F-4 vs MiG-21| with Jerry Beaulier

Jerry Beaulier talks us through his MiG-21 shoot down on Saturday, 28 March 1970 during the Vietnam War with VF-142. He goes from takeoff to landing and how the engagement unfolded out in the air.
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[@treehugger-cu3nm]

I met Jerry this week is Scotland by chance and we got talking. My father also flew f4 Phantoms in the 1970s. He told me this story first hand. Jerry remains a very humble and inspiring gentleman to this day.

[@Aircrewinterview]

Nice one.

[@havedrill1]

Great play by play from a legendary dogfighter. Which we had the cockpit audio. Thanks. 👍🏿

[@dankuettel5063]

I like how he still gets excited over that victory. Nice Submariner BTW

[@user-mx1nf5rf5y]

Yes. Especially that he does not show remorse for killing a man. Man defending his homeland from bombers. But i am shore he will show remorse when he is dying.

[@shastadude13]

@@user-mx1nf5rf5y Yes. Defending his homeland by attacking his democratic capitalist non-aggressive neighbor to the south. Very noble.

[@user-mx1nf5rf5y]

@@shastadude13 Is that what they thought you in school? Or did you come up with that conclusion by watching TV and Hollywood films?

[@777Outrigger]

@@user-mx1nf5rf5y - - Valentino attributes 80,000-200,000 deaths to "communist mass killings" in North and South Vietnam.... "Final Solutions: Mass Killing and Genocide in the 20th Century" by Benjamin A Valentino In battles at Ia Drang (23 October to 20 November 1965), NVA troops slaughtered U.S. wounded. Most bodies recovered were shot in the head or back. At other locations, wounded American soldiers were tied to trees, tortured, and then murdered - On 6 December 1967, Viet Cong massacred 252 civilians in a vengeance attack on Dak Son, an anti-communist Montagnard village - During the 1968 Tet offensive, the North Vietnamese massacred 5,800 civilians at Hue - In total, from 1957 to 1973, the Viet Cong assassinated 36,725 South Vietnamese and abducted another 58,499. The VC death squads focused on leaders at the village level and on anyone who improved the lives of the peasants such as medical personnel, social workers, civil engineers, and schoolteachers. For the Communist forces, atrocities were a matter of policy and were not hidden or punished.

[@johnb4689]

@@777Outrigger Erm, I think you viewed too much propaganda. As most people now are clear who the bad guys where in that war. I would advice you to go watch this interview of an Vietnam veteran to get a better idea how it really was for the guys on the ground: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qprbgKyfh511Y5o For pilots they would believe they where doing "the right thing", and if you factor in that the NVA pilots had kill ratios of 5 to 1 and all the way to 11 to 1 in the later stages of the war (11 USA planes down for every 1 NVA!!) then you can understand under how much stress these guys where! Interviews like these are so important to keep alive as it gives us a view into the reality at the time, for these people. It makes it better to understand how and why they did the things they did. And as always in war, it's always the civilians that suffer the most :(

[@lilibethdoherty295]

My dad was in vf 143 on the independence flying the f4 in 1966 he said he could not believe he could have so much fun!

[@petebowling1668]

Fighting in the sky is hard enough then you have to land on the boat great aviators.

[@saborise7485]

I always love to hear stories like this one!

[@sovietred7371]

Why don't we get interviews with some Mig pilots, im sure they have some cool stories to share

[@xxcxpl]

Because there's no business like show business ... and sadly unbiased both sides of the story history goes by the wayside

[@duyhung2528]

Then you will get stories about them shot down tons of F4s

[@anonymouse6129]

F4 phantom pilots had a cool story too not just mig pilots

[@anonymouse6129]

@vinh lê I dont trust wikipedia

[@anonymouse6129]

@vinh lê Wikipedia is 50% lies if its your main source then it is secretly shrinking your IQ

[@hshs5756]

I listened to this just a few minutes after finishing reading _Phantom Over Vietnam_ for the second time. First time was shortly after it was published in 1988, back when I still admittedly had a lot of innocence about what drives war. John Trotti had lost all of his innocence before he went home from his second tour. Must-read for fighter pilot fans.

[@Ace-Av8er]

The book should have been correctly entitled "illegal Phantoms over Vietnam in an unjust war"

[@SkyroofNova72]

Og Maverick. Still passionate about that moment. Love it

[@robw3027]

Enjoyed that video.

[@R1door]

Fantastic story! Feels just like being there the way he told it! 😃

[@Palabrota]

When you ask questions off-mic it would be good to add them as a caption. Sometimes it's not clear what you've asked and his response is hard to put into context because of it.

[@Aircrewinterview]

I now have a mic for myself so you will be able to hear me clearly.

[@Ace-Av8er]

Phantoms and F-105s favorite disengagement tactics was a nose down barrel roll in full afterburner when jumped by slower antique Mig-17 provided they had sufficient altitude at start of engagement.

[@ronschuster4377]

At MDC in St Louis, in Ops Analysis, I got to read every debrief report of the air to air engagements in Nam. I was surprised that the vast majority of the time nobody scored, and the Migs just an away. But the details of the engagements were valuable for later flights.

[@TakisDiakoumis]

Awesome! I just looked up and re-read the account in MiG Killers of Yankee Station by Michael O'Connor. It's got some good pics of them too. 😀😀 great story 😀😀

[@Aircrewinterview]

I will have to read that one Takis!

[@hectiky]

Great video. That mention of the A-5 Vigilante at the beginning reminded me of how much I want to see a video about it. One of those aircraft that there isn't much attention given to. I hope to see some content about it here one day.

[@rll661]

Another excellent interview! BTW, March 28th is my birthday, but not in 1970. 👍🏻

[@rujiahao4284]

incredible

[@777Outrigger]

"According to Red Baron data, the single most significant factor in the loss of aircraft [in the Vietnam War] was the element of surprise, with 81 per-cent of all U.S. losses occurring when the crew was either completely unaware they were under attack, or found out too late to effectively defend." ..... www.afhistory.org/wp-content/uploads/2005_fall.pdf .. page 11

[@davidruddick3346]

True professional

[@Ace-Av8er]

Indeed a "true professional" highly trained, officer and a gentleman. Fighter pilots are a breed apart

[@sewing1243]

RVAH-7 would have been the Vigilante Squadron on the Connie for that cruise.

[@Losingsince]

Why didn't they feature this in a Dogfights episode???

[@SDsc0rch]

wow - great story bravo zulu sir

[@thefrecklepuny]

Very interesting. Although the F-4 lacking an internal gun/cannon is often seen as its biggest weakness, many suggest Top Gun training more than made up for this.

[@Hairysteed]

After Top Gun the Navy Phantoms kill ratios were several times better than that of USAF Phantoms even though the USAF Phantoms had guns!

[@Phos9]

Also most kills were still made by missiles on the AF side.

[@madaxe606]

Most of the MiG-21 variants the VPAF fielded also lacked an integral cannon, and tended to sortie without a gun pod even when one was available. The Soviets had the same ideas about missiles making dogfights obsolete that the US did. And the R3S AAM that the VPAF used during the war was markedly inferior to the mid and late -model AIM-9's and AIM-7's that the US fielded Topgun gets a lot of credit, but big improvements to AWACS, much better seeker heads on IR missiles, vastly improved IFF interrogation of bogeys, and loosening of BVR rules likely had at least as much to do with it. Fighter pilots being fighter pilots, you likely won't get many of them acknowledging that the massive increase in technological superiority that the USAF/USN enjoyed between 1967 and 1971 was at least as important as the improvements to BFM training received by pilots.

[@madaxe606]

@@Hairysteed There's a number of good articles about that very point - the USAF had a MUCH harder job to do than the Navy, given the need to take off from bases in Thailand. They had to fly into enemy territory with little or no radar coverage until quite late in the war, and started many if not most engagements from a defensive posture - necessitated by the need to stick very close to their strike aircraft so as not to lose contact with them. Whereas the Navy had powerful ship-borne search & track radars parked just offshore, could pick and choose their entry routes into North Vietnam much more freely, and entered engagements from an offensive posture much, much more frequently than their Air Force counterparts. The VPAF had much, much less time to scramble and position their MiG's to intercept incoming Navy aircraft, so they couldn't use the same ambush tactics that they frequently could against the Air Force. Topgun gets a lot of the credit, but the Navy had a completely different set of challenges than the Air Force did.

[@nickmitsialis]

@@madaxe606 right! "Red Crown" naval radar coverage was much more effective than AWACs. That being said, the success of the Mig21 against the later Rolling Thunder/Linebacker USAF was due to how it was used: position by ground control where it could not be seen, then a quick run in, a shot of Atoll missiles then, dive away--pure intercept stuff. the MiG 21 was hard to see due to small size, fast, clean burning engine etc, but the cockpit was very cluttered, and (for the versions flying at the time) they had poor out of cockpit visibility, so they were not made to dogfight. Maybe the MiG 19, with a bubble canopy, heavy cannons, agility, supersonic capacity=if it also had more fuel capacity/better range and also carried missiles, it would have been a better dogfighter.

[@Willoz269]

Reading Mig Aces olf the North Vietnamese Air Force is quite a book.....makes you think the USAF and USN were the equivalent of the Luftwaffe, and the RAF were the NVAF MiGs.....they would go in 2 or 3 flights of 4 against waves of American bombers and escorts to protect their bases, cities and targets....with much lesser technology.....much respect to both sides.

[@SDsc0rch]

XO was so pissed... i bet

[@sexualrenegade]

The greatest thing about this clip is that there are zero dislikes.

[@user-mx1nf5rf5y]

I gave it dislike. Because this pig does not show any remorse for killing a man. He killed a man defending his homeland.

[@sexualrenegade]

Сиви Соко fair comment. I respect your point of view & politics aside but when two people duel with their aircraft for whatever reason they may be opponents, so be it the best person wins.

[@user-mx1nf5rf5y]

​@@sexualrenegadeIf Jerry Beaulier was a decent person he would have said "we fought and i won, but i am sorry that he didnt jump from his plane when i shot him down". But it is hard to be human, right?

[@user-mx1nf5rf5y]

@Mars Exulte There is no point in arguing with you. It is obvious you are psychopath.

[@hectiky]

@@user-mx1nf5rf5y not sure if responding to you is a mistake, as you seem to be interpreting this video a different way than others. You could also be a troll. But here goes. Not everything needs to be a dramatic documentary like on TV. This a just a quick recap of the mans experience with a dogfight. You have no idea how he feels about taking a life (which is part of war). If you think you do, you haven't watched or read enough accounts of peoples war experiences. You act as though he regards it the same way as killing a mosquito, which is nonsense. I hope you understand my intention with this comment. This channel is only about pilots experiences, and nothing else.

[@molnibalage83]

Not only the two mentioned stuff is unreal but as well as the lots of pointless aileron roll. It is mentioned in the behind the scenes by Michael "Flex" Galpin.

[@molnibalage83]

@Joe150 ish www.mediafire.com/file/2m43lf2pewhj9v2/Top_Gun_-_Behind_The_Scenes_%2528Part_6%2529__The_Need_For_Speed_%2528Production_Air%2529.mp4/file From 9:56. In short. During an aileron roll the heading of the aircraft remains the same. The point of any maneuver is changing the relative direction and speed between you and opponent and /or incoming missile. I'm shocked that so basic thing has to be explained further...

[@dirk6001]

👍

[@dominiqueroudier9401]

F4J BuNo 155875 modex NK 201 call sign Dakota and used AIM9 sidewinder

[@andreim841]

Ohhhh, you mean that in real life going in afterburner doesn't activate the brakes? 😈

[@TheGranicd]

Would be interesting to hear Vietnam pilots.

[@Ace-Av8er]

Of course that would be very interesting but we never will hear the Vietnamese side of the story. Even if by a Devine miracle we do hear it it will be dismissed as propoganda. The same holds true in Arab Isreali wars which produced Egyptian and Syrian aces then there is the Iran Iraq was again many aces on both sides However the Iranian produced more aces their top Ace an F-14 Pilot had 11 kills.

[@supagoose1]

No hvh8

[@stevenlarratt3638]

You mean russians right...?!? Hence you wont hear them...

[@Ace-Av8er]

@@stevenlarratt3638 no we mean exactly what we said, "Vietnamese "

[@Ace-Av8er]

@John Smith May they all, RIP.

[@zeitgeistx5239]

Lol I was wondering to myself how long before I see a troll comment and didn't have to look far.

[@thietbui7702]

i need vietsub :D

[@singhsartaaj764]

Dogfight going on in comment box😂🤣😜

[@kallekallenen4346]

So he actually got him the first time and did not give him the soldiers honor to try to get out but shoot him again just to kill. Dishonorable.

[@kkkkk12122323232]

That's an Su-17 in the thumbnail.

[@Aircrewinterview]

Nope it’s a MiG-21

[@kkkkk12122323232]

@@Aircrewinterview You're right, it looked like an Su-17 because of the small nose come but the cockpit is rounder than the Su-17. My bad.

[@ronaldsauce3714]

MiG-21F, probably F-13

[@sauravghosh7064]

update :indian pilot shot down f16 with mig 21 bison

[@clydecessna737]

On this channel, notice how the American interviewees are more articulate, more comfortable and better dressed and groomed than British ones. We have a culture problem.

[@Apemopar]

Mig killer. 😍

[@tyahnguyen8088]

vì lẽ gì các anh mang máy bay chiến đấu, bom đạn đến quê hương chúng tôi?

[@tomk3732]

Spot on - he killed a guy fighting for his homeland.

[@Ace-Av8er]

US produced only 2 Aces, North Vietnam produced, 16 Aces.

[@777Outrigger]

US pilots only served for 1 year in the Vietnam War.

[@dominiqueroudier9401]

Bécause after tour of duty return to air station for instructor like in ww2

[@hicapclipazine6000]

Not to mention for the North Vietnamese the air space was a VERY target rich environment for them. We had to hunt to find them.

[@zeitgeistx5239]

You must be a troll, USAF rules of engagement meant NV airfields were not allowed to be bombed and had a buffer zone near China they could escape to where you weren't allow to chase. Also they needed visual identification before they were allowed to shoot. That adds up to allowing your enemy to continuously harass your forces.

[@Ace-Av8er]

@@zeitgeistx5239 what dose stating facts have to do with being a "Troll"? NVAF also restricted BVR engagement plus they did not have BVR engagement capability at the time moreover NVAF also did not bomb American airfields. USAF, USN aircraft used to escape into Thiland and to offshore carriers........ assuming arguand that American fighter were allowed BVR engagement it would not have resulted in significant increase in aerial kills because the AIM-7 sparrow was extremely unreliable of the 612 Sparrows fired during the war only resulted in destruction of 56 aircrafts (9.5% kill ratio) total, a lot of these aircrafts were friendly, shot down by mistake ( number of friendly aircrafts shot down is classified so we will never know the actual number) which brought about the restriction of BVR engagement. Each Sparrow costs $125k used to shoot down $50k Antique Migs flown by supposedly poorly trained peasant Vietnamese.

[@henryfreeman1713]

The F4 Phantom was no match for The MIG21 over North Vietnam. Many F4 Phantoms were lost; to The MIG21. American Pilots were embarrassed to admit they had been shot-down by Enemy Aircraft. That's a known fact. Most Air Combats were out of Triple A range. In any case, over 10,000 American War Planes of all kinds; including F4 Phantoms were shot down; over North Vietnam. The sleek designed MiG21 had big a big role. No doubt!

[@marinkhan3066]

In Vietnam the losses of F4 phantom against mig 21 , mig 19 and specially against mig 17 was so high that at one point the pilot were refusing to fly them unless they r fitted with a gun . But this propaganda says otherwise

[@dominiqueroudier9401]

Fortunately F8 crusader créws are happy and this time it Was VPAF migs Who avoided dogfight With thé Cruze👍🔫

[@lizardb8694]

As far as I know, that s urban legend. Fighter community was split on the gun issue. For example Col. Robin Olds believed that no gun on Phantom was non issue and installing the gun will result in even higher losses on the USAF side, the thought process was basically that young inexperienced and untrained USAF fighter pilots will try to engage VPAF MIG 17s and 19s with a gun in classic dogfights, insteed trying to rely on F4 Phantom strenghts and will get themselves shot down by more nimble opponents.

[@tenlittleindians]

Sounds like bullshit to me. Refuse an order in the military and your in deep doo doo!

[@Ace-Av8er]

@@tenlittleindians no it is not, pilots have first right of refusal to fly an aircraft that is unsafe has technical, performence issues

[@panchonuts7059]

Shut up and go back to your school work.

[@tomk3732]

US failed to win the air war over Vietnam. A lot of foreign pilots participated on Vietnamese side and scored a lot of kills. The overall kill ratio was roughly 1:1 or maybe slightly on Vietnam side, like 0.8:1. I hope no one believes in the hype of US in 10:1 loss ratio (in favor of US). Historical evidence form the other side clearly says its not true & US is known to over hype. Besides US lost over 10000 flying aircraft over Vietnam - including Helicopters. To this day paramilitary police in Vietnam uses M-16s as so many were dropped and never even fired (almost 1 million light weapons were captured). Until recently Vietnam used US tanks and today their main APC is ... 113 (!!!) So much so for US combat abilities - one can give credit to US war machine for making so much stuff - I mean no one could have lost over 5000 helicopters and survive paying for it all BUT US. And what Vietnam lost? 130 - 160 of all types. That is it. MiG-21 No.4326, which shot down 13 aircraft during the war (war museum / Wikipedia) So now imagine 10 to 1 ratio. That means that single MiG did all the work! LOL. As its 13 kills x 10 is 130 which are total NV losses. "On April 4, in the first confirmed aerial victories for either side, MiG-17s shot down two US Air Force F-105s that were attacking the “Dragon’s Jaw” bridge at Thanh Hoa." So there were *other* kills - hence the 10:1 is a plain lie.

[@torch8922]

Most of the USAF and USN fixed wing losses were non- fighter aircraft types (Skyhawks, Corsairs, Thuds etc). The F4 more than held its’ own. The kill ratio referenced was in regard to F4’s versus Migs only. Regarding helicopter losses, the U.S. Army did lose a whole lot of helicopters, which isn’t surprising when you factor in that their combat arena was typically about 100 feet above ground level. When I was instructing at Miramar, we had 2 ex-army helo types come through, having transferred from the army and having completed advanced fixed wing training and they were entering the F4 conversion phase. One was an ex-Cobra pilot and one was an ex-loach pilot. They both had 3 helicopters shot from under them. Both had 3 Silver Stars. It’s a different world fighting from the treetops or from a jungle clearing.