E11: Uncomfortable questions: the Middle East conflict through the lens of Scripture, with John Parr

[@andrewlim9345]

Thanks for raising awareness of the plight of Palestinian Christians. Restoring a Jewish homeland should not mean driving out Arabs.

[@mmabbs]

They aren't, the Arabs are trying to destroy Israel, Israel is defending itself, remember the 6 day war. Historically Egypt is blockading Gaza more than Israel.

[@Rogue-nc3pl]

Solving the conflict through relegious perspective is not productive.

[@IanHarris-fp6dq]

Canada, and even south west Tasmania

[@janecastle655]

God reacts to man's waywardness. Exile x 2. It is a warning for us all. The lampstands will be or are today beingctaken away for waywardness.

[@janecastle655]

So, a 'true Israelite' behaves in God's loving ways, giving oneself to others. Surely it was the total reverse that happened on 7th Oct 23 and is still happening in Samaria. Where is the respect of God’s image in each other?

[@anishamlaoui6734]

East and West European jewish did come to an empty sumaria or judia Every single spot in palestine was a village or a city that existed for hundreds of years Look at their name today in isreal Tel Aviv was a city called tel arabeeh Haifa was an important flourished coast city like Alexandria, tripoli....

[@janecastle655]

When you start with a narrow view you will only interpret narrowly. Thats Amos Trust. Not the whole story.

[@JoshWashington]

The bible refers to the lands in various ways such as the ‘land of Israel’ (Mt 2.20-21; cf. Lk 4.25) and ‘Judea’ and ‘Samaria’ (cf. Lk 1.65; 2.4; Acts 1.8; 8.1; 9.31). Jesus used the nouns ‘Judea’ and ‘Samaria’ (cf. Lk 21.21; Jn 11.7). These names are routinely used today by Israelites and others all over the world to refer to the land. There is no silence here. To deny the land has been called this for thousands of years, is to deny the bible gives an actual historical account of the names given these lands. So it seems telling to me, that one who claims to be 'biblically faithful', does not think anything Jesus said has direct bearing on the ownership of the land, instead referring to the land as ‘Palestine’ rather than ‘Israel’. Its not that this is necessarily the land promised to them, rather *historically* speaking this was the land they lived in and the land that was named after them. The arabs of the land might have been the majority in the land, but that doesn't necessarily mean it was theirs to rule over. Ever since the Ottoman Empire ceded sovereignty to the League of Nations with Britain as administrator of the Palestinian Mandate - the majority was ruled by the minority in terms of international law. As a recognised political entity 'Palestine' didn't exist. By the UN's legal obligations (San Remo Resolution) and according to *customary international law* (Uti possidetis juris), when Israel declared independence, the lands knows as 'Israel', 'Judea' and 'Samaria' were included within the boundaries of the state of Israel for them to rule over. Arabs living there in effect became Israeli citizens, which some accepted and are to this day. Many of which unfortunately rebelled against Israeli rule. As Christians we are to recognise and be subject to these governing authorities (Rom 13:1). i.e. The (secular) state of Israel, in lieu of customary international law, became the governing authority over these lands, instituted by God - just like any other secular governing authority. My understanding of what constitutes a ‘Palestinian’ today is that their identity is not based on residency of the land. Rather, a 'Palestinian' is an arab of the land who seeks to usurp the authority of the acting sovereigns over the land. By these I mean the United Nations (earlier the League of Nations) and the State of Israel. The Palestinian is thus distinct from other arabs of the land who live under or with Israeli sovereignty over the land, of which there are many (e.g. arab Israeli's, Jordanian arabs). In my understanding a Palestinian’s core identity is shaped by the Garden of Eden sin, the desire to displace God's instituted rule and to rule themselves. I refer you to Benny Morris re the Nakba. After many arabs attacked Israel in 1948 (strangely omitted from his discussion) trying to kill the Jews and drive them off the land - there was a variety of reasons why they fled: many fled the conflict being told by Jordan (who attacked Israel) they could stay with them and return when they won, they themselves violently opposed Israel and were driven off and arguably some were driven off as you alone state. But we should note that some stayed and became Israeli or 1948 arabs. Those who fled the conflict weren't permitted to come back. Many don't recognise the return of so many Palestinians opposing Israeli rule would destroy the Israeli state. Nor do these Palestinians seek financial compensation based on evidence of land ownership. They persist in violently opposing any claim to Jewish sovereignty over the land. If Palestinian Christians really want peace they need to give up their opposition to Israel's rule and stop ripping the scab open all the time. Palestinians dont want peace with Israel. They want Israel of 'their land', just look at Corey Gil-Shuster's youtube channel.

[@JoshWashington]

Here is a cold war documentary on the 1948 war. It gives you a good idea of the extent of the conflict and the number of countries who attacked Israel on several fronts. You can see from this the arabs opposing Israel's statehood wanted to kill all the Jews and or drive them out. i.e. Israel was fighting for its life. kzbin.info/www/bejne/eZKsmmBpndqFgqc

[@petermarshall7882]

Take the text about Land seriously. The land was "promised" by Yahweh to the Israelites, but not given to them. Yahweh and Moses subjected a whole generation to deprivation. All but 2 persons died under this persecution while the new generation were toughened up to become brutal fighters. Only then does Yahweh order the fighters to commit multiple genocides in order to claim the land for him, that is Yahweh. Yahweh lied from the very start of the Exodus. Have you spent a lifetime in church service and not even considered what the Biblical authors recorded of their experiences under the yoke of Yahweh? I assume you know Jesus never once uses the name Yahweh to describe the GOD he commends to all humankind.

[@papabear4040]

What a bunch of ignorant nonsense you speak.

[@Rogue-nc3pl]

@@petermarshall7882 it is just a story a propaganda, myth. If you can show yhwh exist then perhaps there is some truth to it.

[@janecastle655]

Peter recognises Jesus as Messiah. The Hebrew recognition of the promised Saviour. Even demons recognise the promised truth of Jesus