Every Platform Photographers Should Use & Why!

[@user-oc6mr1jr6s]

I feel like photographers who have a big following on instagram usually only support eachother. Feels like they are afraid that others Will grow as well. Kind of arrogant

[@alistairmartins6970]

Dude even if you sit all day you won't be able to check out everyone's stuff it's just a spam fest thats why I love fb groups I'm into bird photography so it's much more sane to just upload a pic to a fb and have people who want to see it see it..i hate hash tags and all that rubbish

[@abrilstorms]

Yesss! I agree with that, or gatekeeping.. 😒 lol

[@user-oc6mr1jr6s]

@@abrilstorms tbh there is not much to gatekeep. Most of them are just Lucky or started in time.

[@louielondonmedia4819]

Adobe Portfolio is also a part of the subscription. Once you bought a domain name, you use as website about you and your photography

[@michaelschmitt5413]

Great video !!! You didn't mention Adobe Portfolio. I was thinking about ditching my Pixieset website and going to Portfolio. I'm just a hobbyist and only do the occasional paid shoot. What drove me to your video, was I was also considering going Pro on Flickr. I'm still considering it.

[@scottgarriott3884]

still love my Flickr!! Made by photographers for photographers.

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

It can be a super useful platform.

[@matthconphoto]

Thanks a lot for your video! I'm currently trying Vero as well - I just followed you there. It's quite a learning experience how to figure out how it works. Kind regards, Matthias

[@starrmontee4722]

this is completely unrelated, but, wow, that is so nice of you to pop in another creator's squarespace link!! I always try to use a creator's affiliate link if I'm signing up for something. But, amazing video - I am so curious about 500px! My problem with uploading high-quality photos is they get easily stolen, so I like doing concept-based collages wherever I'm sharing pictures (usually on instagram) so that the original isn't in full resolution available for someone to use. But I'm not marketing my photography, so I'm not sure if this works well as a strategy for outreach.

[@andrewblackman4372]

I really enjoyed this video, Jonny. Like a lot of people, I've become deeply disillusioned with Instagram, so it's good to know that there are plenty of alternatives out there. I have a question for you: I've just created my own website, but I'm concerned that someone may copy my photos and claim the credit for themselves. Is this something I should be worried about? If so, what should I do about it? (A friend of mine suggested using only low-res photos). I'd love to hear your views on this.

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Hi Andrew, glad you enjoyed the video. I guess you could use low res or water mark. For me personally, I'm not concerned about people stealing my work as the image represents a moment and that moment is simply mine and cannot be copied. Because of this, I'm not precious at all but that's just me.

[@yalborap]

If I may chime in, my experience online has been the sort of person who will steal your work is the sort of person who won’t care about resolution. They might not even try to right click and save, but instead just do a screenshot. Like all digital piracy, the Venn diagram of people who would pay for your work if given the opportunity, and the people who’ll steal it if given the opportunity, are basically two circles that barely touch at best. There’s no point in worrying about them. (And if you’re concerned about larger scale thefts by entities with actual resources, you’re better off just getting your copyrights registered so you can do an easier and faster suit for damages.)

[@hameley12]

Andrew Blackman I don't know if this information will be useful but way back when Facebook was starting I posted some of my works on the site. Months later it showed up in someone else's book. After going through books and websites. I found the U.S. Copyright Office. I was able to secure my literary written works. Yes, there is a fee and it can be too much when you have so many portfolios. It's worked for me, it might work for you. For example, if you wish to retain control over your work and only wish for those pictures to be used as a digital framed print for home, business decor, or other. Or if you wish to stamp your name on the picture and once you do sell it, it is removed but your signature stays there [top of the frame, on the side, or at the bottom]. Even if the buyer tried to remove the bottom part, your stamp will be there at the front or at the back seen under blacklight.

[@super_reisen3121]

Vero seems an interesting option to check out! Thanks for great video 👌

[@CalebThomasMedia]

I was able to take my photography full time 100% because of TikTok. I can’t recommend it enough. It’s incredibly easy to grow on, it’s algorithm is creepily good at connecting you to the exact, right audience, and it’s just downright fun.

[@seralegre]

tiktok is video platform...

[@CalebThomasMedia]

@Sergio Alegre Vicente correct. And I have used it to connect clients to my services, make relationships with future clients, and again, quit my old day job.

[@mikeg4421]

Thanks for your time puttin this together. What is your work flow for keeping these all update with your most recent work?

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Hey dude, It might not be clear but this was intended to show the options I don't post to all of them. Best to pick one or two that work for you.

[@bertoldgerrychannel]

More photographers should view this!

[@lappin_theworld]

Just stumbled on this video and then I saw my image at the end in Lightroom discover! That's so cool!

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Ha that’s cool!

[@KieranTozer]

Heard square space and sat back in shock.. Little did I know that the word tiktok would be mentioned shortly after. Brave man

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Really? I couldn't name a better web platform for photographers than Squarespace. Great voice by the way mate, fellow musician here.

[@KieranTozer]

@@ItsJonnyKeeley only kidding man, just hear about it so often in every KZbin vid haha. Thanks a lot mate, haven't posted anything decent in years, need to get back on it. Been focusing more on the photography lately

[@IDontBelong]

Thank you for the video. I left a comment a few videos ago about how I prefer Facebook. I have over 4000 ppl on Facebook whereas barely 300 on Instagram. I’ve noticed my Instagram likes have slowly started going up (from avg 20 to 50-60 per photo), and usually a few times a week someone will like 10-20 photos at once, but never hit the follow button. I also don’t like how Instagram notifications all look the same. I have difficulty separating the likes from comments. As far as Facebook goes… I don’t know why ppl say things such as it’s nothing but ppl arguing or whatever. The algorithms are the same as Instagram, so if we’re getting a lot of arguing on our feed then We must be doing something to attract those types of posts. As I mentioned, over 4000 friends and rarely do I see any posts with ppl arguing. Facebook shows me mostly other photos from the groups I follow because that’s what I interact with the most. I see more arguing and rude comments in the comments section here in KZbin (not your videos). I tried Twitter as well, but I just can’t keep up with multiple social media apps. I get upwards to 2500 likes sometimes on Facebook in each group. Sometimes I don’t even share in the groups because I can’t keep up with all the notifications. That being said, I don’t know how ppl do that while switching between multiple platforms. Especially those like you who have tens of thousands, and some even millions, of followers. I guess there’s comes a point where We just have to stop interacting with ppl.

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Thanks for you insight Mike, I think that’s a pretty fair assessment of those platforms and I think you’re right not to spread yourself too thin across different socials!

[@martonltd]

Golly gosh!! I uploaded 2 photos to 500px last night, both became popular in hours, after both being liked (even commented on) by many many.... bots - not people!! Was totally convinced for way too many hours though, that it was for real...... What a sad world.......

[@JohnAndonianPhotography]

Really great video and informative. Thank you. I look forward to your other material here.

[@piusgyagenda]

Vero is a great platform that is seeming to fix all the problems of Instagram to photographers in my opinion

[@olsisimoni]

Vero is the best!

[@MatijaSimunic]

As for a vero, I am a long user of this app. Excellent design, way much better quality of photos uploaded on it than rubbish Instagram or facebook, no algorithms and no adds. Only thing bad is manny bugs that are present from the very start. Often you cannot see your notifications although you have them, you hit like on someone's post and that like disappears immediately....But I am a calm person and didn't go away because of that bugs. Just hooping that these issues will be solved sone...

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Hi mate, I may give Vero some time soon, It looks interesting.

[@amv000yt7]

I joined Vero a few days ago, easy to use.

[@philjacko1984]

Enjoying going thru and watching your work. Nice job man.

[@iSpike]

@ispike - just joined VERO, looking forward to posting my ART soon. Cheers from Western Australia

[@olsisimoni]

Vero is an amazing platform.

[@Mindartcreativity]

What about Glass? It‘s like IG but without algorithm and video/stories/reels. You pay monthly or yearly though, but there are no ads and the experience is pretty cool.

[@scotty4418]

Good summary and overview Jonny. Another photography app platform that I tried out was Glass however it was limited in a number of ways, one being it wasn't available for android only IOS and was also a subscription service. I also found the interface to be a bit bland and finding the work of others that could be of an interest could be a bit of a chore as well. I cancelled my account after about 2 months as a result of the downsides

[@nomart5413]

very helpful especially for amateur photographers like me. anyways, just wanna ask what do you think of Smugmug? thnx.

[@dennismacwilliams196]

Ooh... You did not put a link for all of the websites you talked abought. But you brought up so many websites I've never know. So thanks... I'm a older guy who has thousands of photos and would love to Share and maybe sell some. This is just another hobby that I Really like and enjoy. But in my case I know no one that likes Photography like me. So starting this all is a well, very over Wellmeng. Anyway thanks for a very well done helpful video... Dennis

[@Kevine7001]

Most of my clients are from Facebook & now my website. IG is ok but too much fluff so it’s hard to get Anyone’s attention

[@Rothmans406]

Informative and super helpful as always! Thank you!!

[@mohammedmuzammil5554]

Absolutely loved the detailed insights on so many platforms And the lofi background music as well ❤❤

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Glad you enjoyed mate!

[@abritandhisbikeinpoland6802]

you popped up on my youtube feed, and yes you were very useful, subscribed!

[@ShootingStars808]

Another great video. A list of sites to go see how they might apply to me is much appreciated. Maybe a video on how you came to choose Square Space... 🤔

[@dawnhollamby5206]

Hi, I'm being asked to use Miro & it doesn't really seem to be for photographers

[@nealdoesart]

10:30 Thats me! lol Great video. Looking forward to seeing more.

[@dianealles902]

*Chapters:* 03:59 500px 07:59 Flickr

[@danielwestfall9578]

Great insight and perspective here. I enjoyed your thoughts. Thank you.

[@golden5522]

I'mma try both 500px and Vero they seem very interesting cause I'm trying to get into Photography and Art cause I'm having a very hard time doing them so thanks for your recommendations, and wish me luck

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Vero is doing great right now, they're building tools for photographers and it's great.

[@MajestikVisuals]

Appreciate the video!

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

No problem!

[@kenogrady7774]

Awesome video, very informative..thank you for all the great references.

[@Oceansknight]

Now that was a great video thanks. I am getting back in to photography and still thinking about posting socially, if at all.

[@diekritischestimme]

Oh, you don't know for how many years this topic is bugging me as a semi-professional photographer... It's peak insanity. I am basically into photography for more than 16 years now and I USED to be popular on a certain website (which you btw did not name in this video) and I made the huge mistake to only publish my works there. Now I have my own opinions, as a genuine artist such things happen, about a lot of things and I got banned on that website during the covid nonsense, because I was sharing some doctors opinion's which were not mainstream. I got deleted without any warning, nor any reasons given by the staff members, despite the fact that this website has a forum included in which you are allowed to also discuss political topics and everything else. But well, no my situation is the following: I have no real place where my works are displayed anymore and I figured out the same as you, when you say in the video it makes no sense to have social media without a store or website where people can buy prints or similar. So basically, I need to start my own website (portfolio) AND social media at the same time, and I am not much into advertising my own works, because I despise this online mentality of people browsing through hundreds of artworks within seconds/minutes, like people do on insta or tiktok. I also want to use websites which are freely accessable to everybody, without them having to register on that website. So, Insta and Tiktok are partly out because of that already. I am the creating type of artist. I want to simply shoot and share images without spending much time online to build a community or "selling my soul" trying to get famous on above mentioned platforms. Furthermore, I have a pool of let's say at least 1500 works which are fit for publishing, but how am I going to do that on social media? Posting one shot per day? Would take me 5 years to post what I had online already some years ago and then websites like Flickr have upload limits on free accounts (1000 shots per account), so I cannot even upload my works without paying (despite knowing that flickr is totally dead as a community and the investment might not pay off at all) Then, my focus as a photographer is on composition. Many of these websites are either forcing me to crop my shots (insta being the worst) or they do not show the full image in the preview - basically destroying the shots in the preview, because I am not into that "dead center composition" thing, which is typically for beginners as we all know. I tried out 500px some years ago and I hate their image rating system. If you already have many followers there and you upload some new content, you are much more likely to end up with a great rating then someone who is new to the website. I don't want a bad label on my shots (70% ratings or smth like that), just because I am new and not many people see my artworks. I don't want the website to rate my works, I am not there to be rated and art is subjective anyway. Now this is also an important aspect: How do these websites/communities treat new members? I noticed that on many websites it was easy many years ago to interact with other photographers and get authentic activities, but these days everyone seems only to be interested in promoting his own art. On all websites people just follow you so you see their name pop up in your notifications, like on insta, people follow and unfollow you at the same day, just to promote themselves like that. I find this immoral and disgusting. I don't want to prostitute myself and my art just because I am desperate for views/fame/money or whatever people hope for, when they join insta. Ironically, I used to be someone who was very active, writing real comments, constructive feedback etc. for other artists, but now since society is moving in such a rapid paste, I don't feel like spending much time on writing comments anymore, when I know that people will not spend more than let's say 5 seconds to read a message - the recipe for success on twitter, I guess... Speaking of twitter, it is the most toxic place I have ever seen on the Internet. So much hate and disagreement between people.. In a nutshell: I want a clean website, maybe with an integrated print/shop system, unlimited uploads(or at least one free upload per day), free access for all users without making any account and somehow I need people to actually go there (maybe such a website exists, but it's no use if everyone is only using tiktok, insta and facebook and nothing else), but as digital life is these days - this website does not exist. In the end all this online mess has eliminated my passion for art, because when you have nowhere to put it, so people see it, creating it is already weird in the first place. I end up with hundreds of new shots on my memory cards, and on my computer hard drive, but I rarely publish them anywhere, mostly using flickr to show some shots to friends and relatives. If anyone is interested in my works you can go to flickr dot com slash people slash laeton and find some of my works there. I am not into self-promotion so I won't put a link here.

[@Fuksiia]

I still use and love VSCO, but it seems is not as popular as it used to be

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

I haven’t used it, I think it probably should have been on the list. It slipped through the net.

[@jumbojayHTX]

I commented on your only post on Vero. I have high hopes for that app. I shoot glamour and nudes so there aren’t many apps that are welcoming to photographers who shoot what I do. The downside is that there aren’t a whole lot of eyeballs on there yet, and the ones that are looking at my work seem to be mostly fringe characters. I just joined Ello yesterday. That one looks promising as well and I didn’t see it mentioned in this video. Maybe one day you can put out a video on where glamour photographers can post their work to be able to pick up new clients 💡

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

I feel like twitter could be the place, they are pretty tolerant of this type of content and there are a lot of users. I joined Ello when it launched years and years ago but have no idea what the platform is like now.

[@aaronmkeith1622]

[YouPic] might be for you.

[@jaredcollins-photo]

I know this is an older video on your channel now, but I would like to see a video on Pinterest & Photography alone!

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

I always wanted to make that video, maybe I still will.

[@Paul197A]

I’ve been on 500px for about 8 years. I’ve upload about 1500 images over that time. After 8 years I’m still talking to myself. Just about nobody sees my photos.

[@southpaww]

I thought 500PX had some negative press a couple years ago, seemed like the consensus was to abandon it. Maybe inappropriate use of artists work? Unlicensed use, maybe it was. Is it safe, again?

[@giovanatuleski854]

What is better: flickr or 500px?

[@bitsmagtv]

Is FLICKR dead? I still use it and I love it

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

No it’s not it’s still great, that’s just my perspective for someone who isn’t using it yet.

[@ravirajamadan]

I use flickr exclusively and very happy. Its mostly for people who want to slow down and relish the images.

[@gppv]

I find your channel very useful and informative. Thank you for providing such good content

[@diekritischestimme]

PS: What do you think about reddit? And what do you think about copyright issues? I noticed for instance that it is possible on insta to re-post other people's content and make plenty of money with this re-post, even if the original creator gets almost no attention, but the website is not rewarding original art creators, right? I mean they should give at least some of the profit which is going to the re-poster to the original artist, otherwise I find this very unfair and parasitic. Even if the artist might profit from the extra attention he gets from that big re-poster channel, I find it insulting that they can make money like that, while the artist gets nothing.

[@kahiraw]

Huge value in this video. Thank you

[@jamieloftus33]

Found this really useful! Love your videos, really informative. Quick question though? Do you actually use tube buddy yourself?

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

I do, every video.

[@photosfromphilly]

Do you have any suggestions for protecting photos from theft? I've stopped uploading pics for the most part because my images were getting stolen. Hundreds of them. I don't google my name because I find more stolen photos. Thanks

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

It sounds like your photos are pretty sought after if hundreds are being stolen maybe it's worth uploading them to stock photography websites and capitalising from the need. As for stopping people downloading them maybe only upload low resolution versions.

[@LydiaOfAragon64]

Thanks for this video . I feel overwhelmed most the time what all platforms are and do I use to avoid the due to my Asperger’s. But I need to learn as I’m New to it all.

[@gotophotoarchive9131]

As always Jonny top notch video ... thanks for sharing.

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Glad you enjoyed it

[@jexcalder5466]

And again Jonny, love the video, doing fine work work for the community

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Thank you, glad it’s useful mate.

[@meibing4912]

Lacks any info on who are following the various platforms? How can you choose your optimal platform if you do not know who is using which platform? They are very different in age, gender, geography etc. etc.

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

This video is 20minutes long. There are loads of details missing, whole platforms missing. I tried to define a platform as for photographers or for the general public.

[@sambeaumontmedia4107]

Very helpful video! Thanks man!

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

My pleasure!

[@smalltalk.productions9977]

Helpful. Thanks for the effort and sharing. Thumbs up 👍🏻

[@WillNewcomb]

I prefer the way Glass shows off photos, without the blurb.

[@judeemclaughlin7394]

Definately one of the most helpful people I've found on you tube. I actually have a facebook page for my photography that I am trying to get back into using. And I actually subscribe Henry Turner. Several folks have told me to start a you tube channel.

[@okayokay6911]

I feel like Reddit is a good place too if you do it right, can certainly reach a lot of people on there

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Yeah that’s a good shout, Reddit is in my video about places to build social media following.

[@stevenpettit]

Brilliant video, this really helps and I’ll have a look at 500px, just what I need! Question, is the Facebook page/account spawned off your personal page or completely separate ? Not sure if the best approach, thanks, keep up the great work

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Yeah, I feel like it's the best of the bunch.

[@Oceansknight]

with Facebook you can use a personal account with no issues, join photo groups etc. If you want to do it commercially, or just have a page just about your photography, there’s a button called create a page. Hit that and follow the instructions. Then use that page for your photos. It stops you seeing what people had for lunch!

[@IanMcCausland]

a deep dive into Pinterest please!

[@MAFGERS]

Interesting video, as you said KZbin brought me here because it thought it would be useful for me….. subscribed 😀

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

I appreciate the sub and thanks for watching! Glad it was useful.

[@ksenias9512]

I am ABSOLUTELY going to introduce myself the "creepy way" on Pinterest forever.

[@diegofernandezfotografo]

What amazing content!

[@bradleyrieger1517]

On Instagram, my photos don't post to the hash tag pages I enter. Don't know why but is pretty frustrating considering the enormous amount of schlock on line these days.

[@travelwithlenses]

What do you think about fstoppers ?

[@dr.ariachuppani7063]

that was great thank you

[@rob9386]

yess love this!

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Thanks for watching!

[@quansmith7565]

Great and informative video!!

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Thank you!

[@wwebbs-photographer]

Quick and useful! Thanks!

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Im glad it is!

[@Ahmed-ec3uf]

Great Video.. Thanks

[@dennismacwilliams196]

Yes Please Pinterest needs a good video...

[@raywalteroutdoors]

I finally got twitter and like it but it’s mostly people stealing other peoples work and reposting

[@JuhaniViitanen]

Good useful video.

[@Hitman-li1hg]

I genuinely like vero, but I think that it is unnecessarily complicated.

[@smooth111012]

Vero is great for artist & Photographer etc I am on there - Forest Arts

[@GregTPhoto]

Great video, very helpful

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Glad it was helpful!

[@ulisebalbuena]

Great video men! What about vsco? Cheers from Argentina

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Thanks mate, I didn’t try that one. Probably should have added it.

[@djcruse]

Thanks!

[@LouisLuzuka]

This is so helpful

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

I’m glad mate!

[@anthonyyoussef01]

What about Vsco

[@martinsFILMS13]

so which one is the best ?

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

It depends what you want to achieve.

[@martinsFILMS13]

@@ItsJonnyKeeley I want to reach a non photography crowd with photography

[@tjsinva]

Good info. 👍 🥂

[@wi_gee007]

thanks

[@elevatedarchives]

View bug is also good. Majority of these all seem to be more about the "upgrade to pro" to make the hosts money. They are the real winners in all this actually. Oh and youpic, they will bug the living daylights out of you until you block them or upgrade. Food for thought here.

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

I’m going to pin a comment with everything mentioned in the comments. I appreciate your contribution here mate.

[@focaltime9772]

Why did you choose squarespace buddy?

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

I think it’s the simplest to use.

[@demgesch]

foundation seems like a multi level marketing platform...

[@mahdiali6732]

Don't you think that Flickr download makes people steal other photographers work?

[@CornishMotorcycleDiaries]

I'm struggling with Vero and like you don't seem to have any followers, despite following others. On another point, Now I have switched to the new Facebook page, I'm getting endless 'suggested for you' posts from them of either individual Photographers, OR pages like 'Scenic Scotland' showing images that have many hundreds of likes, yet somehow I think there is something afoot. Is this Spam, paid promotion (i.e an advert) or just an algorithm gone rogue? Also some of these images are truly awful. So, is there benefit to 'following' these people, or is it just another attempt to make me consume other people's work, when I want other people to consume MY work. Puzzling and you probably won't even look at this. Ps there is the new kid on the block 'Grainery' a bit like Vero, but analogue only.

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

Try my latest video about Vero, I think it will help.

[@CornishMotorcycleDiaries]

@@ItsJonnyKeeley Thanks had just opened it when this came through👍

[@JayJay-hg5vp]

It's interesting that deviant art didn't make it to this list. Anyone on it as photographers go or is it more an art website these days ?

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

I have to admit I’ve not even though about deviant art for around 15 years.

[@JayJay-hg5vp]

@@ItsJonnyKeeley they got bought over by Wix at one point and many photographers I know emigrated to Instagram at that point. Then there was also boycott of it at the time of free Palestine movement because people were boycotting Israeli goods and services and honestly I have not heard what happened to the platform since apart from people complaining their work got stolen from deviant art and sold as illegal NFTs so maybe all these things combined drove a fraction of creators off the platform.

[@user-rg7ux5hn5t]

thank you for explaining what twitter is in 2022 - when twitter is dead like facebook for about 5 years as for now :D :D :D

[@JkundArt]

Every creator that I follow seems to have the lowest engagement + much lower number of followers/ subs on Facebook/ insta than KZbin or Twitter. Which to me seems like it worth my time.

[@anuradhayadav854]

me also on vero

[@KeithMacRowland]

Why doesn’t anyone mention Tumblr anymore? Free custom domain hosting owned by Automatic the makers of Wordpress. Also easy to post and automatically share on Twitter.

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

It’s a good shout

[@wiandryadiwasistio2062]

you don't mention unsplash, pexels, and freepik

[@williamaungleyraud]

Probably because those you give the rights of your photography away. So although you can be found, potential clients could simply rip your work and give you nothing back. So it's a doubled edged sword.

[@snapshuttre]

is there too much bots in 500px?

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

No sure, lots of early engagement, so possibly.

[@smooth111012]

Forgot foundation, Voice is better. No gas or upfront fees

[@TheWightMan91]

Any experience with picfair?

[@ItsJonnyKeeley]

I haven’t, I stayed away from stock site on this as I felt it was a different subject.

[@RedTick2]

Pinterest video plz!