completely worthless without the ability to pick off single units that get too far from the pack. SC:BW with better path finding would simply cease to be SC:BW, and not for the better.

[@CanariasCanariass]

​@@Dubanx True, also it would shorten the skill gap for professional players. Sounds stupid but one of the reasons the skill gap is so huge is that only a few people in the world are able to have the insane mechanic skills with mouse and keyboard to be able to play professionally.

[@adolfhipsteryolocaust3443]

​@@Dubanx they could just change the stair a little bit

[@mapron1]

@@adolfhipsteryolocaust3443 you don't have THAT stairs in competitive maps, so no one care. Fixing campaign maps... dunno. Really?

[@adolfhipsteryolocaust3443]

@@mapron1 why not tho

[@bigsmall246]

With dramatic music in the background

[@ZemRato]

so, this is the mission where the Dragoon get to shine its pathfinding to everyone watching

[@ComissarYarrick]

One explanation why Dragoon pathfinding is so horrible in SC1, comes to unit hitbox. Apparently dragoon's changes size just a tiiiny bit when moving, so AI constantly calculates and recalculates where they can and can't move. Blizzard could possibly fix this, but never bothered.

[@Gonzalo_105]

blizzard is no longer blizzard, is activision now, :(

[@_bits_and_bytes]

Apparently, they proposed fixing a lot of the bugs in SC:Remastered including some of the Dragoon bugs (not sure if this one was one of them or not) but it didn't happen because the pro players they consulted with at the time told them not to change anything gameplay-related, including bugs.

[@CanariasCanariass]

​@@_bits_and_bytes Yep this is true. For example the Dragoon also has this bug where it suddenly can stop shooting or unable to move. They asked Bisu(a Protoss pro player) on his opinion on fixing that bug and he said they should not do it, as it alters the game play (even though it would have benefitted him).

[@ComissarYarrick]

@@_bits_and_bytes That's what i heard too. E-sports scene ( mosty koreans ) demaned to SC remastered to be as purest copy of SC1 as possible, bugs and all. Blizz could at lest add fixes to campains :P ....

[@excitedme530]

@@CanariasCanariass Blizzard‘s biggest error is only listening to pros for advice, makes the game so much boring and un user friendly

[@dimitaraleksandrov6381]

I remember I spent 10 minutes trying to get the Dragoon up the ramp.. just gave up and moved on without him..

[@ulaznar]

Jokes on you, dragoons were just gettin' jiggy with it

[@pactofshadows]

I watched Robocop when I was young so I wasn't surprised it couldn't go up stairs. But now I am surprised it actually can

[@RochaHigor]

Now to Balance maps lets put this ramps everywhere kkkkkk

[@wherethetatosat]

Dragoon technology based off cows, confirmed.

[@cristianspiridon]

Old gps system can be tricky to use :D

[@L4sz10]

The dragoon knows where it is because it knows where it isn't.

[@Burnlit1337]

Lol remember this, I too thought that you can't bring Dragoons up because it kept running away from the stairs. So kept going with the rest of my squad. Minutes later, I happen to look over to my Dragoons and saw that they somehow made it at top of those stairs waiting.

[@DjinnePasse]

"I have returned" More like "I tried"

[@flower_died_]

이건 스타 역사에 길이길이 남을 영상이다 :D

[@kobymusic108]

It was always funny in missions just to see where they ended up near the finish.

[@ValiduzZ]

FOR VENGENCE ... As long as its not up the stairs.

[@cristhianmlr]

You see, that's what makes the game harder and better then chess

[@drgnearth]

the dragoon knows where it is by knowing where it isn't

[@gaminacthemaniac6444]

Oh yeah I remember that, it was so aids trying to get Goliaths and Dragoons up a flight of stairs.

[@Zeratultheking]

tbf I don't think this is a pathfinding issue but more that the dragoon barely fits up those steps because of the 90 degree turn. That's why every other ramp in the game is wider and doesn't turn. Its literally a square being told go around a circle if you think about it the pixels just barely fit around it so the AI doesn't think it has the ability to go up it so it finds a different way.

[@badrinath5306]

Put a zergling at the top.then try to move even workers there's more than enough space but it won't.

[@muggs105]

Oh, carbot love your parodies.

[@issacb6124]

bro i would have given up before getting him up the ramp 🤣

[@d3j4v00]

made it 4/19ths of the way up the stairs, a personal best. so proud

[@lmenzol]

Wow, I just assumed dragoons couldn’t go up these stairs…

[@YagamiIori6412]

Dragoon: We need brain 🧠

[@benjaminlim3936]

Dammit, now i have to go direct my lost Dragoon up the stairs. 🤣

[@toramaru2490]

At first i was gonna say "bro dragoon is too fat to get up there" But then the dragon just go up and i laugh so hard

[@salthcreative5540]

Goddamnit. 4sec in and I could already feel my blood pressure increasing and my teeth starting to grind.

[@jedenasty2226]

Wait, dragoon can go up this ramp? :V

[@michael-anthonypereira4470]

That pathing ain't so good, Where'd he study tactics?

[@unknownkw]

I know the dragoon can go upstairs when I first played the level before 2000 (by blocking the other way with units), but as this mission is best not to go up as defending the last wave is best using the stairs as choke and position the army behind it. I spent a lot of time on this level to rescue all units and no deaths (perfect result) and succeeded, so I remember a lot of things on it. The hardest part is saving the marines in the zergling room but it can be done.

[@user-ik6oj3bj1m]

what? it could go up the stairs? i didn't know that. stupid dragoon, can't even go up the stairs. i coudln't understand why they give me a dragoon in the first place. now i do. 25 years of mystery has finally solved !

[@badrinath5306]

Is anybody stil suprised that it was the unit that replaced the dragoon that got blink??

[@troublemakeitdouble1299]

"confirmed" still goes the wrong way.

[@DarkTemplar42]

Classic

[@TheAns51]

I ain't special or anything but i actually as a kid when playing this, understood almost immediately that you have to press directly to stairs for them to get up them in this mission

[@DarkTemplar42]

Nice!

[@DX413RB8]

" The unsolved case of Dragoon and Stairs "

[@mariotactico4757]

One must imagine the dragoon’s happy

[@goja3771]

이것만 그런게 아니라 다른 곳들도 이러는 경향이 있음 간혹 저글링 움직이다 보면 길 있는데 그 길로 안가고 다른길로 쪼르르 달려가던데 근접 컨 하면 저런식으로 그 빈틈으로 들어감.... 멀리 찍으면 뺑 돌아감;;;;

[@lexeleister4618]

dragoon worst enemy ofc stairs

[@tribalbeat6471]

He's trying his best.

[@psykopath334]

Painfull to watch

[@jasonsoliva6678]

You have to right click incrementally for every teeny tiny stair

[@OceansBane]

I use them strictly for defense. It gives me a headache lil

[@ConcreteObelisk]

Don't get me wrong i love the first installment but what SC2 really improved upon is the navigation/pathfinding system of units. I still get gamer orgasm when watching colossus going up/down cliffs.

[@flashmhp]

Systems FUNCTIONAL!!!

[@edsonchavez2029]

Protoss the most advanced race intelligently & technologically. The Dragoon... 🍺

[@user-1qc01ai7s]

한번만에 올라갔으면 아이어 방어 성공했다.

[@mickcraftgaming]

Dragoons have incredible pathing 😂😂

[@stevenmayer8528]

The greatest challenge actually in starcraft 😂😂

[@d_t8396]

I always thought that it couldn t pass through

[@GGRetroBattles]

Dragoon is doing its best.

[@sethiddings7293]

I imagine the pilot just swearing in Protoss.

[@TheDedloc]

This makes the broodwar players wanna come back to sc2. If we could just get all the units in sc2 to be completely brainless like this it might come back to life.

[@JTpower201]

Don’t bring back the bad memories. I played it in the original starcraft non-remastered version and it was so annoying to try to get up the stairs.

[@DarkTemplar42]

It's all part of the starcraft experience!

[@SPG37]

I was frustrated, so I abandoned the dragoons and left!

[@onerxowns2202]

Carbot StarCrafts got it SOOO right

[@dennisrodriguez3689]

We hate it but we love it.

[@yakomachaco7611]

He says “confirmed” and “initiating” but does he mean it?

[@yanseok1988]

ED209 : 😮

[@-rage-blackout9145]

Me vs Aldaris Me: Contract please. Aldaris: I give you 2 Dragoon to your order. Your target is hunt Tassadar and arrest him then you take technology. Me: Deal 😎 Tassadar: Wait what Terran brother? I give you 5 Dragoon and 1 Reaver. For passing this stair and you take our technology for free. Few moment Me: Pffff. Move your as* Tassadar and Zeratul playing poker 😎

[@RabbitRoo]

Indeed it isnt :)

[@Cabeza492]

I just replayed the SC original campaign few days ago (not the remaster) and I would think that they fixed that, but now I can see that the playability from then, still intact... Don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing... now I'm confused xD

[@DarkTemplar42]

People would be mad if they fixed the OG pathfinding!

[@andykerr1263]

@@DarkTemplar42 Yup. If you watch any professional broodwar, it plays so differently from sc2 because the players are spending more time fighting the engine than they are each other at times.

[@keizan5132]

It's not only "not the best" but it's actually one of the worst.

[@charliesheen3019]

and arty is complaining about his scvs xD

[@nelfanel6515]

you literally beat game in this mision =))))

[@panther140]

아마 피닉스였으면 바로 올라갔을것

[@DarkTemplar42]

There is no strength in defeat as long as the spirit remains unconquered

[@user-el5hh8ih5v]

마치 입대하기 싫어 발악하는 제모습같네요.

[@dyhlanvillegas5544]

escalera>dragon proto

[@wild_shaman]

Protosses micro, u know.

[@gersonarias1904]

oohhhh.!!

[@MiMi-Elona]

Confirm....

[@Zatra]

Micro 🥳🥳🥳

[@yeesteregg96]

!bool A* algorithm

[@CheeKiatTeo]

WTF what wizardry is this!

[@malibumilk]

개열받네 진짜ㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋ

[@BobBob-kr5wr]

Your intentionally miss clicking to confuse the poor creature. You monster.

[@user-dr6oi7ly6c]

알리고즘 뭐냐

[@yonggeun4222]

whats the point of this video

[@DarkTemplar42]

To show that dragoons can go up that ramp. Most people dont think that it can. read pinned comment

[@yonggeun4222]

@@DarkTemplar42 can you try with reaver archons tank vulture goliart lurker ultralisk aswell

[@Axairu]

Sc1 players sniffing their own farts thinking they are good because they can walk an army up a ramp with 500 apm

[@ltdzinger]

And people think this shit is better than sc2.

[@Dubanx]

The dragoon's pathfinding, in particular, has issues, but SC2's pathfinding just turns the game into two massive death balls slamming into each other. Battles were far less dynamic and interesting in SC2 than SC:BW. Melee unit balance (Zealot/Zerglings) were especially fucked since what was balanced at smaller scales got annihilated faster than they could close the distance once unit counts got larger. There was no picking off units with muta micro in SC like the original, which hurt their balance pretty badly as well.. and I say all this as someone who was high enough ranked in the SC2 NA ladder to regularly face (and beat) grandmasters.

[@CanariasCanariass]

It is better from a professional point of view because it produces insane skill gaps.

[@pierreo33]

Starcraft 2 will never be as good as Brood war.