ELECTRIC vs PETROL CAR - which is REALLY cheaper?? | What Car?

[@whatcar]

Would you still buy an electric car? 🤔👇

[@KnowPorcelain1]

no, I am still hoping synthetic fuels, come to the rescue.

[@thegreatalta]

Nope...

[@MrGMawson2438]

Yes if I was a driver

[@mikeymike1792]

Absolutely. Partly because the ban on petrol and diesel is coming, partly because of the environmental benefits. Yes, I know, they're far from perfect. But they will be better for the planet.

[@paulfowler3416]

Yes yes yes

[@normanboyes4983]

I think a more holistic - ‘total cost of ownership’ approach is required.

[@divid3dbyZero]

I don't think that entirely true. The majority of people that can afford an EV are not hurting for money. Most EV's are not cheap to get into (at least in the US). If you're buying new, you probably have plenty to spend. I can't count the number of Tesla's on the roads in my neck of the woods, but it's rare to see cheaper one like the Leaf or Bolt. These are the same income brackets that buy BMW, Audi, Mercedes..etc. Cars that either famously unreliable and/or expensive to repair. I cannot count the number of customers I see on a monthly basis that pay obscene prices to maintain and repair cars from these brands (all considered luxury stateside), and they act like it's no big deal. If you're getting into an EV right now chances are cost of ownership is not your main concern. You're either attempting to be environmentally savvy or you WANT something new (not need) and you can afford to spend 5 or 6 figures to make that happen. I say all of this as a 2022 Bolt EV owner.

[@normanboyes4983]

@@divid3dbyZero You may be right. Some people have sufficient resources to satisfy their whims without any thought. Some people do not have the funds to meet their essential needs. Others are resource constrained and desire to make rational choices. Within the framework of rational choices, at least in Europe, comparative energy/fuel costs is not the major component of vehicle ownership but depreciation is. So I refute your allegation of untruth.

[@levestane6383]

... and the cost would include a full ecological footprint analysis.

[@iainamurray]

If people actually realised how much their cars cost, I think there would be less car ownership!

[@thegreypenguin5097]

in short: it's a much higher starting investment with much lower running costs. it's great if you can afford to shell out the money to buy the car, but most people can't. w a petrol car, it's more money in the long run but more spread out. what needs to happen is EVs need to become significantly cheaper, so that the avg. person can have one.

[@matthiasknutzen6061]

Fast charging prices are ridiculous

[@Alternity666]

In Canada they are more or less the same as gas price but that's not the whole story. Most of your charging is done at home, with your kWh price at home. For me in New-Brunswick, this is 6 times less than gas.

[@ArmageddonIsHere]

​@@Alternity666 The ratio is even greater here in Southern California. Like 10 times.

[@chrisg9615]

Also they compared a performance vehicle (the i4 m50) to a bloody puegot....

[@mickw3952]

Changed to a ev a year ago and have a home charger (10p per unit). Saved approx £2000 on running costs in the 12 month.

[@BaeLasso]

You could have bought 2 oil cars with at money, or the purchasing difference could maintain the oil car to run to the ground.

[@stevehayward1854]

@@BaeLasso Sorry but EV's are now at same price as ICE cars with the MG4 selling for about £25k and the sports model at £35k with better performance than a much more expensive VW Golf Gti at £45k

[@BaeLasso]

@@stevehayward1854 In Australia, EVs are much more expensive than equivalent oil cars.... about 1.5 to 2 times more expensive...

[@stevehayward1854]

@@BaeLasso I suspect thats either purchasers willing to pay more or your governments fault with import duties. I know they are very much in favour of coal and anti renewables, despite that, renewables are taking over, including grid batteries. 3 years ago EV were dearer in the UK but it seems the prices are coming down reasonably fast

[@Jamessansome]

​@@BaeLasso This is why when purchase price parity is reached (which it nearly has for small runabouts due to battery costs reducing 30% this year alone) your cost of owner ship will be far cheaper than an ICE vehicle. Just image doing nearly all your charging at home for 10p/KWh with no need to do all of the ICE specific maintenance items. I've just had to spend nearly 1.7k on a rear main seal, DMF & clutch on a Ford. That's after spending £3-400 a few months before.........

[@jazzman69420]

Would have loved to see the price differences in service costs over the years to be included in this comparison.

[@ethanlinderman8833]

Think about your comment… if you want services costs over the years, then you probably want fuel costs as well over the years too, at that point that’s a different video about the long term costs of ev vs ice. So tell me why would they include long term service costs in a video about a single motorway journey? What you’re asking to be included should not be in this video at all, maybe in a separate video including all costs over the long term.

[@rayquirk4947]

Battery replacement would have to be included too.

[@luckyrobp]

@@rayquirk4947 no it wouldn’t. Apart from manufacturing faults there will be no reason to change them, they will last the life of the car now.

[@TheComputec]

@@luckyrobp says who? More like battery life dictates the life of the car

[@Malpriorvids]

@@luckyrobp there are 100s of thousands of 12+ year old cars on the road that are cheap to buy (under 6k), cheap to run (40+mpg), cheap to insure, are reliable, and if serviced will last another 8 years. The cost to the environment is only the fuel burned, the oil used, and a couple of sets of tyres, so is perfect if you care about how your kids will survive in the future. You could also run your car for 3 years, resell it, and be less than £5k out of pocket.

[@airspike1]

Interesting test, and yes, using public fast chargers is more expensive. Taking the i4 84Kwh requirement for full charge on my home tariff comes to £6.30. On the basis that I have used public chargers twice in the last year, it still makes sense for me. One needs to look at the proportion of the population without the ability to charge at home - usually they have public transport available, whereas for myself in Somerset with the sparkling good public transport (No bus, train 14 miles away etc) home charging with an EV makes perfect sense. A worthwhile test though and realistic too for some people. Keep up the good channel!

[@MattCasters]

Not even that point is valid. If you're using public chargers all the time you're going to have charging subscription with lower prices. I think you're giving the morons that made this video way too much credit.

[@redbaron6805]

@@MattCasters Exactly. Using the Ionity Passport plan would mean the i4 would cost £29.29 charge vs £52.09 for the petrol car, completely destroying the narrative of this video. Something stinks, and I'm not just talking about the poor fashion choices of the drivers....

[@enfield7123]

I'll stick to dinosaur juice

[@redbaron6805]

@@enfield7123 Because you ARE a dinosaur...

[@studiosys]

So you saying you can take 84 kw off thr grid for £6.30 ? .. what tariff are you on ? . We have to pay 38p / kw ( SHELL ) , so that would be at least 32 quid , whats going on ?

[@Dr-EV]

My Enyaq has similar EXPECTED range to the i4 and that got me from Huddersfield to a charger in Portsmouth in 1 run. Doing full 70mph is the killer. Drop to 65 or 60 and the range increases massively (this applies to ICE cars as well). Amazing how they never consider 95% of charging being done at home as sub 10p/kwh. Also IONITY...... Has been the most expensive charger since they were first installed many years ago.

[@jaymakesvideo]

Bear in mind that most petrol stations charge around £1.35 a litre of fuel on average. I have a diesel car and my diesel car at 60mpg which is my overall average just about breaks even per mile with an electric car, and an electric car costs so much more and i would never get 600+ miles on a charge in an electric car. The tech isn’t there yet in my opinion to make me switch, however I have driven a few electric cars and can see the appeal.

[@Dr-EV]

@@jaymakesvideo Not sure how you get the break even point of fuel cost. I pay 7.5p/kWh to charge my car and works out at 1.9pence per mile. I typically use a public charger for the return journey home maybe once every 6 months. Servicing costs are also far cheaper. Brake pads typically last 50-100k miles depending on car and driving style. No oil changes. No DPF to worry about, and over 1000 fewer parts in general. I'm still recommend some people don't switch when I know it's not worth it in their situation. But if you look and the price of EVs now, they are getting very close to equivalent ICE cars.

[@TheComputec]

@@Dr-EV can you name one single ev that isn’t £10k dearer than it’s ice equivalent?

[@Dr-EV]

@@TheComputec not at the moment, but this is currently the reason why certain people buy EV's, because they intend on doing the milage that makes running cost much cheaper, and because they are far nicer to drive. But don't forget, mobile phones started off as huge bricks, massive in comparison to a home phone, yet they eventually evolved. Guess what's happening with batteries in the next 2 years and the years following on, massive gains in capacity, charging speed, more abundant materials, longevity and best of all, lower manufacturing costs. And they benefit you are already seeing from this big shift to EV's, is the battery technology in mobiles, laptops etc.... Have mainly driven forwards much faster due to existing EV demand. So I fully agree, don't move onto EV yet if it doesn't suit your needs, it may never provide the convenience you are looking for your self, but in just a few years, there will be very few reasons for people to reject the newer, cheaper, better models. Look up the cost of MG4 X-Power price and find another hot hatch that can do 0-60 in 3.9 seconds for that price.... Lol.

[@LondonPrintCentreN6]

go to 12:00 , they mention, but they compare the motorway usage. not home or city usage. so they have to use the fastest charging to get better comparing.

[@andyportm]

I drive a Hyundai Kona Electric - since March. In the summer, by driving sensibly, I got better than the the full 300m range 5miles per kWh (320miles range) vs 4.7kwh for 300miles. This included a weekly average of 100miles plus at 60 - 70 mph on motorways and about the same on country roads. Misunderstanding when to use regenerative braking is often the problem that makes EVs less efficient. Getting energy from breaking when you need to slow down is great. However slowing the car down when you are coasting along is inefficient. There is a loss of energy putting the kinetic energy of momentum into the batteries electrochemistry and then getting it out again. So on the motorway, when there is a lot of coasting opportunity, it is far better to turn regen off. Easy in the Kona where it is controlled by paddles on the steering wheel. Also get some solar panels on your house roof if you can and travelling around is virtually free. I didn't pay a penny to travel between Sept 3rd and October 25th. (August was touring in France - much cheaper than in the video too). Before that I didn't have the Solar panels for charging and it was still much cheaper than my hybrid was. There will be more charging costs through winter - less sun, lower battery capacity at cold temperatures and less sunshine on the roof. But still it will be a fraction of the cost. Electric cars require a different way of thinking about it all, and there is hassle in learning about it. But my running costs have plummeted now.

[@NaturalContradiction]

My monthly expense for BMW 116D was £64 ish. It's now £5.22 for Hyundai Kona Electric. They really convinced me to go back to fossil fuels.

[@hahanah1463]

give it 18months your battery will be soing half that 🤣🤣🤣

[@bbcdentist]

I have an EV. Understanding how to maximise efficiency is good, but I find that very unenjoyable. I want to enjoy driving the car and enjoying it does not mean coasting whenever possible, accelerating super gently, turning off aircon whenever possible 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@IanMcc1000]

@@bbcdentist I have a KIA EV6. I don't bother with efficiency at all. Sport mode all the time and ragging it a fair bit and still get 3.5m/kWh

[@garyminion9610]

I think you have missed the point of the video, it was to highlight what its like if not charging from home and using expensive motorway services.

[@Dome79nico]

How much would it have been if you had used an equivalent 420d of recent generation? Moreover in terms of carbon emissions I would be curious to know when is the break even point between a diesel Euro 6c already built and buying a brand new (equivalent) electric car.

[@edward1591]

This is a really good question and has a really complicated answer. Volvo produced an excellent report, which identified that production of an electric C40 produced about 70% more carbon than an ICE XC40, and that break even could take 9 years, depending on how your electricity is produced. I think keeping an existing car on the road seems an easy win in terms of pure carbon emissions (as opposed to buying any new car).

[@jondonnelly3]

It will depend heavily on the how you charge. Renewable or the grid.

[@peterlumsdon4289]

Superb point,my 420d easily hits 60mpg on a motorway run..it takes 5 mins to fill up and gives a total range of over 600miles..why would I swap to an ev ?

[@jonathantaylor1998]

@@peterlumsdon4289 to stop people dying from strokes, COPD, lung cancer and asthma caused by the increasing air pollution from cars, maybe...? 🤔

[@-DC-]

@@peterlumsdon4289 Diesel ❤️

[@paulaschofield]

The situation here in NZ is currently very different. We've recently done a 1,806km (1,122 miles) road trip in our 2017 Ioniq 28kWh EV with a range of ~220km (136 miles). We charged at public chargers during our trip, but charged on a 3-pin plug home charger overnight once we arrived at our destination, which is what you would do in a real world scenario. So the total return journey was 1,346km (836 miles) and the total cost of electricity was $105 (£50). An equivalent petrol car would have cost $250 (£120). From next year EVs will need to pay what is called Road User Charge (RUC) which in this example would have added $102 (£49) to the cost, making the total cost for the EV $207 (£100). So still cheaper than the petrol car. One thing to know is that we don't have anywhere near as many public chargers here in NZ, and the largest charging site can only charge 6 vehicles simulatneously.

[@ninja12lawbreaker]

You clearly do not have greedy Tory government. British road users are taxed to over £120 billion pounds each year and our roads are worse than aweful because they only spend £6 billion on road maintenance and new roads in total. We have old Eatonian gangsters for mp's

[@iainwares6361]

This is an utterly pointless video. The most expensive public fast charger costs everyone knows can be up to 80p / kw/h. Home charging, which 85% of all charging is, can be as little as 15p, even standard daytime charging is under half that cost. Similarly fast 22kw public charging is well under half that price at around 30p So, go ultra fast public and you're 5 x the low home charging cost, who knew? UK isn't that big a place and the average daily mileage is around 30 miles so maybe a once weekly home charge at 4p per mile. My daughter commutes 90 miles a day on electric which is quarter the cost of her previous ICE fuel cost, over £2000/ year cheaper.

[@ulfw]

So with this RUC thingie EVs aren't worth it as they cost basically the same and are much more expensive to buy.

[@iainwares6361]

@@ulfw What are you talking about, there are indeed many evs now with purchase cost parity with comparable ICS cars, having said that there are also many which are ridiculously expensive, but many of those will disapppear. Running fuel cost depending on where you are and electricity cost and whether you charge at home/work or at commercial chargers, fuel cost can be a fraction of ICE fuel cost. e.g. UK low tariff home charge cost is around 1/7th the comparable ICE fuel cost, but the most expensive commercial charge points can actually cost more than ICE fuel. Example - average miles per year for a UK car is 8,000 and charging on low tariffs at home for a comparable medium size car would save £2600 - 3,000/ year.

[@TheComputec]

@@iainwares6361 Where does the stat that "85% of all charging is done at home" come from? Is that historical fact or marketing spin? I would be keen to see a link

[@geoffreywallace9432]

In a small country like mine, Barbados, an ev car would be really economical as Barbados is 21 miles long and 14 miles wide.

[@mountainman6172]

loool fiat 500e is what you need

[@derek-press]

@@mountainman6172 no ...a bicycle

[@alanhighet7292]

You forget that for most people who have home charging electric is still FAR cheaper than petrol. Currently my running cost over the last year in an EV is 5p per mile. This is charging 85% - 90% at home and the rest at high speed chargers.

[@alanbooth7280]

You forget that over 40% of the population do not have offstreet parking so are at the mercy of commercial charge points. It’s ridiculous to force everyone in to EVs.

[@Ben.Royals]

@@alanbooth7280 Well for them you have plenty of other options. Spend 8 hours at work charge there, charge at the supermarket and contact you local council to install post and lamp post chargers as they are already being used.

[@alanhighet7292]

@@alanbooth7280 correct but the infrastructure is moving on well and in the next five years we should see much better solutions for those who do not have off street parking. There are already options in many cities for lamp post charging and this will only improve but it does need the government to step in and legislate local councils to provide multiple solutions.

[@danharold3087]

@@alanbooth7280 That should be a huge clue to people w/o the ability to charge at home.

[@londonas2]

@@Ben.Royals you live on another planet clearly 😂. Every other charging option is far more expensive than running a diesel car for example. Infrastructure is simply not there yet

[@RobBradshaw]

Last weekend we did your first long trip in our new electric BYD Atto3. We were selling our old 2013 VW GTI. Dropped of the GTI to the buyer in Tamworth NSW - 370km and $16 of petrol. We then took the the BYD on an additional 790km trip through rural northern NSW and southern Queensland. We were able to find some free chargers, plus charging at home at the start and finish. It cost $9.47 on the road plus $30-ish charging at home.

[@dianao.4757]

Interesting! Do you need to install a charger at home?

[@RobBradshaw]

@@dianao.4757 Nope, just the regular 220v charger

[@RobBradshaw]

In November we took a 1068km trip to Tasmania and back. Total charging costs were $468.20. Estimated it would have cost about $820 if we had taken our previous 2013 Golf GTI or $1200 if we had taken our two motorcycles (Niken GT & Vulcan S).

[@chrishander9328]

Seriously? I have a 2015 Land Rover Discovery Sport 241 hp version. Did a road trip from Hungary to Swizerland, Bern 1174km. The total trip costs me 302 Euros and some change. How much fuel does the GTI use to pay almost 900 USD for just 1068km? or more like what are your petrol prices per L over there?

[@RobBradshaw]

@@chrishander9328 Oops, I typed the wrong numbers. The trip was actually 5469km. The 1068 was the number of kwh of electricity we used.

[@OzgunDoganbaloglu]

It is great to see that you chose two affordable cars!!!

[@SteYoung]

At least they were the same unaffordable cars! 😁

[@wanderingambience799]

Haha yeah start the cost analysis with with expensive BMW s

[@madbruv]

Yeah. Affordable is 2k eur. Not 60k wtf

[@tonythompson4951]

Most people don’t have the luxury of off road parking so won’t be able to benefit from cheaper more convenient charging.

[@damienphotographe]

same thinking here these persons are 'a little' out of the real world

[@mikesrandomcrap]

That petrol BMW engine is great! I had an M340i for a couple of weeks last month and drove it from Suffolk to Fort William. Casual cruising to Glasgow then sport plus for the twisties and it finished off at 43pmg average and £200 in petrol for the trip overall. Given the current fuel prices I was pleasantly surprised how good it was all for the trip, with reasonable economy and a brilliant turn of speed and sound when I wanted it.

[@iangraham4510]

43??? My 1.7cdti Zafira design Nav does Cornwall to Edinburgh at an average of 53mpg

[@PJSScotty]

My M340i to the Lakes on M6 from London did 44.6 mpg so not surprised. Some M6 speed limits were 60 mph thought but .. ..

[@Neojhun]

@@iangraham4510 Sorry but 53mpg from a 1.7L vs M340i with a 382hp 3.0L Inline 6 that does 43mpg is a horrible compromise. That is not impressive at all.

[@KING0SISQO]

£200??? Is that one journey or is that there and back? I mean the mpg was impressive but the cost is still insane.

[@bwdrives]

BMW 6 cylinder petrols are the perfect compromise between efficiency and power + sound I have an older 125i with the last naturally aspirated i6 and get 40-45mpg on the motorway

[@Gopher31]

Good thing electricity is not taxed at the same rate as petrol!

[@opaz6565]

Well Electric Car drivers tend to forget that there's almost a £10k difference when buying an electric compared with the petrol version. £10k it's a lot of petrol even with current prices

[@yoyyaesta4808]

If we make the Total Cost of Ownership, charging at home and making more than 10.000 km/year , then BEV wins.

[@jondonnelly3]

@@yoyyaesta4808 only 10k km a year ? I doubt it.

[@opaz6565]

@@yoyyaesta4808 I guess it depends on each person needs. If I split 10k over 48 months which is usually the time I keep a car is going to give me £208 per month to use in petrol which is a lot as I only spend £120. Not saying no to electric cars but at the moment the asking price to buy one is ridiculous

[@tomsdaddy]

If you just want a runabout/commuter, there are plenty of used Nissan Leafs for under £10k that cost pennies to run ...

[@wolfgangpreier9160]

No its not. Even when you drive only 10K each year EVs - even much more expensive ones - are cheaper for the full lifetime of the vehicle. Of course if all you see is the price of the vehicle itself - nobody will be able to help you. Please continue buying expensive petrol, visit the garage for maintenance, do not foget every 80-100K a new engine, AGR, DPF, intake, turbo, a few oil changes, new timing chain etc. pp...

[@awestrope74]

Very few people who charge at home pay the price cap rate which is what I assume you used in your home charging cost calculation. 83kwh for the i4 @ 12p/kwh (current Octopus Go overnight rate) and the cost is £10

[@willielarsson9651]

I drive an EV, and thank goodness my job has massively changed from doing lots of motorway trips to trips of 30-50miles round trio, otherwise I think driving an EV for a living would be very stressful and expensive.

[@yoyyaesta4808]

95% of the miles most people do on an Electric Car, they charge at home. Even in these days you can easily save 70% of the cost of each mile you run in your car.

[@gordonmurray2631]

For now but not in the near future......

[@yoyyaesta4808]

@@gordonmurray2631 Electric vehicles are 3 to 4 times more energy efficient than combustion ones. The most energy price rises the most the EV saves you money.

[@gbej1]

You assume that 95% of the population own their own homes or live in places where they can easily charge at home and can afford these electric cars and drive like 80 year old grannies. That is just not the case

[@yoyyaesta4808]

@@gbej1 I assume petrolheads are unable to own a garage or plug the car in the supermarkets wallbox. Too hard.

[@anthonybariek997]

@@gbej1 what he said was factually accurate and for those who can’t charge at home, Tesco now offer free EV charging for all customers in many of their supermarkets

[@andrewwatson9495]

Very misleading. Tesla superchargers charge 35p/kWh and I pay 7.5p/kWh to charge at home.....

[@raymonddsouza8948]

It seems to me that this is an example of the best-case scenario for the ICE cars vs the worst-case scenario for the EVs. To fully explore the comparative costs, you also need to do the a similar test in and around cities or towns, stop-and-go traffic, basically the more common commuting scenario that most of us face. Then, we could balance up how much you save in every day commutes, vs how much you lose on longer trips, to get an ACTUAL real-world cost comparison of running an EV vs ICE.

[@MassiveBenny]

lol! A motorway journey is hardly an unusual journey - you're an apologist!

[@andym1548]

100% agree... these articles always take the worse case EV and dont forget it might catch fire on the way burning a hole in the planet!

[@andym1548]

@@MassiveBenny for most people a full tank/battery motorway journey is a rare thing on a daily basis... Most UK commutes are less than 40 miles a day.... you're a scaremonger

[@MassiveBenny]

@@andym1548 that's bullshit but carry on....

[@andym1548]

@@MassiveBenny well thought out response... keep on trucking

[@nettlesoup]

This answers the question "which is really cheaper *for long distance journeys?"* and seems a fair test to me. Good that you mentioned the potential savings by slow charging outside the long journey. You included gCO2/km for the claimed manufacturer emissions at the exhaust pipe. Please included the closest equivalent for the EV grid power emissions in future too, so we can see how much less emissions the EV is causing per km. You can either take the average UK grid emissions and/or check on the carbon intensity app for instantaneous emissions at time of charging. And yes there are additional emissions caused by both the EV battery production as well as the petrol mining, refining and transportation, but let's agree those are wildly different depending on which EV you've bought, and are something to be considered separately as part of the EV buying process based on how long you expect to keep the EV and how many miles you'll use it for.

[@mihaiconstantin-pau5116]

you have to also add the emissions for extracting oil, refining it and transporting it to the gas station. Gas doesn't grow in the tank directly

[@TheComputec]

@@mihaiconstantin-pau5116 and 65% of the electricity for charging your car is still coming from fossil fuels... and making those batteries isn't exactly a clean manufacturing process

[@davidperry7128]

@@TheComputec 7.5% from fossil fuels in France, and falling in France. Much cleaner than petrol, diesel, oil refining.

[@TheComputec]

@@davidperry7128 Whichever way you look at it, EV's are not as green as you think. Now, you can carry on deluding yourself, but facts are facts. 90,000 miles have to be driven in an EV before it's carbon footprint begins to reduce compared to an ICE

[@youseflatif796]

Actually, it takes about 50k for the EV and gas car emissions to break even.@@TheComputec

[@saibotyurico]

@whatcar Of course I would. I have two Teslas. I normally charge them at the office, for free... And a bit of an anomaly my model S still has Free supercharger for life... I'm literally driving again to Malaga for free on it, but even if I could not charge for free at the office, I've seen the pod-point chargers in some offices I've worked on and the price per KW/H is about 25p. Yes it is more expensive charging in motorway services (blimey I connected it for 20 minutes yesterday at the dentist and it was a whooping £10!, that'll show me) but really... even without the free charging/supercharging. I could very nicely connect it at home with my Octopus tariff at £0.075 per KW/H. Or even better in summer (whenever that happens) I can quite literally charge it for free from the energy from my solar panels! Now go re-fuel your petrol/diesel by self-generating. Not to mention the maintenance. There's no injectors, belts, oils, fuel filters, coolant, etc etc etc. Not even the brakes need maintenance so often. And for the doomsday battery pessimists: My Model Y 2022 has a 75KWh battery and Model S 2014 has an 85KWh battery, which still has 92% health on it, meaning they both do roughly the same amount of miles. I calculate 200-250 but that's me going 85 on the motorway non-stop. to conclude: Is there a scenario where charging/owning an electric car could be more expensive? Absolutely! Is this the norm? I would seriously challenge that.

[@richkurtz6053]

Not sure in the UK but in the US, states are now charging additional fees for electric car annual registration since EV's do not pay motor fuel taxes. Some states are now considering a mileage charge as well. This has to be added to the cost of driving an EV.

[@ElectricOptions]

Yes correct. I think it is a good idea. Although, I know it can also be a devisive topic

[@alol968]

To complete the picture I would suggest also testing the hybrid cars, a plug-in hybrid versus a basic (not plug-in) hybrid on the same track. Would be nice to know the results.

[@alol968]

@message me on my telegram👉👉 Official What car do it every day for the last 10 years...

[@timfreeman2603]

My experience of driving an EV for 3 years is that I can count on 1 hand the number of times I need to DC charge. I’d suggest AC charging makes up 97% of my use and that is about 1/3 the cost of DC charging in my country. (I don’t have solar yet…)

[@MattCasters]

And so it happens that a lot of people have ideas about driving an EV ... until they meet someone like us or a colleague, a friend, a family member ... to then learn all the information they got was false. In the end it makes the petrol heads like the producers of the video, look like low life scam artists really. Chances are the misinformed are going to be a bit agry at the deception and never go back to burning dino-juice.

[@sh969]

Right? I'm in my 7th year of owning an ev and I've rapid charged less than 5 times. Total. And, my home charger tells me how much every charge costs.

[@PneumaticsAreCool]

As somebody who works in the power industry I could have told you this was going to happen. Electricity is becoming much more expensive due to New green laws. I can see in the near future it will take Over $150 to charge my wife's Tesla. Quite frankly if you crunch the numbers there's almost no way in the world in the United States our power grid will be able to handle even 30% of all the vehicles being electric.

[@bladerower9209]

Why are people hell bent on obsession with range? If you commute over long distances, then they are NOT for you. I have an EV and since ownership have never had a problem for what I need it for and the distance I travel 99% of the time. Its perfect!

[@ThomasMcGuire]

@Joe Lynch Pretty easy to achieve that within any EV these days. Hell, used to do 25,000 miles annually with a 30kWh Leaf... & there's been a 3-4x increase in range since then.

[@del4668]

well one of my cars can be doing 180 miles a day (community nurse) Also we tend to go on holiday to Scotland etc at least once a year and regularly have days out to the lake district etc so i am interested in what happens in an electric car if you actually leave your local area.

[@ThomasMcGuire]

@@del4668 I tend to prioritise accommodation with chargers & maybe have a look on Plugshare as to what's in a particular area. As for long trips (& I do 500 - 750 mile ones irregularly) it tends to be a case of letting the car + sat nav pick up on it, e.g. few months back got on the ferry in Dublin to Holyhead & on to Harwich, ferry over to Hook of Holland & on to Poznan... didn't do anything more than set Harwich (or Poznan) as the destinations on driving off the ferry, let the car to figure out where best stop for charging.

[@IanMcc1000]

@Joe Lynch 30-40k a year makes EV ownership a hassle, but what you could save in fuel costs is potentially massive.

[@elelegidosf9707]

I see no obsession with range here. This is a long-range rest of the cars, therefore the range of the cars is relevant. If one is testing, for example, the boiling times of different kettles, this doesn't mean that one is obsessed with the boiling times of kettles; it is simply what is being tested.

[@davidthegolfer]

My 2022 Porsche 911 Carrera during an 1100 mile road trip in Scotland earlier this year astonished me with an average 38.6 mpg averaging 58 mph. Not a car bought for economy but truely amazing. The majority of 911s built since the early 60s are still on the road so the C02 cost to make them per year of use will exceed any EV I’m sure. It’s not just about fuel used but total C02 cost of ownership.

[@MikeYurbasovich]

In the United States, cars manufactured after 2015 produce less than 1% of annual Co2 emissions. I would imagine the same for Europeans.

[@kevinn1158]

wait a minute.... why are you doing 58 in a 911? LOL.

[@davidthegolfer]

@@kevinn1158 Scotland is awash with permanent 60mph average speed cameras.!

[@kevinn1158]

@@davidthegolfer Grrrrrrrr. They only put those mostly in school zones in Toronto. And inner city main roads where they know people really speed. Like the limit is 50kph and people are doing 80-85 because it's a big straight road. If you are on the highway, people go 120-130 all of the time. 100kph is the limit.

[@derekr1113]

Can you lend me £100,000 to buy a decent one then? 911 is a specialist ownership. Tell us about a major service and Porsche parts.

[@paulphillipson2378]

How long did it take to charge vs fill up and how much is your time worth?

[@KING0SISQO]

Also what wasn’t taken into consideration was the the journey times for both. So the electric cars should of kept the time running while waiting to charge on top of the journey and then you see the real difference.

[@manbearpig3231]

83kw per hour, 57 quid so 45 mins to charge plus he waited so guessing an hour in total compared to 5 mins for petrol.. if you're waiting, likely to grab food so another 10er spent

[@leonhenry4861]

@@manbearpig3231I make sandwiches 😂

[@richardbanner9050]

Interesting video. I've had an EV for 3 months (Skoda Enyaq), very pleased with it. I was always aware charging on commercial chargers would give little or no advantage over ICE cars. However I live in North Essex, have two daughters to visit in Kent the car goes there and back with no issue and in the last three months I've only once used an external charger (and that was to 'try it out' I suspect the car could have got home.... just) I normally charge at home, I have a dual rate tariff so I only charge on the cheaper overnight rate at 17.5p/KwHr. Being a geek I keep track of exactly how much I've spent and over the last three months the cost of driving the Enyaq (2500 miles) has averaged 7p per mile. This compares to the diesel Vauxhall Astra it replaced, which I had 4 years and did 37500 miles at an average cost of 11p per mile. Bear in mind that 11p is an average over 4 years, at the start diesel was £1.30ish per litre and at the end £1.80ish

[@johnjackson2349]

What puts most buyers off an EV is the initial cost of the car in the first place. They are significantly more expensive than ICE equivalents ontop of the other drawbacks of range/charging Infrastructure aswell as unknown variables like battery life and cost. Technology will improve in the coming years but for most people not there yet

[@reiniernn9071]

@@johnjackson2349 You are telling me between the lines that most buyers (common people I suppose) did never learn at school or elsewhere something as TCO....and also do not calculate for their ICE cars the TCO when buying, but go for the cheapest to buy (and possibly paying the most for energy and maintenance)

[@toffeepie1878]

That Skoda dropped 120 miles of range in 35 minutes with the caravan hitched - 28 miles into the trip. We aren't told all the bad things about EVs, if that Skoda is favourable like your previous vauxhall surely there's no benefit, the Vauxhall is far cheaper and can haul a caravan too if needed and gets a longer range. Can't quite grasp it

[@GeraldParchester]

But what if you were towing a caravan or trailer?😐

[@GeraldParchester]

And what happens when we can get our ICE cars converted to hydrogen from water? You can't do that with an electric motor and battery... plus the fact that we are actually running out of the essentials for the manufacture of batteries...

[@davidowen2859]

In the real world the petrol 208 got home while the E208 was looking for a working charge point.

[@bmw803]

Meaning, what kind of moron will spend $15K or more on an EV when Gasoline is cheaper.

[@Hamid-ml5th]

In the real work e 208 save so much money if you use charging in home and mostly you do city running , for 6£ you get 45m for petrol ( just an example) and you get 6£ for 200 mile for electric

[@davidowen2859]

@@Hamid-ml5th In the real world you've just spent £11,000 more on you electric 208 and it depreciates 30% faster than the petrol. Better get driving your break even point is around 150000 miles.

[@bobstirling6885]

@@Hamid-ml5thin the real world a lot of people don't have access to home charging and anyone needing to travel more than 150 miles a day will have to waste time and money charging.

[@bobstirling6885]

@@davidowen2859 anyone planning driving 150,000 miles ain't going to do it in an e208.....if they have any sense.

[@tzeimet]

Having driven an EV for the last 2 years and 26,000 mi. I can say that they really are much cheaper if you charge at home, but if you're ever completely reliant on public charging e.g. when you are on holiday or don't have home charging. They can be quite expensive.

[@MattyThomas86]

And if not; most people would be on a subscription charger service, which would see the cost of charging half , compared to the prices shown in this video

[@MioszMichaowski]

Even though public chargers have become pricey since last year (Poland) Superchargers are still free - but I rarely use them, since their located too far from highways. But since more widely spread public fast chargers have become too expensive to make sense I’ve stopped using them and charge solely at my destination - even if they don’t have a wallbox, they have a regular outlet somewhere. I’ve done it this way on all of my journeys this year - not only does it save me money, but time as well.

[@sandflea2424]

Try it in below 0, hear some charging stations won't work in cold weather, heater wearing down battery faster ECT. Have to warm up because of heavy frost

[@whocares264]

You hear wrong.... Evs are most popular in Norway 🇳🇴 now have a think 🤔

[@chodkowski01]

When you figure in insurance, registration and cost of the cars? Battery replacement costs?

[@777jrg]

What battery replacement costs? EVs (at least the ones that I am interested in) have a 4 year warranty for everything and then 10 year warranty for batteries and drive unit. So what is exactly the battery replacement cost on that? £0? Lol - even after the 10 years, most EVs that are older than that drive for thousands of miles before you even have to consider a battery replacement.

[@whopperwoody]

Great test. Even more worrying is the cheaper petrol cost includes high duty paid to the tax fund, circa 50%. In comparison the electricity for the EV only includes 20% VAT. So add in the duty black hole and EV costs rocket further.

[@Ben.Royals]

But then if you are only using public chargers you aren’t going to be paying the pay as you go rate like the idiots in this video. BMW gives you a charge card getting ionity at 24p per kWh for £11 per month. That’s £59 to do 700 miles a month (£48 for charging and £11 for membership). The same in a 60 mpg diesel would cost £100 for 700 miles a month so £41 more.

[@DamienMcAvoy]

How about a comparison between a PHEV, an EV and a diesel? Volvo xc90 T8 v B5D v Tesla Model X (using super chargers). EVs are tackling hatchbacks which can be very efficient and are slowly moving into SUV territory which is less efficient as they’re higher up. If you need a big car the EV range drops and so does efficiency thanks to increased weight. It would be interesting to see how those three compare. At what point does the reduced running costs overtake the increased purchase price?

[@edition-deluxe]

Damn, EV was supposed to be cheaper. This is crazy. Solution everyone says, just charge at home, but I don't know about you, I do not have a driveway, and I seriously doubt those charging cords will go the 40' from my house to the street, or will be safe being left out at night time unattended, so what now I have to learn to stay up all night too?

[@andrewf7555]

M50 is a front and rear wheel drive ,not quite an equivilant using a m440i,equivilant is the i4 edrive.Probably should also include servicing and running costs.

[@joshuaoverton3309]

They’re both awd….

[@hkchemsir]

Besides the fuel price, you need to consider the cost of the electric cars vs traditional petrol/diesel cars. Also the maintenance fee.

[@iain8837]

So about the same.

[@notroll1279]

​@@iain8837 how so?

[@iain8837]

@@notroll1279 My bad, somewhat cheaper for an EV depending on various factors.

[@notroll1279]

@@iain8837 I just don't know...that's why I'm asking... EVs apparently need less mechanical stuff like brake pads etc., have less moving parts. On the other hand, they're hard on tyres that can be quite expensive and it remains to be seen how well all the suspension and steering components take the increased mass of an EV. Battery life expectation is a big unknown. Tax is none or low, insurance can be very expensive. With various unknowns in the equation, I couldn't say, really. I'm not in the market for a new car right now - I'll probably stick to my old Saab for some more time and let others find out first.

[@iain8837]

@@notroll1279 I have an EV and an ICE, Both do 5k miles a year so no problems for me with general wear and tear. Not service the EV yet so not sure if cost. No government reduction for EV here. Insurance and TAX are identical, fuel costs for EV will be 30% of ICE but with 5k miles it’s no big deal anyway. The way they drive, I take theEV every time as instant torque and ease of driving is great. That’s the main reason my wife switched. Battery has 8 year warranty, car has 5. Won’t keep it longer that 8, that’s for sure!

[@karlsanderson8127]

How long did you stand there waiting for the batteries to charge

[@antoniopalmero4063]

Surely the EV would be fully charged after overnight charge on cheap rate electric .

[@IanMcc1000]

It might not be. Most off peak tariffs allow for 4hrs of off peak time. At a charging rate of 7.4kW you will get approx 30kWh of charge. This gives you a hard limit of 100-120 miles per day at cheap rate.

[@steveb951]

@@IanMcc1000 charge it over two nights then? It’s not that often people drive more than 120 miles in a day anyway is it.

[@IanMcc1000]

@@steveb951 Yeah that's the obvious solution. Of course that sort of mileage is "edge case" territory, but if you have 2 EVs than the hard limit is halved. I'm speaking from personal experience not as a diesel owning doomsayer.

[@ibrahimfarooq9233]

Not everyone has a driveway for overnight charging

[@steveb951]

@@ibrahimfarooq9233 not everyone has a petrol station forecourt in their front garden. Eventually the charging infrastructure will vastly improve, charging times will get far quicker and battery range longer. In China they have cars with replaceable batteries which can be switched out for a fully chargers one in 5 mins. The technology will get improve in time. 2030 is still some way off and petrol and diesel cars will be on ten road for years until we move over to alternatives by which point nuclear fusion power stations should be online. It’s w exciting don’t be hating EV’s because you read some nonsense in the daily Mail.

[@shanea9613]

What an excellent test. I'm sick of people shoving EVs down my throat and crapping on about how cheap they are to run. I greatly appreciate this one.

[@johnsmith-ce2tq]

only cheap if you charge it at home or some work places

[@paulo3564]

Forever petrol car, even without oil.

[@benleigh2923]

Half the cost if charging from home

[@matswessling6600]

😂 no, a totally misleading test.

[@shanea9613]

@@matswessling6600 how so

[@mingiasi]

Also lets talk about the cars prices also. no average bloke will be driving those bimmers. Or ev either (for most part)...

[@naferemix]

39.9mpg on a motorway run isn’t surprising. The claimed 35 is the combined, surely? It’s still not a patch on some diesels and small petrols which are 75+mph on a motorway run

[@admol73]

Motorways are not friends of evs above 60mph

[@davidsworld5837]

that is 8.7 mile to a litre which was £1.99 or 23p a mile. plus road tax cost for that car, plus servicing part ( oil, oil filter, etc) or a new exhaust every 3 or 4 years.

[@mike_oe]

Eye opening, great showcase! Also interesting that the economy test - again - turned into a range test for the electric car. And the charger was not available when required. Falls in line with my first Tesla experience: Unexpectedly only made it 2/3 of the way before charging was required, and then the charge station was fully occupied by other Teslas that also made it exactly that far from our capitol...

[@borinvlogs]

i bought a 3 year old model 3 performance and previous owner supercharged it only once throughout it's life time.

[@TJWhiteStar]

Not eye opening at all honestly just another bunch of EV haters who designed a test to favour the fuel cars. No one drives their EVs like this all the time. Most driving is done with home or destination charging and you get that significantly cheaper (home charging is on the order of 2p per mile compared to fuel cost of 17-22p per mile)

[@alanjm1234]

​@@TJWhiteStarquite a lot of people don't have the option of charging at home.

[@SKYLIMI]

​@@TJWhiteStarOh, of course, because hurling insults at people is the most sophisticated way to showcase your true, refined personality for the world to admire.😂😂😂

[@a.c.e.7568]

Worth it? EVs are not. The price difference out the door between a base Camry and base Tesla 3 in my market worked out to $20,538. Based on 12,500 miles a year and the price of gas and the efficiency of the Camry, they got to drive their car for free (gas) for 8.55 years till they reached the cost of the Tesla. And in that same time period, the Tesla had to pay for their charging. You don't need a PhD in math to figure that out.

[@DefGef772]

It’s also the waiting times, you had to wait for a charger to be available. I’m guessing some cars had finished charging but not moved their cars. If you want to just go somewhere in normal time then petrol would be the best option, just fill up and go.

[@redbaron6805]

Except that claim is pretty absurd. No one is casually driving 200 miles somewhere for a quick meeting and planning that trip to the minute. The average miles driven in the UK is 7400 a year, which is barely 616 miles a month. Which obviously means people are not doing 400+ casual round trips on the clock...

[@tomastoth4018]

Would be interesting to see a comparison: EV vs Diesel too. I've got E61 (520d) that would make this 228 miles using up just over a quarter of the entire tank (range always drops significantly slower from full than later from half tank). OK, half performance only (177BHP), but an easy 53mpg in return. And the car doesn't feel that slow. By the way, great video 👍👍👍

[@danharold3087]

They died at Diesel Gate.

[@nipponsuxs]

My EV cost me around 4cents per mile, about 3cents per km. No diesel is getting close to that.

[@carloperna2769]

After watching this video i can see why people are being mislead into staying away from EV models. The video is showing a real life situation but at the same time not telling viewers all the right information. So let me explain (other may have in other comment but i have not read any of them). Like the video states if you are solo charging from home then yes hands down will be cheaper, BUT when driving on motorways/long journeys and using the fast super charges it will be more expensive BUT, with the correct research you will quickly realise no one pays the expensive rates at the charges. These are many companies with a monthly subscription which lowers the chargers. I have a VW ID4 and i use a company called ELLI WE CHARGE, for £9.99 a month, lowers the 0.69p or higher charge down to 0.28p, so now that cheaper then charging at home right now at 0.35p/0.40p. Would love to see another video from which car telling people that truth and to give people other options.

[@nipponsuxs]

@@carloperna2769 agreed, my EV cost me around 5cents per mile, naturally i try and recharge as much at home at night when electrity is sround 10-12cents per kwh. If i have to take a long rd trip or tow I take my truck runs in diesel. But 90% of our daily driving is by our ev. Id have to be mad to daily my truck, cost around 40 cents mile in diesel

[@philedwards7174]

I agree, nothing wrong with Euro6 diesel engines. Huge economy and range.

[@VladLazar22]

Quick question: Why the speed on the electric car are blurred sometimes? Did you went above the speed limit to increase the consumption? Asking for a friend

[@karenbruestl9688]

Wow - thanks guys for doing this. It's quite frustrating to see what they're doing over there. I mean, for someone like me who only does short travels and can charge for free at the shopping center, it's certainly worthwhile at this point. But it just shows what's to come, doesn't it 🤔🤔

[@illawarriorhill70]

Which shopping centre lets you charge for free?

[@tmayorca8770]

Free now later a fortune, plus you'll be limited per your social credit score

[@karenbruestl9688]

@@illawarriorhill70 Almost all of the ones here in Sydney - makes people come there instead and spend their money 😉😉

[@danharold3087]

In the US and AU electricity never needs to go up significantly. Investors love the market and build the wind & solar farms as needed. The IRA is going to place public chargers every 50 miles along major roads. EVs will rule.

[@BananerRepublic]

@@tmayorca8770 Do you live in china? or plan on living in china?

[@gillo3139]

I’d love to see a similar test carried out driving around town for 200mls. Also if I bought an ev I’d turn all the gizmos on to make it more efficient.

[@Jestey6]

And freeze to death 🙈

[@oliver90owner]

⁠@@Jestey6 Heated seat, heated steering wheel, heat pump. No need to freeze - unless stupid enough not to dress accordingly. Running a couple hundred miles around town might mean several days of motoring with top-ups taking no time at all - possibly only 7.5p /unit electricity, too. Several cold starts for the ICE, continuous air pollution for all around (ICE drivers like to forget this?). De-icing in cold weather takes little energy in an electric, but a lot of effort and steamed up windows for the ICE - unless warmed up before moving off. The overall efficiency would be streets ahead for the BEV. Of course a large, high powered ICE car is not really needed for ‘town use’ so, again, horses for courses arises. But the EV would reign supreme. All-round motoring includes both town and longer distance runs. Occasional expensive electric charging just has to be put up with. I’ve topped up just twice, at public chargers, in nearly 4 months of ownership. It would only have needed one - if person at the place where we stopped was not paranoid of BEVs bursting in flames when charging! I only top up with sufficient charge to easily get home - then replenish with cheap power at my leisure (while I am asleep). Potential fuel saving over 3700 miles could have been as much as £500+ (was actually about £400 because I’ve not yet completed changing my electricity supplier - but a little more if solar energy is taken into account. I expect that figure will decrease during the winter months, but every little helps to defray the extra up-front purchase price. Running round town, on short runs, only returned about 25mpg for our larger diesel car, so near 30p/mile? The obvious means of town-travel would be with the bus pass but that is rarely convenient for our situation. Electric is ruling fine for our household. No going back to ICE. The second car has been driven just a handful of times in the last 4 months - only used when carting roof-rack sized timber and such like.

[@Hamid-ml5th]

@@oliver90ownercan you tell me if you were doing 3700 mile with electric in town , how much would cost you home charging, I am taking normal home charging with box , not solar panel or ,,,?

[@oliver90owner]

@@Hamid-ml5th My mix, at present, is typically mostly 30 mile round trips, then local and occasionally forays up to 200 miles away from home. 3700 miles around town (a smallish town) would likely not be much extra m/kWh for my car - it is not a ‘city car’ - but 4.5-5.5 m/kWh should be easily attainable for urban driving in a more appropriate vehicle. I expect a lot of newer, smaller vehicles coming onto the market will return 6 m/kWh or better for urban driving? Depends, of course, on type and amount of heating/cooling demanded by the driver and/or passengers, too. Simple maths to work it out. Miles per kWh and cost per unit of electric will provide that answer by the formula: 3700 miles divided by m/kWh and multiplied by the unit electricity cost (in GBP) for the chosen tariff. If that 3700 miles is an annual mileage, it is an average of little more than 10 miles per day. My average mileage, per day, is currently more than three times that. My cost, at present would likely amount to around £170 - perhaps less, so less than a third of the cost for a reasonably efficient fossil car. Lots of cold starts and short runs, in an ICE vehicle, could make its fuel consumption much worse. Now, if I choose the ‘Octopus Go’ tariff, my fuel cost would be reduced by a factor of two, so ~£85. Making the ‘energy cost’ about one sixth of that for a petrol vehicle. The ‘Octopus Intelligent’ tariff would cost less than £70 - but would, at present, incur an extra outlay approaching a thousand pounds. Both those tariffs, at present provide other benefits, of course. Running every electrical appliance at those reduced rates can provide substantial savings on the usual household electricity costs. I fully intend changing my electricity supplier in the near future, but I first need to work out the costs, for our particular annual electricity usage. The efficiency of the car will doubtless reduce during the colder part of the year.

[@g600f700]

like you said, road trips = charging outside vs everyday use = home charging. However, don't forget the long term maintenance, reliability, insurance, resell value. There are more like sound and exhaust pollution...etc. I have been using EV 3+ years. Mostly home charging day-to-day use and few road trips, so far keep it. For buyers that go to track racing, show cars, need loud noise, that's another market.

[@ZodbieMan]

Has your EV broken even on its global emissions yet though…

[@g600f700]

@@ZodbieMan I did the numbers, another 1/2 year will break even. After that, it's good.

[@MrDead1975]

home charging also equals the cost of home charger install. ours was around £800, that pays for a lot of petrol

[@g600f700]

@@MrDead1975 I installed it myself both sides, £1600 - cost of the parts. Unfortunately, for owners don't know how to DIY, it's a lot of money.

[@Rhythm24inch]

@@g600f700 so you near the 90,000 miles it takes to 'become carbon neutral'?

[@JamesKirk1988]

Very good test and very true. Level 3 Fast Charging around me, my Tesla Model 3 Performance costs me the equivalent of 25 to 45MPG, depending on electric and gas prices. However, with my electric costs at home, the cost equivalent would be between 75 to 150MPG. I'm in the US and some states charge MUCH less than my state for Level 3 chargers. Then you can also find free places to Level 2 charge. In a nut shell, while EV's are not always cheaper to run, there are many ways to get cheaper/free power. Gas cars need gas, and that's your only choice. But if you can regularly charge for a low cost at home, EV is definitely cheaper to operate overall.

[@thefiestaguy8831]

Except you need MORE money to outlay at the start. The cars cost more... the EV charger you have to buy and PAY to have fitted. In the UK this can easily cost £1,000 or more, often as much as £1,500. Then you are subject to the mercy of your electricity company, who could if they wanted to, quite simply, just double their price for overnight charging rates. I've never seen a fuel garage charge more than 45-50p over the average market price for a litre of petrol or diesel.. but the cost of electricty has drastically increased here in the UK in just the last 13 months and even in other countries like Spain, electricity is still very expensive. Your analogy of "it's a gas car so it needs gas" is a bit daft.... guess what. Your "electric car" needs mains electricity. In the UK, EV prices are a rip off. The government used to give you £5,000 back towards the cost of the car, but they still weren't good value even after that. This scheme then went down drastically to just £2,000 back from the government and within the last 2 years they scrapped it completely and you get NOTHING back now.... EV's only really work if you can charge for free or extremely low cost reliably, and have shorter commute distances.

[@hardykornfeld1733]

We bought an i4 e40 msport last October. Now with 6,800 miles on the odometer we have yet to pay for any charging. Out solar panels make more power than our house plus the car consume and we live in a state with net metering. Our invoice balance with the utility since we moved into the new house stands at minus $3,600. Using Eco Pro and keeping to 5-10 mph over the posted limit, the car averages 3.5 to 4.0 mi/kWh depending on temperature and precipitation. We use regen for nearly all braking so I expect the rotors and pads to last 100,000 miles. Combined with the lower cost of scheduled maintenance, the i4 is far cheaper to operate than our comparably expensive Audi S4.

[@danielknights1505]

Would love to see price comparison including home charging as this would be real life

[@danielknights1505]

@@dingopisscreek maybe not for you and the infrastructure needs more work but petrol and diesel will soon be old fashioned

[@alistairjohnson8185]

Except that you won't be charging at home at the destination will you?

[@CliffordRutley]

@@alistairjohnson8185 nope you'd do that for the first journey. Overnight home charging for the outbound trip would have cost me £7.86 for the BMW and £5.86 for the Peugeot. So even with the expensive fast charging at the other end I'd still be saving around £35 to £40 on the whole trip.

[@mistycat1954]

​​​That is until the government lose their revenue from petrol and diesel then to get the revenue back your home charger will get taxed ,and think about the job loses at all petrol stations that will close .

[@markgarnett3521]

Even now I would not recommend an EV if the user/owner/driver cannot charge at home/work. If you can, then the first 250 miles each day (ymmv) are literally 1/10th the fuel cost. So even the days you go a long way you have halved the fuel cost and for most people most journeys are less than the daily range so 1/10th cost for those. Not bad for something that is better, more reliable, less servicing and for sure more fun!

[@MarkJT1000]

No one ever seems to factor in the cost of your time waiting for an EV to charge, or as here, waiting for a charger to become available. Apply a basic business rate of £50 / hour to that and the cost goes through the roof.

[@kevinashurst634]

Thats simple 90% of charging happens when you are asleep, the small amount of charging for business/holiday etc trips is not usually a problem. Just avoid the chargers at MacDonalds around lunch time.

[@MarkJT1000]

@@kevinashurst634 So who are these people using the ever expanding number of public charging stations. The one in the video was completely full. Are they all asleep in their cars then?

[@kevinashurst634]

@@MarkJT1000 There are a LOT of chargers around, 6,500 rapid chargers now. Use zapmap or the cars inbuilt nav system and go to a charger that's available.

[@kevinashurst634]

@@MarkJT1000 there are 6500 rapid ev chargers in the uk, probably over 100 around Leeds. Why did What Car go to a charging station that is often busy, when the car and various apps would tell them where the next nearest and a lot cheaper available charge point is ? Any yes some people do have a sleep whilst charging. I use that Ionity charger sometimes and it is busy with Porsches/Audis and Kias who can ise the full 350Kw facility and they aren't there very long.

[@Neojhun]

That's because typically I spend about 30 Seconds to charge my EV. Soo my labor cost which my company charges clients is about £125 per hour. Comes to about £1.04 vast majority of the time I charge my car that has 250 miles range. £1.04 Labor Cost is why people don't care and never fact it in.

[@chodkowski01]

The electric is $66,000 while the gas costs $49,000. A difference of $17,000 minus taxes. $17,000 buys a lot of gas.

[@ianelliott229]

The video proves what I’ve known for sometime; that if home charging isn’t an option, EVs are just not a viable option. Further, even with home charging, they are really only suitable, as yet, as smaller city cars.

[@danharold3087]

LOL why do you think the guy selling you electricity is going to charge you less then the guy selling you gas. Charge at home when you can. That is where most people do most of their driving.

[@ianelliott229]

@@danharold3087 home charging is not an option for many of us in London

[@danharold3087]

@@ianelliott229 I tried to say that. Could have been more plain. If your goal is to cut pollution it still makes sense to have an EV even if it costs you a bit more. The few people I know that work in London drive in on scooters. None of these 'gems' doing these cherry picked comparisons consider the enviroment. It does not fit their narrative.

[@richardgp5691]

@@danharold3087 While you yourself will be cutting pollution, it appears the amount generated by the manufacture of said vehicle will take you many years to break even over say a petrol. Probably longer than you will even own the vehicle. So overall you are not actually benefitting the planet at all.

[@danharold3087]

@@richardgp5691 Unlike an ICE car that will NEVER break even. Just gets worse the longer you drive it. Not to mention the pollution generated by drilling refining and transporting gasoline.

[@danielramon962]

Many thanks for such an useful video!

[@edition-deluxe]

That's weird that ev is not as efficient on highway. We've been taught our whole lives highway miles are most efficient.

[@demej00]

So EVs will increase the likelihood of heart-attack.

[@davidgillham6847]

and if you compared this electric BMW to a much more efficient petrol hybrid, there's just no contest, with prices what they are today, petrol wins all day! And on top of that you have all the hassle of charging, the time it wastes and general charge anxiety, I mean honestly why would anyone go for an electric car. My IS300h gets 55-60mpg average on the motorway, nuff said! EVs are just not a good solution for long motorway journeys, they're only good if you charge at home and do short trips each day. I'm also disappointed they didn't factor in charge/re-fueling time here either.

[@jerryjeromehawkins1712]

Or... the strip mining involved with getting these batteries made. Whole mountains are being destroyed.

[@pstanyer1]

Cheaper if you can charge at home. If not then there is not much in-between. More expensive sounds about right.

[@jamesvdv0]

This is why my BMW i3 REx now tops up with petrol on journeys like these. Running it via cheap overnight charging on more local journeys is

[@saeedhossain6099]

honestly PHEV/range extenders are the way to go. having a Kia PHEV and an id4, the smaller Kia is honestly the car we prefer to take on in town and long distances. middle distances (~200 is miles in the US north east) the ID4 is preferable.

[@AlistairHughes]

Now do the same test, with the same cars, driving around town and then with a mix of some dual carriageways and town driving. Most people don't drive hundreds of miles on the motorways every day or even regularly. It would also be nice if you started with the caveats you placed at the end and pointed out this test was using the most expensive fuel options for both cars, and that home charging and supermarket petrol stations would be much cheaper.

[@lastminutesolutions]

Also, a ground up ICE car should be compared to a ground up EV, not an EV based on far from ideal ICE chassis..

[@danharold3087]

LOL it was rigged.

[@evilmario6061]

Came here to say this, thank you for being the voice of reason

[@garethnorthwood8055]

But taking into the price difference from new, how many miles would you have to drive before you start becoming economical and on the same level as the petrol, plus what is a second hand EV worth when the battery is over 5 years old and not holding a charge

[@Brian-om2hh]

Why would the battery "not hold a charge" at 5 years old, when it has an 8 year warranty? Go Green Autos (who post on KZbin) had a 5 year old (17 reg) Hyundai Ioniq for sale. It had covered 90k miles, and had full service history, and was in immaculate condition. A battery SOH (state of health) check was carried out via the car's diagnostic socket while the video was rolling. The battery was at 93% state of health. The car sold for £15k in just a few days....... My 3 year old Kia eNiro (30k miles) is still showing 96% battery SOH....... Typical battery degradation runs at 2 to 3% per year at most......

[@ricardomatos8650]

Bear in mind that the 440i still remain with range to probably make the same journey back while the I4 M50 had "fill up" completely it's "tank".

[@wassap786]

Lets be honest, it was only the crazy low BIK that made people go down the EV route in the last few years. Equivalent EV's are significantly more expsive in the 1st place, and now the unit cost has shot up they arent as cheap to run. I have a 330e at the moment and the range is barely 20 miles at this time of year. But i'll be sticking to a PHEV next time again, the range on them is getting better and they charge at a faster rate, so much more usable.

[@rientsdijkstra4266]

Nope, EV live much longer and have much lower maintenance cost because they have only very few moving parts. That makes their cost of ownership including the buying price over the complete lifespan signifcantly lower.

[@jimklersy1103]

I had a 330e and it was fantastic. I regret selling it. It was the best of both worlds. With sticky tires and a full charge I could keep up with the Porsche Club at my local track! The extra shove from the electric motor really made a difference. It covered tons of miles with ease as well. I am with you on the PHEV idea. I live in a very cold climate and only get the ranges stated on the sticker about 4 weeks out of the year so petrol is a must for me no matter how I try to make it work. -25f cuts my range by half, more if I don't want to wear snowmobile gear and use pocket handwarmers to stay warm.

[@stephenclay6852]

I’m glad you mentioned the home charging at the end of the video because anybody who can charge at home would have left London with a full charge from home and as such in the case of the BMW you would only need that one rapid charge to get back. But for me I prefer the smooth quiet drive of the electric car. As for the Peugeot it’s not really a motorway motor it’s classed as a city car but yes it can do it but it’s not really designed to be belting up and down a motorway. Me for my motoring it’s the electric car. I own a Kia EV6 GT line and love it.

[@smwatson1512]

B58 is remarkably efficient. A monster of an engine.

[@wolfgangpreier9160]

A monster fossil burner from the last millenium. Outdated, inefficient, expensive, stinking.

[@bdeithrick]

😂 at £2 per litre

[@SteYoung]

@@wolfgangpreier9160 but arent EVs just the same? I mean really? They just dont do their dirty business on their own doorstep. Instead they leave their fossil burning in the vicinity of the local powerplant (in most cases) whilst still requiring the use of an even more finite resource? It doesnt feel like the giant leap that its supposed to be, to me.

[@londonas2]

@@wolfgangpreier9160 who hurt you pal 😂

[@wolfgangpreier9160]

@@SteYoung Yes, Electric motors burn fossil ressources which we will never get back, produce much poisonous gases that hurt us, our children, our plants, the animals everything, are dirty and loud, must be maintained regularly and cost much too much to produce and destroy. Or did i just describe FOSSIL BURNING MONSTERS? We do not burn any fossil ressources to generate our electricity. Of course some still have to do because we still do not have enough Lithium, Nickel, Managenese dug out of the ground. But with every battery cell it less fossil fuel must be pumped and burned forever. Battery cells can be recycled. Burned fossil ressources not.

[@billvargas1657]

My Tesla costs about $12 MO. In the US to charge at home with about 1200 miles of driving a month. The cars you tested were not designed to be electric cars which I am sure contribute to the difference in range and cost..

[@bodrulm1]

If you remove government subsidies and tax breaks - both on the car and on the electricity - then ICE vehicles are significantly cheaper. I expect EVs are cheaper to run but you'd probably need to run 8-12 years to reach break even/equivalent.

[@adammachin]

What’s the percentage error on the advertised range on those EVs? Same test in winter would be beneficial as a comparison too.

[@andreipop1]

With the new prices for electicity, in Eastern Europe charging costs the same as a full tank of petrol. Add the more expensive cost of the car.

[@yoyyaesta4808]

Not true

[@darrenburrows-taurus]

Very good test - interesting results for sure. It would have been interesting to have thrown a PHEV into the test too just to be even more comprehensive.

[@itechtalk03]

PHEV’s are only efficient in small journeys once the battery is empty when on a long journey the engine kicks in and you are essentially carrying dead weight which doesn’t make them any where near as efficient as claimed. You are better off with a HEV.

[@darrenburrows-taurus]

@@itechtalk03 yes, I completely understand that but there must still be people that do occasional long journeys in a PHEV that want to understand the long range economy figures. We don't live in an ideal world.

[@berndborte8214]

It focuses exclusively on the worst case scenario for EVs: Road trips using the most expensive charging network out there and even resorting to intentonally not use energy conservation methods on the road trip, even though they're available. And it totally ignores maintenance costs. How is that a good test?

[@tomscott9938]

@@berndborte8214 It's a good test, because comparing going slowly in an EV, worried about your range, is not a comparison to driving a petrol car at the speed limit with no range anxiety. They compared the most expensive chargers to the most expensive petrol, so that seems fair. In real life, you'd fill your car at the local station at a lower cost, just like you'd charge your EV at home, so the journey there would be cheaper for the EV. However, once you are in Leeds, you would find a supermarket for cheap petrol, but the EV driver would be stuck with a fast charger. I'd like an EV, but whilst charging costs are currently 85p Kwh, it just doesn't make sense.

[@EwanV]

So we compare: 1) A pair of petrol cars being driven in a way that gives their best economy, vs 2) A pair of electric cars being driven in a way that gives their worst economy, 3) both fuelled in their most expensive way. Then draw conclusions on which is cheaper? I note that while: 1) Motorway service stations are typically about 140% the price of off motorway petrol. 2) Ionity chargers are over 200% of the highest possible price of home electricity, and 745% higher than recharging on cheap rate electricity. I also note that your home charging costs per mile shown at 11:42 appear to be both inconsistent and the highest possible. 1) the i4 is shown as 12p/m and 2.7m/kWh or an electricity cost of 32.4p/kWh 2) the e208 is shown as 10p/m and 3.5m/kWh or an electricity cost of 35p/kWh 3) British Gas currently (July 2023) offer 9.4p/kWh 12am to 5am which is less than 1/3 of the price you have used for home charging. If you charge at home, overnight at cheap rates: 1) the i4 would have cost £7.86 to charge 2) the e208 would have cost £5.58 to charge This article is misleading, unless you regularly drive hundreds of miles per day and don't charge at home, in which case it is absolutely correct, petrol is cheaper but you are a moron.

[@thefiestaguy8831]

I feel your comments are also misleading. That's a 5 hour period of cheap electricity. How many cars can charge on a home charger from a low level to perhaps 80% in 5 hours? On a public charger - sure... 50-70kw easy no problem, 20% to perhaps 90% in an hour or so. But home chargers are a fraction as powerful.

[@EwanV]

@@thefiestaguy8831 This is a blast from the past, just to note the electricity prices of 9 months ago are higher than today! 😁 The British Gas Electric Driver v7 is currently 7.9p/kWh for the cheap rate. To answer your question, you can charge 1 car per night and add about 140 miles of range every day at the cheap rate. We currently have 2 electric cars, we charge each of them once per week, sometimes twice if we do a lot of miles that week. That leaves between 3 and 5 days per week with the charger unused. One 7.4kW charger can comfortably charge 2 cars that drive the average annual mileage, and 3 cars at a push. To put that another way, one 7.4kw charger will provide enough power for 3 cars to travel 14,560 miles each per year with one day unused (theoretically you could supply 51,100 miles per year from a single 7.4kW charger used 7 days a week, but I wouldn't try it). If you need more and have the space and spare ampage on the supply you could fit two 7.4kW chargers and supply 102,200 miles worth of power. Or you could get a 22kW 3 phase charger (which would be pricy and need a mains upgrade for most UK houses) to get over 150,000 miles worth of charging capacity per charger fitted, though, you would have real trouble actually finding a car that has a battery big enough to need a 22kW charger charging for 5 hours to fill it (thats 110kWh per night).

[@funcool32]

Very interesting test - it surprised me, but didn't shock me. It would be great to factor in the cost of "time" lost to charging, as time in my case is more valuable than money.

[@derekr1113]

Do you have an enormous bladder and never stop to eat or drink? Boody well done you. I wonder about the wonderful things that you drive past, just off the motorway - shame you will never see them

[@andrija87ilic]

I would most probably keep my plug in hybrid. Charging at home with cheapest price, having 70 - 80km per charge is more than enough in town. For longer trips I have hybrid mix, but mostly on gasoline which in my case has 6 l/100km consumption. Best of both worlds and since I do not travel long distance so often, 90% of my driving is electric. I fuel up gasoline once in 6 months. I guess it's rather individual who should go for what based upon needs and use case

[@15coals39]

I have one of these too! Its the best thing ever! Best of both worlds!

[@wokeupandsmellthecoffee214]

out of interest what PHEV do you have and how much did the home electric power point cost ?

[@andrija87ilic]

@@wokeupandsmellthecoffee214 I have Lynk & Co 01, with 17,6 kWh battery. It is super efficient since electric motor is built in the 7DCT gearbox which helps to recuperate a lot and it also works perfectly with ICE in hybrid mode. It costs me around 4800 SEK/Month (swedish crowns) as a company car leasing, otherwise the car costs 460 000 SEK. According to WLTP electric only range is 69km, however I've achieved around 70-75km during the summer, in couple of rare occasions 82km, during winter at -1 Celsius range was down at around 50km. I've heard some complaints that people had only 35km of pure electric range during coldest winter days but I don't what driving style was that... Charger itself did not cost me actually, since my apartment garage has chargers included. However, housing association charges 200 SEK/Month for PHEVs and 300 SEK/Month for BEVs to cover investment and infrastructure cost. Whereas cost of used electricity is super cheap at 1,25 SEK/kWh. That leads to around 3 to 5 times less cost per month in my monthly driving compared to my previous ICE golf.

[@muppit666]

How long did you have to wait for a charger to become available? That is a massive factor.

[@LeakyD]

Plug in hybrids are the way to go in my opinion. Charge at home for those small journeys, petrol and electric for the longer.

[@geoffreyshirtliff4710]

I have had one for a over a year now and cannot fault it does what I want and as you say charge at home for the short runs and the petrol engine does the longer ones. as for this net zero nonsense which will not be met anyway they should have promoted small engine cars with a electric motor so could be used in city areas but also capable of long trips.

[@AvinashSingh-jv7uq]

I am not sure about those either. For shorter trips alright, but longer trips once your battery is out you are basically burning more fuel to carry the weight of that battery which is doing nothing.

[@dayoadeosun1520]

@@AvinashSingh-jv7uq when the main battery runs out, with the smaller battery, it continues simply as an hybrid car. No dead weight bro. I know this because I own the Toyota prius 2020 phev. I compared the mpg of my prius with my wife's vw 2L diesel car, even on motorway, the prius out shines the diesel. I have also driven a merc eqa 250, I know how Fast the miles/kwh of electric cars drop on motorway but most efficient within the city compared with Ice and hybrid cars.

[@malph9216]

How long did you have to wait to recharge, then charge, the i4 and how much did you spend on expensive coffee and snacks while the M440i could have just turned around and got back. EVs are fine as shopping trollies, but don't dare go more than a couple of hundred miles away from your home charger because, basically, you're screwed. So no relaxing holiday road trips. Cars used to be all about personal freedom.....not with an EV it seems.

[@admol73]

So personal freedom means you can't hang around for 20 mins?

[@malph9216]

@@admol73 20 mins charge in an 'affordable' EV with limited charging rates will get you about 30 mins down the road. A 5 minute refuel from empty will get me 400 miles.

[@arianitonline8748]

but what about maintenance and service? how do those compare?

[@SteYoung]

Wow. Really wasnt expecting that, thought it'd be closer but didnt expect that result. Given the quite obvious greed of the energy companies, 69p kwh is going to feel like a bargain over the next 24mnths as they milk EV owners dry.

[@jonathantaylor1998]

If the Government would at least reduce the VAT that charge point operators have to pay for the electricity down from the 20% at present to the regular 5% for 'household' electricity, that would be more of a level playing field 👍

[@bst1623]

My charging price has doubled over the past couple of years from £3.20 to £6.20 for a full charge. It's something I've just had to come to terms with.

[@SteYoung]

@@bst1623 Goodness me! Thats some increase. So in around 6 to 8 yrs you could be paying nearly £100. I really hope not for your sake!. 🙏

[@SteYoung]

@@jonathantaylor1998 Its just disappointing that the cost of running an EV lost its mojo so quickly. Manufacturers thought they could sting you for more money because your 'fuel' bills were so little. That scenario has been taken away for a lot of people. Kias and Hyundais at over £50k for what are largely lower badged (so to speak) midrange family cars is absolute bananas. Its incredible what theyre getting away with. But the truth is, they are because its 'nooo tech'. Fair play!

[@IanMcc1000]

Yeah 69p stings, compared to 7.5p at home.

[@Steve-Cross]

So I made a shrewd move in buying a Nissan Qashqai 45mpg, with even better efficiency on long journeys. Excuse me while I gloat LOL 😂

[@admol73]

Nothing to gloat about. This is a very specific situation.. 95% of the time evs are cheaper

[@Steve-Cross]

@@admol73 Not to buy and it seems not to charge up either these days.

[@Ben.Royals]

@@Steve-Cross Why just charge at home and its costing at most 34p. The video didn't show that or didn't show the vast range of cheaper chargers or that if you do many motorway miles join something like the Ionity subscription service, £16 a month and brings charging down to around 30p.

[@Steve-Cross]

@@Ben.Royals Well that's great... Not everyone can charge at home though. Also, home charging is a long slow process, unless you have a very expensive home charger installed. I will hang on until the infrastructure is good enough to handle the volume of EV's; which will probably be never, at this rate. Who wants to spend their life waiting for a car to charge? That's if you can find a charging point, that is available and actually works.

[@Ben.Royals]

@@Steve-Cross You dont wait for it to charge I just plug it in when I get home from work or when I've finished whatever im doing that evening and go about cooking tea and sleeping. Went to the Trafford centre the other week and car was on charge while we had food and went shopping, super easy. On a rapid charging charing takes 30 minutes or less and if you've already driven over 200 miles, a 30 minute break is welcomed. If you cant charge at home there are plenty of other options available like charge posts, lamppost chargers and gutter ways in the pavement to run your cable to your home.

[@Dirtyharry70585]

Wait until you get billed for yearly road mileage since US roads get funding from gas taxes which ev don’t pay for.

[@matthewfensterwald1853]

I think that they should have included the cost of a full charge at home at night tariffs for both, yah road trips may be more expensive but the day to day may have another outcome. Curious, maybe an update in the future hopefully

[@user-ie6jr4bg1w]

Petrol cars are cheaper

[@frube837]

an overnight tariff sits around 7.5p/kwh so the whole journey charging ahead would of cost you £6.28 using the numbers in the video. day to day it is always cheaper to run electric with home overnight tariff.

[@landlord5552]

@@frube837 I hope you have extra home in destination point also then.

[@frube837]

Ahh yes the over 300mile daily one way journey requiring multiple homes which is the real struggle... Sarcasm aside its just charging up at a super charger at the rate stated in the video for those longer journeys every so often or take advantage of the charging offered by most destination hotels.

[@saintsone7877]

@@frube837 At the moment while prices of power are subsidised to encourage uptake of EV's. Wait until Ev's are 30%+ of the market and wait again until 2035 when all new cars are EV's only. Prices for electricity will skyrocket and make current costs look ridiculous. And then there is the small thing called batteries. Should you need to replace a battery before you get rid of your Ev(trade ins will be near impossible once an EV reaches 7 years of age) and buy a new car any cost benefit will disappear completely. And you forget that the power you are recharging your car with is probably fossil fuel provided as you stated you recharged overnight when little or no solar or wind power is available. One day we will all have EV's and hopefully they will have sorted out all of the negatives but until then EV's are overpriced environmental disasters disguised as savers of the planet. Just ask why since EV's and renewables emissions have not fallen but actually increased and you will be amazed by the answer. Renewables and EV's are the cause of the emissions rising. Yet no-one wants to discuss it.

[@MrSonicAdvance]

This was very interesting, thank you. Personally, I am wary of electric vehicles as I don't know much about them, or all the implications of ownership. I love the idea of free charging, and of being able to charge at home, but I also get range anxiety, and don't want to be forced to scout around trying to find a working charger, or a charger I can use without a long wait. I have a long list of concerns about EVs, but I'm sure a lot of them are just down to my ignorance about EV ownership.

[@MrGrim2u1987]

How long do you think free charging will last ? Once 30 or 40 % of people own them expect all charging stations to start wanting there investments to make money.

[@MrSonicAdvance]

@@MrGrim2u1987 I'm honestly surprised it's lasted this long. I'm genuinely impressed by this @WhatCar video as usually videos that question the all-round superiority of EVs over ICE vehicles have some click-baity title like "My EV ownership has turned into a NIGHTMARE!!!" and then the video is pro-EV and anti-ICE. One particular bugbear I have is charging times. We have a lot of drivers who are incredibly impatient. We have drivers who, when approaching a lane merge, race up the merging lane and force their way in at the last minute, or the drivers who speed along in lane three of the motorway then cut across all the lanes to make their exit so they can get ahead of other drivers, just for a couple of examples. The idea that these drivers are going to happily faff around for ages while they wait for a charger to become free seems unlikely. It's all well and good saying "I have a home charger!", but look at how many households have 2, 3 or even 4 cars on their drive. I suspect there is an agenda to force a lot of "ordinary" people off the road, by making car ownership too impractical for most people.

[@markgc65]

EV range anxiety soon goes away, we charge our EV6 average once a week overnight. Public charging is deer but have done it x 2 in 7 months about £19 total. buying Car is biggest outlay. for us £12.5k "more" to replace than the diesel model we used to own. Similar specs, Diesel used to cost us £160 a month road tax £15, service £40, Ext warranty £39 £264 a month total, EV has free road Tax, costs £37 a month to charge service is £18 a month. so £55. has 7 year warranty so saving £211 a month. 2.5k a year so takes 5 years to get money back. Fly in ointment is resale values ICE likely to fall as we approach 2030 EV likely to be better 2nd hand because they are so dear new. So we won't know for a while what's the best. If EV costs drop people who currently own will also lose big time if they sell.

[@MrSonicAdvance]

​@@markgc65 Entry cost isn't my big concern, as I think I'd lease or PCP my way into EV ownership rather than buy. For me performance is the big plus of EVs. I really DO like the idea of home charging, as I find going to a petrol station to fill up a nuisance. All things considered, given my low daily mileage, I probably would be a good candidate for an EV, but I'm not quite ready to take the plunge yet.

[@markgc65]

@@MrSonicAdvance Best thing we ever did. Would never go back still have a lovely low mileage sports car 155mph 0-60,in 5.6 secs manual gears, But to be honest Now with Ev it's lost its shine. We have KIA EV6 GT line.

[@michaelgoode9555]

Interesting but flawed. EV owners who could charge at home would be charging for a quarter of that cost overnight but you cannot brim your fossil tank overnight at home and nowhere can you get petrol for a quarter of the price of the motorway pumps. I know you petrol heads are determined to try and make it look like running an EV is not cost effective but those in the know know different.

[@jamesj97370]

Worked out I'd have to do 66,000 miles in an electric Fiat 500 to break even vs petrol version 😂

[@Neojhun]

Yep cost of ownership of a higher performance nicer power train does not save you money. A more powerful quicker car is typically more expensive regardless if it's ICE or BEV.

[@jdgolf499]

Couple other points. First, my time has value. How long did it take to charge the EV, including the time spent waiting for a charger to open up, versus how long to fill with gas? Secind, you are correct that charging at home would probably be cheaper, however, in addition to the higher vehicle cost, you must add the additional cost of the charging system. You would need to have enormous savings of electric over gas, and I don't think that will happen.

[@derekr1113]

Do you suffer from range anxiety and have to visit smelly petrol stations? I charge my car like I charge my phone - overnight and never have to worry. Savings over 1000€ per year and not killing the planet = smug. Every followed a diesel car and smelt the exhaust?

[@jdgolf499]

​@@derekr1113 The problem I have, is that I have family and friends throughout the country that I enjoy visiting, and I enjoy driving to many of those places. I also travel for work regularly, but not far enough to fly, and I also enjoy vacations. So, I am not always home to charge overnight, and I rarely see an EV charger at the hotels I stay at, and if I am visiting someone without a charger, I would be out of luck! So, I guess if you are a homebody that never goes anywhere, charging overnight is fine! And let's not forget when California told you that you couldn't charge your EV overnight during a heat wave, because the grid wasn't capable. Finally, don feel too good about saving the planet, because many studies have showed that during the total life of an EV, it is worse than a gas car. There is a TON of minerals that must be mined for the battery, and very large, fossel fuel using equipment is used. Most of the energy used to charge your EV is generated from fossil fuels, and lets not forget the unknown about what happens to the battery once scrapped.

[@ShutterKnack]

​@@derekr1113can you articulate your points without being condescending?

[@bobstirling6885]

That's the big point the EVangelists conveniently forget....the cost of time charging for a self employed person or a company having to pay their drivers to be idle. Both costs are way higher than any possible savings (which really don't exist on long journeys anyway).

[@thefiestaguy8831]

@@derekr1113 You sound like a right cheapskate. A 1,000 euro a year saving is nothing.... you can easily save that much by turning off all electrical items of a night before going to bed, do you do that? If you are so tight fisted and think 1,000 euros a year saving is a lot, I question how you could even afford the over-priced EV in the first place. No to mention the cost of replacing the battery, generally higher depreciation cost.. the fact that a LOT of garages won't touch EV's due to the lethal high voltage batteries on the underside.... meaning insurance costs are higher in EV's than in normal cars. You might be saving 1,000 euros per year on "fuel" but when you factor in the depreciation, possibly higher insurance and inconvenience of having to find a garage (or get ripped off at a main dealer) the actual "savings" are a lot lower. It's ironic you ask the person who uses an ICE if he worries about "range anxiety" as range anxiety is pretty much only experienced for the most part by EV drivers... this video is a good example of it. I've never put 400 miles worth of fuel in my car and then been worried I might not even be able to get 300 miles from that supposed 400 miles of estimated range - my car's estimated range on a full tank is around 420 miles, and yes it's a "smelly diesel" but it is as quick off the line as most EV's and even faster than some of them.

[@peterjones1354]

No account taken of time delays in journeys when chargers not available, or the tension of watching the ev battery level sink as you are driving or the extra stops needed to top up batteries when petrol can keep going. Also how much petrol will the car cost differential get you over the life of the car.

[@Alex-ek5fb]

95% of my charging is done at night at a cost of 7.5p/kWh. Overall, that makes an EV far cheaper, even with the occasional motorway fast charge. The trick is to ensure that your regular return journeys are covered by the car’s range.

[@TheComputec]

Exactly what plan/tarrif are you on that is 7.5p per Kw/h? Supplemental questions:- is it 100% renewable energy What happens when the majority of people get home chargers and the overnight "off-peak" rate is no longer off-peak? Whatever answers you come back with, just remember these points:- Not everyone can have a home charger, The UK doesn't currently have capacity for even 40% of people to have a home charger Your postcode has a large bearing on your energy cost Charging a large capacity battery from home on an 11Kwh charger can take 18hrs

[@Alex-ek5fb]

@@TheComputec it is Octopus Go. They no longer offer that tariff, but the new Intelligent Octopus tariff is better still: they access your car (most brands) or Ohme charger (any brand car) and ensure the car is charged by the mornong. You just set what you want and by when and the cost is 7.5p/kWh. Yes, it is fully renewable and with Intelligent Octopus they of course pick the times when renewables are highest, say when a storm passes through and wind power is at a peak (and at night, the grid has plenty of spare capacity as other use is low). Not everyone a home charger: it is true, though my local council installed some Ubitricity chargers in some of the lamp posts when they replaced the old posts for LED ones. Those use less power, so there was spare power available on the grid that powers those lights. It is council dependent, so lobby your council. For those in apartments with off street parking: new builds need a certain number of chargers by law. For oder homes, either lobby your landlord or tenants association (for shared freeholds). Postcode: there is some variability, but not that much. I understand the 7.5p is available to most on the mainland. Charging a large battery: The Tesla Model Y, Kia EV6 and a range of other 300 mile+ popular EVs have a ~75 kWh battery. On the standard single phase 7.4 kW charging, that takes 10 hours. The largest batteries on UK EVs are currently 100 kWh, so around 13 hours. Besides, London to Birmingham and back is 240 miles. That would be an exceptionally long commute. In a Tesla Model Y which has 4 miles/kWh, that is 60 kWh so only 8 hours of charging. Besides, with Tesla, the cost of Supercharging is not all that high, currently around 38-43p/kWh, so can be used if you really need and much cheaper than say Instavolt. Over time, charging costs will come down for everyone, e.g subscription services are becoming available that lower the cost if you commit to a certain network.

[@andcouncil1]

I was going to offer to pick up your mike and hand it back to your opponent, but oh dear, he seems to have run back to mummy.@@Alex-ek5fb

[@messier4033]

What if we all get EVs and charge at night? Surely the grid will have massive demand and the prices will increase to reflect such.

[@Alex-ek5fb]

@@messier4033 Good question. Two aspects to this: grid capacity and generation capacity. Grid capacity: at night, there is far less demand. Most factories are shut, lights are off, home appliances are mostly off. In the UK at night, the load is around 20 GW, whereas the grid is calculated for the highest use ever (in the UK that is a cold winter’s day) and that is around 50 GW. At night there is always spare capacity even if everyone has an electric car. As for generation capacity: every country has generation capacity that it cannon switch off (e.g. nuclear) or is essentially free once built, so it does not want to switch off (wind, solar, some hydro). Currently, the energy from these sources is often running idle as there is no use for it. EV’s can soak up that excess energy demand so it is not wasted. Those will bring energy prices down for everyone. The way that works is: I give the energy companies 7.5p / kWh, where they otherwise would have received nothing. They get more revenue, so they can charge everyone less (and in a competitive energy market, that eventually happens).

[@INSTRUMANROBOT]

This is eye opening! Thanks for doing this! I think a plug-in hybrid is still the best option in today's time

[@djtaylorutube]

It's actually not a good comparison. Most people do their charging at home. Use of motorway service charges are exceptions. EV's are significantly cheaper. Petrol/diesel fuel is largely similar and only going to go up long term.

[@INSTRUMANROBOT]

@@djtaylorutube somewhat agree with you on the fuel prices but I don't think most people have the option to charge at home.. for example people like me living in flats

[@djtaylorutube]

@@INSTRUMANROBOT Yes and I'm not oblivious to that. As with any technology, it's not going to work for everyone at present but nor would I invest in a wood burner at home because they tend to work well for modern, eco houses which have excellent insulation and I'm not referring to just a load of loft insulation! There does need to be more investment in street charging such as that in China which is a decade ahead of us. The thing to consider is that electricity can be generated from numerous sources and the current high electricity prices are heavily influenced by the coupling of renewable prices to gas wholesale pricing and that model is showing why it's broken. I sell surplus kWh solar to the grid for 4.25p which is then sold to you at the gas rate of capped 34p. Uncoupling that could massively reduce electricity prices. This means that an EV today could in effect be 100% renewable or nuclear powered in future but fossil fuel pricing is ultimately only going one way. I hope for everyone that things will improve.

[@vxrdave12]

I beg to differ and would love them to do a real world test on this. If you look at something like a A250e to get all the hybrid bits in they lower the fuel tank capacity to 30/35 litres in most cases. Result is your able to do 20/30 miles on electricity then only 250/270 miles on the remaining petrol due to the smaller tank. A regular petrol A250 probably get 320/350 miles max from a tank of fuel which you then just fill up rather than plug in and fill up. Hybrid for me not there yet, need more diesel hybrids so you can do electric in town and diesel on the motorway!

[@djtaylorutube]

@@vxrdave12 You've also got the worst of both worlds there because you're paying VED for a diesel, without the benefit of EV range and then the addition of maintenance of complex drivetrains.

[@theintruder77]

I cannot imagine a D9 Caterpillar Bulldozer in the middle of a northern forest working in the timber industry running off a battery. Other heavy stuff like skidders, quad cab pickups and even chainsaws running on electricity is a joke. I have an electric and a Husquavarna chain saw and there is no contest when bucking up 10-12 inch logs. Loads more power in gas.

[@Smudge64]

I charge at home so half price

[@martinrichardson4966]

Would be really interested to see a city based economy test on the same cars. Say drive around the North or south circular in London during the day.

[@glennl2871]

If city driving depend if they do it in peak hour. If peak hour with crawling traffic the electric would blow the petrol car apart. There would be no comparison, and that is from seeing my mitsubishi outlander reset the average fuel consumption and if not driving and idling it sometimes reaches 65 L/100km. When get on the freeway 10 mins it goes back down to 14L/100km. If like the BMW test was, the reason it was 39 was fuel economy goes to the moon :). Mitsubishi outlander I have lowest has been 7L/100km.

[@Bournemouthjetwashing]

Regardless of cost, a petrol or diesel car is be much better than any electric car, sod the environment nonsense and all that range anxiety. ll stick with the combustion engines thanks 👍

[@NAY2GAS]

I pay $12.00 to fill up my Model Y at home in an apartment out my kitchen window. In the past year I’ve used public charging stations only 5% 95% of my charging is done at home. Much cheaper to drive an EV and much cheaper to maintain them. I’ve been driving 100% Electric for 10.5 years and have not replaced a battery yet.