Threat Assessment: A Brief Examination | Magic: the Gathering Commander

[@irbricksceo]

Never forget the most important part of threat analysis. Convincing the table that it isn't you!

[@CYBERHOTS555]

kzbin.info/door/vTsAzlGNC3e9EfFBBQ8iiA

[@davidhansen5067]

I see a lot of KZbin Threat Assessment in Commander Clash comments, and I think it's worth noting that sometimes, the viewer actually has information that the players don't, which affects that assessment in a huge way too.

[@Niuttuc]

(For context, in the case of Commander Clash, viewers can see the hands of all players at all time, while the players can only see their own)

[@davidhansen5067]

@@Niuttuc The man himself! Thanks, probably should have clarified myself.

[@sheahon1179]

I love watching some poor fool get called out for not watching the video! I saw that video and Baby Lasagna is just scary impressive no matter what budget every time I see it. This kind of meta knowledge and spiral fractal thought patterns video is always cool to watch. It is good to make me think, even if it makes my head hurt sometimes.

[@bobby45825]

And D) by not telling him, you technically wiped a player out, so it's a win/win/win in that specific scenario you presented.

[@GFreeGamer]

I'm lucky cos I play in a pod that is very familiar with each other. We've learned to respect when others are calm about situations. It helps that after a game, we generally chat about our threat assessments and what we had hidden in our hand over drinks.

[@onajewilliams3007]

*Plays Hapatra.* "Oh, he's making snakes" *Plays Yawgmoth.* "Oh...he's making snakes..."

[@robertwood1689]

Lmao it's black I never trust them snakus

[@balonius]

I always enjoy how well spoken and particular you are with the words you choose to use.

[@normative]

“Why didn’t you tell me before I scooped?” Because… then the combo player might not have attacked, in which case you’d still be stuck facing someone with a “make infinite creature tokens” engine on board?

[@vengray8055]

Yup, real dumb question

[@brianray3956]

I super love these videos. The number of times I've gone from "REALLY?!?!" to being like "Ooooooooooooh okay now I get it" has happened to me more times than I care to admit and it's so sooooooo helpful to get these kinds of insights into why that happens to me and how I can fix that.

[@CYBERHOTS555]

kzbin.info/door/vTsAzlGNC3e9EfFBBQ8iiA

[@vasylpark2149]

I've also been in games where someone goes, "hey that's a threat please someone deal with it," the other two go "I'm not worried," and a turn or 2 later and oops they won with obvious threat that was obvious.

[@xayidegreymind5782]

The biggest problem I tend to have with threat assessment at my lgs is most players tend to "since I can't deal with threat ill kick the player who is down so I can get something done"

[@kirodos]

As someone who is either the archenemy or the one who is down I feel this. Especially if I just one a game and am now playing a different deck that isn't working as intended they will throw stuff at me and ignore the actual threat in the new game.

[@jasonholmes5714]

Yeah, I’ve seen this. I vividly remember a game where player A was ahead and couldn’t be attacked into; meanwhile, player B had a huge offense that couldn’t be deployed against the opponent doing the most-so they just clowned the other players at the table until they were dead. (I was one of those dead.)

[@CYBERHOTS555]

kzbin.info/door/vTsAzlGNC3e9EfFBBQ8iiA

[@ClexYoshi]

this is a very good discussion to be had because goodness knows threat assessment is something that I'm probably not the greatest at, and at the same time I've let salt dictate when I think threat assessment was not great in a situation. I apologize when that comes up, or at least I try to. the story about Joey's friend scooping in response to infinite Zealous Conscripts tokens is a prime example of why I make it clear that at my table, we scoop at sorcery speed, much like how the command zone does it.

[@Shadow298]

So many great & valid points in this video. Shared it with my play groups because so many people I know (even myself) get caught up on specific things too often, missing the bigger picture or something more obvious from a distance. But I am the player who sits quietly building doing things, misdirecting things so I can win my way, so often do take advantage of other player's poor assessment of things. though I'll always be 100% honest when asked if what I am doing is lethal or dangerous for everyone.

[@vengray8055]

Everyone has to learn in there own ways. Losing to the quiet guy in the corner is a good way to learn.

[@voltcorp]

Your story of the iconic "problem for you" queen reminded me of the Christmas episode of LRR's Elder Dragon Social Club. Wheeler pointed out a huge threat from Serge to Ben, who could deal with it, and Ben immediately told Serge basically "I won't destroy it if it won't come for me until Wheeler's dead". 😂💀

[@Yontanian]

and this is why it's not always helpful to remove threats too early. You might need player A to defeat player b. so you can then defeat player A.

[@joshuaordonez1113]

Players act like cards in your hand deserve to be public knowledge the moment they're in a bind

[@teradul2480]

As someone who plays Vaevictis Asmadi, there's also stuff that plays into threat assessment that doesn't relate at all to the cards being played. Before I deploy the boi in my games I'm always reiterating how I'm playing to make friends and big stuff happen, so if there is a card you don't want Vaevictis to hit when I swing you can just ask. And at that point, if Vaevictis is a card you feel threatened by because he can dismantle your value engine, you're basically wrong, because he can easily be aimed somewhere else. You could've not use your answers on Vaevictis and maybe even gotten something out of it by pointing out a juicy target on the other side of the table.

[@vengray8055]

Not everyone talks or makes deals at the table like that. I can totally see you blaming someone for not saying something lol. Good gimmick.

[@teradul2480]

@@vengray8055 @Ven Gray I'm not saying that every table is going to be having those kinds of deals, but that even the stuff that's not the game pieces themselves have influence on threat assessment. Just shared my own experience with it. Also, "blaming people for not speaking up" is a lot, and I'm sorry if it came out like that in the comment.

[@vengray8055]

​@@teradul2480 You're giving an explanation of how a game could go with your deck and how what could be perceived as a threat doesn't have to be with some negotiation or table talk. That's legit. It did not come across like you blamed people for not speaking up just seeing how someone could try that salty move lol. My bad. Good insight on your games and how things aren't as bad as they seem with some negotiation.

[@Rahzeil]

This is great stuff. I've definitely met people who NEED to see this video.

[@MonkeyGone2Heaven650]

Love how you used Batwing Brume as an example. Love that card lol.

[@mtgsus]

Sometimes people just make rushed decisions. I had a game once where someone locked the board with darksteel forge and nev disk and 3 opponents scooped up (5 player game). As soon as my turn began, the nev disk was activated but I countered the ability and I won before the other players where done reshuffling 😂

[@EpicDinosaur862]

My play group sees a Llanowar Elves: Swords yo Plowshare. Sees a blightsteel: Shruggs it off.

[@markbrierley6367]

I enjoyed your point about people having views on what is or isn't scary. It's very optimistic. It doesn't directly mention skill level contributing to people actually misjudging threats even when pointed out or chaos players who just want to watch the world burn and it doesn't mention people just making mistakes. I know I make mistakes assessing threats sometimes. My most embarrassing story is a game we still talk about at my LGS when a guy Oko'd an Urza that was helming a monoU bounce deck, had stumbled on mana, and had only cast 6 spells the whole game when there was an Ur-dragon out with a Klauth. I blew up. When finally we got an answer about why he had done it he said, "it's a game and I don't care and maybe he won't target me now." Cut to two turns later: a free Fiery Emancipation and Old Gnawbone along with more than a full new grip of cards from the Ur-dragon deck, the Oko player still believed what he had done was the correct play as he and I died to that combat.

[@hanschristopherson8056]

Also sometimes players didn’t realize something was scary because they didn’t read it or because it was a new card to them and they didn’t understand how it worked

[@travisbrandt8663]

Thank you Joey for everything you do. 🥰 love videos like this. Preach

[@MrDegan2]

While I see your point at 5:48 I've also seen and been part of plenty of games where someone was declared a threat, another player thought they could handle it and thus didnt help. And then the declared threat proved to be to much for anyone to handle. It's a fine line to walk

[@QU67Reacher6]

I wanted to also emphasize the cards in hand/card draw point. I've started pointing that out in my games if people start talking about what's a problem. Like, yeah, the elfball deck can almost go off and make 20 tokens or something, but they're top decking with no on-board card draw. In that case, I try to say, "I don't think they're a big problem right now." That phrasing in and of itself also contributes to my opponents' threat assessment. They may think I have answers cause I have seven cards in hand and steady card draw, but I'm sitting here staring at late game finishers and mana flooded lands. They don't know that, but perception's a big part of playing. I'm still working on remembering that, and even more so I'm still working on not getting annoyed when people aren't dealing with the "biggest threat." Turns out, Magic's complicated.

[@morrius0757]

I find that the biggest threats are card advantage, if a card is doing something the deck is specifically meant to do and it's doing it exceptionally, be afraid. That player is popping off and they're going to have the upper hand unless your starting hand and draws were nuts.

[@CYBERHOTS555]

kzbin.info/door/vTsAzlGNC3e9EfFBBQ8iiA

[@azazelmorningstar5631]

Something that always baffles me especially when dealing with stax pieces is people getting salty because I don't deal with them, like dude I have zero graveyard intetaction, I'm not enabling your reanimator deck, especially since you already killed me with it, that rest in peace is my friend right now

[@stoopidpursun8140]

I love getting into a game where someone is playing Kinnan and throws a fit because people instantly kill him the moment he hits the table.

[@vengray8055]

"Why are you playing that?". In that context it was pure ego talk from that guy. He felt like an idiot for scooping and being wrong about who he predicted to win so to counterbalance that he tried to make you feel bad instead to throw the blame off his own stupidity. Classic salty ego talk. I hope you asked him a question to his question. "Why aren't you playing this card?".

[@TuMekeTimmeh]

great video, Joey! Thanks for being you

[@matthews5692]

I think the best way to evaluate threats is just to evaluate the board state openly in game. Playing down the fact that we all don't know which cards can do what with what other pieces, etc. is worthless after just one turn of seeing how the engine operates when it is turned on even just a little bit. Take a moment at the start of a turn just to acknowledge what just happened after the last full rotation, which cards are doing what, who has the most mana available, cards in hand, etc. You can throw in a little shade hypothesizing about what cards are getting played next, who is getting swung at or what you liked or didn't like about it and see how players react to it. This gives you a little bit of subtle tells or hints about what other's plans are or see who's really wanting to strike a deal. Another important thing is just understanding the level of game you are playing in, what the turn zero conversations were like and who is actually living up to those expectations. Sometimes people just get lucky hands and become a problem very early, which isn't their fault and just rng. And most of the times they know it too. Probably the most important thing is to remember that it is just a game and, though some want to win more than others do, to keep it fun and light. If a threat assessment was bad explain your reasoning and apologize for it, then move on. Do your best to never make anything personal.

[@joefjunior]

Love this. Thanks!

[@Vangeltheunderdog]

In regard to threat assessment, there is another factor that the viewer absolutely cannot see, nor feel; that factor is assertiveness. If you have regulars at a card shop (or wherever you happen to gather frequently) and notice specific individuals who make you scratch your head as to how they are able to more consistently win by other players not picking apart their board and instead focus on each other, it can be because that player knows how to influence other people into misdirecting their perception of who the threat is. For instance, at my local game store, we have a regular who consistently has ~50% or higher win rate, not simply because he packs all the fast mana, but because he is very skilled at making people who don't know him yet make "poor" plays. He is able to convince them that someone else is the threat because of such and such reason and they will fall for it. The easiest way he convinces them is by bringing up life totals as an excuse to target someone else, for instance, he will have a massive board-state and a Mana Crypt/Ancient Tomb pinging him and people will beat the ever living crap out of my life total when I have basic lands and a small creature or something else minor, allowing him to outpace the table and cascade out of control. What will usually happen when our life totals all get low is that he'll convince them to blow up all of my blockers and knock me out of the game, then combo off and win on his turn after I'm knocked out. In short, people viewing from outside the game will not experience the pressure of a skilled individual's ability to misdirect the "perception" of threat levels; it's a whole other factor to consider.

[@psychozen7169]

Joe that beard is all the threat we need. Your pass the itchy scratchy scruff phase in to the long soft beard. I just never can get past the itchy scratchy phase and must shave it.

[@nharviala]

This reminds me of a time my friends and I had a small series going. We spent $10 for online decks to play on MTGO, and would upgrade weekly with packs once the initial decks were built. I made Tayam, a deck I was intimately familiar with, and played Survival of the Fittest (40 cents online, woo!). My friend, who was not the strongest at threat assessment at the time, decided to leave it, despite the other two players saying this would end the game next turn, as I only had enough mana for one activation in response to removal, and they were right. I had several combos ready to pop the moment I untapped, and he still used his green removal on something more personally annoying for him. We've had to instill a better sense of threat removal into him since then.

[@DaveTheNoob]

Amazing video. Clear and consice points made, and delivered in a way everyone can understand! Videos like this are important for diving deeper into the philosophies of the game 😄🤟

[@hugmonger]

Joey failed to assess the threat of people being self-aggrandizing and ignoring what he said entirely in this video.

[@deathshop2172]

goddamn, batwing brume seems pretty cool

[@patricksaville8672]

As an Oona player I leave the mono deck as her “food source”. I’ve played against a lot of Krenko decks and Oona can stand her own, especially with cabal coffers, deserted temple, and Urborg tomb lands out. Everyone’s looking at me to “deal” with Krenko, meanwhile I’m the one who doesn’t want them to die yet cuz I can manage their board and I get faeries from exiling pieces of their library because it’s mono red lol. But Krenko swings out and kills one player, said player yells at me, but then I tap out and exile the remaining Krenko library gaining 20+ faeries and then swing out next turn and kill the other player. Threat assessment is definitely about perspective.

[@Onattamato]

I think those sorts of comments boil down more to desperately needing validation and wanting to sound smart as opposed to any earnest attempt to critique.

[@thunderpup7899]

Love this.

[@Pairsath]

two words: Well said!

[@infernotitan1158]

I was part of a game where I was assembling a few different engines, and suddenly he went from holding down a bit of the other decks to completely taking me out of the game. But I'd just dropped a key piece for my entire strategy without anyone making much of a note about it. It was a fantastic display of high-level threat assessment and I was honestly impressed by it.

[@karuptedninja2000]

My solution to threat assessment has been to always assume my opponents made the objective best move they had at a given point so I won't over extend or overstep what I can when politicking

[@dude5556man]

This is exactly why, when i play The Gitrog Monster, everyone in the table shoots almost instantly to kill me.

[@felipeguidolin1055]

Regarding threat asses, i think my biggest level up moment was learning to fly under the radar. My best game ever was when I was playing Ayula vs Lathril vs Kalemne... I was being very careful to have less creatures than the elf deck, and have smaller creatures than the giant deck. If you would stop to count the power I was way ahead, but if you were only looking at how many creatures there were, or who had the biggest thing, you would not notice me.

[@jorisreichert5969]

Exactly, learning to fly under the radar is a level of strategy that many players are not properly aware of. It's also different per group, I have a playgroup that undervalues the mana capacities or cards in hand way too often, so waiting to deploy after a first boardwipe becomes a very strong strategy at that table.

[@oelboy]

Funny. Just last weekend a buddy of mine got really angry at me for not seeing an Urza, Lord High Artificer deck with an Unwinding Clock on the table as a threat. But the Urza player had no cards in hand and I had multiple deathtouch blockers and a counterspell on my hand... 😅

[@LogoMotive11]

I really get frustrated when people don't let things play out. I fully understand scooping when death will take a long time to rest solve and everyone agree to just start a new game. However I've had to give up free information alot of times because I had an answer on hand but the opponent just wanted everyone to scoop and because I insisted on playing it out, the opponent winning will use extra recourses against me that they may not have normally used before they thought I had something. Great video!

[@andrewpark78]

The cards in hand thing is huge. (Also why I get upset when people hide their hands in their laps or whatever but that’s a different topic). Also using body language and how much time they spend deciding as tells is very important which you don’t get in a video. Someone keep glancing at their hand every time you say move to combat? Probably has something. Someone sits there looking defeated off into the distance every time they say pass? Probably no interaction. There’s so much info besides the board state you need to take in that without the benefit in hindsight by being able to finish the video then judge, I’d be surprised if KZbin commentators were more accurate than random chance.

[@vengray8055]

Not everyone pays attention to tells as easily as others but everyone can pay attention to hand size which is HUGE. ALWAYS ASK ABOUT THOSE CARDS IN HAND. Especially when they hiding them ;).

[@Theizzy2265]

Recently in a game, I had a board with 8 charges Everflowing Chalice and a Skullclamp, among other stuff. One player then decided to remove my skullclamp, and the other players started to say "why won't you remove the chalice? He is ramping infinite". The answer was: "He has one card in hand. If I can't let him draw anything more, the ramp doesn't do anything". I find this episode funny because the player who targeted my skullclamp has more experience with mtg and card games in general than the other two, so he tend to have a more accurate game sense than just considering what's he is seeing in the table.

[@vengray8055]

@@Theizzy2265 That is a very experienced player. Those other 2 can learn something from him.

[@MachiriReviews]

>be me >playing Bladewing >chillin, just setting up >opponent playing ghalta >ghalta guy already has ghalta out, and like 5 other gigantic dinosaurs >i play bury alive and bury anger and two utility dragons >table goes braindead, forget about freaking jurassic park right across from me and annihilate me right after I play it >ghalta guy annihilates them within the next couple turns I was literally the only person keeping the ghalta in check and burying Anger was like hitting them with a freaking discombobulation ray.

[@Vrir16]

Had a similar gameplay experience. My buddy's scarab god wasn't mostly creatures whereas Strefan was leading my vampires with a large creature board state. So when Ruric Thar came out my buddy called it out and I just sat there and laughed quietly to myself

[@vengray8055]

Classic for you moment

[@Rococorico]

Threat assessment is a social skill much more than a game knowledge matter. People need to play out the priority cycle and pass their opportunity to intervene more often. Their opponents aren't just opponents, they're also assets. Sometimes it may backfire? Sure. I've seen a Temporal Extortion RESOLVING recently. Each pod will have a different solution to any given problem, and that's one of the beauties of the format.

[@dougystyle79]

First, you'll never see me comment on Commander gameplay content regarding gameplay. It's almost like yelling at the TV when Sportsball is on. "The hell do I know? I'm not there playing the game." Peanut gallery tomfoolery aside, absolutely loved your video, Joey! At my LGS' Commander League, we have all experience levels of players, from those who bought their 1st pre-con and are wading the waters to the old farts like me that built a deck from a legend they found in the bottom of the pool. There are players that think they know everything and thus worry about everything, and there are some (like me) who know too much and try not to have a stroke thinking about it. If it happens... oh well, the combo popped... chalk that up to experience. But never scoop until your life total reads 0, take every opportunity you can to learn from an experience. Didn't mean to go all existential and inspiring there. I just wanted to compliment on your great work, not turn into a motivational poster found at a workplace's break room.

[@breyor1]

Rattle Snaking: attention pulling plays, cards. I had the unfortunate tendency to rattle snake, to the point I was default arch enemy. The frustrating part, was I’d build increasingly funny, and obscure decks that would be strong with a glaring weakness. My fav is Ghalta, you board wipe her, an she be struggling to get back, but if you didn’t she ran people over. I digress, threat assessment is a vexing topic for me, because I’ve been on the receiving end of “double suicide” plays that someone throws their game specifically to make sure I can’t even play. And when interrogated, simply reply “because I didn’t want you to win.” Which, is fair up until they sacrifice their own game, a thing I simply can not play around, because the number of potential threats to me multiplies exponentially if they don’t care about winning, just seeing me lose. I like my game knowledge and skill to be challenged, an a 3v1 tend to be very fun for me. However, it irks me when my personal threat assessment seems to be off when I’ve played mountain, pass, 3 turns in a row and then eat 2 stripmine an a counter spell on my meme commander. Then player C wins because they assembled their 11 mana combo without resistance

[@ozzysmith2571]

Hey my reply made it into an edhrec video!! Let's goooo

[@ThePirateCommander]

Joey be honest, did part of your budget go into having five copies of Baba Lysaga? Were you holding back your true power that game?

[@patonnight]

9:56 that is not extensive knowledge, that is just a toxic player. I'm sorry you had to go through that experience, people like that just ruin the fun at the table.

[@danielharrison2383]

the biggest problem i have with threat assessment is when you are being targeted into the ground by another player and EVERYONE else has no idea why. i have a fairly friendly group and sometimes other people join in. every now and again someone will just try to nuke a person into the ground that everyone agreed was not even remotely a threat.

[@benvictim]

100% agree. This is my biggest issue. I was playing a stasis deck, which to he fair can be annoying and mean. Over 10 turns in which I had 2 mana that whole time, he did 51 damage to me. Yeah I had some life gain, but he singled me out and focused me hard when I was doing nothing for turns on end. He lost to the Voltron player who everyone else said was a threat.

[@imanimason5858]

Great Video!!!

[@venenuminauro]

I will never understand how my whole playgroup focus on my Mesmering Orb because I am "milling all their lands" instead of killing a Korvold when it ETB lol.

[@vengray8055]

You don't understand that some people hate mill more than anything else? Well I got news for you. Those people are out there and sound like they in your playgroup. Many people irrationally hate things they don't like.

[@azazelmorningstar5631]

As a fan of the orb it always amazed me how visceral is the people's response to it, they threat it almost like a blightsteel colossus, even though it's really doing nothing and most cards they mill are cards they weren't going to draw anyway (also they should have more lands if that's the problem)

[@RuudAwakening]

Thats kinda funny! Point them out that milling (unless tutoring to the top or scrying) changes 0 outcome. Decks are shuffled, draws are random, so is the mills. Thats it. If that doesnt hit their ability to relativize.. make a hobby out of it to play that 2mana artifact in every deck, have a good laugh at the cortisol you’re producing, and one day they might see that thingy never changed or won a game but something else (like that Korvold) did

[@vengray8055]

​@@RuudAwakening yeah you can talk all the science and logic you want that was explained on tg, reddit or whatever pod you listened to but people that hate mill more than anything won't be listening. Been there.

[@RuudAwakening]

@@vengray8055 than the options remains to laugh at it xD But I understand the atmosphere in EDH games needs to stay fun, even more when playing with your friends God speed man :)

[@tonyrosetti2738]

Good stuff!

[@redbirdriot]

I know, a second comment, but I really loved this episode. I'm certainly not the best strategic player out there, but I get really tired of the "discourse" about threat assessment for all of what you described here - people who have imperfect information pretending that they don't. Fwiw - I'm totally the player to try and convince everyone that something is a threat, even if it's just a threat to me ;) Politics is how I win.

[@vengray8055]

Playing with newbs is easy huh

[@ThatTarkur]

I think in the end it all boils down to rule 0 discussions. I've been a victim too bad treat assesment on my end but I've also been stuck at tables with way more fine tuned/optimised decks than mine. Because I generally only build decks around what I myself figure out. Anyhow great vid

[@jackmarino8162]

People just don't take other factors into consideration. Magic is such a complex game, yet most players focus on one card at a time. You drop a Rhystic Study people just think card advantage. I see the Rhystic study, I start thinking about mana output. At some point the cards you draw are dead in hand as you just don't have the resources to play them. Other factors matter. Edit: The bird's eye view is so true. I play these bombs which are flashy and obviously bad for everyone, but it's all a Red herring for the knife in the other hand. For instance I play Kruphix Hydras. I have Simic Ascendancy in the deck as well as enough recursion to keep it. People waste removal or tutors in an attempt to stop me from winning. They just kind of ignore the 40/40 hydra that's just waiting for me to give it trample.

[@calebbrown1068]

High time to watch this video after getting first my Stolen Strategy and then my Wand of Wonder blown up by an opponent, with a shared opponent’s Rhystic Study sitting on the table.

[@RobRuckus65]

I automatically treat Teysa and any form of elfball as high priority threats. Elves can go from a couple unassuming mana dorks to 20 20/20 tramplers in the blink of an eye.

[@MultiDAXDAX]

Don't know too much to avoid the Ego Don't know too little to avoid the Fear The Buddhist way to approach EDH (and everything else ;)

[@mitchstanek7809]

Idea for a video: how to subvert threat assessment. Like how do you sandbag either by your plays or while building your deck so that you don't draw the ire of the table.

[@takingchances7239]

I think a pretty important part of peoples threat assessment is also the history they've had against the deck. I have a satorou umezawa deck built to ninjitsu blightsteel and other huge threats as fast as possible. I played against a group that has another satorou deck but is legit ninjas and so their threat evaluation was way off when i had a unblockable creature and just searched for a card.

[@777vid]

remember, scooping first makes you a quitter. scoop last 👍

[@shawnmsattler2116]

I had a table when they saw a white card sleeve in a deck of red, is Jocolompusus, in close to to, destroy everything including land and that deck has destroy all opposition land. It was a casual game and told yhem if I get theses I will Dis guard them. The deck is a lvl 6 or7 power but I had crux of fate and still wiped there creatures out. Still lost to a blue deck.

[@garysalazar5279]

If I am not the threat then something went wrong

[@camfunme]

I have a problem where most of my decks play to the board, and one of my opponents always brings different combo decks. I typically don't draw the right answers to his combos, which inevitably means I choose to use 'player' removal on him instead, even when his board is relatively empty. But then he gets annoyed and/or revenge because I "always target him, unneccessarily". I've continuously added more counterspells and spot removal, but I'm afraid this threat assessment is unlikely to change much, as he typically brings the most $$, spike and combo decks and the other players typically play weaker synergies and to the board like me, so I'm not as afraid of them. Not sure what to do here...

[@Garl_Vinland]

Superfriends decks are always archenemy

[@ryantriplett6512]

Plz make EDHREC show more NEW cards on its own tab. it only shows like the top 4 to 5 at a time. show more!

[@Johnintheplace]

We all know a serial scooper who packs up before someone fogs haha

[@justinwhite2725]

Back in the day in MTGO i played Ghost Coucil Orzhova (before the blinking spirits rule rewrite - damage used to go on the stack) I remember one game in particular. The unwritten rule was whoever attacked first got ganked. I was nickle and diming everyone Orzhov style and everyone had the perception i was 'friendly'. The most aggressive player tried to convince everyone inwas the biggest threat (i was). He attacked me. He had big threatening cratures but i had ghosts of the pennitent or somesuch that haved all damage. The other two players ganged up on him to protect me. He attacked first after all. The player was furious. Started calling them all sorts of names and said thst if they didnt take me out now i would win. He was right. Though as I recall the runner up who I was 1v1 against had some good counterplay to me and it was not an easy win.

[@tatsukinomiya]

AMAZING vid

[@dli199214]

I face a player who does not understand why people go at him everytime, even though he has the strongest deck .

[@orgazmo686971]

This is bugging me, I swear I saw the game Joey's referring to at the 4:30 mark but can't remember it. Was it a Hijinks episode? Which one?

[@damnjekyll]

That dude from the comment section got an entire video dedicated to him, I'd say he bested you in battle tbh 😅 Jokes aside, great talking points 😉

[@tulicloure]

Regarding the point that sometimes a player is only a threat to you, it's also valid to act like you don't know that and try to convince others that they are a threat to everyone. ;) Misdirection, bluffing and politics are important parts of the subject in-game, and "youtube comments" tend to miss on that.

[@mattmonster8402]

You got to consider if a player just wants to see the game end in a certain way. I don't know how many times a friend or I has made a decision that leads to an entertaining ending of the game 😁

[@thezerohero9883]

heres one bit that always kinda sucks. so i play a lot of mishra (effectively the precon with some upgrades) and ill get down a bunch of artifact reducers and mana rocks, and ALWAYS immediately get focused down. every time the explanation is " oh well you woulda just pulled out mishra and a bunch of artifacts" the last game i was told this, i was like "ah yes the commander that requires blue when all i have is red and colorless right now and 0 cards in hand"

[@Kresimir_]

"watching the game explains the game" lolol

[@TheAngelRaven]

Before playing Magic: Storm-Kiln Artist? Seems ok. Me, playing against an Izzet Storm deck: Storm-Kiln... Artist... Respoooooooooooonses?

[@spacewizardpip1111]

I recently started playing a Breya list. Nothing that amazing, but I swear I get the “threat assessment”, tossed at me as my commander is almost immediately slapped with Removal lmaooo

[@bobby45825]

I actually have a tendency at my tables to intentionally say nothing and let my opponents just stir themselves into a frenzy. Sometimes that get's me blown out but other times it makes them start clutching certain cards crazy hard or blowing their removal on my decoys way too early.

[@zerovi3331]

Same here my friends start to get scared of me when I'm not making deals or staying quiet because they think something big is coming however sometimes I do that now just as a bluff cuz ik they expect me to not take deals if I can either win or knock someone out of the game

[@ceroluthor]

Joey only made this video to blast that guy in the comments lol don't lie :P

[@danielgoldberg2129]

Okay, someone plays a Tutor and digs for the best card in their deck, they’re the threat.😂

[@andrewrockwell1282]

On the topic of scooping, I never scoop alone. If anyone feels like we shouldn't scoop, I stay in.

[@vengray8055]

If that player is doing it right they won't tell you anything because that will give info to the person in the lead to potentially kill them. Just stick around.

[@danielgraves13]

in general, i always find it funny when people dont pay for the tithe.

[@SwedeRacerDC]

Threat assessment is impossible. I mean you've got to try and do it, but yeah you can't predict and control everything. A lot of times, it's inexperienced players who are more afraid of one type of deck to realize what's going on with another. I just lost a game because of that and the player that killed me killed the other guy left at the table who removed my creature instead of the biggest threat to the table which provided a combo win, whereas my creature was just generally helpful to me, but isn't actually a win con

[@jancukasu]

10:47 I wouldn't be so kind to call it "extensive knowledge", lol. In contrary he's just showing to others that he's really *lacking* the knowledge, to worsen the fact that he should have looked really, REALLY dumb for scooping earlier 🤣. There's no come back from that walk of shame moment, if I were him. A smarter guy will just shut up, swallow his pride, and accept the defeat and move on to the next game.

[@matblack4721]

Scooping before checking that everyone else is done is a bit silly really. If you think everyone is done, let it happen.

[@hanschristopherson8056]

Sometimes players aren’t removing things because they don’t have removal lol

[@maxducoudray]

Or, if you don’t like trying to decode other peoples’ motives, just let go of the judginess. If you can’t figure out why they player chose to do something you wouldn’t have, no big deal. Let it go and don’t worry about how other people live their lives. Play your own best game.

[@jessejames5452]

I feel like directing game threat away from you is also part of politics. But if you scoop before a game is over, then shad up.

[@Varler_]

I don't really mind poor threat assessment. What I mind is malicious poor threat assessment. IE, "We're friends so I'm going to let your combo resolve or only take out things from the other two players." If that's how you want to play, just suggest two-headed-giant instead of ruining the game for the other two players who aren't involved.

[@sorry987654321]

thankfully everything is becoming cEDH