Four reasons you are NOT ready for a Pertronix ignition failure!

[@Oldcarnut63]

If the protronics fails, it's because the person that installed it did not follow the instructions. Did something wrong when you do it correctly they last

[@vdubjunkie]

While I feel that I understand what you're really saying here, I must semantically point out that all objects fail, eventually. That said, it could be a fair assessment that Pertronix ignition might generally last a very long time, given ideal conditions. I also feel my video addressed that the failure of my Ignitor III and Flame-Thrower coil were likely due to a poor ground. That said, what I feel to be far more important is that in order to find documentation from Pertronix mentioning this absolutely crucial installation step, one must dig very deep, indeed. Not only does the literature provided with the module not discuss the importance of the quality of the ground, but I wasn't able to find it until I discovered the precise search string, taking me to non-US domains. That is the real failure of the Pertronix brand, so far as I can tell. Further, for those paying attention, if your points and/or condenser begin to fail, there are generally warning signs. This makes it far less likely you will be stranded on the side of the road. When an Ignitor fails, it fails suddenly. In order to be prepared for a Pertronix failure, one must have a $100+ spare module laying about. However, with points and condenser, the outlay is much less significant.

[@Flies2FLL]

Now, I am going to post this BEFORE I watch the video. I installed a Pertronix Igniter electronic ignition on my '76 Honda CB-750-Four and it was the best thing I ever did! I bought the bike in Toledo, Ohio, rode it to Pittsburg where I met up with my friend Roy, and he rode his '73 Moto Guzzi 850T to Florida with me. I had had a continuing problem with the fucking points on this bike and I replaced them and set them correctly to no avail; Moisture got into the case somehow and always fouled them, so when I was at my parents house in Temperance, Michigan just north of Toledo, I installed the Pertronix kit for this bike. I never had a problem again! But my buddy Roy? He got to Jacksonville and then his bike started backfiring. We pulled into a gas station just south of town and the owner was there and had files in his pickup. We filed the points down and that allowed him to make it to his parents place in Daytona, where we spent the night. That wasn't my first experience with Pertronix. My dad helped my buy a '77 Volkswagen Rabbit in 1984 when I was getting ready for college at the age of 18. About two months after we bought it in 1984, it gave us fits and it was the points causing trouble. The shop manager recommended Pertronix, and it solved the problem permanently. [The '77 Rabbit? At the time my dad drove an '80 Chevette, which was a complete slug. The Rabbit on the other hand was a little tiger; Half the days of the two months I had left of high school, I would walk out the door and find it gone; Dad had taken it to work and I was stuck with his damn Chevette, he liked the Rabbit so much~]

[@vdubjunkie]

I’m glad to hear a story like this. Naturally there are a lot of variables from one persons application to another’s, but so far most people are favoring the points. There are certainly going to be advantages to each. Thanks for sharing!

[@PeteT622]

I installed HEI using a 4 pin GM ignition module by Pertronic. I had three (!!) fail on me. Being the second and third modules were "new", i ruled the modules and pulled out all my hair trying to find the problem. Pertronix didn’t want to hear it at all, their customer service is the worst.

[@vdubjunkie]

I’m sorry to hear that. In this case I can really only blame my poor engine ground, but plenty of people have issues. One issue I do take is that if the low resistance engine ground is so important, not only should that information be in the installation instructions, it should be large font and bold, underlined.

[@johnweaver8470]

I put the pertronix flame thrower distributor in my 68 396 Camaro been working great for about 5 thousand miles, now I'm feeling a little nervous, keep the videos coming

[@vdubjunkie]

I appreciate the encouragement. Check that ground and keep the points, condenser, plug wires and coil around.

[@tmills2200]

120,000 miles I added a ground wire to the plate before wiring.Havent had a problem with it.

[@jeremydoc]

this is a great resource! lots of stuff I didn't know. thanks for sharing, bud

[@vdubjunkie]

I’m really glad you can find it useful!

[@mrpaisleyshirt]

I think I'll just stick with the old points system. Sure enough if it happened to me it'd be just before a down pour or something. Good job getting your's sorted though, sounds very healthy.

[@vdubjunkie]

I have to say that I’m not in any hurry to get the Pertronix back in. When I put them in, I was feeling like things weren’t running as good as they could. How long has that ground issue been there? That will affect the original ignition system too!

[@bryandallolio3260]

3 Faulty Pertronix kits put my GTO on a rollback 4 times! Back to points. Pertronix sucks!!!

[@vdubjunkie]

Ouch! I’m really sorry to hear that. I’d be really interested to see whether any tests exist to prove they actually improve anything. Years ago they sold a double pronged spark plug for a while. You notice they don’t now…

[@vwpieces]

I run Old Pertronix units, never a failure in 35yrs. That is with copper core wires, and German Bosch Blue coils. Original German Bosch VW SVDA distributors on Everything long before the "Trend" started. I do admit to keeping a fully built, timed and ready distributor in the Box of Tricks in the vehicles. But never needed it and it's only there from ALL the fails I have read about. Long ago bought a pile of 126 VW Industrial engines somewhere and received a box that must have 30 more Old units, NFS👍 Right, Wrong? It Works.

[@vdubjunkie]

Yeah, I get that. The people who design this stuff know more about the science of why you’re supposed to use specific wires and lower ohm coils. However, I can’t help but wonder if those old units have different requirements.

[@Paulman50]

The different ohm coils are to tune the dwell times. With a v8 it needs a lot of power to energise the coil before each discharge, a 4 cylinder with the same ohm coil will get hot because the discharge is slower. so coil ohms is matched to the dwell. The ohms of the plug leads are to get 45000 volts to the plugs. On a vw I can't see that loosing a few volts would matter because we don't push the rpm to 10000 revs. Low reving and low hp engines are not realy going to be effected enough to feel it.

[@atomicmellon1712]

I make a habit of giving an opinion over telling people what to do. That being the case, I think your new set up is the way to go. With all the effort you've put into the stock dual carbs, a stock dizzy with vacuum is definitely what I would choose to run. Those VW engineers knew what they were doing! And think, if you run a stock dizzy then you really do only need to carry a spare points set and a condenser!

[@vdubjunkie]

100% I got curious about the notion that the ignition was more efficient or whatever. But, I’m starting to doubt that. Then the big benefit is just that you don’t ever have to set or replace points. I don’t mind either. I will say that replacing points in this distributor is much more involved than in an 009..

[@atomicmellon1712]

@@vdubjunkie speaking of, I don't think those clips are supposed to be falling off when you remove them from the cap. Maybe you know this. I think the retainers of the distributor body must be worn out. Worn out clips definitely wouldn't be as much of an issue on a T1 set up.

[@vdubjunkie]

You read my mind. On the inside of the space where the clips fit into the body, there is a small dome shape on each side. They are indeed worn out. Possibly the dome and also possibly the material on the side of the clip. It’s one of those things you get used to and I’ve got great little telescopic magnets, so..

[@peterdonaldson6786]

Great video, thanks for sharing. Im still running with points in my 66 bus, and so far not had issues. I considered the Petronics system but was scared off by having to buy everything (coil, leads, etc) (I'm cheap btw) but mainly by what you've displayed here. I recently had someone try and persuade me with the 123 Ignition distributor. Becoming popular here in UK. Have you looked at this?

[@vdubjunkie]

I’m definitely not convinced the Pertronix is such a significant upgrade. That 123 does look interesting. Whenever I see there’s an app associated, I put on my scrutiny glasses. But, I’m sure that’s just to select the programs and it doesn’t rely on that connection to continue functioning. I just hope they didn’t try to get too fancy. Programming is a two-sided coin. Once you start getting into software upgrades.. 🤨

[@yvesboulanger5009]

One thing you did not mention about the plugs... if you are running a high energy 0,3 ohms coils, you need to increase the plug gap to gain the full benefits. Another reason why you just can't leave the plugs alone when going back to standard ignition "on the side of the road". I run points and a vintage Delta CD system, with a 1,8 ohm Bosch red coil (NLA by the way) and plugs gapped at .030. One nice thing about the Delta CD is the switch... should it fail, one click and I'm back to standard ignition. It will get me home. One problem we have today for vintage cars is the poor quality of replacement ignition points and condensers: that alone is a reason to switch to electronics. I use NOS parts - they last forever with the CD system.

[@vdubjunkie]

It's interesting you bring this up. Aside from adjustments to accommodate ambient air temperature, I was just reading about spark gap and how it is directly related to the level of performance desired from the engine. What I took from this is that a bigger gap does nothing to add benefit if you are running a stock, or mild motor. It took me some time to reply because I wanted to look into the Capacitive Discharge system a bit. You may have just inspired a future video. I've never looked into them, due to the cost, but it is very intriguing. So, if I find and research a good circuit I could build myself, or somebody gives me a bunch of money for no apparent reason, I'll be interested to try that.

[@tedpreston4155]

Twice I've installed Pertronix ignitions on my cars, and both of them failed and left me stranded. Never again. I live in the Rocky Mountains where it's often 100 miles or more between towns. Can you imagine the cost of a 100 mile tow? What if it happens during a blizzard? How will you stay warm if you can't run your heater? How will you stay alive? Despite their advertising, Pertronix never did anything to improve the cars' performance.

[@vdubjunkie]

I appreciate you sharing that story. I think plenty of people just believe they are better. I’m really not sure. I do now have quite a few tanks of gas on them and I’m about to get a bunch more on points, so I’ll be able to see whether there’s any significant difference in MPG. Spoiler alert, I’m pretty sure the answer is no

[@tedpreston4155]

@@vdubjunkie That was my conclusion as well. I felt little difference in the way the car drove or performed. Points need adjusting, of course, but they feel great if you do the maintenance, and they last a long time. I suspect that a lot of the market for Pertronix is from drivers whose brains just don't jive with the concepts of clearances and finicky adjustment procedures. The suffering is real! I'm glad I finally figured them out, because points will get you home, most times. My first Pertronix swap was a Fiat 124 Spider. I did a bunch of other tune up and upgrade work at the same time as the Pertronix, so the whole package of improvements felt great on the road! But I couldn't have told you which elements of the tune-up made the biggest difference. I was pleased with all the manufacturers involved, including Pertronix. So I bought a second one for an Austin America. Given that the old coil had been failing slowly, the addition of the Pertronix and a new coil felt like a power boost. But in both cars, the Pertronix unit failed, and left me dead on the side of the road. In both cases, I returned to points ignition without regret. Well adjusted points aren't noticeably different in performance. I learned my lesson the second time. 😏 Thanks for reading! I've needed to get that off my chest for a decade! I never expected to find anybody who might care!

[@tedpreston4155]

Thanks for bringing back memories of two fun restoration projects! I still have the America, and I miss the Fiat!

[@vdubjunkie]

@@tedpreston4155 absolutely, and let’s face it, running an air-cooled VW isn’t something you do because you need to have a no muss, no fuss car!

[@vdubjunkie]

@@tedpreston4155 I’m so glad. The other day I drove by a shop that had a 1986 Toyota Supra. Boy, did that bring back some memories!

[@Rich_Lambert]

Wouldn't it be easier to just carry a spare Pertronix in your car's tool kit?

[@vdubjunkie]

Easier? Maybe. But, when you begin to wonder about any real benefit and you have VERY limited funds to spend on the car.. going back to a tried and tried setup you’ve already used extensively.. pretty inviting.

[@lesliemclean4381]

Bingo!

[@apocolypse11]

Just because u have 12 volts when the car is off does not mean u have 12 volts when is on. Lol resistor wire. Cmon dude

[@vdubjunkie]

Absolutely correct. However, this car doesn’t have a resistor wire.

[@cindys1819]

There are several steps I would take; 1. Tow smucky VW to junk yard and purchase a dignified ride. Like a 70 charger or maybe an Avanti. What kind of ladies are going to jump into what your now driving? 2. If you Insist on retaining your ugh ride, you need the petronix problem by... deinstalling the present engine and doing the right thing and dropping in a SBC tricked to like 450 or so with a basic blower set up 3. Do the really right thing by putting in a Sonny's 1000 or a good SME 4. spraying that thing some wild Metalflake!!!!! Petronox problem (and your life situation) Solved.....😊

[@vdubjunkie]

Congrats. You are officially my first hateful comment. I dig all kinds of cars and I’m pretty darned pleased with the lady I’ve got too, so I’ll keep doing what I’m doing! 😂

[@jeremydoc]

Twitter Fingers havin’ @$$. Cindy over here living under a rock not realizing there’s more people around the world besides they/them. (Probably thinks the world is flat too lulz)

[@vdubjunkie]

Twitter fingers. Thats funny!

[@chrisbusch1970]

those canister coils are junk these days. Get a real coil

[@vdubjunkie]

Ok, I’ll bite. Are you just talking about Beru or something?