FFXIV Mythbusters #3! Putting Some of the Most Common Claims in FFXIV to the Test!

[@silverhairedelf09]

As someone who has ressed a party member and then have them die immediately after and having that interaction happen *so many times*, I really wish that the tooltip for the Raise spells would specifically mention the Transcendent buff you get. It would make it so much easier to explain the mechanic AND would stop this whole misconception about it too. Great video! Didn't know about the Hallowed Ground + Cover interaction myself.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

It is quite silly especially because all of the raise spells are some of the simplest shortest tooltips in the GAME, there's so much space to explain this mechanic!!! 🤣 Thank you so much! 😁

[@DrZlow]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh healer's Rescue also cancels this invuln.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

@DrZlow huh! That is weird..! I might have to test this myself to be sure, but I wonder if the game is coded such that the rescued person uses an "action" to perform the movement! So weird!

[@DrZlow]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh i most certainly does seem like that. Rescue just orders your character to "dash" towards a certaint coordinate (where healer stood at the moment of use). And while this "order" comes from the healer, the action of dashing is performed by the rescue target. Yes i have way too much hours spent progging DSR p2 to not notice that.

[@Kooper.]

It's probably like that because the Transcendent buff is an afterthought. The rez-invuln always existed but it was never visible as a buff. And of course many people always pressed buttons (like a heal) after getting raised so they never found out that there is a rez-invuln in the first place.

[@KINGOFTHESPARKS755]

Fun fact. Hallowed/cover probably came from back in stormblood, where cover/tempered will was a way to prevent KB effects on both tanks. This was especially common in o5s, where a paladin could save either tge other tank or a melee dps from it's early knockback for extra dps

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Indeed! That makes sense to me!

[@Cloud7050]

The place priority for fairy is good to know. Just a couple days back, in a raid I was actually waiting to be sure my fairy had finished moving before weaving Whispering Dawn. Good to know I can just use it after the Place and it will queue instead of getting used on the spot (to be sure, I just tested it in-game too).

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

I'm glad you found it helpful! Also always a good idea to test my claims on your end if you want to be absolutely sure! That's also why I try my best to explain how the tests are performed of course! 😁

[@WeskAlber]

The first one I always took issue with, even before ShB. It's not a problem if you're following the healer rule of: You are a lost puppy and should be at the tank's heel through a pull. It doesn't matter if you steal enmity for a second, because the moment the tank uses any AoE, they've taken it back. And if you're standing on the tank, the enemies won't "run past" the tank to you. Taking damage doesn't matter either if it's just an auto or two, and you can just throw a Regen on yourself. Cover really used to be busted. The nerfs were very needed. Even if its often the only reason people brought it along, Cover's rare utility was silly. We must continue to spread the word of raise invulns. So many times I've raised someone, just for them to die again immediately.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Very true! Not only can a healer take a few hits just fine, but for the most part healers don't need to be so far behind the tank anyway! Looking through patch notes I'm not even sure when cover was nerfed in this way, but I do certainly agree that this limitation is probably for the best! One day maybe we will get the word out to everyone! 😂

[@bl00dm0urne]

To be fair, why would you hit/use a skill on your target after a Raise? Especially when you can see you're not full HP (and hopefully paying attention) while your target seems to be casting something.

[@WeskAlber]

@@bl00dm0urne Cuz they don't know you have an invuln

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

@bl00dm0urne one reason is as weskalber says, another is for some reason, I couldn't possibly tell you why, but sometimes players are scared of idling, so they want to get back to attacking immediately. A particular example of this is tanks provoking the instant they're back up to try and protect the group, which can inadvertently result in them... Dying again!!!

[@bl00dm0urne]

@CaetsuChaijiCh I guess most tank players don't claim the ground as sacred, refuse to die, become a living corpse, or shoot themselves after a raise, and after provoking. If they have, I apologize. :) Also, guess some players' reaction after being revived is to charge head first at a dragon's den cause they didn't hear the "But" after the DND GM said after the words "Invulnerable".

[@ultimatecalibur]

The Cover/Hallowed Ground combo was one of the first combos broken by code changes to limit cheese in raids. If I remember right, during part of ARR and maybe even HW, Hallowed Ground would negate attacks transferred by Cover but this was changed at some point so that transferred attacks would bypass the invuln. Cover transferring attacks has always had some weird interactions and led to some interesting strategies when combined with things like Tempered Will when Paladin was the only one with anti-knockback.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Indeed! I tried looking it up and from my brief check it seems like at some point cover's "effect" was that it made the target take 100% less damage, but then made the paladin take the damage (which would obviously cause hallowed ground to work!). There was even a patch note about a time frame where cover only transferred 80% of the damage! Very strange!

[@ultimatecalibur]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh I think I can explain the 80% transfer. During that time period the attack's damage would be calculated as if it had hit the original target and then the damage was transferred to the Paladin. As a result this bypassed the 20% damage reduction from Shield Oath and any other mitigations the Paladin used. As a result if a Paladin covered someone (such as a main tank targeted by a tank buster) with a bunch of damage taken up debuffs the Paladin would die from full health even if they popped a ton of mitigation. Cover was then given a built in 20% mitigation.

[@Jilhel]

Great video as always Cae is truly casting Expedient for the whole community

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Thank you so much!😄 Haha! 😁

[@alek4ever646]

Here is a very fun one to go along with your cover and hallowed ground weirdness that is probably an unintended interraction or a bug. Not really myth, as simply something that I have tested and turned out to be true. A paladin using Cover AND hallowed ground can save a single teammate from a raidwide invulnpiercing instant kill enrage attacks. I learned this when me and a friend was trying to two-man Suzaku extreme, and I tried blocking the damage from Ashes to Ashes from the pheonixes. We were very confused why my teammate was alive while I died. And spent multiple runs trying to figure out what had haplened. Turns out that Hallowed ground alone does not block em and you die anyway. Cover alone does not keep your teammate safe and you both die.. But both abilities together will allow specificially the target of Cover to survive, while you yourself keel over.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

That is quite strange! If I recall correctly, aoes, even from bosses, hit in an expanding circle from the source, so closer players get hit first 🤔 I'm wondering if cover alone would be sufficient if the paladin is standing a reasonable distance further away, so that the paladin is still alive to redirect the damage! 😊

[@alek4ever646]

I think we tried that and nope and it doesn't matter, whether the paladin is closer or further away. Unless you Hollow, you both die. (especially since Ashes to Ashes are actually up to 4 instant kill AOEs that go off slightly at the same time). For some reason though Hollow + Cover will save your teammate as I think the Cover effect may actually stay for a little bit after you die.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

@@alek4ever646 Oh that could be. Good thing that you went and tested that as well, I imagine it took a while!

[@alek4ever646]

Nah, it was just me and my friend idly testing as we tried to figure out what happened the very first time. After all, we wanted to beat (and farm) Suzuaku extreme just the two of us. And well, if they got a ress, we can. xD

[@yukivanreenen9695]

I believe Eos does stop using Embrace if you use the Place command until it arrives at its destination. However, in a scenerio where your tank has run so far ahead that you need to Place Eos to prevent it from using abilities because it's out of range, it likely wasn't using Embrace anyway. I've used Place in dungeon pulls before because it can be hard to keep track of Eos in some dungeons (mt. Gulg) and some tanks just don't slow down.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Indeed that is a good point! I might test this a bit later, but if you are curious for the answer yourself, the easiest way to test it, would be to do the following: Unequip all your gear as sch. Equip it all again to increase your max hp, and immediately enter combat with a striking dummy, then start constantly ordering eos around like in the devotion dance example. If she's still casting embrace then we have our answer! 😁

[@NastyMick]

Not that i know this for any reason in particular, but targeting an enemy also does not remove your 'After Raise' invulnerability period. What I don't DON'T know is if auto attacks do...

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Auto attacking does remove your invulnerability period yes! 😊 So be careful right clicking things! 😂

[@NastyMick]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh Very good to know!

[@NotTheWheel]

Okay I know the video was just posted but FIRST point as a Whitemage main for many eons I didn't know they changed this. Considering 6.2 is a more recent change though I'm gonna grant myself some leeway - This is good news though because it makes my job easier.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Indeed. It is also a very easy thing to miss given how specific the situation has to be for this to come up, so you are excused! 😁

[@ultimatecalibur]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh You could almost change the title of this series to "Changes that you might have missed."

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

@ultimatecalibur that too haha 😂

[@neflarionshadowflame2050]

I have used cover to eat vuln stacks that would go on a healer in Thok ast Thok when people don't kill butterflies fast enough to prevent wipes. People always seem so surprised.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

A very effective strategy! I imagine people are surprised because cover gets forgotten in general so much!

[@sirhc1528]

PLD Cover overall got drasticly nerved in EW. The fun way of it. Something you used to be able to but are not anymore are: Cover a friend (BLM) before the Shiva/ Tsuki transition freeze/ Stun. PLD took double dmg and the covered player was able to move when nobody else could. Fly high at Bismark. You could cover a player and that player than moved into the knockup tornados. The Coverd player would give the knockup to the PLD and the PLD would fly high and higher with every server tick while the coverd player just stood in that tornado.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Those are some hilarious tricks! I wonder why they removed the ability to do these things 😅

[@renycilfay9773]

The reason pets have a "memory of 30 seconds," is because they actually still gain the buff that used to be visible in 5.0 upon commands (The old Egi Assault 1, Egi Assault 2 buffs the pet would receive as a buff). Those buffs happen to be 30 seconds of duration. However, for some reason they decided to hide the effect again. The way it works in a little more detail is that, like Summoner's "Ruin IV" they get upon using Energy Drain, the button itself is unlocked by having the status effect, and the AI will always use the action if it's unlocked in that manner. Another fun fact about the SCH pets, most of the time the fairy will use the actions in the order you commanded them. But very occasionally, that order gets lost. I'm not sure what the cause is, but it usually only happens when the pet moves in between actions. (For example, if you move your pet like you displayed to delay the action of radiant aegis and use Consolation, Fey Illumination, Whispering Dawn, Consolation, then she will instead do Consolation twice in a row before using the other two actions.) The only time this really matters is in dungeons where you have a lot more space to weave a bunch of actions at once with Art of War than you would with Broil, though.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Very interesting! I wonder, this mixup of order, is this only happening with consolation? Because it is possible that it simply gives the seraph two stacks of it, and happens to keep the order. That would explain it if it only happens with that ability! 😊

[@renycilfay9773]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh It can often happen with the base fairy and Fey Union too, so that's why I say I'm not sure what the cause is. It's a pretty occasional and altogether not *that* impactful oddity, though.

[@renycilfay9773]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh Oh yeah, and if you'd like another myth to bust, there's a huge number of people who actually think that SCH pets will heal the player with the lowest health or percentage of health. Feel free to do your own testing, but make sure to also review real party gameplay footage, too.

[@crowdemon_archives]

The only time I think Hallowed Ground + Cover could be used in a bit of a lulz scenario is P12S's Crush Helm lol (that's assuming you didn't use your invuln for the Palladian Grasp earlier though)

[@RoseArtemis24]

You can do this without HG if you kitchen sink it (i.e. use all your other mitigations) - this is what my cotank and I have bern doing! You just have to make sure you run far enough away to break cover distance between the last debuff hit and the big buster a couple of seconds later. Timing can be a little tight but it's fun to pull off, and allows you to use including for palladian like you said!

[@duranmclemore8667]

I thought for the longest time that when people talked about raise's "5 seconds of invuln" that they were talking about the raise animation. I discovered recently on a p12s pull that it was just something I never experienced because I'm always trying to attack out of the gate

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Indeed, that is a common reason people don't see it! But now you have the knowledge for the future, with the added details of how it works! 😁

[@eidalac]

I remember back when HoTs gave strangely large enmity on tick, and even could pull away mobs after a tank AoE (IIRC, and it's been a WHILE, that specifically could only happen if you had a HoT tick->mob moves to edge of AoE zone->AoE->HoT Tick->mob moves out of AoE range), but it was simple enough to deal with as long as the healer just moved to the tank for them to re-establish enmity. If the tank or healer moved away from each other it was a pain, but that was down to situational awareness. Tanks got a few potency buffs prior to the HoT change, so this was much less of an issue, but older dungeons could cause some weird pulls before the HoT was changed.

[@Amooseable]

A very common myth I come across is that "You need to hit the boss before resetting to set the checkpoint", which I've tested multiple times and shown is not the case. As soon as the boss is targetable, the checkpoint is set and you can reset. This combined with a personal theory I had where the checkpoint setting point was actually when it says "Limit gauge has been reset!", but through O4S unsynced, I tried dying as soon as that message popped up (Which is well before the boss was targetable), and surprisingly the checkpoint did NOT set. Love the series, encouraging people to actually try things themselves helps with having a better understanding of how the game works, rather than just blindly trusting everything else you hear

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

I am guessing people sometimes have been so quick to jump on some fights that it didn't checkpoint yet so the common strategy was to poke the boss once to be absolutely sure, and then eventually it became assumed you had to do so for the checkpoint 🤔😊 I might look into this too! Thank you so much! 😄

[@ostentenacity5328]

I had the opposite happen once: got to the checkpoint in DSR with only 1 person alive, and the (targetable but un-touched) boss auto’d that one person to death immediately. We thought the checkpoint would be set because we saw the boss’s health bar pop up, but nope! Back to the Vault Knights.

[@Ymirsabella]

This video was interesting cant wait for the next ones

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Thank you! I'm glad to hear it!

[@ShifterVampire]

1. For an old regen there may be the problems where tank do a range attack, regen ticks, all enemies start running to healer and tank may not get them all with a singe AoE, meaning that either healer need to run with a tank or tank need to do another range attack. It's not a big problem, but still may be an inconvenience sometimes.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Just to clarify, regen will only generate enmity from being applied, the tick of healing will not! 😊 But aside from that I understand what you mean!

[@ShifterVampire]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh Right now yeah. I was more about how it was in ARR and HW, when tanks also had a harder time to maintain enmity. Hell, just two Medica 2 at the start of Titan Hard/EX could take aggro from the tank if he wasn't prepared. And even if he was sometimes

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

@ShifterVampire oh that is true indeed!

[@skooterboyle1991]

Just gotta say -- THANK YOU for actually publishing some content instead of click bait!! So much drama over nothing out there right now when people could be taking time to improve their game, whether it's combat or housing or glam or whatever. Thanks for being a real content creator!

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Thank you so much, that means a lot to me! 🥰 I'm not the biggest fan of drama content myself either - or click bait for that matter! 😁

[@LarkyLuna]

I think the regen/shield enmity is more of an annoyance now You tag the first mob and rush to do an AOE and your healer casts something in-between those and the mobs rush them the new pathing makes you miss one or two mobs and you have to track them down It isn't really fun to shuffle through a bunch of moving enemies on controller

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Yeah I can see that! 😊 Personally, I Usually apply my regen or shield or whatever to the tank before they enter combat since when they are in combat I want to be attacking too! But I can see how the sudden aggro grab would be mildly annoying!

[@necrolord1920]

My suggested solution to that problem is not to use your gap closer for pulling. Either pull with an aoe as you enter melee range, or pull with a ranged attack. With a ranged attack, if someone else pulls the enmity on a couple of mobs, those mobs should still come to you first if you are at the head of the party, which will give you a chance to use aoe to grab them before they get to the other party members.

[@Zanador]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh Using your regen ahead of time makes sense now, but that's the exact situation that used to be a problem when each tick generated aggro! I remember when I first start leveling healer (which was in 6.0) I quickly learned not to do that because it caused everything to aggro onto me before the tank even got a chance to engage. I didn't realize it had been changed!

[@spiritmuse]

On controller if you hold down L1 you can use d-pad up and down to select enemies from the aggro/enemy list. Much easier than trying to grab them with left and right from a moving group. You do have to have enough aggro to have them on that list first, but in a dungeon that's not really gonna be an issue. Though ideally you shouldn't have to individually target any mob as anyone else who gets aggro should just run towards the tank so you can catch it in your aoe attacks

[@blahpy]

Prior to Endwalker, following the player was also high in the priority list for pets, and I think that changing is probably the most significant change that makes them more responsive now (although the time taken when they are stationary is s a lot better now too. If you backpedalled with your pet in front of you prior to endwalker, it would actually delay the action indefinitely without the 30 second limit. Not really useful in almost any boss arena, because you need a lot of space to pull it off, but technically in Zurvan for example, you could actually backpedal around the arena for 3 minutes straight before the fight to get two uses of devotion at the start!

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

That is quite interesting! I guess they had a much longer memory back then too! 😊 Although what gives me pause is that you wouldn't have devotion at level 60! 🤔😊

[@blahpy]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh Yeah, Zurvan was just the first compatible arena that came to mind because you'd have to walk in a very wide loop without pulling the boss. Pets still only had the 30 second memory if you used place, but if you backpedalled it was unlimited for some reason. I have an unlisted clip if you'd like to see it!

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

@blahpy ah fair enough! I trust you, it was simply the zurvan and devotion thing that confused me! Thank you for the details! 😊

[@RockR277]

Another aspect of cover that's absent from the tooltip is that it doesn't work at all on instances where both your target and yourself are damaged by the same source, iirc. I'm pretty sure I remember that being the case with raidwides, but I'm not sure about targeted/placed aoes.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Hmm that one is hard because I think it sometimes works and sometimes doesn't. Similar to how certain attacks outright ignore hallowed ground 🤔😊

[@PipPanoma]

The HoT aggro actually killed me once in Shadowbringers (kinda). In the old Castrum Meridianum, it was possible to have a full pack of mobs and trigger a cutscene. Scholar's fairy does not watch cutscenes and generated aggro for me with every heal. Once the cutscene finished I felt the wrath of 10+ mobs and died. This is technically not a HoT, but it is an example where HoT aggro could be relevant.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

I think it still qualifies since to my knowledge embrace also no longer generates enmity now! 😊 Those old msq roulette duties often have had some weird approaches to the pulls! I've genuinely seen many tanks back then that would maybe strike each mob at most with one aoe hit as they ran past, meaning they might not have hit all of them consistently, which easily could lead to the outcome you described!

[@shadowofchaos725]

PLD definitely can't hallowed and cover to null everything. You CAN kitchen sink, hallowed, and cover your cotank if they accidentally used their cooldowns like I did in E2S but that's the extent of that gamer move. It's weird. I've heard about the combo getting patched in the early days of coils but I can't find any footage of people using Cover + Hallowed ground. Maybe even to boomers like me it was a Mandella effect. The only claim I can find is in a gamefaqs thread where they claimed to use it in T4.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Indeed, that's what I also demonstrated in the video 😁 that cover and hallowed ground don't have this feature. I believe the myth comes simply from assuming they don't *not* work with each other without ever checking 😅

[@shadowofchaos725]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh that thread was from 2014. So I KIND of believe them. However I really wished they recorded it lmao

[@Viech54]

HoT enmity: I think I knew this one. Hallowed Ground and Cover is still interesting. This situation came up in Seiryu EX with an FC member just a few hours ago. You know, one of these squishy healers. He got the Forbidden Arts stack marker combined with the vulnerability up debuff caused by Blazing Aramitama (buffs Forbidden Arts, so it gives the debuff), we stacked, he died, I lived and cleared. He died because it targets both healers. If there's only one healer, the healer gets targeted twice and dies from the second hit due to the debuff. If there is no healer (solo), it targets whoever is in the fight twice. This can be survived by stacking mitigations or using an invuln. A DPS is probably just dead regardless. But I digress. Then we did Seiryu EX again. I used Cover and Hallowed Ground on the mechanic. My portion of the stack marker was absorbed by Hallowed Ground and I took the damage for the healer. We both survived. It can still be used to brute force mechanics, just not all of them. Works as intended and as proven in the video. I knew about the revive invuln and how it's removed. Didn't know the rest, don't have any job leveled that can make use of any of that right now. Will hopefully remember it when I play one of these jobs.

[@Nurr0]

Interesting! I almost never come across these testing cases so I enjoy hearing about them.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

I'm glad to hear that! :D Thank you!

[@SakuraShuuichi]

a much easier way to see pet actions not happening instantly is to just go on sch and use fey illumination and wispering dawn as fast as possible the fairy has what looks like a gcd delay between actions, conversely take a sage and use their similar ogcd's to see no delay. I was going to bring up that eos used to be effected by fey illumination because pets were essentially party members and seperate entities but you covered that at the end however i will also mention that pet stats used to be calculated based on the a snapshot of player stats at the time of summoning, ergo you could have a summoner wearing tank accessories to increase the health of titan egi(to a point where titan could have more hp than actual tanks and was easier to heal due to summoner having a % based hot for thier pet and sch lustraite being a % based heal), then swap to their normal dps gear, or to healing accessories to buff the effect of physick essentially turning the smn into a tank(via titan-egi) a dps, and a healer(we used to run dps only dungeons until heavensward, and i was able to solo almost all of the dungeons in arr on summoner using this method iirc the only dungeon i didn;t solo was amdapoor keep due to the bees on the demon wall). This also posed a problem when looking at the potency of abilities, whispering dawn was often called op and the best regen in the game because it had a very high potency it just didn't actually heal for nearly as much as people seemed to think as the fairy stats were 1/2 player stats then 1/3rd player stats then 1/4 player stats give or take before more recently the fairy was changed to not have stats they are just the player stats, and so the fairy potencies were lowered.

[@AkaAkoVT]

The odd part is, I could swear the Cover+Hallowed Ground combo works in The Chrysalis. Though that might just be the people I covered never ran into the meteors during the x10 buff phase.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

You'd also need to be within 10 yalms of them for cover to work, and the meteors rarely spawn that closely to each other! 😊

[@StartouchArts]

I learned last night about the knockback during raise thing last night. Doing P4N for the first time completely blind, died off to the side, got rezzed into his raidwide knockback RIGHT into the instakill spikes lining the arena. I was so miffed. Being able to be knocked back into instant death while invulnerable feels so bad

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

It's even worse if you died to getting knocked into them, and then a healer uses lb3, so you raise up ON THE SPIKES and just immediately flop back down 😅

[@atempolaris]

There's something weird with SMN and the pet using Akh Morn as well.. In Eureka especially (~2.12 gcd) I notice when pressing Enkindle, sometimes Akh Morn would go off 2-3 gcds later than it should. This one I'm not 100% sure about, but sometimes the Akh Morn animation would go off without doing any actual damage.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

If you are running a lot, then sometimes the pet can get a bit confused and that can delay its action. Although I am pretty sure the order should take priority so that does sound weird with the 2-3 GCD delay. The thing about Akh Morns animation going off with zero damage is something we know as Ghosting. It absolutely happened, you didn't see wrong. This happens if the attack occurs as the pet is leaving! I might want to test if running around a lot can cause Bahamut to get really slow with Akh Morn!

[@spacewardtrout6977]

I think the cover/HG combo also makes sense if you read the tooltips very literally. Cover makes you take the damage meant for another party member. HG makes you impervious to most attacks (effectively, not the damage) Your covered party member still takes the attack, not you. You just take their damage from the attack.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

That is a very good point! To be fair on the other end, you can reduce the damage with other damage reduction, so I can understand why it might be weird for some. But invulnerability is different from damage reduction as that sets the value to 0 at the end (or at the start maybe?) rather than actually reducing the damage in the first place!

[@spacewardtrout6977]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh Agreed. I think the trick is that mechanically invulns don't seem to "reduce" the damage from attacks, they interact with the attacks or HP directly. Perhaps more easily seen with WAR and DRK, you still take standard damage you just won't drop below 1.

[@Otael]

Yeah, this was always how I envisioned it so the interaction between the two abilities just made sense to me.

[@luccasummers4317]

Finding out sprint can get rid of things like Transcendent and even Dual Cast blew my mind when I first saw it. Dual Cast is the one that is really mind boggling to me.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

I believe the reason for Dual cast doing this is that it is worded as being canceled by using any action that is not an ability, and sprint uniquely isn't labeled as anything in particular, so it isn't an ability despite mostly working like one! It is very backwards!

[@Nazuiko]

Sprint erasing DC is weird to me for an unusual reason - It doesnt have a cast time! Does Red mage's instant attacks, like melee combo or Engagement, also erase DC? I know Swiftcast is not eaten unless the buff actually applied - i.e., a non-zero cast time being removed. (So you can Swiftcast and consume a Thundercloud proc without losing Swift to use for Fire II, for example, or Swiftcast + Afflatus Solace (confirmation needed)

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

@Nazuiko anything that is not an ability will eat it, including melee combos because they are weaponskills and not abilities 😉 swiftcast is an ability! 😁 Sprint is just weird because it is labeled as nothing, meaning it is technically not an ability! 😅 Edit: and correctly as you say, swiftcast is not consumed by instant actions. But swiftcast does not have the added stipulation that using a non ability removes it 😊

[@SirPawsies]

The real secret to Cover is that it basically checks the player getting hit and passes it on to the PLD That is, the real practicality of cover can be seen if you throw mits at the player getting covered (Intervention, other mits by other players, reprisal) The PLD in our static has saved our NIN from tankbusters that he forgot to stance for by popping everything, Intervention + Covering the NIN and swapping

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

That is an interesting example, but I want to mention that damage reduction on the covered player, does not help the paladin when covering. The attack is redirected wholesale to the paladin as if they took the hit. ^^ Under that notion, it would have been better if the paladin had used holy sheltron instead! Although, still, using Cover on the ninja of course still saved them I imagine!

[@abyssmandaedalus]

Awww. There goes my personal head fantasy of being in T13 and using cover + hallowed to block the flatten + flare breaths.

[@Davey23]

I remember back in ARR putting regen on tanks and they'd take it off so I wouldn't steal aggro. This also was of course back when it took more than 1 aoe to get all aggro back lol.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Oh yeah definitely! I recall it being an issue even in stormblood for some! I think this change would've been more clear if they had changed it back then though! 😂

[@SoundlessSatyr]

I'm really surprised you haven't yet covered the myth that Standard Finish doesn't stack (i.e. that Dancers should not partner each other). It's the most common misinformation I see in game.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

I actually cover this IN MY DANCER GUIDE! 😂 I'll make sure to add it to my list! 😁

[@Zanador]

Wait, that's a myth??? I've heard it dozens of times from dozens of different people so I figured they were correct :(

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

@Zanador not the first or last time you will see myths perpetuated by people who never bothered to check (you know, the whole intro segment of the video and that! 😂) it happens unfortunately! 😕😊

[@laerwen]

This is a good one. Also, some people have the notion that Dance Partner/Closed Position stacks. You would not believe the number of people I see who don't know that it doesn't.

[@yurisenpaii]

I'll pretty regularly get 24mans stacked with dancers (sometimes including me) and the fact that one of them ends up partnering a tank makes me so sad.

[@Nazuiko]

One theory with Whispering Dawn is that the Car-- Selene is not effected by her own buff. Which is less of a theory and more an observation BUT, as it specifies Party members, only *party members* can be effected, and Selene is not included in that list similarly to being effected by other AoE buffs, though I dont know if any relevant ones would apply this way

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Indeed! That could be the case! The problem with testing this is that there are no other buffs applied by pets, and no other buffs that have specifically the same description as fey illumination, so we don't have much in the way of testing it!

[@HeroGuy3]

Conspicuously I believe in pvp the paladin lb applies a buff called "hallowed ground" and guardian applies a buff called "cover" (or maybe it's "covered"?) My favourite myths come from pvp like "using guard halves meteodrive damage", "you can guard on react to [insert "telegraphed" non-drg lb here]" (you actually can guard on react to bahamut but you have to watch the summoner to catch it, if you can see the dragon it's too late) and my favourite "you can survive nin lb by pressing drk lb early into the cast"

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

This is true, but I do believe the hallowed ground from paladin pvp lb has a different icon so they are distinctly different! Meteodrives damage is actually halved by guard, because it does 12K baseline, and removes guard from the target, or if it isn't there, instead does 12K more, so using guard indirectly halves it! 😁 Pet jank is always fun. I believe bahamut queues up megaflare around half a second after it's summoned. So you have nearly no time to react! Similar with the nin lb thing, it's actually about who managed to send their lb to the server first, so this can be nearly impossible to demonstrate in favor of either direction! 😅 Pvp and race (speed) conditions are really awkward in general! 😆

[@HeroGuy3]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh you gotta test the meteodrive damage reduction man I'm telling you guard does nothing The first 12k is dealt in chunks of either 3k or 4k over the course of the animation, and the second 12k is dealt all at once at the end I believe what's going on is it's removing guard before doing anything else

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

@HeroGuy3 ill write it down 😉

[@coaster1235]

I assume the exception is also for most debuff soup mechanics to go through Cover, or is there one it works for? Cover at least transfers the p12s p2 tankbuster debuffs

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

I would imagine things that don't actually deal damage or isn't applied by damage wouldn't get redirected. I imagine debuff soups aren't blocked by hallowed ground, and if that is the case, then they are unrelated to the damage, and so I imagine cover wouldn't work. But yeah, I would imagine there are a selection of exceptions as well so it can be hard to make a clear yes or no on each individual mechanic! 😅 A very good question!

[@IosLocarth]

If I remember correctly, cover specifically works by a resolving the damage and effect of the attack and then transferring it to the Paladin. So if you cover somebody with 16 vulnerability stacks, you're going to hurt big. It's also why I believe the Paladins own mitigations do not lower the damage

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

It is a possibility that vuln stacks on the original target will increase the damage cover transfers, but I know for a fact the damage is reduced by other defensive cooldowns used by the paladin, just not hallowed ground 😊 you can test this yourself with the same method as shown in the video, just replace hallowed ground with any other defensive and you should see the damage be lowered! 😁

[@underdarkness7692]

Let me explain the rationale for avoiding HOTs while pulling pre-6.2. A lot of times in some dungeons enemies would be placed in a way where there was no "good" way to fully pull the pack. So like they weren't clumped properly to be able to use a single AOE, but also if you used provoke and/or a ranged GCD pull if the healer got aggro the mobs could run past you before your GCD was back to cast an AOE (or the pack was too broken up for an AOE to work still etc). Also sometimes the proper way to pull (esp now that HoTs dont generate enmity) is to just plain wait like 1-2 seconds for the pack to get closer while running and then time your AOE to maximize mobs hit while provoking any far away mobs. This was never like a *major* issue, and in many dungeons wasn't one at all just due to enemy placement, but it was just annoying enough that in some dungeons using instants to heal instead was often less chaotic because you could time them so that you could heal when you were sure the tank had more than face aggro, which HOT buffs couldn't let you do since they tick consistently. It wasn't like generally causing wipes or anything, but it seems like Square Enix agreed with me that it was just annoying enough to be worth fixing. I was very happy when I saw it in the patch notes.

[@Derekloffin]

Will say to that 1st myth, when it was a thing, no, it actually was a thing needing to be considered. There are numerous pulls in the game which you must face pull as they summon in or otherwise appear at various positions. Even non-face pulls could be an issue as the mobs may not be easily situated to aoe all of them so the others would aggro on the healer. Usually not a major issue, but could slow the pull down as the tank had to hold back to gather up the strays. If your tank didn't notice this, yeah, it actually could be dangerous as you could be getting slapped around throughout the pull. If you had a particular hard hitting pack that could get the healer killed although that was very rare, although one of the circumstances I saw it happen a fair was in alliance raids where there is more than enough packs to wipe a healer out in the span of a gcd. As long as the tank didn't go nuts, or the other tanks were on the ball, even there wasn't too bad, but having personally tanked the floor due to such, yeah... Generally though, slow down was the biggest issue. Aggro on the dps wasn't as bad as they could control their targets and during the pull they are generally limited to single target damage and even aoe's are usually performed chasing the tank which would include the mobs the tank usually has aggro on and on top of that they'll generally target the main tank's target. The regen buff affects all mobs that are aggroed by comparison so it actually is worse in this respect (at least was). Still, it happened with dps as well. Seen more than a few times where a blm did a quick aoe out of the gates and the tank didn't noticed and said blm was tanking the floor by the time the pull was at the 2nd pack. All that said it isn't a thing anymore and thank god (well, the healer side isn't a thing, a dps pulling aggro still can happen if they try). However, if you, as a healer, want to feel a bit of the old fun, cast your regen the instant the tank gains aggro all the time. Same effect. You'll notice pretty quick how disruptive it can be.

[@fluxwise]

Cae-dono always coming in with those neat fun facts uwu

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

I'm glad you enjoy them! 😊

[@red5robb1]

the amount of times im sprinting with the tank, fairy falls behind then i hit embrace while she is 50 yalms behind is more than i like to admit....i actually miss when the fairy had to catch up for embrace to come out

[@omboxox]

The pet action queueing seems kind of niche at first but if you got good at this as scholar you could massively increase your healing output without losing any dps uptime. Placing the fairy is a free action so even though it would be incredibly tedious you could get twice as many uses of fairy cooldowns over the course of a fight. This would also potentially let you solo heal content that you wouldn't otherwise be able to. Super excited to try this out in some savage/ultimate content.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

I suppose that is true! Every time there is extended downtime for any reason, would be a time where you could queue up something like Whispering Dawn to some extra uses! ^^

[@KanaKuroko]

Moving to you can still supersede automatic actions, it's very easy to test. Just summon Bahamut or Pheonx while moving. Despite the fact that you MUST have a target for them to lock on to and automatically attack, they will not and instead opt to follow you until you stop moving or force the automatic action to the top of the queue by using a damaging move. Extremely annoying given Summoner is the only job that can reverse drift out of Energy Drain's cd on the summon GCD, and then the pet will waste autos following you around during mechancs like Superchain in 12 or the Juries in 11. Despite the fact that they removed literally everything they still can't fix how godawful the demi-summon mechanic is.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Bahamut and Phoenix are actually incredibly weird, because they have 4 Autos in them in total, and they won't attack until you attack something. But if you attack super late in their duration, they can actually fit all 4 auto attacks within around 5 or 6 seconds no problem. They just won't do it if they have plenty of time! You are absolutely right that moving can still mess with the pet, but I imagine this kind of "queued up attacks" make it a lot harder to be sure about the finer details! :/

[@AGrumpyWitch]

Can anyone bust the myth that if you're in a dungeon group with 2 dancers they should dance partner each other? Or should one dance partner the tank? If anyone knows you'll settle some debates I've been in! xD

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

That is actually an interesting question, and I remember there being a lot of discussion about it! I will write that one down 😁 The simple answer I believe is that if the two dancers can make sure they don't use devilment at the same time, then they can partner each other at no loss. So the question is mostly about whether it is better to partner up with tank and healer or something. (I'm pretty sure it isn't, but I have not done the math on this!)

[@AGrumpyWitch]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh The investigation continues!! 🔎

[@laerwen]

As a DNC main I've never heard this. Priority is always melee DPS (especially SAM & RPR) - but I would prioritize another DNC before the tank. I absolutely think this is worth a test though to see what throughput from DNC burst/Devilment actually looks like between jobs.

[@iPlayOnSpica]

The pet responsiveness is still a bit of an issue in dungeons and especially deep dungeons. I'd like for the pet follow to glue the pet to you, and I'd like pet actions to be even more responsive. In these situations, SGE is considered better than SCH.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Indeed, I can imagine the simple fact that the pet is always at least one step behind you in every way can be a problem in situations where things have to happen exactly when you say so! 😅

[@iPlayOnSpica]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh And that's when you're not sprinting. If you sprint, Selene/Eos is in Narnia

[@RockR277]

I've long wished for pets to move like they do in PSO2. In that game, they're glued to your side while not attacking and are very responsive to attack commands, although inputs there occasionally get eaten if you're spamming a button.

[@levikane2143]

Correct me if anyone else sees it otherwise, but the wording of Fey Illumination makes me think it only affects out0going healing, and since the faerie doesn't gain the affect, it does not have increased potency for its own spells.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Indeed, it buffs outgoing healing! And as you say it doesn't receive the buff itself. It gets even weirder since even another players faerie will also fail to buff your faerie, where other raid buffs sometimes can affect her 😅 but you are right in that the initial problem is that the faerie does not get the buff 😊

[@anjoumaaka]

The HoT being placed on me as I go to pull a pack of mobs has still occasionally pulled aggro, but only from mobs I have not hit yet to establish aggro. It is still very annoying when it happens as I then have to chase after them to pull them. Basically, just wait til the tank has fully established aggro

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

This happens if the hot is placed while you are already in combat 😊 if the hot is placed before you enter combat then this is not a problem 😊 I can see why it would be mildly annoying though when it does come up 😅

[@commandguthix]

The things that penetrate transcendence is so inconsistent as well, never really understood it. Stuff like enrages is fair enough, but the seventh umbral era in ucob for some reason goes through it as well, which is one of several damage sources you just need to learn to wait with accepting a raise for.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

This is a very good point, and a big reason why even knowing there is an invuln, waiting for a safe opportunity is always a good idea. And even if you are invulnerable, just in case whatever hits you has some side effect you don't get to ignore, it is always good to try and dodge (just don't sprint! 😂)

[@freeflare6338]

HoTs not pulling agro was changed a bit ago. Initial cast still gets agro, but ticks dont. So just cast it before the first mobs are agroed and fine.

[@VashimuXIV]

To me the tatic of using cover and hallowed ground is only needed when it comes to double tank busters and a poor DPS is about to be blown into next Tuesday. The clips I see of that happening put the dumbest smile on my face. Though Cover really is super niche in general outside of a ton of coordination, so I’ll take what I can get.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Of course combining them like that would make it survivable! 😊

[@VashimuXIV]

@@CaetsuChaijiCh Also as a side note Cae, I’ve started leveling Astro, so I might have to fresh up on my homework with your content once again.

[@SREDISKRAD]

While you're correct that healing enmity is 0.5:1 instead of 1:1 like damage or 10:1 for tanks, that only applies to every point of healing that restores HP, every point of healing that does not restore HP is treat at 1:1 enmity. With the Hallowed Ground/Cover combo, I kinda assumed it'd never work. You can't go invunlerable from damage you volunteered yourself for. You made your bed, now die in it. the pet 30s lines up with combos lasting 30 seconds as well, so, perhaps that's the full length of the cast and combo memory window. The "Invulnerability" window is something that mostly pops up in Savage where if you get ressed, your first priority is always "get to your position before doing anything else" to preserve that 5 second window. Yes we sometimes have to remind people sprint removes the invulnerability but this isn't really as useful as it used to be thanks to Savage leaning into "On person dying kills everyone" that it feels like now

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Sources I can find suggest that overhealing simply doesn't not generate enmity, but still apply at the same 0.5 rate. Regardless, the point is mainly that it is unlikely that healing enmity would ever overtake tank enmity, which would still be true even if it was 1 to 1 😊 The pet timer is quite strange because I've heard players suggesting it used to be possible to do this for much longer, and the combo timer was doubled from 15 to 30 seconds in endwalker! It might be that they overlap by design, but I wonder if it is correlated! 😊

[@Cat_Sidhe]

I wish I could remember what exactly the damage was from but during Barbie EX I finally learned about transcendent not being a complete invuln. Now I just assume that anything can kill me and I'll just wait for a safe time to rez.

[@bl00dm0urne]

If I recall correctly, death walls go through Transcendence (your invulnerability buff) and Barb EX gets a death wall after her ground slam transition (phase 2) of the fight.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

All invulnerabilities, and death prevention have this asterisk of only blocking most damage. Death walls for example will always kill you outright because they are designed as out of bounds. Similarly falling off a ledge will always kill you. A limited amount of actual attacks sometimes also strike through. All hard enrages also strike through. I will say though, that waiting for a safe time to raise is also a good idea just in general!

[@PunkFiddler]

Not to mention that with Rouse, your fairy will have more potent healing than Physick making you more inclined to do damage while it is roused. I really wish Rouse makes a comeback and replaces Seraph. They can even remove Physick out of ACN actions since SMN has no use for it, and if the fates allow, SCH fairy will take care of the raw healing, increasing Embrace potency, while the SCH will focus more on the shielding... again.. removing Seraph. I also wish they would permanently increase the pet's movement speed so it can keep up with us.

[@Setsuraful]

Knockback during rez immunity always catches me out. It seems to specifically be knockbacks that don't do any damage, but I always stand there thinking I immortal for 5 seconds nothing bad is going to happen to me.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Oh that's a classic! And always sucks! 😂

[@tristandebart8201]

Look Ma, I'm on TV (3:30)

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Thank you for the assistance! 🥰

[@RockR277]

Ah I remember when regens generated enmity. It could still be a little annoying during the timeframe between tank enmity change and regen enmity change, if the tick caused the enemies chained to your target to run to your healer before you had a chance to aoe. Not a big deal, but mildly annoying.

[@TaranTatsuuchi]

Huh, I missed the patch notes about regen not adding emnity back at that time...

[@cyphi474]

For some reason, BLM's Umbral Soul(spin) generates enmity. Thats just for curiosity. Beware spinning mages!

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Not surprising, but quite funny! It is very offensive to spin according to enemies apparently!

[@TheFrantic5]

If you're worried about your HoT aggroing the tank, then just stay by the tank, and the AoE will grab the mob. Problem solved.

[@scorpiowarrior7841]

The HG and cover myth was because it's a recent change irrc, as in endwalker recent.

[@thetog]

I have "science'd" this with HoT and this is what occurs... Tank will w2w pull, and think the ranged enmity spell (such as tomahawk) will cover anything they run through packs. My Regen will start peeling off these facetanked, non-AoE aggro'd enemies and I get half the packs pulled. So, yes, HoTs on w2w pulls, with no AoE taunt WILL cause your healer a high chance to get squished. If this were mythbusters, the free use of regen on pulls getting no aggro is debunked. I've been proving this in groups since the 6.2 patch. Situationally, wait for all aggro to be set and AoE before laying down regen and medica group regens.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

The aggro you get from regen here is the buff aggro which was demonstrated in the video 😊 If you apply your regen BEFORE anyone enters combat, you'll notice that the tank using tomahawk on only one mob, will not cause the mobs to come to you 😊

[@medivh1035]

Why do they remove the aggro from heal over time's ticks?

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Who really truly knows! It would've done something noticeable if they did it in stormblood! 😂

[@bl00dm0urne]

Your Hots is so strong that not even the tank could take aggro from you.

[@antizombiepasbeaux]

always though that cover was intended to redirect damage to the paladins while ignoring the paladins own damage reduction be it natural DR or paladins CD. Maybe because I tried the mentioned hallowed ground + cover thingy and saw it didn't work at some point through leveling. But whatever it was, it lead me to think the game just takes the damage dealt to someone and transfers 100% what the cover target was supposed to take anyway. Also, coming on the faery fact of this video. This means that using whispering dawn right after fey illumination has no benefit then? I just tested it quickly and seems like it doesn't affect the healing whatsoever. I feel cheated lmao, I always though those 2 abilities where meant to be used together. that's a great example of something that could take like 1m to test but you'll never try as you just assume it would work the way you first though.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Indeed! Fey Illumination only boosts healing from spells, and since Whispering Dawn isn't a spell, even if it had affected the Faerie, it still wouldn't have worked ^^' But as we see, Fey Illumination isn't even applied to the Faerie so there is no way for her to benefit at all :/ Generally, "Healing Magic Potency" buffs are quite few, but they have in common that only spells are affected ^^' It is REALLY weird to put something like that on a pet!

[@ryanexpert]

Slightly releated, it still surprises me how many people dont take advantage of raise invuln. Seen so many use an action immediately and die before i can spot heal them.

[@Wordsman]

while this only happened to me once, but I was doing a crystal tower run w/ my ninja and ppl started ragging on me for using doton (the aoe dust cloud mudra) on a single target. it wasn't full on hate, but they were calling me out as if I were doing something wrong or cringe. For some reason they didn't listen when I tried to explain there was a dot component but I think maybe they were talking about lvl 90 ninja? idk man if you read the tooltip it literally says it's an 80 potency dot for like 20 seconds. more than double the dmg of a raiton (lightning strike) if it hits for the full duration. EDIT: I was wrong. Thanks Chaiji for helping!

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Placed aoes like doton hits once when you place them, and then leaves a damage over time field for a bit. All damage over time effects hit once every three seconds, meaning the 18 second duration of doton means it hits 6 times after the initial hit. This is a total of 560 potency which is significantly less than raiton. Below level 90, doton is worth using on two or more targets. At level 90, it has to be three or more targets. Single target doton used to be a very small gain before endwalker, but nowadays it is a common (and well known) mistake as ninjas see other ninjas do it and assume it is the right thing to do 😊😅

[@Wordsman]

@CaetsuChaijiCh I could have sworn I learned my version from one of your videos. I don't mean to be accusational because I completely forgot about the weird 3-second tick thing, but I do know I usually teach myself a class via your videos. So, is single target doton ever a good idea at any level? EDIT: ah, I'm guessing the ninja guide I was using was pre-ew then. Well shit, alright. At least I get one less thing to keep uptime on and a few extra raitons now, so I can't complain about a simpler rotation.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

@Wordsman it used to be good in shadowbringers and I have a shadowbringers level 1-50 ninja guide which probably mentions this. But my newest guide will tell you raiton is always better on single target 😊 in endwalker there is no level where single target doton is superior to raiton anymore. 😅 Shadowbringers explanation: in shadowbringers doton hit initially and then 8 times over 24 seconds, for 100 potency each, totalling 900. Raiton did 800 potency at the time, so if every single tick landed, doton could do slightly more! I also made this video a few months ago which also discusses single target doton alongside some other unusual rotation strategies: kzbin.info/www/bejne/iGrcanqFYq-YbKMsi=ilAemsefwtSnFcab I hope this helps!

[@kohlicoide2258]

1. When this is a problem for a tank, pray to the gods that you never have a MCH, SMN or both in your dungeon group.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Yeah exactly! 😂

[@GoldenXShark22]

why do those two apply?

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Because summoner tends to open quite violently with bahamut, and machinist with chainsaw! Both are jobs that are somewhat well known to come out particularly explosively!

[@xierotron]

Was a thing in Stormblood and earlier but Shadowbringers made aggro braindead

[@duranmclemore8667]

I think you grossly misinterpreted the HoT aggro tip. People aren't talking about stealing aggro from mobs the tank has hit, they're talking about mods they haven't. If a tank uses a ranged attack to pull one mob and you place a HoT or shield on the tank all of the other mobs will aggro to you until the tank hits them. This also happens if you place the effects a bit before the tank pulls AN enemy.

[@CaetsuChaijiCh]

Many years ago, it used to be a genuine problem if the healer put hots on the tank before and during pull due to how little enmity the tank generated during pulling. This is where the original claim comes from and what many of these players think of. Indeed, a separate section are thinking of the buff aggro that I brought up as well, but that's a separate detail that can be overcome by the healer standing closer to the tank. And many tank players believe healers are made of cardboard and can't take a few hits, but they sure can! Especially when they expect it 😊