Flywoo Cinerace20: My favourite 2" Cinewhoop!

[@Kitsunefase]

Man, you should be really sent more quads for testing. You are the only one who analyzes quads this detailed and provide tuning tips! I am amazed!

[@ChrisRosser]

I've got the X220 V2 review coming up soon. Don't miss it it's going to be a good one!

[@billmcdonald4335]

Nice touch to the tune. I can definitely see it's much smoother. I've been applying your setup advice to my little bird, an ET100, and I've managed to get it to fly like a dream in angle mode. Between the tips I got from both you and Mark over at UAV Tech, I've turned that thing into a whole different quad. I could barely get it to do what I wanted for three years, thinking it was my lack of ability. That's right; I flew a toaster for three whole years before stumbling across your channel. However, in the month or so it took, I feel you and Mark took me on a master class, for now I'm working my setup and getting results I want - even without a blackbox. Would that I could kick in some dosh, but I'm on a fixed income; my choice of kit will tell you that. But I've subbed, I like the vids, and comment whenever the mood strikes. Keep up the excellent work, Chris. This old duffer really appreciates it.

[@ChrisRosser]

I really appreciate the subscription and am very happy you are enjoying the videos. Every subscriber really counts and is helping so much with my interactions with companies in the hobby!

[@billmcdonald4335]

@@ChrisRosser Not only do I enjoy your presentation style, your advice has added huge value to my meagre investment, and has been a huge boost to my confidence. I had over two decades of flight sim experience before I switched to drones. I had an idea they were tricky to fly, but not as tricky as a factory-built ET100. The factory-supplied tune sux & blows simultaneously, and they assemble the things wrong in the first place: the hoops are too high to be effective. I mounted them under the frame and the noise level was cut by half, and I got much better response by that than anything I was doing to it in Betaflight. I told LDARC about that and they sent me a Google-translated 'thanks for your interest' reply, and told me it's a discontinued product. Once I discovered that, that's when I stopped listening to the "if you're happy with it, don't tune it" advice that I was following, and looked up 'tune betaflight' and went from there; one of yours was near the top, I clicked, and ended up flyin' a beast. Thanks again.

[@billmcdonald4335]

I don't mean to harsh on LDARC here. Just reporting my experience. Their stuff is good value for the money; it survived all the crashes I could throw at it for three years, after all. I'm actually trying to stockpile parts, coz I do love the little thing.

[@samavella8831]

Hi Chris, I’m very late to seeing this review and came across it since I just purchased the latest CineRace 20 DJI O3 with Crossfire. Since most of the major hardware components are the same, I’m curious to know if your tune could be used for this new version as well? Have you considered doing a review of this latest release? Thanks 🙏

[@SpinUpMedia]

Hi Chris. Great review as usual. Do you think I can use this for the new O3 version?

[@kontachim]

Thanx! Video is very useful. I like this cinewhoop too. And your tunings really improve stability. It's very cool! Thanx again. The only thing, i would like to notice, as for me they (manufacturer) placed a GoPro mount to close to the bow and installed camera makes dron unbalanced, heavier to the bow. It feels especially when flying indoor - slowly. I installed geprc Gopro mount (+1 hole drilled in the middle of mount) closer to the battery ( to the middle) using the first frame frame carrying screw. And felt huge difference at the Drone's control.

[@gandaulf_fpv6925]

Alright Mr. Rosser I just ordered. Looks really nice and well designed. I trust your judgement and I am curious about the changes to the tune. I'm sure your adjustments will be spot on as usual. Thanks buddy.

[@rctom1]

Hello CR , thats the best rewiev I `ve see on this whoop, surely one comming after the other but you give so mutch explenation with a ton of scientific background that´s amazing for sure. I ´m really impressed. (JB can´t do it better,lol)

[@ChrisRosser]

Thanks! That means so much to me. I'm hoping to do lots more reviews like this and give people suggestions for awesome tunes for all these new quads. 👍

[@rctom1]

@@ChrisRosser All the FPV or RC community has to thank YOU cause u´r able to explain the physics in an entertainment and exactly way that people can understand and benefit from your knowlege.

[@k4x4map46]

clean review very clean footage great job!

[@ChrisRosser]

Thanks for watching. I appreciate the support!

[@loop_fpv1261]

hey Chris now u got 9.5k subs,,congratzz,,im from 3k

[@ChrisRosser]

Thank you! I'm glad so many people are enjoying my videos and yours as well!

[@loop_fpv1261]

@@ChrisRosser Top fan from Sri Lanka hehe🍻☺️

[@chrisyoung8062]

I was just about to pull a trigger on a cinelog25 but now I need to recalculate.

[@ChrisRosser]

Having lots of good options does make things tricky!

[@chrisyoung8062]

@@ChrisRosser So I ended up with both. I purchased the Cinerace20 but I also built a Cinelog25 which turned out really well and flies great. The Cinelog25 turns out to be a little too much to fly in the house, although I might try a severe scaled throttle limit like 50%. The Cinerace20 on the other hand is pretty easy to control indoor.

[@PiraphuRajamohan]

What if you get errors after on the motor test after applying bel heli?

[@41ofus1]

Hi ! I have cinerace20 analog pro and I have problem with range…it’s very very poor. Do u have any advice? I have cobra S google

[@Euwanh85]

I am curious why did you not flash with bluejay?

[@ChrisRosser]

This vido was made before I spoke with BF devs and learned more about BlueJ. I recommend BlueJ now. 👍

[@Euwanh85]

@@ChrisRosser any recommeneded settings for that?

[@artifixialtoxidrome5676]

Same question here, would be interrested if bluejay works, and what settings...

[@droneready8278]

Love this little quad... Certainly considering it since I got an e l r s t x

[@philm0303]

Hey Chris, i was thinking a lot about ordering the CineRace 20, and your opinion led me to finally buy it. Thanks for your great content, I am currently working through your BF4.3 Filtering and Tuning videos, trying to craft a checklist I can use for setting up a DIY quad. I know this is maybe a bit too much to ask, but will you maybe provide a Tune for the CineRace 20 on BF4.3? Your amibitons remind me of Project Mockingbird, and I'd love to fly a tune of your excellent knowledge on my CineRace 20 with BF4.3. I saw that the new BF4.3 presets also have a place for BNF presets, which seem to be empty until now. Maybe this could be a great kickoff. Greeting from Germany!

[@nz2764]

Hello, do you know where to find CLI for BF 4,4 ?

[@Mattylite_FPV]

Hey Chris! I just got the Cinerace20 as well and I noticed that the props were not seated to the ducts. Do you think there would be a benefit if I seated the props like on the shendrones squirt?

[@ChrisRosser]

I don't think so. Having the props cut into the ducts seems to create a risk of smoking a motor and the perfromance benefit would be pretty small (just a few percent). I've done a video on how ducts work for cinewhoops and they don't rely on the prop blade being close to the duct at all.

[@alperenozgur]

what happens if i put 1404 5500 motors in it? can be flyable and possible to balance it for same performance?

[@wearemany73]

So let’s have a whip-round and get Rosser a strimmer? 😁❤️

[@ChrisRosser]

Never! How else will I improve my piloting skills?

[@zombie.cycles]

Hi, I tryed your tune with 1303 5000kv motors and with p and d 1.5, I have flyaway and motors get hot. 1.1 is better but motors still burning. from this motors at 6000 rounds i have 1086, changed that to 8.6. stock tune worked quite good.

[@ChrisRosser]

What was the air temperature when you were flying? Did you make the mechanical modifications suggested in the video to reduce vibration?

[@Mike-mk7qt]

Great video, all thumbs up 👍👍👍

[@whoopsquad]

Thank the kwad gawds I found you!!! This quad comes with shambolic settings😂😂😂

[@robert_g_fbg]

How does the audible quality compare to other cine whoops? Considering this class of quad is meant for flying near folks, the annoyance factor should be reviewed as well. Maybe it’s just me, I like my tech stealthy. Enjoying your contributions, and am glad to be a patreon member. Cheers!

[@ChrisRosser]

It's quite high pitched and reasonably loud but it doesn't feel too intimidating to me. Certainly not compared to a 3in cinewhoop which can be quite scary! Thank you for your support 🙏😁

[@yoni8542]

Hello ! could you help me send me the configuration of your drone please! I accidentally factory reset via betaflight! flywoo sent me a configuration but something goes wrong, I can't arm it!

[@dariuszrogowski2360]

Hi Chris, thank you for your content it is very helpful. Could you help me with the installation of vista module I don't have OSD info in my V1. many thanks

[@margonsales1]

Hi, please, this frame can fit a RunCam Split 3 Micro/Nano?? Thanks!!!

[@ChrisRosser]

Yes, absolutely. The split 3 micro will fit. The nano would need a nano to micro camer adaptor.

[@Shauny_D]

would you tune the dynamic idle the same way in 4.3?

[@ChrisRosser]

Similar. I have a video for dynamic idle on 4.3

[@rmph001]

Hey Chris! thanks a lot for this video (and all the others of course, really love your very insightful and informed content). This review actually convinced me to go for this bnf and i could not be happier of the choice. This quad is fantastic to fly indoor and outdoor, is packed with a lot of technology to thinker with and flies amazingly. Have two questions about this though: - would you see any possibility or need to update to BF 4.3 or you think it's better to leave it alone since it already flies well? - DVR audio picked by the mic on the quad is VERY noisy. Did you also have notice this or is just my issue?

[@artifixialtoxidrome5676]

Thanx a lot for your nice and straightforward review! I really love your channel and already learned a lot! And by the way, i also bought a cinerace20 hd, and i really love it! I tried to follow most of your recommendations (flashed esc's, turned on bidirectional dshot, dialed in your settings in betaflight) but since i'm a total newbee i still have two problems / questions. 1) you mentioned that you shortened the vtx antenna. How can i do that? Do you have any advice how to do it? Seems to be a tricky job? 2) i still have pretty bad low frequency vibrations after punch outs / while descending. In fact the propwash is so bad, it sometimes turns the whole drone for about 45 degrees to the left / downwards in one big jerk. I already thougt, maybe this is a problem of vibrations from the antenna (see question 1) But maybe you have other suggestions? I fly without any extra camera mounted, just the whoop, like it came from the manufacturer. I'd be really happy about every advice! thanx :-)

[@ChrisRosser]

Hi! Happy to hear my videos helped. The easiest thing to do is buy a shorter antenna or find a way to mount the antenna to the arm. I like the iFlight sigma UFL antenna if you have a vista.

[@ChrisRosser]

Whoops struggle with propwash. The best thing to do is to find some lower pitch props and setup and increase dynamic idle in BF.

[@artifixialtoxidrome5676]

@@ChrisRosser Hello Chris, i'm still wondering if it's possible to shorten the original antenna. And you also mention this in your video, and it also looks like you shortened the original. But how is this possible? Just carefully dremel the tube away? but how did you take care about the cable inside? Sorry for my questions, but this freaky long antenna drives me crazy, and it's also in the way when storing the whoop. So i'd love to also shorten it a bit... Thanx for your help!

[@HindsightFPV]

Hey Chris great video, I have one on the way and I'm thinking out using a naked Vista with a nebula nano pro but I'm questioning the airflow with that frame. Do you have any thoughts about that?

[@ChrisRosser]

What about the airflow is worrying you?

[@HindsightFPV]

@@ChrisRosser thanks for the reply, I'm just concerned because the area that holds the Vista looks awfully boxed in. Seems like airflow would only come from the top or bottom of that area. If I'm running a naked Vista I just wouldn't want to cook anything because of insufficient airflow.

[@carlosrito]

Do you think I can put the insides of this quad DJI version ,on the iflight alpha 85 frame?for a lighter build

[@ChrisRosser]

If the prop size is 2" that should be fine!

[@doctorpuente]

Hello, thanks for the review, one question, how do I do if beta flight does not recognize the drone, and what place on the board is to press and boot?..gracias!

[@ChrisRosser]

Hi Aarón, if you head over to my discord server you can get help with this issue in the support hanger: discord.gg/KHJWTmqSw8

[@doctorpuente]

@@ChrisRosser I found it, thank you!

[@BimoWicaksono]

hi Chris, thanks for the wonderful tune tutorial, i have a question though, i tried to flash the esc using bluejay rather than BL Heli M, but I can't turn on the rpm filtering toggle on bf 4.2.8, do you know why? is it because I'm using bluejay rather than BL Heli M ? thanks before 🙏

[@ChrisRosser]

Bluejay should work. I would head over to my discord and ask the ground crew in the support hanger.

[@BimoWicaksono]

thanks for the prompt reply, I did resolved the problem, I downgraded the BF configurator to 10.7.2 and the bidirectional dshot toggles works again, recently i upgraded my BF configurator to 10.8.0 due my plan to upgrade the fc to 4.3, but it seem the BF 10.8.0 can't work flawlessly with fc 4.2

[@TERBANGFPV]

Speedybee blackboc viewer can directly access the log in this FC? If yes its very helpful in the field

[@ChrisRosser]

I think so! The blackbox explorer and PID toolbox on the PC is probably more useful for tuning though.

[@TERBANGFPV]

@@ChrisRosser hi again Chris.. about the disabling all gyro lpf, is it really need to still add single lpf2 at 1000hz if running 4k pidloop and dshot300 ? what if not use that and completely disable all gyro lpf like on your other filter recomendation? i never really notice about the anti-aliasing effect from the pidloop down sample from 8k to 4k..

[@ChrisRosser]

@@TERBANGFPV If you turn off all gyro lpf while running at 4k Betaflight will enable a two point average on the gyro data. Much better to have gyro lpf 2 at 1000Hz than the two point average filter!

[@TERBANGFPV]

@@ChrisRosser better in terms of what? Latency or noise attenuation? Is so than all f4 fc if running rpm filter needs to have lpf2 enabled?

[@TERBANGFPV]

i flew mine and watch the stock blackbox log. its so clean... but dunno why after i tear apart the quad to remove the smo cable the gyro become very noisy.. maybe i broke the 25v caps?

[@robzFPV000]

Vary informative...you obviously know the tech end of it. I just subscibed. This Cinerace20 seems to the best cinewhoop by far out there to date. You twisted my arm. I think i'm gonna get me one.. :) Can a guy use a 3S battery on this? I have a ton of 850ties and 650ties?

[@ChrisRosser]

I think you could ues a 3S yes but it would be a little less powerful.

[@chrisyoung8062]

On the topic of tuning Dynamic Idle and dshot idle I did discover something that I guess shouldn't be all that surprising. Finding the RC value (i.e. 1035 or whatever) for a given RPM changes with props on or props off. I'm not suggesting that anyone do this tuning with props on. In fact please don't! I felt comfortable doing it because of the prop guards and I found a safe way to hold down the quad so it couldn't get away and I would NEVER do this with something like a 5" quad. The RC throttle value is higher with props on which makes sense because of the load the props put on the motor. In my case the difference was 1044 with props off to 1053 with props on to achieve 4800 RPM (this is on a 2.5" quad).

[@ChrisParayno]

Well done! Sold.

[@ChrisRosser]

Thank you! Appreciate the kind support 🤠

[@ChrisParayno]

@@ChrisRosser question, what do you think about the nano hex?!

[@MountaineerFPV]

This in the 03 Air unit………SOLD 👍👍👊🇺🇸

[@epicdroneworks3898]

Hey Chris! I am wondering what kind of flight time your getting with that total weight around 220 grams cinewhooping? I am thinking about picking one up because ive heard great flight times but would love your take on the 550mah

[@ChrisRosser]

It's right at the end of the video. 7-8mins without naked camera. 4-5mins with.

[@thfpv4974]

Awesome 👌

[@ChrisRosser]

Thanks Tony!

[@samseazyfpv]

Can this frame carry 1206 6s motors? Does it make sense to run it on 6s?

[@ChrisRosser]

I don't think it makes sense to run 6S on such a small quad. The 6S batteries are quite a bit heavier. I think 4S is probably the best for this little guy.

[@samseazyfpv]

@@ChrisRosser with an 6s 450? I fly 4s 650 on 2" easily. Especially on a pusher setup. The 6s 450 is slightly heavier. But the motors with 1206 are heavier too.. I'd like to test that.. But not sure about the height of the motors. Will they fit in the cinerace 20 frame?

[@chupsymoto1414]

do yo have pids for 10.8 betaflight?

[@ChrisRosser]

You can use the same PIDs for 4.2 and 4.3

[@darkmann12]

Coincidence that both you and quadmovr post a video about this quad just minutes apart?

[@sendorm]

And Nick Burns and Gal Kremer. This is how marketing works. Also Albert Kim and Drone Camps RC :)

[@darkmann12]

@@sendorm Huh, I'm only subscribed to the two I mentioned. Interesting that it's so widespread

[@GTXgb-gt8lz]

@@darkmann12 they probably got the quad early for review and flywoo gave them a set time to release the reviews

[@darkmann12]

@@GTXgb-gt8lz meahwhile quadmovr: doesn't talk and just rips lol

[@ChrisRosser]

No coincidence. The product was launched today and there was an embargo date and time. I've been lucky enough to play around with the Cinerace20 for a week or so already.

[@jotun3652]

Forgot the time table?

[@ChrisRosser]

Whoops! Thanks, added!

[@sadboybushido]

Really really strong jello. But that's expected on a 2inch.

[@ChrisRosser]

There is definitely some Jello but only on full throttle punchouts which you won't be doing with a Cinewhoop so i don't see that as a limitation. For a 2" the video is super smooth for cinewhooping around even without stabilisation.

[@sadboybushido]

@@ChrisRosser talking about full throttle. Any idea why it's called cineRACE? Is it supposed to be from the same category as the HGLRC Racewoop?

[@sadboybushido]

@@ChrisRosser by the way, I'd love to see you review the Racewoop. Seems like an interesting little beast. Very nice review by the way. Chill voice and nice vibe. Thanks!

[@ChrisRosser]

I don't know. It's a pure Cinewhoop. You aren't racing anything with ducts! Prop guards yes. But not ducts.

[@NOIZYB]

looks shaky

[@ChrisRosser]

It's only a little drone so some shake is probably inevitable.