Five Underrated Badges in Paper Mario: TTYD

TTYD has many badges, some of which are inevitably better than others. However, there are some useful badges that tend to get underrated by the TTYD playerbase. This video will show five of those badges, show what effects they have, explain why they're underrated, show where they are obtained, and demonstrate their usage within some battles.
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[@Mighteyes]

A lot of these strategies require weirdly specific knowledge about what exact moves enemies will do on what turn, and sadly that would probably jam up the smoothness of a playthrough for me personally if I had to constantly look up such things in order to make use of these, but still very cool showcase

[@Kappy0]

That Bowser/Kammy strat for Double Pain was fire, my guy. I loved it LOL

[@TheFatestPat]

I remember messing around with some of these badges looking for new strategies. It seemed like danger Mario was all anyone talked about back in the day, which I thought was pretty boring.

[@fernando98322]

Instead of FP Drain for the casual players, I recommend Flower Finder. You can get it immediately after tradings some Star Pieces (I don't remember the number but it's not high). This badge makes many FP drops appear after battles, you can use normal amounts of FP each battle and you won't drain and reach 0 FP for a while. I tried it out in my most recent playthrough and the results were incredible

[@Miccat87]

Flower Finder is a pretty nice badge for sure, especially in the pit of 100 trials. Something a lot of people don't know is that you're guaranteed at least 1 flower drop if you have it on, which is nice. I'm not sure if it's underrated, though. Also, it is useless for boss fights, obviously.

[@squid_cake]

@@Miccat87no wonder I always got flowers after battle. Do more flower savers increase the minimum amount of flowers?

[@Miccat87]

@@squid_cake Flower Savers? No. Those just reduce the FP of attacks by 1. You might've meant to say more Flower Finders, in which case, I don't actually know because I haven't ever stacked them. You can't get more than 1 of them without farming enemy badges. This is made even harder because no enemies hold Flower Finders. You'd either have to spam Kiss Thief on the right enemies until you happen to get one or get really lucky and have them drop one after battle.

[@squid_cake]

@@Miccat87 whoops, i misread flower finders as flower savers. As for always getting flowers after battle i think i'm just lucky

[@trumpeterjen]

I know this comment is kind of old, but I recently found out that if you have Flower Finder and Bump Attack/First Attack enabled, then even enemies you defeat without fighting will drop flower points. You can run back and forth between weak enemies and farm free flowers just by walking through them. Heart Finder works the same way.

[@7thdayfallout]

Glad you mentioned HP Plus. It only occurred to me on a recent playthrough how valuable that flexibility is, especially since I'm trying more challenging runs these days... I've been a BP spammer since I was playing this game as a kid but back then I always brushed off that badge and that mentality just kind of stuck with me through the years. I also feel the same about FP Plus, though it's less valuable. I dunno about Jumpman being underrated, I've always thought this badge had a positive reception, even people who are scared of its downside first can quickly come to realize the ways to work around not having your hammer.

[@Miccat87]

Yeah, I actually also felt the same way about HP Plus until fairly recently. Also, while there are certainly a good amount of people who recognize the value of Jumpman, I think there are still a good amount who are turned off by the loss of hammer. Maybe there's fewer than I thought, but I figured it still made sense to include it.

[@stevray98]

It says there's no guarantee Grodus will use lightning next, Grodus then proceeds to use it twice more, going off this footage it seems to be the only move he knows. /j

[@groovyninji]

Oh that Smorg battle was just phenomenal. Awesome showcasing!

[@TheGerkuman]

Please use thicker outlines for your text so it's easier to see them against similar colour backgrounds. Really good video otherwise! Extremely informative.

[@Miccat87]

Yeah, the text conflicting with the background has been something that I've sometimes had issues with. I've been a bit unsure about how to address that issue. Thanks for the suggestion, and I'm glad you still liked the video.

[@coleminer8847]

Heres another alternative against spiky enemies using jumpman Spike sheild, when combined they essentially just act as a cheaper power plus Also Double Pain with the Payback badge (or whatever it’s called) from the Pit of 100 feels like it could be a neat combo

[@Surgemaster2012]

Even though there are better badges I LOVE Double Dip, it's a lot of fun to use even just to mess around with. I have been using FP Drain a bit recently, it's a fun badge.

[@Miccat87]

Interestingly, those are two badges that I hadn't really realized the value of until I started challenge running.

[@poochycosme]

The FP drain battle is interesting because while going through it for the second time, I felt like everything you did could've been replaced in a way or an other without the badge because normal jump without the badge does the same damage at the same cost as spin jump with the badge and the power bounce with the badge does the same damage at the same cost as a spin jump without the badge and in the third phase, you could have started with an earth tremor to kill the weapons and used a fire flower on the second turn to get it down to 11 hp or maybe you could have intentionally missed the earth tremor action command and done an other attack to deal the correct amount of damage but then I realized that you wouldn't have had enough star power left for art attack to finish the fight. However, you could have used a shooting star instead of the earth tremor and then you should have been able to not need the FP drain badge but it let you beat the fight with one less item which is interesting

[@WackoMcGoose]

Chuggaa explained HP/FP Plus really well in his recent Paper Mario 64 re-play. You're essentially "temporarily trading a BP level-up for FP or HP", letting you Chet Rippo yourself at will for free.

[@sagacious03]

Neat run & analysis video! Thanks for uploading!

[@SuperMarioOddity]

Jumpman is kind of broken when you realise that it actually gives +2 damage or >+6 with Power Bounce , for only 2 BP.

[@HavikXIII]

Are you serious!? I'm never using my hammer again

[@chillstoneblakeblast3172]

Definitely agree that FP Drain is underrated. I think HammerMan is underrated as well (Mostly for fire drive plays)

[@rodrickgoldberg2324]

One badge I think is often overlooked by players is Super Appeal. One by itself isn’t a big deal. But if you stack multiple of them together, the effects can be game breaking. And since you can get as many of them as you want from the Pianta Parlor, you can start grinding for them whenever. (And if you don’t agree, you can still grind for them and other low cost badges at the parlor to sell them at the badge shop for some quick cash)

[@Miccat87]

It can certainly be useful. I'm not totally sure I'd consider it "overrated" though. Also, I'd like to mention that often times, when creating these types of badge videos, I don't really consider extreme stacking. I usually don't consider it because doing so gives a lot of badges, such as Power Rush or P-Down D-Up, an unfair advantage.

[@MountainMemelord]

Power Rush is also busted.

[@RichardDong68]

The problem with double/triple dip is that backtracking to get new items you need is really not worth it most of the time.

[@Miccat87]

I mean, I'm evaluating them based on how useful they are in a challenge running context, not on how easy or convenient they are to use. Besides, 10 or 20 items is still plenty of room to plan some pretty crazy item combinations.

[@Alexs23743]

Double Pain...double pleasure? Mario became One-Jump Man with that badge. D: You really want to see an underrated Badge? How about Timing Tutor, which gives you a prompt when you're in the window for a Stylish move, with no drawbacks (I don't think)!

[@tessaPMpro]

I agree with all of these except HP Plus, I always felt that HP Plus is a very mid-tier situational badge just like FP Plus, Zap Tap, and Spike Shield but it definitely is better to equip HP Plus than to level up HP for sure so I do agree that it's useful there. I feel like Jumpman and Double Dip aren't underrated by the challenge run community as many of us know how good they are but they are overlooked by many casuals who aren't aware of how good they can be. FP Drain is easily the most underrated, for a long time I had just dismissed it as useless without even trying it (mainly due to its downside because I used to have a bias against badges that decrease attack so I would refuse to even try it) until I started challenge running and realised how useful it can really be both on bosses and on regular enemies, many players don't seem to realise how much potential it has.

[@Miccat87]

HP Plus has always seemed like a bit of an unusual badge to discuss to me, but ultimately, I do think players often give it less credit than it's worth. I definitely agree that casual players are the ones who tend to underrate Double Dip and Jumpman. Their placements in the Glitz Pit community tier list makes that evident. Also, yeah, FP Drain is probably the most underrated. As soon as I came up with the idea for this video, I knew it would be one of them. It's kind of become the poster child of underrated badges.

[@Driggsdamonstah]

Interesting choices for sure. I don’t really use HP Plus or Double Pain much, but they pair well together. FP Drain was actually brought to light with its benefits by Jdaster so people view it more positively now, same with Double Dip, both badges are at least in A tier, while FP Drain is a solid B tier badge. Also I wouldn’t call Jumpman Underrated. It ranked in the highest tier.

[@Miccat87]

Yeah, it's true that some of these badges have gotten better reception over the years, but there's still probably a good amount of people who don't think they're all that good. I feel like Jumpman is well known within the challenge running community to be a very useful badge, so yeah it makes sense that it'd rank up high, but I've seen a good amount of other players that seem to think it's a bad badge, so I figured it was appropriate for this video.

[@RaceBandit]

Given the prevalence of the Danger archetype, I'm not surprised to see Double Pain on the list in the interest of speeding up Danger setup.

[@Miccat87]

Yep. While it was probably intended to be purely harmful, it actually can be quite helpful in some specific cases.

[@ogre589]

Yeah I don't think I'd ever use these strats. I am a massive completion junkie so the idea of running into the final dungeon at lvl 5 is way beyond my preferred playstyle.

[@Miccat87]

Yeah, I get that not everyone is into that sort of thing, but I hope this has at least given you some appreciation for these badges.

[@ogre589]

@@Miccat87 My mind is running towards triple dip Zesty's Dynamite. Nothing like 3 aoe 7 damage attacks in 1 turn.

[@Chiptroid]

Banger video! Never got around to utilizing FP drain but now I see that potential. Could you make a video on boss ai/behaviour? Always curious on it, and how you mentioned Grodus’ attacks being random after turn one!! 😊

[@Miccat87]

I have done a video recently that included all boss HP triggers, which is an important part of their AI, so maybe you should check that out. I might cover other aspects about them in the future.

[@dELTA13579111315]

Been playing through ttyd again the past few days having fun experimenting with badges. I've left Mario at 10hp, currently he's level 21 I believe and I just finished chapter 6. I maximized his attack and I'm making use of jumpman so no hammer (outside of first strikes). I think with the action command the regular jump does 28 damage to a target without defense, while in peril.

[@Mimikium778]

i think this is a flawed list, only really agreeing with HP Plus and FP drain here as the other strategies revolve around and/or thrive with peril/danger mario which by itself is a very popular strategy, so enabling it further just kinda feels redundant to me, i guess? that being said, the effort put into this video to showcase strats is really admirable, and i respect the hell out of this video for trying to spread word about a variety of strategies, like how double/triple dip can lead to some fun item spam builds with thunder rages or spamming the heck out of status items. good stuff.

[@Miccat87]

It is true that danger/peril strats are pretty common, however, I feel like the methods of attaining them that I showcased in this video might not be as well known. Many people might not think of using Double Pain to set up peril, as it seems like a purely harmful badges on the surface. Also, the other four badges on the list don't always relate directly to danger or peril. It is totally possible to use badges such as Double Dip and Jumpman for strats other than peril. I just opted to show them being used in peril strats because those tend to be the most powerful and I felt that it would better demonstrate the potential that some badges have.

[@Mimikium778]

@@Miccat87 fair enough, and i shouldve specified about jumpman, as i think that badge is very appropriately known as a powerful badge regardless of strat. i didnt mean to imply it was just/only strong for danger strats, i just excluded talking about it because most of the people i know agree that jumpman is incredibly powerful, so i never felt it was underrated to begin with. that could just be narrow scope bias with friends though, maybe it really is underrated and i didnt have a large enough view on the community as a whole's perception of it before going into this.

[@Miccat87]

@@Mimikium778 Yeah, the perception of what's underrated will tend to vary from person to person. I've seen a good number of people who don't seem to think Jumpman is very good. It is understandable that some folks would be scared off by its downside, even though it's not much of problem at the end of the day.

[@basilvitamin8878]

i've heard a lot of people say that double dip is good, not sure it belongs on a list of underrated badges really great video though!!

[@Miccat87]

Thanks, I'm glad you enjoyed the video. Whether or not the badges on this list are underrated is very much a matter of personal perception. I personally haven't seen a whole lot of people praise Double Dip. Additionally, it seemed likely to me that even those who thought it was a good badge didn't realize just how could it can potentially be. I don't think I realized how good it was until I started learning about how useful certain items can be.

[@AidenYTP]

I didn’t even know Spike Shield existed, so that’s why I always thought Hammerman was more useful because of Hammer Throw.

[@Miccat87]

It's also worth noting that jump attacks generally benefit more from the attack boost than hammer attacks. Plus, spiky/fire enemies aren't as common as you might think, and there's other ways to hit them even without hammer attacks.

[@AidenYTP]

@@Miccat87 next time i play I’ll try to get my hands on Spike Shield just to be sure.

[@Luwis1337]

Some Badges i can always recommend are: Pity Flower because its really useful, more useful than lowering your damage of one to gain each attack a flower point in my eyes. Zap Tap is very neat and helpful, not the best or very powerful but still very neat to have. Flower Saver P because the best ones cost the most FP to i think its very wise. P-up D-down for for Mario and Partner because you always enough HP, even at the end. Fire Dive for early game because its really good until Chapter 5.

[@Miccat87]

These are some interesting recommendations. Flower Saver P is definitely a great badge. I didn't include it in this video though because I'm pretty sure the majority of players know how good it is. I think the P-Up D-Down badges are also good, especially the partner version, as them taking more damage isn't really much of an issue. Not sure how underrated they are, though. I agree that Fire Drive is great early game, but it does lose a good amount of viablility later on. It really shines in Pre-Hooktail Pit runs, as it remains one of the best attacking options in that scenario. Again though, I wouldn't really call it overrated. I see plenty of players praising it already. I'd say Zap Tap is very useful against leeching enemies, such as swoops and fuzzies, but otherwise, I wouldn't say there's a whole lot of use for it. I'm not really sure what the playerbase thinks of it, as I don't typically see it getting praised nor bashed. I definitely can't say I agree about Pity Flower, though. Not only do you have to take damage for it to do anything, but it also only works 30% of the time. FP Drain may lower attack, but it's far more effective and reliable at maintaining FP. I'd argue Pity Flower is one of the worst badges in the game.

[@Luwis1337]

@@Miccat87 i personaly think its a great badge. The effect of having sometimes one FP back is really good. Later on, you almost always get atleast one FP back, i even sometimes got 2 FP and once 3 FP. Yes, it is luck based, yet later on you fight against atleast a group of 3 to 4 enemys and i can assure you that you always get 1 FP atleast back for no downsites. Yes, if you manage to perfectly use the counter attack than its useless i know but honestly imo Paper Mario 2 is am extremly unbalanced game over all. Danger Mario as example but not only this but also being able to do 4+ damage for each jump alone with the only jump badge, two attack + badges and the all or nothing badge and the spike& fire shield to give you an extra damage which even people who play the game for the first time can achieve too easily or that you can attack each badge multiple times, like for the pretty lucky badge which is extremly strong or as a negative thing attack badge like Power Smash which increases the damage by 2, yet multiplys the Flower cost to 2, meaning if you equip that badge 3 times you have a cost of 8FP for 6 more damage, which is redicilous if you equip another one for +8 damage but have to use 16 FP. Cooking and item shops are also extremly unbalanced, not to forget the enemy dificulty which slowly starts to increase in the forth chapter while in the chapters before they are all easy to defeat yet give a lot of EXP which is why from the 5 Paper Mario games i played (colour splash is untouched yet sadly) Paper Mario 2 is at Place 3 of the Paper Mario games simply because its imo so extremly unbalanced, yet still a great game

[@HavikXIII]

Has anyone tried a consumables only challenge run? Triple dipping on items, crafting coconut bombs and stuff ljke that?

[@Miccat87]

Pretty sure that's impossible. The most damage any item can deal is 7, and the final boss has 210 HP to deplete if you consider both phases. Even with 20 items, you couldn't come close to winning. You'd have to allow non-consumable stuff to some capacity for a run like that to be possible.

[@HavikXIII]

@@Miccat87 you're right, with that math you'd need at least 10 more items

[@Miccat87]

@@HavikXIII You'd need 31. It takes at least 9 items to deal 60 or more damage for the first phase, then at least 22 to deal 150 or more damage for the second phase. Even with 30, it would still barely be impossible.

[@HavikXIII]

@Miccat87 you could use the stipulation that you can only attack while under the affects of an item, but then items that last 9 rounds would break that

[@Death_13TH]

Personally I don't think Double Dip is underrated, but I'm not really in the "Deep" part of Paper Mario's community so I might not know. As for stuff like HP plus and Double Pain I think those are the type of badges that would only be considered underrated in the casual type of mindset. Since "Double damage" would always seem a negative unless you for sure know what you're doing. The funny thing is, I've done a build using Hammerman, but not Jump man. So that was kind of fun to witness.

[@Miccat87]

Yeah, I'd agree that casual players are the ones who are more likely to underrate HP Plus or Double Pain.

[@thomaswest2583]

Hp plus and fp are literally useless. I cost the same as leveling up. You have no extra badge points to spend on anything its better to just upgrade the hp or fp. It be different if it cost only one or two points because at least then you'd be coming out ahead. But not how it currently is.

[@Miccat87]

The key point is that it increases flexibility. Yes, it provides the same effect as leveling up HP or FP, but it allows you revert your HP or FP back to what you had before increasing it by simply unequipping it and getting the 3 BP back. You can't do that with leveling up before the end of Chapter 5, and even then, you have to trek back to Rougeport Sewers and pay Chet Rippo 39 coins every single time you want to lower your HP or FP back. Being able to customize your build in such a highly flexible way is what makes badges so useful to begin with, so I still think HP Plus and FP Plus are very useful. I honestly almost never upgrade HP or FP upon leveling anymore because using HP or FP Plusses instead is pretty much just objectively better, as you can get infinite HP and FP Plusses at the Pianta Parlor anyway.

[@PhantomAarantula]

Okay, but bear with me: The inverse can be true. Leveling up HP and FP would be worse than literally useless. It'd be actually bad to do. Even if you didn't need the plus badges, they sell for 75 coins each while if you wanted to readjust your stats later, it'd cost you 39 coins. Checkmate.

[@thomaswest2583]

@@PhantomAarantula No checkmate actually. When I upgrade a stat I want it to stay at what I upgrade it at. The only advantage I could see is using a last stand strategy. But thats a double edged sword. All it would take is one bad action command to end the character one strong blow and missed action command and its game over. But then again I don't really care for gimmick strategies like that. I prefer to make character tanky.

[@thomaswest2583]

@@PhantomAarantula I guess its a preference in player strategy choice.