From Kratom to Suboxone

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[@BNMS217]

I started using kratom abt 2 years ago when i was 18. My main addictions at the time were weed/adderall/xanax and tramadol when i ran out of addys. It was great for a while but now i feel just as burnt out as i was before. For reference i take abt 120gs of kratom a day at about 30-35 grams a dose. Ive tried quitting cold turkey and ive tried tapering a million times but the withdrawals are just terrible. Its a weird dilemma bc i understand how tough subs are to get off of but at the same time i cant keep going like this. Id love to hear some feedback from ppl who have also been in this situation

[@SuperSterling]

I went from hard stuff to Kratom then Kratom to Suboxone. KRATOM W/D was 1000x worse than Suboxone for me but I managed my emotional attachment to Suboxone by not taking it at the same time every day and getting comfortable with going up to 3 days without it for “practice” over the course of an entire year I would advise you educate yourself on Suboxone first and then switch if your tired of the Kratom cycle man

[@SuperSterling]

No one really talks about managing your emotional attachment to Suboxone. I would advise you take this VERY seriously like I did if you switch

[@dannyj7618]

I like your idea of not having a set schedule when you take suboxone. I have been on kratom 100g a day for 10+ years. Going to try 4mg of suboxone. and slowly week myself off in 2 weeks. What should i expect. Any tips for subs?@@SuperSterling

[@dannyburton9919]

fuck. I just want to stop bupe. Guess this avenue is cunted

[@jamesadamgleason9471]

I've made that switch. Subs are easier to manage but much stronger in the long run. I'd recommend tapering off Kratom and Sticking to it. If. You hate yourself and your life tho, it will be impossible. You must be ready

[@jaiyemanp4699]

You can take kratom and bupe at the same time you WILL NOT get precipitated withdrawal . Just so y’all know.

[@dr.chrispark]

That’s been my experience working with patients as well

[@edencooper2240]

Thank you I was really worried I start mad on Wednesday and I don't think I can go 24 to 48 hours without anything

[@bekeneel]

I think the bupe would make the kratom mostly ineffective (if you take at the same time) so yea there's probably no harm. Allthough I wouldn't see the need. When I stop kratom for just 1 day I already have sleeping problems tho. I want to try Bupe to get off my big habit of daily kratom use. Cuz I know Bupe alltho it's powerful u can get that ceilling effect, but with kratom you quickly need another dose and so your tolerance goes up and you need more again. And doing without an opiate painkiller would not be realistic considering my chronic pains. Now I just need to find a smart doctors and not my usual doctors who are so shortsighted and full of pre-judgements on substance like this :/ i hate it. Pain simply needs to be treated, whatever the cause is. And kratom is an uncontrolled substance, not really "safe" as you don't know rly what's in it..

[@SupChamp]

Thank you I was wondering that

[@SupChamp]

My worry would be taking kratom for a few days and then taking a piece of sub while still.high on kratom

[@cherylvoss-ie1ky]

What doctor's dont tell you about suboxone is about the addiction. So all you do is trade one for another. Its hard to shake bc ive tapered down to the smallest amount still having a hard time. So decided to try kratom...it helps and i hope this will work I'm 4 days in...i just want to feel good without taking drugs.. 😢

[@shanteshante811]

Me too how’s it going and will we ever just be drug free or are we stuck basically that’s how I feeling now man tired of crying

[@markbach2085]

@@shanteshante811listen to me. Get on Suboxone. It is trading one for another and trust me it is messed up. But you get your life back. You get your meds from a legit doctor and place. No risk of tainted pills. Get the Suboxone to a point where you can miss a day without taking it. Then start to taper down. Once you get to the 1-2mg level I suggest taking sublocade. It’s a shot they inject into your belly fat and basically you’re good for a month. I took my last shot in November and haven’t had anything since. Drug free since then.

[@ianbrady7620]

Currently on 6mg subzolv tapered down from 12mg taking it slowly one day ill get off it on it a year wish everyone luck 👍

[@intothesun3537]

I used Kratom after tapering forever off Suboxone till I was down to .25mgs. I started at 2mgs for 6 years. I still felt some WDs because I didn't take a lot of Kratom and I also skipped days. I stopped the Kratom after about a month and now I'm coming on 9 months off. I feel just fine now and life is good. It wasnt easy and there were still some minor WDs and then some minor PAWS but was manageable.

[@jaydens2756]

Hey how are you doing nowadays? Good job getting off and having a plan, and control of yourself to use kratom for what it should be used for. I’m tapering right now was on 1.5mg a day for the past year, I’ve been on for a year and a half total. I’m at 1mg currently and tommorow go down to 0.75 for 3 days and then -25% for another3 days until about 0.25 so I’m doing something similar to you I want to ask how it’s worked out for you, what strains did you use and how you dosed. If you don’t mind me asking that is and I also plan to use it for only the worst of the withdrawals do they get more manageable after a couple weeks?

[@stefonpalinic5559]

Well I have used hard drugs but u have to taper off hard opiates before switching to kratom. Suboxone is much more powerful than kratom and has much more awful side effects. Kratom when taken proper has barely any side effects one bad one is rage. Suboxone has hair loss, depression, low sex drive, erectile disfunction, memory loss, protein vitamin loss. Muscle mass loss. Constipation . Kratom our the other hand if taken properly in doses six to eight grams daily has almost not a single side effect. Also if u usually take eight grams a day u switch to six for three days you can go back to eight and feel the same effects you felt from eight grams your first time. This is where people don’t have common sense and instead keep increasing doses.

[@Jay-se2ym]

2 mgs of suboxone is nothing even being on it for long

[@riggins44ful]

I gotta get off suboxone, been subscribed for 10 years....did k help you?

[@tom-sk8qw]

@@riggins44fulI currently switched from 2 mg a day for six years straight over to kratom at a low dose and it’s managing by withdraws. I would say 90%. I feel great but I hear there’s some trouble trying to get off the kratom but I’ll take my chances with the Kratom withdrawal because I’ve done Suboxone withdrawal, and it was a total nightmare

[@danielyates9055]

Careful with suboxone. Not communicated enough how strong of an opiate it is. For reference a 30mg oxycodone pill is 45mg oral morphine equivalents. An 8 mg subutex is 240mg oral morphine equivalents. - a pharmacist

[@DarrellTyler-i4r]

@danielyates9055 but they don't tell you that.... and how you have to slowly come off which takes over a year or you risk months long withdrawals

[@jamesroberts1655]

Okay. So last time we went to Florida on vacation I ran out of subs and Kratom was my go-to. We were on vacation for a week and had purchased enough to float me an additional week after our return. So almost 3 weeks later, I ran out of Kratom. To my utter shock, day 1 of NOTHING, I woke up and got through the morning. By Noon I found myself declining very quickly. ALMOST 3 WEEKS LATER I found that I was STILL going through a miserable withdrawal. How in the heck do you kick this stuff for good!? To me, right now, suboxone is the devil.

[@dr.chrispark]

@@jamesroberts1655 slow taper over a long time seems to work best

[@HighPriestessAngelique]

Suboxone is very strong, just curious why you went from Kratom to Subs. I was on MAT for ten years, Methadone for 7 yrs & Subs for 3 yrs and tapered down to Kratom. I understand every experience is different but I think it’s also important to not dissuade anyone who wants to try another method. Subs caused me to develop Bells Palsy & I’m still trying to avoid a full on attack. That’s just my truth, blessings ❤️

[@ninatee7220]

Kratom is addictive

[@aelfwealld]

@@ninatee7220 Buprenorphine is too. Probably much more so. From what I know it’s certainly harder to get off of.

[@thetahexhodlhands4550]

@@aelfwealld Have been addicted to both. Kratom was always worse and its honestly because of the short duration and the whole lifestyle of it. I was getting no sleep.. waking up every 2-3 hours trying to chug more green sludge.. Then that causes urination every 1 hour on top of it. I could not leave my house without a gallon of orange juice and big bag of kratom half the time i just stayed inside. I was constantly sick and not eating. Soon as i switch to subs i pop one in when i wake up and my life is 100x better. Im sleeping again and gaining weight again. The withdrawals are almost identical maybe suboxone a TINY bit more intense, but its also way easier to taper and measure then kratom.

[@vintagebleachedblonde4322]

@@thetahexhodlhands4550 i’m glad you’re doing better I don’t agree with the suboxone withdrawal being anywhere like kratom withdrawal it took me a year of hell to get off Suboxone and I was only on for one month before I started trying to get off I’m two months off of Soboxone and I still feel like complete and utter crap my experience with kratom withdrawal two days of discomfort then it starts to get better it’s not comparable

[@thetahexhodlhands4550]

@@vintagebleachedblonde4322 Interesting. Everyone is so different it seems. As long as i taper off suboxone and dont rush it its just a little bit of runny nose and being tired/depressed. Very similar to kratom for me

[@Crisscross-ro6gt]

This confuses me very much because I have stopped Kratom for six hours before and then after those six hours dosed Suboxone and it completely worked without throwing me into precipitated withdrawal I would never wait 24 hours to start on Suboxone at least for me when it comes to Kratom.

[@ig0ty0ur6ix4]

I feel the same. I literally go 6 hours without kratom and I am almost in full withdrawal. It sucks. How would I go about getting suboxone? I take about 70 grams of kratom a day and I have tried to stop and the withdrawal is horrible. I can’t do inpatient because I have kids and a wife to take care of. I can’t stop my life to get treatment, I would need to get treatment as an outpatient. I want off of kratom but I can’t find the time to get help

[@loganjohnson2005]

So is the sub that you guys took have the naloxone in it or just straight buf?

[@phillipgage7356]

I just took my last dose of 2 tsp dose of kratom at 8pm and took my first sub strip (4mg) at 11pm. Felt amazing. Today is day 2 free from Kratom using your method….but Doc….listen to me….you most definitely CAN take kratom and subs at the same exact time with zero side effects.

[@brandih1121]

This is the comment i was looking for. Thank you.

[@brianfreland9065]

This is what I was looking for...I just got my script fpr subs and I just took a handful of kratom this morning. ..wanted to make sure I wasn't going to spiral into heavy withdrawal

[@phillipgage7356]

48 days later and I’m substance free!

[@trevor_corey8037]

@@phillipgage7356hey I really need some advice. Do you have a plan with your doctor to get off subs anytime soon? I’m really scared to take off habits again that’s why I started kratom. And I know people say sub is safe but I’m a skeptic. I’ve also heard people say it’s a worse withdrawal than heroine.

[@bekeneel]

Doesn't the bupe block the kratom tho? Cuz I do know it blocks heroin for example, for the most part if ur on bupe (suboxon).

[@iammrpositive5108]

I started three months ago. The stability suboxone has given me compared to how life was with kratom has changed my life. I was shocked to be offered suboxone through the VA. It has literally saved my life.

[@lonestarstatechris]

I got off Suboxone and went on kratom; it is 10x worse. Not as bad with constipation, but constantly dosing sucks.

[@iammrpositive5108]

@@lonestarstatechris yeah. Kratom is one of the worst experiences of my life, and I've done it all.

[@yesNo-pr4nc]

Hey there. May I ask how much time there was between your last dose of kratom and switching to suboxone?

[@iammrpositive5108]

@@yesNo-pr4nc it wasn't much time at all. I didn't really have to go through kratom withdrawals. I took the suboxone at the first hint of them.

[@iammrpositive5108]

@@yesNo-pr4nc It was somewhere between 24 and 48 hours.

[@jrl495]

I’ve been on everything, especially opiates. I used suboxone/subutex to get off of drugs, then Kratom to get off of Suboxone/subutex. I’ve been through withdrawals a million times in my life. Being on Kratom for 3 years…..nothing even can close to the severity of my Kratom withdrawals. Literally 10 times worse than withdrawals off of any other opiate that I’ve ever experienced. I’m weaning off of Kratom now and will NEVER take it again in my life. I’ve been off of drugs and alcohol for 8 years and will not take anything but gabapentin or something like it from here on out, now that I know I’m Autistic and ADHD.

[@dr.chrispark]

That’s interesting. Thanks for sharing your experience

[@Settings404]

Yeah I’m pretty sure I’m adhd too. That’s why I liked kratom so much when I didn’t have a tolerance because it helped me focus for hours on end

[@theGODfather746]

@@Settings404 I have ADD and felt the same way

[@ChristiannTyler]

Maybe you can help me understand because what I don’t understand is if you’re taking large amounts of kratom then you go onto Suboxone say for a 7-10 days then stop completely wouldn’t the withdrawal symptoms just resume per usual or potentially even increase?

[@dr.chrispark]

You will likely have withdrawal if you stop either of those without tapering to very low doses

[@ChristiannTyler]

@@dr.chrispark so tapering the Suboxone over 7/10 days would just mean potentially heavier symptoms?

[@dr.chrispark]

@@ChristiannTyler Taper length and risk of withdrawal depends on multiple factors including length of time on opiates, dose of opiates, and individual response to buprenorphine. Difference between kratom and Suboxone would depend on the person likely. And this video was for people addicted to kratom and unable to taper. I typically recommend long tapers to prevent withdrawal and relapse but everyone is different. Always talk to your doctor 👍

[@lip91688]

was on suboxone for 5 years at 16mg a day. the last 4 months i been tapering down and currently on 8mg suboxone a day. my sleep is absolutely terrible if i am lucky i get about an hour or 2 a night. i am not sure if it’s from the tapering or what. but i was told kratom could help, my question is can i take 8 mg a day of suboxone and still take kratom before bed ? thanks

[@UnseenThreat07]

8mg is still a high dose - you'll get better effects from the kratom once you reach 4mg and under.. but a good red vein kratom could help you sleep and take the edge off a taper.. no harm done in trying it out

[@UnseenThreat07]

If your worried about being thrown into precipitated withdrawals from mixing the two I wouldn't worry about it.. I've mixed both plenty of times and never had any issues besides the subs blocking some of the kratom effects when on high dose 8mg+

[@theblowupdollsmusic]

Why not just get the sublocade and be done with it completely. Almost no withdrawals with the shot I hear.

[@shym6158]

The guy is trying to help people with addiction and people in comments yelling at him… wow

[@keanureeves9802]

Seems kind of harsh making them wait 24-48 hours lol. If your in withdrawal that long might as well kick the whole habit lol they will not even have the energy to converse with you or make it to the appointment unless they lie to you about their dosing be real.

[@dr.chrispark]

People do it all the time

[@bekeneel]

Huh i think you don't have a clue about how long withdrawal can take lol, even of kratom.. Especially if you been on it for long time & using a lot. I'd have no problem tho waiting that time only, chance is high i would quickly get sleeping trouble.

[@keanureeves9802]

@@bekeneel I used to be on OPMS extracts took a 5 pack a day for over a year. Worst withdrawals in my life, even worse than hydro and Oxy. Shit damn near lasted 2 months before I had any energy. It was so horrible I vowed I never touch ANY kind of opiate again.

[@bekeneel]

@@keanureeves9802 I see, looked it up cuz I didn't know what OPMS is. Expensive lol. I like kratom in it's pure (powder) Form, and for the price of 6-7 such little bottles I can get half a kilo hehe.

[@keanureeves9802]

@@bekeneel be careful with kratom bro powder is worse because it stays in your gut hella long. If you do it longer than 3 months everyday and quit your in for a ride. It’s a full on drug it has hella alkaloids and ssri properties aka antidepressants you talk to your dr about it they won’t understand you. Might as well be speaking Chinese shit should be illegal

[@camomaster6316]

So here's a question. Let's say someone was dependent on suboxone for a long time but switched to kratom. Now if they can't get off the kratom could they use the suboxone for a week to get through WD? I know suboxone use to be used like that, but a lot of doctors don't tell there patients this and they end up being on it long term. Does the week sub thing only work for someone who was never dependent on subs? I see this question a lot about switching to a shorter acting drug and going back to sub to get over the WD but I never heard a awnser.

[@perpetualmotion357]

Subutex is the same as Suboxone. The only difference with the Suboxone is the added naloxone that's put in there so people don't shoot it which can put you into wd's. Taking it orally there isn't enough in it to have any effect. Bupe is what causes precipitated withdrawals and not the naloxone like a lot of people assume. I've heard people say it's safe to take Subutex and you'll be in the clear but that's not the case. I made that mistake. I've been prescribed both. It's the bupe that kicks off the opiates from your receptors and partially attaches to them not letting anything else work.

[@stefonpalinic5559]

@@nickycotton6137 Did you just say kratom is dangerous? Lol

[@nickycotton6137]

@@stefonpalinic5559 = No I typed it months ago & it's banned over here! Wonder why? There's nowt dangerous about it then eh 'Stefon' ? I didn't "just say that" if you bothered to read the rest! LOL

[@stefonpalinic5559]

@@nickycotton6137 compared to what is it dangerous? Tho alcohol?

[@nickycotton6137]

@@stefonpalinic5559 = You on a wind up! LoL 'Alcoholism' is a different "kettle of fish" altogether!! Anyway, enjoy the Kratom Stefon.

[@RustinChole]

Interesting. I’ve used kratom sporadically while tapering my bue dose. Granted I’m taking a very low dose of kratom when I do, but…. In my experience bue is waaaay more powerful, and longer lasting than kratom. And I’m on a very low dose of bue at this point (2mg’s). I guess it should be said that I take 1/4 to 1/2 the recommended kratom dose, as I don’t need another addiction.

[@headlinepipe8662]

If a person is strictly addicted to kratom and wants to kick the habit, would suboxone be a good treatment for this? Considering the fact that the person is having difficulty

[@Preacher_.]

100% man, especially if you've tried abstinence and failed.

[@jsnbrgn608]

Would a doctor prescribe bup for kratom withdrawal?

[@Preacher_.]

@@jsnbrgn608 yes

[@Preacher_.]

@@jsnbrgn608 you may need to find a specialist though, family medicine doctors may not be too familiar with it, but just be completely honest and ask for help, their job is to help.

[@jayj.2297]

@@jsnbrgn608yes. My doctor did

[@melbell6328]

Dr. Park, I thought bc both Kratom and Suboxone are partial agonists, that you actually don't have to wait any length of time to switch from Kratom to Subs, precipitated withdrawal doesn't happen, assuming only kratom in your system and no other opiates. Can you confirm this is not true??

[@andreah6175]

I concur, there ARE alkaloid blockers in Kratom so basically its the plant version of such meds that attach to the same opioid receptors in that way. Its not discussed much but there was a scientific research video done with mice that proves a certain potential and promise for addicts.

[@HighPriestessAngelique]

I agree, Suboxone would kick the shit out of Kratom if that’s all that’s in your system. Imo it wouldn’t cause a precipitated withdrawal.

[@perpetualmotion357]

It doesn't cause precipitated withdrawals going from Kratom to Subs. Maybe if you downed two extract shots and then took a sub an hour later it would but I've taken Subs after using Kratom only after a few hours and the Sub took over completely.

[@stefonpalinic5559]

It’s is not ok to go from kratom to suboxone. Firstly you can taper down to a very small crumb of suboxone. Yet the withdrawals are so bad you can’t stop suboxone. Kratom when you taper the withdrawals are so weak most people can handle them. So I can’t understand why anyone would touch subs who was on kratom. Now I hope that no one takes any opioid unless prescribed by doctors. No you don’t have to wait at all to switch

[@ianmedford4855]

@Kristin Brown Curious... how'd that go for you?

[@jamesroberts1655]

I’ve got your back (glows in the dark). I love that shirt. I have the same one😂

[@mH-sn5vm]

I’ve been taking Kratom for three years like twice a week but I don’t have withdrawal symptoms I haven’t taken it for four weeks is that normal Kratom is more beneficial than Subutex I promise you that

[@benhall2235]

If you only take it twice a week you won’t have any WD symptoms. People who get dependant on it take it multiple times a day every day for a minimum of a month, usually a lot longer.

[@naomiwainwright9873]

Every day use is what causes the issues

[@g.s777]

I tried it three days ago and It's been three days that I've done it I'm also deciding to do it once or twice a week.

[@nelsonrojas978]

Honestly I would rather be on kratom instead of Suboxone. Suboxone kills my emotions, my teeth, and my overall well being. 😊

[@jessiejeanne9717]

I was thinking about trying to get off suboxone with Kratom.

[@rickp3753]

I wouldn't. I tapered off subs without kratom. I know too many people whose lives are ruined because of it.

[@ig0ty0ur6ix4]

How would I go about getting suboxone? I take about 70 grams of kratom a day and I have tried to stop and the withdrawal is horrible. I can’t do inpatient because I have kids and a wife to take care of. I can’t stop my life to get treatment, I would need to get treatment as an outpatient. I want off of kratom but I can’t find the time to get help

[@kylearmstrong1188]

I am going through the same thing. I just west to my primary care Dr the other day and asked for help. She hooked me up with a couple phone numbers for suboxon clinics in the area. And a referral. After a 1 hr consultation with the Dr he was able to help. No inpatient necessary

[@dr.chrispark]

Talk to your family doctor for guidance or find an addiction specialist. Many people are able to detox without going inpatient and while working and taking care of their family.

[@ig0ty0ur6ix4]

@@kylearmstrong1188 thank you so much. This gives me hope! I hope your detox goes well! I will talk with my PCP.

[@ig0ty0ur6ix4]

@@dr.chrispark okay thank you doc! I will definitely do this!

[@xxihasxx]

in my opinion suboxone shouldn't be taken to off kratom, other way around! suboxone is horrible to detox from you will regret it unless used for life which is often what happens.

[@JohnMcdee-r7z]

What happens if you go from kratom to subs,bring tolerance of kratom down then back to kratom.im more of a harm reduction guy than full on sobriety.dont no enough about sub,but I don't think it would help if it's stronger.but still open to learning more,but I'm glad your doing well.

[@dannyburton9919]

brother, you are l missing the fact of what the underlying issue is. Cows eat grass, some is better than others and some are more nutritious and some are more dirty. Long story short, all of the substances. ....... same shit but different smell

[@darlamckinnon4546]

I'm more about harm reduction for myself as well... 6 grams of kratom a day now down from 14 grams 👌

[@libertyforamericanow]

I have a question what kind of doctor do I go to for Kratom addiction? I just went to a pain management place and asked if they could help me get off a Kratom and they said no

[@dr.chrispark]

I’d recommend you talk to your family doc first. He or she may treat you or refer you to an addiction specialist

[@libertyforamericanow]

@@dr.chrispark i dont have a primary

[@darlamckinnon4546]

I think what Dr Chris park is targeting here is heavy kratom use. Your best bet is tapering. My plan is 1 gram a day until 10 grams. Then go like 0.2 to 0.3 per day. You can even do like 0.1 per day.

[@libertyforamericanow]

@@darlamckinnon4546 I wound up on suboxone. Take it from me, just do the taper and get off kratom. Suboxone is 10x the struggle to kick

[@kaldaninja]

Guys yes Bup is another addiction but its more controlled and gives your life stability. You got yourself into the mess its just a way out. Later if you want to taper off thats your choice.

[@loststar9970]

Bro well said I’m on Keaton was at 40.g a day I’m down to 6 a day now almost ready to start subs only cuz I work a lot I can’t just go dry so ima split the strip and use in small squares thank u for the information I was going to just take it now. I’d prolly hate life for a few hours had I not found you ❤

[@jordash9992]

6 grams a day is nothing bro why would you use subs to get off it when subs are 2x as strong and will 2x as hard!

[@KimberlyADarling]

I’m using 40 capsules. Four capsules equals 2,000 milligrams. Been taking, this time, for six months. Stopped before, when I was at the same level, three years ago, and had the suboxone to get off, but was told to be off a half day. So when I took it, I vomited. I decided I wasn’t going to use it to get off. But I was super fearful of withdrawals. Problem was, I was in day three of covid virus, so I was sick from that to the point I’m not sure I had withdrawals. I had been on for two years. After being off for 1.5 years, I had fatigue from long haul covid and had to work more to catch up with debt from some lost wages. I just said, screw this. I had guilt from being on Kratom, but my fatigue, dismal mood and pain were why I said, I’m using it. I have help through the V.A. And am starting with Suboxone around January 24-February 5. I need to stop but wish I could use it for, forever BRB

[@phillipgage7356]

How are you doing @KimberlyAnn

[@utah801SLC]

Would love to hear how your journey is going. I'm on my 6th yr of Methadone and then Suboxone use. Down to 1mg of Subs, I've had friends tell me Kratom helps kicking the Subs. Not so sure after watching videos and reading comments. Hope you are making progress!

[@BrentCox2B]

Any luck using Suboxone to get off Kratom? How did everything go? Im thinking if doing the same.

[@ueehurstonsecurity8887]

thanks for the info doc. I'm going through withdrawal of this now and have 4mg suboxone saved up. (i quit suboxone with kratom and saved some subs just incase) I didn't know how bad kratom w/d was going to be and dont want to precip at all. I'm wondering if even the heaviest of users can use bupe on that 48 hour mark. the sickness and kratom took me from 118 pounds to 103 at 5"9 within days. ive been using kratom for about 2 months but in a very concentrated gel capsule form with 33mg of mitragynin. I took roughly 50 of them over 5 days to get through a business trip out of town and now im waiting to take bupe again. Curious if my case is extreme and i should wait longer than normal to take the bupe. I don't know what advice you can and cant say as a doctor over the internet without seeing me in person ect. but i thought it was worth a shot to ask for your opinion. thanks again for the informative video

[@ueehurstonsecurity8887]

follow up for you ( i waited 48 hours to take the bupe in order to be safe, and it worked! (2mg suboxone taken sublingually 1mg at a time with an hour between. in hindsight it was a little too much bupe I should have taken 1.4MG I feel because feel buzzed and ide rather feel normal, not high even slightly. (I'm at that point in life where I've had it with drugs I'm a young man and must move forwards) I may now be home free for the rest of my life from addiction. your video was a huge catalyst to this. thank you doc (other parts of the internet said it was safe to take bupe just 8 hours, after kratom and you were the ONLY one who told the correct facts and time to wait due to kratoms half-life. "~24-48 sometimes more depending on the patient symptoms" Had I went into precipitated withdrawal I don't know if I would have survived it at 103 pounds+my mental state and ill just leave it at that. I have my parents help with full transparency (I no longer lie to them) so I'm not alone, I think this is it for me, my big moment of I am done with addiction... god bless you and your family. thank you, thank you Thank you i feel like i owe you one!! ill keep you in my prayers

[@matthewlindsay5323]

I started taking sub to come off kratom and it has been a literal miracle

[@loganjohnson2005]

Are the subs you are taking without nalaxone or with?

[@darlamckinnon4546]

Why? What was wrong with the kratom?

[@mikaeldarander3458]

Inget withdrawals from kratom after 6-8 hours😢

[@chrishendricks1160]

Im using suboxone to get off kratom now..u can use them together too..there isnt any precipated withdrawl with these 2..but my kratom habit got so bad I wad doing 3 mit45 or 3 opms gold shots a day!!!..I just said screw it I want off this kratom and went and got suboxone to get off..Im on 8 days no shots or kratom powder..free again!

[@6.2bandz]

I’m day 1 no percs I’m going to use the mit 45 shots to get me to the 72hour mark then I’m going to use my subs that’s fine? Do I have to wait a certain amount of time before I take subs from Kratom?

[@kayle9674]

i just got off fetty.. useing kratom for 2 days now, the kratom wont put me into precip?

[@6.2bandz]

@@kayle9674 no the Kratom won’t at all and you can take subs after Kratom there no acute withdralws I had to answer it myself last night you good to take Kratom

[@6.2bandz]

@@kayle9674 get red maeng da Kratom and then get mit 45 Kratom shots then get o.p.m.s gold 5 Kratom pills I promise you won’t have any pains or anything you still won’t be able to sleep

[@kayle9674]

@@6.2bandz thanks. i survived... i had 1 xanex bar amd kratom for 50 hours of detox and now on suboxone.. my plan was to quit fetty, use kratom to help with fetty withdraw and after 2-3 days go back om subs and i was worried if taking that kratom for 2 days (since it acts on the opiod receptors) that mayb the sub would put me into withdraw but it didnt. im 80% better now with my sub

[@stefonpalinic5559]

Also one big lie is that kratom tolerance grows fast false. Suboxone tolerance grows just as fast if not faster along with scary withdrawals..

[@mejohn101]

my kratom tolerance grew exponentially. within weeks. just my experience.

[@stefonpalinic5559]

@@mejohn101 That is a easy fix with a little thinking. You can go from 10 grams a day to 7grams for four days . After only three two four days of dropping dose when you go back to ten grams you will feel the same effects as the first time on ten grams. I took kratom for three years almost and never had a tolerance increase using this simple trick. Unfortunately people just don’t understand kratom very well. Unfortunately for subs this will absolutely not work as well if at all.

[@stefonpalinic5559]

@@mejohn101 With subs to drop tolerance you have to drop dose for a whole two weeks. Which is just very hard to do for most people with kratom you’ll lose tolerance much faster.

[@mejohn101]

@@stefonpalinic5559 I can't speak on suboxone as I have no experience with it. I did try dropping my dose as you mentioned, but did not find it reset my tolerance. Again, different people will have different experiences, so I'm not saying everyone would have mine.

[@Troubledboy88]

The difference between Kratom and subs/opiates. Kratom alone has never killed anyone, it’s helped many. It may be addictive but any other synthetic opiate is more so

[@benhall2235]

@@chrismarchetta5862 Has a longer half life than what? Buprenorphine or methadone ? It’s about the same as methadone as far as I can tell. 24 hours for Kratom and 25 hours average for methadone from what I’ve found online. Afaik buprenorphine has a similar half life to methadone.

[@cameronjordan9350]

@@benhall2235 they try and claim it killed a few people. My girl died with it in her system and they put on the death certificate that they can not rule out kratom toxicity that her levels have been know to kill people. I hate them for that they litteraly don't know what they are talking about.. She litteraly only.took a teaspoon and died from something unrelated but it had my whole family thinking it was kratom.

[@rubymir5111]

if I take kratom for sub withdrawal will it restart the process? I'm on day 24/25

[@benhall2235]

@@rubymir5111 no you’ll be fine, just try not to develop an addiction to Kratom. If like me you’ve been addicted to proper opioids like heroin or subs then Kratom I’d nothing. I’ve used it for months on end every day and quit cold Turkey without any issues other than a bit of trouble sleeping. I could have avoided that altogether if I’d tapered down first. It won’t set you back to square one with your subs withdrawal. Not at all.

[@alexmangrum90]

@@benhall2235 methadone has a much longer half life. Suboxone is longer as well

[@WHITETAIL215]

Man I just want to know as I'm sick right now off suboxone if I take kratom here or there will it slow my progress with my detox or only help me and I can't get a answer

[@stefonpalinic5559]

It will help just don’t take it more than four day hope this was not late. Just don’t expect it to take away all the withdrawals just a good portion of it

[@stefonpalinic5559]

It’s is not ok to go from kratom to suboxone. Firstly you can taper down to a very small crumb of suboxone. Yet the withdrawals are so bad you can’t stop suboxone. Kratom when you taper the withdrawals are so weak most people can handle them. So I can’t understand why anyone would touch subs who was on kratom. Now I hope that no one takes any opioid unless prescribed by doctors.

[@nickycotton6137]

Fair-Shout..👍.. Withdrawal's from Sub's are far more manageable than Heroin. It's easy to forget why on them so long tbh. Just when Drugs Worker said "some stay on it for life" my addict Brain jumped on the chance to 'stay high' increasing up to 20mg's 4 yrs ago. (Now on 12) However am grateful as 'lapsed' a few times on Codeine & Gear, but managed to recover thanks to that script. 8mg's is sufficient + only thing stopping getting sober is worrying about future without it. Kratom messed with a (now dead) old Pal's guts, but apparently it's helped many tbf. Have also heard/read the withdrawal's are similar to "Opioid" ones so naturally apprehensive. With Sub's time is needed + a slow Taper, but Inpatient Detox should be there for the end/in general as had a Seizure last time & just helps feel safer etc.

[@stefonpalinic5559]

@@nickycotton6137 See for me heroin withdrawals weren’t different from suboxone suboxone withdrawals seemed longerfor me. Also yea kratom will mess with ur stomach at first till you get used to it. But kratom withdrawals are very manageable.

[@trollgod195]

This is why people die from opiates doctors not knowing what their doing

[@nickycotton6137]

@@trollgod195 = More like the person taking them in the 1st place doesn't know what a terrible journey they're in for eh. TrollGod!

[@nickycotton6137]

@@stefonpalinic5559= Yeah/Fair-Play..👍. Still grateful for that script though. Heroin withdrawal's are seriously 'full on'. Then there's the Feelings of 'shame & guilt'. With this will have zero energy & just gonna stay in Bed. (Mind you it will plenty of trips to the Bog)... Those who can exercise in full on Withdrawal do admire, but hopefully will get Rehab as those Detoxed from Class A's etc + Alcoholics still shaking for Months will take mind off self.

[@DJIDokkōdō]

How has it been? I've been using approximately 40 grams or so. 5-7 Table spoons of Red Vein a day. For 6 months straight. Went to my doctor "like I feel like I've relapsed" he was like here script for suboxene. It took 2 weeks to get the courage up. I'm exactly 48hrs off Kratom. Idk why I'm scared as hell to take suboxene. As if I might like it more or something. I'm also a bit freaked about going into precipitated withdrawals. Hope you're doing well. Thanks. ✌️

[@ronzy417]

I went from kratom to subs, one of WORST decisions of my life. Suboxone is hell, would have been much better to come off kratom.

[@Pete23269]

subs are harder to get off

[@Pete23269]

lower taper that 40g down

[@theblowupdollsmusic]

@@ronzy417 have you tried the sublocade shot? It's supposed to create an automatic taper over the course of like four months with no withdrawals.

[@cryptoisthewaytogo]

haven’t heard of that, been on sub for 5 yrs. Would be nice to take somthin that just slowly released from your body

[@usp9sd1]

Dr.chris Park how could I get in touch with you without broadcasting it to the world?

[@brucelee4996]

You just "wing-it" Dr. P. l learn more from you than the 5 minutes I spend with my PA once a month.

[@clc477]

Sounds like hes a suboxine salesman lol

[@Omerta_1964]

Dr park, how long should someone wait after stopping suboxone to start taking Kratom?

[@dr.chrispark]

Most folks that I know don’t wait at all and just take at night or with first signs of withdrawal

[@Omerta_1964]

@@dr.chrispark OK thanks i appreciate it! 👍

[@Omerta_1964]

@@dr.chrispark I did not take my sub dose this morning and just used 2 grams of kratom green maeng da . I did not really feel anything after a hour so i took two more grams of kratom. I need the Kratom to replace the suboxone because i can no longer take suboxone for several reasons so if the Kratom does not work i am in trouble.

[@williamclaflin7863]

Doc honestly you are doing more harm than good by replacing kratom with suboxone unless thier abusing other opiates also.

[@dr.chrispark]

This video is about addiction. It has nothing to do with “replacing” drugs

[@scotrubi5296]

The conclusion of the 8 point factor analysis Kratom’s overall low potential for abuse and risk to public health and its extensive history of safe use, including findings from recent surveys in the US, suggest a strong benefit to risk profile that is within the range of current dietary supplements and many over-the-counter products

[@perpetualmotion357]

From my experience Kratom is stronger than Hydrocodone. 5 grams of quality Kratom kicks the crap out of two Vic 10's. People taking it every day for a mood enhancer and pick me up have no idea what they're getting into.

[@stefonpalinic5559]

@@perpetualmotion357 You are right but you can much easier taper off kratom than subs, perks,methadone. So do not spread misinformation that these horrific man made satanic drugs are in any way better than kratom health wise thank you very little. I took kratom for five years so I knew I thing or two about its withdrawals.

[@Preacher2628]

I just started today. Kratom to suboxone

[@shym6158]

How long did u wait ?

[@usef-syria]

How was it

[@danielbonner8309]

Have you had people that had precipitated withdrawal going from kratom to subs. Ive bounced around from kratom to suboxone a bunch in the past and never experienced them. Suboxone is much stronger in my opinion. Honestly they kinda go together well.

[@SAMEntalhealth]

They definitely go well

[@perpetualmotion357]

You won't go into precipitated wd's taking subs after taking regular leaf no matter when. Subs overpower it completely. Maybe if you downed two extract shots and took a sub an hour later(not sure why'd you do that) but if it's regular leaf Subs will knock the crap out of it. Subs kick the crap out of Vicodin. I could take two Vics and then take a strip and wouldn't feel the pills at all or go into withdrawal.

[@stefonpalinic5559]

That is impossible because kratom is very weak compared to subs. So subs would mask all withdrawals all together. Now going from subs to kratom you may have those precipitated withdrawals. Kratom is like a house cat and subs are like a full grown lion very different power. Even tho kratom is euphoric it’s no where near the filth and poison of the disturbing potent power of the all might sub.

[@perpetualmotion357]

@@stefonpalinic5559 If these people are wondering what precipitated withdrawals feel like, try using Fent for a week and then pop an 8mg Strip 12 hours after your last fix of Fent. Never in my life have I experienced such a devastating withdrawal. I can't even take Subs two days after using that crap pr it throws me into them. They have become basically worthless since Fentanyl came on the scene. Maybe they were designed for Heroin cause I had no problems going from H to Subs even 8 hours later, never got prec wd. This Fentanyl is an entirely different beast. It's like they designed the certain Fent analogues to intentionally interact with Bupe. It doesn't matter if it's Subutex or Suboxone. It's not the Naloxone that causes pre wd, it's the Bupe kicking that crap off your receptors and replaces it with a partial agonist. I agree with you on Subs being poison. I had withdrawals for months coming off that crap and it never really did take my urge to use away. Got less effective the longer I was on it and then caused depression. I would feel no highs or lows in life, killed my libido and destroyed my testosterone levels etc..It's amazing how doctors want to throw everyone on Bupe nowadays, even for Kratom withdrawal lol.

[@stefonpalinic5559]

@@perpetualmotion357 Dam that’s scary that this fentanyl is that dam dangerous that subs can’t cover its withdrawals. Luckily I stopped using right around the time fety hit the streets. Now all those negative side effects you mentioned I have all of it from subs. What’s so messed up I am on a super low dose of subs. Still I’m getting those side effects you mentioned. See I took only kratom for two years and had no side effects besides constipation maybe once a month. I’m definitely gonna try to switch to kratom again this suboxone nightmare seems to be never ending.

[@Bball332CM]

Can you get suboxone for kratom addiction? I have a bad bad, catastrophicly expensive kratom addiction. Withdrawal is BAD. I Asked 1 provider and they said they don't give it for Kratom addiction. Thing is, I don't have a history of other opiods. I have been trying to quit 4 a long time.

[@dr.chrispark]

Yes, it works for Kratom

[@barb7124]

I went to a suboxone clinic and got on it immediately. You can also look online they prescribe it for kratom use disorder

[@Bball332CM]

Thanks guys!

[@Bball332CM]

Barb, you don't live in the Chicago area by chance? That's where I'm looking for a doctor.

[@justinvanegas-rogich131]

What about Tianeptine to get off opiates/ kratom

[@dr.chrispark]

It has a short half life which makes it less beneficial for tapering

[@mH-sn5vm]

There is so much miss information about Kratom it’s disgusting as a doctor you shouldn’t speak on a plant you don’t understand it’s incredibly naïve of you as a western educated doctor to look past Kratom

[@stefonpalinic5559]

What misinformation?

[@a1fromday117]

If you are only taking Kratam will you test positive for opiates in a urine test?

[@calebwright2849]

No you wont test positive for opioids. They have to specifically test for mitragynine and 7 hydroxy mytragynine. Now it could be possible that you could get some kratom from a shady place and it have some kind of opiate added to it. I know i have heard about some fatal kratom cases that had a tramadol analogue being added, which wouldnt test positive for opiates either.

[@dannyburton9919]

took oxy for ten days and then just started using bupe? Mate, i only know you're wrong because I was SOOOOO wrong about that. . 2 day wait minimum Experienced failed withdrawal expert. Haha, the many layers of irony.

[@TheKenLucas]

Thanks Doc I'm going through the kratom withdrawals now it's horrendous I'm sweating constantly can't sleep without sweating the bed and maybe getting 2 hours of sleep lol

[@TheKenLucas]

Thank God for the Gym 🙏

[@7USC7]

How much kratom did u take/da?? How long???

[@TheKenLucas]

@@7USC7 4-6 tablespoons a day for nearly 2 years now

[@terintiaflavius3349]

@@TheKenLucas How are you doing now?

[@g.s777]

@@7USC7 nothing should be used every day I use medical cannabis also and I just started using Kratom for spinal stenosis and I'm going to use it once a week maybe not even and I'm slowly using less cannabis.

[@vintagebleachedblonde4322]

I have a horrible kratom Dependency 8 g every two hours at the two hour mark I began to withdraw profusely it’s destroying my life I don’t even want to live anymore

[@barb7124]

I went from $800 a month kratom to 16mg suboxone paid for by insurance. Cant tell a difference between them.

[@darlamckinnon4546]

Ok dude, that actually makes a LOT of sense.

[@rickyyo215]

Kratom has a very short half life. They attach to different receptors. It’s not fully understood how they interact.

[@7USC7]

What state are you in Doc???

[@dr.chrispark]

Mississippi

[@7USC7]

Thanks!!! Has anyone done a study on the highest quality Kratom??? Which do you think causes the best sense of well being or euphoria??

[@vintagebleachedblonde4322]

Kratom is not an opiate so why the 24 hour wait?

[@dr.chrispark]

Kratom works as a partial opiate agonist.

[@vintagebleachedblonde4322]

But I’m confused Kratom does not bind to the receptors it just intermingle’s so how could Suboxone kick the kratom off the receptors When the kratom is not even binding to the receptors

[@stefonpalinic5559]

@@vintagebleachedblonde4322 I did not wait and the kratom took away the withdrawals not perfectly but just enough to even go to bed

[@thetahexhodlhands4550]

@@vintagebleachedblonde4322 People get confused about this a lot. But yea you are right you can actually take suboxone with kratom it doesnt bind the way other opiates do or cause precipitated WD. I have suffered a bunch of times when i did not need to and recently found out you can do this a year ago.

[@vintagebleachedblonde4322]

@@thetahexhodlhands4550 did you take Suboxone for a kratom addiction/dependency?

[@corganearnheart187]

Haha kratom half life is 4-6 hours haha. Kratom is so much easier to quit than subs. This guy is spreading false information. Look it up and pay attention for factual reliable sources.

[@dr.chrispark]

Pharmacokinetics of mitragynine in man Satariya Trakulsrichai et al. Drug Des Devel Ther. 2015. “which demonstrated linearity and was consistent with the oral two-compartment model with a terminal half-life of about 1 day”

[@scotrubi5296]

THIS my friend is correct.. Very good study.. I've go hope for you after all

[@scotrubi5296]

Having said that there are flaws in that study after continuing research

[@KDuB9I6]

If you can use kratom as a tool to get off subs then great...but some ppl start on Kratom, and the addiction grows to where they are dosing every 2hrs and taking hundreds of grams per day (horrible on the body) just to avoid withdrawal. So when you living that type of lifestyle switching to a once per day prescription dose of medication is a huge relief and tool.

[@wishingyoupeace]

THANK YOU1

[@stefonpalinic5559]

One objection I have to this doctor is the idea you cannot know doses when taking kratom. In one sense he is correct in another not exactly. You can have a pretty good idea on dosage if you get it from same company. They have capsules that contain a certain amount. So to say you can’t taper is not accurate.

[@These-nutz]

Every bag even the same strain can be a lot different, it could be stronger or a lot weaker

[@stefonpalinic5559]

@@These-nutz no it cannot if you buy the same name brand. Actually even if you buy different brand same strain it’s going to be very similar. It’s like weed the same strains are usually exactly the same it’s the same concept.

[@These-nutz]

@@stefonpalinic5559 in my experience you can buy the same strain same brand and it can be very different, it’s unregulated, I’ve bought bags back to back and one bag one teaspoon gives you the same effects as 3 teaspoons same brand and strain, potency Varys, been taking it for 4 years, it’s a plant, marijuana for instance it Varys in potency unless you use clones

[@stefonpalinic5559]

@@These-nutz Yes it does vary just like weed so three grams is always gonna be similar in effect. One thing people don’t understand is that if your digestive system is working well it will make the kratom more potent. So what you eat , if you physically active, water intake all these things will affect how much of a effect you get. Just like weed one gram of the same strain will give you very similar levels of THC. So either way you can take less and less. Also they have extract that will give you a exact dose if you are that worried about getting a very slight higher or lower concentration. People confuse their bodies inability to digest kratom with tolerance increases or concentration levels.

[@stefonpalinic5559]

@@These-nutz Yes it does vary just like weed so three grams is always gonna be similar in effect. One thing people don’t understand is that if your digestive system is working well it will make the kratom more potent. So what you eat , if you physically active, water intake all these things will affect how much of a effect you get. Just like weed one gram of the same strain will give you very similar levels of THC. So either way you can take less and less. Also they have extract that will give you a exact dose if you are that worried about getting a very slight higher or lower concentration. People confuse their bodies inability to digest kratom with tolerance increases or concentration levels.

[@robthompson8285]

I mistakenly took a 100 mg naloxone pill thought it was my Zoloft, right after I had done an opms kratom shot. I was in precipitated withdrawal so bad I thought I was on another planet.

[@dr.chrispark]

Oops

[@Alexcision]

omg that shit made me sick as fuck a week ago. i was prescribed it to take away my desire to drink..my doctor didn't realize enough how kratom worked. it was awful. i was fine about 36hrs later. now I'm thinking just getting back on Suboxone lol

[@barb7124]

Would OPMS liquid go well on suboxone?

[@danedi2951]

Naltrexone probably you meant

[@shym6158]

But isn’t naltrexone in suboxone now? I’m so confused

[@Bjj827]

Dr, are there any studies that show cannibals heals the damaged receptors in the brain from long term opiate use?

[@benhall2235]

No cannibals eat human flesh, they won’t heal anything.

[@tracemagace8434]

Generally, they eat them .

[@bobby9642]

I went from kratom to suboxone , to deal with kratom withdrawal .but i dont know if suboxone also have withdrawal ? I dont want all this shit anymore .please help me 😔

[@buyaminaziz771]

Any update sir? Can u withdraw kratom with suboxone ?

[@bobby9642]

@@buyaminaziz771I found suboxone very effective to help kratom withdrawal, only the duration and dose of suboxone I have no idea. But indeed suboxone is effective for kratom withdrawal, believe me. I just stopped suboxone for a while because I can't wait when to stop suboxone. I have no idea. , afraid of being addicted to suboxone .but the conclusion is that suboxone can really help, just don't get to the point of addiction .I don't know how

[@buyaminaziz771]

@@bobby9642 okay thanks..I just use suboxone about two days for kratom withdrawal and used when i really needed.i hope we can make it..

[@bobby9642]

@@buyaminaziz771 yes suboxone can deal with kratom withdrawal .just make sure dont take it for the long term or it will trapped you as kratom destroy your normal life .

[@bobby9642]

@@buyaminaziz771 now you dont take kratom anymore ? Or you still take it a little ? When i was on suboxone , i dont take kratom even one cup if im not wrong.

[@thateabishhh]

So you really gonna sit there, drinking Kratom’s cousin…COFFEE and delete my comments sir?

[@dr.chrispark]

I will sit here and drink coffee. But I didn't delete your comments.

[@DJIDokkōdō]

Dude while coffee is a "cousin" it's like comparing apples to oranges. Take a year of coffee abuse compared kratom. It's like night and day. I was all pro kratom,until I truly learned. I'm a manager at three different cbd stores. 85% of our business is kratom sales. Everyone is just as hooked on kratom as they were on meth or heroin. They can't go a day without it. So what do you define as addictive? My definition is something that not only physically but mentally becomes what either feels like a dependence or is actually physically altered my chemistry. If I hadn't experienced so much hell over the years I swear. Like I want to take you Ultra-Pro-Kratom ppl and stick you in a room for a week without it. It sure as heck isn't they same as being in the room as someone kicking coffee. Kratom helps, but it also hurts. Can't play it one-sided. Idk I'm an extremely addictive personality. 8 months into AA/NA I started using coffee. Man I got an uplifting buzz from it. I was super surprised. When I started kratom I was mesmerized at how uplifted I was. There so different, if I drank 20 cups of coffee I never felt numb or sluggish and drunk. Or euphoric....seriously what's the point in arguing caffeine over and opiate? All drugs suck..

[@thateabishhh]

@@DJIDokkōdō all drug don’t suck. It’s the people that abuse them and our addictive personalities that suck. And you might wanna sell lab tested Kratom and stop selling those extracts. Those extracts are what’s hurting us. Do I beg, borrow, steal, suck d!ck to get more Kratom when I’m out…NOPE! Am I addicted…NOPE! Am I dependent…YUP! Lab tested Kratom, less is more and staying hydrated are the keys to being successful

[@nickycotton6137]

Aye, what's this Kratom all about then!? See many 'HR'ing' it to 'help' with various Opiate withdrawal's. Seems like equivalent of suggesting take Spice instead of Cannabis.

[@billscannell93]

No. You have it exactly backward. Kratom is weed in your comparison, suboxone the spice. Kratom is not anywhere in the ballpark of a brutal synthetic opioid like suboxone or methadone. I have tried that shit in the past, and never will again. Suboxone for kratom is the absurd, upside down, inexplicable idea. Another analogy akin to that is telling someone to wean off coffee with Adderall. Kratom is also nowhere near as strong or destructive as alcohol, a substance it has helped me personally a great deal with. I have taken kratom on and off years and years now, with no negative effects on my health or life, no withdrawals. When kratom is taken away (which I have no doubt it will be, by our lying FDA) that will be our stupid nanny state, empowered by its own people, essentially telling me, "No more freedom to take this thing that has helped you. You are still free to drink yourself into oblivion or get some awful thing 10X as powerful from your doctor, though."

[@nickycotton6137]

@@billscannell93 = Well just know it's been banned in various places! LoL subutex is nothing like Spice! That stuff turns People into Zombie's & feel's like gonna die whenever have taken that Crap. MANY Heroin Addicts are now addicted to both! At least Subutex gives the opportunity to lead a more stable life. Not gouged out all day or walking like a Dribbling zombie.

[@billscannell93]

@@nickycotton6137 To make kratom a felony, as they are (for less-than-honest reasons) bent on doing, is insane. The idea of giving Suboxone to people to come off kratom also makes no sense. I really don't understand how suboxone and and this ground-up plant stuff can even be compared. I am sure people with HEAVY opioid tolerances are helped by suboxone, but it is a huge understatement to say kratom is a gentler substance. The point of my comparison was not to say spice is similar to suboxone, but to point out that going from something mild and natural to something infinitely more potent and synthetic, is a step in exactly the wrong direction. Anyone who thinks kratom is comparable or even worse than heroin, has no experience with kratom, has only learned about it from the FDA, has bought adulterated kratom, or something else, because that sounds like crazy talk.

[@billscannell93]

@@nickycotton6137 Best of luck with your addiction problems, too. I get a little irritable on the subject of kratom, because I think kratom really has the potential to help people. There is an interesting documentary on KZbin, "The Leaf of Faith," about kratom, you might be interested in. By documentarian Chris Bell. He also has an interesting perspective on steroids, not that I am into that shit. Peace!

[@nickycotton6137]

@@billscannell93 = Backward! OK seeing as you deleted your regret etc! I'll finish with all the best 'Bill' & you took my comment to heart so good luck with Kratom.

[@Alexcision]

i took Suboxone for years. i quit 11/01/2018. I've taken little bits a few times since then for medical pain emergencies, but other than that nope. I started drinking more since i switched from Suboxone to kratom & recently tried a drug Naloxone & holy fucking shit did i get SICK! So I'm taking more & more kratom..so I'm actually omw to getting back on Suboxone lol. i realize I'll have addiction probs for life. it's already been 3/4 my life. a low dose like 2-4mg would be ideal. for whoever kicked Suboxone with or without kratom, or kicked kratom, i solute you, bc that's the hardest thing anyone can go thru besides just dying imo.

[@These-nutz]

No methadone is a lot worse, I quit methadone cold turkey 100 mgs every day for 20 years ( 1999-2019 )I did take Kratom after 25 days of almost no sleep, I couldn’t take it anymore I was going crazy, I got a lot of relief after taking kratom and slept 8 hrs for the first time in almost a month, I was taking 10 caps 3 times a day for 4 months than cold turkey off Kratom, I don’t recall feeling all that bad I just couldn’t sleep hardly and I had bad anxiety, I quit Kratom for 6 months then went back, when they shut everything down I relapsed then went back to Kratom, I’ve been taking it 6 months now, I ran out of money and couldn’t buy any so I’ve been taking pieces of sub strips I had left over, that was 3 days ago, I’m going to try and take these subs for no more than 5 days then see if I can stop, I got started taking OCs back in 1998-99 Because I hurt my back at work, I have a long history, I might not ever feel “normal “ without anything? When I was completely clean those 6 months I didn’t sleep a solid 4 hrs the whole time, taking Kratom I get usually 5-6 hrs solid sleep, I’ve probably messed myself up ( I’m 46 )

[@benhall2235]

Methadone is the hardest opiate I’ve ever quit due to its long duration and full agonist nature. However if you taper it properly even that can be not too difficult. In the uk our methadone is free so it’s not like we have the additional difficulty of money to come tend with unlike our American friends. First time I quit methadone was in 2009 and I tapered down from 120mg per day to 30mg per day to get into a rehab. Once there they dozed me up on Valium and Digydracodeine for nine days. That was hard but I did it. I was in that rehab for six months. After about 10 years I relapsed and got straight back on methadone, this time my highest dose was 60 mg per day, again after a while once I was stable on it and not using I began tapering , the first few drops were bigger as the dose is still high so I went to 50 then 40 then 35 etc, once I was down to 20 mg I dropped by 1 or 2 mg every two weeks. My last two weeks I was taking 1mg per day. Over here our usual methadone is 1mg/ml so it’s more liquid which makes tapering to small amounts easier. It’s green too not pink. Anyway I was working as a delivery driver and technician at the time so quite a physical job but doing it gradually like i did meant that I didn’t even need to take time off work, I had some wds but not really bad. My ten year of clean time probably helped me as well, the more times you do a detox and the longer continuous use, the harder it gets each time.

[@alexanderwilkins9440]

@@These-nutz yaa I know what your talking about. Starting to suspect I'll need to be on something for the rest of my life just to semi function. Over half my life on hard drugs and I started so young my brain was still developing and I feel like I shifted some neuropathways in some big ways..... best of luck to u man God bless

[@SupChamp]

Bro narcanned himself recreationally! That's a first for me never heard that before

[@cryptoisthewaytogo]

@@These-nutzthank you for your story, I’m the same age and been through opiate addiction since early 20s and now been on sub for 5yrs or so. And would like to quit taking it but don’t wanna mess with the withdrawals again so just keep taking it. Usually take 2-4mg twice a day. Haven’t ever tried kratom. Live in Indiana and can’t buy it here

[@princessbiker1975]

This is stupid why get off kratom fpr sub? Drs are WRONG

[@dr.chrispark]

Wrong about what?

[@scotrubi5296]

I'm still curious of why you won't debate me if I can straighten out Congress and police chiefs I can certainly straighten you out ..

[@alexanderwilkins9440]

I've been on the strong shit for so long I get into unbearable withdrawl at 16 hours. Have 2 dose every 3 or 4 hours... this is going to be the video I refer my doctor 2. I've hid it from him till now...

[@AJBuddha]

My doctor said he can’t refil or prescribed new prescriptions because I use Kratom. I did some research & made some phone calls & it looks like I’ll be doing a chemical assessment & doing outpatient meetings along with Suboxone for the Kratom withdrawal. Originally I was on opiates & benzos mostly Fentanyl for about 5 years & I quit Fentanyl cold turkey to go 45 days of inpatient treatment then I went to 2 different sober houses for a year n a half til I got kicked out for using Delta8. Also doing outpatient during that period & having daily meetings & UA tests n my councilor asked about my Kratom n delta 8 use. I explained why, they don’t recommend using them with a history of addiction, but the thing is I have a different body & different mind than everyone else I’ve been through a lot of tough time my entire life & ive always pushed through & made myself be positive & optimistic. So really I just want mental stability but I also have bad dental anxiety n have mental breakdown/ panic attacks when I don’t want them. Ultimately I gotta provide for my family & be a leader with the recent passing of my Father the torch has been passed to me as the 1st born male in my direct family. I feel I have a responsibility to keep everybody else together, but I never feel like I can keep myself together. But I will never stop trying to improve myself everything is a work in progress

[@jessicagarcia6241]

I keep seeing scientific articles and then them being removed? Are you trying to push Suboxone is that why you're not allowing people to give facts about kratom? Cuz that to me is extremely sketchy cuz it seems like you're not wanting anyone to understand anything about kratom so you can push subs.

[@dr.chrispark]

Hahaha. You guys are hilarious. I literally tell people how to stop using subs on this channel. How is that pushing them??? Did you watch the video? It’s specifically for people addicted to kratom. If that’s not you, then why are you here?

[@thetahexhodlhands4550]

@@dr.chrispark Hey i might disagree and start arguments sometimes but this is actually funny ^.^. You never delete any of my comments haha what's she talking about

[@resewatson402]

The most I took a day was 3 roxy 30s I know that I have a issue and can’t afford my habit I just took my first dose of sub today and I have one more left but I was told don’t take the second pill till after 3 days sense I can’t get a script for the subs need some advice on what the next step I should take when i take the last one should I switch to kratom should I try an go cold turkey then cause I don’t have the cash to buy script or even see a pain management doctor or detox clinic only thing I can afford is these kratom they have for 8$ that give u 100 pills need some help yall

[@dr.chrispark]

If Kratom is legal where you’re at, then using them to taper would be a reasonable choice. You just have to be careful with dosing and reduce use over time

[@brianfreland9065]

Get medicaid...it's free and covers opioid addiction treatment like suboxone. I just went to the doctor yesterday and got a script put into the pharmacy immediately. Didn't cost me a dime

[@barb7124]

100 pills of kratom for 8 bucks? It must be head shop garbage.

[@gio1985s]

holy shit kraytom stans going hard in here.....for me who has been doing 50-75mg of percocet for years I tried to go to kratom and the amount I had to take to feel ok was scary so I backed off I'm not exploring subs witch is also scary...this jst sucks and I feel like an idiot for getting caught up in this bs

[@thechosenwon4089]

Hang in there. It happens to the best of us.

[@6.2bandz]

Man literally going through the same shit bro but honestly get them subs just got me some time to make a change for the better

[@kayle9674]

get xanex bars... as many as possible.. you can literlly sleeo through the first few days or even save tben fir eaach night and they will still knock u out

[@6.2bandz]

@@kayle9674 hell nah no xan bars

[@gio1985s]

@@6.2bandz yea im allset with xans but I did grab sme gabbys and am slowly weaning off the perks down to 45mg/day never any more witch is good for me....once I get to maybe 15mg I'm gonna take a week off wrk an jst jump off use the gabbys for restless legs from what I've read they help...this process takes sme real fckn fortitude but so far so good I don't take pills chasing a high so I think that's why it's been doable for me so far

[@juliegrafton93]

You can take suboxone right away with kratom, no precipitated withdrawal.

[@josephobuck5409]

What if I take kratom first that suboxone?

[@HyDR0CoDoNe]

u dont have to wait switching from kratom to bupe. kratom acts like subs in being its half agonist half antagonist. i take my normal prescription pain meds (opana and 30mg oxycodone) with kratom and dont get pwd. kratom is a weird drug. it def works on opiate receptors bc it covers up wd from oxymorphone.

[@dr.chrispark]

That’s been my experience as well

[@bekeneel]

that's so weird, you were taking oxycodon & opana (oxymorphone) togethere?? do u think bupe is rly stronger than kratom? i'd like to switch mainly cuz i take quite a lot of kratom daily & the suboxone works longer i could limit my intake to i think once daily.

[@HyDR0CoDoNe]

@@bekeneel whats weird bout that lol the opana is ER and the oxycodone is instant release. the bupe is def stronger than the kratom. just got back with my refills gonna be a good night. you have pain issues or take for addiction?

[@SupChamp]

You can still get opana? HOW? I miss that shit

[@scotrubi5296]

How long is suboxone half life?? Humm??!!

[@Omerta_1964]

24-36 hours

[@b.csplatbriancross7062]

Kratos can help with opiot withdrawal but to much gave me two strokes and a fatty liver

[@iammrpositive5108]

Lol Kratos

[@logan6239]

He is the God of War. Opiate withdrawal is light work to Kratos.

[@jessiejeanne9717]

Shoot,i was trying to do the exact opposite.

[@dr.chrispark]

Works for some people. Talk to your doctor to see if it would be a good idea for yiu

[@dontbefooled132]

Lol this wrong I took Suboxone the same day as I stopped taking kratom like four hours after

[@mH-sn5vm]

Why would you put them on Subutex a worse medication then Kratom and more addicting jeez what are you gonna give him to get him of Subutex methadone what do you give him to get off methadone heroin 🤔🧐

[@dr.chrispark]

I'm glad Kratom worked for you. Happy Thanksgiving.

[@thetahexhodlhands4550]

I have been battling back and forth with heroin, methadone, suboxone, kratom, roxies for most of my life. Kratom addiction was on par with my heroin addiction I am so glad i switched from kratom to subs. People dont get how bad kratom addiction is sometimes its an all day 24 hours a day job it just wears off every 3 hours and its absolute hell. I was getting 2 hours of a sleep a night for months and was a complete zombie. I just switched from kratom to subuxone and im finally a productive again

[@Omerta_1964]

@@thetahexhodlhands4550 Suboxone is ruining me life. I have been taking it for 10 years now and feel like a total zombie. i feel detached and very anti social. never in the mood to do anything and nothing excites me and i am always tired. I am not alone with this either, there are many others that are or have experienced the nightmare being on suboxone can be!

[@Settings404]

@@Omerta_1964 I feel the same way about kratom and I have to stay home because I need to reside every 3 hours

[@theGODfather746]

Suboxone is so much worse ngl.

[@b.csplatbriancross7062]

If people can make 24 hours your not needed

[@jaydenadams4272]

You are definitely not correct on this info. Stop spreading these lies. You have no clue.

[@dr.chrispark]

What lies are you talking about? How am I wrong?

[@scotrubi5296]

You wanna go step by step this video is FULL of total BS. EXCEPT when you said u don't know enough

[@scotrubi5296]

Would you like to have the actual science done on this first THEN..after you read the mechanism etc.. Have me on as a guest And we can discuss again after you are actually educated on the situation.. And the problems with the drugs you are suggesting,?? And also have you personally ever taken the drugs you prescribe? I'm guessing no.. I HAVE.. real life and what you read in a book is totally different... Id love to really have a frank discussion with you ..you are are so misinformed. Or In your words. You basically know nothing

[@scotrubi5296]

I'm not some yahoo . I spend time educating legislators police etc.. Don't believe me go look at my background pick I'm on the right holding the sign.. Its uneducated talk like this that gives kratom a bad name. If you read the material I give you you will see IF YOU ARE HONEST kratom has a better mechanism and safety profile than EVERY drug you are prescribing..let's chat ..unless you aren't confident in you ability to defend your opinions.. And accept MY FACTS..

[@scotrubi5296]

Also quit erasing the science that was left here about kratom UNLESS you have an agenda or something to hide... Your going to have DOZENS AND DOZENS of people on this video you will have to oak and erasing ALL of ALL of the science we will ALL drop that you're to scared to leave up..

[@drainmonkeys385]

This all seems like it’s coming from a doctor that doesn’t know enough about this.. and is being very cautious.. but if you can make it 48-72 hours with no Kratom then you can go the rest of the way without assistance.. 100%. For me… 4 hours without, the withdrawals begin. 6 hours,I’m really feeling like shit.. 8-12 hours. Nose is running.. feverish, cold sweats, scratchy throat, runny nose, diarrhea, confusion, restless legs… really bad restless legs ,, really really really bad restless legs.. 24 hours, I’m wishing I would die.. I’ve been on Kratom since 2006. A kilo about every 3-4 weeks It’s awful but still better than heroin or fentanyl… Kratom won’t kill anyone… it never has.. don’t believe the DEA or anyone else who says it is deadly…it’s not… what’s deadly is not having it available

[@dripsonice413]

So are you off Kratom now? I was addicted to oxy 30s for ab 5 years and quit w Kratoms help took Kratom for a little over a year and then became addicted to the fake 30s/fetty.. I took fetty for close to a year and quit ab 2 months ago by using subs for ab 10 days then switched to Kratom for a little over a month but then relapsed not heavy into fetty just very very little like less than a pill per week for almost 3 weeks, I quit again using Kratom for the past couple weeks but am nervous I’ll relapse again bc with the subs I feel much more stable and normal but with the Kratom I have highs and lows and feel like I’m hurting when I shouldn’t be and if I take too much I get dizzy and sick. I’m thinking ab getting back on suboxone maybe for the next 3-6 months until I feel completely in the clear from fentanyl. Then try and use Kratom to taper off subs but use the Kratom lightly not how I have been (30-40 gms a day) for about 2-3 weeks and hopefully get out on the other side of this thing once and for all

[@erinbrowne5001]

My Kratom WDs were much more severe than what you just described.

[@Jay-se2ym]

Using subs to come off kratom does not work.. cuz subs are much stronger than kratom

[@dr.chrispark]

Longer half life is why it does work

[@kickinaddiction]

Dr park, let’s do a video together! I have experience with both substances. If you’re willing, how can I get in contact with you to set it up? Would be fun to do a collab video either way. 👍

[@dr.chrispark]

Yeah man that’d be cool. send me an email [e-mail]

[@badass1g]

@@dr.chrispark I’ll be sending you an email in the next 10 mins. 👍

[@kickinaddiction]

@@Jesse_222 😀 it’s been great to do collab vids with him. I’m sure we’ll do more in the future as well. 👍

[@christinaaguilar1483]

I thought I’d share my experience taking suboxone for kratom addiction, I took 8-12 mg of suboxone day 1, 8mg day 2-3 and 6mg on day 4, my last dose of kratom was on Saturday at 2pm and I took the sub that Saturday at 9pm, I didn’t have precipitated withdrawals taking it so close together. I stopped taking the suboxone on day 3.5 because I was not trying to switch one addiction for another, so I hopped off after almost 4 days, it’s been 2 days going on the 3rd since my last dose of suboxone and the only withdrawls I feel are the PAWS from kratom, like I was sweating through my sleep last night , but I slept for 14 hours to get through it. I have diarrhea that immodium isn’t helping, but it did help with the stomach ache, I took seroquel last night to fall asleep, and I’ve been drinking a lot of fluids (Powerade, water, caffeine free diet coke) and I ate a pancake dog and sandwhich last night for dinner just to get something in my stomach. I honestly think I managed to get off the subs just in time for my body not to get used to it, praying I don’t feel any worse than I do now in the next few days as I can just barely handle how I’m feeling right now, just a little uncomfortable, cold sweats, diahhrea, irritability. I saw someone said they got addicted to subs in 5 days and had awful withdrawls after 12 hours, doesn’t seem to be the same case for me for now at least, anyway good luck to whoever is trying to fight this battle the same way I am, I will update this comment in a few days to tell if I made it through or not.

[@BrentCox2B]

@@christinaaguilar1483 how you doing now ?

[@christinaaguilar1483]

@@BrentCox2B I didn’t feel too good for about a week, but it was very minor symptoms like diarrhea, minor chills in the morning, it was mostly mental, my depression and anxiety were really bad, but I’m on antidepressants so after about a week of being back just on those I’m alright, I also had DPDR for about a week, now I only get it when I start panicking which is usual to me. What I think happened to the person who got bad withdrawls after 5 days was the withdrawls from whatever they were using suboxone to come off of hadn’t entirely left them yet and they assumed it was the subs. I definitly recommend only taking them 5-7 days max or stop as soon as you can, like the last dose I took of subs I let it wear off to see how bad withdrawls were still going on from kratom and it was bearable so I just decided the day prior was my last dose. I only used subs to get through the peak of my kratom withdrawls. I believe today marks 2 weeks off of kratom and like 10 days off of subs. I’m late but I didn’t get any notifications lol

[@deeboi623]

How’s it going now? I’m on high dosage ok kratom and I want to try subs Kratom WD is just as bad as fentanyl WD

[@christinaaguilar1483]

I’m good, after about 5 months I am almost back to normal, I’m going through some PAWS still, but they are coming in smaller more manageable waves. Kratom withdrawls are hell, I was taking 50+ gpd I never measured I was taking them in heaping spoonfuls It’s almost 6 months now and still not 100% normal more like 95% and I think it will be a long time before I feel completely myself again, but I’ll take 95% over going through that again. I am never touching kratom again. I been through many addictions and kratom has been the worst