Fire Emblem: The Sacred Stones - Seth vs Orson

Fire Emblem 8: When you use Seth to attack Orson after Orson has turned traitor.
I find Seth's words to be inspiring.

[@berserkberserker]

"Sir Orson.... Prepare yourself." FOR NINE DAMAGE

[@drevniysamurai]

But NINE vs ZERO)

[@lancelotstny4376]

Well. His equipment is shit.

[@Jang7457.]

Even with an iron sword seth can kill Orson with Spear, because if he can double which he can, the next hit would be a crit

[@jermainemalloy6341]

This was like a dream fight right here, both were practically untouchable when you played as them and could obliterate any enemy with ease, so it ofcourse made me wonder how a duel between them would play out.

[@monika-il3hw]

Yes but Iron sword... Because seth is a chad, he don't want to humiliate and one shot is ennemy

[@Lunchbucket192]

"It is my charge. It is my hope. Sir Orson...prepare yourself." Fantastically written dialogue right there. Seth is such a good character

[@diegoramirezbrenes6389]

Lunchbucket Like if you wanted to kill Orson with Kyle/Forde but you just couldn't :v

[@diegoramirezbrenes6389]

And finally killed him with Ephraim and a Killer Lance

[@GrumpyOrangeCat]

I killed him with Ephraim using reginleif, soooo.

[@KyzaSangre]

seth only vs orson

[@byronvonedmund]

Hey another Robin pfp enjoyer

[@AGJ117]

It's still disturbing how it's hinted that Orson was so mentally broken over the death of his wife that he probably made love to her dead corpse.

[@maltheopia]

My man needed some hardcore therapy, not a Regenleif to the face. Sucks living in pre-industrial times.

[@joshuagabrielcatindig7607]

@@maltheopia or a Silver Axe to the torso. I made Duessel kill him. Traitor killed traitor.

[@maltheopia]

@@joshuagabrielcatindig7607 If you're playing 0% growths that's a good strategy for every boss battle. Have Duessel, Gerik, Seth, and Saleh kill everything.

[@joshuagabrielcatindig7607]

@@maltheopia what about Innes though?

[@maltheopia]

@@joshuagabrielcatindig7607 I forgot about Innes, yeah, bring him too. Fucking Deathgoyles.

[@majoric2121]

The most beautiful confrontation of all the fire emblem

[@ythandlename]

Orson betrayed Ephraim not because for his wife, but because not only did he stripped him of all his items; he was used as bait for the enemy units right after he just tells him to not push himself.

[@akkarinderweise1617]

The first time I played sacred stones I lost that silver sword. That was a tragic moment D: after that i always took everything from him xD i guess we all did:D

[@kaeru3228]

Damn, we really all did it.

[@Jang7457.]

Well the first time i played FESS i didnt take his items away because its like he is on par with Seth, and i was raged because Orson became an enemy

[@AnoNYmous-bz2ef]

Pretty sure that was you, not Ephraim

[@Cyborg609]

They should have given Orson more chapters on player side and have those be paladin favoring maps to bait noobs in to investing to him. Imagine sharing frontline kills with Seth and maybe even giving some statboosters to him (with the dream of having 2 Seths on field) and then having him betray you. That would have actually made someone mad compared to just losing his equipment. Heck.. why not even give the stat gains you got while controlling him to his boss base stats now that I started to think like asshole game dev?

[@jerry3115]

Of all his weapons you chose an IRON SWORD

[@joshuagabrielcatindig7607]

Probably to dispose of it.

[@noelle1030]

AND IT EVEN BROKE AFTER THE FIRST STRIKE 😂

[@falena2245]

@@noelle1030 LOL xD

[@InternetPeopleAreNotReal]

It’s weird looking through all the comments dating back 12 years ago and seeing everyone’s takes on Jagens. We come a long way. We have become enlightened on how truly broken of units they are.

[@MarceloKatayama]

Kudos to LittleAl016, defending jagens 8 years ago

[@stephenfong1144]

I mean, some Jagens aren't really Jagens because they have good growth rates, and those are the ones that good, not the true Jagens

[@InternetPeopleAreNotReal]

@@stephenfong1144 out of all the “Jagens” in the series the only one I can think of that is not broken is Gunter. While some “Jagens” fall of sooner than others like FE6 Marcus or Aaron, their utility in the early game is worth so much that I would still consider them good. I think trying to distinguish Oifeys from Jagens is kind of dumb.

[@alejandro_rodriguez_99]

@@InternetPeopleAreNotReal the problem with Gunter is that he is only a Jagen 2 chapters, because when he arrives in revelations and specially in conquest he is outclassed because his stats are awful, specially speed. The only good thing that he has is his defense in conquest.

[@stephenfong1144]

@@InternetPeopleAreNotReal That's fair, but I would also argue that the OG himself is also kind of bad, my Marth and Abel bulldozed the early game just fine for me (then Merric showed up and I was basically set)

[@straypaper]

Eirika: "Sir Seth, this Iron Sword is just about to break. We can't risk anyone being caught in battle with just one swing left. Would you take care of this, Sir Seth?" Seth: "Certainly, Lady Eirika." Seth later that day:

[@lpfan4491]

He was just using advanced strategies. Orson saw a regular ironsword break, so he will not be able to prepare Seth suddenly pulling the Audhulma.

[@adl_dic]

ORSON IN HEROES

[@justsomeguywithaquestionab3175]

Of course, this appeared in my recommended the moment Orson is a ghb unit in Feh.

[@Bafford]

I think, that Orson is kinda tragic character. First, he lost his beloved wife - that made him mad. Later, he was a mere puppet of Formortiis. It shows us, how dangerous feeling can be.

[@elegante8520]

It kinda reminds me of darth vader

[@MattMorency]

What would his wife think of him now?

[@nancestpasmoi1834]

@@MattMorency "welcome dear"

[@joshuagabrielcatindig7607]

The flip side is also true in FE6. The whole reason the war started is because Big Z thought that emotions and feelings are useless.

[@kidwaryodproduction]

@@elegante8520 Darth Orson actually can be a good gimmick. 😄

[@randomuser5663]

I love how Seth still respects orson even though he betrayed renais

[@thelegacyofgaming2928]

They probably grew up together as knights.

[@praneshroyale5019]

SETH is the best silver knight of the whole world

[@megaoptamas759]

Seth= best FE knight ever

[@I_AM_JUST_A_NARCISSIST]

best? more like The God of FE Paladin

[@HuskyWolf101]

Seth is way better than Marcus

[@ShadowdaHedgie11]

It's always great to see characters who, even if they're not going to hesitate, have respect for their opponents. Or at least for the person that their opponents used to be.

[@omegadragoon1544]

Orson is in FEH!!!!

[@zebra_ecstasy5772]

Why was I recommended this video It's been 14 years What the hell

[@swedenfc19]

The KZbin algorithm works in mysterious ways.

[@arawn1061]

The man the myth the legend

[@ynelonitnelot8860]

Captain Price? XD

[@alex-sh5ed]

Algorithms are magical. Just when Orson makes it to FEH this pops in my you-know-where.

[@MrMatthias]

It's my favorite entry in the series, and yet after all these years, I didn't know there was unique dialogue for fighting Orson with Seth.

[@Murtag182]

seth is my favorite character in that game. putting him against orson is awesome, theyre both paladins, and theyre both pretty strong. too bad orson turned bad. although he did have a reason to...

[@taramaforhaikido7272]

Some people make it about "feelings". Nah, it's worse then that. Orson lost the only thing that gave his life reason and purpose. Deep down he likely knew his wife was an empty shell. In denial about it. What else did he have though? He wants the memory. It's so tragic. I love it!

[@implord4197]

Nothing is scarier than a man with nothing left to lose.

[@KiLLeRoiKiLLeR]

Seth always has something nice to say :)

[@markhunter3533]

Even when he is about to kill you

[@SethJV]

@@markhunter3533 Dying to him is an honor

[@Mikiyora]

I think Seth is my favorite character. I use him a lot, i leveled him up as much as i could! GO SETH!

[@KarlSturmgewher]

Tana vs. Orson: Tana: "Orson. Come back to Renais, for Ephraim and Eirika! You need not give into this senseless quest to save your wife!" Orson: "I'll never betray Lyon, or my wife. Tana: "There's always a way out. Orson: "What about for my wife years ago?! Was there a way out for HER then?" Tana: "I'm sorry it's got to end like this."

[@thelegacyofgaming2928]

Orson is a well written character. Sheesh

[@landonthielen7017]

whenever you start this game seth is the biggest fucking beast ever imo hes a palladin so i guess thats why he is so strong but damn its like steroids i lost in the prologue because eirika was hurt and exposed so i lost in normal mode lol

[@chillstoneblakeblast3172]

Landon Thielen And remember, this is the game that nerf them by only wielding sword and alances and removed their axes to balance them.

[@maltheopia]

@@chillstoneblakeblast3172 Imagine how even more busted Seth would be if he could wield Handaxes/Hatchets, Brave Axes, or Garm.

[@jorge.penacovidiano]

Im back again, sir orson.

[@swedenfc19]

Saving the experience for my other units ;)

[@swedenfc19]

Oifaye is actually third. Less growth than Seth, though he starts off with better stats at level 15 (capping at 30), while Seth starts off at level 1 (capping at 20). Seth will have generally better stats, a combined of about 118. While Oifaye ends up with 108~110 (forgot exactly where it falls into). Oifaye does end up with more hp, a 55 compared to Seth's 47. But considering the stats, I do not consider hp to be as important as the other stats, and so Seth is still 2nd.

[@LittleAl016]

Marcus was always useful no matter which game it was.

[@linzig32]

my seth is usually 1 or 2 away from capping most stats he was my top unit in my first playthrough

[@realpochita29]

very inspiring quote... but scrolled a little fast... but a really inspiring quote!!! ^_^

[@LittleAl016]

In FE7 Marcus's case: It's not as bad as you make it seem. (Far from it actually.) Even if he does have -2 Spd on average at that level (which, if I'm not mistaken, should be when you recruit Geitz/re-recruit Wallace, and that's assuming that you feed him boss kills), he can still weaken enemies, and of course act as a bit of a ferry for Eliwood or whoever else may need extra movement. And of course, I'll direct you to the key words "good for beating the map in fewer turns".

[@LittleAl016]

You can't judge everything by growths alone. Especially when growths are luck reliant, and don't exactly give a complete picture of the story about a unit. Which is part of why I brought up the LHM promotion, and being as good as Marcus (who by the way, IS the best paladin in FE7) when he rejoins. Besides, Sain's growths aren't as bad as you think. Believe me when I say Lowen's are worse. Lowen's good earlygame, but has limited usefulness outside of that.

[@luminescentpearl4126]

Bro is ahead of his time

[@LittleAl016]

@@luminescentpearl4126 You can thank the guys at Serenes for having set me straight.

[@luminescentpearl4126]

@@LittleAl016 HOLY FUCK HE'S STILL ALIVE

[@LittleAl016]

Change Seals can play around with EXP gains though just in case you're concerned with them. So using a Change Seal on Frederick to make him a Cavalier (or an Armor Knight, or a Dracoknight) would end up no differently than making him either a Paladin, a General, a Griffon Knight, or a Dragon Master EXP-wise.

[@shadowphantom2]

@elguaro3 Sorry about the confusing set up, it was more of a self- reflection quote or perhaps i said it to gain a better understanding of Seth himself. But if you are looking for an answer then i'm sorry again, I don't really remember what i was thinking about during the time i wrote that statement. I might remember though... oh well

[@swedenfc19]

Wanted to let my other units get the experience ;)

[@GoldLink364]

Oh. Full battle forecast, huh?

[@LittleAl016]

The list of which, is actually fairly long when you think about it.

[@LittleAl016]

EXP is only good as a means to an end. Their growths are the only thing from being useful is the game's second half. Aside from that, using Jagen, FE6 Marcus, and Zealot, can help shave some turns off of your total turncount in the meantime and are arguably required to be used on their game's hardest difficulty. These facts put them comfortably in Upper Mid, if not High, on Efficiency Tier Lists. Same thing with Isadora minus the required on HM part, despite not joining as early as FE7 Marcus.

[@maltheopia]

how does it feel to be vindicated?

[@mattdominick1679]

Best Unit vs. Best Traitor

[@swedenfc19]

Hard-mode Percival.

[@Dragonpike]

@boym0n2 Seth is one of the most useful prepromoted characters

[@lordox9]

I use louise too but i almost never uses archers because of warriors, magic and long range weapons. Echidna and Dieck pwned Idoun (I forgot equiping Roy with sealed sword)

[@clutchuwu1355]

Okay quick question. What happens if Orson dies before this mission, I always took his inventory the mission before when he assisted Ephraim, but I've never let him die out for some reason...

[@zhengwenyu1587]

I believe he simply retreats

[@Dragonpike]

@LordofDragns No Marcus is only a Jeigan in FE6, in FE7 he can actually be useful

[@butteredsalmonella]

Top 10 anime fights

[@ritogamo9830]

jagen vs unexpected traitor jagen

[@tamayammy]

Lol during my first play at this game I gave Seth the Audhulma and not Joshua too XD

[@Hyralc]

I think Seth is rejected because, by the time ANYONE plays FE 8 just flat out reject Seth cause they think, "Oh, its the first prepromote, AND its a palidain. Screw him." and yeah.

[@LordofDragns]

@Eskizofrenik Marcus is a Jeigan. Seth is an Oifaye.

[@danialamjad8083]

I love this game but it is hard and i war on chapter 19 but i did not have cool people i had so many that died

[@elguaro3]

@shadowphantom2 what are you talking about?

[@reiswindy]

I thought he was an Oifey archetype?

[@miky_the_shepherd]

I hoped for a crit

[@paxpacis2]

If you want to take weapons of SS make Ike use Audhulma and Seth Vidofnir. Ike does 15 dmg again and Seth 15 dmg, too. Ike has 50 hp and Seth has 60. Ike needing 4 attacks to kil lSeth and Seth needs 4 attacks as well. making them equal again

[@ganondorf59]

agreed, but Seth would win!

[@LittleAl016]

There's really no difference between a Jagen and an Oifey aside from the fact that Oifeys have usefulness outside of being a Disc One Nuke at best.

[@paxpacis2]

QuestioN: If you train Orson, will he be a stronger boss?

[@mayonaise8089]

no nothing changes

[@LittleAl016]

Percival doesn't come dangerously close to breaking FE6 like Seth does with FE8 though. Marcus doesn't either with FE7, but he's closer than Percival is.

[@maltheopia]

Percival has the stats and weapon ranks to break FE6 in half, but man is arriving after the game is well over halfway over is not a good look. At least he has the decency to join before the nightmare that is Bern/Sacae.

[@paxpacis2]

Vidofnir however has only 30 uses, that's why you should use sacred weapons wisely. ragnell however has, additionaly to it's ridiculous strenght a defense boost AND a range attack infinite uses. I'm not really sure which is the easier game. RD or SS. They are both no challenge So that's no argument, too. The point in this discussion is "who is stronger"? And arguments were that Ike has way better stats, but that's not true. They are similar.

[@paxpacis2]

If you want to make it fair, you have to give the characters weapons of ONE game. So if Ike may use ragnell. Seth should use Wishblade. Easy maths: Seth increases his damage by 7 and receives 5 more from Ike making: 17 dmg for Seth and 20 for Ike. 50:17= 3 attacks to kill Ike 60:20 = 3 attacks to kill Seth. makes them equal. (Wishblade has range, too)

[@MKnut207]

music f-ing rox

[@2000sDigitalBoy]

Some people consider the Oifey a sub-category of the Jeigan archetype.

[@guardianofthetoasters2323]

Seth, the guy first timers used all the way because he is simply that strong

[@maltheopia]

Unless I'm trying to do something weird like a ranked run or zero percent growths, I pick my team by personality instead of by combat performance. The problem with FE8 is that there are so many well-written characters that I end up just rolling dice to see whether a new unit should displace an old one. Nothing personal, Seth, Ross, Joshua, and Lute.

[@guardianofthetoasters2323]

@@maltheopia well if this is the first fire emblem game you have ever played, then new players like me back then would use this beast 9/10

[@maltheopia]

@@guardianofthetoasters2323 Yup. Seth is good even on zero percent growths, so I never feel bad about shelving this beast of a man for a few levels while I play around with meme units.

[@kilnareth7970]

Back then, I was of the mindset to stop using OP things at the start of every game so I actually never used Seth once through first playthrough.

[@LittleAl016]

Every Jagen is usable though. :/

[@christellmef]

Except for Vander

[@endeavorrattata7839]

I remember using myrrh against him.... i got really scared but it actually turned out to my favor...... myrrh's very op i dont wanna use her anymore.

[@LordofDragns]

@swedenfc19 Personaly I would have to rate Titania first, Seth second, and Oifaye third.

[@talic864]

hes coolio.specially with audhulma i ownt fortimiss with seth only =p

[@Phoenix7786]

Ahh Seth, quite possibly the coolest of the Jeigan/Oifaye archetypes and I believe one of the first (At least US) to be usuable.

[@bend.7590]

All the comments from 10 years ago calling Seth a Jagen did not age well at all. Seth to this day is the best prepromote in any fire emblem game and easily the best unit in SS. He can solo the entire game

[@thelegacyofgaming2928]

Seth is his own category.

[@paxpacis2]

I just compared their maximum stats. I don't don't see the "far superior" Ragnell is a cheating weapon though. If Ike used a normal weapon Seth could probably even win

[@paxpacis2]

That's why I said, that Ike isn't "far" better. Of course he would win, since he is broken and Seth's growth rate isn't as good as Ikes. But still Ike isn't invincible. Well let's see. That IronS of RD have 6 Mt. Ike does 7 dmg to Seth and Seth does 5 dmg to Ike. So Ike needs 9 attacks to kill and Seth needs 10 attacks to kill. It's close but Ike will win

[@swedenfc19]

Other than the hp on the low side, he has one of the best stats growth in FE8. Also, he flats out beat both version of Marcus as well. Hard Mode Percival is slightly better, but Seth should be second amongst the pre-promoted paladins, barring FE10 and the additional promotion. With a slightly low hp, again, but his other stats are very satisfactory.

[@karinja3172]

To be fair, Sacred Stones has quite a lot of low hp units

[@alecneal602]

I'd argue that Marcus is better in the harder FE7 modes. FE8 is still fairly easy without Seth (and Seth doesn't make HM!Father and Son less of a groin-punch), whereas Marcus is absolutely head-and-shoulders above... well, pretty much everyone ever, in a game where you have a much smaller selection of highly competent units (which require more training to become killing machines). TL;DR God with very mild Speed issues in a hard game > God with very mild HP issues in an easy game.

[@Doggomorph]

Doesnt apply to me i instantly promote ephraim on the first turn and got him the Signelide or the other sacred stone special lance muahahahhahaahaa and max him out

[@wrathofpain5]

He maxes strength early but all his other stat growths are shit. Lowen is the best paladin in that game.

[@ALPhaubber9]

what does he say to seth when he dies?

[@SethTheArcanine]

Just his normal death speech.

[@noVva555]

ALPhaubber9 you will never see it.....becuase SETH IS THE SON OF CHUCK NORRIS

[@ALPhaubber9]

so he has no time to say anything?

[@ALPhaubber9]

he just drops dead?

[@noVva555]

ALPhaubber9 no i saying that set is the best paladin in all the series

[@YTPrule]

@swedenfc19 He's what u call an Oifey archetype,like Jeigans(Marcus's archetype) they're pre-promoted,but like Seth & Titania, they're still good 4 the endgame.

[@gamesmaster2000]

Seth's my favourite pre-promoted character. After getting stuck on the DS remake of the original thanks to Jagen I was reluctant to use Seth, but he proved helpful and loyal. Never let me down.

[@ghis4000]

seth v seth 2*

[@finalbossd]

There will be no jeigans in fire emblem awakening, all prepromoted units can be reclassed to their unpremoted form and raised to level 20.

[@wrathofpain5]

@boym0n2 lowen, kent, oscar, LOWEN. makalov, and i think i forgot to mention lowen all are better than pre promo paladins. hell the only one worse really is sain.

[@QuickSmasherEXE]

Doesn't Seth start out with 46 HP though?

[@LittleAl016]

The only ones I would call better than the prepromoted paladins are Cain, Abel, Aless, Alan, Lance, and arguably Oscar. All the rest are objectively worse in comparison. (Well, except when being compared to Isadora and Geoffrey.) Being worse in comparison =/= being bad units though. And Sain's the second best cavalier in the game. All he needs is a LHM promotion, and he helps defeat Lundgren, and he's as good as Marcus when he rejoins.

[@downsouthchiko5492]

oldest comment ever but kyle outmatches all of them

[@shanner]

LittleAl016 alan and lance? Uhh, perceval would like a word with you

[@goaldhost]

look yes Seth has good growths. the reason he is edged out is that the other cavalry units have more levels to train.

[@ganondorf59]

Me 2!!!!!

[@LittleAl016]

Jagens were always usable though. :/

[@KHfanguy]

i get scared when I try to let my other guys fight bosses, cause if they die, then it's good-bye lol

[@guardianofthetoasters2323]

that is why im so glad i played it on gba, can save those baby right up

[@acephilosopher5146]

Everyone talking about the iron sword, but when I see seth has an S rank in swords I be like

[@joshuagabrielcatindig7607]

It's quite possible, as early as the first chapter in the route split.

[@paxpacis2]

He is not that better. If Seth uses Vidofnir, giving him a bonus of 5def Ike would do 15 dmg with Ragnell. Seth would do 10 dmg if Ike uses Ragnell. (With Ragnell being a uber weapon anyway) Seth has a max hp cap of 60 and Ike a max hp cap of 50. Seth needs 5 attacks to kill and Ike needs 4 attacks to kill Seth. I call it very close not 'way better'

[@lordox9]

seriously everyone never uses the pre promotes because of everyone writes about their bad stats I alvays train marcus to 20 only to have him run to every village in trouble before they get robbed Zealot is horrible and the only pre promoted unit i uses is Karel

[@gamermad]

lets add skills? imagine ike had aether and seth had sol? tho this would be canceled with nihil haha :D