Point of View (Part 2) - Third Person Objective, Limited, and Omniscient -- Video and Worksheet

[@m4fireup213]

You are actually the best teacher that shows exactly what she’s talking about in a neat understandable way and also gives examples. Thank you very much. Keep it up!

[@EnglishUnits]

Thank you for these very kind words, M4 Fire UP!

[@jamilaratlamwala3513]

Thanks , my exams are tommorrow , this helped me a lot

[@ramishahfatima9988]

Me too

[@KryptKicker5]

Wouldn’t the Harry Potter example be third person limited? I’ve not read the book but, to me at least, the observation of the Dursley’s emotions are based solely on outwardly available information. As opposed to actually knowing how Harry feels inwardly. Thank you for the video!

[@Sena-hu1iy]

I love the way you teach and I don't know why you have only a few videos. wish you had more videos about writing a strong paragraph and the paragraph types

[@EnglishUnits]

Thank you so much for these kind words, Sena!

[@primrose5508]

This is so helpful! Thank you so much from aspiring writer out there who didn't go to college & are trying to put it all together!

[@EnglishUnits]

Hello Primrose, thank you. I wish you great success!

[@JeroshNarayan]

Thank you for the video, it was insightful. I understand why you're saying that the Harry Potter paragraph is omniscient. However, can't the argument be made that the paragraph could also be interpreted as limited? The sentence, "And, if the Dursleys were unhappy to have him back for the holidays, it was nothing to how Harry felt" - can't this be seen as filtering through Harry's thoughts rather than objectively stating how the Dursleys certainly had felt? Much like the "forced enthusiasm" example, I think it's quite possible that the description is filtered through the point of view of the character as opposed to drawn from omniscience. This would have been my interpretation at least. I can see that particular sentence being used to communicate a bit of the character's irritation towards the Dursleys and the writing style borrowing the character's voice. Or am I completely wrong with this one?

[@EnglishUnits]

Hi Jerosh Narayan, yes, this is an excellent argument. It is possible that the narrator is telling us Harry's thought about the Dursleys, which would make this selection read as third limited. My gut says that the tone and words the narrator uses don't seem like a thought expressed by Harry (which would support that it's third omniscient). BUT, it doesn't matter what our gut says; answers and conclusions must be supported using details in the text. In the selection shown, no detail in the text definitively disproves your argument--so I feel your answer is correct. (The same goes for third omniscient.)

[@chiemelachimaobi4359]

I think i have an objection As educational as this video is, and as much as it has helped me, I feel harry porters example is controversial as it can also be an example of 3rd person limited The narrator said, “and if the dursley's were unhappy" this doesn't actually mean that they were unhappy, even if they were unhappy it was an assumption If not it should have been “and even as the dursley's were unhappy" But it was clear that he knew harry porters thoughts tho So i think it should be 3rd person limited as opposed to omniscient P.s The play might have made use of 3rd person omniscient, but this particular extract doesn't portray it well... I stand to be corrected tho

[@Oakdeus]

I had the same thoughts as well, because of the "if"

[@Goldenbrickfilms683]

Yes, this is correct. I was thinking the same thing and Googled it. It is not omniscient.

[@funnyshorts9880]

Thank u for this video u gained a subscriber

[@ImranKhan-xw2lp]

your teaching style is so amazing..Please try to make more videos regularly👌🙂

[@EnglishUnits]

Imran Khan, thank you so much for your comment. Your kind words are very appreciated!

[@asfandyarkhan8954]

Thanks a lot .....it was so helpful....may u live long ...❤❤❤❤

[@draxthedestroyer2442]

This actually helped me avoid writing errors in my Novel thank you subbed.

[@Zimbant]

Excellent! Great explanation and examples! Thank you very much.

[@danimatt814]

Thxxxx I have a test in an 1 hour & 30mins, saved meeee!

[@ronavanessaguillermo362]

This is very helpful, thank you so much💕

[@vonwick64]

Thanks i have to study this and you helped me a lot.

[@marinahaynes9121]

I agree

[@AA-pm5yk]

I did not know the differences between these three types, but after I saw this video, I knew how I could use them. Many thanks !

[@Kamran_Ali0]

Ma'am first off, thanks a bunch and hats off to you for beneficial and impactful video, this contains certainly useful knowledge with reference to Third Person POV. Thank you very much, but i'm curious to know that how does narrator know the silent thoughts of his character?

[@EnglishUnits]

Hello, the author of the story creates the narrator (and all characters). So, when writing a story, the author decides--will my narrator know the thoughts of characters or not? If yes, the author writes in a way that gives the narrator a limited or omnisicient POV, but if not, the author writes so that the narrator has an objective POV.

[@shaden2735]

So helpful Thank you so much

[@minabashyal1442]

This is the best explanation. Thankyou so much. means a lot

[@marionbechler7772]

I‘m from Germany and i‘m infinitely grateful for this video ! Thank you !!

[@EnglishUnits]

Hi Marion Bechler, thank you for this very kind comment!

[@m.h.4021]

You literally saved me,i am going to have a benchmark in Tuesday and Thursday,i need to know this stuff:D

[@pasqzita1805]

This is the best explanation I have heard and watched. Congratulation!

[@olivek5982]

This helped me soooo much with my English THANKS

[@alisha8011]

Thank you , you're very good at explaining

[@hezekiahsemple2080]

wow! love the way it was explained.

[@ssmith5086]

What a fantastic teaching. Wish there was more.

[@betheshift3530]

Thank you for the videos, I am learning from them. There is one thing, however... In practice one, you state that we know the narration is in 3rd person omniscient because we know that the narrator knows what everyone is feeling. What I am confused about is that the sentence reads "IF the Dursleys were unhappy..." Isn't the mere fact that "if" is used show us that he doesn't know all the feelings?

[@EnglishUnits]

That's a really good question. Usually, the word "if" involves uncertainty--but not always. In the sentence about the Drusleys, "if" is used sort of like in this sentence: If I were Mary, I wouldn't eat that mystery food! In this sentence, there's no doubt in what is said--I definitely would not eat that mystery food. Also, I'm definitely not Mary. It's an odd construction used to make a point. So, the sentence about the Dursleys actually means, "The Dursleys were very unhappy to have Harry back for the holidays, and he was so much more unhappy than they were about it!" Usually, the word "if" WOULD create doubt about whether the narrator knows the thoughts of others for certain...an example without the word "if" would have been better to avoid this nuance!

[@misshyperalphafemale]

Great explaining ,madam Thank you !

[@OLIVIA-yg9ei]

Thank you, I have been looking at various styles trying to understand these all day. This finally broke it down in a way I could easily understand🙂

[@maricarmenberesp8645]

Great video and explanation!!!

[@manasreddy1852]

Hi. Thanks a lot for the video, can we have some work sheets to print??

[@EnglishUnits]

Hello, thank you for your comment. There is a printable worksheet in the video description.

[@snugdream2307]

Greetings! How about facial expressions on non-main characters? Or actions. When someone makes a facial expression, or any action really, it's because they thought or felt something. So if it's third person limited, and the main character is Tommy, and the narrator states that a secondary or non-main character such as Sammy twitched, winced, their nose scrunched up / their nose scrunched up in disgust, eyes watered, they hesitated before continuing to speak, etc, would that make the story third person omniscient? I'm pretty sure I've read stories that are third person limited but other characters do react to the same situation as the main character differently, with facial expressions, clenched fists, loud voice, tears, etc. Aren't these descriptions, actions, thoughts, feelings, that let the reader know what that non-main character is thinking or feeling? I feel like I am missing something here. Help or clarification or examples would be so appreciated! Tommy is the main character who we follow. The early evening sun was setting behind Tommy and Sammy as they walked along the sidewalk home from school. On the other side of the road, along the sidewalk parallel to them, the new girl who Tommy had seen at school was walking. Tommy dropped to his shoes and pretended tying. Sammy rolled his eyes. While the thought or feeling may not be exactly stated we get some of Sammy's reaction. Something made him roll his eyes. If it were a longer passage, we might know exactly why he roled his eyes, because he's been witnessing Tommy do silly things like this all day. Or what if Sammy scowled? I'm confused when side characters are displaying and revealing actions. Is it only when the main character notices? Tommy caught Sammy rolling his eyes. Sammy's scowl hit Tommy like a spike. Basically are facial expressions, body actions, strengths of voice, tears, laughter, yawning, etc, the thoughts and feelings of non-main characters that once mentioned / narrated, make the story omniscient instead of limited? In the practice 3 part, one of the sentences says: then Roy's Father poked his head and said, with forced enthusiasm: "And don't forget Disney world." wouldn't the narrator telling us that Roy's father was enthusiastic make it so that we know what he was feeling, sensing, thinking, etc? or at least his mood would be revealed, and therefore feeling? And since it says it was forced enthusiasm, he must have been attempting to force it, giving us more insight into his character at that moment. Are tones of voice and sarcasm and choosing to be quiet, staring, etc, disorienting the reader and plunging us out of the main character's experience and into omniscient? So confused! Your videos are helping me learn and I appreciate it very much! I think I understand about the silent thoughts and feelings you mentioned, is this the rule go by? What if the mother had smiled after speaking, or the dad clenched his fists in anger. Are smiling and clenching fists reveals that should be omitted from non-main characters if you want to keep the story third person limited? I'm not sure where the line from limited to omniscient gets crossed - especially in descriptions when secondary characters have facial expressions and reactions and bodily actions, (especially ones that reveal how the secondary character is probably feeling or thinking: nervous, tired, angry, etc). Do we only show the main character witnessing these facial expressions, reactions and bodily actions, in third person limited, that way while the secondary characters may be displaying thoughts and emotions, it's only interpreted, witnessed, experienced through he main character? We just see things that the mom and dad did and said, not silent thoughts and feelings but what if the narrator describes HOW they did or said something (angrily, through wet eyes, smiling, etc), then does that push third person limited into omniscient, since we are getting a sense of what the secondary characters might be thinking or feeling? Thank you!

[@EnglishUnits]

Hi Snug Dream, actions and facial expressions DO show how a character feels. However, they are seen by everyone. So a scowl, shrug, or rolled eyes doesn't help us know whether a narrator has third person omniscient (or limited) point of view. An omniscient or limited point of view is when a narrator can read the character's mind even when there are NO actions or facial expressions (rolled eyes, scowls etc.). I think you are confused because authors and narrators ALWAYS communicate a character's thoughts or feelings...otherwise, a story would be boring. But interpeting the thought from actions we see is very different from hearing the character's thoughts and seeing into the character's mind. Some narrators (third limited and omniscient) can see right into the minds and thoughts of characters with NO clues from actions or faces. But other narrators are like you and me--they cannot read thoughts but can only see actions and faces and interpret them. (The ones like you and me are third subjective:). Does this help?

[@snugdream2307]

@@EnglishUnits Yes, and thank you for taking the time to help me (and anyone else who might need this clarification). My goal is to write in third person omniscient, because I like the idea of the narrator (who is not the main character in the story, but a separate entity) popping in with his own remarks here and there and sometimes addressing the reader (I don't know if that kind of narration can be done in third person limited? Please let me know). But, I still only really want to follow a main character's thoughts and feelings. So, I didn't know if it was allowed to describe facial expressions and body actions of non-main characters, since those reactions seem to infer thoughts and emotions. But you are saying in 3rd person limited and in omniscient, it's ok to write about any character's facial expression and body action, as long as the one true main character is the only one to have their thoughts and feelings directly written about / stated? So if Tommy was the main character, in a third person limited story, it's ok to write, he kicked his bag against the wall. He had never been so angry. but that would not be allowed for a non-main character, such as Sammy, because in third person limited, the narrator only knows the thoughts and feelings of Tommy. So for a non-main character, Sammy, it would be, Sammy kicked the bag against the wall and heaved deeply through grit teeth (omitting saying he was angry, but showing it through actions and facial expression and body language). In omniscient, while the narrator can reveal any thoughts and feelings of any character, can an omniscient narrator choose to only reveal the thoughts and feelings of a single main character (similar to third person limited), so that there's a closeness of only truly knowing / following a main character but with the added benefit of knowing more about places, people and histories (things the main character wouldn't know)? And to pop in with the narrator's own commentary? If I have this right, please let me know! Also, since my goal is to write in third person omniscient (or limited if I am wrong here), can a narrator pop in with their own remarks and/or address the reader, only in omniscient? Or can that also be done in third person limited. What type of narration can describe things such as; setting, even if the main character isn't awake yet? If the narrator says, "It was a beautiful pink and yellow morning, a little sky in every bead of dew." how can a third person limited and or omniscient narrator say this if the story is from a main character's point of view, and he or she is asleep. is that not ok? can narration about setting, if the main character isn't around to experience it, and narration about things the main character doesn't know such as histories of towns and peoples and techniques, only be done by an omniscient narrator? Thank you!

[@EnglishUnits]

The type of narration you’d like to do can be done with all POVs. It is easiest to pull off with third person narrators-subjective, limited, or omniscient all work fine with this type of narration. Yes, correct-In third limited and third omniscient (as well as all other points of view), it's ok to write about any character's facial expression and body action, as all narrators can observe these details just like any other detail in the scene they are watching and describing to the reader. In third limited, you are correct--the one true main character is the only one to have their thoughts and feelings directly written about / stated. The examples and labels you gave about Tommy and Sammy are correct-knowing Sammy’s thoughts, versus just seeing Sammy’s actions. The question in your third paragraph is tricky. Theoretically, yes, an omniscient narrator could know thoughts of ALL characters but only reveal the thoughts of ONE character. However, in this case, if we were to analyze this narrator, we will think this narrator is third limited-since there is no evidence of knowing thoughts of more than one character. Your last questions about a narrator’s knowledge of history or a setting where the narrator isn’t present are interesting. Any narrator using third person POV (subjective, limited, and omniscient) can know as much as the author wishes about history and setting, as long as the knowledge stays consistent throughout the story. A first person narrators’ knowledge of history and setting will depend on that character and what that character would naturally know. (For example, in Twilight, the narrator is a teenage girl. She only knows details about setting and history that any teenage girl would.) If a first person is sleeping, it is almost impossible to express during that moment-you have to express it before or after the sleeping. Finally, the types of point of view (first, second, third, etc) are used to teach learners so that they RECOGNIZE points of view when they see them. BUT, as a writer, you can have your narrator do whatever you wish, know whatever you wish him or her to know, as well as to speak to readers directly or not. You should know which POV you chose so you can describe your story and stay consistent as you write it (or break the consistency, but know why).

[@kristinalam6614]

I thought that the whole thing of "seemed", "felt", "looked", was just a case of filtering and using filter words. I didn't think that it was because of another point of view. I was told many times that I should refrain from using filter words so that I could connect more to the character and that it just distances us from the character.

[@EnglishUnits]

Hello, yes, filter words are often overused by writers because these words are an easy and obvious way to show differences in POV. For that reason, this video uses filter words to explain differences in POVs-to make the differences obvious and clear to learners. This is good in a teaching video, which should be simple and clear! But it's bad in a story where frequent use of filter words oversimplify details for readers and pull readers away from the action of the story.

[@Youssefidammi]

Thank you so much for this very useful lesson.

[@EnglishUnits]

Thank you very much, Youssef!

[@anthonyhyattjr7289]

I enjoy this lesson; it is very helpful. I am not so sure, but I think there is an error on page 1 of the worksheets. In Review and Complete, the third-person POV column lists the 3 types of third-person as Subjective, Limited, and Omniscient. Shouldn't it be Objective instead of Subjective?

[@EnglishUnits]

Yes, thank you! I updated that detail in the worksheet.

[@manishpandey2083]

I understood everything. And I understand why the second and third stories were from "Third Person Limited" perspective. But, I just wanted to know, is it possible that: A. The narrator did not mention thoughts of other people, because they were not having any thoughts or feelings in that moment? B. The narrator did not mention the thoughts and feelings of others because that was not important to convey the story? If any of the above possibilities are true, does the narrator becomes "Third Person Omniscient"? How can we be sure of what the case is? Thank you.

[@EnglishUnits]

Hi Manish, this is an excellent question. Yes, situations A and B that you named can happen--and it will be hard or impossible in those pages to identify the point of view--but it will not continue through the entire story. Eventually, you will reach a part where finally, the narrator says a sentence or two that prove the point of view as he or she talks about other characters. (Then you can study the narrator's words to see whether the narrator knows the thoughts or not--and of which characters, just one, or more than one.)

[@manishpandey2083]

@@EnglishUnits Thank you for the compliment. Actually, your videos are excellent, it makes people think and bring up good questions. I understood your point, a small passage might not contain a message about feelings/emotions of other characters, but a longer passage or the entire story will have it mentioned at one place or the other. I understood this situation, if there is a mention of their thoughts/feelings, it makes the perspective omniscient. But, in cases we fail to find any mention, we will consider it "Limited Perspective". And that is the issue, what if its either A or B, what will we consider the perspective then?? Also, there will always be some characters, so unimportant, that the writer does not bothers to describe him. I do not think each and every character's thoughts and feelings need to be described. Eg: "As he turned around the corner, he saw two men sweeping the road. He carried on." Here, it is not required at all to describe the thoughts and emotions of men sweeping the road. I think what I do not understand is who to consider character, and who can not be considered character. I am sorry to bother you again and again. I will watch your videos again. especially the one describing literary elements, may be I missed something there. I trust I will be able to find the missing link. Thank you again for your replies and all your videos and help. Best Regards. Have a wonderful evening.

[@EnglishUnits]

Hi Manish, thank you for posting this question. Others might have the same one. Note that 3rd limited would be that the narrator knows ONE character’s thoughts…3rd objective is when the narrator knows NO character’s thoughts. Also, a narrator’s point of view in a story stays the same from beginning to the end of that story. (There are very rare exceptions that would need to be addressed separately.) So, which characters should you count or pay attention to for determining point of view? Well for 3rd limited, the narrator only needs to know the thoughts of ONE-so this will usually be the main character, or the most important one in the story. For 3rd objective, the narrator knows no character’s thoughts or feelings-so you can study 2-3 of the most important characters, always paying most attention to the most important one-if the narrator doesn’t know their thoughts, you can be pretty sure that he or she won’t know the thoughts of other characters either. The place in text that seems to give the best clues are when characters speak. So as you look for clues, you might tend to find them in part of the story with dialogue. For situations A and B that you mentioned, these situations will not change the point of view because when we identify point of view (or other points in literature), we need points to support our answer. SO, if A and B are true, theoretically, the narrator COULD have omniscient point of view-but since he never mentioned character thoughts, we can’t prove or confirm for sure that he knows them…We can only prove that the narrator shared NO character thoughts, so we have to choose 3rd objective (if no character thoughts are shared). Did this help?

[@manishpandey2083]

@@EnglishUnits Yes, this makes everything clear. So if the narrator conveys no thoughts, that makes the perspective objective, if he/she conveys only main character's thoughts, its limited, and if he/she conveys thoughts of others including the main character, its omniscient. And, we do not need to consider what might be the case (A or B), but look only at what is present there in the text. I totally understand it now. Thank you so much for the time and effort you took to explain. Its very kind of you. You are admirable. My fascination with languages has increased recently, and I am learning new things. Yesterday I learnt about word-formation and type of languages based on word-formation. It blew my mind. Thanks again for all your efforts. Your videos are brilliant, and the exercises in between are very important, they clarify things totally. My best wishes for your upcoming videos. I am looking forward to new releases on your channel. Wish you a lovely day. Warm Regards.

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[@EnglishUnits]

Your comment is very kind and also funny. Thank you so much:)

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[@EnglishUnits]

Rania design, thank you very much! I also did difficult commutes for courses--but it finally paid off. Hang in there!

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[@bananaboi9644]

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[@rogerdatcaballero1386]

If you write and know what multiple characters are thinking, but only one at a time in different chapters. Is that limited or is it still considered omniscient? Is Choosing to narrate specific characters still omniscient? Also is it bad writing if someone decides not to be consistent between them both, or is it just a matter of what the narrator chooses to let the reader know that he knows? For example if the word “seemed” is used in a omniscient narrative. Would mean its inconsistent within the point of view? I would just like some advice from someone experienced. This confuses me at times.

[@EnglishUnits]

These are good questions! In the example you mention, it sounds like this story is told in third person omniscient POV, since the narrator knows and shares the thoughts of more than one character. However, each section is told in third limited POV, since it shares the thoughts of one character and excludes thoughts of others. As you mention, in some stories, authors change POV intentionally to add suspense, reveal character traits, and so on. (Usually, even those stories use only two POVs.) It’s ok to do this as long as the reader can follow without confusion. The problem with inconsistencies is that they cause confusion, which slows momentum and makes a reader lose interest.

[@rogerdatcaballero1386]

@@EnglishUnits Thank you for your reply. I really needed that for clarity. So long as the narration doesn’t confuse the audience, while still remaining interesting. I appreciate the response.

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[@EnglishUnits]

Thank you for your comment and for watching, Shemeka:)

[@DreamArt63]

Me at my reading test looking down at a POV question: 😶 Also me going back in my brain for this video: third person..... limited.... my brain: its so hardddddd!!! my heart: you know this man my hands: circles wrong answer my eyes: you circled the wrong answer buddy also my hands: changes it to the correct answer my teacher when looking at my test: CONGRASTS! you got a 100%!🥳

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[@EnglishUnits]

Thank you for your kind comment, Manar:) I am glad this video was helpful!

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[@titaanggara5914]

“He rushed beyond the barrier and called to her to follow. He was shouted at to go on but he still called to her. she set her white face to him, passive, like a helpless animal. Her eyes gave him no sign of love or farewell or recognition.” would you please give me your opinion about those sentences? are those limited or omniscient?

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[@prico3358]

Out of hours and hours of research on this topic, enought that I thought I got it, I could never transcribe it in my writing until this video. I wished I say this video 4 days ago. It's been a nightmare. I wanted to write 3rd person limited but didn't know how to avoid head hopping. I couldn't get it. Now I do.

[@EnglishUnits]

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[@kerengarciano5043]

can someone tell me if this is Third person L or Third Person O: Harry didn't know anything about the wizard prison, though everyone he'd ever heard speak of it did so in the same fearful tone. Hagrid, the Hogwarts gamekeeper, had spent two months there only last year. Harry wouldn't soon forget the look of terror on Hagrid's face when he had been told where he was going, and Hagrid was one of the bravest people Harry knew.

[@EnglishUnits]

Hi Prettycutepanda, this portion of text shows two characters--Harry and Hagrid. If we know ONE character's inner thoughts, the POV is third limited. If we know MORE than one character's inner thoughts, the POV is third omnisicient...So, whose thoughts do we know in this text? We only know Harry's thoughts. We do not know Hagrids inner thoughts, though his facial expression helps us guess them...Therefore, this portion of text shows only enough information to assume a third limited POV.

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[@user-mp9fv5bf5d]

For the first example (Harry Potter), the narrator said "IF they were unhappy". This doesn't imply that they were in fact unhappy. Doesn't this mean that the narrator does not know what they were thinking and as a result is subjective (at least in this scene)?

[@EnglishUnits]

Hi Navid Nemati, this is a great question. Usually, the information after "if" is unknown or hypothetical. However, sometimes information after "if" is known, as in this example: "He is a good student, if a little loud at times." In this sentence, the speaker knows that the student is loud but also smart. Here's another example similar to the example you asked about: "If Bob is tall, then Paul is a giant!" The speaker knows that Bob is tall and means that compared to Bob, Paul is even taller. This construction is a comparison using "if"...and it is also how "if" is used in the video question from Harry Potter. The narrator meant that the Dursleys were unhappy to have Harry back in their home, but Harry was even MORE unhappy. The narrator knows that both parties were unhappy.

[@user-mp9fv5bf5d]

@@EnglishUnits oh, I get it now. Thanks 👍

[@freefireups6479]

Anyone here from Mrs. Reidwoods class?

[@chickenburritosupreme8269]

Am i the only one is class and has no clue what their doing?

[@NoahLeap]

I'm right here with ya! My teacher made us watch this video.

[@moorekids2893]

no

[@jamaljorafi8424]

and said, with somewhat forced enthousiasm: " and don't forget Disney World". Is the narrator knows the character's thought here? " forced enthousiasm"?

[@halaariki6330]

👍👍

[@imanibooth9589]

It did not help me at all