Ecler Nuo Send Return Loop / External Effects with Pioneer rmx-1000

[@lacosta323]

I would like to comment this despite the video is very old, because could help WARM 2 owners, since filters on the new Ecler mixer works exactly like this. I own a WARM2 and an old EFX 500. Initially the result was the same: turning on the level of the filter, on the mixer, holding on the volume of the channel I always got a "phaser" like effect on the sound. Then I did some reasoned tests. On the EFX 500 the effect switch has to be in the "ON" position (left filters or right filter, as you want), the mix potentiometer between "original" and "effected" sound has to be 100% on effects. With this parameters I get an incredibile experience, managing the filter amount only with the Effects pot on the WARM 2. Basically this means the unit works very very very well only with effect units which are able to output only the effected sound without mixing it with the original sound. Hope this helps in your choice. #ecler #warm2 #rotary #exf

[@DroidApproved]

How do you find the eq pots on the Warm? Some owners are complaining that they are very wobbly. There is some wiggle to the Nuos that I own (I own a Nuo 2, a Nuo 2.0, and a Nuo 3), but nothing too bad.

[@aquiloote1]

Hello, is your configuration on the Ecler Warm2 with the EFX 500 pre-fader or post-fader? I want to know if you can include effects with the EFX 500 without touching the channel fader of the Ecler Warm2. Thank you

[@Motel-Music]

This was.really helpfull. Now all i need is a rmx-1000 and a standalone mixer 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@ignaciochester2870]

I used to have problems with my ecler nuo 2.0 and a Boss DD7 pedal. Just what you said at the begining of the video, the doble signal levels. I used 2xrca-2 mono jack 6,35. I solved the problem by connecting the pedal input B and output A using some 2xrca-1 mono jack 6,35. This way the pedal goes in sending mode, EFX mode, so now I can use it as in a DJM or a xone. Now it’s perfect. Don’t have to lower any fader. Just roll the dry/wet

[@darrinbisson8914]

I’m not sure i understand the settings you’re describing. Do you have a video for this? I don’t get the input B and output A details. I’m looking at a Warm2 and a hologram effect pedal

[@atetraxx]

​@@darrinbisson8914you gotta use a send and return FX cable. Standard

[@duncanmclellan]

Absolutely spot on. Exactly what I needed!

[@DroidApproved]

Glad to have been of help.

[@andyskinner7163]

BRILLIANT INFO MATE,I KNOW THIS VIDEO IS A GOOD AGE NOW BUT I AM CONSIDERING GETTING A NUO 2.0 AND ADDING SOME FX UNIT.SO THIS KNOWLEDGE IS GREATLY APPRECIATED.WELL DONE AND THANKS FOR UPLOADING

[@DroidApproved]

I'm glad that was helpful for you. You'll love the Nuo 2.0. It is an awesome mixer.

[@philferrar319]

Perfect!..Invaluable knowledge..really like this little mixer!..

[@DroidApproved]

Thank you. It is one of my favorites, as well. Please like and subscribe.

[@butsch2608]

That's exactly what I was looking for, I want to buy a ecler Nuo 3.0, and I wanted to know if I could use an rmx. Thanks for this video! 👌😁

[@DroidApproved]

You're going to love it. Ecler makes great mixers.

[@saleh1267]

Hey, so im deciding between 3 and 3.0.. is the 3.0 much better than the 3 or even worth the difference thanks :)

[@JXVI]

Dude this is f*cking awesome!

[@nuttycommuter3718]

I've got the Nuo 4.0, which is an awesome mixer and had the RMX-500, but sold the RMX because of the phasing issue. It just added an extra complexity to using it that, to me, wasn't worth it for the value the effects added to my gigs. Both units are great and if you really value effects, I can recommend them, but it just wasn't for me.

[@gunjabeans]

Digital FX with a Parallel FX loop. No bueno. Great workaround you show!

[@axelconradt5551]

yes, because of the latency of the digital effect board. That also causes the flanging or phasing sound.

[@NielsMF]

What other effect panels would you suggest? Im not a big pioneer fan…

[@Pyroja]

This is some good knowledge!

[@philsimpson474]

Great video, thanks. I'm using a Nuo 2.0 and was considering the RMX 1000, but was wondering what happens if you switch to post fader. I'm guessing it's back to the phasing issue as there would be no way to take out the channel signal without losing the effect. Thanks again!

[@DroidApproved]

You're exactly correct. Once you switch to post fader, there is no way to avoid the phasing. I'm glad you enjoyed the video. Thanks for watching and please give it a like if you haven't.

[@mattjudson1456]

@@DroidApproved thanks for the info. So it's impossible to do an echo out transition?

[@DroidApproved]

Technically you can, but the signal will phase with the effects post fader.

[@fabianrugies9915]

I have the ecler nuo 4, with the same return/send thing. Can someone tell me if its possible to use the kaos pad mini 2s also with the mixer, because it only has one aux/jack input

[@themainman3900]

Thanks for this video, only one I found that addresses this. I was wondering if you knew what the ideal effects unit would be feature wise to use with this kind of loop that wouldn’t require this workaround, or if your demo is how it’s designed to be used. It seems like it would be virtually impossible to use post fader effects without getting the phasing/volume issue. I’ve seen other people mention needing an effects unit with a wet/dry knob like a kaoss pad when talking about a xone 23 (which I think has the same type of loop), and was considering trying to put something like the xotics effects x-blender in the loop somewhere with a pioneer rmx 500.

[@DroidApproved]

Unfortunately, this is just how this effects loop works. There is not going to be any sort of unit that will allow you to bypass this workaround. The Xone 23 is even worse. I tried using one with an rmx and with a Kaoss Pad, and there was no way to get rid of the phase effect. When people talk about using an effect unit with a "dry/wet" what they actually mean is a send vs direct mode. In send mode, the effects unit only sends the effects signal when it is engaged, meaning it will not pass the dry signal through the unit. Even with a unit like this, you still need to duck the channel fader, because the mixer drops the effects signal back over the master without replacing the original dry signal. A Kaoss Pad is a unit that has a send vs direct option. Hopefully this explanation helps. Let me know if you have any other questions. Thanks for your comment and please drop me a like.

[@fiorenzocannavacciuolo4686]

@@DroidApproved Sorry to jump in, but Allen & Heat mixers have Send/Return like an "INSERT" so you should not hear a "phase" effect when you enable with the button "FX Loop". I own a S2 Mixer and it's like that, i can use DJ Isolators (Like Omnitronic ISO, Bozure, etc) with ease, just using Isolator knobs not together fader and anything else on the mixer. I also read another comment below and it's exactly the same. Could you please clarify this? Is there something i'm missing? On top of that i have one question, what will happen if you use "POST" mode instead of "PRE" ? I'm asking this since i'm evaluating to buy Xone23 or Ecler 2, but i'm really confused about this feature. I would like to have a "full wet" send and return for my isolator. Many thanks in advance

[@DroidApproved]

Post will still phase, and if you pull the channel fader down, you will of course lose all sound (with the exception of the tail of a delay or echo of course, but in the case of an effect like a filter, the sound will naturally cut out). The Xone 23 is completely different, and, in my opinion, useless. That particular mixer does not replace the original signal with the effects signal. Rather, it combines 50% effects with 50% original. As I mentioned, I have used the Xone 23 with both the Pioneer rmx-1000 and a Korg Kaoss Pad. Even with the Kaoss Pad set to "send", there was still phasing because the original signal is still present. I would recommend the Ecler Nuo 2.0 over the Xone 23. Thanks for your comment. Let me know if you have any other questions, and please drop me a like.

[@fiorenzocannavacciuolo4686]

@@DroidApproved Just thinking... With "post" setting, did you ever try to use any other loop fx/machine rather then Pioneer? Could this be lead by a delay in processing and send the sound back? It's pretty unbelievable... I'm not saying i don't not trusting you, many thanks for your help and support, but this sounds so ridiculous to me :D Even more ridiculous is Xone23 that combines 50% effects with 50% original. I have S2 and it doesn't, i perfectly use my Omnitronic ISO. Thanks again!

[@DroidApproved]

Yes, I also have a Korg Kaoss Pad Quad, and it behaves the same. Unfortunately, it's just an old school send/return loop.

[@QRS365]

hey i just got this mixer. do you know how to set it up with Algoriddim DJpro.?

[@ME-rz6en]

Hi, glad I found this video. Many thanks for posting it. Even though the topic might not be that relevant anymore, I still would like post my confusion around this topic. I am analog DJ and thinking of moving from my XONE:02 to NUO 3.0 or 4.0. I would like to use the SP404 for FX and samples. My XONE:02 works perfectly with it: the FX returns are post-fader and 100% wet and the samples are played directly into the mix. The FX control is a switch and doesn’t allow any dry/wet fine-tuning, but it allows to quickly apply the FX with one finger. Now, if I understand correctly, to get the same with the NUO, I would need to turn the knob and same time pull the channel fader (two hands)? I am struggling to understand the benefit of this concept, as I would expect that the FX send knob would allow to define the dry/wet proportion (all the way right: wet, similar to the switch on my XONE). Is this simply a workflow-bug? I am wondering, if this concept also applies to the NUO 3.0 and NUO 4.0, as they have an additional FX Return control. Respectively, if the 4.0’s general FX Send could be used to control the wetness. However, based on my intensive research on the web and consultation of the block diagram (not a technical expert, though), I believe this is not the case, hence the fader pulling is required in any of the models. Any further experience / insights? Cheers.

[@DroidApproved]

As I mentioned in the video, the mixer drops the effects signal back into the master on top of the original audio, so it results in a phasing effect since there are two overlapping signals. The send knob on the Nuo is not a "dry/wet" control, but rather a volume control. The effects signal will always come in 100% wet. The reason for pulling the volume fader down is so that when the effects are engaged, you will only be hearing the wet effects signal. You don't HAVE to pull the channel fader down, but if you don't you will hear a phasing effect from the two overlapping signals. All of the Nuo mixers work this way. Again, the send potentiometer is volume control NOT a wet/dry control. Hopefully, this makes it clearer for you, because I don't know of any other way to describe it. LOL. Good luck!

[@ME-rz6en]

@@DroidApproved yeah, many thanks! I just wish they had made it more flexible back then, as there are not many analog alternatives available anymore.

[@DroidApproved]

Good deal. That being said, the Ecler Nuo line are excellent analog mixers. I love them and would recommend them to anyone.

[@demo_1]

Nice video! I'm thinking about buying the same mixer (the updated 2.0 version) but I have some concernes. I see the cons on the layout of the effects loop in this mixer, but I have a question: How about using the thrid micro/line channel as an aux return? So the setup would be: fx send into the rmx-1000, output of the rmx-1000 into the third channel of the mixer. This way, when switched to pre-fade, you can control both the amount of the channel signal that goes into the effects unit (with the fx send knob) and how much of it is going back into the mix with the ch3 knob. I don't think it will solve the phasing issue with the filter but certainly it would improve the amount of control you can have on the mix (e.g. when using echo/delays).

[@DroidApproved]

You could run it that way, but I don't think there would really be anything to be gained by doing it that way. Let me know how it works out for you.

[@demo_1]

@@DroidApproved Since I don't have the mixer, and the phasing issue on the filter is kind of a deal breaker for me, could you please try it yourself and report back here if the phasing issue still remains? I would be so thankful

[@DroidApproved]

I guarantee it will phase unless the channel volume is off as I show in the video.

[@demo_1]

@@DroidApproved I see. Thank you!

[@david87trs]

Hi! Thanks a lot for the video. It's very interesting. I was wondering if I use a guitar pedal should I have to make the same "trick" to avoid phase issue? So, in other words, it's a RMX 1000 "problem" or an Ecler Nuo "problem? Thanks!

[@DroidApproved]

I believe it is the way the loop is set up on the mixer itself, because this also happens with Korg Koass Pads, which have their own wet/dry controls on the unit. I have no idea what would happen with a guitar pedal, but I suspect more of the same. If you try it, please let me know. Thanks.

[@david87trs]

@@DroidApproved Ok! I'm going to order an Ecler 2.0 this week. However, I will use it with a soundcard and traktor+xone k2. As soon as I buy a guitar pedal, I will try it. Thanks!

[@czonerelax]

Good vid man..

[@JustinAzeiMusic]

I tried this with xone 92. Cant do this like you. Always phase

[@samuelgriffard4748]

I'm purchasing this mixer and im wondering if you could answer a question about the fx ive been having. Ive seen in other mixers fx sends (pioneer, xone) it appears you can operate them in mono or stereo. I can't find any documentation saying that this mixer has this function. Id like to know because this would impact my decision on what fx to buy..theres lots of great mono reverb and delays, but if it only comes in on L or R its not gonna be useful

[@DroidApproved]

Unfortunately the mixer only runs stereo out. The send/return inputs and outputs are left and right rca jacks.

[@samuelgriffard4748]

@@DroidApproved thank you for the prompt reply. I decided to say fuck it and just get some Y cables.

[@DroidApproved]

LOL! Right on. Let me know how you like the mixer.

[@samuelgriffard4748]

@@DroidApproved mixer sounds great! Feels like a huge step up from my numark m4, and im excited to gig with it once covid is over. I got an earthquake devices space spiral to use as a reverb/delay pedal and two 1/4 to rca y cables to plug it in. I thought they would double the signal for faux mono, but I was wrong, so I'm having to get a 1/4 ts to 1/4 trs adapter to do that. Other then that no issues. I chose to have the fx come in on the 3rd middle channel instead of the fx return because it feels easier to use that way- just adding signal to my echo chamber channel.

[@DroidApproved]

Excellent! Using the third line is a legit way to add effects. Nice one!

[@saleh1267]

Hey, so im deciding between nuo 3 and 3.0.. is the 3.0 much better than the 3 or even worth the difference thanks :)

[@DroidApproved]

They are basically the same, with some slight differences. The Nuo 3.0 has vu meters on each channel, whereas the Nuo 3 has a vu meter for the cued channel. Also, the Nuo 3 has an extra line input per channel over the 3.0. I think you would be happy with either of them.

[@loudimages]

why not trying the output of the fx unit into the line in (not the return on fx loop), so you can use the fx on the other channel than 1 or 2 where you hook the turntables. so you can engage it and control it with the knobs in the middle, independent volume no matter what you play on the turntable (will not have to do tricks with the fx knob and channel volume fader).

[@DroidApproved]

You would still need to duck the volume on the channel to eliminate phasing.

[@franzwilhelm9682]

So it is not possible to have a effect per channel while mixing only on the master?

[@DroidApproved]

I'm sorry, but I don't quite understand your question. You can use effects on one or both channels, but you can only apply one effect at a time, depending on your effects unit. Does this help?

[@franzwilhelm9682]

@@DroidApproved yes !! and I bought one ! and it works!! :)

[@franzwilhelm9682]

And your video was the best on the subject! thanks for the help. @@DroidApproved

[@DroidApproved]

Franz, I'm glad to have been of help. Ecler made some really great mixers.

[@WestCoastFront]

Had this mixer for about 10 years but never did use any effects. Don't like how you need to turn down the volume. I'm glad I never bought an effects processor for this mixer.

[@adag1oeth]

Bro what a piontless setup, then you might as well use it at master out. Long story short rmx is useless xD cause of the delay

[@djnofo]

Very nice explanation! I have an Allen & Heath Xone 23c. I have the same issues with the phasing but i don't have any dry/wet knobs on my mixer. Are there any effect units i can use? I had a EFX-1000 but sold it last month because of this issue.

[@DroidApproved]

Thanks for watching. With regards to your question, I haven't used that mixer, so I'm not sure. Did you try lowering the fader when you engaged the send on that channel?

[@gunjabeans]

The Xone mixers and Nuo both have Parallel FX loops. Delays and Reverbs are ideal in Parallel FX loops. Turn the mix to 100% on the FX unit and blend it in on the mixer when needed. A guitar fx pedal would be a good choice. Phasers, Flangers and Filters should not go in a Parallel FX Loop. They are better to put on the master out or a linear fx loop like on a Bozak AR-4. In this video when he pulls the fader down he is demonstrating how a Parallel FX loop mixes side by side with your original (dry) signal. The FX are not ON your original signal, but beside it. In other words, the wet FX are a separate signal in addition to your dry signal. With digital FX there is a few milliseconds of time that the computer chip needs to process the info. When mixed in side by side with the dry signal as they are in a Parallel FX loop, they are not aligned in time. This causes a weird sound called phasing because the waveforms cancel some frequencies out. This is known as Phase Cancelation.

[@djgorey]

@@gunjabeans That's a perfect explanation! Thanks :-)

[@djcolindale]

Works great with the Xone 96. I'm guessing the connections are quite similar.

[@standard931]

Bit of a noob question... What's the point of these fx?

[@DroidApproved]

Just Google "dj effects". You will get plenty of answers.

[@masterblaster8119]

Does ot work exactly the same on Nuo 2.0?

[@DroidApproved]

Yes.

[@andykelly7321]

That is by far the dumbest workaround or whatever you wanna call it I have ever seen. This comment is no way aimed at you or your video. The fact that you have to kill a channel while turning a knob to use an effect and then re up the channel and turn back down the knob after you're done using it is just nuts. I was thinking about getting an RMX but watching this has completely put me off. I guess thanks man :)

[@DroidApproved]

LOL. I don't know what to tell you. That's just the way a routed effects loop (vs insert) works. Another option is to send it to the aux channel, but you'd still have to duck the main if you don't want phasing. It's the same way on other mixers as well.

[@andykelly7321]

That's just crazy but I guess you gotta make it work. :)