CHOPIN'S Fantasy Impromptu As A Chord Chart

In this lesson Tim Smolens demonstrates what Chopin's FANTAISIE IMPROMPTU OP. 66 would look like as a jazz chord chart and discusses the harmonic movement on this composition in terms of chords and keys. In this way he shows how the different strengths of classical and jazz musicians are but a fractured whole with both skill sets crucial to musicianship.
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[@Pets0undz]

I have long fully agreed with your main point here. I wish they would just write the chords in transcribed classical music.

[@TimSmolens]

Because it is a dictatorship, the people on the lower end of the pyramid are on a need-to-know-basis and for the musician that means play your part. Heck, half the orchestra doesn't even have the same notes because of transposing instruments. How confusing. It should all be universalized! A should be A for everyone.

[@danielo174]

Fantastic idea. This is so cool. Thanks for this

[@Michael-Amelia]

Wow such a great video! Really enjoyed this. Looking forward to seeing more of your stuff.

[@divinodayacap3313]

Wish more people did this Classical pieces, analyzed with charts and chords and roman numerals

[@paulelliottmontagu]

Looking forward to this one!

[@user-ge2vc3rl1n]

One thing I LOVE about jazz lead sheets is how most arrangers will divide systems into blocks that fit the form of the music. Classical sheet sheet music does not have form and instead they either cram as many bars into the system or they do 2 bars per line (and I hate both options so much). If you're arranging sheet music and you're not considering the form of the music then please choose 4 bars per line it's so much clearer.

[@davidmiller4078]

Have you done Bach ? I had an Ivor Maraints guitar tutor booke from 1975 ish which had an accompanying cord chart and its helprd demistify classical music generally Gerry Mulligans early tune with Chet Baker from the late 50s early 60s definately were re working passages from Bach albiet with differant melody lines Then theres that great middle section from Dizzy Gillespes Night in Tunisai which ifound from Brahms ? its also borroeed in Alone Together Making Whoopie and George Shearings Lullaby of Birdland ? Its all fascinating Most Piano players know this even Billy Joel and Elton John who did have Classical lessons as children teenagers Constructive analysis cheers

[@Kavafy]

That's nice

[@musterionsurly]

great insights. If you ever do another of Chopins prelude in Em would be great as a jazz tune.

[@pixytomsongs]

I think the Jobim tune “Insansatez” is based on the changes of the E minor prelude, also Radiohead’s Exit music

[@vtnatureboy]

Please take note of the title of the piece: Fantasy Impromptu. Basically an improvisation. That’s why it is called that. Yes, it is written down, but Chopin had, quite literally, the ability to improvise, remember what he had done, and then write it down. This was not uncommon among “classical” musicians during the early 19th century. And don’t think bar by bar. Chopin didn’t. Also, there was a desire of composers during this time to break from the tyranny of the dominant/tonic universe to leverage what we call “mediant” harmony - where centers of pitch move by “3rds” rather than 4ths or “relative” keys. This piece is more mainstream than much of his music, but the principles I outlined here still apply.

[@samwisegamgee4659]

Wow! This was sooooo different from most analysis. I love the Beatles-quote you noticed that I'm sure they didn't consciously copy; still neat though.

[@kripakov]

Man, natureboy talking music school smack…you gonna take that shit? You gotta nip that shit in the bud, bud! Pronto! Seriously though, if you want to see a melodic minor sequence of modulations that will blow your mind, check out bach’s wtc book 1, d minor prelude. Very very cool, right up your alley, modulations to a key a third away, very novel, genius even. Keep doing what your doing, you’re a rare bird, special dude you are!

[@WarlikePeace]

I'm half blind and occasionally quite squirrelly. Will I ever find my acorn?

[@brucesstreet8204]

Great & very interesting. I been looking for something like this for a while. I just know some chords from pop n jazz & wondered if classical could be written the same. But some of the theory coming from classical is very strange to me - the assumption that it's in either major or minor and you know if it's in minor they call it a III chord but it is actually bIII for example - so why don't they just use bIII. I came across this in David Bennett videos, Hook Theory song analysis & Open Music Theory chapters on popular music.

[@vtnatureboy]

Classical musician here. You could not be MORE WRONG when you say that classical musicians are not thinking about chords of a piece and how they relate to a key. Literally that is all we think about. We spend years/decades analyzing everything through the lens of not only harmony, melody. We go to the trouble of harmonic analysis for large scale works such as Wagner’s Ring to miniatures such as Chopin preludes.

[@TimSmolens]

@@vtnatureboy obviously you know a lot more about this topic than I do so I'm not going to fight you too much about it. I have worked with tons of high level classical musicians and arranged string quartets and recorded them. Most scores I have seen do not show anything about what chord progression is at work. Plus if you are a composer like me and adding lots of unorthodox jazz arrangements into classical there is no way for the string players to tell what is going on as far as the harmonic structure.

[@kylezo]

That's a stretch bud. Nobody you work with in the professional world would agree with you, jazz or classical. It's just industry standard behavior.

[@calfee62]

Thanks for delving into another dizzying rabbit hole. I had to find out Chopin was around 25 years old when he composed this.

[@justice4all719]

Almost all classical composers use improvisation to compose.

[@vtnatureboy]

Just to educate you a bit, have you ever heard of “figured bass”? Have you ever seen the “clavier” or “harpsichord” part of a Baroque piece of music. It looks 99% like jazz chords, and the players improvised their parts. Mozart improvised his cadenza’s for his own piano concertos, and modern day violinists and pianists usually improvise their own cadenzas on solos. Beethoven was more well known in his day as an improviser than a composer. Yes, it is not the same as jazz, as jazz has a rhythmic element often forgotten (but much appreciated by aficionados). But please brother - you are exemplifying the “divide” between jazz and classical by just solidifying your lack of understanding of classical music.

[@TimSmolens]

@@vtnatureboy of course I have heard of figured bass most music students go through it in their first semester and forget about it and never use it again. Sure it is a decent system for telling chord progressions but it is just not used by most practicing classical musicians and it definitely isn't on most people's charts. When each individual member of the orchestra is playing their part they have no idea what the chord progression is.

[@rafaelsouza8592]

​@@TimSmolenswhy would they bother knowing the chords if most of them are playing melodies? They can't improvise, they're just sight-reading it.

[@BsktImp]

0:38 Sorry, but have to disagree with you. Quite the opposite.

[@TimSmolens]

It's a thick subject with a lot of nuance and I'm sure a great case could be made for what you are purporting. I found that with my compositions tending to have a lot of jazz harmonies and when I have hired string quartets they don't seem to know what any of the harmonies are functioning as, maybe they do as related to just the key but as far as what cord we are playing when I'm adding 13s and sharp 11s and flat nines they seem stumped. The other problem is that equal temperament is completely out of tune especially with some really important intervals like the major third and the dominant seventh that does not get adequately addressed and reconciled to the true tuning of the harmonic series. All of this and I haven't even mentioned the obscuring factor of vibrato. Of course vibrato plays a huge stylistic influence but the average degree of vibrato in most classical violinist I have played with is very large. Are we doing so much vibrato because it's stylistically the right thing or is it because it helps obscure the tuning deficiencies of the 12-tone equal temperament system. There are so many issues confounded into one here. I know that when string quartet players play together they do think about the chords and where they are in the key but I still don't think they have the holistic understanding of the harmony that jazz players do by just understanding actual chord changes with the correct extensions and all of that. Thanks for your reply I am absolutely no expert at the nuances of classical music and it is quite possible that I am ill-informed on this subject but I have written music for classical musicians played an orchestras and play jazz and the divide I see between jazz and classical musicians is staggering And I wish there was a way to rectify it

[@WarlikePeace]

Please check with the local laws before resolving with a minor.