Former GCC Pastor Abused and John MacArthur Knew?

[@allisonhartwell3528]

Also, regarding John MacArthur saying that he was told this was perpirtrated by a bitter x-wife. Why didn't he get on the phone and talk to the x-wife. It would have only taken a short conversation to see that she is not a bitter person looking for vengeance. Let me give some insight. This x-wife is my auntie. She is one of the most amazing godly ladies around. Paul was abusive to her in the way he treated her during their 4 year marriage. He left her with 2 very little girls to run off with an 18 year girl who was in his youth group (as he was a youth pastor). My aunt was the most amazing single mom, my parents stepped in and helped out a lot. My aunt never ranted or raved or even talked about Paul's ills against her and against his daughters in leaving them. She eventually met and married a wonderful young widower with 2 sons and they married. He became "father" to my 2 cousins and was a wonderful father. He and my aunt both served the Lord together and touched the lives of many hurting young people. My uncle passed away a couple of years ago and my lovely, godly aunt, at 80 years old, still serves the Lord with all of her heart, soul, mind and strength. She is one of the strongest ladies I know, spiritually and physically. Strong in the word and service and love. She is a mentor to me and has allowed the Lord to use these abuses for His glory. She has allowed Him to make all things work together for the good as she has followed Him.

[@Underdogtheology]

Such an important part of this story! Thank you for making that clear, Allison!

[@perfectlymprfct]

Glory to God. Thank you for sharing. ❣

[@susandraluck25]

I have been following this story and it troubled my sleep because I was so disappointed. I’m 73 and have been very blessed by his ministry. Brother John is almost 83 now and I do notice a slowing down. He honestly could have forgotten details.

[@marymorris6897]

Thank you for this beautiful post. Please send our love to your aunt.

[@susannahwhite7561]

Thanks for sharing and give her a big hug the next time you see her and tell her we love her with the love of the LORD 😊

[@ransche1]

Forgiveness does not mean that you shouldn’t pay for your crime.

[@stevefraley4283]

As a non-Reformed Christian, I appreciate your willingness to speak honestly and truthfully about this subject. I haven’t seen any other Reformed believers calling this out, which I find troubling. I admittedly have never been particularly impressed with MacArthur, though my family holds him in extremely high regard. One thing I have been wondering, which those who do regularly listen to him, is whether he has exhibited humility in the past. Has he ever publicly apologized or admitted that he was wrong about something? All I have ever seen is him pointing out errors in others, but I have never seen him point it out in himself. With that many years of preaching, he should have had plenty of opportunities to do so.

[@marymorris6897]

Great question. I've always felt he is a hard man. Now it's getting into the area where he could be called an enabler of abuse.

[@susiedyck4914]

Reformed/Calvinist protect their own, as long as they are faithful back to them. If they would speak TRUTH in love, they would be "shunned"

[@JonathanNYCity]

I'm a reformed believer and I've been calling him out on this even though I used to be a big fan. But fan no more. I know many other reformed believers who are also honest enough to call him out. But sadly, I also know many who are defending him. Also, I know of one theological mistake he admits to making. It was a long time ago and I forget what the issue is. I think it was something to do with the Trinity. That seems to be the one he always points to when anyone asks him if he's ever been wrong on something. Apparently, he believes that is the only thing he's ever been wrong on.

[@maranathamaranatha832]

@@susiedyck4914 It's not just the "Reformed-Calvinists" who protect their pastor. All mega-churches protect their "beloved pastor"... While they are fallible beings just like us. The label "Calvinist" does not change the fact of idolizing one's pastor; in all denominations there is this unfortunate tendency, unfortunately. be blessed

[@rdrift1879]

In my years at Grace Community Church, I never heard any pastor speak with humility about their own sin. They would never say they are sinless, but the culture is one that such humility would be seen as a weakening of a leader's authority. It was not that way in the early years. That grew over time, when no one was left to call Dr. MacArthur to account as an equal.

[@mjsabie8517]

If this story is true it is completely disgusting. There should be NO church discipline when someone admits to sexual abuse of a minor. The ONE AND ONLY correct response is to call the police and have the sick pervert arrested. How is it that even criminals in prison know that sexual abuse of children is wrong and they often punish inmates in prison for these crimes and yet a "pastor" does not understand this.

[@Underdogtheology]

I agree with most of this although I’d say church discipline should come AFTER the police are informed and the government steps in.

[@mjsabie8517]

@@Underdogtheology I guess I can agree with that but in theory, but its not what's important in context. I'm upset at everyone in this situation honestly. Even the gentleman that reported this to the church and later wrote the affidavit. This is not something that should be reported to a pastor and talked about behind closed doors. This is a criminal act and should have gone to the police first. If after the fact the church wants to say something in "discipline" of the person I'm fine with that as well, but the guy should be in jail making church discipline somewhat moot at that point. What would this man have done if he found out that this person had raped an adult woman instead of sexually assaulting his minor daughter? Crimes should be reported to the police not the church.

[@Underdogtheology]

@@mjsabie8517 I completely agree. Police should have been told first. Church discipline after the man is in jail. I also agree that it’s mostly moot at that point, but it is biblical.

[@shelteredsparrow2736]

So well put

[@carolbarlow8896]

You and I have similar personal stories. I cut my theological teeth, so to speak, on JM's teaching starting in 1979. So after 40 plus years of benefitting from his teaching, this is hard. I don't agree either with all of Julie's views but as you say, this is not about her. I lost it for John starting about 15 years ago when he was making such sweeping, condescending statements about women on GTY so they obviously came from his pulpit. Also, I disagree with Beth Moore but no Christian gentleman tells a Christian lady, no matter how wrong she is, to "go home". It's conduct unbefitting a good pastor. Well done Dean. I'm glad I found your channel.

[@Underdogtheology]

I’m glad you did too. Thanks for your thoughts on this!

[@shelteredsparrow2736]

I am so with you there!

[@guardianmeister6650]

MacArthur lost me the day he volunteered some information that was very telling about him. In one of his Q&A sessions after a church service, I presume, he confidently declared that the "suffering Church is just fine without us." Then the alarm bells went off. That kind of speech shows serious contempt for the sufferings of the saints and an attitude of considering himself be off the hook to suffer with God's people. In Hebrews 11 Moses is declared "by faith" to have refused to be called the son of pharoah's daughter and to refuse the riches of Egypt, but chose rather to suffer with the Children of Israel. A man who is not willing to suffer with God's people is simply not a pastor. He has given himself that title. It wasn't until these words came out of his mouth that I even thought to myself to, say, check out his net worth, which turns out to be >$15M as of today, according to Google search. This does not speak of good things. Where there is smoke, there is fire. MacArthur essentially ex-communicated Eileen Gray for not submitting to her husband in an abusive scenario. In one of his sermons posted on KZbin, he talked about an elderly man who was "getting ready to go to Jesus" who shared with him on his deathbead something like this: "I'm so glad Jesus came because I never overcame my porn addiction." (not exact, but representative). So Eileen Gray was ex-communicated due to holding her ground on an abusive home situation (which, by the way involved children) and "she may not have really been saved" was declared publicly in church not long after she left, but the guy who admits to a long-term habit of porn is "headed for Glory." If you listen to JM closely, he ends up being inconsistent with himself. There is just too much of a trail of stinky smoke following JM. This is what happens when church becomes about big money. And by the way, after Gray's ex-husband was convicted under criminal charges (which actually has very high standards for proof), GTY made a show of how Gray was a hero in prison and weathering the persecution and their "missionary" to the prison. Why did they have to be so vocal about it? In 1 Cor 4, in this verse ... "Let a man so consider us, as SERVANTS of Christ and stewards of the mysteries of God" ... that word, servant, is actually the word for an under-rower, like an oarsman on a galley. They move the Kingdom forward in a way that does not draw attention to themselves. They don't get attention or glory and they certainly don't magnet that to themselves. Nothing about the way that was handles looked good, wise or godly.

[@Homeschooler64]

Agree Dean. Lying a sin, but covering for a sexual predator is a CRIME! He’s complicit, so JM needs to have more consequences than more than just stepping down.

[@joycelint6652]

I'm glad you brought up the fact that this can happen at any church. Protestants got really upset about what took place in the Catholic church, without realizing that this can happen anywhere.

[@Underdogtheology]

It can and does. Thanks, Joyce.

[@peterburton3095]

Although I'm sure it happens more often in churches run by satanic freemasons Catholics and MacArthur.

[@Maranatha7557]

I appreciate your focusing on facts. Unfortunately, some Christian brothers and sisters seem to be more interested in JM’s “good” reputation than a victim of abuse. It’s very disheartening.

[@Underdogtheology]

I agree. 💔

[@PotterSpurn1]

You shall know them by their fruits.....

[@stevesizemore6274]

Yes. How you treat others does not matter, just protect the cult leader!!!

[@allisonhartwell3528]

Thank you so much for speaking out though it might cost you. You are exactly right and you have approached this in such a gracious yet strong way. Wendy is my first cousin. I have been a witness to how deeply these wounds of sexual abuse wound someone's soul. That wound can be healed by the Lord and then even used for His glory, but it can take years and always leaves deep scars. I am a born again Christian. I have been a lay leader in our church my entire adult life and my husband an elder. I have not allowed this to turn me away from the Lord and the church, but I know that this grieves God's heart deeply. And to people who say these are lies, you are wrong. This is all truth. God knows the truth. We need to have a 0 policy for child abuse.

[@Underdogtheology]

Thank you so much for commenting on this. I truly appreciate your willingness to share your perspective. And I totally agree. Thanks, Allison.

[@MrsCambers]

Bless her heart my prayers are with her. I was disgusted to hear more stuff about JM covering for this stuff.

[@watchingpraying7763]

Thank you for covering this. It's been the IHOPKC dumpster fire that has opened my eyes to all the rest of this. Appreciate your courage, along w/ the badass Roys Report. Whistleblowers need a platform that will help get the truth out there. The truth will set us free, but it will burn out anything of the flesh along the way. God Bless you as you carry on His work.

[@LonnieReimer]

I believe you can forgive even if there is no repentance. I forgave my dad when he stepped over the line into abuse, but he never believed he was abusive and thus never felt the need to repent. Also we can forgive someone and still hold them accountable and require them to address the consequences of there behavior. When I forgave my dad it freed me from my desire for justice now, and was the gateway for me letting go of the anger from what he had done and find the healing I needed. For me forgiveness is a journey not a particular decision, it took years for me to forgive my dad, and it took years for my wife to forgive me of my abusive behavior. For John MacArthur to expect the girl to forgive her father after only a confession of guilt is short sighted and does not deal with the connection between the healing of the wounds and forgiveness. To expect forgiveness when the wounds are still fresh and deep is unreasonable and adds more pain on the victim.

[@Underdogtheology]

You’re right Lonnie, I should have been more precise. I meant a forgiveness that brings reconciliation. Thanks for sharing your story. I appreciate you.

[@LouisaWatt]

Forgiveness is good for the survivor of abuse, but so is removing themselves from danger. That’s the biggest issue in this story for me as a training counsellor.

[@johnarc3856]

having been around these sorts of ministries..... when they tell a girl she "needs to forgive", they are not speaking of her mental/spiritual state primarily. they are telling her to back off on complaining about the abuse anymore. its a power play to get her to quiet down, for "they have it under control", which they usually don't. it means she is not going to get resolution. many will read this line of thinking as an attempt to groom a child. many would call this highly inappropriate. what you speak of is the process of healing.

[@allisonhartwell3528]

Important information to discuss. Children need to be protected.

[@Underdogtheology]

Amen!

[@allisonhartwell3528]

Yes, we forgive, but that doesn't mean leaving someone in a position of authority over others who struggles with this type of abusive sin. Yes, even if Paul sincerely repented, he should be forgiven, but have been made to step down from any place of authority and get a job in a different field and have accountability. Yes, we forgive an alcoholic and praise them for remaining clean and sober, but we still encourage them to not hang out in bars.

[@bellyfulochelly4222]

Why don't people get this? It's such a simple concept. A man in this situation has ruined his reputation with outsiders, so he is disqualified. "Moreover he must have a good testimony among those who are outside, lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil." I Timothy 3:7 NKJV

[@barbarasimmons4158]

I can't help but wonder if the main offense to so many from Julie Roys is the information she has brought or the fact she is a woman.

[@Underdogtheology]

I wish I could emphatically deny that, but I think it’s a part of it.

[@lookinglistening09]

@@Underdogtheology It's palpable. The way Phil Johnson, for instance, addressed her--I can't see him being that way to a man. Phil was a favorite of mine on GTY radio. 😞

[@barbarasimmons4158]

This is what the tip of an iceberg looks like.

[@lyndaash6766]

Thank you for your Godly coverage of this. As a victim (maybe the first?) of JM and GCC going back to 1972-1974, I'm deeply saddened by what has come to light. I thought it just happened to me because John was young and inexperienced. To learn that these abuses have been perpetuated for decades more is absolutely mind blowing, to say the least. I'm working with my elders now to see if there is any value in pursuing giving my testimony to someone to try and bring about change.

[@Underdogtheology]

Thanks for sharing a bit of your story here Lynda. It sounds like you’ve been through quite the ordeal. And I’m glad you are looking into way to share your story and seek justice. Im praying for you.

[@HarrisonFamilyValues]

I appreciate your take and your bravery in holding people accountable

[@Underdogtheology]

Thanks, I appreciate you! 👊🏻

[@bobhall3535]

Interesting segment, Dean! In my 40 yrs of Christianity and local church involvement, I've seen bad ministerial decisions made by godly pastors who gave their time, money, and lifestyle change to devote their future lives to the betterment of the kingdom of God. Mistakes will happen, and bad decisions will materialize. The human element always seems to find a crack in the armor of God (due to the wearer, not the armor)... and capitalizes on it. Like you, I've pastored a small church and been involved in other small churches in one capacity or another. I've also found myself involved in megachurches as just a member in the pew to non-paid laymen services of low-level leadership of those megachurches. In every mid-sized church, I've been affiliated with to megachurch size, I've had pastors and elders who faced termination due to THAT cracked armor where the human element took advantage. The sin/sins... immorality or/and poor ethical choices involving, among other things, money management. J.M. seems to have made poor judgment decisions concerning matters of abuse in the past. Now... years later... those poor judgment decisions are catching up with him. As the Word states, "Be sure your sins will find you out." I think the biggest problem in our churches today... is politics in local church leadership, again, based on my 40 years of local church familiarity. Then to justify matters, those leaders will say, "This is God's will." After pastoring my small church, then noticing and recalling political maneuvers within other churches, I said to God, "Father, if this is how it's done, I'd rather not go into vocational church pastoring." After my first pastorate (which spoiled me due to having a good staff where everything was upfront and honest, with no favoritism, no, politics involved), I've not pastored since. And do not regret it to this day. When God's church leaders compromise character with compromise, God will chastise those churches.

[@Underdogtheology]

I get this, Bob. Thanks for sharing here.

[@buck-intrends8850]

Thank you for ALL of the information that you provided! And listing the sources and documentation so folks can go and read it themselves is a great way to stay objective. Especially appreciate the support you offer to the victim and her family. The whole GCC thing of blaming the victim is horrific and to think they did this while SUPPORTING the felon - the abusive father is outrageous. MR. MacArthur has A LOT to apologize for. Anyone who listened to your presentation and still backs GCC is so far gone that I don’t know what to think about them. I am new to this, have you done anything about that awful supposed documentary called “The Enemies Within The Church?” There is another guy who needs to be called out. If you haven’t seen his website you need to. His wall of shame, or what he calls his Woke-A-Pedia is nothing short of McCarthyism. And he calls himself a Christian! Keep up the good work, get some rest. Prayers for you and your health issue.

[@Underdogtheology]

Thanks for your thoughts and support!

[@allybromley3460]

Thank you so much for making this video!

[@pappywinky4749]

I learned recently of a retired pastor I really admired my entire who has done some serious things back when he was younger. I don't know what will happen with the situation, but it's been really painful to learn that. I have been really privileged in my life and environment that these situations were always dealt with incredibly seriously and strongly. I remember a lot of men I respected doing things I simply could not fathom. The older I get and the more I see how we need the grace of God, his forgiveness, his love and most of all his humility. I hope JM and other elders of the church will be held accountable because this debacle is gonna tarnish is ministry forever.

[@Underdogtheology]

Yeah, I honestly believe God isn’t going to let men who claim faithfulness but hide sinful actions to “finish well.” It’s still sad when it’s uncovered though.

[@Cwood79]

@@Underdogtheology I agree sadly. One wonders why GCC doesn’t make a statement. At the very least the victim are owe some respect. They kept this from John McArthur’s reputation all these years after all. I guess John McArthur, about two weeks ago, in the pulpit told those the congregation that more lies will be told about me in the internet this week. He did this from the authority from the pulpit. It seems a bit cult like rather then Christlike. At least he could come forward and say I messed up because l was lied to and believed it at the time.

[@vaughntuckerart3940]

Sadly , I think there is more even after this.

[@Underdogtheology]

Sadly, I think you’re right.

[@lookinglistening09]

It's hard to believe there aren't. After reading how even GCC women treated Eileen Gray, I imagine there are women and children whose stories may or may not have reached JM, and whom GCC elders and members may have coached to stay silent.

[@Playalinda3677]

This commentary was so insightful and helpful. You are one of the only people to expose this for what it is, idolatry of a person. I too have benefited from JMac sermons and books. I've referred many people to specific sermons but I will never ignore the truth about any Pastor/teacher. And JMac isn't the only famous name that is having his pride exposed. It is a deep shame that men of God eventually become compromised by their own power trip. I am praying for their discipline from God for the good of the church and to teach us all to fear GOD and not hold men in such high regard. Some of JMac's supporters are embarrassing.

[@rebekahthompson4526]

Thanks for sharing this. So sad.

[@judiking4579]

I know, that this was a year ago. But, I believe Wendy and the missionary… just listening to this today.

[@donnaeid2862]

Getting this out into the open is good for the sheep! We are in a season of great exposure! We cannot have the lost who are hurting come into this kind of church teaching! God will not have it! God is cleaning up His church!

[@africandaisy.3]

Great examination of the letters. It is helpful. Appreciate your words @36:39-41:11. It is frustrating and so disorientating when the weaker person's cause goes ignored and justice/attempts at restoration is denied right off the bat.

[@shelteredsparrow2736]

There are KZbin videos out there that say “why people hate John MacArthur?” and try to make about the good things he does and make it sound like videos like this are walking away from those good things. I really believe it is a cult

[@smcconnell2200]

Silence from the church makes a very loud noise.

[@shelteredsparrow2736]

I too believe that Megachurches is not a good idea. It makes it hard to deal with this kind of situation. Another reason is pastors are to care for their sheep. How do you adequately do that when you don’t know them

[@LookingUpwardMovingForward]

Thank you for your honest look at this and your ability to realize this issue of abuse is a scandal in our churches and defames the name of God. I too used to love John MacArthur. He is winsome, isn’t he? My eyes have been opened. We need to quit with the celebrity “pastors” and begin to look for true shepherds. What these reports reveal is an unchristlike attitude of disdain and dare I say hatred of women and children. I recommend 2 sermon series by Jeff Crippen: “domestic violence and abuse” and “wise as serpents” You can find these on sermon audio. He also wrote several books on this, including a book called “Unholy Charade.” May the light shine in our churches and expel the darkness. We all need to open our eyes and get educated. Any talk about pursuing the purity and peace of the church and caring about pure doctrine that does not begin with expelling known wolves is meaningless.

[@Underdogtheology]

I’ll have to check both of those out. Thanks!

[@JJeff-mq9mr]

JM is sounding like the leader of a cult. His words and phrases used is scary, as clearly he uses the Lord as though he got confirmation from our Lord to support this man. Who clearly should have been forgiven and kicked out from fellowship and never stand on top of a pulpit again.

[@J.F.331]

After watching the entire video I have to say you are spot on about pointing out the inconsistencies in JM’s response. I hate to be in the position to say this but I am praying that more victims will come forward. This is not necessarily to see JM fail or any pastor to fail but if injustice has occurred we need to be praying that justice prevails and closure is given to real victims who have experienced abuse by men in power, whether in the church or outside the church. In the end, may the truth prevail and all liars be exposed no matter who they are or what their gender is (male or female).

[@Underdogtheology]

Totally agree! Thanks.

[@lookinglistening09]

Great job, Dean. I found your channel after reading Roys' latest article. (I appreciate her work, too.) Your coverage and analysis are spot-on. I'd read most of the attachments on Roys' website, and they were heartbreaking--I'm glad you acknowledged the coldness in JM's tone. Wendy said he sounded angry on the phone when they finally talked (I think in 2003). All of this news is so disheartening. I'd found him and the church and attended for months online until I got over Covid. I thought I'd found my church home. It was bad enough after the Eileen Gray news. JMac returned strong when he returned to the pulpit--especially this Resurrection Sunday, but it would never be the same for me. Now, I'm hurt and turned off after reading his words. He even preached on lying in his first sermon back, which I felt was a veiled response to the Gray news. I never made it in person and don't know if I ever will now. If anyone has suggestions for a biblical SoCal church, please share. Keep up the wise, compassionate, strong work, Dean. I liked and subscribed.

[@Underdogtheology]

If you’re near Simi Valley, my buddy Luke Dailey is on staff at a good church.

[@lookinglistening09]

@@Underdogtheology Thanks so much! I'm in Los Angeles but was willing to drive to GCC, so I'd commute to Simi Valley. I found the site and will check them out. I hope you feel better.

[@josephbenzjr.2849]

Thank you for speaking on these topics. I believe that topics like these should be addressed but more often than not they aren’t because people would rather protect someones reputation than standing up for a victim and biblical truth. Unfortunately, I don’t think there’s any accountability in GCC. As someone who wants to be in ministry one day it makes me think about the reality of how one day I’m going to have to deal with situations like this. I hope the capital C church gets better at this as a whole. Thanks for the content it’s really blessed me.

[@Underdogtheology]

Appreciate that, Joseph.

[@The5150lady]

Well done Dean. Thank you for your courage.

[@Underdogtheology]

Thanks for the encouragement.

[@terrybain828]

I love John MacArthur and have benefitted from his teaching so much over the years. I also have found his study Bible to be an amazing help, but that does not mean he is infallible. I agree with him on most things, but not all. I am not a Calvinist, but have learned much from many Reformed theologians like him and RC Sproule. I have listened to many of his sermons and appreciate his teaching style. I hate to see his reputation sullied in any way because I think he generally holds himself to a high standard of integrity, but I love him too much to let him get away with any wrong doings that would undermine all the good he has done in his ministry. I hope he would repent for not reporting alleged abuse to police and letting them investigate the matter properly. I also hope he would repent for victimizing victims by asking them to either return to their abusers or leave the church. I disagree that the problem has anything to do with the size of the church. I have seen similar problems in small churches as well. The truth is that we need to learn to stop being so extreme in our evaluations of each other. It is just as wrong to jump on the band wagon and demonize them as it is to idolize them and defend them at all costs. Even at the cost of truth. Our first loyalty as Christians needs to be to Christ who is the Way, the TRUTH and the Life.

[@Homeschooler64]

Why is this reduced to something as a “transgression”, needing Biblical discipline??? If there is validity in Wendy’s claims, the it was a crime that is prosecutable. Churches “deal on their own” with no bringing this crime (against the law!) to a courtroom, & the survivor can have some fair justice.

[@MrsCambers]

This whole thing just proves to me that the same people who think Catholic priests are so bad are not willing to admit the same about their own leaders. I live in Newfoundland Canada. Look up Mt Cashel victims. Back in their day to accuse the priest was like accusing God himself. It’s shameful to me that people are doing the same thing in Protestantism as well. Some people need to stop pointing fingers if they’re not going to take the log out of their own eye.

[@guardianmeister6650]

True sincerity may have one or two seeming inconsistencies here or there. But a consistent pattern of inconsistency is red flag central.

[@bordendonna]

I just started following you…love your channel. IHOPKC Leader and chief false prophet has made a statement….lol denying “false allegations of sexual abuse.” I’d love to hear you cover this. Julie Roys on X and Blaise Foret are two following the sad story. I do think the hyper spiritual crowd is often treading on dangerous ground in addition to the hyper legalists. Lol. Keep covering the topics. Good stuff!

[@britineywarren]

Thank you for spotlighting this!

[@stevem2529]

MacArthur called out

[@lorrainethomas4736]

Thank you Dean, appreciate your courage in covering this!😊

[@eslycarrero]

@Dean Lentini 32:17 mark For clarification sake. Since his handwriting is not very easy to read... Here's the letter J.M. wrote typed out in legible font form below... ==================================================== From the desk of John MacArthur 8/29/79 Dear Wendy, Thank you for your letter. I am so sorry about all the problems you have been through, but I believe the Lord is working in very special ways. Your Dad is really sad about air all & we have met and talked at length about this situation. He is a wonderful Christian and The Lord has worked graciously in His heart so that he is more then ever committed to living to HIs glory. He has been a faithful part of our staff and will continue to be in the future. We have had good times of prayer in the past 2013 days, and I will be close to I’m in the future. I’m praying for you Wendy and grateful for your love for your Dad. Forgiveness is a big word that comes from a little one - Love. I’m glad for your love toward Christ gives a forgiving heart toward others. I know the Lord will be glorified as we work together with your Dad to see him be all that God wants him to be. In His Love, John MacArthur P.S. I care very much about you and your Dad and want you both to know the best of God’s blessing & walk in His will.

[@Underdogtheology]

Thanks!

[@eslycarrero]

@@Underdogtheology My pleasure. It truly was a difficult task to understand his handwriting! 😜

[@AngelINTheMatrix]

God bless you for being a true man of God and actually exposing evil in its entirety without pulling punches. You are doing this exactly the way scripture teaches us to expose evil. God bless you a hundred thousand times over I pray that he just showers you with his love for doing this.❤❤❤❤❤❤

[@LivinLifeLive316]

This is disturbing!!! What is the teaching of this church??? Why are these men not turned into the authorities?! Why are men favored with John MacArthur and women and children treated so harshly?!? THATS NOT CHRISTIANITY!!!!! This is taking women should be silent in churches to an evil level!! Oh, and if women are not silent then they are bitter?!?

[@prepostmodern1032]

Mr. Mac Arthur, your habitual cover-ups make you unfit by your own sermons' standards. Repeated actions disqualify your gifted speaking ability. At least Hybels and others stepped down. Mr. Mac Arthur, may you keep whatever shreds of credibility you may have left and resign....

[@steveharris9610]

Appreciate your calm and reasoned approach, and effort to look at the facts,without undue emotional outbursts. I probably need to be a little more like that! I tend to have very strong feelings about what I believe. I'm not saying that you dont,but you keep them under control.

[@Underdogtheology]

It’s taken a lot of practice. Unfortunately I’ve had to deal with these types of stories often in ministry.

[@mvaug69]

Let me be entirely honest here. I live in the UK. I have never been a member of Grace Church in person, only online and I see a problem. Sex abuse is happening in the Christian Church, and it's mega serious. I support Diane Langberg (FOCL) and her 40 years experience of counselling sex abuse victims in the Church, children and adults. Cover-ups and misunderstandings have caused immense damage when pastors are simply not trained to counsel these issues. My thoughts on MacArthur's expectations and advice about forgiveness (if he wrote the letter) are not in favour. . A child is damaged after sexual contact with a close relative, particularly incestuous contact with a parent, and an emotional fob off like this is equivalent to rejection. I'm with you on this but knowing sex abuse in the churches isn't something new, or the Church's ignorance of and fear to approach the right channels for the victim. How is that girl going to live with seeing her father forgiven while she continues to struggle with the effects of abuse? God forbid! Rubbing a child's back may not be with any sexual intention. Touching and fondling a child's genitals and penetration is sex abuse equivalent to rape. I'm not afraid to lay the facts on the table for Christ's sake. Thanks for your report. Well done. 😀❤🙏

[@Underdogtheology]

Appreciate this Margaret.

[@dragonfly10]

Disturbing 😳

[@Underdogtheology]

Very much so.

[@Loveispatient76]

Maybe we can talk about abuse more

[@perfectlymprfct]

Thank you for Truth. 💌

[@Underdogtheology]

Thank you for the support.

[@perfectlymprfct]

@@Underdogtheology I served 30 years in the Army and led Soldiers from the Squad to the Battalion level. In all it's worldliness and frailties, I can wholeheartedly proclaim that the military does a poor job, but is still handling this subject far better than the Church.

[@gramajan4]

I disagree....we can forgive without repentance. We're commanded by Jesus to forgive, What can't happen without repentance is reconciliation. The two are completely different things. I have forgiven my ex-husband for his abuse, but there can never be reconciliation until he has repented. Without repentance there is no safety, because the person has no remorse and will not change.

[@cathyc1730]

It is about discernment. There is no discernment in the church. It is ignored, even though the Holy Spirit is telling you something is wrong.

[@stevevos2764]

Thx Dean. The greatest pain is when professing Christians cause it.

[@cathyc1730]

The victims pay and suffer their whole lives. What about the perpetrators? Nothing? It is about THE VICTIMS!

[@susandraluck25]

MacArthur believes a divorced Christian can remarry under biblical circumstances. I know because I wrote him years ago feeling guilty having marrying a man divorced before he was saved. He responded and sent a booklet on the subject.

[@Underdogtheology]

Yes, but those “biblical circumstances” would be only adultery or abandonment by an unsaved Christian according to him.

[@jsl8905]

Based on your worldview you should not be concerned or surprised by any of this. According to Calvinism everything that everyone in this situation, did and did not do and your feelings about it was predetermined by God. There is no free will in your theology. Just another example of how Calvinism is untenable and nonsensical.

[@andrewgordon9318]

Good points on a sad situation, though am not sure complementarianism is the real problem. There have also been abuse in egalitarian fellowships. Think the issues are concern for church reputation over victims, a misguided belief that churches should handle situations rather than refer them to the state. Elder led congregations & failure of leaders to live lives of repentance and faith.

[@Underdogtheology]

My point was to say that their extreme form of complementarianism might be part of the cause. Abuse is definitely not just a conservative problem.

[@snopure]

A court affidavit from the pastor who married the Grays said GCC was applying pressure on Eileen to "submit" and return to her husband in spite of what he did, basically only because he said he repented. That case at least sounds very much like a complementarian issue, and heavily skewed towards the benefit of the husband as if GCC has never noticed the other biblical marriage command of husbands loving their wives as Christ loves the Church.

[@bertsteensma6066]

Or, maybe to avoid or protect against a lawsuit! BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU WRITE OR SAY?

[@timturnage576]

This is patterned behavior. Also this is authoritarian behavior not complatarion behavior.

[@Underdogtheology]

I agree. Although I’m learning a fringe sect of complementarian teachings might have something to do with this.

[@tommywitte9916]

Unfortunately, it's going to cause alot of division in the church.

[@Underdogtheology]

I agree. This type of story is devastating.

[@tommywitte9916]

@@johndisalvo6283 that's a very truthful point.

[@Justice4Mica]

It is necessary at this point, it is vital that church is safe for children, this should be a non negotiable, and unfortunately at this point it’s going to take division to resolve.

[@gerri-rose]

These issues should be treated that same way as any person who is known to be caught in a sin. We are to come along side them and if they refuse then the church deals with them. The scripture is clear about sexual sin...call it for what it is...all are accountable. And for the teachers..."for all who harm one of my little ones". We are considered children until we mature enough to eat milk..what are they being fed. There are dire warnings! Vanity vanity and pride cometh before a fall...

[@MalaikaLele]

There is a difference between FORGIVENESS and PASSIVENESS: We are called to forgive others, MEANING we do not hold gruges and do not look for vengeance, we hope and pray this person repent and be saved; we are NOT called to DO NOTHING TO STOP EVIL and let evil doers operate freely and do nothing about it, in the name of "we are all sinners"!! so why do we have the Police and a Judicial System? Who established them? It is God who established authorities to restrain evil and maintain order, peace and people's well-being Deuteronomy 16:18,19 . If someone rapes another person and you know the truth, you should report to the relevant authorities, if you don't, you are an accomplice of evil! Habakkuk 1:4 ; Micah 3:9; Proverbs 18:5

[@Underdogtheology]

Completely agree.

[@nickypendleton4066]

I expect that at any moment you will be breathlessly reporting on the New developments surrounding Julie Roys..After all she has had to withdraw from her own conference "for the safety of the survivor community" ... any videos yet on her "statement of regret" which is by now old news..But im sure your on it... And be sure to "check your Bias at the door.."

[@Mary-hs3gu]

Thank you for this. The dislikes equal willful ignorance. It’s sad that people just can’t be honest - even with themselves. (I’m sure I’ll join you in the dislike category). Also, thanks for reading Scripture. I know I’m a year late…..

[@scottfox4120]

Keep going abide needs to be addressed

[@doncaribe2488]

Im shocked watching this.. love the hat though 👍🏼

[@tommywitte9916]

Coming

[@stevehardwick1578]

Be careful about jumping on the bandwagon here, much of this has been debunked. Julie Roys has an obsession with this because she disagrees with John MacArthur's biblical views on other issues.

[@Underdogtheology]

What has been debunked? By whom? Big statement, Steve.

[@stevehardwick1578]

@@Underdogtheology Were you there during the whole event? I think a "big statement" is condemning and vilifying a pastor based on allegations from decades ago. You need to research the situation and read the correspondence between MacArthur and the daughter who was the victim.

[@Underdogtheology]

You didn’t answer my question, because there is no debunking this story. It happened. Also reread your own words and would you honestly say past actions don’t have any effect on someone’s current status just because it was so long ago? Or is that just about JMac?

[@stevehardwick1578]

@@Underdogtheology Of course past actions are important. Again, do the research. He communicated with the victim, she thanked him for helping her dad etc. If she was abused, he had no way of knowing. I'm guessing you're just another anti-Calvinist. Remember, don't bear false witness, you will answer.

[@Underdogtheology]

@@stevehardwick1578 you mean other than John Tucker informing him and Paul Guay admitting it to him??? I’m fine with disagreement, but don’t accuse and then not look into the details. Also I’m about as pro-Calvinist as you can get. 😂