Empire 6" & 12" Combination Squares - Squareness Test

[@martinhawrylkiewicz2025]

Why not just draw a second line really close to the first line and check if they are parallel ....

[@sreevatsan]

Great review, very helpful! I’m looking to get a 6 inch combination square. Empire, Irwin and Swanson are my current contenders. All the three seem in the same price range and quality.

[@nobuckle40]

Very glad that you found it helpful. Thanks for watching. Take care.

[@robc8468]

The difference is how long they hold squareness after use and wear. Quality heads are Cast iron and big box store square heads combination squares are made of die cast aluminum or ever worse zinc. A dyi homeowner would probably be ok with low end squares a metal worker or a professional would be better off with a cast iron PEC or Starrett. I am not a tool snob and I own a Starrett combination square for metal working layout and a Irwin aluminum head square for woodworking projects.

[@nobuckle40]

I used Starrett, Brown and Sharpe, and Mitutoyo machinist's tool for years when I was in the tool shop. Unfortunately, I sold a bunch of that stuff many years ago. I totally agree with you, cast iron/steel heads, that are precision ground, are the way to go. Thanks for your feedback and for watching.

[@denniscotey8182]

I've been a cabinet maker, furniture builder and a finisher for 40 years. I've used the very worst to the very best measuring and layout tools. I find it interesting that you think homeowners dont want or dont need more precision layout tools. But I get it, "let them eat cake".

[@jesterraj]

Hi i got this based on this video...was spot on......caribbean locked on

[@nobuckle40]

I'm glad it helped. Thanks for watching.

[@3stagevtec]

I have the 12" version of the Empire combination square and mines was not square from the factory. I suspect it may be hit or miss with this brand..

[@nobuckle40]

Shipping could play a role as well as how they are handled at the retailer. Thanks for watching.

[@PasiSavolainen]

I have the Empire 12" machinist square and the 45deg edge is off by a degree, so 4 degrees for a full 360 needed for a frame. Found that out after using it for a "45deg" shooting board.. And since it'z some zinc alloy, it's damn hard to adjust it because it clogs any sand paper and files completely. Mine is from ~8y ago, might've changed since. Another thing I didn't understand to dislike first were the printed markings on the straightedge, they wear off.

[@nobuckle40]

Thanks for watching and for the input. I too have a machinist's combination square - with center finder head and protractor head. I rarely use these for woodworking as they are truly for machinist use. We'll see how these hold up over time. Thanks again.

[@PasiSavolainen]

@@nobuckle40 oops, I used wrong name, it was indeed combination square and same-looking one that you tested. For me it also had "good enough for woodworking" 90deg angle

[@mrsimpleesarcastik3494]

close enough for rock n roll for me!

[@nobuckle40]

Me too! Thanks for watching.

[@jesterraj]

Hi i got the 6' out of the box its square ...has some milling marks thought but dead on.

[@nobuckle40]

I'm glad that you like it. I hope the video helped and thanks for watching.

[@alfredomarquez9777]

You failed miserably at several aspects: 1) these squares are made from two INCOMPATIBLE materials: A hard Stainless steel ruler, riding against a too soft, wearable Zinc alloy. But to really mess it, the sliding surfaces inside the zinc alloy head, are very small, so that the wear will be concentrated on those small pads, rendering the square useless all too soon. 2) When checking a square, the best way is to use the pointed scribe, as any pencil is just too soft and its line is too coarse to be useful, AND, you have to trace TWO very close paralell lines, in that way, you should see more clearly any deviation, as it is easier to see those two lines either diverging or converging. Lastly, using a wooden "factory edge" is OK for a rough, quick comparison, but to really do it properly, get a METAL STRAIGHT EDGE, and proceed to test the squares against it, not against a soft wooden edge. Finally, you completely forgot to test the 45 degree edges, which can be easily compared by placint the two squares against each other. I went Testing them at a Home Depot, I found that ALL of the squares of the lot (more than 20 piieces) were off appreciably! Even the Empire Rafter squares were slightly BENT on their "shoe" side, making them worthless! As a last resort, I picked up several of the "Get Two for the price of one" package of the same Empire 7" Rafter squares, and even inside the cardboard packing, It was IMPOSSIBLE to press the pair against themselves, due to the curvature of the inside edge of their shoes. This was due to them being deformedfromfactory. Truly bad "advice". Go, get a good brand and retest them against the Empires, there wil be no comparison.

[@nobuckle40]

Thank you for your feedback. Perhaps you could make a video of how to properly test a combination square. That would be helpful. Also, as far as good brands are concerned, the best on the market is probably Starrett. Mitutoyo is another good brand. No, I did not forget to check the 45 degree feature. I didn't test it because that feature wasn't what I was concerned with. Perhaps I will at some point in the future.

[@histguy101]

These are used for construction carpentry. I never see anyone out on job sites using $150 speed squares or combi squares. You'd have to keep it in a protective case all the time. Would you walk around with a woodpecker shoved in your pocket or tool belt? I mostly see people with empire or Milwaukee squares and levels.

[@nobuckle40]

@@histguy101 I agree. I bought these because I do more woodworking than machining. When I was a machinist I used highly accurate combination squares made by Mitutoyo. I still have my machinists combination squares but these are more practical for the work that I am doing. Thanks for watching.

[@thecthomebuyer]

@alfredo Wow. Alfredo seems to be a very passionate accuracy enthusiast. His pencil lines were much less than a 64th’’. To explain to you why thats still a more than adequate level of squareness. Those may not be up to a 10000th of an inch but it is perfect for the average joe who will use them to build a door or kitchen cabinets or a nice coffee table. If you are a pro then this is obviously not the tool that you should use. In that case a pro making high end furniture should use a LS Starrett or Woodpeckers etc. The tool will last a lifetime since it will be used less than a pro would use his/hers. This guy just made a wonderful informative video. Why are you being THAT person. Don’t be that commenter.

[@TM_Stone]

Hopefully you don't critique people like this when you're face to face. His wife/boyfriend makes something he doesn't like: "You failed miserably at cooking this meatloaf 🤬🤬!!"

[@Andrew-xd9fg]

These combination square are junk, they will only last a year of daily use. Would be better off buying a starrett

[@nobuckle40]

@@Andrew-xd9fg I agree that they are not as high quality as Starrett. But I don't expect them to be. Thanks for the input and thanks for watching.