Ep152: Let's Not Be Rash About Wearing Garments

On this impromptu episode of Mormonish Podcast, we are joined by the wonderful Lila Tueller, daughter of General Authority Hartman Rector Jr. to discuss a faithful social media thread about medical complication when wearing garments.
The opinions of faithful Latter Day Saint women are very telling in the broader conversation about garment wearing that is happening today. And especially in light of the recent General Conference talk about the importance of the garment of the holy priesthood and change to the temple recommend questions instructing members to always wear their garments day and night.
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[@suzieq5383]

The day I decided I was done with church, I threw away my garments and it felt so liberating!

[@robinnetto6794]

Today I found a top in my camisole drawer…… CREEPY 😆

[@camillekartchner]

@@robinnetto6794 what a jumpscare😂

[@marquitaarmstrong399]

I understand. But kept my garments. They make great dust cloths.

[@Cascadian_6.5]

Russel M Nelson retired from medical practice in 1985…. 40 years ago… we need to not consider him a medical expert.

[@markkrispin6944]

Rusty "Anti-Christ " Nelson

[@China-Clay]

Exactly, he is totally out of touch with medical issues, nothing personal but he shouldn’t be considered an expert anymore

[@robinnetto6794]

I knew him in the operating room in 1980 he was a stake Pres?? And he was sexually inappropriate with me and other nurses.

[@Jsppydays]

He still spent how many years as a medical professional. He has decades of experience. And then let's remove his degree and say by the spirit or prophecy he would know these things because he's a prophet.

[@China-Clay]

@@robinnetto6794 care to elaborate?

[@michellemilne3315]

My understanding is that neither Joseph nor Hyrum wore their garments the day they died because it was a hot day.

[@robinnetto6794]

And Joseph had a drink and someone was smoking.

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

They did not have e their garments on but Joseph took his lucky Jupiter talisman which supposedly has magical powers of protection.

[@kerryholyoak5720]

Apparently Moroni wasn’t wearing garments when he appeared to Joseph Smith !

[@williamwallaceg2627]

I totally sympathize with this original commenter. Just stand up and live your best life. Underwear is not a reflection of your commitment to anything other than hygiene.

[@BadAsss_patriot]

Amen 👏🏼 it’s insane we are focusing on this level of control in the church. A piece of cloth has no power. Reminds me of the 😷 push.

[@miriam-moore]

Her body is telling her what to do. She has to stop wearing them.

[@knparker8]

I love how you "covered" this issue. I always appreciated Landon's humor. Many good points made.

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@hanako4475]

"beeHIVE State!" 😂

[@China-Clay]

“The Garment”, so funny how we refer to them, also, “I took off my garments “, meaning, “I quit wearing garments”

[@Thesortvokter]

A secularized jew can't put his foreskin back on, tho...

[@williamwallaceg2627]

Just demonstrates the amount of brain F’ing that goes on in the group. PTSD! It’s a struggle to get away.

[@moviehipster]

Allways buy what ever garments you like, as many as you like, then deduct it from your tithing! God will understand & approve.

[@pollydunn3191]

Just another way for the church to fleece their members. Make underwear that they require the members to wear and make it so it will turn gray or yellow so the members have to replace them more often. More money in their coffers.

[@chinnasue58]

Thanks for solving a mystery for me! I FINALLY know why bleaching them never worked AND why "blueing" (which is supposed to turn yellowed whites white again) only made them BLUE. 🤣🤣🤣 They were only "so-called" white fabric!

[@randyjensen8038]

“So called” 😂😂😂 nice touch

[@carolineraines6465]

Rebecca, you described perfectly how I felt with the emotional reaction to garments. I felt fat and in the Utah summer heat, I felt like it was 20 degrees hotter!

[@freyast2213]

Regarding the “wear your bra over the garment”. I think this came from back in the 1800’s when bras didn’t exist, women would wear their corset over the chemise, so wearing the garment under would make sense. It them probably just became a thing that women said was more ritgheous

[@kimberlycherrine-bell5371]

I was actually instructed in the temple by a temple worker during my endowment that the WHOLE garment must always touch the skin WITH NOTHING between it and my skin..That was back in 1995..My mother in law was instructed exactly the same when she went through in 1965...So if a woman says other wise in those time periods either we had over zealous instruction of it was stabdard and lots of woman either did not pay attention or ignored the EXTEMELY EPHASIZED instruction

[@louannhoffman8708]

I would like to know whether the Church's garment business is profitable. I have also been waiting for someone to come out and reveal how garment making is done in a sweatshop environment. I've known a couple people who worked in one of the shops in Utah County, and their stories are heart-breaking. One person I knew had breast cancer surgery and treatment while working at that shop. She was suffering and yet under pressure to perform better--and that was after a couple decades of perfect attendance and a flawless work ethic. I had trouble wearing my garments after watching what she went through because her suffering became a symbol of garments to me.

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

I doubt the church will ever be transparent on its profits or manufacturers.

[@AlanZabriskie-tr2uj]

If you go onto the exmormon subreddit there is a picture of the Communist Chinese sweatshop

[@amygreen758]

I also had a doctor tell me not to wear them. I have five autoimmune diseases. The garments caused me to have constant UTI and yeast infections. It was miserable. And I find it ironic that the church wants males and females to represent vastly different roles, yet the male and female garments are so genderless in appearance. A bit of lace does not make them look feminine. I would love to know if the fabric for garments are made or dyed in a sweat shop, before they come to Utah, to get the emblems sewn on, and Beehive packaging. Does anyone know?

[@markkrispin6944]

The answer is yes. Sweat shop made from a third world country

[@jeannycastro2379]

Omg!! Landon made this episode 10 times better!! Loved it!

[@99blackbirds]

I'm still Active but I disagree with gaments so much!!! We need to righteously ReBEL! Jesus Christ did not die on the Cross for me so I could wear UNDERWEAR 24-7 and be shamed and guilted to wear them! I will NOT obey out ouf FEAR & SHAME!

[@randyjensen8038]

I also never saw one artist depiction of Jesus wearing garments on the cross. If the temple dates back to Adam, shouldn’t there be scriptural references about “and my father wore nothing but one-piecers whilst he dwelt in the wilderness”

[@Jsppydays]

Okay really? if I would have known this years ago, this would explain a lot. I am very chemically sensitive and had issues wearing garments. Why in this world would they have to go through so much to save a buck and make those of us who already have autoimmune issues more sick. This is the billion dollar Church. Just saying. There is absolutely nothing they can say to me to guilt me into wearing garments again. I have to have very chemical-free products in my living areas let alone on my body. Is this breaking the word of wisdom by putting chemicals on our body and wearing them 24/7....Shame and n them. Best video ever. Thank you. Cheep freaks. I'm pissed. I spent so much money on doctor's appointment trying to figure out why I had so many issues. Now I know

[@freyast2213]

I can’t believe (well I can) that they’re buying cheap crap fabric & then dying them. They could charge more if they wanted to & ppl would pay, but really they should just cover the cost. Or just stop making people wear them.

[@johnjohnson426]

The whole dying the Gs white is so metaphorical for the entire religion!

[@robinnetto6794]

Right on!!!!

[@loubylou1899]

My thoughts exactly.

[@miriam-moore]

My experience with garments is that when my mother was in her 80s she asked me if I wanted to go to the temple and take out my covenants and I looked at her and I said no mom I don’t think God is a micromanager and I certainly don’t want the discomfort of garments for no reason is what I was thinking

[@robinnetto6794]

She probably did not need your reason but at 80 she can not understand.

[@carolyearsley]

@@robinnetto6794 Robin, I am nearly that age, and have very clear thinking skills. You should not make assumptions based on one's age.

[@brianhopkins7726]

I’m here for Landon! Love the quips

[@TheSaintelias]

Landon’s dad jokes are awesome. Thank you Landon!!!

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

I’m glad someone likes them! My kids hate them (or so they say)!

[@yorgasor]

Garments are a sacred reminder of the covenants we make in the temple. But most people wear them and don't think about it at all, and lose some of the blessings of having that constant reminder. Just think how blessed you are if your garments cause a rash! That itchy bugger will really be a _constant_ reminder of your covenants! And remember that these garments represent Jesus too, so now all day long you won't be able to think about anything but your covenants and Jesus! What a blessing!

[@moviehipster]

If GOD hangs our eternal salvation decision on which underwear, thats a pretty wacky heaven to go to.

[@LadyPoet06]

Rebeca, I had a similar experience with a woman straightening my garment and chewing me out because it was showing. I was walking into a store, during the summer. I tripped and broke my toe. It was sticking out at an awkward angle, I’m sitting there stunned and a woman comes up behind me and puts her fingers down my back and starts yanking on my garment and yelling at me because they are showing. No help getting up, just sitting there with a broken toe and a woman shoving her fingers inside my clothing; shaming me because my garments are showing. What is wrong with people?

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

She probably assumed your garments protected you and you couldn’t be hurt! Oh the ridiculous things done in the name of the garments of the Holy Priesthood!

[@wandaAnthony2]

THE DOCTOR WHO HAS SEEN ME TRUMPS THE PROPHET DOCTOR WHO HASN'T.

[@donnellallan]

Something came to me while listening. Why not encourage members to draw the symbols on their skin in the appropriate places with non-toxic temporary skin dyes (think henna or eyeliner)? The recommend question could become “do you wear the sacred temple symbols day and night?” I would think that it would increase meaning to participate in a ritual of applying the symbols oneself rather than purchasing underwear ready-made. I very much appreciate the important work you are doing with this podcast, Landon and Rebecca! And Lila adds good insight and wisdom everywhere she goes. Thank you all!

[@miriam-moore]

I love the idea of tattoos

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

Thank you!

[@BadAsss_patriot]

Then how would they manipulate and control women’s modesty like they feel like they have to do?

[@ajadamsv9208]

When I was on my mission in the mid 1980’s I spent a year in the Amazon. We always took off our clothes and garments when we were in our houses due to excessive heat and sweating. If you didn’t you would develop jungle rot! Looks like hamburger growing in every crevice on your body.

[@2mcarp]

I like the quote, "An organization that can control what underwear you wear can control everything in your life." When I decided to quit attending church, I gave my bishop a letter explaining that he needed to replace my in the YM presidency and that I no longer believe in God and would not be attending church." I included my temple recommend. Later that day, the bishop dropped by unannounced and wanted to talk about the letter. His first question? "Are you wearing your temple garments day and night as instructed in the temple?" I'm sorry, I just told you that I don't believe in God, but you want to know about what underwear I'm wearing?

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

Wow! Because they know if they can get you to conform you won’t question! They also need to feel that nobody would leave because of something they did so it must be something you did, like change your underwear! That’s why that question is so important. Good for you!

[@erinhimes7057]

I was not privy to the "petite" secret until last year!! I feel so cheated.

[@curtisholyoak8743]

When I graduated from LDS corporation I took off garments as well as all religion.

[@markkrispin6944]

Congratulations. Did you burn 🔥 your magic underwear? I would have!

[@moviehipster]

(Mormon Bamboo-zled Garments!) Heavy on the boozled, very light on the bamboo.

[@chinnasue58]

I was thinking, very light on the booz[e], heavy on the BAM.😂

[@michellesunshinestar]

I get yeast infections some of the time (and I'm no longer in the church). I can't imagine having a yeast infection with garments. They should have special undies for that time of the month. I hated ruining my garments during that time of the month, and they cost so much. Even now, I want to try those special p***** underwear. I have to buy more underwear next month. I finally found a brand I like: Jockey Women elance briefs size 9.

[@valentinat3250]

As a never-mo, the whole idea of having to wear garments makes me cringe.

[@suzieq5383]

You can do this Landon! 😂

[@user-sb6hk2bd3f]

I use vinegar for my face it works amazingly well I’ve been using it for a long time . It’s a great natural cleaner as well . 😊😊😊

[@IGaveUpEternalLifeForCoffee]

I was hoping the church was moving away from garment wearing, but instead they’re doubling down. I’m SO glad I don’t wear them anymore. I had a skin condition for 12 years and never tied it to garment wearing until it suddenly went away when I stopped wearing them. Also, wearing the bra over the garment top was terrible. That’s how it was back in 1993 when I went through the temple. In 2011 they changed it, but it wasn’t announced and I didn’t know for several more years. They need to stop dying fabric and use white fabric to start with, preferably organic. They could also use more skin friendly fabrics like silk, wool and linen. Expensive, yes, but it’s not like they can’t afford it!

[@makesen]

The day Joseph Smith was killed he was not wearing the garments. It is brutally hot in the Midwest summer, and it was common not to wear garments as a method to relieve distress caused by wearing garments in that heat. Evidently it is fine to not wear them in instances of personal comfort.

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

He was wearing his magical talisman though!

[@janetbrockman3729]

I used to make my own garments out of fabric that I could tolerate. And that was over 15 years ago.

[@robinnetto6794]

Wow. More TBM than anyone I know!

[@carolyearsley]

@@robinnetto6794 She said that she used to make them. She could be an ExMo now.

[@SuzySylvania]

That’s fascinating! I just did my own alterations until I altered them right out of my life!

[@yorgasor]

Doubt your detergent before you doubt your garments.

[@AvadenSV]

😂

[@beckyburnett2246]

Landon is on a comedy roll. Love it!

[@Rckcasa4118]

I was a wildland firefighter first 13 seasons. Being in Idaho, wee often had a handful of lds firefighters. I was always blown away by their commitment- we had to wear the green fire protectant pants, a t shirt then the yellow nomex long sleeve shirt in on fires- add to that the summer heat and heat of the fire. I they had the added extra layers of garments! Let alone packing our red bags. It was tricky enough having 21 days worth of clothes for non-garment wearers- they had to include those in their packing. Just wild to me.

[@Rckcasa4118]

As I typed this Landon just mentioned his military experience. 😊

[@2LucidDream]

My mom had to wear depends so she wore them next to her skin. When the bishop asked if she wore her garments next to her skin she asked "is it respectful to have an accident in her garments?", the bishop okayed that.

[@kerryholyoak5720]

A mystery ! That is the beauty of it !

[@jamespeters9522]

Bamboozled is a great comparison!

[@countkolob]

One of the best things about not believing anymore is not having to answer strangers' questions about my underwear. Though I'll be honest, I've been asked by A LOT of Ex-mos if I still wear garments because (a) my wife is still in and (b) I haven't resigned. My response is always "Do you think you're my bishop?" People usually get that point. As a male, I never had the mind of issues women have, though I did experience chafing at first because garments don't provide the sort of support I was used to having. Additionally, we were converts and my dad wasn't a member and in those days women couldn't go unless they were sealed to their spouse (at least that's what my mom was told). So I'd never seen them or had any frame of reference to what they were like until I got them in the temple. It was a huge culture shock.

[@miriam-moore]

I wonder if Lila‘s father on her husband side, her father-in-law if his attitude was taught to him by the early members of the church if they took pride in this sort of rejection of non-wearers of the garment if this is what people face if they listen to their rashes in the old days as well

[@nancyjohnson8642]

Oh my goodness! That is really horrible. Have been trying to get my dinghie bluish grey garments back to white for YEARS!!!!!!!!!! I kept thinking my blue jeans were changing the color of my garments to a dinghie bluish grey! THIS is CRAZY!!!!!!

[@sallyostling]

Landon's a bachelor??!! How you doin😅?

[@MontanaMomma1]

My sympathies for anyone with these dye allergies! I had a reaction allergic reaction to a medication a few years back after only 2 days on it! I looked like a strawberry and the itch was insane! It took about 3 weeks to fully recover. Hy husband has an allergy to most laundry soap and we only use the ultra sensitive liquid stuff. All that being said, I’m wondering if any non garment wearers have had issues with regular underwear cause this is sounding like a real safety issue. Why no warnings on the labels? This sounds like a recent issue!! And further…why are there no men complaining about this?? Dye is dye right??

[@raquelbelnap7252]

Nothing worked for me. I never dod gwt the bamboo because order ing takes forever and you can only 2 pair to start with and if theu work you can get more. 8 to 10 werks. I decided not to wait that long to be rash and welt free and so i took mine off. Liverating. Wont ever go back. There is an autoimmune condition that there are dtoll rashes when it flares, but at least it isnt all the time! I also know several women who found the bamboo to be not any better.

[@MM-jf1me]

20:06 This is a problem with clothes across the board -- even 100% cotton clothes bought at any "mainstream" store can be treated with different chemicals first without any type of notice to the consumer. Most (all?) antiwrinkle 100% cotton clothing is actually coated in synthetic materials which completely encase the cotton, which is why they behave more like acrylic than actual cotton.

[@China-Clay]

A doctors “note” for not wearing garments, guess we are back to grade school again

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

Maybe the First Presidency will start issuing Hall Passes!

[@2mcarp]

I had a similar experience to Landon's, in terms of my believing spouse freaking out about me not wearing my garments.

[@nancyevans3590]

Good dad jokes, Landon. Seriously this episode shows that the church cares about 2 things. Controlling members, especially women and money. It’s not a surprise anymore, but still disheartening how many people are afraid to do anything else but strictly obey.

[@kays6082]

Does that mean that they have PFAs with all that dye and having to set it in??

[@miriam-moore]

Yes, Ladies! Let’s get Landon!!!!

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

Lol

[@bambie1830]

I’m pretty sure for military you just send in whatever base layer was issued to you and the church places the symbols in them for you

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

No you actually purchase them through the church distribution with the markings already on them.

[@lyndablades8706]

I heard a military guy I know say he liked the brown garments because they hide skid marks! 😅

[@ExmoRaymo]

Soo…one may require a protective layer underneath the garment “which will serve as a protection for you throughout your life?”

[@michellesunshinestar]

My ex-mother-in-law bought me my first underwear. I have no idea how she knew my size.

[@miriam-moore]

Why do you think it is that the general authorities never talk about us having exceptions to the rule or if we do it’s because we’re selfish and weak??

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

There is an exemption for GA’s for everything..it is a do as I say not as I do!

[@aBrewster29]

Ha ha ha ha, Landon keeping it light. 😂

[@hg4144]

Any bleach will be an irritant to the skin!! Any talk about washing detergent ???

[@jennifermay8710]

Landon is on a roll😅

[@susangroom960]

This makes me so sad and angry. In 2013 I developed terrible hives literally head to toe. Noone could figure it out. Even dermatologists and allergy specialists didn't knoq what caused it. I was on disability for 2 years because I couldn't wear clothes. But I sure wore those stinkin garments. I ended up retiring from my job in 2015 because it was so awful. In 2021 I finally woke up about the church...took off my garments, haven't had a rash or migraine headache since.

[@miriam-moore]

There are all cotton garments?

[@miriam-moore]

These general authorities are such old men. They really don’t know what to do. Do they

[@BrianWaller-qe7gr]

Most of them look like the can go at any time

[@tamicox990]

This could all be solved if they just said - just wear the garments when you go to the Temple.

[@user-sb6hk2bd3f]

And vinegar is great to put in the laundry as well

[@Jsppydays]

Just spent thousands of dollars on tile work and the first thing the tile guy said is do not put vinegar on this tile. It's too acidic. So now you're going to put on your clothes? There will definitely not last long.

[@awilk07]

I would get horrible cystic acne from garments. Once i stopped wearing them it got better

[@elizabethotte5167]

My distribution center must be different than yours, if regular underwear is cheaper than garments.

[@miriam-moore]

Landon, what do you mean that you had khaki undergarments? Were they khaki colored and everything else was the same or were they actually made out of a cotton twill, which is what I believe khakis are made out of

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

Yes they were the same garments just dyed khaki. Marks were already in them.

[@user-fo4bs1ix6i]

When I used to wear them being a woman that one time per month, my pad wouldn't stay in place for protection and rolled down the pant leg and feel out and I never wore the one piece garment but because of the potty women would have to wear a belt with the old fashioned pads. I left the church so luckily that's no longer an issue for me, to me, garments are ridiculous and has nothing to do with covenants to God, Jesus paid the ultimate price and that's our covenant when we accept him and repent.

[@rebeccasirrine947]

Why does every comment have to start with an apology?

[@williamwallaceg2627]

I wear Superman underroos, does that count?

[@BrianWaller-qe7gr]

Does it help you have super powers?

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

Yes! Both sets of underwear have the same superpowers!

[@makesen]

The church could get on the tattoo train and require members to tattoo the symbols in the prescribed locations and then the truly faithful would never take them off. Ha ha ha

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

Neither would the apostates! Lol

[@user-ux3vb5zg1p]

My temple garments are pure white soft cotton just like a little singlet and briefs that are a bit longer they are thin and light a comfortable set of underwear

[@sheliabryant3997]

Someone wondered whether Jesus wore these (or any type of) garments. Well, consider, 1) As "His sweat was AS [like] great drops of blood" when He was praying in Gethsemane, no mention was made of His "garments" nor of His robe being "BLOODY"; and (2) HIS garments did not protect Him from being taken by temple GUARDS to be abused by High Priests; nor from being scourged near to death; NOR FROM BEING C R U C I F I E D. Just saying.

[@miriam-moore]

She is setting herself up since she can’t decide for herself.

[@incognito137]

🤦🏼‍♀️

[@bambie1830]

All cotton is dyed white I thought

[@miriam-moore]

I thought There is actual natural white ?

[@janetbrockman3729]

Ah ha ha ha ha

[@miriam-moore]

This is an attempt at humor. Please read with that intent

[@randyjensen8038]

Hey now, Rebecca, let’s not completely discount men’s experience with garment wearing. While I realize it’s much worse for women, to say “it’s basically like wearing boxer briefs and a t shirt” is not accurate. They’re is no fabric as comfortable or breathable as your basic Costco undershirt, and none of the styles give a man any “support” where it’s needed. Even the ones designed to be athletic, they still can’t figure out what Nike and Under Armour have been doing for decades. But yes, women have it worse.

[@nancyjohnson8642]

I wouldn't get into trying to prove this with a doctor's note. Their doctors are not the business of the Bishop. Don't go there.

[@chriswigman4218]

Did Jesus Christ wear these garments? I know the Bible talks about his robe.

[@Thesortvokter]

Deuteronomy 22:5 “A woman shall not wear a man's garment, nor shall a man put on a woman's cloak, for whoever does these things is an abomination to the Lord your God. 1 Peter 5:5 Likewise, you who are younger, be subject to the elders. Clothe yourselves, all of you, with humility toward one another, for “God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble.”

[@ritaconley9544]

This is so disgusting. This church is nothing but a giant grift. No wonder people are not wearing these garments.

[@user-ux3vb5zg1p]

This podcast is full of nasty comments

[@SidVranes]

I’ve been wearing garments faithfully for 30 years and they have been a protection for me. Are you folks interested in faithful stories or just the partial truths spewed on this podcast. Landon is a joke. Too bad his only purpose in life is trying to catch some tail on exmo.

[@marquitaarmstrong399]

I just think God is more interested in your heart than your underwear. So sue me.

[@Thesortvokter]

What kind of God would put protection into underwear? 😐

[@mormonishpodcast1036]

The same god who put strength in Samson’s hair I guess!

[@Thesortvokter]

@@mormonishpodcast1036 lol