Fire Emblem's Intriguing Case of Crimson Flower Dimitri

In Fire Emblem Three Houses, Dimitri was almost an entirely different person in Edelgard's Crimson Flower route, sparking enough intrigue for me to briefly discuss the differences between him and the Savage Boar variant of the Azure Moon, Verdant Wind, and Silver Snow routes. Thanks for listening, and do consider liking the video if you enjoy this type of content. It'll support this channel, and I'd greatly appreciate that!
Below is the list of music used in the background (in order that it was played), for those who may ask:
Limes ~ Blase
Mega Man 4 Complete Works OST - Skull Man's Theme
Limes ~ Selfless
#fireemblem #dimitri #threehouses

[@viranevaloni]

It's a bit sad how the most traumatized version of Dimitri is the only one that can get a "happy" ending, but still, It's so interesting at the same time how different he can be written just by changing 1 thing 😮

[@maverick5169]

Dimitri is still bloodlusty even if he doesn't get kidnapped by Cornelia, CF just didn't show it properly. Felix is a pretty reliable narrator, considering that not only Dimitri does not deny his accusations in their C support, but in their A support, he tells Felix to stop bothering with obvious question: he is both a friendly man and a wild animal that wants to kill. There is a pretty cool detail in Three Hopes about his true nature, whenever you defeat a lot of enemeis, your character smiles. If you defeat many enemies with Dimitri, he has a cruel smirk and he only has that during battle, never in cutscenes. It's an exclusive thing for when you play as him. I seriously recommend checking Hopes out when you have the chance, it explains so many things that 3 houses didn't, it's much more than just a spin off.

[@trulymrword]

CF Dimitri: "We just want to defend our home, leave us alone!" Everyone else: "You monster, kill him!" AM Dimitri: "Kill every last one of them!" Everyone else: "It's ok, we know that there's still that kind king deep inside of you."

[@rainyday9174]

Cornelias line in 3Hopes about how she should have tied Dimitri up with chains and gouged out his eye's makes me think she's responsible for the eye patch

[@UnlimitedMrX]

When the world needed him most, he returned I always thought that Cornelia's coup, and Dedue's supposed death was the catalyst for what made him go full boar mode. But you've definitely put it in perspective in a way that I could never put into words. The eyepatch metaphor is also something I never thought of, but makes too much sense in hindsight. And yes, I'd love to see the Dedue character analysis as well.

[@FlautistAcacia]

My understanding was that Dimitri didn't go full murder hobo since he wasn't framed for his uncle's assassination and isolated for five years, and instead had to be king and have authority. I do agree that CF has a lot more "tell" than "show". It does hurt a lot that his most well-adjusted ending is after all the trauma 😢 This was a super interesting video ❤❤ I'd love to see how you'd talk about his "arc" in Hopes at some point!

[@LordZemosa]

I'm an outlier, but I'm actually enjoying the resurgence of Three Houses popularity and content atm. The toxic banter seems to have been left behind from when the game first peaked. A few years later now, it feels like everyone's looking at it from fresher and more unbiased perspectives, and not getting themselves personally and morally involved with the narrative disagreements anymore.

[@CainMagnus]

Yeah, I think the discourse died down mainly due to how many newcomers 3H attracted. Many of these people who contributed to the toxicity have likely just moved onto other games by now, so the more dedicated fans of the franchise are now just looking back on it and acknowledging what it was. I find it very comfortable to make Fire Emblem videos when these games have some age on them. Because a lot of the crazy peeps aren't around to kill the mood, lol

[@TheGamersState]

You know what I think would have been a great twist that makes Crimson Flower way better? A twist where Dimitri is actually able to be convinced Edelgard's methods are the right way forward. Even Seteth in the Crimson Flower route flat out admits to Byleth that he cannot support Rhea's current course and if the empire wins he will leave Fodlan in Byleth's hands. If someone so loyal to the church as Seteth, even to the point of basically being the 2nd in command, can see how badly Rhea's choices are getting, I fail to see how Dimitri and the Kingdom couldn't see it either especially since Dimitri has a much more stable head in this route.

[@CainMagnus]

That's a bit tricky, as I don't think it's as straightforward as that. Seteth's remarks were more towards no longer being able to stomach Rhea's deteriorated sanity; that her judgment was too clouded in her unhinged rage to make better decisions for Fodlan. He still didn't see eye-to-eye with Edelgard's ideals even until the end. Given Byleth proved themselves to him in White Clouds, they were the only one he could really trust at that point, since Rhea went too far off the deep end. Had Byleth not been on Edelgard's side, I don't think he'd see any right with an Adrestian-controlled future, since Edelgard wouldn't have the guidance of someone he trusted. Had Seteth truly felt any sort right in Edelgard's path, he'd have joined Byleth instead of leaving. He was just trusting them to make the best of what he probably considered the worst case scenario for Fodlan. He and Flayn's last conversation before their map began showed that they certainly didn't hold Edelgard in any positive light, perplexed with why Byleth chose to fight for her. And that's one of Crimson Flower's strengths. It stays true to Three Houses's main theme, despite its flaws. Even though Edelgard and her faction believe they're right, most of her foes are genuinely good people; those who tried to fight for their own ideals that clashed with hers. Dimitri realistically would never side with Edelgard, for their visions of the ideal Fodlan are too radically different. Their fruitless debate before the Azure Moon finale supports this. Characters like Seteth are amazingly impactful because they show how much of a gray zone Fodlan is; that so many people have varying morals on what's considered right or wrong. It mirrors how divided our own world is on social and political issues, and how we can never meet together in the middle on problems.

[@TheGamersState]

@@CainMagnus Yeah that's a fair argument. Actually; Follow-Up question, Would you say Azure Gleam Dimitri is pretty close to Crimson Flower Dimitri?

[@CainMagnus]

Honestly, I dunno. I'm dragging my feet with playing Hopes. I know very little of what the game presented outside of some spoilers that I couldn't avoid.

[@TheGamersState]

@@CainMagnus You really should give the game a shot, not just because the gameplay is fun but also for the music. Some of the remixes are arguably better than their original counter-parts. Of course there's also the story which I think is interesting because it seems to be hit-and-miss and it's interesting hearing people's opinions about it.

[@shizachan8421]

@@CainMagnus The game is super fun but you really, really should play Black Eagles and Golden Deer first. Blue Lions is...not great in this game.

[@nicoloenricorimoldi7425]

I think that line about Dimitri non t caring about a fair fight is corroborated by the fact that both him and Rhea agree on a strategy but then secretly plan to fight differently, betraying each other in a way. (Dimitri hopes that Edlegard will attack the Church forces first while Rhea orders one of her soldiers to search the road for Fhirdiad and attack if they find the Empire’s forces, only following the plan if the Kingdom will have already engaged) A thing I find interesting is that unlike what Hubert says, it’s Dedue that chooses to use any means possible and transforms kingdom forces into demonic beasts, while Dimitri maintains his values and is horrified by the idea.

[@duyanhpham9227]

Seiros not reacting to Dedue and some Faerghus schmucks swallowing crest stones and turning into some dandy beasts when she lost her shit when Edelgard tried to yoink them in the holy tomb back at the monastery will forever confuse me.

[@hilgigas09]

@@duyanhpham9227 I think it's the difference between watching someone abuse painkillers and having someone rummage through your medicine cabinet.

[@duyanhpham9227]

@@hilgigas09 thats actually a really good analogy but for some reason Seiros thinks she has a monopoly on all the painkillers

[@mray4784]

@@duyanhpham9227 Beacuse they're her family?

[@hansgretl1787]

Dimittis eyepatch also serves to represent asymetry. You might have seen this in other media as well, think Zuko from Avatar. A character struggling between their darker impulses and their own sense of morality, or even just a character with a good and an evil side can be represented with an asymetrical facial design to represent it. This is even played with in the cinematography of some cutscenes, like the Azure Moon ginal cutscene. For example, when he stabs Edelgard, his working eye is covered by his hair. For one, he doesn't want to see her dying, but it also shows how his compassionate side couldn't win out in the end and he had no choice but to kill her. I could talk about that cutscene for hours and if I ever make a video essay, it would be on that, so please don't steal my idea😢

[@hilgigas09]

CF glosses over the part where Ft. Mercius is a smoking crater. As far as Dimitri knows Adrestia took the fortress then nuked it, POWs included, to make a statement. The fact that he wasn't frothing with rage says a lot about his composure.

[@DKKing-pu2fq]

People really downplay or gloss over the effect the 5 years of solitude after the coup had on Dimitri. People always focus on the coup itself or Edelgard’s reveal as the flame emperor. Let me put it like this, people who are in prison when they are put in solitary confinement for weeks, months, or even years it causes people to go insane or to be completely lost in dark thoughts. Now put someone like Dimitri who has severe PTSD, found out his stepsister/old friend is the Flame Emperor, and just lost his kingdom and presumably lost best friend as well in a coup and you put him on the run alone in solidarity with his own thoughts with no support system. That’s gonna cause even the strongest people to become insane, have extreme paranoia, suicidal thoughts/tendencies, schizophrenia, depression, antisocial, and other mentally illnesses. In crimson flower, the coup never happens, he is never put on the run and in solitude, and he has his support system Dedue, blue lions, the church, rodrigue, and Gilbert there to support him. Yes he still deals with episodes of PTSD and wanting vengeance like he was in white clouds but since he’s never put on the run and in solitude his mind hasn’t completely snapped like it does in 3/4 routes.

[@rhettmitchell]

7:26 I think crazy Rhea in CF makes a lot of sense just like how insane Dimitri works in AM. She just didn’t get as much screen time, of course. Her trauma has been festering for over 1000 years and she never fully dealt with it. When she thought she finally had her mother back, she was betrayed. Her completely losing her family, including Seteth/Flayn dying/leaving, makes her actions very much believable in CF. Also some of the best parts of the game for me are Cherami Leigh absolutely going off as Rhea

[@CainMagnus]

The problem isn't with Rhea herself or her craziness, but rather, the flawed execution and skewed narrative Crimson Flower pushed against her (mainly because of how incomplete it is). A lot of Edelgard's points against her and the church were half truths and falsehoods passed down through her ancestry (something CF didn't bother to challenge when revelations in Verdant Wind had hard counters for them). While misinformation is fine for the sake of the story's conflict, it causes those (the players) who don't feel like playing any other route to not feel entirely enticed to seek out other routes for the full picture. It's why Rhea gets a lot of unjust hatred in the community (even ignoring the general discourse, as even people who didn't like Edelgard viewed Rhea as objectively evil), as CF didn't do a good enough job to hint at any nuance in Rhea's insanity. Thus, leaving a lot of players to misunderstand why she went nuts because of the skewed narrative. When the game's major theme promotes the idea how much of a gray zone Fodlan is, CF, despite being the one route that best showed the morally gray landscape, did the church completely dirty. Dimitri, despite being a lunatic himself, hadn't been painted as a blatant villain like Rhea was. Even with CF's inaccurate portrayal of him, the subtext in his writing still made it clear enough that his fall from grace wasn't rooted in any malicious intent, and that the kingdom itself wasn't an evil domain - something Rhea and the church didn't have the benefit of. It's why those who started with CF gave AM a chance; because the dialogue never tried to push that Dimitri and the kingdom were inherently evil, and it made them curious to what was going on with them. It's also why despite knowing the truth behind what actually happened to the Nabateans in VW, many to this day still disregard the truth because of how CF didn't provide enough scenes that challenged the information Edelgard fed Byleth about the church. Which, the bias of Edelgard's route carries over and not allow them to understand where Rhea comes from. So, when Rhea goes crazy, there's nothing in CF to at least suggest that her madness stemmed from somewhere else. With how the Agarthans are the true villains, CF's narrative puts Rhea in an unfair position to be treated as an evil akin to them, when the point of 3H's war was to show that every faction had their reasons for doing what they did. TL; DR That's why I phrased myself as "they depicted her a million times worse than she actually was." Not as a way to say crazy Rhea didn't make sense (because she IS crazy with some skeletons in her closet), but that CF heavily pushed the narrative in Edelgard's favor in order to give the player someone to strictly root against as the "true evil of Fodlan." It really just came off as us beating up an old crazy grandma with untreated trauma, which does a huge disservice to her arc.

[@AvaliciousV]

Say what you will about Crimson Flower, but it's by far the most unique route when it comes to the "political situation" of Fódlan. And I really appreciate how logically it's all set up too: Since Edelgard has the Black Eagle Strike Force, Thales isn't at the front lines at Garreg Mach (neither are Demonic Beasts), which means Rhea doesn't get captured, which leads to her fleeing to the kingdom, where her presence saves Dimitri from Cornelia's coup. About Dimitri's "calm" manner; I almost appreciate it that he is kinda subverted to what we hear about him, it makes the whole "gray morality" part of CF stick out a bit more (as it should have been even more). Also, if we ever get a definitive edition of 3H, and CF gets actually properly finished, I hope they give Dimitri a new portrait/outfit, even if it's just an edited version of the 3Hopes one, since i feel like his unkempt appearance in CF is kinda unfitting. (maybe Dedue too, with less scars). All in all it's really interesting seeing Dimitri deal with his inner demons in different ways, depending on the route, and it's definitely a favorite aspect of the game for me.

[@shizachan8421]

I would say CF is the only route that is actually interested into the whole three way war. The other routes always sideline the non-Edelgard NPC Lord hard because they fundamentally follow Silver Snows plot structure which is about the church resistance vs the empire. Its also the worst route tbh, so 3 out of 4 routes are build on an inheritly broken fundament. In VW and SS, Dimitri just dies charging into the battle field after Gonder field, which doesn't do anything for the story and only exists for the trailer. Dimitri is immediately just killed and Claude just vanishes in SS and becomes a subservient Damsel who hands over Leicester and his heroes relic to Dimitri in AM. CF is not only the only route that actually deals with the greyness of the story but also has any respect for most of its cast. Claude is for the first time truly shown to be the master tactician, Dimitri gets to display nuances between boar and savior king and Rhea gets to be the terrifying villain she was hinted at from the start to be instead of some damsel in distress.

[@AvaliciousV]

@@shizachan8421 hmm... i definitely agree about Claude's part in the story; he definitely just serves as a "third section" excuse and is otherwise a lore dump exposition character, even in his own route (something i chalk up to the split of VW & SS). I definitely wish they had a bigger role for him, with interesting motivations. While i haven't played Golden Wildfire yet, 3Hopes at least addresses one of my bigger issues with Edelgard attacking the Alliance even though her and Claude have similar motivations. And while i see where you're coming from with Dimitri, I have to disagree; AM is all about him and his mental struggles, and while his fate is somewhat random in VW/SS, it really highlights the difference Byleth makes on him in AZ; Something I really appreciate was the Ghost scene in SS, highlighting the dark outcome of SS.

[@shizachan8421]

@@AvaliciousV I feel like CF also helps making it more clear why the conflict between Edelgard and Claude just works. They have similar ambitions, but they are also overall very ambitious. They are good but they are not righteous, so they end up competing for who gets to be on the top of the world. Claude is also generally the strongest he ever was in during Hopes. Really I would say as much as people hate on him being more grey there, he benefits the most from the extra time to rule and establish himself. And the issue is, you are right when it comes to the broader picture, but when it comes to the narrative at hand, there is no reason for why you should care about Dimitri dying there, at best it serves you well to see the kingdom collapse for VW. In SS the ghost scene is also just kinda...weird? It feels forced, as if to artificially inflate Dimitris importance because he just isn't important for SS and never had any connection to Bylet there. CF works because the route itself gives each of the Lords a moment to shine and firmly establishes in which relation they stand to Edelgard and what their overall role is. Claude being much more of a rival than a Foe who had his own ambition to be on the apex of the world, so to speak, and who accepts Edelgards claim on the top after her victory over him while Dimitri is a direct foil to Edelgard and shows the manipulations of Thales and Rhea and how similar both of them actually are. He is a good man ruined by the absurd world Edelgard challenges. Which is also a reason why I don't appreciate AM much. the Blue Lions and Dimitri are among the most negatively affected by the Status Quo, yet outside of Sylvain in all of his endings, Azure Moon never has them change the world much. Edelgard just rips apart the old system as it existed and creats a whole new world. Claude rips down the barriers between cultures and nations. Dimitri...randomly invents democracy without any hint, because he has nothing that feels logical to offer.

[@shizachan8421]

@@AvaliciousV What I want to add is, what I mean with it is generally how the game does not give you any reason to care in the slightest about Dimitri and his fate in Verdant Wind and Silver Snow. I get your argument of the contrast with AM, but the issue is that this also works with Claude, saying that the contrast Claudes plot offers is how in Verdant Wind, he finally comes to dedicating himself to stand his ground and risk everything for his believes, instead of saving his own ass when its convenient. The issue is that this requires having played their routes first. I played Crimson Flower first, so I didn't really care much about Dimitri and his struggles beforehand, because I didn't knew the character at all. Crimson Flower managed to make me care and be interested in his character, something I don't think Silver Snow or Verdant Wind could have done. Silver Snow is more cringe in the way it tries to force a connection to Dimitri.

[@spencerblais2539]

Thanks for the breakdown, Magnus! Glad to see you back. Despite CF being one of my least favorite routes in Three Houses, seeing this angle of Patchless Dimitri with your analysis makes me better appreciate and understand the strange story beats this route took. If Three Houses ever does get a Remastered treatment in the future, I'd love to see CF get expanded upon to make it stand out much more; a Director's Cut if you will. And shoutouts to Analog Vernacular as well as a longtime friend of mine. He was the guy who helped me get back into Fire Emblem and my friend (Who will remain anonymous) for steering me in this direction, as she and I were getting burnt out on another series before this. EDIT: Yes, I'd love to see a Dedue analysis too. The guy deserves way more credit than he's given.

[@spreadhappiness3250]

The rhea thing was truly ridiculous so I get your annoyance

[@KillSwitch-360]

This was one of the biggest questions I had when I first played CF I was like "What the hell happened to my boy?" (I liked dark Dimitri. It was the dark inside hinted in the early game) Thanks for sorting this out

[@jefffan1992]

Honestly I played through the 4 routes and as far as the stories go I took the 3 leader student paths as each student's take of the war. In this context Edelgard sees Rhea as a monster do to her ideals for a merit system over the crest system clashing with one another. Edelgard does have a good bond with Dimitri as well so it's only natural that she would paint him in a positive light perhaps letting him conquer his demons earlier. As for Claude he isn't blind to Dimitri's shifts and views them as a toxic trait that will end with Dimitri dying off in a pointless way. As for Dimitri he agrees more with Claude's take on it but because he hates himself his take of the story of it makes him worse but has the flip side is he can shake it in the end, also he sees Edelgard as a overly ambitious leader that will take things too far and cease being human to reach her goals. As for their view of Claude he is pretty chill for them. As for the other characters supporting in the story, I took it as a pick a reason to side with this person in each route. With that in mind Dimitri is a feral beast of a leader would be Felix's reason to pick up arms against Dimitri. This isn't cannon clearly but it's the only thing that makes sense to me.

[@comfyareadbhar]

Dimitri's portrayal in CF showcases the weak writing of the route. That line where Hubert implies that Dimitri doesn't fight 'fair' anymore is mostly used to balance our questionable actions as an invading army in CF. Unlike AM which portrays Edelgard at her best (we can see a nuance perspective of her arguments and reasoning for the war, we also get to see a more humane side of her through Dimitri's recollections) CF portrays a Dimitri destitute of everything that makes him a compelling character, he becomes a 'plot device' whose only purpose is to aid the flimsy narrative. Having said that, CF gave us some of the best Dimitri/Dedue interactions, so I guess I cannot be too offended.

[@thiago292]

Crimson Flower just needed to drop the pretenses and embrace Edelgard as the game's antagonist and let us play AS the antagonist, instead of trying to justify every single one of her actions at every turn and portraying the people who are literally defending themselves as somehow evil lol

[@TeddieSage1987]

I am curious how you'd compare Three Houses' Dimitri with his Three Hopes versions.

[@CainMagnus]

I haven't played Hopes yet, outside of its demo. Kinda dragging my feet with it tbh. Whenever I do finally get around to it, I plan to make a few videos on it.

[@ja-melvinson7994]

Okay but Dimitri not having the eyepatch also felt weird to me too. Though I’m pretty sure I have another (admittedly pretty obvious) reason why he’s more hinged in CF and it ties in with why Edelgard becomes the Hegemon: no Byleth. Byleth is an exceptionally charismatic person and no one really doesn’t like her after spending at least a little bit of time with her. The students all have their issues and when Byleth is leading their specific house, all that guidance and charisma really does steer them right. So much so that when Byleth “dies”, the lords just…break. I know there are other circumstances at play for Hegemon Edelgard (which I argue CF should’ve tried hinting at making a thing and had Byleth just pull El out of) and Boar Dimitri but all of it is predicated on Byleth’s existence specifically.

[@SniperYanda]

Yuri has a line somewhere that I thought was in this route, where he talks about towns on the frontlines of the war get liberated overnight by a single man, only for them to find out it's their own king doing it, which was another reason he was called the Tempest King.

[@JaiDjangoSX]

I'd love to see a dedue video, my brain cannot analyze text and diolauge well, these videos help so much for understanding charectors and game stories.

[@TheSqueakerNerd]

Dang, I almost got jumpscared when I saw Dimitris face. I've never seen him without his eye patch. I haven't gotten to his game just yet so that's funny.

[@avastarb0b]

I would love to see a video on Dedue.

[@duyanhpham9227]

Honestly when played three houses for the first time Dimitri felt a little meh during white clouds and only when he became a pirate I was intrigued enough

[@DJJD-sl6kc]

My personal belief is that Dimitri only went insane when seeing Edelgard in her Flame Emperor armour. CF is the only route where Edelgard doesn't wear her armour. AM is very obvious for when Dimitri saw her. In the other two routes, she storms Garreg Mach in the armour, without the faceplate. Thus allowing Dimitri to see her in the armour of his father's killer and lose it. Without ever seeing Edelgard in the armour, Dimitri can never fully lose his sanity. The ghosts of his past would only to him to kill Edlegard based on suspision, not confirmation causing him less of that full bloodlust. He would still be looking for his father's killer in CF. That has always been my headcanon.

[@shizachan8421]

I personally feel like its probably due to Rhea keeping him focussed. Like Dimitri has certainly the boar boiling inside of him and he is primarily motivated by vengeance. In fact, CF shows that Dimitri would have joined the war even if Cornelia doesn't stages a coup against him. Its very obvious in the route that Rhea tries to use Dimitri has a pawn to get at Byleth, especially with her just outright sacrificing him at the end of Tailtean.

[@scitails]

I remain convinced CF should've been DLC. It would've given them more time to work on it and feel less rushed. It also would make sense as it is the most different and the only "hidden" route. The base game also does a terrible job of making Edelgard vs the church a real morally gray debate. Cindered Shadows tries to make up for this by adding a bunch more shady stuff about the church in the supplementary lore to make it seem worse, but it feels so forced at that point. If they had just let Edelgard be the antagonist in the base game, they wouldn't have had to write in half-hearted attempts to make her seem like a protagonist or make the church "bad" in White Clouds, which honestly are much less enjoyable than the stellar bittersweet cutscenes after the time skip and in the throne room on SS. The base game already had to juggle three routes and the contrasts between three nations. Adding another contrast between Edelgard and Rhea was just too much for them to handle well. Especially since Rhea isn't even playable on SS. Luckily, Three Hopes does Edelgard a lot better, and Scarlet Blaze is easily the best route in that game, compared to CF being IMO the worst in Three Houses.