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EEVblog

Күн бұрын

Teardown Tuesday.
What's inside an EDMI Atlas Mk10A Smart Meter?
EDMI Mk10 Datasheet: www.smartbuildi...
EDMI Mk10 Reference Manual: www.edmi.com.au...
VAC4626 Current Transformer: www.vacuumschme...
MSP430FG4618: www.ti.com/prod...
TNY268: www.mouser.com/...
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Пікірлер: 711
@mikeselectricstuff
@mikeselectricstuff 11 жыл бұрын
I think those small terminals are for connection of test gear for line monitoring etc. without having to connect to the big beefy cables.
@laernulienlaernulienlaernu8953
@laernulienlaernulienlaernu8953 5 жыл бұрын
I can never get over the amount of kit in Dave’s lab
@jonka1
@jonka1 6 жыл бұрын
@22:00 The use of current transformers is surely the safest and most reliable means of isolating the current sensing circuits from the line voltage. I suspect this is the thinking rather than the equally valid problem of micro - ohm input resistors. Also perfect for transient/lightening pulses.
@r0bstewart01
@r0bstewart01 11 жыл бұрын
The meter is also designed to be immune to the 12kv @ 9 Joule impulse test. Hence all the isolation on the inputs, comms etc.
@themo1234567890
@themo1234567890 11 жыл бұрын
Hi Dave, great Video as everytime! Actually, the two LEDs on the top of the main processor board are for rs232 communication through the case. After the device is calibrated, one can program vendor-specific (or data from the electricity company) into this through rs232. Also there are two modes, one for calibration and one for the vendor specific settings(and also an mode for the end-user of course). If I remember correctly you can activate this mode via a jumper. Greetings from Germany
@beeringo
@beeringo 9 жыл бұрын
Great stuff :) I work at EDMI and most of the company including the team in Brisbane who designed the meter has seen it and loves the enthusiasm! Shame to see so many ridiculous comments here... dont even know where to begin! Just in case anyone wants to know these meters use a GSM/GPRS modem, the same frequency and power as their mobile phones (NOT microwaves!). The meters are usually connected ONCE per day usually at night to send readings, commonly via a data telephone call (CSD call) or a packet data connection (GPRS) and lasts around 20s for the former and 5s for the latter. The rest of the day the modems sit idle just as a mobile telephone. Am i to believe these people who are crying out that smart meters are dangerous also don't own mobile telephones and keep them on their person at all times? Also don't own microwave ovens and especially don't have WiFi routers in their home? As it happens, no i don't :) Thanks for the fun video!
@pu1ypj
@pu1ypj 9 жыл бұрын
Leon Wright And they are better than BPL!
@beeringo
@beeringo 9 жыл бұрын
Broadband over Power Line? In most cases yes - mainly because the infrastructure around BPL adds a fair cost, GSM/GPRS solutions are cheap and easy! However in sparsely populated countries this isn't an option as coverage can be terrible. There are a lot of other options to carry data over power lines, and in fact BPL is VERY rarely ever used as meters do not need high data rates. Most common is G3, PRIME & S-FSK :)
@frewerage
@frewerage 9 жыл бұрын
+Leon Wright Is there any article that available to public ? Any articles to back up what you said ? Or it is "company trade secret" ?
@beeringo
@beeringo 9 жыл бұрын
+Khanh Ly Each county will have their own regulations around smart meters, but in the UK the smart meter rollout (which promises to install a smart meter in all homes by 2020) is completely government regulated - and as such is completely transparent on the technology. Data infrastructure companies bid to carry the information from meters which included mostly Mobile (cellular) data carriers and some new technologies, and in the end a company called Arqiva won the northern region of the UK contract, and Telefonica (aka O2) the mobile cellular carrier won the central and southern region. So - 100% of the UK's smart meter communications will use either cellular communications (telefonica) or long range radio (arqiva) as mandated by the government. We as meter manufacturers have to fall in line with this. As you requested - here is a great place to start: www.gov.uk/guidance/smart-meters-how-they-work. Secondly this may be more of interest: www.gov.uk/government/news/award-of-smart-meters-dcc-licence you may want to google some of the references there. I hope that kind of answers your question if not let me know - but perhaps be a little more specific - what exactly do you want an article relating to? Cheers :)
@frewerage
@frewerage 9 жыл бұрын
+Leon Wright I thought you are from Aus ...
@robertbackhaus8911
@robertbackhaus8911 11 жыл бұрын
Sure you can choose not to have a 'radiation source' in your home. The biggest radiation source in your house, by a couple of orders of magnitude, is 50/60Hz radiation from power wires, so you can choose not to have that, and you don't need a meter then either. Honestly, calling a 3G modem a 'Radiation Source'.
@CTimmerman
@CTimmerman 6 жыл бұрын
It's a cell phone that messages a whopping 1% of the time. Think of the children!
@ETlerin
@ETlerin 11 жыл бұрын
Most enthusiastic moment of this episode: 18:58 "oh look at that, look at that...beautiful! Ooho...That's..." (real fans know the standard vocabular)
@SwitchingPower
@SwitchingPower 11 жыл бұрын
The round window with the metal ring is to hookup an infra-red probe so the meter guy can read all the info out.
@RetroGamerVX
@RetroGamerVX 11 жыл бұрын
Great teardown as usual Dave, would be interesting to see it powered :o)
@speedyracer7594
@speedyracer7594 11 жыл бұрын
Awesome video Dave !..I work with these meters everyday and I can tell you they are very reliable and we consider them basically a power quality meter and not just a smart meter because of their functionality. Also EDMI started out making irrigation controllers in Australia. I will look around work for a schematic for you if your still interested.
@doralola9720
@doralola9720 2 ай бұрын
May i ask help on how you communicate with edmi meters via modbus? Can i directly connect it to a PLC? I currently have mk6n
@rtybn2012
@rtybn2012 5 жыл бұрын
Those loops through the coils are a current transformer. The ratio could be as high 1,000 to 1 or even 10,000 to 1. That means that a 100Amp current could generate 10 volts. The circuity could divide that down to some useful voltage .
@nadakhater23
@nadakhater23 3 жыл бұрын
Please could you tell me what happened if the direction of the current passing through the CT has changed in this case ; the meter will measure the KWH & KVA &PF Correctly ?
@bjtaudio
@bjtaudio 8 жыл бұрын
On smart meters there is a way of stopping power theft by grow houses, and it done where everyone has to have a smart meter but they is also a smart meter connected to the main bus for each power transformer. The meters communicate with each other and the utility control center constantly, the meters check to ensure power going out on the bus matches to what is metered in total at all the customers properties, if a mismatch occurs the utility can come out and trace where the extra current is flowing, easy.
@Carnivorecorey
@Carnivorecorey 8 жыл бұрын
bjtaudio believe it or not that's way too expensive. In Australia (well at least in Victoria Australia) they use the volt drop method. Where they can detect, pretty much to an address an anomaly in volt drops using surrounding houses smart meters. It's an automatic analysis feature built into the system that auto flags
@caddyguy5369
@caddyguy5369 6 жыл бұрын
bjtaudio Or it could be legalized and they could actually pay the bill for the grow house without fear of persecution.
@matthewmaxwell-burton4549
@matthewmaxwell-burton4549 6 жыл бұрын
In France they use the method stated by njaudio. In essence it is the same as what you just said.
@josephaltman460
@josephaltman460 5 жыл бұрын
No more two butter knives bypass.
@oldestnerd
@oldestnerd 6 жыл бұрын
In case no one else has mentioned it, the 2 "LEDS" on the front panel inside the metallic circle is actually a ultraviolet communications link with an LED and sensor that can be used for various purposes like reading the meter manually.
@ratburger12345
@ratburger12345 11 жыл бұрын
One meter I worked with actually (probably) had a detector for external magnetic fields as a tampering tool! Didn't ever crack one open, but there was space reserved in the memory for tamper alarm, both switch and external magnetic field. Didn't see anything related to magnet field detecting on that meter though.
@kfishy
@kfishy 11 жыл бұрын
Hi Dave, there's an application note from TI, "Implementation of a Three-Phase Electronic Watt-Hour Meter Using MSP430F471xx" (slaa409a) that seems similar to the metre shown in the video, and which uses an MSP430 in the same 4xx family.
@jimparr01Utube
@jimparr01Utube 3 жыл бұрын
A common trick used about that time was to cascade x10 gain amplifiers - two or three of them. The chopper amp principle allows AC coupling. Then each of the amp outputs arrive at the ADC MUX. The amp output/s not saturating are used for the measurement and scaled accordingly. Hence good resolution at both low and high load currents.
@sanches2
@sanches2 11 жыл бұрын
actually they might have the means... look at 07:22 where external contactor drivers might be hooked - tb3 etc. if you seal the contactor, the customer supply might be stopped.
@SirBunghole
@SirBunghole 11 жыл бұрын
Nothing like sexy switch action to get an EE excited!
@spagamoto
@spagamoto 11 жыл бұрын
As for the shunt bypass detection, perhaps the meter temporarily draws extra power through the voltage detection taps (the ones that are connected to those removable metal clips), then monitors the current transformer outputs to make sure they rise.
@EEVblog
@EEVblog 11 жыл бұрын
Ah yes, of course. Forgot about the modem, that would need a few watts during TX.
@tlangdon12
@tlangdon12 4 жыл бұрын
2A is a common current requirement @4V for GSM/LTE Modems during TX so the SWPS will need to put out circa 10W for a few seconds. The 2W budget for overall power consumption is not really affected as the time the modem spends transmitting is a small fraction of the time that it is not transmitting.
@John_Ridley
@John_Ridley 11 жыл бұрын
I'd love to see really reliable double blind tests done on people who claim to be able to feel em fields around cell phones.
@sushiming7544
@sushiming7544 6 жыл бұрын
The proof is all in. The Radiation is Illegal
@UKsystems
@UKsystems 24 күн бұрын
@@sushiming7544 the radiation of the smart meters is not illegal. They literally have the same communication chips in as mobile phones.
@jrsmile
@jrsmile 11 жыл бұрын
One of the leds on the right of the device is actually a IR-receiver. German hacker groups already started tmpering with the firmware without opening the case :)
@MrPINKFL0YD
@MrPINKFL0YD 4 жыл бұрын
Good
@UKsystems
@UKsystems 24 күн бұрын
What you really need to realise they actually were given authorisation by the manufacturer without sudden secret keys. This is impossible for the meter to accept most of the communication.
@EEVblog
@EEVblog 11 жыл бұрын
I was a little bit surprised, I expected a higher spec 16 bit converter.
@pmgodfrey
@pmgodfrey 11 жыл бұрын
I have to agree with Dave as well. There is no reason to be afraid of being near devices like this...just don't touch the terminals! It's no more harmless than a wireless router or even your microwave which is probably ten thousand times more powerful...you might have noticed that when you reheat something and can't get a good WiFi connection. Don't fear the unknown -- learn about it (by taking it apart)... :)
@johnpublic793
@johnpublic793 2 ай бұрын
You can never cut this off...cell a d routers you can
@pmgodfrey
@pmgodfrey 2 ай бұрын
@@johnpublic793 -- Not sure what you're talking about there. Your sentence didn't make sense.
@UKsystems
@UKsystems 24 күн бұрын
@@johnpublic793 nope if you turn the phone off the signal is still going into the building from the phone mast and it is way more powerful
@DIYTAO
@DIYTAO 11 жыл бұрын
Those two leds (black and clear bluish) at 10:20 are most likely 2-way Infrared port.
@downeysoftner5226
@downeysoftner5226 4 жыл бұрын
Focal plane array
@Mark19960
@Mark19960 11 жыл бұрын
Those LEDs on the front look like they are for IrDA or the like. It's probably there for reading the meter without opening it or having to plug something in.
@sanches2
@sanches2 11 жыл бұрын
i was almost screaming at the moment you tried to bend the tin pieces with the screwdriver.."lift the terminal block! lift the damn TB!" hehe i really enjoy watching you vids ... but sometimes i think i get too much into them:)
@philcolbourn
@philcolbourn 7 жыл бұрын
Nice. Thanks. Did you power it up? PS: the 2 LEDs on front - could they be IR transmitter/receiver?
@warywolfen
@warywolfen 11 жыл бұрын
One might use 4 pieces of 14 gauge wire, bent into "U" shapes. Then solder 2 pair together, creating 2 jumpers, each good for 40 + amps (14 ga. wire is rated at 20 A, but that's with insulation and in a conduit. But these would be in the open and have better heat dissipation). To do the soldering, one might make a temporary jumper to run the iron. The jumper ends could be filed flat, for better contact. Each jumper would complete the circuit for each of the two 120V legs of the 240V supply.
@jonw0224
@jonw0224 11 жыл бұрын
You buy a block of data, just like a consumer would with a data plan. But you consolidate your usage over all of the devices and get a big discount. You also design the modem to transmit a short burst of data a few times a day. Most of the messages utilize compression as well.
@mikeselectricstuff
@mikeselectricstuff 11 жыл бұрын
PSU is not overkill once you connect that GSM modem.
@blackIce504
@blackIce504 11 жыл бұрын
bypassing current is when you have a wire that will bypass the meter for example if you tap directly into the fuses before the meter on the active as most people would do that will detect it by messuring the load via netural as Netural is connected back to a RCD. Reverse Current is simple, for solar or wind turbines that people get for there homes so they can messure how much you put back into the grid.
@sivalley
@sivalley 11 жыл бұрын
As Dave walked through the spec sheet, the current transformers are fairly immune to DC offset, the same thing that would be seen as your relatively slow hand movement would move over the meter box providing you have magnets powerful enough to do so. At which point you now have to worry about the interacting of the magnets with the mains leads making your hand vibrate at mains frequency. :-)
@HalidDurakovic
@HalidDurakovic 11 жыл бұрын
it is easy to detect bypass, because in every electric installation, you will have a parasitic currents, for instance a FID Fuse will use some current form each phase to detect current loss, and capacitive and inductive losses in cables, will draw very small currents.
@bjtaudio
@bjtaudio 8 жыл бұрын
Very nice meter, the power supply caps have been beefed up to improve reliability. The anti-tamper is basically the micro-switch, the software stores usage history and events such as a unauthorized break in, It also relies on the physical security seals on the screws on the box. It however cannot detect a full power diversion where power is connected to the service cable or street bus before the meter. This type of tampering is typical to take power to run grow houses, without detection. Detection is only found from suspicious activity reported to police by neighbors.
@Marineio
@Marineio 11 жыл бұрын
I believe they are, programming or reading the meter - I have a small "eye" window on my own meter at home, it's not a "smart meter" but it is a digital one (replaced our old black rotary analog one).
@EEVblog
@EEVblog 11 жыл бұрын
It would only have to report once a day or week for a few minutes, and you'd program them all for random times.
@midasg1
@midasg1 11 жыл бұрын
An optocoupler is a device that optically isolates an electric signal. It's just an LED pointed to an fototransistor inside a chip
@EEVblog
@EEVblog 11 жыл бұрын
Not that I'm aware of. I know a guy that used to design the alarm panels for EDM.
@dv6000hp
@dv6000hp 11 жыл бұрын
New technolgy will continuously adjust power. The tower will send data packets to the phone information of how well the tower is hearing your phone, based on BER rates and/or RSSI level, Some phone transmitt as low as 20mw and at the most 600mw typ. The reason for this is to conserve the battery power, as it can be a big selling point(battery life talk time). I know I cannot convice you otherwise that using a cell phone is not harmfull under normal use. Oh, remember to answer my simple question?
@EEVblog
@EEVblog 11 жыл бұрын
Those people are crackpots. It's just a regular GSM phone that calls maybe once a day or week or something for a minute or two.
@bsnellgrove
@bsnellgrove 6 жыл бұрын
one reporting every 20 seconds is what we have to endure in the UK
@sushiming7544
@sushiming7544 6 жыл бұрын
And its wireless which means it will make you sick.
@UKsystems
@UKsystems 24 күн бұрын
@@bsnellgrove you’re not really enduring anything if it can talk to a phone last the phone mass is already penetrating the building with radio signals let alone the wires is giving off magnetic field
@UKsystems
@UKsystems 24 күн бұрын
@@sushiming7544no
@whysguy3
@whysguy3 11 жыл бұрын
I am having a herd time understanding info you thow at us. I am an EET student. I whatch your vids to catch as much knowledge as I can but you don't go into any detail about the purpose of the individual components and how they are used within the whole assemblies. So in you next vids could you tak more time to explain the parts ,components,and how they work together to accomplish the job it was built to do. Love the show keep them coming
@therealjammit
@therealjammit 11 жыл бұрын
In the US, all houses have 220V 3 phase coming from the pole pig. Some houses only have 220V 2 phase for cost reasons or the size and location of the house. Both the 3 phase and 2 phase have a 110V tap to ground. Down under (are both capitalized?) as I guess should be using 440V 3 phase, or 440V 2 phase. Both the 3 phase and 2 phase have a 220V tap to ground.
@queazocotal
@queazocotal 11 жыл бұрын
(not checked datasheet) You can in practice get well over 12 bits of range (though not absolute accuracy) with this type of circuit - simply as the input is a nice slow sine-wave that is changing much, much slower than your ADC. You end up with individual measurements being 12 bits, but if you have 1024 measurements, your resolution goes up by about sqrt(1024).
@JohnDoe-qx3zs
@JohnDoe-qx3zs 8 жыл бұрын
To avoid bypassing the current sensors, they rely on the existing safety system to prevent bypassing the old electromechanical meter (which fits the same plug and form factor). The box is physically sealed with an actual company seal, so they can just inspect it to detect a breakin to the part with unpaid electricity.
@fuba44
@fuba44 11 жыл бұрын
The external battery could be for powering the unit when taking it back to the lab for testing unexplained faults, and preserving data in case of tampering.
@riakata
@riakata 11 жыл бұрын
I here there were complaints that shame exposure did the same thing. Ironically in some cases where people were complaining about all sorts of cellphone tower effects the provider later revealed with documentation that they never even powered the system up for years just to show how it isn't doing anything.
@38911bytefree
@38911bytefree 11 жыл бұрын
You cannot use shunt resistors in a polyphase one since you need to isolate each voltage. Otherwise you get 380V between current sensing inputs. Current transformers are more suitable for this three phases ones. Shunt ares used un single phase ones where VCC and shunt voltage are both referred to LIVE. Still posible to use shunts in a poly but need isolation transformers on each current channel. And since the voltage drops are small at low loads, transformers tend to make it worse.
@ChaplainDaveSparks
@ChaplainDaveSparks 8 жыл бұрын
I suspect that this would be installed inside a weatherproof NEMA (or the non-USA equivalent) locked enclosure. The antenna would be the weak point, and they'd then investigate when the unit failed to "check in". By the way, there's a bit of a health scare (among some) of the effects of RF exposure.
@nikomo
@nikomo 8 жыл бұрын
The RF coming out of these is low-power non-ionizing radiation - the only health problem this thing could cause is provoking paranoia already present in someone's nutcase.
@UKsystems
@UKsystems 24 күн бұрын
What do you need to realise is literally every country apart from the US and Canada put metres inside enclosures either inside the property or some other electrical thing the reason is because you can replace the meter without having to worry about a stupid socket needing replacement every 2 to 3 years when they create a new standard and it doesn’t work
@HDXFH
@HDXFH 11 жыл бұрын
Cool, I did a Teardown on a Landis & Gyr E350 Smart Meter, The quality is pretty good for something made in China, (uses NEC and other Japanese componentry)!
@EEVblog
@EEVblog 11 жыл бұрын
In oz maybe the majority are, but still plenty on 3 phase. My office has 3 phase in the panel box.
@sstorholm
@sstorholm 6 жыл бұрын
The reason for the external battery is probably for temporary metering, think temporary main distribution points for building sites or similar.
@koitk
@koitk 11 жыл бұрын
Glad to hear, you're not using mobile phones:) And live somewhere in the middle of desert. I bet your phone is way more active in the wireless network or even if not you then people around you, compared to this device. Rediculous to say that you'll fry in the radiation caused of theese meters.
@r0bstewart01
@r0bstewart01 11 жыл бұрын
We actually use the AC cycles to sync the clock in australia as it is more accurate than using the RTC. In Oz we actually make up the number of Cycles in a day, so is is more accurate to use that than the RTC.
@HDXFH
@HDXFH 11 жыл бұрын
1 Pulse/ 100 Wh, you should be able to wire this up as a single phase test meter, it'd be handy for measuring your workshop power consumption :)
@joopterwijn
@joopterwijn 8 жыл бұрын
Fraude detection is mainly done on "street" and "neighborhood" add all meter minus your street meter. Add all the street meters minus the neighborhood meter. Locally only meter fraud by seals on the meter.
@jani140
@jani140 8 жыл бұрын
+EEVblog: You entirely missed to mention one major task of this unit. Measunring the line frequency. And thats the optocuppler in the middle of the HV board is for. A zero cross detection circuit.
@JohnDoe-qx3zs
@JohnDoe-qx3zs 8 жыл бұрын
When you read the specs: Those are not "8 different output rates" They are "8 different price rates", as in 10 cents/kWh at night, 1$/kWh at the time of day when they have to power up every old power plant and ask the TV tower to switch to backup generators just to keep the voltage up.
@cuckingfunt9353
@cuckingfunt9353 8 жыл бұрын
The heavy power supply is for start up, the battery is low and needs charging and loads of signals will need to be sent.
@JohnDoe-qx3zs
@JohnDoe-qx3zs 8 жыл бұрын
The unit serves no purpose without mains power. The battery would only be for some things that must be on during a blackout, like keeping the clock running.
@r0bstewart01
@r0bstewart01 11 жыл бұрын
The big power supply is to give you an extra 3.6Watt power supply for the Modem (which uses more than the meter!)
@dariusssss85
@dariusssss85 8 жыл бұрын
there is some kind of infrared protection. The two diode that sit together are a infrared transistor and infrared diode. i suspect that they work as reverse protection in the glass casing. the ic can measure the volume of return current from the transistor, but they can be used maybe as some sort of programing. the metal ring with the two holes in it looks like is made for some magnetic clamping device or cable..... or both
@ElecTrickKF
@ElecTrickKF 8 жыл бұрын
+Jordan Koinarski Your right. They are for programming. I've seen it at my local electricity suplier warehouse. They're programming different tariff for different customers. They use magnetic ring with two holes for programming diode, infrared transistor, not sure and special computer testing unit.
@skonkfactory
@skonkfactory 11 жыл бұрын
The white relay is actually a photovoltaic silicon relay. You might want to try opening it up- might be interesting as a mini-teardown.
@John_Ridley
@John_Ridley 11 жыл бұрын
If there is such an effect, it's due to the battery getting warm. Do the thermo calculations on how much RF power would be required to feel that warming; it's almost certainly more than the phone is capable of producing.
@tonyeezi7315
@tonyeezi7315 6 жыл бұрын
I was surprised to learn that the smart meters being fitted in France work on KVA consumption rather than the traditional KW. Seems to mean that has most devices nowadays use switch mode PSUs, and lighting has been changed to LED or low energy fluorescent then home electrickery bills are dearer than they were before with the old traditional meter using the same devices.
@MikhailDavidov
@MikhailDavidov 11 жыл бұрын
Pretty sure those two LEDs on the face (with the ring around them) are an IRDA programming/service port.
@cuckingfunt9353
@cuckingfunt9353 8 жыл бұрын
They detect the missing current same way you would for single phase ( p-n=0) . All the phases have to add up. If you bypass you would have to be careful to use good connections and same length cables. But having said that plenty of machinery and welders would be setting them off all the time anyway.
@michelleengland1173
@michelleengland1173 7 жыл бұрын
ph1 10amps ph2 10 amps ph3 10 amps neutral- 0 amps
@DanielVidz
@DanielVidz 7 жыл бұрын
Those LEDs "as Dave called them" under the round window are IR transmitters and receivers. I wonder how a half wave rectifier driven load would go given they're transformer coils, in other words trying to force pull DC current. I imagine there would still be relativity of 50 cycles between the transformer and the DC load but not sinusoidal AC and it's a hack but it's a hack that requires no tampering.
@Membrane556
@Membrane556 8 жыл бұрын
Seems much better designed from an isolation stand point then many of the US ones which have been known to catch fire.
@BenjaminEsposti
@BenjaminEsposti 8 жыл бұрын
+Membrane556 I don't think it's due to inadequate isolation, it's really due to the number of power surges. Most smart meter fires are caused when a high voltage line comes in contact with a lower voltage line, which causes a surge that can't be "shunted" away by the small-ish surge arrestors (Usually MOVs) in the meters.
@UKsystems
@UKsystems 24 күн бұрын
The US ones basically catch on fire like the US electoral system does the minute you push Fitt and electrical appliances in to a socket unnecessarily it’s going to heat up
@jan.tichavsky
@jan.tichavsky 11 жыл бұрын
You have one company which owns the distribution network and then you have other companies which can rent it and provide their services and prices. It works like phone lines and ADSL where you can choose from many providers. So we have competition here already but the for regular household the price difference isn't that high.
@Renatodonadio
@Renatodonadio 11 жыл бұрын
Those ones at 10:20 aren't LEDS, they are Infrared Input/Output diodes, when the electrical company comes at home to install the meter, they load on the meter customer infos with a IR gun connected to a laptop or palm PC
@oisiaa
@oisiaa 11 жыл бұрын
Oh no! Radiation! A big scary word that I know nothing about and therefore fear it!
@costyytsoc
@costyytsoc 11 жыл бұрын
pretty impressive current transformers,
@doctorzaius4084
@doctorzaius4084 8 жыл бұрын
LOL @ all the rubes posting warnings about how wicked and evil this meter is from their cell phones. The communication method here is *quite literally* a cell phone; or a cellular modem to be more specific. This meter doesn't operate on an RF mesh network. It has a SIM card and an IP address and connects to a central office directly. The utility has to pay for that cellular service for each individual meter, just like regular people... which is why these datalogging polyphase meters are only generally used in commercial or industrial (high $$$/heavy load) applications. They've also been around FOREVER (landlines were used before cellular became viable, and still are used where cell signals don't reach) and yet somehow we've all survived no worse for the wear.
@BenjaminEsposti
@BenjaminEsposti 8 жыл бұрын
+doctor zaius You're right, but only partially. Some meters operate on a mesh network, and some run a hybrid between that and what you said. Still, I think all this privacy stuff is way overblown. Like, there is more than one person on this planet, hellooooo?!
@doctorzaius4084
@doctorzaius4084 8 жыл бұрын
Benjamin Esposti Sure, these days there are almost as many different communications methods as there are meters. RF mesh, mobile and fixed-network AMR, power line carrier, cellular, landline, ethernet - and many systems utilize a combination of all these technologies. iTron and Silver Spring Networks are the heavy hitters at the moment but there are probably about 50 other companies out there offering similar products as well. That said, it's been my experience that utilities are generally only willing to invest in dedicated cellular/landlines for large or complex billing accounts, reactive metering, independent generating facilities, load-shedding/demand response participants, etc. The more widespread AMI mesh/fixed network systems now becoming commonplace for residential and small(er) commercial purposes typically only use cellular, landline or ethernet communication for data backhaul from a central collection point.
@racheleaston43
@racheleaston43 7 жыл бұрын
American smart meters are a danger to the public, and have been banned in many states.
@doctorzaius4084
@doctorzaius4084 7 жыл бұрын
Nope, I'm right they're wrong. This meter is literally a cell phone.
@thomasesthomas1996
@thomasesthomas1996 7 жыл бұрын
rationalwiki.org/wiki/Barrie_Trower Psudoscientist.
@sivalley
@sivalley 11 жыл бұрын
They probably could find you bypassing the meter with the software on their end. Meters in the same cluster still show the same phases up yet the sum power used does not match the sum measured by the meters in the same cluster. Your bypassed meter would be the glaring 'black hole' in such a case. Sometimes analogue is better than digital. P-)
@_waymin
@_waymin 8 жыл бұрын
'..sent me THIS little puppy!' I immediately imagined him slicing up a dog. *cries self to sleep*
@keldsor
@keldsor 11 жыл бұрын
Very nice "tear down" - I just got one of them installed in my house !
@ebmmdawguy
@ebmmdawguy 11 жыл бұрын
Woa, we just got one of these installed!
@chefjoesplaylists2565
@chefjoesplaylists2565 7 жыл бұрын
Wonder if that RJ45 is a form of Ethernet with PoE (using that in our networkable cards in box as well as outside the equipment rooms)? Also that pair of LEDs on the metal ring on the cover are probably the manual IR port they can use when the cell towers are down. That's also on all the "smart meters" in the US where there's insufficient cell service.
@jaimealoro
@jaimealoro 6 жыл бұрын
I think it said it was just two RS232 connections implemented in the RJ45.
@timramich
@timramich 11 жыл бұрын
In the US everything from the meter to the electric company is their property. Wires, poles, everything. The same applies to any other metered utility like water and gas. If you have underground wiring, the transformer box put on your land is not yours. The same applies to cable TV with those boxes for underground wiring.
@jonw0224
@jonw0224 11 жыл бұрын
Most of the smart metering tampers are caught by exception reports that troll thru the data. If you data changes drastically from "normal", it ends up on someone's desk. This was true before smart metering only now you can catch it faster because you see the change nearly instantly instead of monthly. Smart meters also send wireless messages for "powered down", or "powered down and disconnected from load/source", or "current above limits", or "temperature out of bounds", or "cover open" etc.
@4crpg
@4crpg 11 жыл бұрын
Hello Jesse Levesque Try wikipedia In physics, radiation is a process in which energetic particles or energetic waves travel through a vacuum, or through matter-containing media that are not required for their propagation. Waves of a mass filled medium itself, such as water waves or sound waves, are usually not considered to be forms of "radiation" in this sense.
@DerTabak
@DerTabak 11 жыл бұрын
Well im pretty sure the communication is TLS(or something like that) encrypted.
@dv6000hp
@dv6000hp 11 жыл бұрын
I have asked you twice. Simple answer yes or no. I am just curious as to your answer, you have every right to your opinion. The field I work in (RF) i understand the limits of exposure. And health concerns And the FCC (SAR). You have a right to take it to the extreme. Just keep in mind nearly all electronics device emit some type of RF. Older techology could have been a concern as some bag phone could exceed 4watts at 800mhz. Newer technolgy phones don't even come close to this power level.
@lodevijk
@lodevijk 11 жыл бұрын
It's surprised they're using only a 12bit ADC. Perhaps due to the slow nature of AC mains they can afford to extend their resolution by averaging.
@Tool-Meister
@Tool-Meister 6 жыл бұрын
Could you please add the word "MAINS" to your title. Those of us looking for smart test meters would be appreciative. Nice review. Even though I was looking for something else, I watched the entire video and found it interesting.
@UKsystems
@UKsystems 24 күн бұрын
Then the time you’re looking for a smart test meter not smart meter
@shockwave77598
@shockwave77598 11 жыл бұрын
All you people complaining that they are losing their old mechanical meters -- The old meters read wrong as they age. When they took mine out and replaced it with a smart meter, my electric bill went down 100$ a month.
@BitGridTV
@BitGridTV 8 жыл бұрын
as it is transmitting Your data via GSM: Jam it by wrapping this thing in Aluminum foil. Your power-provider will see that U dont like smart meters very soon.
@BenjaminEsposti
@BenjaminEsposti 8 жыл бұрын
+BitGridTV That's a good way to get in trouble with your power company too XD
@BitGridTV
@BitGridTV 8 жыл бұрын
Benjamin Esposti U may get visited by Your provider. of course. peel the foil off again before someone is investigating. No. Data. From. My. Home. -Period!
@doctorzaius4084
@doctorzaius4084 8 жыл бұрын
+BitGridTV That wont work... not for this meter anyway. It's got 10 years worth of storage space for interval data. If the connection goes down, it can just be downloaded through the optical port later on.
@BenjaminEsposti
@BenjaminEsposti 8 жыл бұрын
+BitGridTV It's silly that you say such a thing, especially because you're here on the internet! Your every move is being tracked, even your computer's operating system is tracking you! *Sigh* Some people...
@BitGridTV
@BitGridTV 8 жыл бұрын
WELL on the web I pay my fun with my data. but NOT just from the mere existence of my home. *period* BTW I dont use a smartphone and hope I can keep it up that way as long as possible *SIGH* Some teachers...
@xenoxaos1
@xenoxaos1 11 жыл бұрын
The GSM module has a "BOOT" on the mask...possibly there's a serial boot output on some of those pads for diag/programming.
@ETlerin
@ETlerin 11 жыл бұрын
12:52 "Made in Germany, oha...brilliant"^^
@EEVblog
@EEVblog 11 жыл бұрын
Oh, missed that one, didn't bother to read the part number.
@gmcjetpilot
@gmcjetpilot 6 жыл бұрын
No wounder these things burst into flames... it looks pretty light duty for working in harsh environment.
@ab.3800
@ab.3800 11 жыл бұрын
The two IR leds how the people who do come out to read the meters read them. And some models can be reprogrammed via them. For anyone interested theres a DEFCON presentation on here about hacking these things oh here, just search "defcon 20 smart meter". It's more about the software than hardware, but for anyone interested in these things it's worth watching/listening to.
@timramich
@timramich 11 жыл бұрын
The infrastructure that falls on public land should be public property, and infrastructure that falls on your land should be your property. It's not hard for multiple facilities to pump into one grid and have the user decide who it wants to purchase the power from.
@UKsystems
@UKsystems 24 күн бұрын
Most countries have similar things to that but a meter on your land or service cable before it should definitely be the power company because otherwise this issues about you not being able to repair it because it being sealed and unable to because of tampering
@r0bstewart01
@r0bstewart01 11 жыл бұрын
Thats a Whole Current (10/100 Amp) meter. That is why the Voltage Terminals are linked to the current terminals. In the CT version The Voltage Terminals are NOT linked to the Current terminals.
@douro20
@douro20 11 жыл бұрын
I mean the file is just missing off of their server; I don't believe they intentionally removed it to keep prying eyes out of it.
@XOIIOXOIIO
@XOIIOXOIIO 11 жыл бұрын
First line in wikipedia, since you requested. "Radio waves are a type of electromagnetic radiation with wavelengths in the electromagnetic spectrum longer than infrared light." Sine the person who I originally replied to just said "Radiation", it is pointless to argue over the small differences and technicalities. If you are really worried about being dosed with radiation, build your house in a Faraday cage, and wear tinfoil, otherwise radiation is a part of every day life, from all around us.
@goose300183
@goose300183 8 жыл бұрын
Those two round LEDs not in lightpipes: Are they a UV and IR? The colour of the packages suggests that. I wonder why. Maybe it is some diagnositc thing not intended for customer consumption.
@alesjazbec6536
@alesjazbec6536 7 жыл бұрын
Infrared port. Diagnostics, configuration,..
@michelleengland1173
@michelleengland1173 7 жыл бұрын
for programing tariffs and ripple signals load shedding New Zealand
@John_Ridley
@John_Ridley 11 жыл бұрын
Seriously? They're worried about the health implications of what is essentially a cell phone dozens of feet away making a 30 second call every day or week? Do they run away when they see someone on the street pulling out a cell phone, lest they get injured by the evil radio waves? Do they have no mobile phones, wireless routers, cordless phones etc themselves? Do they plan their driving routes to stay at least a kilometer away from any radio station antennas?
@HappyfoxBiz
@HappyfoxBiz 5 жыл бұрын
oh wow, that device is powered byh just that measly amount of power? that's super efficient, none of my household devices come that close! that's basically less than the standby light on my LED panel
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