Fragmentation From Steel Armor? Armored Republic FragLock

💲 Links: campsite.bio/b...
Plate Used: AR500 Armor Level III with Fraglock: bit.ly/2UXAP46
D-RMOR spall/frag guards: bit.ly/3l2L41J
TSG frag covers: bit.ly/3c5SY9s
SAS: alnk.to/8tHpwFW
Guard Dog: bit.ly/35Z9Mvk
* * The information presented in these videos is technical and educational in nature. All safety precautions are followed. Imitation or the use of anything demonstrated in my videos is done AT YOUR OWN RISK. This video is not an attempt to sell you a good or service. I am not a gun shop and DO NOT sell or deal in Firearms. Such a practice is heavily regulated and subject to applicable laws. I DO NOT sell parts, magazines, or firearms.
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#bodyarmor #ar500armor #NIJlevelIII

[@TheEverydayEnthusiast]

No one has tested an angled hit on steel armor. I'd like to see that. Maybe even with handgun rounds

[@chatnasty]

Same here. If I had to guess I'd bet that a large hunk of the bullet ends up deflecting

[@aleksandarcurguz2428]

Bulletsafe did?

[@jackblack6904]

Its been done before at least once that i saw on youtube, IIRC it was an advert for a ceramic plate seller though, so an independent follow up would definitely be nice to see.

[@MrTrenchcoat7]

Steel ops did one on angled shots.

[@indyjons321]

Or glancing hits to Ceramics...

[@dgd947a15fl]

The reason ceramic and poly plates can stop spall is because they're designed to deform on impact, which is how the displace the energy. The bullet breaks up and still moves forward a bit. Unlike steel which stops bullets by just being hard, and since the bullets aren't going forward then the material needs to go somewhere.

[@noquartergiven7789]

Bullet fragmentation is not technically spall. Spall is secondary fragmentation caused from a projectile impact. So if the bullet hits the steel and causes pieces of that steel to fragment off that is spall. If it's just pieces of the bullet then it's fragmentation or "splash". If you've ever shot a piece of wood and seen the splinters fly off the back those splinters are spall. ETA: If the plate coating is flying off that is spall too. Most of damage seen in this demonstration is bullet splash.

[@dgd947a15fl]

@@noquartergiven7789 Correct. But the word spall is such a commonly used term for bullet splatter now that you basically have to say spall when discussing it.

[@JeepJeep234]

Ceramic armor does not contain fragmentation. Poly and kevlar do. And if you have a good enough coating on steel it will contain frag.

[@bass779]

Really scary. Good for two shots, on this particular sample.

[@mikewong2440]

Lovely. So now it can pass 1/3rd of the NIJ III test. Yey.

[@joncampo1627]

Ceramic is only good for a couple shots as well and then the whole fucking bullet goes through it

[@Rokaize]

@@joncampo1627 no. Only if the shots are right on top of each other.

[@jimmymartino5433]

@@Rokaize To pass NIJ certification, plates must resist 3 shots in a 4” inch circle, so even then, I’d say you’re good

[@sedition517]

Very simple but effective way to see fragmentation. Overall good job brother.

[@BuffRANGE]

Thanks a ton

[@Hgkingx]

It would have been interesting to see the test in a plate carrier and seen how much would have been caught by that.

[@crazyassracing]

Would like to see you test swimming in swimmers cut plates.

[@BuffRANGE]

Good idea for a video. How effectively can one swim with hard armor :D

[@DinoNucci]

@Chris Ayala nah bruh

[@libertarianGO]

@@BuffRANGE I'll do it! Tell me where to send the video. To clarify for those who are going to freak out, I'm a strong swimmer (life guard for years) and I was in the marines. I'm well aware of what I'm getting myself into and I'm not going to be dump about it.

[@brianblose]

I've learned more from a few videos of yours recently than I have from every other gun channel about body armor. Thanks bro. Keep up the good work

[@BuffRANGE]

Thank you, and I'm glad I am helping spread knowledge :D

[@blakeb.8525]

Friends don’t let friends buy steel plates for armor.

[@DinoNucci]

Wat?

[@Halal_Dan]

@@DinoNucci steel bad

[@saintsinningsword]

Seen how coatings on steel armor falls off after a few shots, guessing they're equally if not more important to consider if using steel. Still thinking test medium could have been better, but looks proof enough that spalling or splash will hurt you if spall coat fails.

[@saintsinningsword]

Wondering how steel and ceramic or polyethylene composites work in place of spall coat. Kevlar sleeve looks interesting.

[@MinuteBracelet]

At this point i would recommend steel plates, but only the ones from steel ops. Theyve got the frag liner figured out pretty well and good

[@MrGiXxEr]

I always see spall tests done square to the plate but nobody ever does a shot off angle. Could you show this at some point?

[@atxjaphotos4217]

Steel Ops has.

[@MarinMatt95]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/d5-ZkoBur7Fgi5o

[@JustanotherMA]

1: People have done so. 2: At an angle, bullet have higher chance to ricochet. Bounced bullets have more unpredictable trajectories while still being lethal, so...

[@MrGiXxEr]

@@JustanotherMA You don't say.🤦‍♂️

[@obzylitecrysis]

@@MrGiXxEr what he’s trying to says it’s potentially dangerous to test out shooting steel plates because it could bounce back to you

[@RiotVenom]

This has probably been asked already, but I'd love to see a test like this with budget ceramic plates like RMA 1155s or Hesco 4401s. Been seeing arguments recently of ceramic fragging worse then steel, but I'd really like to see a test that isn't from the armor company themselves. That being said, just found your channel today and I'm loving the content. Keep it up!

[@BuffRANGE]

I will gladly test ceramic and PE and add carriers as well!

[@JoshSmith-mm1fi]

If you’re curious that lie that is spread is from ar500 on there “test” micro particles of basically sand popped some balloons and they’re like 😢 see ceramic spalls too.

[@Seth9809]

The production quality of this video is crazy.....

[@redrummaster5076]

Thank you for another wonderful video I would have preferred in this test for you to shown us what happened after 1 round I feel that since you kept firing. It cause the protective coating to separate giving a way for more shrapnel to be able to escape

[@BuffRANGE]

1 hit is no problem for these coatings, and that's been demonstrated by many.

[@markeasley6149]

Great use of used gel blocks. Very creative

[@BuffRANGE]

Thanks.!!

[@jaysmith9496]

Id like to see a plate with 1/4-1/3" raised lips with the coating over and in it. wonder if said lip would help contain any lateral fragments

[@Evergreen1400]

I was just sitting on the toilet while watching this and that was the exact thing I came up with, I do believe it would work

[@timewave02012]

I assume they can't make it cheaper than competitive options.

[@jaysmith9496]

@@timewave02012 I'd pay double the price for an ar-550 plate that had a lip around it help hold the coating, as well as act as a hard barrier for the immediate fragments. As would anyone who actually uses these things for work/duty instead of as a fashion statement. It would more be the increase in production time. The quickest route would be 4 bolt on sides, but then you have to engineer it in a manner where it doesn't compromise the areas around the bolts. machining as a solid piece is out, so it laser welding. In an ideal sense it would be a multi piece bezel around the plate, possibly with hinged corners that locks onto itself as to not have to drill the plate.

[@user-td1zo3tv9p]

If they could create some kind of matrix to embed within the spall coating to give it some gripping power and prevent the lining from being cut free. It could anchor the front to the back around the perimeter. But face it: if you have a guy unloading an M14 FA on you or an M240B doing the same, irrespective of whether or not the coating retains adhesions, your chest will be like a Strawberry Smoothie on the inside from the kinetic impact trauma. To that end, this test was designed to elicit a FAIL and i wonder what his agenda really is to perform the "test." It sure as hell isn't anything on the order of "scientific" if you ask me. Just a Hack with an agenda. Prove me wrong, Muscle Buff Man.

[@BuffRANGE]

@@user-td1zo3tv9p What's my agenda? People post pics of Steel armor fragging, but then never offer any details. I had the plates and time to test it myself. I like to share info. If you think I simply did this to elicit a fail, you're wrong..

[@sauceman5273]

I'm glad somebody made a video on this. AR500 and Spartan Armor Systems are really terrible companies. People who don't know anything about armor will google "armor plates" and these two companies will show up, especially AR500. Since they don't know any better, they'll buy steel plates from AR500, likely to learn later that steel plates are terrible. They're heavy, rarely meeting NIJ Level IV, not good at taking multiple hits, cracks into pieces like crazy, and spall like crazy, often upwards into your neck, which will kill you. Pretty much everything else AR500 sells is a scam, too. Their carriers are low quality and heavy.

[@dexm2010]

I don't think there are any Level IV rated steel plates, at least none that are being sold for use in plate carriers.

[@AA-dn8dj]

I hope you are having a great day Buffman.

[@BuffRANGE]

No complaints here.

[@moshkid16]

I wonder if a company put a 10°-15° lip around the armor creating a slight bowl effect that would deflect the spall out. atleast under he chin area if that would make any difference. Great videos.

[@556bc]

Steel is for targets, not for body armor. There's a reason why no entity in mil and leo uses them for that purpose.

[@nicolas8098]

steel has been used and is currently used by some army but not because it's better than PE/ceramics just because it's cheap and you'll keep it for decade ( a good exemple would be the 6b23-1 russian army body armor which has been used from 2008 to today and is now being replaced by ceramics plate)

[@Talex-jb8bp]

They need to use that coding in conjunction with Kevlar that wraps around the plate so the Kevlar will act like rebar in concrete

[@rileyneufeld7001]

A kevlar sleeve would be perfect for this! I've always thought that some form of kevlar should be bonded to the steel. Though with corner impacts I think a kevlar carrier would be more ideal.

[@agentoranj5858]

@Chris Ayala You say that like it's a bad thing.

[@rileyneufeld7001]

@Chris Ayala I doubt a thin kevlar sleeve would stop any rifle rounds from penetrating. And it doesn't add much weight so who cares?

[@Talex-jb8bp]

The Kevlar isn’t supposed to stop the bullets it’s supposed to catch the fragments

[@cfl4286]

Late to this, but I have seen companies make Kevlar bags/sleeves for 10x12 steel plates that seem fairly effective. Tho, it seems pretty pointless when you can get hesco L210s or other budget ceramic plates that will stop the same threats and are half the weight.

[@schuylermorris5342]

They need to somehow scuff up the strike face of the plate before applying the anti-spalling material that way it has an actual surface to bond to to give it a good bite is with a smooth surface that s*** just peels right off after a shot or two

[@BuffRANGE]

Yep that is an issue as well!

[@robbabcock_]

Good test! Like lots of other folks I started out with steel but moved to ceramic/PE as the prices began to come down. So far I've only seen one really viable method of mitigating spall and the company/guy that does it seems to have abandoned the efforts. That was a metal frame that skirted the edge of the plate to block fragments. It was an ingenious arrangement but I've seen nothing from him in six or seven years. Honestly I don't see much point to steel for body armor anymore; at one point it was a lot cheaper but nowadays it's about a wash. True you may potentially get better multi-hit capability but that doesn't matter if spalling kills you before the plate is penetrated.

[@mikewong2440]

And then there's the issue of material quality. Remember that no test we've seen is third party _batch_ testing. This is third party testing, but only single sample. Given stories of concerningly often freak failures, well...

[@ayoodjsmk]

I hate how many videos on KZbin make it seem this way but the testing method is not how it would be in a real life scenario… steel plates are far more safe than soft armor & the chances of death are far less but even then you shouldn’t rely on any armor for numerous reasons … I personally know someone who has been shot wearing steel armor & guess what he’s alive …. Now in comparison if you’re wearing soft armor & get hit with a 308 you better get used to having a storage compartment in your chest , or not! Because you’ll most likely be dead unlike steel plates which will either stop the round completely or be defeated either way you’ll suffer a less brutal death

[@ayoodjsmk]

I don’t see what’s so hard to understand it’s common sense … neither choice will 100% save ur life for multiple reasons

[@michaelturk7237]

@Ricky LS OK but we aren't talking about soft vests. Nor are we talking about how you shouldn't rely 100% on your armor (glad that didn't apply to your friend tho, happy to hear he lived), or whether it can stop bullets (don't get me started on green-tips and off-brand "tactical armor"), or whether the test is one-to-one "realistic" rather than an illustrative demonstration. Ignoring everything else, why skimp out on armor? Why pick the heavier option that still throws spall at you? Because it's _cheaper?_ Because you didn't want to hunt for NIJ-certified ceramic plates instead of just hitting the 'Buy' button? Ultimately it's your money and your body bro, but when you have to spend the difference on a spall liner treatment + a Kevlar liner + a trauma pad just to be able to declare an unrated and untested plate imported from China "just as good", then is it REALLY "just as good"? No. No, it isn't. That's a cope. Love yourself. Get ceramics or polys.

[@humansvd3269]

There's also spall sleeves sold out there to help this.

[@BuffRANGE]

Yep I threw a link to a few in the description

[@hiota45]

Friends don't let friends buy steel armor

[@ThanksforcensoringmeYoutube]

Fantastic work, bro. You always go the extra mile 👍

[@BuffRANGE]

Thanks 👍

[@AlphaRomeoOneFive]

By golly this was another great video! Spalling is no joke. I'd imagine if one of those fragments hit you in just the right place it could fatal for sure. Thanks Matt!

[@BuffRANGE]

Indeed!

[@dthompsont3796]

I'd say getting hit in the chest without armor could be fatal as well. 😳

[@trechtzach8151]

@@dthompsont3796 the thing is in the US steel VS no armor is a false dichotomy.

[@cc-vg4ed]

BUT....BUT....BALLOONS!

[@BuffRANGE]

They all float down here!

[@madeconomist458]

Between this plate's being flat and weighing almost 8 lbs, I personally wouldn't even dream of wearing this in any plate carrier. BUT(!!) Even AR500's cheapest Heritage plate *did* stop at least one hit of 7.62x51 with all fragments contained. Tactical Scorpion Gear's TSG1012BRC plate is listed on the NIJ's database of compliant armor. As of this writing, one can score a pair of AR500 plates for $65, and a pair of TSG plates for $88. Even the very cheapest Chinese ceramic plates will cost $200 per pair.

[@derbestatter6]

I wrapped my plates with kevlar stuff and frag is no question anymore...

[@BuffRANGE]

I would say if you use steel they should be covered in an envelope of Kevlar.

[@derbestatter6]

@@BuffRANGE Yes Sir its all around , multiple layers

[@TheTyler701]

Kevlar tape? What kinda wrap?

[@NoizyBearBearOfficial]

I wonder if a quarter inch lip around the whole plate would help stop the spall? Or if the plate itself was milled with honeycomb or circles into it like a golf ball would help the spall fly forward instead. Other than that I think it’s dumb they don’t make double coating standard, like why do you have to pay extra just for a second coat when the first coat is just going to fail.

[@f3nixfire]

Awesome! This is great data! Thanks for the info Matt!

[@RightWingNutter]

Try some of those level 4 plates with ceramic scales over UHDPE or Kevlar. The ceramic absorbs most of the energy that would go into spall on a steel plate. Then the back layer absorbs the remaining penetrating energy. I use those on the front and steel with liner on the back of my rig.

[@BuffRANGE]

Yep! We will be re-testing with ceramic and PE plates inside of carriers.

[@gnomereviews]

Yea yea you win 🤴🏻

[@elburropeligroso4689]

I wonder if a light weight aluminum frame around the edges or some kind of nylon or kevlar gasket running around the edges and protruding forward out 1/4 of an inch would be enough to catch the spall fragments.

[@dgd947a15fl]

A kevlar cover would do it, and some companies do make kevlar sleeves for steel plates. Of course the problem is that then you're adding even more weight and cost to something that's already heavier and more expensive than many US-made ceramic options for the same protection level. Buy Hesco L210's or 4401's.

[@bkackmagic555]

@@dgd947a15fl even so it still frags a bit.

[@mikejeffsteel]

Really helpful test! Thanks!

[@BuffRANGE]

Glad it was helpful!

[@Zlongster]

Wrap your plates in duct tape and it greatly reduce spalling

[@stompinmcallister1312]

Because of your help and testing I got some la police gear level 4 alumina and pe plates very happy with them. I am also happy to report it seems they fixed the edges they don't have the extra padding around the perimeter of the plate anymore I would say that's because of your review.

[@BuffRANGE]

I'm pretty sure they're still a reduced ceramic strike face, and mention it in the description. If it still weighs about 6lbs 3oz then it will have the ring.

[@stompinmcallister1312]

@@BuffRANGE yea it's the same just was pretty solid feeling there does not feel spongy at all

[@digitalpunk5365]

Buffman is awesome

[@HomeOnTheRanges]

I feel like steel armor with a full build up coating and a spall jacket as additional protection is the answer. The reason I say this setup wins over ceramic is because steel armor will remain effective for your entire life and is more durable as to be used in training

[@BuffRANGE]

But with more and more advanced bullets coming out, steel remains weak to those along with even the basic M193.

[@HomeOnTheRanges]

@@BuffRANGE level 3+ ar550 stops m193 and beyond up to 30-06 jsp

[@BuffRANGE]

@@HomeOnTheRanges no it doesn’t. Only up to about 3,150 fps. You can get that from a 16” barrel. ;)

[@mattasan6859]

I would like to see this test done in a standard plate carrier to see if that affect these results.

[@DinoNucci]

THIS

[@schuylermorris5342]

If it has enough remaining energy to separate the anti-spalling coating then it's going to rip right through cordura or any other plate carrier material

[@skyhop]

Sometimes at surplus stores you can find random web gear that has kevlar liner packs inside of it. I got a few, and used some rectangular kevlar packs to wrap the edges of my plates with. The kevlar packs are generally only frag rated, but that's precisely what they're dealing with.

[@dgd947a15fl]

Yeah, but the point is that a company shouldn't claim that something stops spall if it doesn't actually stop spall. If it needs to be worn in conjunction with other products in order to achieve certain characteristics, then they need to say that.

[@plmkoo6772]

If you need to go through all that might as well just get ceramics

[@thedude828]

Surprisingly tactical scorpion plates did ok on spall in mr guns n gears review but did fail after a few shots but his setup wasn't as high tech as this one but it performed pretty well

[@VapidSlug]

Might be best to have steel back plate but have something that captures projectiles sitting beneath your face

[@rightwingairsoft]

Id like to see a test with the Kevlar wraps to see what mitigation it may give. Either way, steel just isn't worth it anymore. Thanks for the content!

[@dgd947a15fl]

Yup, even without kevlar sleeves it's already more expensive than many high quality US-made ceramic options. Add a kevlar sleeve to actually do what the spall coating fails to do and now it's even heavier and more expensive.

[@DinoNucci]

Um WAT?? Steel is the correct answer. Donno wtf you smoking.

[@Chicano_pistolero]

@@Anthony-yz3vj probably because they don’t wanna buy it again in five years after the armors expiration, ceramic armor loses its integrity after a few years which is why it has an expiration date

[@martinandrews8496]

I've never seen one of these.good idea broski

[@Larbr000]

I picked up tactical scorpion frag enclosures to help. They are not terribly expensive and include trauma pads

[@miketeets2962]

This is not a full coated plate, this is a base coat.

[@jeremiahjohnson9908]

If they are wearing armor, go for the groin.

[@lyfandeth]

Be nice to try some "tanglefoot" spall liners and see how good they are at catching spall.

[@BuffRANGE]

Who? Link?

[@evolutionnow807]

Put the plate in some kevlar from a flack jacket or something that will catch thos little fragments like flack vest kevlar dose with fragments of grenades and shrapnel

[@bkackmagic555]

At that cost ceramic does it better

[@dzsquad1965]

But with them in a plate carrier that fabric should also help stop fraging?? And can't they put something like vacuum air tight gel in front of the Spalding? Or some type of gel block like 1\4 in or 1\2 in gel block materials

[@ColeDedhand]

Looks like they need some surface prep to get better adhesion.

[@BuffRANGE]

It sure does seem that way. In the past, sometimes the coating held and big pieces fly off. Not consistent..

[@DinoNucci]

That's what I was thinking too.

[@KpopNiDontStop]

I am definitely getting those sleeves.

[@Rurik_Luci]

Don't forget this is an issue for rifles. Something you have a 0.69% chance of facing.

[@rustysausage69]

I'm very late to this vid but the way to keep that coating on the steel is to increase the contact area of the coating, and/or divert the direction of the spalling on different directions; dimple drilling the plate or texturing it would do just that. It would be much more expensive to produce (requiring CNC work) and would require probably 1/8" thicker metal to begin with but that would let the coating stick for more rounds than 5 (I assume a 9mm would probably take 8 or 10 rounds max to separate the coating from the steel). Once that coating comes off, the steel is completely fubar as useful protection. EDIT: a liquid antispall layer that self-heals somehow would also do the trick. No clue how that would work though.

[@BuffRANGE]

Then that would get into the realm of heavier weight :(

[@rustysausage69]

@@BuffRANGE MUCH heavier. no free lunch thats for sure lol

[@joemoment-o1275]

3:45 you need an MVP so you can load AR10 mags.

[@markanthonystringfellow3923]

Great Work B!!! Guard Dog steel body armor do a kevlar spall cover that works really well and i like over the usual coatings :-))

[@BuffRANGE]

Do they sell those covers separately?

[@markanthonystringfellow3923]

@@BuffRANGE Im not sure to be honest, a while ago i found an israeli company that was selling them on ebay for around 40 pounds (UK) for 10/12 inch,but with all the different shapes of plates and cuts available it can still be awkward to get a snug fit!

[@blckandwhtknight]

Would be nice to see a curved one. The flat plate is going to push all the frag energy to the seams. Once part of the lamination is broken there's no stopping the frag. A curved plate should disperse the energy locally instead of the edge.

[@dgd947a15fl]

Unfortunately you need to pay extra to make the plate single curved instead of FLAT.

[@mikewong2440]

It'd be helpful for viewers to see your shot placement if you put brightly colored paper circles on the plate to indicate shot placement. Also might help you more accurately determine shot placement? Dunno.

[@BuffRANGE]

Normally I do that, but the stickers come off very easily. The white paint pens or white out pens run. In this case I wasn't so much concerned with shot placement vs trying to get the coating to to fail.

[@Halal_Dan]

I wish you would weigh the plate before the test. The level III plates that AR500 sends in for ballistic testing are 9.8 pounds and over half an inch thick, while the ones they sell are 8 pounds and much thinner.

[@BuffRANGE]

I did not know that. I have this plate somewhere, let me weight it.

[@Halal_Dan]

@@BuffRANGE Yup see for yourself (www.ar500armor.com/media/wysiwyg/AR500Armor_NIJ06_III_42313_1.jpg )

[@mikewong2440]

@@BuffRANGE yo wait what whazz the result brother

[@mikewong2440]

Well that's one hell of a damning proof

[@BuffRANGE]

@@mikewong2440 This plate weighs 7lbs 8oz..

[@bepropheta6665]

I don’t think it’s possible to “stick” something to the front of an AR500 plate and expect it stay stuck after being shot. Every bullet when it hits becomes a 360 degree knife. AR500 welded to the sides creating a frame is about the only thing that will keep the bullet fragments contained (at least slow them down).

[@Evergreen1400]

I think you’re right. I think steel is still very capable but you’re absolutely right the current way of mitigating spalling by sticking something to the surface is not working. I came up with the same solution you did as far as creating an edge there’s a few others that came to the same conclusion it would be nice to see an evolution in how it’s created.

[@cpaoutdoors9926]

The object is to not get shot bottom line and Armour not all that effective when you got the fatal t sitting on top of it anyway

[@Docsporseen1]

Do you think having it in a carrier like it would be used would help catch the fragments?

[@dgd947a15fl]

Maybe, but it shouldn't have to rely on a carrier. If their plate is actually an In-Conjunction-With system, then they need to be upfront about what it needs to be worn in conjunction with to achieve the claimed protection. If the coating doesn't actually stop spall, then they need to stop claiming it stops spall.

[@Nathan-jh1ho]

If it can stop a decent velocity BB, because the penertration depth is about the same as a BB

[@TMega5612]

Looks like the coating handled two shots before it started failing. They probably need to find a way to hold it close to the plate more effectively. How deep with the spall penetration go if the blocks had some denim lining them? Also is this the build-up coat or default?

[@BuffRANGE]

This is the build up coat.

[@TMega5612]

@@BuffRANGE Thanks for the clarification.

[@HouseOfJacobWAKEUP]

Is there any material I can line my plates with that will have green flames spalling when I shoot it? I need it for marketing reasons.

[@davidhunter9434]

Did this AR500 Armor plate have the single coating or the buildup coat of anti-frag compound? Would love to see this test highlighting the difference between the two. Also - have you done the same type of testing with ceramic and/or ceramic/poly plates? Ceramic does spall and frag as well. Would once again love to see this shown so we can better understand our options. Cheers!

[@dgd947a15fl]

This plate did include the buildup anti-frag coating, yes.

[@davidhunter9434]

@@dgd947a15fl Did Buffman say that in the video?

[@BuffRANGE]

It's the build up coating. I apologize for not mentioning that. I will re-test this using a plate carrier and PE and Ceramic armor. Just give me some time to get the test done and edited.

[@davidhunter9434]

@@BuffRANGE Thanks for clarifying, and yes - a re-test using a carrier and one with Ceramic/poly plates both in and outside a carrier would be most excellent. Your videos are really helpful! One more QQ: Were these plates current, with the most recent formula of their "fraglock" or were they older plates?

[@kid1027]

wouldnt a level II or IIa plate carrier be able to stop fragmentation?

[@RogueJedi501]

Would it be better for multiple shots compared with ceramic? The ceramic can only with take so many hits before it’s not effective anymore. Steel can take more but then you’ve got the spalling 😕

[@BuffRANGE]

It depends on the threat. There’s some interesting frag mitigation tech for steel that could make it viable but cost and weight become a concern. Depending on the threat ceramic can take many hits as well

[@generalbakedpotato6150]

Think tactical scorpion makes a spall bag

[@BuffRANGE]

Yep so do a few others :D

[@VeritasEtAequitas]

Personally, I don't store my vital organs externally to the sides and in front of my torso.

[@BuffRANGE]

But veins and arteries carrying blood are there :D

[@VeritasEtAequitas]

@@BuffRANGE Brachial arteries, yes. Especially if your arms are up holding a rifle or pistol.

[@theparaminuteman]

@@VeritasEtAequitas your neck is right up there tho

[@Abzocold]

Six shots is silly. In actual use you'd take one, maybe two rounds and you'd gtfo of there. The coating will contain that decently well. Back at base you break out your stored can of undercoating/rhino liner (You bought that too, right? Right?!) and re-cover the plate with a new thick layer and you're good to get back to work. After ceramic takes a round or two it's not terribly safe to use anymore and must be replaced. If I could afford multiple ceramic plates I'd do that but the budget says steel and spare coating.

[@kennyphan3953]

You did do multiple hits and would weaken the coating. What about the first 1-2 shots? Realistically do you want to get shot 6 times?

[@BuffRANGE]

Realistically no. I guess the hard part is there is NO standards for mitigating frag. However I feel the plastic coating frag systems are not robust enough.

[@kennyphan3953]

@@BuffRANGE fair enough, valid points all around. I feel though I would be happy if it stopped a one or two shots with minimal fragmentation I would be happy for what you pay for. Some armor is better than no armor!

[@kennyphan3953]

@@BuffRANGE I love your channel keep it up!

[@joegreschak2499]

Have you thought about trying one of Spartan’s spall sleeves?

[@BuffRANGE]

I want to do a follow up with some of the sleeves available. They would be of great benefit here as I mentioned and while they add to cost, would go a long way to mitigate this.

[@dgd947a15fl]

@@BuffRANGE Make sure to do an analysis of how expensive and heavy it is once you include the cost and weight of the sleeve, so that people get an idea of what they're actually getting into with steel armor and what they actually need to spend to get a functional plate.

[@BuffRANGE]

@@dgd947a15fl Indeed. some of these sleeves are not cheap!

[@SteelTyrant527]

Have you conducted a video on the effects of a steel plate in a frag sleeve?

[@BuffRANGE]

I have not. I plan on it :D

[@dgd947a15fl]

Just buy Hesco L210s. Once you take AR500's Level III+ steel plate and pay extra to upgrade it with the spall liner that doesn't works and to make it single curve instead of flat, it's already more expensive and heavier than Hesco L210s.

[@BuffRANGE]

Those are up next! Well not right next, but I've talked to a retailer and we have some coming!

[@dgd947a15fl]

@@BuffRANGE HUZZAH!!!

[@kitingalla2826]

I had a question if someone was strong enough to carry it wouldn't still plate The beneficial behind a ceramic plate

[@BuffRANGE]

well yeah but that would be a HUGE amount of weight to carry.

[@kitingalla2826]

@@BuffRANGE thanks again for your quick response and yes I definitely see that I figure still play might be 7 lb plus a ceramic being 5- 7 lb depending itself.. specially if you went front and back with both thank you for your input once again

[@angus1321]

How about making it more realistic and put the plate in a carrier

[@messiaxm9730]

Understanding the problem of the various plates, there will surely be a well-studied solution to the army, and what is it?

[@bjsmith6753]

Wonder if they angled the edges of the 500 steel at 90 degrees if it would stop splatter all together or atleast through it back at the shooter.

[@alouiciousjackson5812]

Just goes to show that all spall coatings are a gimmick! If you want protection, stack a level 2 pad on top of your plate!

[@288gto7]

Its not a „gimmick“ they work for the first round. And the companies never claim that these plates will still be useful after the first round

[@dgd947a15fl]

@@288gto7 They never tell you it only works for one round either. Which is sort of an important detail.

[@dgd947a15fl]

Any soft armor cover would need to be wrapped around the sides of the plate in order to stop spall, since spall splatters outwards. Soft armor laying on top of the plate won't actually catch any spall.

[@alouiciousjackson5812]

@@dgd947a15fl if the two pieces are tightly bound together it does work. What I want to see is thin sheets of Kevlar placed in between the layers of spall coating build up. I don't know why anyone hasn't tried that yet.

[@nathanc.8821]

How about a aramid weave frag cover? That would be a good test

[@jake9705]

My AR500 Armor order is taking FOREVER to ship! I ordered a pair of 10x12 plates the last week of November, still haven't received anything other than spam mail. Glad your armor was sponsored or you'd be waiting too 😆

[@BuffRANGE]

They claimed 6 week lead times now? These plates were From last year so I’ve had them awhile.

[@9ryder]

I dont understand why they dont just create metal rim going around the plate. Like sideways U metal rim and antispall coating goes under that in the front. It would catch spalling way more effective and antispall coating wouldnt get torn off after just few rounds

[@mikewong2440]

Price, mostly. The tooling required would cut into their bottom line, and of course they can't have *that*

[@chrisgodfrey2846]

Could you do a test with the Guard Dog anti spall/trauma sleeve?

[@jonathanbond5432]

I have a problem. I’m 6’2 long torso. I have the shooters cut and I’ll get hit in the gut more than anywhere in the body. Armor Republic has a.11x14 flat armor, which sucks but what sucks more is it basecoat. I looked on our website I couldn’t find if they do personalized frag lock. My question is is there a place to go to get it professionally done or obviously being sarcastic by three shooters cut for the front and three for the back? Come on you can’t tell me taller guys need protection from just below the neck down to an inch above my belt line. I’m not trying to get shot in the stomach. My only option now is to have soft armor underneath and the a2shooters cut On top, I can’t be the only one with this problem

[@BuffRANGE]

Yeah you might be handicapped to 11x14, but generally speaking lower torso isn't always covered..

[@atxjaphotos4217]

I'd love to see you test a SteelOps plate.

[@BuffRANGE]

I've talked to them. Drop them a comment on their FB or IG page and tell them you want to see me test their stuff.

[@JRassi_Militaria]

It would have been more useful data wise to check for spall between each shot, not after 6 rounds; that's not a realistic threat, and it doesn't tell us what the coating can actually do. Looks like it held up for the first 2 rounds of 308 (worst case) before it started allowing spall to pass. Do you not consider that a useful level of protection?

[@BuffRANGE]

THE NIJ level III under 06 is 6 shots of M80 ball. Even the the upcoming NIJ 07 RF1/2 are 3 hits. If manufacturers were more transparent in their claims I would find any # they state to be acceptable. Rather than them issuing blanket statements "Stops all Fragmentation" :D

[@DinoNucci]

Fraggle Rock !!

[@DinoNucci]

Damned Doozers always eating the swizzle sticks

[@mikewilliams8151]

With hollow points, will get more slapt

[@bkeller80]

Great video!

[@BuffRANGE]

Thanks for the visit

[@parkplaceninja]

mine are wrapped in kevlar

[@Zacharygundam]

I always stand in one place taking 6 bullets. How about something more unrealistic like 1 or 2 hits. Maybe it will fair better.

[@fajile5109]

I was thinking if they welded a honey comb pattern to the face of the steel it could reflect more spalling back instead of out. I always thought itd be nice if armor was repairable but re coating ar500 wouldnt really be easy. Or possible if you died.

[@hhds4716]

Why don't they have a lip of steel go all around or to curl the edge of the plate to make a box like lip that sticks out like an inch or so from the plate to stop bullets like a bullet trap 🤔

[@stevedo18able]

It's got me thinking in recent times. I used the CATI curved plates for the insane comfort with curves and the build up coat. I don't know if you'd realistically expect to get hit that many times for the spalling to eventually make its way out of the coating and through the plate carrier to do damage. I am concerned about the curves and at what angle you are shot at. Will it ricochet? Something no one has really tested. The easy and possible solution is Steel armor on the rear, ceramic in the front if it is a huge concern.

[@BuffRANGE]

That is true. the true mulitcurve plates like CATI have the top section angled towards the shooter.

[@user-td1zo3tv9p]

Uh, it's 2021, Pardner.

[@BuffRANGE]

I recorded back in November ;)

[@derekromero2331]

I’m considering buying my first plates. And as scary as spalling seems. My thought is that I’d rather take possible spalling than a 5.56 through the sternum. Someone care to discuss why steel is so bad to me?

[@BuffRANGE]

Steel is prone to penetration inside 15-20yds with M193 from 16” barrels. It will stop m855 and possibly M855a1 but M193 is a weakness. What threats do you want to stop?

[@derekromero2331]

@@BuffRANGE I’m just a regular civilian now with a regular job. So my curiosity with plate is coming from just a want to have something to maybe keep in my car in case of a crazy societal collapse. I’d want something to wear so me and my family can travel from the east coast back to Texas where our home and family is. I’d primarily be concerned with typical handgun rounds like 9mm and maybe stopping 1 or 2 long gun rounds (since civilians will mostly only have semi-auto rifles). The ar500 freeman is tempting right now because of its very small size it would be something I would be able to wear long term without being as tempted to remove it during any trip.

[@BuffRANGE]

@@derekromero2331 I would think you would be better served with an RMA 1092. You're getting a true multi-curve plate that's right at 5lbs, and offers coverage of M193, M855, and M80 ball as well as virtually all pistol threats. Another good option is the Militech RF2 or Tactical Scorpion Gear III+ Extreme. You will gain overall thickness in those, but your ballistic coverage greatly increases.

[@libertarianGO]

Ok but it's made to be worn in a carrier of decent quality. The carrier is part of the armor system. I've seen them shot multiple times and have no pass through on the carrier. From the looks of it none of them would make it through a good nylon carrier. This test would be similar to taking the ceramic away from the polyethylene backing and then trying to test it. The system is a system and should be reasonably tested together for effectiveness. I do agree that if they were to do a mild steel lip around the edge it would help a lot though. Love your videos though. Thank you for your work.

[@xthetenth]

Don't tell AR500's market that or they wouldn't be buying the cut-rate nonsense gear they bundle with it.

[@BuffRANGE]

I would agree that the carrier itself could provide benefit, and that I will follow up with additional testing. And your analogy is not really correct. The ballistic rating of steel is not changed by throwing it in the carrier. If you removed the ceramic from a hybrid plate, you'd be completely changing the threat capability of the plate.

[@dgd947a15fl]

Not a valid point. The carrier itself is NOT part of the protection system, and any armor plate shouldn't rely on the carrier to stop spall. What you're describing is more like an In Conjunction With system. And a more accurate analogy would be if a company made a plate that only stopped certain threats with a Level IIIA kevlar backer, but didn't say it needed the kevlar backer.

[@libertarianGO]

@@BuffRANGE I respectfully disagree. Steel acts as the hard portion of the armor the same way the ceramic acts. The difference is that the ceramic ABSOLUTELY requires the backing while the steel can stand alone for stopping the bullet but does yield issues of spawling without a containment rig (spawl guard is only half of that). Ceramic and steel are two completely different types of armor on how they are to be employed. I would never recommend someone run a steel plate in a Rhodesian rig because they were not designed to go together. On the other hand running ceramics in a concealment carrier would make you look weird and fat, while steel can protect you from handgun rounds and stabs to your vitals in a thin plate. Everything has its uses. Steel just has so much mis-information out there that most people don't understand what situations it excels at.

[@libertarianGO]

@@dgd947a15fl my point is completely valid according to military armor standards. You don't use hard armor (steel or ceramic) next to sensitive systems (hydraulics on a helicopter) without a proper containment system. If you call and ask ar500 armor (as long as it's not a new employee who doesn't know what they are talking about) they will alway tell you that the plates are to ONLY be used in conjuction with a properly designed carrier. In short, designing a system is just that, a system. Hard armor destroys the ingerity of the bullet and there has to be an additional system stop the fragments after that. For ceramics it has to be permanently integrated which is why it's sold as a single piece but steel can be much more modular with minimal frag material if you sale it separately. Please share with me ONE incident where a steel armor company (of decent reputation) has suggested their product can protect you if you would like to duct tape it or bungee cord it to you chest. This is not combative, I'm just genuinely looking.

[@refutonefandus]

Given how they sell even the base coat as an "addon", despite it being virtually essential (though even their double coating is not effective in stopping spall), should tell you how much they care about their product. If you point out how shitass their armor is, they ban you. Camera tricks from their videos. Massive promotional campaign with huge payment incentives to their promoters. I'm amazed that they even sent you a product to test. Maybe they figured you were small enough it wouldn't hurt them.

[@BuffRANGE]

I've actually have been testing their stuff on and off for the last 7 yrs :D Granted collectively I have only amassed like 700K views across those videos, they (AR500 Armor), know I'm a no BS guy for testing. Maybe they see "any publicity" as "good publicity."

[@refutonefandus]

@@BuffRANGE They seem to be that way. I've found a lot of these scummy companies love hearing us trash talk them. It's almost sociopathic in nature.

[@mikeforeman6274]

A thin metal frame pressed around the edge to hold the liner on and catch the fragments could easily improve the plate, the liner rubber stuff would still be catching it. if you’re going to get hammered by a .30 cal machine gun at close range it may not help anyway.

[@mikespectre4153]

Is it pissing anyone else off that his camera just won't point where he wants it to point? Wth kinda camera is that?

[@BuffRANGE]

It’s the gimbal. He hates me a lot.

[@mikespectre4153]

@@BuffRANGE damn that sucks man lol. In either case I liked the video. Im really kicking myself for buying steel plates instead of just paying a couple hundred more for PE plates