Fuel Injection System Priming & Troubleshooting - Perkins 4.236 - JCB Backhoe Project Part 7

[@DOCTORDROTT]

I always clean out the fuel tank, then fill it with fresh diesel, clean out the filter in the injection pump and the gauze in the lift pump. If anyone gets trouble with these DPA pumps, tap the top part of the body on the pump. Its a common fault that the internals stick in shut off position thereby no fuel coming through to the injectors. Just a tip I have picked up .

[@aljotock]

Soooo satisfying! Thanks for the video👍

[@briansmobile1]

Thanks for the video- I've got a Skytrak with same engine and similar problems. I'll be pulling the injector pump probably tomorrow or so.

[@oby-1607]

It was good to see it start. I have a Miller Big 40 that ran out of fuel and now it won't start. I bled the pump and up to the injectors but to no avail. I wonder if I have the same problem you had. Very frustrating as I use this welder for all my remote jobs when they come up. Thanks for sharing.

[@mikegamer6104]

Your problem is , need to open the bottom bleeder on injector pump and crank engine to pretty me it and get air out. Pumping primer alone is not enough. Top bleeder can be done with just the priming pump and no cranking. Then close both bleeders and crack the injectors , you should see the fuel squirting from nut when cranking. Close the injectors and it will start as long as filter is full and bled.

[@mpzalew]

👏🏼 this is what did it for my wood chipper! Thanks so much

[@Nudnik1]

I use a electric 12v fuel pump from a Ford 7.3 to prime motor for a few minutes in some cases. Put before primary filter and let run until you hear fuel returning to main tank. Take top cover off CAV shut off lever stuck off. Common issue.

[@dansmovingtrucking1314]

Yours is just like like mine-never wants to prime, inject and start. -So basically you had success by bench bleed with a power drill. NICE. Congrats. I don't want to work that hard. P.S. Thanks Mrbugsier5 for info about blocking the return line to the fuel tank.

[@ChernobieffPiano]

That console and gauges are sweet!!

[@dansmovingtrucking1314]

Thank you TMD for this video. I have a 1400 by D&W Diesel and don't remember there being 2 5/16 bleed screws on the inj. pump so I will double check that. I also had the same issues of trying to prime the inj. pump. But Dude! I can't believe you took the pump OFF!? What about start the screws into the threaded shaft hub with out dropping one or more of them down into the crank case. I would not want to go through that again I was sweating bullets! I'm not changing that injection pump ever again. I think I'm gonna order a new lift pump from Lift Tech and I'll take apart my old one after I get the new one.

[@powerelectronicsguyl306]

Hi TMD; Ahhh, the dreaded bleeding routine! I service generators with these engines. I'm hoping you know about the injectors and their return fuel ports. I’m curious about return fuel volume exiting them. Following accidental fuel starvation or a filter change, I would like to develop a better, less messy way to bleed the injector lines on these old Perkins engines without the need to crack hi-pressure line nuts, filter vents, upper pump reservoir vent screws, hand pumping, etc., and cranking the engine to purge out air bubbles. What if tee fittings with some sort of high pressure check valve within the tee could be added to the line fittings at the injector pump and each tee connected to an electric fuel pump? Without cranking the engine, would this modification push enough low pressure fuel through the injector return lines and back to the pump reservoir? Another tap on the electric pump could also push fuel through a replaced filter and back to the tank. Would the electric pump flow through the return lines purge away enough air in 5 or 6 minutes to permit the engine to start? Thank you for any reply. Jack, aka electricalpowerguy

[@ProjectsbyTMD]

Powerelectronicsguy L - I agree with you that when the injector pump looses its prime, it can be a real challenge getting the pump going again. It would be great if there was some short cut that would simplify the process. I should also mention that I had an episode of fuel starvation over the weekend and had to repeat the entire bleeding exercise again! I'll post a video on that one when I get some time. (There was a bucket full of "sludge" in the fuel tank that had to be cleaned out.)

[@powerelectronicsguyl306]

ProjectsbyTMD Wish I had an engine to experiment with. When you get everything finished, could you please temporarily re-route the injector return line at the banjo fitting atop the filter housing and into a pail so we can see how much fuel flow is in this line with the engine running at idle or half-speed? If the stream is something more than a slow dribble, then my aforementioned check valve-tee idea might work. If the stream just drips or is too slow, then an electric pump add-on would take forever to bleed the system. Thanks for sharing this rebuild project and your ideas with us.

[@jlz7038]

awesome, helpfull info, especially about the pump filter cleanout.

[@edgarloz3261]

Good morning Mr. I have a backhoe similar to yours. I see it's good mechanic you. I have a problem with my backhoe, the problem start losing strength in the reverse and forward. The hydraulic system is perfect, can excavate without any problem, I use the charger frontral perfectly, only does not reverse and forward. Could you help me?

[@dansmovingtrucking1314]

Excuse me Mr. TMD. Could you remind me which way to make sure my machine is in 2 wheel drive so I can road it? I can't find the operators manual and I don't have any mud or snow to see if the front tires spin under power. P.S. I always loved your JCB videos and I am subscribed.

[@greasemonkeyno2]

Start at thank ,then sediment bowl ,then filter in bolt at lift pump ,then filter on top of lift pump,then one in back of injector pump, forgot to tell you some have a water trap fitted. jcb fitted a lot of fuel filtration not all a bad idea . hope this helps

[@johnjohnson6657]

Had an engine that would run great for 5 to 10 mins under full throttle then die like its out of fuel each time. Reprime and would start but same thing time and time again. Come to find out fuel sediment bowl which is made out of Polycarbonate clear plastic so you can see it had several cracks in the bowl and must of been sucking air under full throttle. I believe the Bowl cracked cause some water got into it over time and froze over the winter. Had about little less than a cup of water and slime in sediment bowl. Just something to check

[@augustzochbauer2673]

Hi, may you can help me out - i have the same engine mounted in an mf tractor 362. The problem is that the fuel comes out only at one high pressure pipe at cylinder 2 (beginning in the front). No matter if i vent with the hand pump or by the starter motor. Shut down valve is not stuck but no matter how it is adjusted (run or stop), fuel comes out only at high pressure pipe no 2?! May you can give me some tips to figure out the issue. Thanks, August

[@augustzochbauer2673]

Just demounted the end-plate and recognized that the vane pump isn´t rotating at all - the shaft, when looking trough the covered opening at the front side, is turning. Something at the distripution shaft is broken either loose. Worth for repair... is it fixable?

[@pascalhsia2290]

Injectie pomp trekt lucht

[@msalowit]

Hi, great video, thank you for this. Question: you gave a carquest part number for the fuel filter. Would you happen to have similar for the water separator/sediment filter? Thanks in advance...

[@ProjectsbyTMD]

Hi Mark - no, I don't have that part number -

[@msalowit]

ProjectsbyTMD thanks anyway!!

[@fantasticmoonwalks1343]

i have a ford 420 is like a 1979 but i cant tel oil level fuel or hydralic level nor is hot. starts and run look like all wires are cut off what can i do

[@dansmovingtrucking1314]

Do I pull the lever back or push it forward?

[@gundorethemighty]

I got a 1400b an man this thing givng me all kinda problems . Getting no fuel in the fuel filter . but injecter pump full of fuel. got no pressure coming out of the injector pump . i think i have the same problem in getting it primed . I have a Question . does you fuel filter have Holes at the top of the fuel filter . or is it flat shape with no hole's

[@ProjectsbyTMD]

I seem to recal that there are holes on the top - FYI ... there's another fuel filter screen in the injector pump (at the fuel inlet). Take that apart and clean it. Also - take video when you pull the filter related parts out - if you do not assemble it correctly, the injection pump will not build pressure

[@gundorethemighty]

@@ProjectsbyTMD hey buddy sorry for the long awaited reply . 1 we got another pump 2 new fuel filter 3 found out the fuel filter oil ring went into the filter in stead of the housing so now i got fuel filling the fuel filter boil, bled each line they squrting fuel go to start it still nothing . bled each injector there's alot of fuel coming a nice little bead go to start it still will not hit a lick. spray some diesel dope (Ether) she fire's right up then die's Keep giving her the dope she will run . but once you stop she just die's . i think i ether i got a air someone stuck in the system. or the injector's are bad even thou i clean them an they seemed to be in good shape . i checked the back of the injector pump there no trash no nothing . i mite just bled is more .

[@richs65treebucketservice24]

Where did ya Connect on that Perkins to get the RPM's Gauge.........?? Thanks.Rich...

[@ProjectsbyTMD]

There's a tachometer connection on the top front part of the engine.

[@edgarloz3261]

Good morning Mr. I have a backhoe similar to yours JCB 1550B 1987. I see it's good mechanic you. I have a problem with my backhoe, the problem start losing strength in the reverse and forward. The hydraulic system is perfect, can excavate without any problem, I use the charger frontral perfectly, only does not reverse and forward. Could you help me?

[@ProjectsbyTMD]

+edgar Loz Sounds like you have a problem in your automatic transmission - I believe that there is a pressure check procedure for diagnosing the problem - can't seem to remember how to do it. Check for references on line for more info.

[@moonesayad8279]

ProjectsbyTMD l have jcb 3c mark3 dose not go forward or if it did it's very weak but in reverse dose well the hydraulic very good and please help me by showing the manual service to elect. system. thank you

[@zhengkairui6325]

edgar Loz t

[@chizuck3322]

I need help or any info you got. I have the same engine in a 185 CFM compressor trailer. it Wouldn't run I had the injector pump rebuilt new pencil injectors new lifter pump all bleed out. Now it runs but when you put it in work mode it idles up builds air then when it idles back down it dies like it's getting a kill signal from somewhere any ideas

[@kxrider9314]

Hi there, I'm working on a JBC loadall, and has the same engine. It's been sitting for like 3 years and I've been trying to start it and it won't fire.. I have diesel going into the injection pump and have bled all the lines, still won't fire. So I'm trying to take the pump off and was curious how you did that. I've never worked on a Perkins engine. thank you!

[@ProjectsbyTMD]

+Wade Knisley There are 3 bolts on the pump side; and, you need to remove the inspection cover on the fan blade side to gain access to the 3 bolts that secure the pump shaft to a gear that is driven by the crankshaft. I would also crack a line coming off the lift pump to make sure that it is supplying fuel to the filter & pump. (After the line is cracked, manually pump the lift pump lever to see if any fuel is coming from the pump.)

[@kxrider9314]

+ProjectsbyTMD Hey thank you, I actually found that plate on the fan side just before you wrote back. The engine is sandwiched in machine with the fan facing the back of the machine, so you couldn't just look at the front of the engine to see that cover plate. The lift pump works great, and I tried your oil trick in the injection pump, and it worked for a little bit, and then quit working again at all. So I think I'm going to take the pump in so that they can check it out. Thank you for your help!

[@austinmcbride7715]

+ProjectsbyTMD im working on a 1991 jcb 1400b my hydraulics wont respond to any of the controls what could.possibly be the problem?

[@AbdulKurad]

Good sir thanks

[@stevel2407]

Do you know what year models these black top JBCs are ?

[@ProjectsbyTMD]

I don't know the exact year - suspect that it is a mid '80s

[@MrGiovannix12]

have any issues starting it in colder temps?

[@ProjectsbyTMD]

+MrGiovannix12 Timely question ... just posted a video on it - kzbin.info/www/bejne/bYuplayfoJZ1kJo

[@sweetwilly125]

what about the timing of the pump??? does it have to be timed with the engine???

[@ProjectsbyTMD]

+sweetwilly125 - The pump can only be inserted one way into the front cover's timing gears. As such, there should not be any error associated with this step. If you have taken off the timing gears for some reason, please make sure that the timing marks on the gears are installed correctly. On the pump itself, there should be a timing mark on the pump that matches a mark on the front cover. If any of the timing marks are incorrect, the engine will not run - as it is injecting fuel in the wrong part of the combustion cycle. (This mark is discussed in one of my videos.)

[@justinrobertson1590]

What gauges did you use ? Looks good!

[@dicksonmwanza5328]

were is number one fuel flow of 3c pump

[@OZARKSHDRIDERS]

Do you have another channel called Desert Sentinel

[@ProjectsbyTMD]

no

[@ReasonForemost]

+ProjectsbyTMD Appreciate your very informative video. I have a tractor with this same Perkins injection pump which is not outputting diesel fuel to any of the injectors. I've already tried everything I could to get the air bled out of the fuel system as you demonstrate, so I am now getting ready to remove and test the injection pump as you show in this video. Do you use oil in this video to test your injection pump because it was more convenient to use instead of diesel or does the higher viscosity of the oil help to get this Perkins pump primed? Thanks

[@ProjectsbyTMD]

I used regular motor oil to get the pump primed

[@ReasonForemost]

Appreciate your response, just trying to better understand why you used oil instead of diesel when you tested it using a drill. So to be more specific, is it easier to prime a diesel injection pump with regular oil than with diesel fuel?

[@ProjectsbyTMD]

you can use either - I simply had oil in a thumb style pump can that made it easy to prime the injector pump

[@MrBugsier5]

the easiest way of priming these pumps is to block the return from the filter to the tank, get some pre pressure on the pump, we do this often whith Indenor engines (same pump, ) no trobles in bleeding then!

[@samscreativefarm]

Do I block the return line and crank the motor or pump the hand primer

[@dansmovingtrucking1314]

Oh nevermind you're machine is not a four wheel drive.

[@jlz7038]

awesome, helpfull info, especially about the pump filter cleanout.

[@ProjectsbyTMD]

+JL Z I'm glad that it was helpful!