Figuring Out the Buddhist Path: the Five Higher Fetters

[@DougsDharma]

🧡 If you find benefit in my videos, consider supporting the channel by joining us on Patreon and get fun extras like exclusive videos, ad-free audio-only versions, and extensive show notes: www.patreon.com/dougsseculardharma 🙂 📙 You can find my book here: books2read.com/buddhisthandbook

[@Xaloxulu]

One of the things that amazed me while reading the Lotus Sutra a long time ago was how it was written in a way in which I, the reader, was addressed as though I was among the Buddha and bodhisattvas. One connected thing I realized only recently was that similar to the sutras, people like yourself who do videos like these really do spread the dharma to "immeasurable hundreds of thousands of sentient beings". Thank you Doug 🙏

[@DougsDharma]

My pleasure! 🙏😊

[@evelynodonnell2583]

Thanks, Doug, I've been enjoying these videos and learning a lot about Buddhism. I can't help but notice the Buddha really liked his numbered lists! :)

[@DougsDharma]

Oh for sure! I think they were good methods for memorization.

[@dialaskisel5929]

Thank you very much for the video, Doug. It is always a pleasure that helps calm my restless mind.

[@DougsDharma]

Glad to hear it. 🙏😊

[@Madmaxx600]

Wonderful videos Doug. Be well.

[@DougsDharma]

Thanks, you too! 🙏

[@xiaomaozen]

Wonderful video, Doug, thank you! 🐱🙏

[@DougsDharma]

My pleasure! 😄

[@Ghatikara]

12:51 I remember Ajahn Sona's view was that the restlessness in this particular case refers to the tendency of the mind to still move, though very subtly in the Anagami stage

[@DougsDharma]

Yes, I think that makes sense: moving in the direction of subtle wantings.

[@Ghatikara]

@@DougsDharma hmmm I wouldn't say the word wantings because Anagamis have already overcome sense desire

[@dechenpiya304]

Thank you 💖🪷

[@DougsDharma]

You’re welcome 😊

[@fraternitas5117]

5:50 I love how this dhamma basically nukes the christian conception of desiring to be reborn into heaven as the ultimate spiritual goal.

[@DougsDharma]

Well yes, it would have been directed more at the Vedic/Brahminic ideal of rebirth in a heavenly realm.

[@Johnoines]

When I think of the 3 forms of conceit the first thing that comes to mind is high school! I've never personally seen 'restlessness and remorse' very closely related.

[@DougsDharma]

Yes lots of fetters in high school! 😄😄

[@Dharmaku56]

Presently we live in the sense realm which relates to overcoming of the lower first fetters or self obstacles of the sense realm. The overcoming of the higher fetters or self obstacles to final wisdom related deliverance is overcoming fine and immaterial realm self attachment, then to the last self obstacles of underlying self narrative conceit and restlessness tied to a self notion. The final fetter self obstacle has 3 parts of eradicating the drive for desire and existence (becoming), driven by a false and corrupted self referenced identification The four noble truth as wisdom clarification and the Middle Way path guidance is followed and fulfilled to wisdom liberating deliverance and the unshakeable deliverance of mind. Nivana, the unconditioned and unfabricated is penetrated and realized (without self reference or self promotion)

[@anans.9851]

Just like to address one more point concerning the five higher fetters. So far, there is only one sutta mentions that the five higher fetters could conclude into only two higher fetters including; “upapattipaṭilābhiyāni saṃyojanāni” and “bhavapaṭilābhiyāni saṃyojanāni”. As a result, the lower five fetters together with the two higher fetters, just said, enable to separate four groups of noble people consist of “Sakadāgāmissa”, “Uddhaṃsotassa akaniṭṭhagāmino”, “Antarāparinibbāyissa” and “Arahato”.

[@DougsDharma]

Which sutta are you referring to? 🙏

[@anans.9851]

@@DougsDharma It’s from Tipitaka (Roman Scrip) book number 20 page 66 sutta number 131. Anyway, I am not sure if the Tipitaka I studying is the same as yours.

[@AUTOMOTATE]

Out of curiosity as I'm new to understanding Buddhism, does Buddhism itself have a singular goal? Is there something a Buddhist aims themselves to achieve through it externally or internally? Really enjoying the channel definitely going to be listening to the podcast before work. 😁

[@DougsDharma]

Buddhism is a very large and complex belief system, so there are many different aims depending on the different schools or practices one follows. In the early tradition however the aim is the attainment of enlightenment, which is the complete ending of greed, hatred, and delusion through the ending of craving. All of this is encompassed in the Four Noble Truths. I've done videos on these subjects, they might be useful to you! 😊

[@AUTOMOTATE]

@@DougsDharma thanks that's really clarified it, I'll check out these videos. 😁

[@Wanderer2035]

Yes Buddhism is very complex, but in an ultimate sense the main goal is the ending of your suffering. Enlightenment is when you become your true self. Your true self is the self that is absent of all the layers put on to you by society, these layers are different forms of conditioning, attachments, emotional baggage, negative tendencies, other manifestations of the ego. At enlightenment you essentially become the IAM, the higher self, the higher self is no longer a part of you any more, you are now the higher self at this point. The uncorrupted part of you now becomes you as a whole. This is when all your suffering ends, and now when the physical body dies, your completely free to do what you want. Your no longer bounded by the chains of reincarnation. You can still reincarnate, but now you have the freedom to choose.

[@midooley543]

What’s your Myers Briggs type?

[@rafaelecattonar1506]

Hallo. I have one question. Maybe I've already asked. In that case I say sorry for not remembering your answer. Anyway, I decided practice Zen meditation. Are Zen and Buddhist meditation in general helpful to those who suffer epilepsy? Thanks for your answer.

[@DougsDharma]

I would expect they might be helpful in dealing with the emotional effects of epilepsy, but you might want to seek out professional guidance from a trained meditation teacher near you. 🙏

[@Xaloxulu]

You've probably heard about the effectiveness of the ketogenic diet in regulating epilepsy, but then you probably also know how restrictive and complicated it is. I do not suffer from epilepsy but I noticed, after being keto for a month, that a similar state is induced by trying to limit insulin spikes after meals. The methods I employed came from a researcher known on the internet as Glucose Goddess and boil down to three relatively simple dietary "hacks": 1) Drink about 15g of vinegar diluted in water before meals 2) If possible eat foods during a meal in this order: fats, then proteins, then carbohydrates 3) Up to an hour and a half after a meal engage in some form of 10 minute exercise (walking, yoga... it doesn't have to be intense) Of course, nurturing a healthy attitude towards food and having discipline in our food choices are a basis for any further "hacking". Wishing you all the best in your spiritual and health adventures 🙏

[@rafaelecattonar1506]

Thank you both 🔥🔥🔥👍🏻

[@normalizedaudio2481]

High master gives a guy like this a real hard time. My friend is caught in one of these deep states. We stay with the friend. This is tough one for people in cultivation. OK, I'm not listening.

[@k.k.2749]

If ignorance is the origin of suffering as mentioned in the video and is so important, why is it not mentioned in the second noble truth together with craving, which so clearly states what is the origin of suffering? The first sermon is supposed to be the most important one where the Buddha presents his fundamental teachings. Is there some reason that it got left out?

[@DougsDharma]

This is one question people ask. There are two accounts of the origin of suffering, one in the Noble Truths and another in the 12-link chain of dependent origination.

[@Ash-so2sr]

No audio?

[@DougsDharma]

Audio should be working!

[@Ash-so2sr]

​@@DougsDharma thanks

[@luizr.5599]

I believe these concepts are interesting as history of Buddhist thought, but not actually useful for irreligious meditation.

[@Tridib_Tinkel]

A video about the Research by Ian Stevenson on rebirth, please.

[@Wanderer2035]

Wait, you can be reincarnated into Heaven? I always thought if you reincarnate, it’s always going to automatically be in the physical world.

[@DougsDharma]

Well it’s traditionally believed that one can be reborn in heaven or hell realms. They are all only temporary however.

[@saralamuni]

Be careful not to abandon all ten fetters before developing great compassion. Otherwise you will be come an arahant and disappear from existence. Weary of samsara and attached to nirvana; only a Buddha will be able to release you from your spiritual coma. Therefore make the determination here and now: I will never abandon all sentient beings!

[@emperorpalpatine9841]

Being an arahant is the goal of the Buddha’s teachings, and they don’t disappear from existence anymore than a person who wakes up from a dream disappears to the characters in the dream.

[@saralamuni]

@@emperorpalpatine9841 and then what?

[@saralamuni]

@siyovaxshen-sipad-zid-ana2432 Is hell empty? Have all beings perfected the ten pāramitās and attained anuttara-samyak-sambodhi? I don't think so; I can see the cries of the world!

[@saralamuni]

@siyovaxshen-sipad-zid-ana2432 that is called an arrival fallacy. What about everyone else? Will you leave them behind to suffer in samsara?

[@Ash-so2sr]

As a secular bhuddist I don't even understand the goal of enlightenment. I see no objective way to assert one is or isn't "enlightened". When I think of enlightenment the only comparison would be to epicurean ataraxia, which was peace of body and mind and as a point of view which permeates all our experiences but it wasn't something beyond daily life or that could protect us from physical pain, Mainly a way of understanding the nature of pain to be able to endure it better, a wisdom practice . But all is temporary. Even peaceful states . When one dies all ends, and that's fine too. If death is the end of individual mind then enlightenment becomes secondary, the main goal being living a life of compassion and as free of suffering as ethically possible.

[@DougsDharma]

Yes, it's similar to ataraxia. In the early tradition, it's understood as the complete ending of greed, hatred, and delusion.

[@Ash-so2sr]

@@DougsDharma to you and according to bhuddism is it actually attainable or is it another ever moving goal post? like Is it an ideal to strive for or is a measurable state of mind ? Is there a way to know who is enlighten?

[@Xaloxulu]

​@@Ash-so2sr If you don't mind me using a Christian analogy, God being infinite means that as we grow more and more divinized there is always infinitely more we can experience and attain. I'd say nirvana is similar, different buddhist schools have had different criteria for assessing if someone had attained it, but you always find that enlightened masters continue with their moral, meditative and contemplative training even after being assessed as accomplishing enlightenment. Since you described yourself as secular, there are ways we have scientifically verified differences between lay people and experienced meditators (brain scans for example). If you are interested in modern, secular people who claim enlightenment and teach about attaining it you can check out Shinzen Young, Daniel Ingram and Frank Yang. If you want an even more secular and scientific framework from someone who does not claim such an accomplishment you can check out the work of cognitive scientist John Vervaeke. Wishing you all the best in your journey to ataraxia!

[@Ash-so2sr]

@@Xaloxulu appreciate it, yeah I think that Christian analogy is very on point, the infinite whether it's called God or nirvana for the believer will always procure a higher degree of knowledge or experience to be attained. Yes I'm a secular, so I really appreciate those names you mentioned I will go through them as far as their claim to be enlightened it's obviously for a secular like me suspicious but interesting to examine. As far as certain brain activity being taken as enlightenment I honestly cannot buy that, in this sense, monks are secluded, how easy it is no to harm in seclusion? , how practical not to be stressed if you don't work a salaried Job, if you don't have family, bills and worries...even the greatest seclusion in fact cannot make one not responsible for the state of things for all, bhuddism vs social change is one fo the topics I like to investigate, how can bhuddism be included into a political or social program, the monastic life to me is a shunning of the life of the masses, and if bhuddism is useful it should be useful to the masses, but I'm getting out of topic, there are some very interesting bhuddist teachers with a very clear political and social commitment to change, there is one I enjoy hearing from Mexico, originally she was from new York that does often exposes the duty bhuddist should have o political change for the benefit of people, their channel is called "face buda", As well I'll check the other authors you mention too, thank you!

[@Xaloxulu]

@@Ash-so2sr Your welcome and likewise, thanks! Well, your question concerning seclusion, stress and social involvement is interesting and important. I guess one way to tie it all together is to maybe see these monks as socially involved by really delving into the moral, meditative and contemplative practice to such a level that they are able to impart knowledge and instructions more thoroughly and easily to people in their community who lead a more turbulent life and do not have the time, peace and resources do so themselves. It's quite similar if not the same to Christian monks and saints who were examples and guides to communities, or theologians who had the intelligence, time and devotion to think through aspects of God and reality which we do not have the resources to. To briefly touch upon your brain activity comment with an anecdote I remember Ingram talking about, which concerned him baffling some neuroscientists with the speed at which he could detect subliminal visual cues which got to such a frame rate that they were surprised a human could still guess correctly much above the rate of probability, if not (almost) completely accurately, can't remember exactly though. There is much more research that has been done though, I know a former highly accomplished molecular biologist became a Tibetan monk at some point and was involved in many of these studies (google Matthieu Ricard).