Flight Following Mistakes | Tips for Talking to ATC

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[@omnijack]

Video cuts off a bit early, but is otherwise still packed with great information

[@TiagoSeiler]

Hoping the full video gets uploaded, looks like there was more info coming at the end

[@CanardBoulevard]

Hey, you're finally in my neck of the woods - right next to my home airport, and you can just barely make out where my house is at around 2:30 in this video! :) In any case, in my experience, Cleveland ATC are never too busy to handle flight following. I've never been refused by Cleveland (been refused many times in busier areas like Florida). I will generally do my initial call up with just "VFR request" and wait until they have a moment to get back to me. THEN I will hit them with my current position and the full flight following request, supplying all the information they need in that call. If you try to do it in the initial call-up, they inevitably miss most of it and have to ask you to repeat things that they didn't get on the initial call-up.

[@df0813]

Ha! I grew up right near where that little chunk of CLE Class B is cut out at the surface. I'm fascinated by your Cozy, maybe someday we will cross paths while I'm visiting home.

[@CanardBoulevard]

@@df0813 There used to be an airport underneath that little chunk. The airport is long gone, but the chunk remains. When I first brought my Cozy home, I was based very close to there at 4G8. Now I'm at 1G5.

[@df0813]

@@CanardBoulevard I was wondering about that, I remember my dad bringing me to ride go-karts on an old abandoned runway as a kid in the 80's -90's. Maybe that could have been it!

[@__________________v___00000]

Here in N. California near San Francisco and Sacramento airspace, sometimes it is preferred to just state position and N number. They are often VERY busy on other frequencies and the long initial call blocks other aircraft. If they do not reply after 2 calls, we remain on freq. We may receive a call much later if they want to vector us or give traffic and we get our code then

[@MikeHalsall]

Norcal controllers are the absolute best. "Norcal, Cessna XYZ, VFR request"... "Cessna XYZ, Norcal, squawk 1234". They know that VFR request is 99% of the time shorthand for requesting FF. Elsewhere it seems they just want you to cold call with your full request all at once.

[@mikesteffen3378]

My flight following mistake: getting flight following in Los Angeles airspace while practicing navigation on a cross country flight. While dutifully trying to identify a nav aid Morse code, I turned down the busy ATC frequency. I probably flew another 20 minutes before looking down to see the “receive” light on the radio flashing away with no audible sound. Turning up the volume, I just caught the tail end of “…if you can hear this transmission, please ident!” Many apologies later, and I learned my lesson.

[@michaelarlen7805]

A cold call should be done first saying who you are and “VFR request”, that lets the controller get ready to receive all the information on your next transmission and enter it into the computer to process the request. If you say everything first transmission you’ll most likely have to repeat it cause the controller wasn’t ready and didn’t get all of it written down, or you’ll have that back and forth with them asking for the information piece by piece like in the deli example. If you want to make it as easy as possible for them, you can give the information in the exact order they enter it into the computer which is as follows; tail number, three letter departure airport, three letter arrival airport, aircraft type, and the altitude you intend to fly at. When giving the airport information, you want to give the 3 letter identifier instead of the 4 letter identifier or airport name, so JFK instead of KJFK or Kennedy. This is because their computers only accept three letters, so if you give the “K” prefix they have to go back and delete it. As for the aircraft type, give the type code like you would on an IFR flight plan instead of the actual make and model. For example, P28A instead of Piper Cherokee, C172 instead of Cessna Skyhawk, AA5 instead of Grumman Tiger, etc. An example call will sound like this; N12345 requests flight following from Juliet Foxtrot Kilo to Echo Whiskey Romeo, aircraft type is Papa Two Eight Alpha, at four thousand five hundred.

[@caribbaviator7058]

That was me Solo XC under the KATL CLASS B shelf leaving a Class D airport! I was still a novice on the radios!

[@AlyssaM_InfoSec]

02:28 - Typically yes an initial "Cold Call" to say your position and that you have a request is preferred, but definitely not always. Some facilities want you to give it to them all at once. A local example of this by me is that KMKE Approach prefers a cold call, but KMSN Approach wants the full request all at once on your initial contact (and will often tell you so if you cold-call them).

[@mwp1088]

I get flight following all the time out of KDPA, and the best way to get it in a busy airport if you are departing a towered field is request it on the ground with the controller. Sometimes you even get a squawk code before take off as well!

[@SmittyPilot]

I agree, I do that all the time at my Class D airport if I am flying XC distance or greater. My home airport is near DC SFRA, BWI, DCA so busy airspace, so good idea to have traffic advisories when arriving and departing that airspace.

[@manly2652]

Atc will often route vfr traffic over that corner of Canada. Pilots often ask about it and atc says"it's fine we control that airspace too."

[@JoshuaTootell]

Pretty stressful for students in my area to call up, but it is definitely great to do it. And most times the controller can tell and slows down for you.

[@jakew9887]

Excellent presentation. Thanks

[@user-lg9nq8iy2x]

I just call up clearance delivery on the ground and request it there. Much easier than doing it in the air and SDF prefers it.

[@bigmungus4864]

Since you are a skyhawk wouldn’t you then not need to say 172? It would just be SkyhawkN1222 etc? Idk just wondering I have about 117 hours so I new to flying. ?

[@RAPR117]

you are correct, it was a small error in the video

[@andrewable2634]

I know some controllers only want to hear your tail number and request for initial comms. I fly next to Hartsfield Jackson so you can imagine how insanely busy it gets.

[@williamk5998]

Another good reason to file IFR (if appropriate) in VMC.

[@rollamichael]

Haha, the one and only time "I've" ever requested flight following was on a cross-country training flight west to east through Cleveland's airspace, a bit north and east of the path used for the demo in this vid. The controller additionally gave us class b clearance wo us asking for it and the folks seemed delighted to help us. I found the constant radio calls to be distracting so didn't ask for it on the way back. That said, on the way back we had a drone near miss, but I don't *think* flight following would have helped. We were at 4,000 msl above Burke Lakefront when my CFI, who saw it first, shouts out "drone!" and with no time to react, I saw a grey four-bladed drone at our exact elevation pass by a few yards away on our starboard side. Yikes! We called the near miss in and since we didn't have to take evasive maneuvers (we didn't mention that there was no time even had we wanted to), that was the end of it. p.s., not too many heavies (read as, basically none) going into or out of CLE 🤣.

[@CanardBoulevard]

Oh yes there are! Almost constantly! I know, I used to be based at 4G8, which is right under the approach path for 6L/6R at KCLE. Our pattern altitude was only 800' AGL because of that, and there were a few times when I got extremely close to some big iron while in our pattern - they'd be only a couple hundred feet above. That said, I use flight following pretty much on every cross-country if I'm VFR. It's extremely helpful with spotting traffic, keeping an eye on weather, making sure you didn't miss that restricted area that just went hot, etc.

[@rollamichael]

@@CanardBoulevard Hmmm, I thought mostly 737 and smaller. Thanks for the flight following input.

[@swordoflorn]

How do I download your free resources if I already have a login? I don't want to "enroll" because I am already, and I can't find these resources when logged into Flight Insight.

[@user-no4vq3rm6t]

I’m stealing the deli analogy for when I’m a CFI lol

[@req2000]

Yes..ALWAYS let atc know you're changing altitude. Please.

[@cmoney2731]

Moral of this story…. Get your Instrument rating and file IFR

[@andik2329]

That is one solution if you like to be vectored around. My solution would be to fly without flight following. It doesn't provide anything for that route shown in the video. It just creates a lot of unnecessary radio calls. If I 'd cross Lake Erie I would want flight following because now they know who and where you are and if you had to ditch the rescue would be faster.

[@JoshuaTootell]

Radar services are useful if you are in a congested area ​@@andik2329 We used Flight Following on my PPL check ride!

[@cmoney2731]

@ flew VFR on an IFR plan yesterday in a busy PHX Bravo….no vectors, no unnecessary calls, just pleasant advisories and smooth air.

[@AK-xe2ly]

@@cmoney2731you didn't fly vfr on an ifr flight plan unless you requested it specifically

[@cmoney2731]

@@AK-xe2ly okay so it’s obvious you’re not familiar with aviation….. so maybe leave the pilot talk to the pilots

[@rollamichael]

Is it just me or do others agree that in today's world of electronic communication where there are better alternatives, the whole complicated and error prone blah blah blah stuff on the radio should be deprecated asap and we should be making best efforts to get it out of our air control system. For example, your g1000 equipped airplane knows exactly where it is including altitude and the type of aircraft it's installed in. It knows all kinds of things about the current running state of the aircraft. That should all be given to atc seamlessly. Then, assuming one has programmed in your destination and preferred routing, that's also known so that could also be given to atc seamlessly. Then, a computer at atc could.... you get the idea...

[@I_know_you_are_right_however]

That is fantastic... in your $1M+ Cirrus. What about Joe Bleaux in his $40k Luscomb?

[@rollamichael]

@@I_know_you_are_right_however To be sure, there is no $1m+ cirrus sitting in my garage nor is there a $40k Luscomb. That said, can the $40k Luscomb carry an ipad plus some rx/tx goo? Plus the system could be designed such that someone that doesn't have the gear could fall back on the old method. Very outside the box, I don't know, a functioning government could fund an infrastructure update plan that gets everybody current all at once.