Friction Between Friends Pre and Post-Financial Independence

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Have you encountered any tension relating to your side of FI? Whether you've already retired or not, we'd love to hear from you in the comments.

[@rx911S]

Interesting topic guys and glad you are addressing it. Bottom line, hope you continue the channel. My wife and I have not had any recent tensions related to FI or RE, My wife retired this year and i am still working (we are closer to traditional retirement age). For me, its not a question about FI, since we hit that number a while ago. but i still enjoy working (also have the benefit of working from home) and i will work for another year or so.

[@wineguy68]

I wouldn't say tension, but within my friend network, everyone is still working so it's becoming more and more difficult to relate and empathize when we get together. The farther out I get from my corporate life, the less interested I am in the BS of the corporate world. I honeslty enjoy NOT thinnking about it so I find it more and more difficult to sit and listen to my friends go on about work. Don't get me wrong, i try but its getting harder.

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

@@wineguy68 you're so right. I recently had lunch with a few former colleagues and my initial interest in the latest workplace gossip fell off really quickly. I just don't want to hear about the BS part that I'm so grateful to have distance from now. -Jason

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

@@rx911S Thanks! FI is the freedom to choose. If you're happy and getting sufficient benefit from working, it sounds like keeping that up is the right decision for you. Best wishes to you and your wife!

[@aztecforlife7360]

Great topic on a few levels. I hope you both continue to find value in the conversation. I certainly enjoy listening. I found your channel in late 2021 when I was pre FI. Now I’m post FI and RE’d. Your discussions were a big part of awakening me to the possibilities and charting my personal journey. That is my way of saying that what you do makes a difference.

[@QuantumImperfections]

Never have I experienced more friction than when my income leveled up into the $200s when my friends were still in the $40s and $50s. Even without talking about it the resentment was palpable whenever I got a new (used) car or rented a house instead of an apartment etc etc. Nothing brings and tears people apart like people's own financial expectations of themselves and their perceived "deserving" of others.

[@jeffreylo8608]

Great work exploring this under-represented side of RE. It is precisely this kind of conversations that makes 2SFI so much more valuable and and relatable than other shows. Thanks for sharing this very real conversation. It shows the strength of your friendship and I can't wait to see more from you guys.

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks so much for the very gracious feedback, Jeffrey! We really appreciate it. People seem much more attracted to the "mechanical" side of FI and the subscriber counts from those channels show it! But we're so appreciative of our audience who finds our content valuable. 🙏

[@malinallitekpatl1]

Love this conversation. I'm coasting to FI, feel disengaged from the FI community, and even more distant from the average consumer. It's a reminder of how unique I am in my circles, and a reminder to revisit my approach to others when it comes to money and my financial situation. Side note: Discord, Slack, etc. all fly over my head, lmao. I am not on the apps and sites the FI community uses today. But am happy to hear they exist.

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks, R M! Thanks for sharing

[@jondiaz3475]

Thanks for staying free of ads and marketing "partners." The independent viewpoints you both bring to the table make for a much more honest content experience.

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks, Jon

[@anguslaing6611]

My 2 cents worth... Firstly, love you guys... I'm a perfectionist (and i need to heed my own advice), BUT we would all watch without all the bells and whistles. Just you guys talking, having some guests, showing some Excel s/sheets is pretty much what captivates us... Maybe don't worry so much about the editing, replying to comments...

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Appreciate the support and the feedback!

[@fbobmosdal]

It's so good to see two old friends sit down and talk to each other with respect and love and work things out. If people need to see what non-toxic masculinity could look like, this was it. Thumbs up!

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks, Bob

[@merrybrown6407]

Hi both just want to say how much I greatly appreciate your channel…I love the conversations and always look forward to a new post. Eric you’ve honestly kept me going on the fire path as I don’t know anyone in real life who is in such a similar position, I have been laughing and nearly crying every step of the way with you! Jason thanks for the guidance ……a steady hand to not only Eric but the rest of us 💕

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thank you so much, Merry 🙏 We truly appreciate your support. Best wishes to you

[@Aussieartforkids]

Well done keeping this channel going Eric and Jason I remember thinking quite often when I first found your channel that it would be quite difficult to keep Jason motivated

[@J-D248]

I love your videos! The way you guys discuss this topic is so unique and valuable and it's something no one else covers quite like this. I'm planning on being FI in 2028, and I've gained so much from your conversations.

[@lsismeiro]

Hi guys, I hear the podcast regularly and I really appreciate your shows. You both bring insights about FI before and after reaching it but this you already known. :) Keep the episodes coming, you still have a lot to discuss and teach us about life in general and how to reach and enjoy FIRE.

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks very much for your support, Luis

[@Shadey88]

Great episode, I’m not one to comment usually, but really appreciate the content you both produce. Not everything technical is applicable in Canada, but I find you non technical content very applicable. I am sorry to hear that you get hatters. You put yourselves out there and I have a great deal of respect for that. It is not easy. I think the tension is the magic. So please keep producing the magic. Thank you.

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks, Haydn! We appreciate your support 🙏

[@cindykephart1653]

Truly appreciate this episode. As someone who is on the other side of FI, the discussion really resonated with me. Thank you both.

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks! So glad you liked it

[@dinkle5813]

This is the angst between my current self and future self. Thanks for taking on a tough conversation.

[@NettieFIRE]

Such an interesting topic. I had my own revelation about his just 2 weeks ago: ‘why am I so protective of my time?’. I reached FIRE in May 2020 (similar to Jayson) and now I guard my own time so strongly - if it not a ‘HELL yes, then its a hell NO’; before (pre-FIRE) I would sprinkle my time generously - but, oh so thinly - with others (too much so), with little regard for myself and the bigger goals that my husband and I wanted to achieve. I remember in the year before I FIRE’d I was so anxious about how limited was my time, energy, patience and general bandwidth, for everything required in life. I’d been physically stretched before but, this was different, I wanted this pre-FIRE stage to end, and end fast. I recall that overnight (it seemed) I said to my husband ‘this will be my FIRE date’ and I was certain to stick to it; I knew it myself, yet my husband doubted me. It felt like my unconscious mind (and body) made the decision before realised it in the my conscious. I knew that I was never going to return - to work that I no longer wanted to do - where I exchanged my time for money. I can see that supersaturated bandwidth fill with Eric and I wish him good speed on the journey. My husband retired 7 years before I did and he, as a consulting (commercial) electrical engineer and business owner worked daily with architects, builders, sub-contractors and (not a spelling mistake) ‘interior desecrators’. The architect is a tricky and pedantic species; part of the cog that makes the synergies of a whole project come together. 😉

[@meganavalos4605]

Regular watcher, first time commenting. For what it’s worth, I love watching you guys, the guests, the math, the fact that you are both articulate and intelligent & so much more. I love that Jason hasn’t disappeared to a beach & represents a more realistic FIRE life. As a woman, I’d like to hear from your wives more 😂 but that’s not stopping me from tuning in to each episode. I hope that you can both find a way that creates value for you. I agree with Jason, you bring something to the space that is beyond the transactional technical side, because let’s be honest anyone pursuing FI has blind spots outside of the spreadsheets. Thanks for all you do!

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks, Megan! We truly appreciate your support. Fun fact - I am not a big fan of the beach 😂 Believe me - both Eric and I would _love_ to have our spouses on again (assume you've seen the earlier two-parter with them)! Maybe when we're all in the same place next week I can make yet another pitch to Laura and Lorri about coming on again. -Jason

[@jasonboey90]

Great episode. This kinds of topic about is rarely discussed. I guess I myself am involving less in the discord server and other communities as I am just keeping my head down and focusing on the FI goalpost. I don't feel any tension, but I also feel like engaging with communities is conflicting with the time that I have to do something else. Love the episode, thanks for sharing.

[@CaliToTheCrowd]

Been a lurker on Spotify for ages... quick one to say that I absolutely love this podcast! I'm set to hit FI in 2030 and these fuel me!

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks for all your support! Best wishes to you on your journey.

[@NegSkew]

Loved watch this episode while you walked through violating the First Rule of FI-ght Club. The post RE and pre-FI desires seems spot on and authentic. Well done once again! Greatly appreciate your insights.

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Ha! Thanks very much. So glad you enjoyed it.

[@stevenharms5368]

Enjoyed. Stay true to your name, two sides.

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks, Steven!

[@andybell7665]

Awesome content gents. Very real discussions, as always ... 👏

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks, Andy

[@joell439]

I've watched every episode on this channel from the beginning and just wanted to say how much I truly appreciate all the effort to create and share this clever content. It has always provided me clarity and confirms my approach to living the retired side. Thank You 👍👍😎👍👍

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Wow! Thanks so much, Joel 🙏 We truly appreciate the support you've given us and the show. We'd greatly appreciate your help in getting the word out that we exist! Best wishes to you.

[@OGBhyve]

I can tell you both that I continue watching and receiving value from the conversations you share. Perhaps there's a way to keep the occasional deep dive, but more often, something less effort for you both. Keep things sustainable. Less frequent videos > No more videos due to burnout

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks, Bhyve

[@Jfhelwig]

My favorite episode so far

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thank you 🙏

[@heathhall3662]

Jason Fi & RE. Eric probably FI now and RE when everything is lined out. For me, I understand how to reach FI and it is probabilistically just going to be another decade of saving and investing. Because a decade is such a long time the thing I am getting out of this show is a valuable look at what FI and RE can look like. Thank you both for engaging in this project.

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thank you, Heath! We appreciate your support

[@mildca]

Watching this video makes me wonder if a FI-vorce is coming? I really enjoy the concept of TwoSidesOfFI and hope that you guys are able to make the show work until Eric reaches his RE date. Tensions happen -- glad you guys were laughing at the end. 😅

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Nah, we're all good! We're much better for having had this conversation though.

[@ahan6288]

Will you stop these videos when Eric crosses over to RE?

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

@@ahan6288 we have no plans to but naturally we will see where life takes us!

[@brdoboy]

Great episode as always, guys! Although not quite what I expected from the title. If you're up for it I would love to hear more about how to interact with friends & family who aren't on the FIRE train. I know you've touched on it, but I think there is a lot here to unpack. (Just make sure you pick the right thumbnail, obviously!)

[@dabrigalive]

Excellent conversation!

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks!

[@BB-dr6ho]

So interesting ❤ speaking the truth 👏

[@EBsDenStudio]

Great topic for the conversation, I think I get both of your points of view and perspectives around the "FI-RE status" For me, being post-FI, now it's always about "getting something" from the activity/project ahead of me, and as you stated, the conflict with "control" (the controllable things) it's many times a reason to avoid or engage with that activity. At some point I guessed your "Two sides of FI" project lifecycle would end after Eric reached his "FI number", but now I think that it doesn't matter, it will make sense even after that, you will always be able to provide interesting conversations (FI/RE or whatever) because of your long friendship even having both of you post-FI stages, experiences, etc. I agree with Eric's comments about the Discord server, it looks like adding more activities to the project schedule 😂🤓🤣 (I have joined some Discord servers, and already having email newsletters, KZbin & Reddit, it is a bit too much to keep up with 😲🤣) Keep up with the great conversations 👍

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks, Enrique!

[@PowerfulMoneyHabits]

That’s why they call it a labor of love

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Yep!

[@Ludwig120]

Love your discussions and topics. Very much in line with what we are doing at LifeWish Institute. Would you be interested in discussing further?

[@prlily]

Hey, you guys. I really love this channel and I love your conversations! I'm getting a sense that there is a shift here, in priority for each of you and what's important to each of you. I truly hope that you both find what you are looking for. That said, I wonder if you would feel different if you had 1.2M subscribers vs .2M? What about 2.2M subscribers? Not looking for an answer - just wondering if it would make a difference if you had a larger subscriber base with sponsors as well.

[@ra9r]

On the one hand its amazing to have momentum with the channel ... but I can also see how its starting to feel like a real job to Jason ... which is one of the things that you don't want in early RE. My suggestion is to outsource the boring bits. It will eat into your channel revenue, but if it lets you focus on content and still have fun ... worth it. It would be a shame to miss this opportunity to build something amazing that could put you both into FatFire.

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks, Rodney

[@craigmillman3421]

Sorry if this is a bit random - love to know how you record these videos. You both look like you are talking to each other but are looking directly at the camera. Which is great for the viewer. Are you not looking at each other on the screen? When people are looking at someone on the screen it doesn’t look like you are watching the camera. It makes such a difference to the viewer.

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Hi Craig, check out the show notes for episode 50, which was a Q&A. In the video we talk about our setups in detail and in the show notes there's links to more information. The quick answer is that we record on each end via DSLR + Skype, looking into our cameras - though we can see each other on our laptops as well. twosidesoffi.com/ep50/

[@jayedwards2781]

Please make an episode where you release your numbers

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Jason here - We do talk about this idea in several of our videos. Here's a short answer: kzbin.info/www/bejne/pGmUYnePrKqXqNU For more on our position - in essence, one's FI number isn't terribly useful to any other person. I say that because it's very directly influenced by your expenses and lifespan, along with your risk tolerance. Ignoring lifespan, it's largely about the former, and secondarily the last factor. Expenses are truly individual - where do you live, what kind of lifestyle do you want to have, do you support other people or charities, etc. Then you have risk tolerance, which is one of the factors impacting withdrawal rate i.e. how much you're willing to withdraw from your portfolio each year to meet expenses. Many people talk about the 4% rule, which both Eric and I think is too aggressive based on our (and others') assessment - see link below for more on that. We want a higher degree of likelihood of success in our plans. You may be far less conservative, and still others more conservative than us. This is why any individual number is less useful. In giving a range, we're trying to make it easier for folks to understand in a broad sense how we're each thinking. I hope that's useful. kzbin.info/www/bejne/kImrmWSdqbRkoqM

[@christinab9133]

❤❤❤

[@newcreation19]

As always, a great conversation! I hadn’t put my finger on it before, but yes the fact that y’all aren’t so technically focused and talk more about the mindset is a large part of the draw for me. Throwing it out there, I would 100% join y’all’s Patreon. Probably something like $2/month, personally, but I bet other people would join, too. I honestly wish more of the content creators I love would create Patreons vs going the advertiser route. Now that I’m thinking about it, it’s just FI creators who refuse to make a Patreon and prefer being ad supported, which makes no sense. FI people know that our time is our most valuable resource, but it’s the only way to “pay them”, when you’re not interested in buying a mattress, clothes, or random supplement, which just seems so backwards. 🤔 In summary, please make a Patreon!!

[@Aussieartforkids]

Reality of real life set backs such as redundancy which I have just become as of yesterday after 13 years with the same firm. Reality big life events and ongoing threats of AI will effect all of us in such a big way trying to retire and who are retired..!

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Very sorry to hear that you've been made redundant. Always a tricky situation to navigate unless one is in the rare case to be hopeful for that outcome. Best wishes to you

[@billsgirl1000]

Evolution happens organically. The two of you offer something more than others and hopefully you will figure out how to keep working together.

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks

[@davidfolts5893]

These two fine gentlemen have some of the most gripping financial conversations, which become excellent learning experiences for the listener. Talk about value add on steroids. 😀

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thanks so much for the kind words, David. We really appreciate it! Anything you can do to share the word about our little channel is greatly appreciated!

[@alanyoung159]

Once eric gets into post FI, does this show end? Would the name change?

[@mikaelnegri]

Woaw.. Such a great video! You are so respectful of one another it's inspiring. You managed to make me anxious, laugh, sad and curious all at once. Thank you for your time and guidance to the Fire community. I have been watching your videos /content from New Zealand. You have fans all over the world 😉

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Hi Alan, we have no plans to sunset this show! That said, few if any of us are great at predicting the future, right? Our crystal balls are all very cloudy :)

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Thank you so much, Mikael! We truly appreciate the feedback and your support.

[@wendytodd9673]

Hire a person to find advertising and pay them a fee

[@TwoSidesOfFI]

Yep, it's one option for sure.