From Here To Infinity: Tie-In Part 2

Tie-in Episode 2: The conclusion of the Evolutionary War, the Avengers get undermined by management, Spider-Woman is created to make the lawyers happy, Thor goes through some crazy stuff, and the Fantastic Four enters a period of spite.

[@kradeiz]

Joe Quesada: Geez, you undo decades worth of history and development for a cultural icon and people never let you forget it.

[@tipulsar85]

"I'm a kid forever," sounds like what Quesada thinks of 616 Peter Parker sometimes...

[@cyberninjazero5659]

17:30 "Ben Grim is Marvel's Forest Gump" Hey remember that time he redeemed Sandman to the point that Sandman became an Avenger?

[@myriadmediamusings]

Lmao they retconned the reason why Mephisto screwed over Peter’s marriage down the line.

[@lizzymatheson6487]

Simonson's run on FF gave us the Time Variance Authority

[@Caernath]

Chuck: "He calls them the New Immortals, because as established the New Gods as already been taken." Darkseid: "Indeed. It's one thing that my faithless son Orion has gone over to Highfather, I won't allow others to take the despised name of my enemies."

[@Kuikkamies]

Y'know, there had been some gnawing questions about Marvel during this era for me (as most books weren't published locally) and these made things click in a "Oh yeah!" kind of way. Thanks foe clearing up issues that had been kicking about last thirty years in my subconscious.

[@Archeopteryxman421]

Also, Walt Simonson's FF run is one of my favorites in comics (surprised you didn't mention the TVA)

[@dendostar5436]

Lol I am well-versed in the High Evolutionary. The fact you can say this stuff in a matter-of-fact way is so great.😆

[@SageofStars]

If they need a morally ambiguous villain to bring into MCU, I still think he'd be the best. They used him well enough in Guardians 3, but he is so much more than what was shown there. Better, he, unlike Thanos by the end, ISN'T on an Ego trip. You beat Thanos or defy him, and he will move heaven and earth to show you you're wrong. But the HE? He'll look at you, nod, and congratulate you on it. Hell, he's the only big bad in Marvel whose stopped a fight solely to let them evac civilians, since he wasn't trying to hurt people(That would be pointless). He's simply pitting his will against those who oppose it. No one else needs to be involved.

[@TevyaSmolka]

oh boy more infinity tie-ins.

[@SageofStars]

23:42 I'd judge you and Linkara for this...but then I'm still pissed off that we FINALLY get Robby Reed, Dial 'H' for Hero, back into DC comics during the New 52, a character who, in his original run, was an interesting, likable person who had all the power he needed to just pound his way through any situation, but would sometimes just talk to the bad guys to get them to stand down. His '90s' incarnation was even more interesting, as rather than a goody two shoes/Billy Batson type, he was turned into both the Big Bad and Big Good of the Dial comics, thanks to the Dial splitting him into the Master and the Wizard, a run that ends with him remerging, and the two heroes who'd been learning from him returning the dials which remerged as well into the original, and he goes off to help protect people...never appearing outside of a crowd shot or two. Finally though, he's brought back, and...he's an asshole. He invented, rather than found the Hero Dial, and is pulling a Booster Gold/Blue Beetle shtick where he's trying to sell the tech, even to villains. Worse, we find out his Dial isn't free transformations into forms with powers in this version, but instead his dials are 'summoning' those heroes or their powers from the other universes, usually at the worst time, killing them or people they're trying to save. And Robby doesn't give a dang about it, and is only forced to stop because of a threat to his own life by the League(Who aren't even doing it for a good reason but because the tech is too dangerous to THEM, not because they want to protect others.). I hate it, and it's been over a decade, and I still hate it. Not quite as much as Mass Effect 3's ending, but it's up there.

[@42ndLife]

Alejandra Jones: the forgotten Ghost Rider. Man, that character was actually interesting. She was taking from us too soon. When Johnny Blaze resumed the GR title I was hoping that she'd become the next Vengeance, but instead she just rode off to obscurity. I think it's time for Alejandra Jones to make a resurgence.

[@peggyliepmann5248]

If they ever do anything with Eric Masterson, I hope they simplify it down to "Mortal who is Worthy of Mjolnir and the name of Thor". Even if other parts are more complicated, he just needs to be Worthy.

[@KainGerc]

Masterson got his own magic mace later and was a stand-in for Thor for a while until he eventually died. his son inherited the mace eventually and sporadically shows up in various modern books.

[@SageofStars]

@@KainGerc Thunderstrike was a neat concept, but honestly, the art in the 90s hurt it more than most. That and his ponytail could become a living thing that seemed to dance all over the page.

[@SuperPoser573]

Monica never recovered from Gruenwald's Captain America fanboism

[@KainGerc]

well, Monica keeps showing up in modern comics (though it seems she's unable to keep being in an ongoing series), but Doctor Druid is reduced to being a cameo character who shows up sporadically (usually to be belittled and made fun of)

[@mikegates8993]

I'm going to have to rewatch this one once or twice, because I lost track of how some of this stuff connected to the Evolutionary War.

[@SageofStars]

1:17 Why you gotta call me out like this, Chuck? To be fair, not many of his creations, even those MADE to be enticing are well loved in the community. Hell Rocket Racoon gets more fan art, if only due to Guardians. I think I've seen some pieces of Sir Ram, and maybe a piece or two with Lady Vermin. Hell Ka-Zar's buddy Zabu gets more love, and he's not even anthro.

[@lynngreen7978]

If The Captain was leading the Avengers, what was Tennille doing?

[@L1701]

Getting blazed with the FF.

[@andrewrowland6086]

Leading the Masters of Evil obviously.

[@rainydayman2k]

Of course, Steve Rogers was wearing the black suit as The Captain because he'd been given that suit by Demoltion Man, Dennis Dunphy, who had been introduced in the Thing's solo book along with Sharon Ventura, with both featuring in a short arc of Cap's book right before Steve resigned. Then the Commission on Superhuman Activities hired John Walker, the Super-Patriot, who'd previously clashed with Cap, to be the new Captain America, which turned out to be a plot to besmirch the image of Cap that was initiated by the Red Skull, who had been resurrected by Arnim Zola in a body cloned from Rogers. So when it was time to switch Steve back after the Skull's plot was exposed, the government faked Walker's death, and gave him the black uniform as well as a new cover identity, Jack Daniels. Yes, USAgent has been named after two types of whiskey! COMICS ARE WEIRD.

[@Norvo82]

I'm still saddened by the way Gruenwald and DeFalco decided to functionally freeze all character growth from 1987 onwards. Driving away Roger Stern from Avengers and forcing Steve Englehart to undo his changes to Fantastic Four (and West Coast Avengers) just so they can do watered down retreads of past glories is a painful waste of talent. It's also a tad hypocritical of DeFalco to enforce the illusion of change only to then write out Thor and replace him with Eric Masterson.

[@mikegates8993]

I think the X-Men are the most hurt by that decision. Because unlike other characters like Iron Man and Thor, they have an actual goal they're working towards and this policy means they will not only never achieve it, but likely never make real progress.

[@Norvo82]

@@mikegates8993 Thing is, Chris Claremont was still driving the X-books in the late 80s and he seemed to pretty much ignore the new editorial edicts. He had the X-Men die, move to the Australian outback, then they were all slowly picked off and resurrected as Claremont worked on a massive Shadow King storyline he wanted to stretch out to Uncanny X-Men I#300 in 1993. Of course all of that didn't happen when editor Bob Harras decided to side with hot new talent Jim Lee who wanted to do more traditional stories with the classic villains. So by 1991 Claremont was out and the X-Men were now living at the school in Westchester again with Charles Xavier... Same as it ever was.

[@Archeopteryxman421]

Gruenwald's treatment of Monica remains a black mark on an otherwise pretty solid writing career

[@rikrikonius1301]

I thought Rick Jones was the Forrest Gump of the Marvel Universe

[@KainGerc]

FYI, Gilgamesh is an Eternal and has shown up since then in various Eternals books. Just to emphasize how random and inconsistent the Avengers roster has been over the years.

[@mightybluespider]

Young Gods...

[@DeconvertedMan]

bring on more confusing stories!

[@CoyotesOwn]

You did mantion tat it te Celestial Sentient Ship tat used to belong to Apocalypse.