Free Will and Super determinism

An argument: how much information determines Free Will or no choice.
arxiv.org/pdf/...
1) If you have no information == You have no real choices. You do have guesses and you can learn from those, but they aren't yet choices. Hence, it is Super determinism to anyone who knew your actions, or it is Free Will to any hopeful parent that doesn't yet know that humans have to learn how to make stupid choices.
2) If you have **some information** == Here, choice means you know what consequences your actions have, to **some** degree. + It means you have **some** idea of an event on the horizon that you will actually be able to make a decision on. Both are required. Hence **FREE WILL**
or
3) If you are a god and know everything or are a scientist and have set an experiment in which all variables are known or contained in a set (with the set being contained and never revealed) and are repeatable then the outcome is repeatable and the outcome is determined. Hence Super determinism.
I had this same argument with a preacher when I was 5. I lost the argument then, I would lose the argument now, and hence, the stupidity of the argument.

[@shirtenvy8870]

I was going to say it was somewhere in between. I would go with everything is fated but the free will allows you to pick the wrong path thereby learning more about yourself and life in general. Wisdom and knowledge is variable even if you know who you are, as you a constantly evolving being. So depending on the situations and external forces can change the way you react & also if it is a situation where your subconscious takes over you may react differently than you normally would if it not a stress situation. ie when someone almost hit my car my brain was acting from a reflex impulse at that particular moment- it was a split second thing.

[@martinsoos]

Everything is Fated, but since we aren't Gods to know our fate, our ignorance will always give us hope. PS, turn your comments on your channel so I can tell you to make a video about that mud drink you make. Oh, wait, I just did.

[@shirtenvy8870]

@@martinsoos lol or you could just txt,lol :)

[@shirtenvy8870]

@@martinsoos you would have really loved what I made over the weekend, arugula,purple dead nettle, henbit, some chicory and ginger :) it was my anti-pollen tonic!!

[@martinsoos]

@@shirtenvy8870 :-)

[@turgidturbitity7415]

Many thanks for your ideas, I've seen many arguements for and against free will (including sabines argument) and I've not heard this one yet, gave me pause for thought. From my own understanding, a lot of the differences in opinion seem to stem from where a person thinks the 'will' exists or doesn't. Super determinists say the quantum realm is either cause and effect (so no freedom) or entirely random and probabilistic (so no will). That was Sabines argument I think. Others point to the subconscious mind controlling the will of the conscious mind, that we cannot "will want we want", that our subconscious controls our actions not us. New arguements for something called "compatibilism" seem to suggest that perhaps our subconscious will can be overruled by our conscious morality, but as I said it seems to depend on where a person thinks the 'will' exists or doesn't. I don't see an agreement on where the battleground for free will exists. Are you arguing for a type of compatibilism? Great video, did enjoy

[@martinsoos]

Thanks for the addons.

[@YawnGod]

Is there a difference between "predetermined" and "determined"?

[@martinsoos]

If you are determined and it is possible then it is predetermined. If you are determined and a pretty girl walks by, well, for every rule there is an exception.

[@YawnGod]

@@martinsoos Ugly girls need love too.

[@martinsoos]

If it's just ugly on the outside, save one for me. Some reason I keep drawing ugly on the inside. The last one couldn't open her mouth without a cutdown and would stare any woman down that came near me. The third time I said "I don't want to be around you" eye to eye, I gave her warning first then said it loud enough for half the dance hall to hear. It was like being around my mother, always watching my drink to see if she is going to drop some mind-numbing poison in it.

[@shirtenvy8870]

@@martinsoos 🤣

[@shirtenvy8870]

I was laughing at the first comment of -for every rule there is an exception. not about people that have ugly on the inside-- I am sorry to hear that btw that you had to deal with that

[@truthseeker2275]

Epistemology does not supervene ontology.

[@martinsoos]

I see no difference between justified belief and opinion. Why would someone have an opinion if it wasn't a justified belief. As for ontology, it is nothing more than mapping large sets and computer programming does that the best if you can program. I am at a loss as to how either deals with action vs. reaction and the root of action. Nice words to pull up though, I had to look them up.