Flaperons? Should I Use Them? Quad City Challenger ll

In this video I put my Challenger ll through the test to see if I want to incorporate the flaperons into my flights?

[@jasonm8376]

I don't use my flaperons for anything other than trim while flying for weight distribution. Challengers will slip sideways and come down like an elevator. Just cross control hard and hold that stick all the way over. Steer with the rudder. Recover within 10 feet of the ground and land normally. You can land easily in spots you can't take off from again.

[@spirotrifonov7101]

Very good presentation. Learned a lot from this trip. You did. Move on. With new destinations. I will follow up. From Bulgaria. Much greetings.

[@TheJonjonj]

Thank you thank you!

[@techlifetime4098]

Talk all you want and do what you want it is your channel. I enjoy your videos, there is always something interesting.

[@TheJonjonj]

Thank you so much!

[@KenpoBill]

You are doing a great service for everyone. Keep doing just how you are doing. I am trying to get a Challenger I for myself.

[@TheJonjonj]

Thank you so much! I really appreciate that comment! Don't let anything stop you from getting one!

[@AndrewPeterson-nh4oj]

I was a CFI for many years, Flew cargo. My challenger one was the best plane I ever flew in 11k hours. The challenger two I didn’t like the clip wing, The long wing 2 had some pretty sluggish ailerons. It flew good with no doors on. With doors on it was a little weird. I was a test pilot on the zenith line in China. Did a lot of tests about flaperons. Your best off using flaperons as trim. Putting them full up will give you reflex if it has upward Deflection. My chalkenfer I rigged to have 10 degrees of reflex. It gave a little nicer glide and little faster cruise. Kitfox the flaps usually go up past neutral and you get some extra speed too as I’m sure you know from having one. I wouldn’t use them as a secondary flight control. (Just trim). It just doesn’t do much for you.

[@dirtdobber2715]

Excellent!👍👍

[@orvjudd1383]

Used to have a Challenger single seat. Loved it.

[@Notsoshadyacres.]

Nice videos, I appreciate your opinions sharing your experiences, and showcasing the challenger!

[@TheJonjonj]

Definitely! Thanks for watching more to come!

[@pugle1]

I've been wanting a Challenger 2 for years. Ideally with amphib floats and skis for winter. Subbed and thanks for what you do.

[@TheJonjonj]

Awesome! Thanks for watching and don't stop from getting a ch2 they are great!

[@ralfkruse7565]

Hi Jonjons, here in France most pilots use flaps 1 for takeoff and flaps 2 for landing. It depends a bit on behavior of the plane and the runway. Flaps 2 reduces the stall speed about 5 kts , can be useful on short fields. How long is your runway 1200m or more? Avignon airport is 1850m paved with ILS and PAPI, and 850m grass plus a separate 250m grass for slow weight shifter and with a seperate pattern.😊

[@chrisoconnell5727]

cool video ! keep em coming !

[@TheJonjonj]

Thank you!! I will

[@thecottonpatch80]

Great Video. A good battery at rest should show 12.6-12.7 volts. With the engine running it should show 13.8-14.5 volts. Check to make sure you have a solid ground with your rectifier and the frame. As for the flaperons I've noticed that with a heavier pilot solo you need a little up flap, and you'll pop off the ground faster. When I'm with my CFI I give a little down flap and were still off the ground within 300ft and once airborne ill just trim for flight and leave alone. My opinion on the flaperons is to just use as trim as well. Set it and forget it and trim as needed. When we stalled mine the other day we found that it didn't break like a GA plane. We didn't get it to buffer we just notice that it was falling with a -fpm and it stalled at 33mph. we flew 3 different speeds for slow flight went from 50-45-40mph, and it flew great. Awesome job maintaining centerline on landing. Your radio and intercoms sounded really good for the entire flight except for that last min of the video. Check out my latest video and watch me basically be a baby. LMAO. Loved the video great job.

[@TheJonjonj]

Me and Justice watched it as we were going to sleep then your videos ran for a few hours while I was sleeping! You're welcome 😂😂

[@MrKermitro]

I enjoyed your video

[@TheJonjonj]

Thanks for watching! Subscribe for more!

[@cheesewizard2294]

Great video... I'm working on plans for an original design with ailerons and have been considering flapperons. Lightweight aircraft can notice large changes in flight characteristics from "small" changes in weight and balance. Small amounts of trim are like snake venom, tho. Very effective in small amounts. Fine tuning the takeoff and landing characteristics of a heavier than normal TOW or unbalanced situation is where im thinking flapperons be most helpful, tho. Its still like snake venom, tho. Not trying to bring the plane down to it's normal T.O./L speeds. Trying to regain normal control characteristics at reduced airspeed, without overdoing it and sacrificing control. Besides flapperons, ive also been considering 1 or 2 degree variable pitch wing mount for this purpose. About putting flaps down before takeoff, DON'T.. even if heavy. Flaps produce a crazy amount of drag. Dont engage flaps on takeoff until at high enough airspeed to gain lift, and only if necessary(short runway). Gotta play with that to figure out what works best for different loads, but, not on takeoff. Get altitude, slow to stall speed, add a little flap at a time, and continue slowing/adding flaps to see how far you can take it without control issues, then translate that for adding flaps during takeoff.

[@hydojenk]

Interested in the challenger. Thanks for the videos.

[@TheJonjonj]

They are great! Thanks for watching

[@frankjackson7685]

Flaps really help you to have a higher rate of descent so you can stay high as you were saying you like. Then you can bleed off speed a lot quicker. On your short field with your flaps down you basically run down the runway and jerk the plane off The runway then as you build speed reduce your flaps that gives you a short field takeoff

[@michaelschwartz9485]

Got my sub and looking forward to seeing your other videos!

[@TheJonjonj]

Awesome thank you so much!

[@rfarley565656]

Fun video to watch. I really like the way you think out loud...

[@TheJonjonj]

Thank you! Please subscribe!

[@rfarley565656]

@@TheJonjonj I already have, look forward to catching up on all your content...😀

[@TheJonjonj]

@rfarley565656 thank you!

[@ulpilotrmh]

Once I got used to my CH1 I think I only used the flaperons for in-flight trim. I rarely used them for takeoff and I believe this might have been due to the fact that I controlled my weight to a maximum of 170 pounds for most of the years I flew ultralights.

[@nitroneal414]

I gave you a like and I subscribed

[@williamlambdin9817]

I have a Challenger CWS and haven't noticed any advantage in using the flaperons in terms of added lift for takeoffs . I have an electric trim on the elevator that trims for hands off cruise flight. If I didn't have the electric trim, the flaperons could be useful in trimming for cruise.

[@Damianthelovetour2024]

Awesome video. I’m wanting to build a chinook sj with a 800cc hisun efi 4 stroke 60hp

[@TheJonjonj]

That's awesome you should video document the process?

[@rickowens396]

you r doing a fine job. I feel you have many good friends as a good man will. piss on the doubting tommies

[@TheJonjonj]

Thanks Rick! I will do that 😆

[@davidmorris436]

Good job !!

[@LeonardLayne]

I think you will make a great CFI. Im 70 and have been flying since PPL in 1982 commercial in 94

[@TheJonjonj]

Thank you so much for the kind words! Email me so later I can send you a link to the stuff you need to solve your radio issues [e-mail]

[@viviennepatterson5950]

Hi there. I’m in NZ thinking of getting a plane and a Challenger is for sale. Your videos are awesome.

[@TheJonjonj]

That's awesome! Please document it if you do get a challenger and thank you for the comment!

[@grandenauto3214]

I had a challenger 2… awesome plane, I never did put doors on and flew all year in Alberta Canada. It would land in places that Cessnas wouldn’t think of landing

[@jamesordwayultralightpilot]

My single seat challenger friend also has the wingtip fences which add to the slower stall speed and added stability. Coming in high and hot is the best part of ultralight flying. Chop throttle turning base and glide all the way in!

[@TheJonjonj]

What are those? Like the droop tips or VGs?

[@lylewright3884]

you are doing a fine job keep doing what your doing the interaction ls what keeps the contrnt interesting

[@TheJonjonj]

Thank you for the kind words!

[@garysherwood3136]

I had a Challenger I with flaperons. They worked great for trim.

[@williampflugfelder7099]

Just be yourself. Honesty and candor is welcome.

[@TheJonjonj]

Yea I try to just be me! Thanks for watching

[@challenger2ultralightadventure]

I also got the "you talk too much" and "you need better audio" and other comments in my videos. At first I took those comments personal, and really seriously considered changing how I do things to please those commenters. Then after a while I realized that I really am doing this video thing for my pleasure, and presenting them for other people to follow along or maybe get something out of them. So I started to let those kind of comments slide. Once I have my Challenger flying and I'm going on camping adventures with it, I might consider constructive comments to improve the video quality. As for the voltage you are seeing, as long as it is above 13.5 and below 14.5 you should be good. Remember that these Rotax engines will greatly vary the voltage output of the stator with RPM. So idle voltage can be as low as 17 Vac (yes AC) and go considerably up higher as your RPM increases. From what you reported as your full power voltage, it looks like your regulator is working just fine. Good that you're monitoring it, as it can damage electronics if it suddenly spikes high. Cheers from Winnipeg.

[@TheJonjonj]

Good info! Can't wait till your bird is flying!

[@jerbear7952]

Dang dude, you talk so much you had to do it on someone elses channel too lol. I hate comments like that. Its your video, your life, if people don't like it they can leave.

[@neilrempel7167]

Sounds interesting, I love it , I love watching it flying

[@TheJonjonj]

Thanks for watching!

[@ricardoimpagliozza4056]

I just got a challenger II with 503 I’m a private pilot waiting for transition training hard to find someone to fly in mine with me. Love you videos. From ohio

[@TheJonjonj]

Nice I love hearing that! Don't sell it. Learn to love it!

[@richarddubord3978]

Thanks for the videos

[@TheJonjonj]

You're welcome!

[@chadparker5690]

I use the flaperons for trimming while cruising as while as for landing with floats on.

[@JohnBaileyDarke]

Two comments: Flaps or flaperons (whatever) are not necessary on this aircraft. You have the nice long runway and have a fear of loosing the engine. Stay high where you feel safe and land land a 100 yards down the runway. instead of trying to land on the numbers...

[@BruceWyder-xw9ir]

I have a zenith ch 701 80hp use my flaperon all the time, take off and landing

[@TheJonjonj]

@BruceWyder-xw9ir I've heard they work good on that platform! Definitely a different flight from a challenger!

[@TechTheRedneck]

Thanks for the video!

[@TheJonjonj]

Thanks for watching!

[@hartmutweyer1875]

From my experience, I do stalls with power off. To the power off stalling speed I add 30% to get the correct approach speed. And for a max angle of climb speed I add 20% to the stalling speed. Works with all planes that I ever flew

[@makedolife]

Keep talking, keep flying and keep sharing. You be you, that’s why here. They can go somewhere else :-/

[@TheJonjonj]

Thank you I definitely will!

[@LeonardLayne]

I have a question. I had a built in sigtronic intercom in my 160. I now have a PJ2 handheld radio which takes my headphone jacks directly. I also have another headset. My plane also has a push-to-talk switch on center stick. What do I need to buy so i can use the push to talk and #2 headset? Just a portable intercom?

[@rrh2918]

I put electric flaps on my Challenger one!

[@TheJonjonj]

On the flaperons or you made separate flaps?

[@rrh2918]

I split the flapper on and made flaps. Put electric motor on them. Redesigned the fuselage to make it more streamlined. Cut 2 ft of each wing of the clipped Wing special. Redesign the wing tips to get rid of more disease. Put sheet metal on the Leading Edge to get rid of the ribs.

[@grandenauto3214]

You don’t have a yaw string on yours? Handy little piece of string…

[@TheJonjonj]

I've that about adding one I currently use my turn coordinator but it would be nice to keep my eyes out front instead! Thanks for watching

[@jackryan152]

You dont suck! nice flight

[@TheJonjonj]

Thank you 😆

[@ryanmullany1]

Fly stop talking lol jk a lot of good knowledge coming out of ur mouth. Miss you brother

[@TheJonjonj]

Miss you too man!

[@scottgotwings]

Try slipping the plane on final. I've been impressed at how quickly my challenger will come down in a slip. This will allow you to stay higher until you're ready to land.

[@TheJonjonj]

I have and it is definitely a great airplane for slips!

[@oppositz]

Challengers love to fly sideways. Slipping to control glide path super easy...

[@dentech987]

Had a Kitfox IV. Flaperons were sh_t or worse because the more flap you used the less the aileron you have to a point of being down right dangerous. Having tried them a few times, it was never again.

[@TheJonjonj]

I've heard this same thing from more than one person!

[@cyrushohbach6729]

👍👍

[@BruceWyder-xw9ir]

1/2 flaps on takeoff full flaps on final

[@TheJonjonj]

@BruceWyder-xw9ir definitely not in the challenger lol.

[@outdoorsdelmarva5691]

How LONG is that runway? and your going around?

[@TheJonjonj]

For the sake of the video I was using the threshold and numbers for visual references so obviously I can land 10 times on that runway but then distance is hard to comprehend and that type of stuff is what people want to see.

[@orvjudd1383]

If you don’t like bees, you should have painted your plane a different color. Bees love yellow.!

[@bbt305]

Talk while you fly.

[@TheJonjonj]

I definitely do more now! Check out my newer videos! Thanks for watching

[@alkempton1512]

Is that a gps speedometer?

[@TheJonjonj]

Yes it's on Amazon $25

[@alkempton1512]

I will look it up,,thank for the cool videos

[@TheJonjonj]

@@alkempton1512 definitely thanks for the kind words!

[@markzahra-hansell7020]

I found them to be a waste of time .

[@TheJonjonj]

I agree! I would like an aileron and flap separately!

[@MrCoyote928]

I was going to like this video, until you made the uncalled for remark about President Trump...

[@TheJonjonj]

@@MrCoyote928 what did I say about him?

[@TheJonjonj]

@MrCoyote928 well I support President Trump if that's an issue then feel free to not watch!

[@transcendedanal7307]

I wonder what it would take to make the flaps effective on the Challenger