Our LAND USE PLAN Via PERMACULTURE ZONES - Ep. 100

[@judyrene]

Hi Summer! Would you consider doing a video about how you stay so organized throughout all of these projects? I remember being amazed at how organized you are while watching your video about choosing land. You are honestly so inspiring.

[@FlockFingerLakes]

Yes, thanks for the suggestion. These "soft skills" are the ones that often get overlooked.

[@meebabeebadeembadeemdam6787]

I'd love me some exPlanatory Previews into Powerful Permaculture Project Planning Practices and Programs for Planting Plants and Prettifying Planetary Partitions.... Pretty Pretty Please 😂😂😁😁 In all seriousness, I'm a fan of Project Management stuffs 😅

[@GardenerPhyl]

What a joy to have a visual of the long term plan. I’m impressed with how much you’ve accomplished in only 100 episodes. Congratulations!

[@FlockFingerLakes]

Thanks Phyllis. A little work every day leads to a lot of progress over time!

[@cipriantodoran1674]

Love the planning that is going on. An ideea: on the "interstitial" area, keep the Norway Spruce to be harvested for wood at a ripe age, plant around them for now the shrubs and trees you are thinking about, and then use the openings that will be created to keep things even more divers.

[@sandylee1717]

Such a promising future for the land and YOU ALL

[@Fabdanc]

It's going to be interesting to see how many song birds return and start to make their homes on your property. With all the different zones and different fruit, berry, nut, seed, and bug forage areas for them... Hopefully you get a strong return. Keeping my fingers crossed that your spongy moth season is not a severe one!

[@FlockFingerLakes]

We've had SO MANY good bird sightings already and every time we see a new species, we make note of it. For instance, this year was the first year that we heard yellow-billed cuckoo and they are pretty much the only bird that eats "hairy" caterpillars, so we're hoping they are feasting on all the spongy moths that are defoliating the trees. But we're doing quite a bit of research on insect host plants to encourage more insects since the majority of our birds are actually insectivorous. Let's see how species diversity and numbers change over time, at least observationally-speaking.

[@jeaniedickman6421]

The more native plants, the more birds, and other native creatures will come and have symbiotic relationships! I love that Summer thinks about all of that too!

[@bknesheim]

Fencing in smaller areas in the wood for some time until seedlings had time to grow and then move the fence to a new area could cut cost. This should promote age difference in the threes that grow up. Even making clearing inside the fence could promote the range of plant that get a chance to grow up

[@FlockFingerLakes]

Yes, not a bad idea. We are considering that for an area that had never been clear cut on a slope, which currently is primarily beech, (all of which have beech bark disease), so in a few decades, we'll likely have no overstory there.

[@barbll000]

Wow. These are some very well thought out plans. I’m very much enjoying watching your videos for this journey.

[@FlockFingerLakes]

Thank you!

[@janetshepherd9062]

Love watching this. You guys have such a wonderful plan and really moving forward. Thanks for sharing!

[@FlockFingerLakes]

Thanks for taking the time to watch Janet.

[@GardeningWithJohn]

Well what you've done so far looks great and the plans moving forward look like they're also going to bring out the best from the area. I'm from the south of England, I live in a flat but I have about 250m2 on my allotment and there's nothing like having your own piece of earth to grow fruit, veg, flowers and just be. All the best, John

[@asianangie7209]

Such great vision! I’m looking forward to the tea garden.

[@jeanneamato8278]

Just glad you’re doing this. Such a huge endeavor.

[@malinn8429]

Hi from Sweden👋 This is such impressive and lovely work you are doing! Respecting the core and essence of the land, not making it into something its not. Tx! ...Oh and deer lollipops🌷😆 for me it was the calendulas that got a chop last year🦌🌼

[@judymckerrow6720]

Thank you Ms. Summer 🌸💚🙃

[@Wendy-zl8kv]

It’s all so exciting! Thank you for sharing with us.

[@FlockFingerLakes]

Thank you for taking some moments to enjoy and learn with us.

[@JeraldBaliteTV]

Excited for the future plans

[@Tr3ntsGames]

An absolute dream to live here

[@FlockFingerLakes]

We had to make the bold move to attempt carrying out our dreams; it's so easy to get 'stuck' in daily motions of just-like-every-other-day-I've-lived-before. Haven't been disappointed since we started. We hope that our steps and our surety can help others achieve their dreams, whether similar or different.

[@jayjohnson3724]

What a great explanation. Thanks.

[@wimhance6541]

Congratulations on your 100th, that went swiftly (for me.) I'd been guessing about the greater vision so this perspective, to a confirmed city rat, is yet more vicarious pleasure. Glad that non-natives still get a look in, important to play a little, and I love the two hundred year plan but what on earth is the Jurassic sector?

[@analoggirl]

Jurassic is probably referring to it being veryyy wet, lush, and over grown

[@wimhance6541]

@@analoggirl Perhaps, it is right next to the Bog.

[@FlockFingerLakes]

We're thinking of larger trees, larger-leaved plants so we can feel "small" in that area. :)

[@SequoiaElisabeth]

Thoughts, words, and action. The creative process! It looks like you are well on your way to realizing your dreams... even if you are not fully aware of them all. Wishing you all the best!

[@FlockFingerLakes]

Thank you Elisabeth, always a great supporter.

[@gregernst1364]

Good to see a holistic plan coming together! Don't get stuck on specifics, every good plan evolves over time. Maybe I missed this, are you all intending on the peripheral houses sold to permanent owners, leased year to year, or somehow rented on a more temporary basis ?

[@FlockFingerLakes]

The common house, which we're all staying in now, will eventually be opened to family and friends, but our plan is to eventually have at least three homes for the three families of Flock members, leased out. The Meadow House in the meantime, which is the first place we're renovating, will serve as one of those surrogate homes for us in the meantime. Some of our initial discussions revolve around having an Artist-Scientist-in-Residence program, which appeals to us too, but that will likely involve a different type of housing for shorter spans of time. All in all, too early to tell and make definitive decisions.

[@barbkrienke8400]

It has been so interesting watching your implementation of these large projects and seeing how your plans are maturing over time. I am especially loving the intermingling of your house projects with your visits to researchers and other people who are implementing and testing things that you want to work on in your own property. The video on reforesting with the 4 different test plots was fascinating, and I loved the visit to the family growing shiitake mushrooms, the amazing work being done to gather local seed and grow large numbers of these natives to repopulate large tracts of land, and the work on coaxing water to flow differently on the land! Well done!!!

[@LisaOsterholt]

If you are thinking about tiny houses in the Nut Grove, where would they park their vehicles especially in winter. I love that you have a plan. It is so practical to think through potential issues in advance. Thank you for sharing this with the community.

[@earthzeroapothecary]

I love the speakteasy!!

[@sabiaknows]

Thanks Summer for such a smart and generous video. Can you suggest some software to use during this planning process? Thanks again

[@FlockFingerLakes]

We've gone through lots of different software applications-finding the right ones that work for us, and imagine we're not through our searches. Right now, we're primarily using PhotoShop and drone imagery for planning out the land; and AirTable for keeping us organized with species lists, finances, project management, etc. We also use Fusion360 for doing the architectural layout of the buildings. We're still looking for a solid application (via phone) that does highly accurate GPS locations so we can map out / record / document what plants we're planting where. If anyone has suggestions, please feel free to let us know!

[@samchow9119]

Very inspiring video. Make me wanna get a piece of land.😅😅😅

[@ktbunnimorri8519]

I love your approach of permaculture and adjusting with the landscape, habitats etc.. it's very inspiring, for me especially, even if I am in a zone 9 currently. I am still able to use this as some sort of guide for my future plans and I thank you for the amazing videos! Keep it up Flock Fam! Hope I can come and visit after a B&B is established!! ;)

[@FlockFingerLakes]

Glad this information transcends zones!

[@emblarovardotter]

Regarding the deers: It seems like what the larger ecosystem around you need is more superpredators, I live in northern Sweden in a village with a local wolf pack and that comes with its issues (sheepattacks, not being able to have your dogs of leash) but the forest is really thriving! Even though I see deer almost every day the seedlings in the forest are left alone since the deer don't feel safe enough to stand still in shrouded places because of the predation. Moose still nibble on the young plants, but that is mainly in forestry plantations and I don't really care for those either so I say go ahead 😅

[@charlesbale8376]

A lot to think about, enjoyed the video.

[@rons3236]

Thanks for the overview Summer! You guys have a vision that is wonderful and inspiring. I'm so happy to be along for the ride! Someone commented about reintroducing the wolf or cougar to control deer pressure. I know you've got your hands full with everything already, but what would it take to actually make something like that happen?

[@FlockFingerLakes]

We wouldn't be able to make that decision. Those decisions likely come from the state through Propositions, but I would imagine that there needs to be a proper feasibility study for wolf reintroduction. For instance, a wolf pack's hunting territory is VERY large. At a minimum, it's usually around 32K acres and reintroduction typically happens in National Forests. To compare-The Finger Lakes National Forest is only half that territory (~16K acres). So you would need to ensure that there is enough territory for wolves to roam and expand. I think the Green Mountain National Forest, which is more like 821K acres, would be a more viable place for gray wolf reintroduction if it were to happen in this "general" region of the Northeast. Historically wolf reintroduction passes by narrow margins, but can imagine in the area of the. Green Mountains, it would be met with more interest. Here they are working on green corridors.. (we are considered to be in part of the "emerald necklace" but there are large expanses that are more developed too, so that's something that would need to be in consideration. As far as cougar reintroduction: they are elusive, but they are already here, so don't think they'll need to be "reintroduced" so to speak.

[@rosalivecokr]

hi Summer! do you also plan on doing a video about the insect life/wildlife/animals at flock?? :)

[@anastasiawak894]

Wow this was great. You guys inspire me and educate me on so much. I just love watching. The land is absolutely stunning. I’d like to claim a tiny X on that map for potential camp site 😜

[@FlockFingerLakes]

We're not sure when we'll get to the campsites just yet-but hopefully in due time!

[@carlosseptiencuevas1613]

i would add monke puzzle tree for something exotic and piñons in the main lawn, mixed with chessnuts for conservation.

[@naturewithgabe]

How do you plan to go about managing the non-native grasses that you might want to remove or knock back around the ponds? Turf-cutting? Herbicides? Smothering? Just curious!

[@TheEmbrio]

Greqt to have a layout ! It’s good to have a plan, but of course we all, already know it will shift, because those permaculture zone should be centered on the paths you use, from the most frequent to the least. So depending on how often you come in and out of the site, those roads should carry function too. Some zones 2 in your plan are quite far from living spaces or even useful paths. But you’ll iterate and see.

[@wolfbirdhomestead600]

Super inspiring stuff y’all are doing! Any particular reason you have a nut system separate from the orchard? Have you looked into “syntropic” style agroforestry? You could have something similar to mark Shepard, where you stack: annual garden, orchard, and livestock into a synergistic system. Any thoughts on using managed livestock to regenerate the land? Pigs/ruminants can create disturbances to activate the native seed bed. Have y’all discussed plans on growing membership? I’d love to take part in growing a regenerative community.

[@FlockFingerLakes]

The nut grove seemed to 'naturally' fit primarily in that section because there were already some substantial (50-70-year old) nut-producing trees in that area, namely oak and hickory-with easy access due to being close to the driveway. Additionally, we had to remove (and still need to remove some lingering) Japanese honeysuckle and multiflora rose in that area, so that left huge gaps in the understory to introduce some hazelnuts. There are also some pre-existing Ribes and Rubus in the area. Not sure if those are native but we surmise they are. It feels more "natural" of a system as opposed to one that is highly managed. What we're likely going to do is just prune out dead/dying/diseased branches and keep on being vigilant with the honeysuckle, multiflora rose, and the barberry. Plus that area is sandwiched right between the "Flower and Fruit" area-so even though we're not considering that area as a full-blown managed "orchard"-it primarily has fruiting trees and shrubs, like serviceberry, crabapple, beach plum, Cornus (various kinds), pear, plum, bayberry, Ribes, Rubus, Fragaria, and others. There are some repeats of those species in the orchard as well, but we definitely erred on more cultivated varieties in the orchard and more species types in the interstitial area. We think as we move forward, we'll begin to experiment with all sorts of different food production techniques-but it'll likely never just be food production just for ourselves. We've been really focused-at least at this stage-on bird/bug/wildlife habitat and food pockets. We think providing more and more spaces and food species for them will be a greater delight for us and help alleviate their food pressures over the seasons. As far as animals go, it's definitely within our purview but we're likely not going to bring on any until we're all here to manage the chores and responsibilities that come with fellow animal husbandry and kinship. In short: we're just not there yet. As far as membership growth-we're just not there yet either. We imagine as we begin finishing up renovations and home building, we'll start to discover ways we would open parts of Flock up to the community more.

[@germanplantguy3133]

Hey have you guys ever considered planting a small carnivorous garden? They are usually bog plants so ideal for wet areas like beside the lake ^^

[@janakituraga7438]

Hi! Fabulous. Have you considered natural farming on a piece of land?

[@FlockFingerLakes]

Because we're up for experimentation on this land, we'd imagine that we'd practice some form of natural farming as we move forward here.

[@Shaden0040]

Time to reintroduce the wolf.

[@kareharpies]

Cougar has made its way east 🙏

[@FlockFingerLakes]

We wouldn't be able to make that decision, though it would be interesting to explore, especially since there has been some successful reintroduction elsewhere (e.g., Yellowstone, AZ/CO, etc.). Those decisions likely come from the state through Propositions, but I would imagine that there needs to be a proper feasibility study. For instance, a wolf pack's hunting territory is VERY large. At a minimum, it's usually around 32K acres and reintroduction typically happens in National Forests. To compare-The Finger Lakes National Forest is only half that territory (~16K acres). So you would need to ensure that there is enough territory for wolves to roam and expand. I think the Green Mountain National Forest, which is more like 821K acres, would be a more viable place for gray wolf reintroduction if it were to happen in this "general" region of the Northeast.

[@ValeriaVincentSancisi]

With the chickens a thought .. you could put into a coop and make them part of the compost/veggie system or you could have the chickens and especially the ducks to move daily in the pastures as a system of mowing and fertilizing and yes you would be moving chickens every day instead of moving the poop out of the coop...

[@jeaniedickman6421]

Summer, what programs (or apps?) do you use for mapping the property and for keeping the lists of plants? The mapping would help me SO much. (My drawings don’t work out so well!😆)

[@FlockFingerLakes]

We simply use drone photos and photo shop.

[@nesekaba]

Love this! Very curious what the red and white garden will be? I don't know if you've talked about it elsewhere. But why red and white? What sorts of plants?

[@FlockFingerLakes]

For lack of a better name, we're just working with more red- and white-flowering plants; or ones that have white/red features other than flowers. We think it would make a nice entrance garden down at the road.

[@nesekaba]

@@FlockFingerLakes Very cool! Why did you choose the colors red and white?

[@cefcat5733]

My dreams aren't even as big as your plans. Those deer are too smart, hungry and silly. Would 'big chickens' like geese, be able to keep them on the other side of the fence?

[@lydianicolenorwick125]

Summer, do you have a video about the programs you use for mapping?

[@FlockFingerLakes]

We've shared some of our mapping techniques in our '10 Tools' video, but here, we're just using Photoshop with drone images.

[@lydianicolenorwick125]

@@FlockFingerLakes thank you! I appreciate your reply. We're moving into our dream property Saturday! Can't wait to get started.

[@Cl0ckcl0ck]

Did you consider getting a few outdoor dogs to keep the deer (and chicken snatchers) away? They would love to live with you.

[@bryanhumphreys940]

You need some mountains lions! They eat a deer a week on average and don't attack people (usually).

[@FlockFingerLakes]

There have been sighting here but I guess they aren't plentiful enough.

[@GLFLex]

What is the software you used for the mapping

[@FlockFingerLakes]

Just photoshop at this point with a drone image, at least what you see in this video.

[@dustygreene3335]

I'm curious what your future water plans are? Ie Grey water....septic and then plans for Ponds and lake...will you be trying to create any flowing water? Also any aquaculture plans...ie fish, mussels, edible water plants etc?

[@FlockFingerLakes]

Right now the two places are on septic and that actually goes through the meadow area, where we are growing more wet-loving plant species. We're open to considering more home composting techniques for the future spaces. There was also an interesting technique we saw at a school in Philadelphia where they used a grey water 'waterfall' system used to purify the water via the way in moved down a series of "naturalistic" water steps. It's rooted in Japanese water purification. Things like that interest us. But we are starting to think about water management on the land, which we touch upon in this video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/i4DGc5usg9uGesU. This space was set up for water movement and irrigation (with 5 wells too!), so we'll be approaching that again. We do have two streams and springs on the land, so we may be working with them more in the future. Pond scaping and management will be a 2023-2024 project. Those will be big projects.

[@JoannaLouise200]

Do you have a Zone 6 for naughty people? 😉

[@Lillystromhollow]

Are they all polyamorous?

[@ramthian]

Hi babe x

[@TDN3052]

Would you ever consider reintroducing wolves in the "wilderness areas" to curtail the deer population more naturally? Is that practical or possible or legal by any stretch of the imagination?

[@FlockFingerLakes]

We wouldn't be able to make that decision. Those decisions likely come from the state through Propositions, but I would imagine that there needs to be a proper feasibility study. For instance, a wolf pack's hunting territory is VERY large. At a minimum, it's usually around 32K acres and reintroduction typically happens in National Forests. To compare-The Finger Lakes National Forest is only half that territory (~16K acres). So you would need to ensure that there is enough territory for wolves to roam and expand. I think the Green Mountain National Forest, which is more like 821K acres, would be a more viable place for gray wolf reintroduction if it were to happen in this "general" region of the Northeast.

[@burtnation1357]

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