Fallschirm-Panzer-Division 'Hermann Göring'

Fallschirm-Panzer-Division 'Hermann Göring'
With Lawrence Paterson
Part of the Operation Avalanche (Salerno) 80th Anniversary series
• Operation Avalanche (S...
In the early years of the Third Reich, Hermann Goring, worked to establish his own personal army to rival Himmler's SS and Reichswehr. The result: a private Prussian police force which grew into one of the most powerful armoured units in the Wehrmacht. This unit fought throughout the war, engaging Anglo-American forces in vicious battles across the European theatres of Tunisia, Sicily and Italy before finally being defeated by the Red Army on the Eastern Front. In today's talk, we will learn about the Hermann Goring Panzer Division with a focus on their defence of Italy after the Salerno landings in September 1943.
Lawrence Paterson has been writing non-fiction Second World War history books since 2000; his first book published by Pen & Sword in 2002.
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Goering's Boys in Blue - The Luftwaffe Field Divisions 1942-1945
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[@ToddSauve]

I had an elderly friend named Gunter Brauer here in Calgary who had been in the Herman Goring division in late 1944 and into January 1945. This was obviously not during the Italian campaign but he had some interesting tales to tell. He had been forced to join the armed forces when he turned 18 and that happened in October 1944. So he had the option of joining the Herman Goring division and he thought "Wow! Look at all the fancy gear they have!" So he chose them with the hopes, like all the other young men, of riding in a tank or operating some fancy piece of gear. All they really wanted him for in the end was as cannon fodder. The higher ups knew the war was lost. So he got really rudimentary infantry training and then put in the front lines in Poland facing the Soviets. He woke up one morning to find the guy next to him in his fox hole was dead. He never really understood how he had been killed but it was a _very_ disconcerting experience. Another time his commanders had him execute captured Soviet officers. He said they had so little ammunition that they may as well have been disarmed. They were issued potato masher grenades with no detonators. "What were we supposed to do with those?" Gunter asked derisively. "Smash them on the heads of Russian soldiers and kill both of us?" Finally he woke up one morning to find the Soviets has bypassed his position during the night and thus he was a POW. He said he could not really complain about how the Soviets treated him as a prisoner, considering how the Nazis treated Russian POWs. He faked that he was sick for quite a while, so they put him in the camp infirmary. He was terribly worried that he would sent to the salt mines in Siberia, which happened a great deal, and that was considered a one way trip. Eventually they just let him go. He was a skinny little teenager and he thinks they finally just had pity on him. He had to walk almost the entire way back to his family farm in Pomerania but a Soviet commissar came along in a horse drawn wagon when he was about five miles from home and offered him a ride the final distance. Gunter said when they got to his farm his mother ran out, tears flowing, to welcome him home. He said the three of them, him, his mother and the Soviet commissar, stood there and had a good cry together. All of them were so glad the war was over.

[@jeffkujawa803]

That was really a good story…. thanks for sharing!

[@lllordllloyd]

Thanks for writing this story. For all the tales of enterprise and bravery we enjoy, survival was so often just a matter of pure chance. I am pleased this man got to live his life.

[@ToddSauve]

@@jeffkujawa803 You are welcome Jeff.

[@ToddSauve]

@@lllordllloyd Gunter was a good man and I am glad I got to know him. He died in June 2019.

[@MegaBloggs1]

great story -thankyou for sharing!

[@jeffbraaton4096]

I thought I knew stuff about HG, but alas my resources are from 40+ yrs ago. Larry gave us a fantastically enthralling presentation, new information through out. The sidebar as usual was totally engaged. Definitely have Larry on again Paul this was a great show. Thank you

[@cenccenc946]

I was in Salerno a few years ago. I was amazed that anyone would consider a landing there. It is a narrow bay surrounded by a bowl of steep hills all around, with narrow roads and passes (even today) overlooking it. It was just a natural shooting gallery. Amazing that it was not a total a bloodbath and failure of a landing.

[@mathewkelly9968]

17:15 i could think of worse postings than a Cavalry unit in the Luftwaffe ffs guarding Karinhall

[@philbosworth3789]

That was such an informative and enjoyable episode from Larry. Please have him on regularly Woody @WW2TV because I think Larry could keep us all spellbound episode after episode. Great sidebar input again. This channel continues to impress in every way, certainly more than worth the meagre contribution I provide.

[@keithcitizen4855]

himmler a waiste of space running an army towards the end too at a post doing nothing

[@alanscheckenbach5265]

The photo at 52:08 of the man sitting in front of the rear idler of a Pz.IV. He’s described as a recruit by Larry - he is in fact the very experienced Oberleutnant Alfred Dreher, commander of the HG Panzer’s 7th Kompanie - later died of wounds sustained during the German counter-attack against the British as they were crossing the Gargliano River.

[@mathewkelly9968]

33:23 from experience in my eeerrrr younger days i confer , itll keep you up for a week but youre going to be fing useless the next week . Like if we're talking background amounts like the amount of cocaine in coca cola back in the day is a whole different ball game to a proper dose . Just a stupid idea

[@Thumpalumpacus]

Mr Paterson is right to focus on people. A veteran with a knife is more dangerous than a rookie with a gun, after all. I'd take a good pilot in a mediocre plane oxer a bad pilot in flying the best, too. People matter.

[@PalleRasmussen]

Robert Citino's favourite division as a child 😅 "You want an immediate, reckless rush at the enemy? I am your man". Brodny was the largest tank engagement *ever*, and it is the USSR, not Russia. Important to emphasise these days where Russia takes all the honour and uses it in its propaganda against Ukraine.

[@stephenduffy5406]

In the film 'Patton,' just after the Sicilian campaign, Patton became jealous of all the good press Monty was getting, and he said, referring to the American Army: "Don't they know we beat the Hermann Goering Division?"

[@terryemery7839]

Great information as usual.

[@peterfriedenspfeife9230]

I have appreciated this show very much. I never got a grasp on the Hermann Görung Division, only read glimpses here and there. Also in the popular memory in Germany, this unit doesn't exist at all, at least this is my impression. Therefore it was so interesting to learn about the unit's origin, development and deployments. A big thank you to both of you, Lawrence and Paul! Best greetings, Peter

[@WW2TV]

Thanks Peter

[@markrunnalls7215]

Early 251s with 20mm flaks ,makes a nice combo .

[@jonathanmarsh5955]

What a fascinating talk! The 'Herman Goering Panzer Division' [sic] is one of those units of which we have all heard but about which most of us actually know very little. Re: the 'Panzerschockolade', or sustained Pervitin use, by Day Three or Four I would have thought that at least some of the men in the unit would have shifted into the wonderful world of 'amphetamine psychosis' and have become a bit 'unreliable and unpredictable', to say the least! Thanks to you, Paul and Lawrence, for a very informative presentation. A quite remarkable piece of research and scholarship.

[@jammininthepast]

Thank you Lawrence and Paul, I learned much from your superb presentation. You're appreciated.

[@palmergriffiths1952]

Great Video on the Herman Goering division. I remember my Grandfather saying he was up against these Guys when He was in The First Special Service Force.

[@farizdbro9903]

Woody, any plans for a future episode on the “elite” Brandenburg unit? Greetings from Malaysia.

[@WW2TV]

If I can find a suitable guest historian

[@farizdbro9903]

Lawrence Patterson did a book on the unit some years ago.

[@WW2TV]

Yep, we've talked about it and he will come on and talk about them at some point

[@terryemery7839]

@Phil Bosworth. Great community and good discussions. Happy to be here.

[@mathewkelly9968]

A unit so over equipped that you could have fielded like 3 divisions instead .

[@ottovonbismarck2443]

Outstanding Lawrence and Paul ! Although I knew a fair bit of the HG history, I wasn't fully aware that the "division" was never fully deployed.

[@williamkolina3988]

Paul you had mentioned the horror of aushwitz.Could you do an episode about the ground penetrating radar at Treblinka?the findings are remarkable.I have always loved how your channel brings historical accuracy

[@WW2TV]

It would depend on finding a suitable guest

[@lukejohn6139]

Fantastic presentation about this crazy division. Really appreciate how the story of how the division came to exist and what it was rather than just the details of a particular battle.

[@FrankenTiger88]

Does your channel plan on doing a video on the September 1943 battle for Rome between the Italians and Germans?

[@WW2TV]

Not really, but we have a show scheduled about the massacre of the Acqui division

[@farizdbro9903]

The “largest” tank battle was actually a series of battles fought in the Praga [suburb of Warsaw] area in 1944. The number of tanks that were involved in the 2 SS Panzer Corps/5th Tank Guards Army clash at Kursk has been hugely exaggerated.

[@dexterscott7824]

Bigger than Dubno?

[@PorqueNoLosDos]

Once again a 1st class presentation/lecture/discussion. Now I love how you present "new/not-covered" subjects in detail drilling down on the "rabbit holes". Bravo! BTW I would love an episode of nothing but "rabbit holes" or your favorite ones not fully explored. Thank you.

[@JohnEglick-oz6cd]

The Nazi- German Luftwaffe's Fallshirmjeger were Evan tough in Normandy summer of 1944 . And in Greece , and Crete May , 1941 .

[@williamkolina3988]

I respectfully disagree about the kampfgruppe They were highly efficient US army copied them in team(commanders name) Task force Marine Corps uses BLT Brigade combat teams All arms unit under one commander usually has better command and coordination than separate independent units

[@WW2TV]

They could be excellent or terrible, it all depends on when and where

[@larrymapex]

I agree they were frequently highly efficient and the Germans excelled in their use. However, it was, as Paul says, highly dependent on the calibre of its leadership. I didn't mean to state that they were an inefficient method by which to wage war, more to illustrate the fact that the HG formation never really went into action as a complete unit.

[@richardbinkhuysen5224]

I've sent you the composition of Fallsch.Ersatz und Ausbildung Rgt.Hermann Göring for Aug.1.1944

[@i-a-g-r-e-e-----f-----jo--b]

@1:09:30, talking about the saved artwork from Monte Cassino, there is a German and French production film called "The Green Devils of Monte Cassino (1958)". I watched it on YT two weeks ago, so it's funny that I'm hearing about it historically now, thanks. The film didn't mention the 2 missing trucks but the film has them being attacked by Italian partisans as they transport the artwork, thinking the Germans were stealing it.

[@briankorbelik2873]

And sorry, I may be jumping ahead here, but the Hermann Goring Division eventually was formed into a Panzer Korps. FallschirmpanzerkorpsHermannGoring, with a Panzer Division, a Panzergrenadier Division, and Korps troops. Like the Grossdeutschland Panzer Korps. The two Korps fought together in East Prussia at the end of the war, taking turns commanding each other's units, and both units were nearly completely destroyed. GD managed to save only about 800 men, and HG about 4,000, out of a combined total of over 40,000.

[@RobertRailey101]

I was in the US Army in Afghanistan and Iraq. We were issued caffeine chewing gum to keep us going when needed. Granted, it’s not illicit or even a controlled substance but the idea is the same. Need to stay away for a bit pop some gum. But it wasn’t meant to be “turn into a Berserker for a month.”

[@nubtube7313]

Really enjoyed this segment, thank you. Lawrence, I really appreciate your style of reciting history and couldn't agree more with your sentiments regarding the importance of the human element. While the machines and equipment hold an interest all on their own, although this too has a human element to it, it is the human element of the fighting formations of WWII that holds my interest most. And your explanation at 34:00 in the time line could not have been said better. If we really want to learn from human history, it is important that we try to understand the historical players as they were, and not who we imagine them to be. Anyone interested in gaining more insight into how ordinary men (doctors, lawyers, plumbers) could commit the atrocities that occurred during WWII should look up the Standford prison experiment from 1971. The study had to be terminated early because of the unethical psychological behaviors being observed. I think this study offers a very good model that can be used to help explain at least some of the abarrent behaviors witnessed during WWII, especially in the concentration camps. And elements of this type of aberrant behavior can also certainly be extended to the various fighting formation that were deployed on both sides.

[@markrunnalls7215]

Apparently Dubno and Brody were the largest tank battles on the Eastern front ,and not Kursk..

[@WW2TV]

Yep

[@lyndoncmp5751]

Bare in mind the vast majority of the tanks on both sides in 1941 were much smaller and lighter. BTs, T-26s, 38(t), Panzer IIs etc. At Kursk, there were a far greater proportion of larger tanks etc such as T-34s, Panzer IVs, Stugs etc. And of course, Tigers, Panthers and Ferdinands in addition. In terms of tonnage, Kursk beats Brody. Just saying ✌️

[@asullivan4047]

Thanks for pointing that out! After the failed blitzkrieg attempt to invade Moscow. Germany never regained that momentum. The rest is history.

[@briankorbelik2873]

I am older now, but in my younger days I worked with anumber of former German soldiers at a large West Coast telephone company at that time, who had fought in WW2 and all had served in Russia. They were all gentlemen, they had been just your "average" Heer soldiers, none had fought with the Waffen SS. They told me the units that they had fought with, and except for one man they had fought in Heer infantry divisions, later in the war. The one other gent had commanded a Stug and had fought from '44 on. And while working in a Savings and Loan in Pasadena, CA, my wife made friends with a classy gent who was older even for being a soldier in WW2. We came to know him pretty well and he did tell us some pretty harrowing stories about fighting in the East. He had been in an HQ unit in the East and was lucky to have made it out alive. As has been mentioned, many of the men that I met had first emigrated to Canada before winding up in the States.

[@alwoo5645]

The Luftwaffe had its own tank division yet the navy had no air arm

[@larrymapex]

Thanks everybody and thanks Paul. Really enjoyed that :) Great community you have here.

[@WW2TV]

Thanks Larry

[@williamkolina3988]

I'm wondering how police can become paratroopers.most police are not fit enough to be paras Plus it is a young mans job

[@merdiolu]

Unfortunetely I missed this one. Italian campaign is one of my favorite fronts , Salerno amd Southern Central and Northern Italian campaigns

[@asullivan4047]

Many more casualties then were expected unfortunately. Main land Italy was no Sunday afternoon at the park!!! The allied forces never received the recognition they deserved.

[@mindbomb9341]

One of my relatives died there.

[@zulubeatz1]

As someone who had a relative who was killed flying a FW 190 for the Luftwaffe over Normandy for 3 days almost alone, I agree that Goring was a misfortune. The Luftwaffe did have an effective ground commander in Kurt Student, though. What a fascinating feature about a unit that were somewhat a mystery.

[@nilo9456]

The quote as I've read it goes like this, " Germany/The Nazis had a Prussia army, an Imperial Navy and a Nazi Air force. Lots of truth, lots of confusion, lots of propaganda. Just a mess for those of us who try to make sense of the past.

[@hughsmith7668]

My Father was on the USS Byscain at Salerno. I hate to brag but my Dad won WW2 all by himself on that ship. Look it up.

[@mathewkelly9968]

30:43 34,000 men wow an Australian Corps commander would wish for that many

[@adambrooker5649]

Excellent topic, one I was very much looking forward too! I have a wargaming force based off this division, as well as lots of references. Thanks very much!

[@scottgrimwood8868]

Larry gives an excellent presentation. I really appreciated him breaking through the myths & misunderstandings about this unit.

[@abrahamoyevaar2226]

Had to rewatch Mr Stouts and Mr Bloods excellent presentations in preparation for this. Thanks Lawrence and Paul for this excellent presentation.

[@missmissy2490]

Thank you so much. This is so interesting.

[@VonMinzeIII]

I love the Channel and the content with true hustorical insight in dealing with misgivings and glorification of so called wehraboos myths I have a question What is regarded logistically historically operationally as the best German land unit of And during WW2?

[@larrymapex]

That's a tough question, but it would probably/arguably have been one of the premiere Waffen SS divisions such as the Leibstandarte or Das Reich. There were, of course, many highly effective land units within the Wehrmacht...so it would be quite a list.

[@mathewkelly9968]

25:11 i think the term "elite" in ww2 really comes down to recruitment ,training , motivation and or equipment . Get a couple of those right youll get an above average unit

[@damndirtyrandy7721]

Get them all right and you have the Devil’s Brigade..

[@iancarr8682]

Fascinating detail. Would the Division have had its own Enigma codes, with all the admin that would go with that?

[@larrymapex]

That's actually a good question. I believe that they used standard Heer Enigma codes as they were in communication with senior Army units the majority of the time. Saying that, there was a great deal of communication between the Regiment/Brigade/Division and regional Luftwaffe command units, so I would assume in that case they would use the same Enigma net that all Luftwaffe combat units used. I'm going to investigate that - it's an interesting question.

[@garymiller_85]

Enjoyed that very much.

[@WW2TV]

Glad you enjoyed it. Lawrence was a super guest

[@i-a-g-r-e-e-----f-----jo--b]

Thanks, great video! I always remember George C Scott playing Patton after being questioned about his troops fast advance in Sicily implying a weak enemy defense saying something like , "Are you kidding me? That's the G D Hermann Göring Division!".

[@asullivan4047]

Interesting and informative. Excellent photography job enabling viewers to better understand what/whom the guest speaker is describing. Yes fighter ace Luftwaffe general Adolf Galland. Often argued with disillusioned Goring 😈 & Hitler 😈. About the catastrophic losses of pilots & air crafts. That were unnecessary & wasteful. Diabolical Goring was more interested in pilfering the museums in Paris. Then the well fair of his pilots. Mussolini 😈 was an albatross around Hitler's neck. He deserved no less!!!

[@markrunnalls7215]

Interesting division the HG ,elements of there flak units wore SS camo smocks ,and they held the port of Memel from the soviets during April and May of 1945.

[@wildcolonialman]

Fascinating. Thank you. Well aware of the Reich Marshalls 4 Year Plan, minister of the 4 year plan, bestowed enormous autonomy. But no idea, the size of this Division, all other commands with in.

[@gamedude412]

The big issues with goring/luftwaffe troop is 1st action was a...goatfuck in russia. They broke and ran the enemy captured there fresh winter uniforms. to the point the other german were ordered to shoot men in the winter uniform. it left a bad taste. The HGD has one of the better counter attacks at the end of war too the Panthers caught the Polish Division and crushed them.

[@dexterscott7824]

Just bought Paterson’s book. Looking forward to reading it! The only other books about the HG Division that I know of are the Osprey book and the old Franz Kurowski book.

[@edmundcowan9131]

Good work guys.

[@morganhale3434]

This is an excellently done presentation on a controversial unit (I have read things about the Herman Goering Division being one of the greatest combat units in the war to it being a bad idea that was made even worse by poor execution.) The truth is always somewhere in the middle. To the US 82nd Parachute Regimental Combat team in Operation Husky airborne drop they were tough S.O.B.s.

[@dexterscott7824]

Military evacuations go especially well when the enemy isn’t making much effort to stop them.

[@petebondurant58]

Wolfgang...Amadeus...Mozart

[@WW2TV]

Relevance?

[@petebondurant58]

@@WW2TV The music at the beginning...

[@WW2TV]

Ah yes indeed

[@reeseasmr2511]

If the unit has no specific role, how do you write manuals and train? Talk about being confused when you go to the field.

[@WW2TV]

Yep, this was something that plagued this unit (thankfully for the Allies)

[@theccpisaparasite8813]

How many of these fallschirmjaeger survived the war?

[@WW2TV]

I don't think anyone would have exact figures, but certainly some did

[@mabbrey]

brilliant vid

[@garyarmitage9359]

Amazing!

[@FrankenTiger88]

From what I have seen that do you need questionnaire in Tunisia operated Italian army, fighting vehicles to some degree can you shed some light on that?

[@WW2TV]

Hopefully Lawrence will see this and reply

[@larrymapex]

Hi. I'm not aware of Italian armour being used by the HG troops, but I know they used Italian soft-skinned vehicles and motorcycles in Tunisia. Is that what you mean? Cheers

[@FrankenTiger88]

@@larrymapex I thought I saw a picture or two of this unit in Italian Semovente 47/32 tank destroyers I will have to check my source material. Thank you.

[@larrymapex]

@superhiker9583 that would be great to see. Entirely possible with the battlegroups formed on Sicily using everything available to hand. Let me double check that too.

[@waynehatton4136]

Wrong, the white collar tabs are later!

[@WW2TV]

Who cares. Which I mean in the context of WW2TV not being an insignia / militaria channel. This was about the unit's history

[@waynehatton4136]

It's about accuracy and truth.@@WW2TV

[@larrymapex]

On 23 March 1936 The Regiment exchanged the Reichswehr green uniform for Luftwaffe blue. The unit was also provided with distinctive white Luftwaffe rank patches, fringed by orthodox Wehrmacht Waffenfarbe colours; for example NCOs and men of the Jäger were identified by rifle-green Waffenfarbe, with red for flak artillery. In Divisional Order 64/44, dated 3 January 1944, Conrath commanded the wearing of the division’s famous ‘weisse Spiegel ’ (white epaulettes) to end. The distinctive bright white insignia had hindered effective camouflage of troops in action and provided a handy aiming point for Allied soldiers. Henceforth, small metal wings denoting rank could be worn directly on a plain collar. Silver tresses for non-commissioned officers were also forbidden on field service tunics, and administrative elements of each battalion were instructed instead to source field-grey braid.

[@WW2TV]

Thanks Lawrence

[@JohnEglick-oz6cd]

The Nazi- German Parachute Div.s ( Fallshirmjeger ) were well trained , and elite fighting units . Especially on Italy under the able , sagacious Nazi- German Luftwaffe Field Marshall General Albert Kesselring . He fought a Skil ful fighting retreat causing the Allies to take Italy nearly 1year after landing in Sicily July 1943 .