Colt's Prototype Scaled-Down Model 1910 in .38/9.8mm

[@jamesgilbert124]

When you forget your 1911 in your IWB holster and it goes through the wash.

[@stephen7571]

It would be very clean!,!

[@Pen2penguin]

hate it when that happens

[@paulsimmons5726]

Too funny!

[@cedricpidde2633]

Very depressing mornings they are

[@georgesakellaropoulos8162]

That's funny. I like the way you think.

[@Axemantitan]

I notice that it uses a lot of the ergonomic improvements that went into the 1911A1: Curved backstrap, longer hammer spur, shorter trigger, etc.

[@F1ghteR41]

I suspect it was part of the 1929 refurbishment Ian mentioned. This example doesn't have those: www.rockislandauction.com/detail/56/3554/experimental-colt-model-1910-98-mm-pistol-serial-number-4

[@parrotraiser6541]

As Ian was describing the history of that piece, it was hard to hear him over the sound of the collector value whooshing upwards. Rarity, condition, history, curiousity value...

[@Gangxisiyu]

"One of a Kind" gets tossed around a LOT but...there it is.

[@F1ghteR41]

The one in the original condition (№4), however, sold below expectations in 2012: www.rockislandauction.com/detail/56/3554/experimental-colt-model-1910-98-mm-pistol-serial-number-4

[@SteamCrane]

@@F1ghteR41 Put your mouse over the main photo on that page and move your mouse wheel. Shows how they shrunk it.

[@F1ghteR41]

@@lostalone9320 Let's just wait and see how this one would sell.

[@bradlybellant3975]

@@lostalone9320 the finish on it is orgasmic along side with the other stuff

[@Brawler_1337]

That thing is in immaculate condition. Holy crap, it’s gorgeous.

[@glockparaastra]

Sure is!

[@42ZaphodB42]

This doesn't seem to have been moved at all

[@mmclaurin8035]

Few pistols are as sexy as a polished steel 1911

[@skepticalbadger]

@@42ZaphodB42 Read the description.

[@42ZaphodB42]

@@skepticalbadger Damn. I was right 😁

[@eizol568]

You can tell Ian is excited and trying to get the story out as quick as he can 😄

[@therealcarlxii]

Totally

[@derain95]

Yeah I almost thought I left 1,25/1,5 playback speed on but no, just a happy Ian.

[@lamborghinimiurap4005]

You wanna go bowling cousin?

[@eizol568]

@@lamborghinimiurap4005 “Sorry man got shit to do.Can’t bowl with you right now”

[@Punkaraprectv]

00000000000

[@MrChispa06]

1911: What are you? 1910: I am you, but smol

[@swampratt36]

Learn something every day , wow I'm 60+ and never knew this . Thanks very much .

[@roman_sudneko]

Looking forward to watch C&R's many-hour episode on 1911...

[@davidbrennan660]

The Universe might reach Temperature death a week before the episode is aired.

[@lordhefman]

Othias is going to need a bigger table if he is going to cover the variations and guns leading up to the 1911. A literal pile of 1911s.

[@pscwplb]

I wish Ian had showcased the tiny legs that pistol spontaneously grew that enabled it to walk out of the Colt Museum and into a private collection.

[@worldtraveler930]

I second that motion.

[@andrewweninger1059]

I think he covered a video about one of the worst perpetrators of the thefts from the Colt museum collection.

[@SlavicCelery]

In the additional info of the video, he indicates that it was sold onto the civilian market. Could have been during one of the numerous bankruptcies Colt is known for.

[@pscwplb]

@@SlavicCelery that would do it

[@randymagnum143]

Their ought to be a museum dedicated to the incompetence and ineptitude of Colt's management and unions in the later half of the 20th century up to their demise.

[@stacybrown3714]

Okay so my Colt 22 ACE made for civilians in 1937 is this size. It has more "1911a1" style than this example, but it is this size. I know from 1931 to 1941 only 10000ish were made. I didn't know about this"1910" prototype. Thanks for bringing this gun to us. It appears there is more to this story.

[@2nd_a_dad4791]

Content like this is why Ian is one of my favorite GunTuber guys.

[@bulkhungry]

Ian : " ..and nobody's going to put them into production now " Kel Tec and Ruger simultaneously : " Hold mah beer ! "

[@randomidiot8142]

Ruger would probably wait for keltec to do most of the legwork and then introduce theirs later. Or SW. They don't really have anything all that special or unique.

[@glennruscher4007]

Chamber it in .30 acp/shortened M-1 carbine brass with modern powder. 7.62x21 ?

[@randomidiot8142]

@@glennruscher4007 sounds like a 32 hr magnum automatic, or a 7.65 french long.

[@brandontanis388]

I'd buy one

[@cymond]

@@randomidiot8142 What has Ruger copied from KelTec recently? The only thing I know about is the P3AT -> LCP I want a Ruger Sub2000 and CP33

[@SafetyProMalta]

Colts travails in "what if" moments go back a long way...

[@richardlathrop61]

More like preserving market share by threatening competitors. The Winchester-Colt gentleman's agreement comes to mind.

[@mikepette4422]

Ahhh yes the famous 9.8 mm cartridge ! So many of us grew up on the wonderful 9.8 mm errrrr

[@Xenophon_Xanthippus]

Serial number 2 might be sitting in an old mans collection right now, and no one knows about it. Wild.

[@silvirhunter3607]

I could imagine he still has the original box of ammo for it since that round never got.. er.. around.

[@glockparaastra]

Now CZ (Colt) needs to get these back into production!

[@ScottKenny1978]

It's basically a Baby Rock.

[@theodorehunter4765]

@@ScottKenny1978 Baby Rocks are smaller than this.

[@Broken_Yugo]

There are already a couple slightly more scaled down 1911s on the market in .380 ACP.

[@anthonyoer4778]

@@0neDoomedSpaceMarine Bolt or Colt which is it heretic.

[@ScottKenny1978]

@@0neDoomedSpaceMarine because this isn't as big as a 1911.

[@richardtoms9161]

I have always loved the 1911 pistol. I have fairly large beefy hands and the size of the gun is just really comfortable to use for me.

[@xb0xisbetter]

I was going to say the same thing. The 1911 fits me like a glove. I think it is poetic given that I grew up drooling over the things until I finally bought a Colt as my very first firearm.

[@georgesakellaropoulos8162]

The cool thing about the M1911 is that it fits smaller hands, too.

[@Soravia]

1911 was meant to be made with American 10mm Auto. Browning just didn't have the powder to make it happen.

[@brogeoti]

Ian, fascinating pistol: it exhibits M1911A1 Transitional features such as the arched mainspring housing, the extended grip safety (beavertail), the stamped trigger, the full-checkered walnut grip panels and the slide roll markings of pistols produced in the 1920's while not having the finger cutouts behind the triggerguard.

[@Nate-bd8fg]

God damn that gun has never even seen a bullet. Looks like it just came of the conveyer

[@fishdisc7022]

Wow, didn't know Colt started it's work on 10mm in 1910

[@5_qm610]

I just watched your video on the history of Colt, good timing with releasing this!

[@joshbarnett1090]

The last time I was this early, the 1911 was an ideal service pistol.

[@icepicjoey]

It still is. I carried one before I retired and still do.

[@randomprojectsusa5196]

Underrated comment, even though it’s 8 minutes old lol

[@Minong_Manitou_Mishepeshu]

Still is buddles.

[@Brawler_1337]

@@icepicjoey I wouldn’t say it’s ideal, but considering how minor the improvements to the Browning system have been over the last hundred years (linkless barrels and double stack magazines being the biggest) you certainly aren’t at all far behind the curve with one. There’s a reason why so many new pistols are effectively product improved 1911s: Browning’s system is just awesome.

[@brianbetts3444]

Saw this in the current RIA auction catalog I got in the mail and was thinking this would be a interesting gun for Ian to make a video about. Lol. Thanks for the great videos.

[@haydnjenkins7607]

I owned a Star. 380 scaled down 1911 pattern , much smaller than your Colt, gorgeous little, gun every time I decided to sell it I'd go to the range to give it a goodbye shoot, and realise how nice it shot as a backup pistol loved it until the 1995 UK handgun ban.

[@IndianaJoe3]

I think I found Fireplace Guy's next gun. :)

[@bkilpatrick68]

Interesting it has an arched mainspring housing. Guessing that was a part of the work done in 1929.

[@ditzydoo4378]

Ah! this is why with the 1929 museum re-work of this gun we see an "arched" main spring housing, part of the 1911-A1 make-up over the older straight housing 1911's.

[@F1ghteR41]

You're correct, the original ones didin't have all that: www.rockislandauction.com/detail/56/3554/experimental-colt-model-1910-98-mm-pistol-serial-number-4

[@JerryEricsson]

it reminds me a lot of a Colt Combat Commander in .38 Super my old police Chief carried when I first signed onto the police force in my home town. I got hired because I was the only Vietnam Vet who applied and they had a special deal with the VA where the fed would pay half my wages for the first 9 months of employment and I would need to be employed for one year or they would have to refund the money to the Fed. The Chief's pistol was nickeled and was very pretty indeed, we used to kid him that he carried a pimp gun but he never took it very seriously.

[@turbogerbil2935]

It'd be interesting to have an update on the realised auction price. I'm guessing that pistol will go for a very large number.

[@JimYeats]

Yes. It will go for not one, not two, but five boxes of 9mm ammo.

[@georgesakellaropoulos8162]

@@JimYeats Now it's 10 rounds in a baggie.

[@comiketiger]

What a beautiful pistol! Thanks for showing this!

[@wilsonj4705]

And Colt mucks up another opportunity for a winner. Amazing they lasted as long as they did.

[@victorvonmagnum6270]

Now that is a true forlorn gun. Dare I even call it a forgotten weapon?

[@MrLobstermeat]

OMG that thing as nice as they come! Wow

[@michaelpaz8940]

The Baby Nambu to the 1911’s Papa Nambu with the 50 GI 1911 being the Grandpa Nambu

[@randykreps3519]

Thanks Ian! Now you made me want a Commander in 9mm. Always informative and entertaining! Keep up the great work.

[@dda774]

Enjoyed this, as I do with then all. You mentioned where this could have gone. Well I have a Browning 1911 - .380 that is about 85% of my full size 1911. It is a pleasure to shoot, when I could get .380 ammo. It's small and light enough to be a carry gun.

[@russbilzing5348]

It's always fun when Ian gets so involved in the presentation of something so rare and previously unknown to the rest of the world that he has to be careful not to swallow his tongue. Now, I'm 6'3" and I can one-hand a basketball, so you might think I'd love a good sized pistol. That is, indeed, true, and a 1911 is just fine in that area, as is a double stacked P-14 or a Coonan. I'm not sure why it is that I prefer a TT-33, then. Somehow, I've come to prefer the fit and feel of this Russian variant over the more likely 1911. So, when I saw the difference in size comparison, I knew I'd just love to try this on. Never gonna happen, I know, but now I have that unscratchable itch...

[@kingsolomoniii8594]

Browning kind of did this for their 1911-380 pistol. It’s a scaled down 1911 for 380. Fun guns to shoot.

[@tigerman3]

Definitely a "forgotten" part of 1911 lore. It seems to have futuristic look of the 1911A1. (Arched mainspring housing?) Thanks Ian!

[@Robert32064]

That mainspring housing makes you scratch your head. Colt evidently considered it right off the bat, unless it was changed in the refurb in 1929. It has the short trigger, too.

[@TWX1138]

@@Robert32064 I'm betting on the refurb, especially if they were using it for essentially marketing for the new pistols.

[@Robert32064]

@@TWX1138 www.rockislandauction.com/detail/56/3554/experimental-colt-model-1910-98-mm-pistol-serial-number-4 Note the mainspring housing, trigger length and grip safety tang on this pictured 1910.

[@KurtOnoIR]

That's a slick piece. Perfect size.

[@TheEpictrooper]

Reminds me a lot of the modern Browning Black Label 1911 in .380acp. It is a shrunk down 1911 that surprisingly fits well in the hand. (Which surprised me as I have quite the meathooks)

[@hughesr.6656]

Or the Springfield EMP.

[@fireguzzi.]

I was coming to make this same comment. Those black labels are very well done and great shooting little guns! Another "wish I hadn't sold it" situation.

[@stevenrush9862]

I think they should build this pistol and cartridge again . I want one .

[@joepiper6064]

Just bought a Browning 1911-380 85% smaller ! love it!

[@timmytyphoon]

Ian, I almost never comment on videos but I had to say this was awesome. Now all we need to do is convince somebody to mass produce this gun and I bet there would be one in every nightstand.

[@loupiscanis9449]

Thank you , Ian

[@AlessandroBottoni]

Very interesting gun. It's sad it never reached the market. Thanks for this video.

[@KageMinowara]

Watching Forgotten Weapons is what has made me want to learn gunsmithing. So I can make replicas of all these obscure, but wonderful firearms.

[@randomidiot8142]

Stop wanting and start doing, get a move on messing stuff up and getting that learning curve pointed upwards 👍

[@Gordonseries385]

Cool history! Thank you Ian Take Care

[@methodeetrigueur1164]

That really reminds me the FN « Grand Browning » 1910 in 9.65 x 23mm. Ian put a link at the end of the video.

[@Adf8702]

Love the history and storytelling. Super interesting. Thanks!

[@andywindes4968]

My great-grandfather, Will Zumwalt, and his brother Alec were ranchers in the Ft. Sumner area of New Mexico in the early 1900’s. In 1909, they were in a gunfight with another pair of brothers named Hall, and the Hall’s lost. (The local sheriff counted 21 holes in the body of one of the Hall’s.) Family legend has it that my great-grandfather and his brother were armed with .380 Colts, but I have questioned this for years. The .380 had only been introduced the year before, and it always seemed doubtful to me that two young ranchers operating in the far west would have the latest Colt pistols. It seems far more likely they were armed with a 1900, 1902, or 1903 Colt in .38 ACP. Unfortunately, the trial records for Will (he was charged with manslaughter and subsequently acquitted) make no mention of either the guns or the cartridges. I wonder what an old west historian would have to say about this? The Hall Brothers, legend has it, were armed with Colt SAA’s. It doesn’t seems like a fair fight either way.

[@hughbarton5743]

What a beauty!!!! Wow.... Thanks, Ian!

[@eisenkrieg553]

That's a shame because that frame size would be just perfect for my smaller size hands. That tiny bit of difference would be great for handling it better.

[@DH-xw6jp]

@@zoiders girth is always more important than length. Always.

[@zacharyrollick6169]

That cross hatching on the trigger makes me drool.

[@stevevanosdall416]

Seems like the closest thing to that would be a Springfield EMP; which, as I understand it, is a scaled down 1911 in 9mm. (They also make 'standard' 1911's in 9mm...) Kinda the same concept... but backwards.

[@harrystanton205]

It would be super cool if CZ/Colt brought this back to market in 9mm. It would be crazy expensive and probably not worth it over the newer fixes to 9mm 1911 problems, but it would be really interesting to see nonetheless.

[@The_Modeling_Underdog]

A true beauty of a pistol.

[@trooperdgb9722]

I like his technical descriptions... "equally squished"..

[@ericcook1300]

This might have been said but the Springfield EMP 4” seems to be a modern equivalent.

[@calvinbrodhead6199]

It is a really interesting story and a very beautiful gun. Thanks again for the content

[@JackedALF]

Reminds me of the Browning 1911-380, but 100 years earlier.

[@donovanchilton5817]

Great little pistol.

[@renegade44040]

Well the big question is where is that 38 the salesman checked out? That's got to be a special gun. A holy grail.

[@JerryEricsson]

Reminds me a lot of the little Star BM and BMK that I had, my Star PD was a bit smaller and the little Citadel that I have now is smaller but none of them look as sleek as that 1910. Comparison, the M1911 is like an Impala, the 1910 like the Corvette

[@itsapittie]

The .38 ACP was no slouch for its day. It clocked a 125 grain slug at a nominal 1,100 fps which makes it comparable to the 9mm parabellum's 124 grains at 1,150 fps. A 9mm in that slightly smaller frame size could have been a winner for some European military and even the .38 ACP should have interested someone.

[@simoncleret]

Browning currently make scaled-down 1911's in .380 ACP, if anyone is interested. They're 85% scale.

[@paulbervid1610]

Ian you are a genius, the should have called it the "squished ".

[@thelemon0001]

The best handgun ever, but with slightly less of it.

[@DK-gy7ll]

This pistol has obvious post-1925 features on it... arched mainspring housing, A1 grip safety, thumb safety and slide stop... and the front part of the slide is darker meaning it was heat treated which Colt didn't start doing until 1925 on the 1911A1. Also the rollmarks are definitely post-WW1 era. I believe this pistol was actually newly-made around 1929 like you mentioned at the end of your video.

[@philiptynan9159]

Wow, what a beautiful gun.

[@AnimeFan_2013]

6:02 - lol I should add this to my wishlist, just seems neat

[@Shootsmith]

Browning currently makes their similar 1911-380 that is a 15% scaled down 1911

[@ScottKenny1978]

As does Rock Island.

[@stevenclark2188]

That surface finish and engraving on the slide looks like it was just made a year ago.

[@283blood]

Apparently they fired this thing once every five years, then cleaned it with baby soft cotton balls, before storing it in a royal velvet box. I have a 38 Super 1911 that is half the age of this pistol that doesn't look that good. Props to who ever owned this for gun care.

[@nicholasfoldes2970]

Fair quality and reasonable caliber for the times it was produced

[@yosoyinfinitus8927]

Gonna be my first handgun. It runs it’s generations in our fam

[@fortressalaska9822]

FN does make an 85% sized 1911 for the .380 ACP, a very nice gun.

[@williammcdorman6426]

Nicely made, must be nice to have craftsmen to make you something like that just to give them some mental exercise.

[@markspencer3612]

It's also got the extended tang on the grip safety .

[@FireflyActual]

Would be interesting to have a look at an early 1911 in .38 Super.

[@Mikkemeister]

Now there's an idea for CZ/Colt, make them in 9x19, slightly modernized (trigger, beavertail, sights). 😁

[@RalphReagan]

So beautiful!! Beautiful ❤

[@CurtHowland]

A few years ago I did a test shooting of a 1911-pattern 9mm, that was itself scaled down to be a compact 9mm. I found it to be horrible, it felt unsafe, awful to shoot, I wanted nothing to do with it. One of the other testers marked it as the best he'd shot that day. Just goes to show, pistols really are a personal thing.

[@michaeldelucci4473]

This pistol was used in Hollywood film's because they had a problems with 45 acp blanks. The early war films of the late 1920s and 1930's

[@jamesbussey2911]

I don't blame the salesman for failing to return the pistol he checked out in 1922..."If they want it back, they just need to ask me and I'll return it." Meanwhile your buddy in the company armoury 'files' the loan form in return for a bottle of single malt...👍 Once again proof that the 1911 Colt is the most handsome automatic pistol ever made, when one takes a look at the originals.

[@seekertwo1]

Excellent video. I wonder what would have happened if Colt had introduced this model in 9mm instead of the Commander for the post-WWII pistol trials.. ..

[@fredk97]

Dimensional comparison between this gun and an M57 Tokarev is even closer than that of the 1911

[@TheLambdaGuy]

The design hasn't changed at all

[@usbiv223]

“Equally Squished” is the name of my new band!

[@jonathanrogers9961]

Browning has the 85% scale 380s. Got to shoot one. I was impressed.

[@mazkact]

Precursor to the Browning and RIA .380 1911'sh pistols. Sweet.

[@thehairball5526]

What a beauty.

[@jonminer9891]

Hi, Ian. I agree about "What could have been" especially for the civilian market. It looks like a much more suitable gun to carry than the 1911. It puts Glock styles to shame. As an aside, what is your opinion about the sale of Colt to CZ? CZ just announced that their plans to build a factory in Arkansa, I think, are "on hold" because of the COVID depression. Thanks for sharing! Stay healthy!

[@sebathadah1559]

CZ owns Colt? Good maybe their customer service will become better.

[@axelpatrickb.pingol3228]

@@sebathadah1559 Kind of ironic a company twice as young as Colt and served as a major Warsaw Pact arms manufacturer acquired it...

[@Ni999]

David Drake put out a video on CZ's recent announcement to not start production any time soon due to market conditions.

[@charles_wipman]

Looks spectacular; didn't Dillinger have one in FA and in .38 SPC?.

[@RiderOftheNorth1968]

No. .38 Special is a revolver cartridge. And an exellent one too.

[@kennethquesenberry2610]

I had heard of this pistol and cartridge before somewhere, probably in an article in American Rifleman. Only I thought it was from the late 20s or early 30s. Be that as it may be, in 1910, the .45 ACP was not a standard cartridge anywhere and (I think) only the Germans were using the 9mm by then. It seems to have been a common practice ever since cartridges became available that when a manufacturer introduced a model, they only chambered them in their own cartridges. So Colt would never chamber a Smith & Wesson cartridge or vice versa. And if they did (which they did), they'd call it something else. But proprietary cartridges are still being introduced. Some models of Star automatic pistols were quite similar to the "slightly smaller" 1911. In fact, Star made a wide variety of single action pistols, all variations of a Colt automatic.

[@aptminer9531]

Gun jesus dropping some gun knowledge on us with 32. french longue

[@williamstuart9812]

Beautiful. Looks like they updated it to A-1.

[@theodorehunter4765]

Someone should send this video to CZ since they bought Colt. Who knows? Maybe CZ would be interested in making them?

[@zacharyrollick6169]

Probably not. It's basically just a regular 1911 in .38 Super, just slightly smaller.

[@heinrichzerbe]

Holy shit, this gun is going to be sold for a fortune. I sure hope Ian will ad later on what it went for...

[@heinrichzerbe]

@@BatCaveOzThanks for the info. Saw that he didn't do it anymore, but didn't think too much about. Will definitely look this one up.

[@RefreshingDietDrPepper]

The last time I was this early, Hungarian Dragunovs cost less than $5,000 to buy from an importer.

[@JimYeats]

Well played. I wish you all success in trolling MAC for years to come!

[@patrickseaman]

Wow, it really is gorgeous!